Kirby's Warp Star Adventure: Kirby's Stage Discussion *Meta Knight Talk*

[KaptainKrunch]

As far as neutrals go, I would take her to Battlefield. When I play ZSS's they tend to play a spacing/keep away game, and try at all costs to keep you away. Battlefield seems like the neutral stage that is smallest, meaning she doesn't have as easy of time running away and keeping you away. Is there another neutral that people think works well for getting in close?

You guys got all the counter picks already.

Agreed. Space is essential for Kirby, keeping ZSS close would be your best option.

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ Ah sorry guys, I need to be less lazy than I am now. I'm guessing ZSS is done since there's not much discussion of her, next character anyone or continue? ☆

 

[TaterSalad0811]

How about Olimar? People want his matchup re-done, why not the stages too?

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ I still can't see why it's a disadvantage match up, same with ZSS. ._. ☆

☆ Ok, I'll wrap up the ZSS stage discussion, you guys can talk about Olimar stages, where to take him, and where not to. ☆

☆ Edited: I almost forgot, how many tournaments known that made Final Destination a counter pick? ☆

 

[aqua421]

I like to bring olimar to frigate, get him off the right side on the first part of the stage and hes pretty much done.

 

[TaterSalad0811]

☆ Edited: I almost forgot, how many tournaments known that made Final Destination a counter pick? ☆

I think that was just a theory someone posted due to certain matchups being very un-neutral on FD. But that's what bans/stage striking was made for.

And you put a lot of work in to get that text every time you post. Geez, it looks like there's more font, size, and color settings than the actual post.

 

[fromundaman]

No, it was because OS made a circuit with FD as a CP, and a custom-stage equivalent as a starter, but that's the only time I've ever seen that.

 

[Lord Viper]

I like to bring olimar to frigate, get him off the right side on the first part of the stage and hes pretty much done.

☆ Frigate is one of the best stages to take him to. >:] ☆

☆ Pokemon Stadium IMO is another advantage since the transformations sometimes mess with his Pikmin, though I had a few Pikmin mains that wouldn't mind going there anyways.... O_o ☆

No, it was because OS made a circuit with FD as a CP, and a custom-stage equivalent as a starter, but that's the only time I've ever seen that.

☆ Oh, I see. I haven't been to a MWC in a while, (or the thread), so I haven't heard all the news. >.< ☆

And you put a lot of work in to get that text every time you post. Geez, it looks like there's more font, size, and color settings than the actual post.

☆ Posting in color is serous business. =P ☆

 

[Triple R]

☆ Frigate is one of the best stages to take him to. >:] ☆

The only thing to watch out for is that he gets more yellow pikmin on that stage, which equals he has lots of priority......

 

[TaterSalad0811]

The only thing to watch out for is that he gets more yellow pikmin on that stage, which equals he has lots of priority......

Oh, because the stage is technically metal, right? So just juggle him a bit and you'll be fine.

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ According to what I last discussed in the Olimar match up, Jungle Japes is no longer an advantage stage against an Olimar main of a high level of play, but we do have a tiny advantage on that stage though. Norfair and Luigi's Mansion is the worst stage to pick against Olimar. Norfair Olimar has too many to hang on to, while the Lava sometimes saving his life which is a pain for us. Luigi's Mansion, see Zelda minus the Din's Fire. ☆

 

[fromundaman]

It's not that it's NOT an advantaged stage, but some Olimar players do really well on that stage, and he can do stuff you wouldn't expect (he camps the platforms like a beast. Just keeps tossing pikmin, then he can jump under and Uair you or pivot grab if you try to get on).
Hilt, for example, is **** on that stage.
That being said, Japes and RC are still the best stages to CP him.

LM should never be legal, but in the event that it is, ban it. He is stupid good on that stage... pivot grab>Dthrow>Usmash x3>Dsmash... fun...
Norfair kind of sucks but is nowhere near as bad...
He's good on Delfino too. It gives him a great variety of Pikmin, depending on the stage, and the neutral one gives lots of yellows if I remember right.

 

[aqua421]

I dont really like japes against olimar. I feel like its harder to gimp him because the water saves him. i know the water kills all of his pikmin except for blues but if the olimar stays calm and the second jump correctly then he should be fine.

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ I need to play more Olimar's on Jungle Japes still. So far two disadvantage stages to know and one advantage stage for us.... I know we have more. ._. ☆

 

[TaterSalad0811]

Using Olimar's power and spamming pikmin while he's offstage is lulzy. Pretty much anything that impedes his recovery is an advantage stage.

Rainbow Cruise-Win
Jungle Japes-He falls into water a lot, killing pikmin and thereby preventing recovery
Battlefield-Spit under the stage. No more discussion needed
Smashville-Like Battlefield, but with more camping
Green Greens-Lol, wind

 

[fromundaman]

...What? BF is a terrible stage to bring Oli to. The platforms help him out so much, since he can Usmash and Uair through them, and if you approach near the ground, which you will kind of be forced to do here, you get pivot grabbed.

The stage doesn't hurt his recovery at all either. Don't count on spitting under the stage; you can do that on a lot of stages, and with better results (PS1, FO, Picto, PS2, LM, Lylat, etc.).

Also, GG is bad too. He can just camp all day and pivot grab every approach, not to mention he'll kill you ridiculously early here.

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ I don't know, with Battlefield Olimar can't Pikmin spam like he could which is a major problem to deal with. With platforms, you'll have to be on the ground for him to successfully spam you with Pikmin. I haven't tried Olimar with Pictochat or Lylat Cruise, how good is those stages for us? ☆

 

[TaterSalad0811]

☆ I don't know, with Battlefield Olimar can't Pikmin spam like he could which is a major problem to deal with. With platforms, you'll have to be on the ground for him to successfully spam you with Pikmin. I haven't tried Olimar with Pictochat or Lylat Cruise, how good is those stages for us? ☆

Imma say Lylat is about even, though Picto is pretty much Final Destination with occasional doodles. Not too educated on stages, so don't expect much intelligent discussion from me here...

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ Does this conclude the stage talk of Olimar or is there more to add? ☆

 

[TaterSalad0811]

Well if you would ask the other Kirbies, I'm sure they'd contribute a bit, but that's all I've got.

 

[fromundaman]

☆ I don't know, with Battlefield Olimar can't Pikmin spam like he could which is a major problem to deal with. With platforms, you'll have to be on the ground for him to successfully spam you with Pikmin. I haven't tried Olimar with Pictochat or Lylat Cruise, how good is those stages for us? ☆

It barely hinders it. I mean, he's not going to be spamming from the top platform or when he's high up to recover, and when he's under a platform, he can still spam at you with only a SH needed unless you're on the top platform, where he can hit you by SH>UpB.

 

[Sky Pirate]

Fun fact: We can also hit you with a shorthopped Yellow Uair if you're standing on the top platform of BF. :3

 

[Lord Viper]

It barely hinders it. I mean, he's not going to be spamming from the top platform or when he's high up to recover, and when he's under a platform, he can still spam at you with only a SH needed unless you're on the top platform, where he can hit you by SH>UpB.

☆ Doh! I forgot to reply. >.< ☆

☆ I see what your saying now. I guess the only good starter for us would be Lylat Cruise or Pokemon Stadium if we are lucky for those two to be starter. So only Yoshi's Island and Smashville is the only starte for us?! )= ☆

Fun fact: We can also hit you with a shorthopped Yellow Uair if you're standing on the top platform of BF. :3

☆ I'm pretty sure we can block it. =P ☆

☆ But I understand where your getting at. ☆

☆ Not enough discussion here, are we done or continue? ☆

 

[TaterSalad0811]

I say done, but if SV is one of the recommended starters, why not FD then?

 

[Kewkky]

Wow tater, you're the last post in 12 11 different threads. How does that make you feel?

Obviously not spam, because you're actually saying stuff that matters. :bigthumbu

 

[fromundaman]

I say done, but if SV is one of the recommended starters, why not FD then?

The moving platform can help us avoid Pikmin while mixing up approaches somewhat. Also, being below Olimar generally seems good.

The big problem with FD is that it is big, so lots of camping, and we kind of always have to land near him, which is not something we want. That being said, I wouldn't consider it horrible. In fact, it might be better than YI (His pivot grab is dumb on non-flat stages. Well, on any stage really.).

☆ I'm pretty sure we can block it. =P ☆

Won't it shieldpoke?

 

[Sky Pirate]

☆ I see what your saying now. I guess the only good starter for us would be Lylat Cruise or Pokemon Stadium if we are lucky for those two to be starter. ☆

Wow, I didn't realize how badly Kirby has it in this match-up. D:
Lylat gives us extra Yellows, platforms, and some fun uneven terrain to play with.

 

[TaterSalad0811]

Yeah, I just played an olimar yesterday. On wifi. Then I was the one who got gayed by Frigate. Seriously, there's a hidden lip under it.

More importantly, did we discuss it yet? The metal stage type gives Oli (I think) Yellow pikmin, but he can't tether the left edge, though he can grab like gayness, and at the height (or lack thereof) you have to be to Bair him, he can grab you anyway. Spitting him under is a near guaranteed K.O., but risky as anything. He can shark the platforms with his Uair, and those yellow pikmin don't help us there either.

Get Jowii on this once the stage discussion is over.

Wow tater, you're the last post in 12 11 different threads. How does that make you feel?

Obviously not spam, because you're actually saying stuff that matters. :bigthumbu

I think I might get Canvas Curse this weekend. Not sure though.

 

[Sage JoWii]

Get me on what? >_> the MU?

 

[TaterSalad0811]

Get me on what? >_> the MU?

Hyehsz, for quite some time we've been very confused with the oli MU. That and Falco, though it's mostly about the ratio, which is kinda dumb if you ask me.

 

[Sage JoWii]

Well I'm very fluent with the Oli matchup as I've played a lot as Kirby (though now I use MK for that MU);

It's definitely a hard MU, I wanna say 40-60 Oli favor or worse. If you guys want, we'll skip the lower bracket character for this week (Pika) and have Oli instead? Talk about it in the KGD and I'll consider.

 

[Lord Viper]

Olimar match up is a lie!

☆ Next character then, any suggestions? ☆

 

[TaterSalad0811]

Have we done Diddy yet?

 

[Sky Pirate]

Umm... Sorry to bump such an old topic.
I recently got to play three different Olimar players on various stages and learned a few things.

1. How can ANY of you fight an Oli on FD? That's just painful. D:
2. Rainbow Cruise seems solid if you can keep your momentum.
3. PS1 doesn't seem to give much of an advantage, if any.

I haven't gotten to play a fellow Oli on our ultra-secret crap stage yet, though. T_T

I'm looking forward to seeing what you guys have to say about counterpicking Dedede and Toon Link when you eventually get around to them. ^^;

 

[Sage JoWii]

SUPER BUMP!!!!!!!

Alright guys, until Viper updates this (or passes it if he's no longer up to tending to it) we need to get some discussion back in here!

New stagelist with the new ruleset.
First off, Distant Planet.

The Slant- >_> On the left side of the stage is the slant. It's a walk off that periodically becomes something of a waterfall when the level rains. Best part of this level IMO. Rock shenanigans seem obvious, amirite? With a stock lead or percent lead that seems like the best area to camp because you can use FC a bit because it'll angle down and UThrow should kill earlier the higher up you get. Another thing is once a character gets close, you can just Rock and let it carry you down the slope away from your opponent! Lastly, against the ICs MU if you're on the slant when it rains and are being CG'd it'll break the grab! When it rains and we Rock it or FC it how does the attack play out? DISCUSS!!!

The Mid-ground- MK obviously will shark the **** out of this area but I see no reason why Kirby can't do the same even if it's slightly slower. Another thing is that it's small! For ppl like Yoshi, Falco, Samus and other campy characters you can really get in there and bring the fight to them.

The 'platforms'- They're bouncy? Someone (prolly me) needs to see how FC and Rock can be used in interesting ways on these.

The monster!!- >_> Shenanigans. It's an advantage and disadvantage to everyone the same.
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Luigi's Mansion

This one is really ****ing straightforward. The reason we say you should take Snake to PS1, despite it being a solid Snake CP or neutral stage (see what I did thar?), is because the terrain helps you to live longer while you dole out damage. LM seems to be the EXACT same thing but on a large scale as the whole stage seems to be an excuse to live longer and aircamp harder.

Honestly if you play this level right there's no reason why you should ever die before 100%.

Could this be the golden CP vs. the IC MU? Aircamp using the many levels to avoid getting grabbed and bait to punish. The vertical walls enclosing the mansion stop ICs projectiles to assist with avoid damage while camping. We can tech the kill move following the 'infinite' grab off the first floor ceiling I think but I'll definitely try and research this first.

Projectiles get halted HARD on this stage, which is amazing against those annoying MUs we have to get around the projectiles.
=========================================================================

I don't know PTAD that well so I'll have to play that a lot more to see what useful Kirby advantages can possibly be on that stage. Hopefully my post can encourage experimentation and comments on these new CPs.

 

[C~Dog]

I have a tourney this weekend, so I can try out some of the new stages for CPs and give my thoughts.

I have CPd Luigi's in the past however. I have a thought: when using Uthrow inside the mansion, does the height gain of the platforms cancel out the high ceiling of the stage?

 

[Lord Viper]

★ New stage list eh? I think it's about time this thread woke up from it's slumber. Since PTAD is counter pick, Kirby mains will have a much better chance to win against characters like Ice Climbers, Marth, (though we have a lot of stage advantages against him), Olimar, and other characters that need edges to survive. =3 ♛

★ Since it's been months since the last discussion, we should start new... resuming with Olimar. ♛

 

[fromundaman]

PTAD gives us a stage with no edges, which helps us gimp and punish recoveries like Marth's and ICs, and has a couple other things. First off, a large stage is good for keeping us alive. Secondly, grabs and inhale make it easy-ish for us to get people into the cars.
Also, on the part of the stage where there's 3 platforms and the track curves upwards on the left side of the screen, when the cars come below you, only the top platform is safe. However, if you Dthrow on that platform, your opponent's hurtbox goes slightly under the platform and gets hit by the cars.


Also, Luigi's Mansion is a horrible place for us to go. I don't remember what ICs have there, but it's a great stage for them, and almost every character in the game uses the stage better than us (DK never dies, Oli is the absolute gayest thing ever there, ROB and MK have some gay **** there with Dsmash and tornado respectively, Zelda can Usmash to Dsmash, and Uair through the lower platforms, Diddy has Barrel shenanigans and ******** good combos there, etc.)
This stage being legal means I have a new perma-ban for every tourny allowing it.

 

[Sage JoWii]

I did like PTAD last night when I played it @ my smashfest. >_> No edges means Falco, Fox, Wolf and ZSS all have to recover ON the level and you can get massive punishment on their recoveries.

 

[fromundaman]

Exactly. On PTAD, TL, Link, Marth, all the starfox chars, potentially shiek/Zelda, Luigi, Mario, Pika, Lucario, CF, Diddy (Kinda, if he has to use his UpB), and Ness all get punished hard for recovering (IE Hammer or Fsmash).
Oli, ZSS, Ike, and Ivysaur are going to have a hell of a time recovering without hitting the track, which does 40% each time if I remember correctly, and we can Dair or footstool them back into it.