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K. Rool's Kremling Kutthroats: PM BKupa666 for an Invite to the New K. Rool Thread

Groose

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Some of you may be thinking that I'm grossly overestimating K. Rool based on my last couple of posts: In truth, I'd really only peg him right at 50% or so in chance--he could go either way, and neither way would really surprise me. I do think he's more likely than Dixie now, though.

I wasn't aware. He doesn't appear as a playable character, it seems, but I suppose this does serves as an appearance.

Besides, Little Mac was revealed this month because February 2014 marks the 30th Anniversary of the original arcade Punch-Out!! game (which was first released in February 1984).

In that light, February's Direct was the most appropriate occasion imaginable to reveal Little Mac. This only further serves to cement the pattern of Newcomer Direct reveals (i.e. the Direct they are showcased in is determined by the nearest notable anniversary or nearest relevant game release).

February's Direct was the most appropriate time to show of Dixie as well as Mac, given the TF release and the Direct's showcase of the game. But she was nowhere to be seen. Either Mac's priority has pushed back her reveal, she was always going to be shown off later, or she isn't in SSB4 pure and simple. The aforementioned pattern when it comes to Newcomer reveals in Directs, and how Dixie did not adhere to this pattern, does not do her any favours for her chances.
Which should logically take precedence for Nintendo: celebrating an anniversary (without even mentioning that they're doing so!) or promoting a game that is supposed to help bail out a struggling system?

If they truly had the the potential to do both up their sleeves, they would probably have gone with promotion. And since they didn't... maybe they didn't have the potential to do both up their sleeves.

That's just an easter egg, and it's not even a connection I've ever made myself. Using the cartoon to bolster K. Rool's chances is pretty silly, if you ask me. That's like assuming that because Sonic ate a chili dog in the opening cutscene, that Sally Acorn and Bunnie Rabbot should have appeared in Sonic Generations.

And to address the earlier comment about DK64 being poorly received, I can only speak for myself, but I find that game incredibly boring and tedious and really don't get the love for it. On the flipside, I really don't get the ire hurtled at DKC3. I love that game, and would call it my second favorite in the series.
Eh. I'd like to disagree. I think it attests to K. Rool's overall importance to the series. I'd say his screen-time-dominating role in a semi-popular cartoon is at least as important as Dixie's rolls in Diddy Kong Racing or Donkey Knga.

Oh, and in my eyes DKC=DKC2>DKC3>DKC4>DK64. I haven't been able to play the first DKC for a few years, though, so my opinions on it may change when I finally get to do so again.

I would probably say that a villain is more likely to get a third slot of the series over a secondary sidekick. Just looking back at past Smash games, the pattern I notice for larger series is usually main protaganist -> main side kick -> main antagonist -> something else.
In most cases, you'd be hands-down right. However, the DK series doesn't really conform to such labels. Dixie is the primary sidekick in the second game of the series, and the main character of DKC3. She's qualified enough to get into Smash on her own right; the only real reason she isn't a near shoo-in is because she has to compete with someone who is similarly deserving.

The 16-bit era was my bread and butter, but I don't think that has anything to do with my distaste for DK64, or collect-a-thons in general. I LOVE Banjo-Kazooie and its sequel, they're two of my favorite games of all time. DK64 just doesn't do anything for me.

And if you haven't played the original DKC trilogy, may I ask... what on earth are you waiting for?
Agreed. My all-time favorite platformer is Mario 64, yet I think the all four of the Country games are better than DK64, which is a good, but not great, game in my eyes.

I don't get why people think Dixie not being revealed along with TF hurts her chances. Why would they reveal Dixie before having the person she's most connected to on the roster? I really can't imagine a Dixie trailer with no Diddy Kong. And no, they wouldn't have revealed them both at the same time. There's nothing that leads us to believe that they would do that for any characters. Now, an argument may be made for Diddy not being revealed sooner but that doesn't eliminate the possibility of her being revealed at E3 or even being a secret character.
It's not anywhere near definite that Dixie is out because she wan't revealed. Even so, I say that it does hurt her chances. The vast majority of returning veterans and Rosalina herself were revealed to hype up major Nintendo releases, and nearly every major Nintendo release (bar Pokemon, which didn't need it!) has been hyped with a character announcement. Why wouldn't they hype Tropical Freeze, a game they hope will really help turn around the Wii-U's poor sales, if they could do so? Also, look at the measure of hype Little Mac created--wouldn't that have best been saved for closer to the launch of Smash? If Dixie is in and she's finished, then I see no reason why her reveal didn't switch places with Mac's.
Isn't it possible that Dixie has been planned, but hasn't been completed yet? She may be a low priority, last-minute clone choice that will be finished after the higher priority cast is completed. We've still got up to 10 months before the game is released, and Sonic shows that the Smash team can pump out a character pretty quickly at the last minute.
Solid point, and one of the primary reasons I still say Dixie has a pretty good (~30% or so) shot at being in this game.

Someone said it's a coincidence that DK's Banana Slamma became his Giant Punch in Smash? I'll call BS on that now, for a reason beyond the cartoon airing during Smash 64's development and having a cult fanbase in Japan.



Sakurai says: He's white! Is this Yeti DK?



Yes. Yes it is.
I knew there was some other thing that Smash took from the cartoon, I just couldn't think of what it was. I forgot all about Eddie the Mean Old Yeti!
 
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MasterWarlord

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I don't get why people think Dixie not being revealed along with TF hurts her chances. Why would they reveal Dixie before having the person she's most connected to on the roster? I really can't imagine a Dixie trailer with no Diddy Kong. And no, they wouldn't have revealed them both at the same time. There's nothing that leads us to believe that they would do that for any characters. Now, an argument may be made for Diddy not being revealed sooner but that doesn't eliminate the possibility of her being revealed at E3 or even being a secret character.
I was assuming Dixie would be revealed during the direct alongside Diddy as a single character slot. It was the most logical way to bypass the fact that Diddy had not been revealed yet. It was also the only form Sakurai considered Dixie for in Brawl, meaning he would have had to actively change his opinion that she is worth her own character slot, even though Tropical Freeze most probably was too late to take into account when he was selecting characters anyway.

Isn't it possible that Dixie has been planned, but hasn't been completed yet? She may be a low priority, last-minute clone choice that will be finished after the higher priority cast is completed. We've still got up to 10 months before the game is released, and Sonic shows that the Smash team can pump out a character pretty quickly at the last minute.
Sakurai has been showing active interest in more unique characters with his newcomer choice, and a clone doesn’t fit that description. Dixie in general doesn’t really, with her very low moveset potential that is further lowered if she is not in a tag team. Most people are pessimistic about roster quantity due to Sakurai’s various comments about how limited the roster will be. There’s not a lot of room if we’re looking at a 45 man roster.
 
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False Sense

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It's not anywhere near definite that Dixie is out because she wan't revealed. Even so, I say that it does hurt her chances. The vast majority of returning veterans and Rosalina herself were revealed to hype up major Nintendo releases, and nearly every major Nintendo release (bar Pokemon, which didn't need it!) has been hyped with a character announcement. Why wouldn't they hype Tropical Freeze, a game they hope will really help turn around the Wii-U's poor sales, if they could do so? Also, look at the measure of hype Little Mac created--wouldn't that have best been saved for closer to the launch of Smash? If Dixie is in and she's finished, then I see no reason why her reveal didn't switch places with Mac's.

Solid point, and one of the primary reasons I still say Dixie has a pretty good (~30% or so) shot at being in this game.
I might argue that, if they REALLY wanted to hype up Tropical Freeze and were planning on having Dixie, she might have been a little higher on the priority list to have been completed at that point. It's true that the Wii U isn't doing so great right now, so taking any extra precautions possible would be a smart move on their part. Having Dixie ready by that point could have been beneficial to Tropical Freeze, but clearly that didn't happen. Admittedly, this is probably reading a bit to much into the matter, but it does raise the important question of why wasn't Dixie revealed to hype up Tropical Freeze? Unless of course, she isn't present.
 

Dropkick JD

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Guess I'm still in the minority where I'm anti Dixie making it in.

That can come next year. I still feel as though the rep we need for DK this year is King K.Rool. He was needed last year as well, but he was sorely missing.
 

False Sense

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Guess I'm still in the minority where I'm anti Dixie making it in.

That can come next year. I still feel as though the rep we need for DK this year is King K.Rool. He was needed last year as well, but he was sorely missing.
Well, you're not alone in that minority.
 

MasterWarlord

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I personally believe most people hopped onto the Dixie train because she was "likely".

K. Rool has been and always will be most popular.
 

Sehnsucht

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The 16-bit era was my bread and butter, but I don't think that has anything to do with my distaste for DK64, or collect-a-thons in general. I LOVE Banjo-Kazooie and its sequel, they're two of my favorite games of all time. DK64 just doesn't do anything for me.

And if you haven't played the original DKC trilogy, may I ask... what on earth are you waiting for?
I enjoyed the BK series (particularly Banjo-Tooie) more so than DK64, so I hear you there.

As for DKC, I guess I could eventually get myself a SNES emulator or something. You can be sure that whenever such a day comes, I'll relay my impressions here. ;)


Isn't it possible that Dixie has been planned, but hasn't been completed yet? She may be a low priority, last-minute clone choice that will be finished after the higher priority cast is completed. We've still got up to 10 months before the game is released, and Sonic shows that the Smash team can pump out a character pretty quickly at the last minute.
Given how much trouble Sonic's last-minute inclusion caused in Brawl, I'd like to think that Sora would learn from their mistakes, and ensure that they lock in the roster much earlier on in development. At the very least, we see that both Sonic and Mega Man have been secured early, given their high profile Third-Party status.

And it was Sonic's Third-Party status to begin with that was the trouble, because Nintendo has to go through licensing and so forth. Dixie would not have such an obstacle in her way.

As the SSE campaign shows, Jigglypuff, Wolf, and Toon Link were lower priority, since they didn't have the time to include them in the SSE proper (and Roy and Mewtwo, and the Forbidden Seven, were also low priority if their absence is of any indication). But there is no SSE this time, which frees up a lot of development space (apparently, the SSE took 3/5 of overall resources).

With all this in mind, I would think that if Dixie was found worthy of inclusion, work would have begun earlier in the development process. Even if she is lower priority (which I would doubt, given that she is a Newcomer for a central Nintendo franchise), the lack of SSE and a larger team (thanks to the Namco-Bandai partnership) would increase her chances of completion in time for release.

SSB4 is now almost two years in development. I would think that at this point, they would have something to show for Dixie - and with the TF tie-in with the Direct, they could even have worked harder to prepare material worth showing, if she was still rough around the developmental edges.

With all this in mind, this "low priority, still working on her" train of thought doesn't seem to be very robust as an explanation for her absence in this month's Direct.


I don't get why people think Dixie not being revealed along with TF hurts her chances. Why would they reveal Dixie before having the person she's most connected to on the roster? I really can't imagine a Dixie trailer with no Diddy Kong (A). And no, they wouldn't have revealed them both at the same time. There's nothing that leads us to believe that they would do that for any characters (B). Now, an argument may be made for Diddy not being revealed sooner but that doesn't eliminate the possibility of her being revealed at E3 or even being a secret character (C).
A) I also suspected that Dixie would not be revealed before Diddy. Which is why I, along with many others, suspected that Diddy would be revealed in the Miiverse update on the night prior to the day of February's Direct.

We instead got the Home Run Bat redesign update. And then the Direct passed, with neither Diddy and Dixie in sight. Then Friday, we got Diddy for the American release of TF, but no sign of Dixie.

Diddy is now out in the open - and in conjunction with TF - so now the wait for Dixie begins.

B) They would have if they were a tag-team, but we now know this is clearly not the case. Even so, for the purpose of tying in TF to Smash, they could have shown off Diddy and Dixie. But as you rightly note, Directs are reserved for Newcomers, as the ongoing trend illustrates.

Which again leads us to the puzzling missed opportunity of not having confirmed Diddy Kong in a Miiverse update prior to the Direct. If Dixie is a solo fighter, then confirming Diddy the day before, then showing off Dixie in the Direct on the occasion for TF's release, is the most appropriate occasion to do so from every angle - marketing, advertising, relevance, and hype generation.

Having two Newcomers per Direct is unprecedented, but there's no reason they couldn't have shown off both Mac and Dixie, since they both had every reason to be shown off in this month's Direct.

If Dixie is indeed shown off later, then I will evermore scratch my head as to why she was not shown in February's Direct.

C) E3 is a venue meant to generate anticipation and interest for upcoming games. As such, E3 is best suited for heavy-hitting Newcomers - highly popular/requested characters, unexpected or surprising choices, long-overdue contenders, etc.

Is Dixie as a character and as a Smash contender a suitable fit for E3? Would she generate the hype that E3 as a whole is meant to generate? In this respect, K Rool is much more a worthy contender for an E3 showcase than Dixie.

After all, Dixie has finally returned to the main DK platformer series this year, whereas K Rool continues to toil away in the relative obscurity of DK spin-offs. To have him make his bombastic return in a high-profile crossover game such as Smash - and being a highly requested character and the seminal DK villain - would be a very hype-worthy moment, especially at E3. What better way to generate buzz for Smash than showing off such a heavy-hitting Newcomer candidate.

They could show off Dixie in conjunction with K Rool at E3 2014, but there's no way that K Rool wouldn't overshadow her.

The next Direct will be in April. Will she be shown off there? Why so, if February was the most opportune moment for revelation? Same goes for all future Directs, unless a DK property that is relevant to Dixie is announced later this year.

As for secret characters - which I take to mean, characters not revealed until after release - then I suppose she could be. Though it's hard to say how they'll approach secret characters this time around. Luigi, Marth, Lucario, Toon Link; they've already revealed characters that have been unlockable in the past. Will they be on the starting roster this time?

If we exclude Sonic and Mega Man (who will most certainly be unlockable), then we now have 22 characters. In December, January, and now February, we've gotten two new characters per month. Will this trend continue, with two per month until release (+E3 batch)? If the game is indeed released this year, then we could get up to 20 more character reveals at the most.

A question is raised by all this. If Dixie is a secret character, not meant to be revealed until after release, then why was this decision made? Why was she relegated to post-release reveal status, instead of the February Direct? Was she deemed not exciting enough to warrant Direct spotlight (as opposed to Little Mac, who clearly generated a lot of excitement)?

In the end, the outlook remains the same. Dixie could be revealed at E3; she could be revealed in a future Direct; she could be revealed only after the game is released. But there is no denying that the best possible window for her reveal has now come and gone.
 

False Sense

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Here's a thought: What do you think would happen if Dixie Kong was revealed...

As an Assist Trophy?
 

SmashShadow

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It's not anywhere near definite that Dixie is out because she wan't revealed. Even so, I say that it does hurt her chances. The vast majority of returning veterans and Rosalina herself were revealed to hype up major Nintendo releases, and nearly every major Nintendo release (bar Pokemon, which didn't need it!) has been hyped with a character announcement. Why wouldn't they hype Tropical Freeze, a game they hope will really help turn around the Wii-U's poor sales, if they could do so? Also, look at the measure of hype Little Mac created--wouldn't that have best been saved for closer to the launch of Smash? If Dixie is in and she's finished, then I see no reason why her reveal didn't switch places with Mac's.
Yes while that may be ideal, Diddy Kong and Dixie Kong equally advertise for Tropical Freeze as they are placed on par in that game. Also, this ties in to what I said in the previous post; Why would Dixie be shown off before Diddy when she's most connected to Diddy Kong? This was a prime opportunity to reveal Little Mac whereas either one of the Kongs could have been revealed within the first couple of months and they would still be advertising Tropical Freeze.
 

Sehnsucht

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Here's a thought: What do you think would happen if Dixie Kong was revealed...

As an Assist Trophy?
I find that many of the Newcomers proposed here and elsewhere more than enough deserve to make AT status, if they cannot attain playable status.

This wouldn't be ideal for the supporters of such characters (e.g. Dixie), but it would show that Sora acknowledges their significance. And this would all apply to K Rool, even though I personally would much prefer him to be playable.
 

Johnknight1

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Uh, those are not spin-offs? The Mario sports games are, but the other DK games are full games in their own right, independent of DKC.
Except that some of the Donkey Konga games no one bought and didn't come out internationally. It also doesn't help that the current DKC Returns games, the first Donkey Kong games to sell considerably since DK64, don't even acknowledge those games, or any games since DK64.

Jungle Beat at least sold decently, but it wasn't that great of a game. I still don't get why Sakurai and co. were dumb enough to include a stage from that game despite not giving us an actual DK stage from a game that wasn't a spin-off (and also that isn't a generic jungle location). They should have hired some people to help make a DKC or DK64 stage, but nope, they didn't, and they got crapped on for it, and rightfully so.

Then again, Brawl committed that cardinal sin several times (see: Metroid is lava and lava is Metroid, and Frigate Orpheon acting nothing like the actual location from Metroid Prime), and Sakurai seems to directly believe such craziness.

Truthfully I wish we could get a lava/mountain (mine cart?) DKC level and a jungle Metroid level.
 

Groose

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All this debate between Dixie and K Rool, I would just be happy to have either of them at this point.
It all comes down to this to me--Dixie is a pretty cool character, and I'd be interested in having her duke it out with some other Nintendo All-Stars. However, I've always played the DK games and wanted to take control of the villain, and I'd absolutely love having the ability to play as him and cook the gooses of Bowser, the Kongs, Mario, and Ridley.

I might argue that, if they REALLY wanted to hype up Tropical Freeze and were planning on having Dixie, she might have been a little higher on the priority list to have been completed at that point. It's true that the Wii U isn't doing so great right now, so taking any extra precautions possible would be a smart move on their part. Having Dixie ready by that point could have been beneficial to Tropical Freeze, but clearly that didn't happen. Admittedly, this is probably reading a bit to much into the matter, but it does raise the important question of why wasn't Dixie revealed to hype up Tropical Freeze? Unless of course, she isn't present.
Great reasoning. We must also consider that Tropical Freeze was supposed to launch months ago, so they probably should have been prepared to reveal her a whole lot sooner.

Yes while that may be ideal, Diddy Kong and Dixie Kong equally advertise for Tropical Freeze as they are placed on par in that game. Also, this ties in to what I said in the previous post; Why would Dixie be shown off before Diddy when she's most connected to Diddy Kong? This was a prime opportunity to reveal Little Mac whereas either one of the Kongs could have been revealed within the first couple of months and they would still be advertising Tropical Freeze.
She really wouldn't have been shown off before Diddy. Diddy would have been revealed some few weeks before the game (Marketing: hey, we have this game coming out soon! Go check out the trailer), and Dixie would have been revealed right at the game's launch (Marketing: Hey, the big new DK game is finally out! Go and get it!).

And despite the two having the same role in Tropical Freeze, the level of promotion they would create by being revealed in Smash is very different. Diddy was a veteran and very briefly caught the attention of the larger community--his reveal made people remember that there was a new DK game out. However, Dixie Kong would have captured the attention of an even larger community and held it for longer--her reveal would make people really check out the new game.
 

BridgesWithTurtles

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With all this in mind, this "low priority, still working on her" train of thought doesn't seem to be very robust as an explanation for her absence in this month's Direct.
I never implied that to be the best explanation for her absence, but simply as a point to consider. Sonic was probably a bad example. The Melee clones would probably be a better comparison to draw. The roster was decided long before Tropical Freeze was known to the public, and it's very possible that TF had little to no impact on the roster. Dixie may have been locked in as a "low priority" newcomer to create should the development team have extra time after completing everyone else. From what we can gather about Melee's development, the Final Five clones were decided on after the team found that they had enough time to make them. What I'm suggesting is that Dixie may have been chosen as one of several characters to use as late addition clones/semi-clones should they have enough time left over, much like Jigglypuff, Toon Link, and Wolf in Brawl. Since Dixie didn't become "relevant" or demanded before the Tropical Freeze reveal, she wouldn't have been as high of a priority when the roster was finalized, and they wouldn't have planned to have her and a trailer ready for TF's release.

Sakurai seems to be going for unique movesets with the newcomers this time, but there's nothing saying he won't pump out a few last-minute semiclones if he gets the time to. He's shown before that he's willing to sacrifice some creativity in order to deliver us more content, so I think it's much too early to dismiss Dixie as a contender. And besides, just because all of the newcomers we've seen have been "unique", that doesn't mean all of them will be. It's obvious that the most interesting newcomers would be likely to be shown off before release. It's entirely possible we'll see a few more conventional newcomers that won't be as heavily promoted.

If Dixie is indeed going to be in the game as a semi-clone, then it makes sense not to show her off yet; she's not as interesting. Regardless of what game she promotes, if she's not highly unique, it makes sense that Mac would be shown first. They always could have just fallen back on Diddy for a TF tie-in anyway, which they did.

Like I said, this is all just wild guessing on my part, but it's still a possibility. I think it's unwise to dismiss Dixie, especially since she'd be such easy clone potential and Sakurai has been throwing us for a loop for months now; not showing Dixie at such an obvious time is just like something he'd do. In this scenario, I'd expect the DK newcomers to be both K. Rool (who'd be very unique) and Dixie (who'd be a semi-clone and revealed later). I'd find it hard to believe that we'd get solely a semi-clone Dixie as a DK newcomer.
 
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If Dixie Kong was intended for this game, I agree that Sakurai would have prepared her for a reveal alongside Tropical Freeze. It simply fits the pattern of how newcomers have been revealed. Instead of that, we got Little Mac advertising a 2009 game and Diddy Kong bringing up the rear as a returning veteran to represent Tropical Freeze. Something just doesn't feel right about that if you consider her to be a valid 'DK' newcomer, at this point for its role in Smash Bros and as a Nintendo franchise. Donkey Kong is huge, if it's getting a clone, that's not really appropriate considering its popularity and that of its candidates. To put it into perspective, I'd say Ridley is the only other remaining newcomer ahead of K. Rool (pre-announcement up until now) and Metroid is far less relevant as a franchise. It would be a terrible decision to only give one cloned newcomer from it.

That's why I'd give it to K. Rool being revealed at E3, or a cloned Dixie is revealed at launch, or both. I don't see DK getting nothing. I'd say the middle option is bone-headed to say the least, and not in-keeping with the trends Sakurai has taken when giving us newcomers.
 
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Sehnsucht

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I never implied that to be the best explanation for her absence, but simply as a point to consider. Sonic was probably a bad example. The Melee clones would probably be a better comparison to draw. The roster was decided long before Tropical Freeze was known to the public, and it's very possible that TF had little to no impact on the roster. Dixie may have been locked in as a "low priority" newcomer to create should the development team have extra time after completing everyone else. From what we can gather about Melee's development, the Final Five clones were decided on after the team found that they had enough time to make them. What I'm suggesting is that Dixie may have been chosen as one of several characters to use as late addition clones/semi-clones should they have enough time left over, much like Jigglypuff, Toon Link, and Wolf in Brawl. Since Dixie didn't become "relevant" or demanded before the Tropical Freeze reveal, she wouldn't have been as high of a priority when the roster was finalized, and they wouldn't have planned to have her and a trailer ready for TF's release.

Sakurai seems to be going for unique movesets with the newcomers this time, but there's nothing saying he won't pump out a few last-minute semiclones if he gets the time to. He's shown before that he's willing to sacrifice some creativity in order to deliver us more content, so I think it's much too early to dismiss Dixie as a contender. And besides, just because all of the newcomers we've seen have been "unique", that doesn't mean all of them will be. It's obvious that the most interesting newcomers would be likely to be shown off before release. It's entirely possible we'll see a few more conventional newcomers that won't be as heavily promoted.

If Dixie is indeed going to be in the game as a semi-clone, then it makes sense not to show her off yet; she's not as interesting. Regardless of what game she promotes, if she's not highly unique, it makes sense that Mac would be shown first. They always could have just fallen back on Diddy for a TF tie-in anyway, which they did.

Like I said, this is all just wild guessing on my part, but it's still a possibility. I think it's unwise to dismiss Dixie, especially since she'd be such easy clone potential and Sakurai has been throwing us for a loop for months now; not showing Dixie at such an obvious time is just like something he'd do. In this scenario, I'd expect the DK newcomers to be both K. Rool (who'd be very unique) and Dixie (who'd be a semi-clone and revealed later). I'd find it hard to believe that we'd get solely a semi-clone Dixie as a DK newcomer.
This seems fair. And indeed, this (semi)clone angle is much more sensible than late Third-Party additions.

So K Rool would be a higher-priority Newcomer (for a variety of reasons), and Dixie would be icing on the cake if time allows for it. If they can squeeze in two DK Newcomers, then all the better. But if not, then we get the (inherently) more interesting and unique K Rool as the DK Newcomer.

I would never outright dismiss Dixie, or claim by subjective fiat that she is not in the game; I merely see her absence these past few weeks as a slight shift in the chances at play for DK Newcomers. At the moment, K Rool seems more likely, and Dixie less likely - even if only by a hair's width. That's all there is to it, really. ;)


If Dixie Kong was intended for this game, I agree that Sakurai would have prepared her for a reveal alongside Tropical Freeze. It simply fits the pattern of how newcomers have been revealed. Instead of that, we got Little Mac advertising a 2009 game and Diddy Kong bringing up the rear as a returning veteran to represent Tropical Freeze. Something just doesn't feel right about that if you consider her to be a valid 'DK' newcomer, at this point for its role in Smash Bros and as a Nintendo franchise. Donkey Kong is huge, if it's getting a clone, that's not really appropriate considering its popularity and that of its candidates. To put it into perspective, I'd say Ridley is the only other newcomer at this point ahead of K. Rool and Metroid is far less relevant as a franchise. It would be a terrible decision to only give one cloned newcomer from it.

That's why I'd give it to K. Rool being revealed at E3, or a cloned Dixie is revealed at launch, or both. I don't see DK getting nothing. I'd say the middle option is bone-headed to say the least, and not in-keeping with the trends Sakurai has taken when giving us newcomers.
Just to clarify that Little Mac's inclusion in the Direct was not to promote the 2009 Punch-Out remake, but because February 2014 marks the 30th Anniversary of the Punch-Out!! franchise.

The rest is solid. :)
 
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Just to clarify that Little Mac's inclusion in the Direct was not to promote the 2009 Punch-Out remake, but because February 2014 marks the 30th Anniversary of the Punch-Out!! franchise.

The rest is solid. :)
I know friend, I even made a point of that in a previous reply. That is a great point I overlooked in my gargantuan rant post last page. However, I was alluding to the (obscure) fact that Little Mac's Dojo page links to the Punch Out!! Wii website. Go check it out if you didn't notice that.
 

Sehnsucht

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I know friend, I even made a point of that in a previous reply. That is a great point I overlooked in my gargantuan rant post last page. However, I was alluding to the (obscure) fact that Little Mac's Dojo page links to the Punch Out!! Wii website. Go check it out if you didn't notice that.
I do recall reading that somewhere. With 2009 Punch-Out being the most recent of Mac's games, it's the only game available to be linked on the official Smash site. So that's only to be expected.

In your post, however, your wording did say that they revealed Little Mac this month to "promote" 2009 Punch-Out, so I thought you might not have known about the Anniversary stuff.

Anyway, glad we understand one another. :)
 
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No harm, no foul, I enjoy your posts immensely so I didn't want there to be a misunderstanding. Not to say there aren't many great Kutthroats.

Is it too late for Tropical Freeze to get music into Smash 4? David Wise's soundtrack is freaking superb, and tracks such as this one perfectly set the tone. Although Returns had some killer original tracks too, just not on this level or in this style.

 

Johnknight1

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Anyone else notice that all the Donkey Kong character designs seem similar to DK64=???

I think we're gonna get a K. Rool that is mostly inspired by DK64 guys. I just have "that feeling" that the development team likes that game a lot, just like how seemingly everyone from HAL Laboratories likes Star Fox a lot (which confuses me as to why they don't make a Star Fox game).

Edit: Seriously, there's about like 2 dozen DKC 1-3+DK64 songs or remixes of said songs that should be in Smash, as well as about half dozen Tropical Freeze tracks.
 
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Sehnsucht

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No harm, no foul, I enjoy your posts immensely so I didn't want there to be a misunderstanding. Not to say there aren't many great Kutthroats.

Is it too late for Tropical Freeze to get music into Smash 4? David Wise's soundtrack is freaking superb, and tracks such as this one perfectly set the tone. Although Returns had some killer original tracks too, just not on this level or in this style.

We'll probably get a few tracks from DKC Returns, if nothing else. From Tropical Freeze music would be welcome, if that sample is any indication.

Did we get any DK64 tracks in Brawl? If not, I'd imagine it's because of the Rareware affiliation.


Anyone else notice that all the Donkey Kong character designs seem similar to DK64=???

I think we're gonna get a K. Rool that is mostly inspired by DK64 guys. I just have "that feeling" that the development team likes that game a lot, just like how seemingly everyone from HAL Laboratories likes Star Fox a lot (which confuses me as to why they don't make a Star Fox game).
I hope they add boxing elements to K Rool from his DK64 boss fight. Definitely a Down B shockwave pound attack, and maybe some boxing gloves for his tilts. Little Mac won't be the only one at home in a boxing ring. ;)

It would also be great to have his blue boxing uniform, complete with the belt and the shoes, as an alternate costume (along with the Kaptain and Baron outfits, complete with palette swaps for each).
 

BridgesWithTurtles

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I agree that K. Rool would likely pull a lot of inspiration from DK64. Diddy did the same in Brawl, and it's true that Sakurai (or someone working on Smash) seems to really like the game. Melee even gave us an original cover of the DK Rap. K. Rool's Melee trophy also notably references the events of that game. Apparently DK64 has a bit of a following in Japan.
 
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Groose

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While we're on the subject of music, I'd love to see either of these two Tropical Freeze songs blaring in the background of a King K. Rool stage. Grassland Groove or Scorch n Torch.

Both make my Top-10 DK music ever... and that's saying something.
 

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It would also be great to have his blue boxing uniform, complete with the belt and the shoes, as an alternate costume (along with the Kaptain and Baron outfits, complete with palette swaps for each).
I never considered it, but yeah, that would be awesome.

Just imagine: 6 outfits of the King persona, 2 outfits of the Kaptain persona, 2 outfits of the Mad Scientist persona, and an outfit that's related to boxing.

IT WOULD BE A GLORIOUS FOR ALL HUMANS KROKODILES ALIKE!!!!
 

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We'll probably get a few tracks from DKC Returns, if nothing else. From Tropical Freeze music would be welcome, if that sample is any indication.

Did we get any DK64 tracks in Brawl? If not, I'd imagine it's because of the Rareware affiliation.
Unfortunately no, which is disappointing. Having said that, it did have some DKC music in there and the DK rap was used in Melee (which was developed during the Rareware buyout) so it probably wasn't Rare that stopped it from being used.

I hope they add boxing elements to K Rool from his DK64 boss fight. Definitely a Down B shockwave pound attack, and maybe some boxing gloves for his tilts. Little Mac won't be the only one at home in a boxing ring. ;)
It would also be great to have his blue boxing uniform, complete with the belt and the shoes, as an alternate costume (along with the Kaptain and Baron outfits, complete with palette swaps for each).
I definitely agree, I could see the Shockwave move having a similar effect to Bowser's but with a shorter jump and more AoE.

IT WOULD BE A GLORIOUS FOR ALL HUMANS KROKODILES ALIKE!!!!
Hear Hear!
 
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MasterWarlord

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I hope they add boxing elements to K Rool from his DK64 boss fight. Definitely a Down B shockwave pound attack, and maybe some boxing gloves for his tilts. Little Mac won't be the only one at home in a boxing ring. ;)

It would also be great to have his blue boxing uniform, complete with the belt and the shoes, as an alternate costume (along with the Kaptain and Baron outfits, complete with palette swaps for each).
If K. Rool actually gets in, he may get the relevance he needs to show up in the next Punch Out game as a guest. First DK, then his antagonist based off his DK64 appearance.
 
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BKupa666

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K. Rool would almost certainly get another one of those cliche "clashing punches" pics with either Little Mac, Villager, or Bowser.

Aside from the reveal date details, I agree with @Smash Daddy in that there has not been nearly enough Tropical Freeze music in this thread.


This one is my personal favorite. It's basically a continuation of Krook's March from DKC2.
 

False Sense

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I hope they add boxing elements to K Rool from his DK64 boss fight. Definitely a Down B shockwave pound attack, and maybe some boxing gloves for his tilts. Little Mac won't be the only one at home in a boxing ring. ;)

It would also be great to have his blue boxing uniform, complete with the belt and the shoes, as an alternate costume (along with the Kaptain and Baron outfits, complete with palette swaps for each).
Since Little Mac's reveal, I've really wanted to have a four way match between Mac, King K. Rool, Donkey Kong and maybe King Dedede or Lucario. There are quite a few good characters who'd enjoy a boxing ring to fight in.
 

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Since Little Mac's reveal, I've really wanted to have a four way match between Mac, King K. Rool, Donkey Kong and maybe King Dedede or Lucario. There are quite a few good characters who'd enjoy a boxing ring to fight in.
If anything has ever made me want 6-player matches, the prospect of hosting a K. Rool/Mac/DK/Villager/Lucario/Dedede battle is that thing.
 

False Sense

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If anything has ever made me want 6-player matches, the prospect of hosting a K. Rool/Mac/DK/Villager/Lucario/Dedede battle is that thing.
I guess Tournament mode would be the closest you could get.

...Actually, that in itself is also a pretty cool idea. A full out boxing tournament would be pretty fun with a group of people. Maybe throw in characters like Bowser, Kirby, or Captain Falcon for a little more variety.
 

BKupa666

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I'm trying to imagine a Punch Out!! styled K. Rool at the moment, and am currently thinking of him pulling out his blunderbuss and shooting boxing gloves for Little Mac to dodge.

Then, there's obviously the playing dead bit to work in for when he gets knocked down...
 
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Mega Bidoof

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I'm trying to imagine a Punch Out!! styled K. Rool at the moment, and am currently thinking of him pulling out his blunderbuss and shooting boxing gloves for Little Mac to dodge.
I'm trying to imagine a bus driver styled K. Rool.

He could drive his blunder bus and drive it across the stage as a final smash! :troll:
 

BridgesWithTurtles

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I don't know why, but a bus-driver K. Rool persona seems exceptionally hilarious and somehow very in-character. Probably has to do with the fact that I can easily imagine there being quite a few overweight, insane bus drivers with eye tics.
 

BKupa666

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I don't know why, but a bus-driver K. Rool persona seems exceptionally hilarious and somehow very in-character. Probably has to do with the fact that I can easily imagine there being quite a few overweight, insane bus drivers with eye tics.
An excerpt from Iwata Asks:

Iwata: Wow, asking the person who crafted scenarios for Final Fantasy to write one for Smash Bros. is a pretty big deal.

Sakurai: I know! (laughs) I didn’t ask him to write everything from scratch though. I explained the world of Smash Bros. and its characters and then asked for his help. The first storyline he came up with, however, wasn’t exactly what I was looking for.

Iwata: It was different than what you had envisioned.

Sakurai: Right. It wasn’t bad at all and had its own appeal, but it was a bit different than what I had envisioned it would be. It went something like this... ”Some of the characters are on a bus on the way to the stadium. Samus is there. Donkey Kong is there and Snake is watching the bus from afar.” It was like that. (laughs)

"Some of the characters are on a bus on the way to the stadium."

"The characters are on a bus."

"Bus."

 

BridgesWithTurtles

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An excerpt from Iwata Asks:

Iwata: Wow, asking the person who crafted scenarios for Final Fantasy to write one for Smash Bros. is a pretty big deal.

Sakurai: I know! (laughs) I didn’t ask him to write everything from scratch though. I explained the world of Smash Bros. and its characters and then asked for his help. The first storyline he came up with, however, wasn’t exactly what I was looking for.

Iwata: It was different than what you had envisioned.

Sakurai: Right. It wasn’t bad at all and had its own appeal, but it was a bit different than what I had envisioned it would be. It went something like this... ”Some of the characters are on a bus on the way to the stadium. Samus is there. Donkey Kong is there and Snake is watching the bus from afar.” It was like that. (laughs)

"Some of the characters are on a bus on the way to the stadium."

"The characters are on a bus."

"Bus."

Ah, so that's why K. Rool wasn't in Brawl. He was driving the bus, but that scenario got scrapped. Man, SSE really is responsible for all of Brawl's problems, isn't it?
 

False Sense

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Ah, so that's why K. Rool wasn't in Brawl. He was driving the bus, but that scenario got scrapped. Man, SSE really is responsible for all of Brawl's problems, isn't it?
The bus probably got sucked into that Subspace thing, trapping K. Rool and preventing him from appearing in future Donkey Kong games.
 
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