Social Jigglypuff Social Thread (read first post!)

[Shrimpchris]

Description said it worked on Jiggs, could be helpful but I won't be able to try anything til this evening or tomorrow.
Creds to Jiggly for making me think to post this here. (I saw your comment and it reminded me of the thread )

 

[Codaption]

Definitely a fantastic tool for us. Can you imagine how well that'll work in tandem with Rest?

 

[drakeirving]

Not too sure how much better it meshes with Rest considering we already sort of have the option of let-go -> jump -> Rest (maybe it moves us forward better?). Being able to shield immediately or grab immediately might be more powerful just by it existing. Getting back to neutral from a ledge scenario is often a problem for Jiggs, so being able to take care of some options is good. By doing so we then open for mixups where people might start using more punishable options to try and hit us from ledge and then the Rest comes out.

 

[Codaption]

So I checked Kurogane's info on Puff, and noticed some inconsistencies. Some of her stat listings are off-for example, it says her fallspeed is at 52nd place, yet if you check the overall rankings it still puts her at the bottom (55th).

I also noticed it said our Nair has 6 frames of startup and our airdodge 6 frames of endlag, when I had heard from around here that both values had one less. I'd chalk it up to my own gullibility if not for the aforementioned mistakes, so I just want to confirm here.

 

[drakeirving]

1.1.1 airdodges were all nerfed 1 frame, so maybe that's what you're thinking of. Nair doesn't have 6 frames of startup, but it comes out frame 6 (i.e. 5 frames startup) which is probably what you meant.

 

[Desu~]

I dunno about this,

but guys,

This **** ****ing sucks.

For so many obvious reasons.

 

[Vinylic.]

Can't see any reason. It's hard to pull off and it requires just as much practice as Perfect Pivoting and Pivot dashing combined.

Do point out why it's bad news for us though.

 

[Shrimpchris]

Yeah, finally got the chance to try it and it's actually stupid hard to do right. Pretty disappointing tbh.

 

[Codaption]

I mean, yeah, it hurts our edgeguarding even more but it's ultimately just another option at the ledge. It's basically a better version of a standard ledgehop- insanely useful, sure, but also insanely risky. In fact, I'd say it's even riskier than a ledgehop against us because we can meet them with a Rest if we read it.

Not to mention, we can do it too

 

[FooltheFlames]

Not to mention, we can do it too

^ This.
So No worries~

I've been practicing this tech with Puff, Mew2, nad Greninja, and I can only sometimes do it on Lylat anyways. And others are having pretty much the same results- only able to do it on Lylat.
If anything, we could ban Lylat on a counter pick if we dont like it being used~

 

[Uncle Tonkle]

This tech doesn't give invincibility like Melee waveland so it's probably not as scary as most people think. If you cover it they might not even have a double jump left (which is why I think it's a lot less risky to use for Jiggs as well). But time will tell what happens to this tech, so far I can get it like 1/3 times on BF. Something to think about is instantly using sing from this. Even if you mess up you can still do a nearly instant sing from the ledge. Now if only it was just that little bit more reliable...


Also hi I'm new to the Puff boards.

 

[Jiggly]

This tech doesn't give invincibility like Melee waveland so it's probably not as scary as most people think. If you cover it they might not even have a double jump left (which is why I think it's a lot less risky to use for Jiggs as well). But time will tell what happens to this tech, so far I can get it like 1/3 times on BF. Something to think about is instantly using sing from this. Even if you mess up you can still do a nearly instant sing from the ledge. Now if only it was just that little bit more reliable...


Also hi I'm new to the Puff boards.

Welcome to the puff boards! ^_^

 

[Desu~]

Can't see any reason. It's hard to pull off and it requires just as much practice as Perfect Pivoting and Pivot dashing combined.

Do point out why it's bad news for us though.

I meant as in it's super useless lol.

 

[Vinylic.]

Well, I use sing. Nothing is useless.

 

[Uncle Tonkle]

I feel like not landing on the stage with this is probably more useful than landing with it for Puff at this point. Instant aerials from the ledge, flying Sing from the ledge and probably Pound from the ledge feel like better options than standard getups unless you really need the invincibility frames. I would only feel going on stage with instant getup is good when you want a grab instead of shield poke from Pound, because you can edgeguard their recoveries easily. Then again if you can break their shield you get an edgeguard regardless so there's a lot of situational stuff for this tech.

So yeah, this basically makes Puff on the ledge a relatively big threat compared to without it. Also Pound makes this a lot better than it is for a bunch of other characters, so I'd say it's not useless at all.

We should probably find a different thread for this lol

 

[drakeirving]

But the only thing this changes is getup on stage. You could always drop, instant jump and aerial.

 

[Uncle Tonkle]

Yeah fair enough lol

Something fun with lagless getup is if you can do it perfectly you can drop to the ledge again immediately and reset your invincibility frames. I don't think this is humanly possible to do consistently but it's fun in theory regardless

 

[Vinylic.]

Sigh.

9th place tonight.
3rd place a week ago.

Yay. Labbing for the next time I fight PrinceRamen. I got more MUs to work on: Ryu, C. Falcon, Fox, Falco, and Wii Fit Trainer. If anyone has advice, I'd like to know.

 

[Desu~]

Im surprised people seems to have a hard time dealing with Ryu.
Well, I can't win against the current best Ryu in Montreal as of right now, but his DA, grab, jabs, ftilts, fsmash, projectiles, side b and down b are all avoidable by crouching. This leaves him mostly approaching from the air.

He hits like a truck though, so you wouldn't really want to go aggro on him.

 

[Uncle Tonkle]

Sigh.

9th place tonight.
3rd place a week ago.

Yay. Labbing for the next time I fight PrinceRamen. I got more MUs to work on: Ryu, C. Falcon, Fox, Falco, and Wii Fit Trainer. If anyone has advice, I'd like to know.

Falcon gets a lot of stuff off of downthrows. Learn his grabbing patterns and duck under his grabs when he does them, usually they're really grab heavy in general so it's pretty easy to get the read.

Fox is hell everywhere except offstage. We can't get anything on him for free in neutral while he can just get all the janky hits. The best thing you can do is try to stay diagonal to him and bait him by weaving in and out his effective range (his diagonal range is the worst because it requires jumps and his aerial momentum is pretty bad). He should be dead every time he's offstage though.

Falco is basically the same deal. Offstage he should be super dead because of his recovery being the same as Fox but shorter, but don't get spiked by his side B. Also his aerial momentum is different so just search for spots he seems to have trouble hitting you while you're safe to hit him.

I sadly haven't played many Ryus but from the little experience I do have hitting his shield can get you killed at like 60% with OoS shoryu, which really blows. Apparently you can crouch his stuff so abuse that I guess.

Wii Fit Trainer is basically the same story as Ryu for me. From what I can tell she has poor range and recovery, so you can probably just keep trading things all day and get away with it. From just theorycrafting I thought she had a lot of trouble with aggro players, but since I literally haven't played a WFT in at least half a year it's kinda up in the air. I guess you can space outside of her small ranges but inside a zone where she doesn't feel comfortable to just throw out projectiles at you and you're golden.


So yeah, most those things are pretty basic. The one thing Jiggs definitely needs is a solid understanding of effective range, so just learn those for all characters and it should be enough to play the matchup.

 

[MarioMeteor]

Sigh.

9th place tonight.
3rd place a week ago.

Yay. Labbing for the next time I fight PrinceRamen. I got more MUs to work on: Ryu, C. Falcon, Fox, Falco, and Wii Fit Trainer. If anyone has advice, I'd like to know.

Against Falcon: duck a lot. No, seriously, his dash grab can be ducked under, so if you have good reaction time, you can use that to your advantage. Don't try to fight him onstage too much, either. He has a nasty habit of killing Jigglypuff at 80%.

 

[a dog]

Hey guys. Before I try playing this character, I was wondering: What are considered to be Jigglypuff's best and worst matchups?

 

[Codaption]

Our worst matchup is generally considered to be Yoshi, though Ness also gives us a lot of trouble and swordsman in general are a pain to fight. Anyone that can beat us in the air is an uphill battle practically by default.

Our best matchup could honestly be Falcon. Yes, his advantage state is scary and everything said above is generally true, but we have an easier time getting in than he does and than we generally do in most matchups (this is one of a select few matchups where playing aggro is recommendable, as he can do very little to stop our shield pressure). Our advantaged state is also nothing to sneeze at, and in general Falcon can't handle it when he's at the receiving end. As long as you space properly and don't get tanked by a stray Raptor Boost, you should be fine.

We also have a pretty easy time against Bowser Jr, though- Kart Dash is pretty much his only real option for approaching and recovering (and is a pretty nice chunk of his combo game as well), and we can stuff the move with aerials in just about any situation. His projectile game is nothing to write home about, either, and once you get in on him he's combo meat (our shorthop aerials are at a great height for catching his body when he's on the ground, too, so we can get that extra chip damage and it's nice). Learn to intercept his Kart Dash and Abandon Ship, and the poor sod's a dead koopa.

 

[Uncle Tonkle]

Ness is hard? You can literally edgeguard him by just staying right above him every time he's offstage. His Up B kills him if it hits Jiggs and if he tries to jump through you you get a free nair. If he throws out an aerial he'll either not recover or be on the ledge while you're in a spot that is hard to deal with for Ness.

If he gets a grab he'll wreck your ****, but that just means you play your jumping neutral a little bit higher above the stage than otherwise. Generally Ness will beat your offensive options with fair though, so either catch his jump the moment he jumps up or airdodge and weave out (this is generally a losing situation as he can just throw another fair to wall you out completely). You can also airdodge right through him if he jumps if you're sure he'll throw a fair. His bair is slower than Jiggs' and he'll be stuck in fair for too long. Only do this if you airdodge the early frames of fair by either a read or a super duper reaction though, if you airdodge at the later frames he can just fly with you and nair for free, or if he doesn't fair he obviously gets a free punish as well.

PS: You can bait his grabs easier if you don't play your neutral way high, try to keep it just slightly above grab range. Also keep effective range in mind when landing. This is generally the stage in the game where Ness will try to zone you as hard as he can if he's good. If you realize on time you're usually safe to retreat to ledge then let go of ledge and fair, for as far as I know he can't challenge this effectively unless he super reads your timing and gets pk fire on you.

 

[MarioMeteor]

Hey guys. Before I try playing this character, I was wondering: What are considered to be Jigglypuff's best and worst matchups?

Her best matchup would probably have to be Ganondorf. I'm not too sure about worst. Maybe Marth.

 

[Vinylic.]

I still have a discord server for jigglypuff if anyone wants in. It's for future mu discussions and social talk without the memes. Plus, I have rules so yeah.

 

[Jiggly]

Ive had no wifi since tuesday, good to be back folks. MU wise, I think our worst MU is Yoshi and maybe Meta Knight, our best MUs are prob DH and maybe Falcon.

 

[SmashRacer]

Hey fellow Jiggly mains
I have played Jigglypuff for about 2 weeks now, and she feels like such a fun character to play, so I decided I want to pick her up as my 2nd main.
I'm having a ton of fun playing as her online and I have been in the lab practicing combos and kill setups, with help from Muramishis Combo Exhibition
My favorite alt is the Straw Hat

 

[Codaption]

Ness is hard? You can literally edgeguard him by just staying right above him every time he's offstage. His Up B kills him if it hits Jiggs and if he tries to jump through you you get a free nair. If he throws out an aerial he'll either not recover or be on the ledge while you're in a spot that is hard to deal with for Ness.

You're underestimating Ness's double jump, airspeed, and aerial toolkit. Literally every competent Ness main knows that PkThunder2 is a trash recovery and will know how to get back to the stage without having to rely on it.

If he gets a grab he'll wreck your ****, but that just means you play your jumping neutral a little bit higher above the stage than otherwise. Generally Ness will beat your offensive options with fair though, so either catch his jump the moment he jumps up or airdodge and weave out (this is generally a losing situation as he can just throw another fair to wall you out completely). You can also airdodge right through him if he jumps if you're sure he'll throw a fair. His bair is slower than Jiggs' and he'll be stuck in fair for too long. Only do this if you airdodge the early frames of fair by either a read or a super duper reaction though, if you airdodge at the later frames he can just fly with you and nair for free, or if he doesn't fair he obviously gets a free punish as well.

Note that just about everything you said here comes with an "if" or a "but" attached. Ness beats us in the air, plain and simple, which is the main reason why this matchup is so hard- we can somewhat keep up both in the air and on the ground (as his ground game isn't actually all that great outside of grabs), but it's definitely an uphill battle in both cases.

PS: You can bait his grabs easier if you don't play your neutral way high, try to keep it just slightly above grab range. Also keep effective range in mind when landing. This is generally the stage in the game where Ness will try to zone you as hard as he can if he's good. If you realize on time you're usually safe to retreat to ledge then let go of ledge and fair, for as far as I know he can't challenge this effectively unless he super reads your timing and gets pk fire on you.

I see no reason why he couldn't challenge our fair with his own or trade using Nair (which will definitely win). Even a ground move like Jab or ftilt would probably interrupt it.

If Ness can read your timing down to the letter, though, he's not gonna use pk Fire... he'll use his disjointed and crazy-powerful fsmash and knock us straight out of the game. Fortunately this isn't something that should be happening often, as it'd require a very hard read to pull off.

Hey fellow Jiggly mains
I have played Jigglypuff for about 2 weeks now, and she feels like such a fun character to play, so I decided I want to pick her up as my 2nd main.
I'm having a ton of fun playing as her online and I have been in the lab practicing combos and kill setups, with help from Muramishis Combo Exhibition
My favorite alt is the Straw Hat

Sunhat buddyyyyyyy :D

 

[kk1127]

I'll send you an invite.

could you send me one as well?

 

[Desoosis]

They need to make rest a little bigger hit box. I had a casual For Glory game going, and as I was playing I broke this guys shield, giving my self a good ol' pat on the back and a good game smirk. What I didn't know is that Jigglypuff's rest is wonky and didn't hit when I was walking casually (to give an intense moment of awesomeness. I have should have just jumped and rest them.) into them and I did a rest. Sadly the rest missed and I was furious mixed with confusion to why this rest missed. I don't know what was wrong with the rest, but I know I was inside of my opponent and that rest should have hit. Any reasoning on why it didn't hit?

 

[Vinylic.]

Rest is fine as it is. You should be thankful that it's not the size of melee's hitbox.

 

[drakeirving]

Depends on character. Some are easier to hit in certain animations than others, and that goes for any character and any animation.

Nice thing with shield breaks is that if you get on it right away, if you miss the first Rest you can go for a second before they recover.

 

[Jiggly]

Rest hitbox is perfect. Best it has ever been <3

 

[Kojii]

Depends on character. Some are easier to hit in certain animations than others, and that goes for any character and any animation.

Nice thing with shield breaks is that if you get on it right away, if you miss the first Rest you can go for a second before they recover.

Shield break recovery takes less time the more damage they have though :/

 

[drakeirving]

I hope you aren't going for Rests when they're at those sorts of percents though c:

 

[Vinylic.]

To be honest, you can probably get away with it when facing sheik. Not many players know how to make a strong punish game with her.

 

[Thirtyfour]

Is sourspot Rest a thing?

 

[drakeirving]

No, just one hitbox.

 

[Vinylic.]

There's invincibility however. If you manage to abuse the hell out of that, I'd be mighty impressed.