Japanese Tier List by SHI-G March '15 (Version 1.0.2)

[LancerStaff]

I'd say it's pretty accurate. It's mostly FD over there right? The only seriously objectable thing I see is Marth being third from the bottom. He's at least five spots higher, probably more.

Another thing I don't like is that Pit and Dark Pit have separate slots on the list. Honestly, DP could be lower. But you're supposed to use the two together anyways. He's essentially a custom set for Pit, and I don't think we need to rank character's custom moves individually. Put the two in the same spot and move them up one or two.

 

[Ichel]

Well... this tier looks a bit accurate than others
It's fine

 

[Xiao-Xiao]

I did share a lot of my information with Gheb for a long time but I havent been able to contribute since I don't have a computer most of the time. Trust me theres a lot of stuff that's only on Japanese network sites and not Youtube. Yoshidora is ranked top 2 in Japan's online ranking only losing to Rain. He hasn't been to an offline tournament yet. His win rate vs most of Japan's top players is VERY consistent.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Trust me theres a lot of stuff that's only on Japanese network sites and not Youtube.

Well there's the other problem too.
Pretty sure 99.99% of the smash community doesn't speak in moonrunes.

 

[ミスティック Speed]

Lucina and Marth deserve to be higher, imho. They're seriously good in the right hands.

 

[oogamania]

I agree with most of this list, however I do not believe that C.Falcon's potential is lower than Yoshi. I firmly believe Yoshi has a higher-learning curve than C.Falcon (and less usage) and Yoshi's meteor spike is not as telegraphed by comparison.

I'm surprised JigglyPuff is in a higher tier than Ganon and Kirby. I've yet to see any dedicated, successful Jigglypuff mains, whether in online or offline tourneys. If this was a doubles tier list, then yes, I believe Jigglypuff would be better.

But, this is Japan, I'm from the West. I'm going to continue to make my mains high tier my own way, regardless of any tier list.

 

[Troykv]

Wow, Japan says that Fire Emblem is now the new Hyrule tier? Shame.

Maybe it's a little early to say something... Except perhaps for Mii swordsman, I don't think there's a bad character in Smash 4.

Lucina and Marth deserve to be higher, imho. They're seriously good in the right hands.

I'm surprised the effects that can have the "nerfs" received Marth.

 

[Rango the Mercenary]

Tier lists are a popularity contest at this point. -_-

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

Side B is Back Slash which sends Shulk to his doom. Fire Fox is extremely linear and is probably the easiest recovery to intercept. Fox Illusion is also easily predicted. Falcon Dive only goes diagonal at first, then to the sides. Both are easily gimpable.

You're basing this off of the best possible scenarios for the opposing player. Yes, illusions are gimpable, but the odds of you punishing it consistently against a skilled player is lower than that of someone will always try to illusion to the ledge or ledge hop illusion, or just doesn't DI properly or occasionally fire Fox on stage. And while this is a weakness, some characters have things that make up for their disadvantages. Like Falcon, who is very mix up heavy, hits hard and fast, multiple combos from Nair, Uair and D-throw, solid jab and a variety of kill moves. Some just don't have those traits, and suffer for it due to a lack of a strong neutral game.

At the end of the day, this list is based purely on tournament results and doesn't dictate your ability to win with / against a character; so prove these things aren't true; play in tournament and win.

Also, Mario is on a higher tier than Luigi. Better air mobility, higher traction so you won't fly away when someone hits your shield, more reliable kill moves with better range, easy throw combo set ups and resets. Mario has it made in this game, so it's easier to win with him than Luigi.

 

[RSF-Blue bomber]

i dont think megaman should be c or mid b tier. if anything he should be low a tier because when i use him he defeats most of the A tiers i've battled.

 

[proxibomb]

G&W's crouch, anyone?

 

[Space Stranger]

tires R 4 Qu- *shot*

is among the more underrated characters in the game. His power and KO potential makes him equal, if not, better than his clone. His recovery game requires alot of mashing with his tornado.

 

[[OCK]LLama]

Even when you go by that, that's still puzzling. Yoshi is definitely a top character (that somehow is not getting much rep here) but top 5 is stretching imo.

You have to understand that they have a really good Yoshi by the name of Yoshidora placing consistently and showing how good Yoshi is PLUS even the weest think Yoshi is top 8, combine those 2 factors and you have a decent reason why Yoshi is top 5.

Also explains why Wario is so high, Abadango's a ****ing beast.

Reminder that this is more based off of the Japan meta and NOT much of the game's data itself. So complaints about how your favorite character is bad here isn't goin to do you very much good unless you fly yourself to Japan and change the meta or something. People need to appreciate this as a rare insight into the Japanese meta consensus.

Also SHI-G would be like VGBC making a tier list, As both seem very very similar in roles for their respective regions, so also try to remember that.

(I'm still ****ing salty about mega man being only B after Daiki played like a boss tho)

 

[Sinister Slush]

You should also mention that Japan only uses 3 stages which might be why Yoshi is as high as he is + other cases like Little Mac.

 

[RetroGamersGuru]

You should also mention that Japan only uses 3 stages which might be why Yoshi is as high as he is + other cases like Little Mac.

Well that is definitely straight to the point. I thought that limiting their stages more than we do only applied to 64.

 

[MarioMeteor]

You're basing this off of the best possible scenarios for the opposing player. Yes, illusions are gimpable, but the odds of you punishing it consistently against a skilled player is lower than that of someone will always try to illusion to the ledge or ledge hop illusion, or just doesn't DI properly or occasionally fire Fox on stage. And while this is a weakness, some characters have things that make up for their disadvantages. Like Falcon, who is very mix up heavy, hits hard and fast, multiple combos from Nair, Uair and D-throw, solid jab and a variety of kill moves. Some just don't have those traits, and suffer for it due to a lack of a strong neutral game.

At the end of the day, this list is based purely on tournament results and doesn't dictate your ability to win with / against a character; so prove these things aren't true; play in tournament and win.

Also, Mario is on a higher tier than Luigi. Better air mobility, higher traction so you won't fly away when someone hits your shield, more reliable kill moves with better range, easy throw combo set ups and resets. Mario has it made in this game, so it's easier to win with him than Luigi.

And that's precisely the reason why this list is flawed beyond belief. A list based solely on tournament results is always gonna be flawed. I don't have to prove it, others already are. Look at Boss, he takes Xanadu almost every week.
While Mario is an extremely good character, he is not as good as, nor better, than Luigi. I hate to sound like somebody else, but Luigi has better matchups all around. While Mario's aerial mobility is faster, his aerials don't string together as well as Luigi's. Mario does not have better range than Luigi, and even if he did it wouldn't be saying much since both of them have ****ty range. Mario's grab game is good, but Luigi's surpasses Mario's in that some of his grabs can be guarenteed kill setups. And by some I mean down throw. Luigi also has a better offstage and defensive game due to his back air which kills at like, 90%, Frame 2 Neutral air, down air spike, Cyclone spike, better spacing with Fireballs, and even more I could name but won't.

 

[Xermo]

And that's precisely the reason why this list is flawed beyond belief. A list based solely on tournament results is always gonna be flawed. I don't have to prove it, others already are. Look at Boss, he takes Xanadu almost every week.

One person beating a free region doesn't make a character suddenly a god, just means everyone else is bad.

 

[Jucchan]

And that's precisely the reason why this list is flawed beyond belief. A list based solely on tournament results is always gonna be flawed.

Quote from the article: "This was made from crews' point evaluation, not from tournament results."

 

[DavemanCozy]

Rules:
WiiU Singles
Items off
Stages: Final Destination, Battlefield, Smashville, Omega Stages
2 stocks 6 minutes
Miis are default size, 1111 set.
(Not written in article, but customs off)

That's a very limited stage list, and also explains why Miis are all low (well, Brawler and Gunner, Swordfighter is bad no matter what).

Quote from Tenuhe:
"In voting, I imagined a tier list where B and above is a placement where you can win tournaments straight-forwardly, C needs amazing player skill or gimmicky tactics to attempt to win a tournament, and anything D and below has their limit capped at top 8."

Hmmm, if this is the case, then I don't realistically see some things.

Some thoughts:

Diddy #1, Sheik #2 isn't contested by anyone. We all seem to agree on that.

Yoshi being #3 was weird to see, but with that stage list it makes more sense. Even then... #3? I think that Rosalina is a better candidate for that spot.

I think the Japanese are the only ones who know that Wario is good, as the community tier list here seems to think he's average. I dunno about Wario being #6 though, I think ZSS, Pikachu and Fox should be higher imo.

Villager is the most interesting anti-metagame character I've ever seen in a Smash game. I feel we've yet to see what this character is truly capable of.

Fox at #9 (around there) is correct, imo. He was one of the characters everyone thought was going to suck with all the things he lost from Brawl, but Smash 4's has been very kind to him with Jab locks, better recoveries, and no chain grabs to mess him up.

Pikachu, I honestly believe he's better than that. He has a very high skill cap, but quick attack is damn good as a recovery and movement option. I'm excited to see what this meta has in store for Pikachu.

Luigi is also a character I think should be higher than he is right now. Amazing combo game, scary cyclone and up-b are scary, and good N-air to break pressure. Definitely a top 10 contender in my book.

I still don't know how Dedede keeps getting ranked so high. I think Meta Knight is the best of the Kirby characters, honestly. Peach should be above both of them as well.

Bowser Jr is the one I disagree with the most. If we go by the quote that was given, I would say that he's a D tier at best.

Even jab cancels don't seem to save Link from D-tier, let alone being lower than Shulk.

I think that Ike, Donkey Kong, and Falco should be in D-tier at the very least. Gunner and Brawler should dip lower to E.

This is my opinion as well, but I think that Zelda is absolute bottom, maybe higher than Samus and Swordfighter.

 

[ZeoLightning]

DK and Kirby shouldnt be that low, they are not that bad

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Of course I think Charizard is too low (I'd put him in mid tier) but I'm Jiggs' and Doc's placements.

 

[Sucumbio]

Villager is the most interesting anti-metagame character I've ever seen in a Smash game. I feel we've yet to see what this character is truly capable of.

Camping imo

 

[Hoenn]

I love it how japan hates pikachu in every game lol
cept probably 64

 

[Diddy Kong]

are extremely underrated.

They probably are on a better level with , and that is good to see though.

I think are all quite underrated though.

 

[LiamMail]

not approved by me
and why they no town and city? halberd? pkmn stadium? duckhunt?

 

[MarioMeteor]

One person beating a free region doesn't make a character suddenly a god, just means everyone else is bad.

I'm not even going to waste my time.

 

[DavemanCozy]

Maybe it's a little early to say something... Except perhaps for Mii swordsman, I don't think there's a bad character in Smash 4.

Zelda is pretty bad, unfortunately

She's one of my favourite characters, but I just don't find her worth playing at all with her current design. A slow character with only good out of shield options and mediocre everything else... I'm afraid that nothing short of significant changes to Zeldas moveset or considerable speed buffs will make her better.

One person beating a free region doesn't make a character suddenly a god, just means everyone else is bad.

>Xanadu is free

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I think the thing about Wario is, how do you stop him from camping in this game? If he just decides that he doesn't want to play without a charged Waft, what characters can reasonably deny him that?

 

[Ffamran]

not approved by me
and why they no town and city? halberd? pkmn stadium? duckhunt?

They're probably asking why other regions allow those stages. Different regions; different rules. I wouldn't be surprised if there was some scene in some random place that only allows Battlefield as a stage.

 

[M@v]

tires R 4 Qu- *shot*

is among the more underrated characters in the game. His power and KO potential makes him equal, if not, better than his clone. His recovery game requires alot of mashing with his tornado.

Until you come to the realization that his slow movement speed in the air and on the ground, lack of combos mario has, and his worse recovery limit him and make fall to right about where he is on this list.

 

[Drinz]

Of course I think Charizard is too low (I'd put him in mid tier) but I'm Jiggs' and Doc's placements.

Honestly its because he doesn't get enough spotlight. People point out his flaws but never his strengths, and rarely do you run into somebody who mains him to see his true potential.

 

[Meek Moths]

I think are all quite underrated though.

i guess you think melee pichu is also underrated. and brawl ganon too. xd

 

[RetroGamersGuru]

i guess you think melee pichu is also underrated. and brawl ganon too. xd

Three out of five are IMO. Charizard and Samus, not so much.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

i guess you think melee pichu is also underrated. and brawl ganon too. xd

Three out of five are IMO. Charizard and Samus, not so much.

Fight me!

 

[Meek Moths]

Fight me!

being able to win with yur favorite character does not make her top tier (mid tier in this case)

 

[Swamp Sensei]

being able to win with yur favorite character does not make her top tier (mid tier in this case)

Right.

Which is why I'll have to win enough times to overthrow the entire tier list.

 

[Meek Moths]

Right.

Which is why I'll have to win enough times to overthrow the entire tier list.

dats the spirit i like it

just watch out for banana peels

and fishes and rapid hedgehogs

 

[RetroGamersGuru]

dats the spirit i like it

just watch out for banana peels

and fishes and rapid hedgehogs

Considering the new customs meta, the hedgehogs will not be as annoying as others.

 

[Meek Moths]

Considering the new customs meta, the hedgehogs will not be as annoying as others.

makes me feel sad my main has crap customs pls help miyamoto

also, are there any significant custom tournys before EVO? evo is just so far away, so until then we shouldnt see any changes to tier list

 

[RetroGamersGuru]

makes me feel sad my main has crap customs pls help miyamoto

also, are there any significant custom tournys before EVO? evo is just so far away, so until then we shouldnt see any changes to tier list

There aren't any big ones, just local ones. IMO, the community should have two separate tier lists: One including customs, the other would not. This would highlight the level of significance of customs whether it is high or negligible.