Isaac (Golden Sun) in SSBB thread

[Rubydragon]

Well as would I. Let us hope Sakurai sees it the way we do.

(This thread is now basically a chat room.)

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

They made games for the PC. And no, not before they started making games for Nintendo, after. They announced a PC golf game - they eventually cancelled it, but not because Nintendo owns any part of Camelot.

Nintendo owns as much of Camelot as I own of them. The fact that they partner with Nintendo does not make them Nintendo's property. Unless you think Capcom, Namco, Konami, Square Enix, and Sega are all Nintendo's property.

 

[Magically Enhanced Hobo]

I think at the time of Golden Sun they were a second party of Nintendo's, and then broke off to become a third party, much like Bungie did with Microsoft. Not sure.

Anyways, just cool out, everybody. We're arguing over a (very unimportant) technicality, and quite frankly not getting anywhere with it.

The point is, Isaac deserves the spot most. Period. Whether or not Sakurai wants to waste it with Ashley or Birdo or Tingle is up to him, but that doesn't stop Isaac from being more deserving, and no stupid argument about ownership or importance is going to change that. But whatever, I'm sick of arguing about this.

Bassoonist, go ahead and make the thread, dude. Definitely! If Isaac isn't in, at least we saw what you've been working on for the past few weeks. If he is, then we've got a brand new thread in which to celebrate.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

You thinking that doesn't change the fact that they've never been owned by Nintendo at all.

 

[PriestOfApollo]

They made games for the PC. And no, not before they started making games for Nintendo, after. They announced a PC golf game - they eventually cancelled it, but not because Nintendo owns any part of Camelot.

Nintendo owns as much of Camelot as I own of them. The fact that they partner with Nintendo does not make them Nintendo's property. Unless you think Capcom, Namco, Konami, Square Enix, and Sega are all Nintendo's property.

True, Nintendo has no rights over Camelot. However, Nintendo owns rights to all Golden Sun characters, so what's the problem anyway (don't believe me? go to "your page" or whatever it's called on Nintendo.com....there should be a picture of Jenna in the background on some page or another.) ?

^Ok...maybe that's not really proof, but I know that Nintendo owns Isaac.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

The whole argument is "franchises Nintendo created". People argue that Pikmin was not the only new, great, successful franchise Nintendo made last generation, bringing up WarioWare (but not Mario Strikers, for some reason), and Golden Sun (which was not made by Nintendo). Pikmin is the only great, new, successful franchise Nintendo introduced last gen, while GS is a great, new, successful franchise Camelot made, and WarioWare is a great, successful spin-off franchise Nintendo made.

 

[Durbl Piij]

I think the argument just got overheated and people stopped going to the beginning of it. A Link to the Snitch was just saying that Olimar had more of a chance than Isaac did. I mean, good for him, defending a character that I gather he is fond of. Its what any of us would do too. The whole ownership argument spurted from there.

I personally thought that Camelot ws 2nd party then split off to become a third party. If it was a third party and has the rights to Golden Sun, I would never expect to see isaac in brawl. BUt I do feel that since they are still partners now, and good enough partners for Nintendo to let them make Mario games (tennis and/or golf was it?), that Isaac's chances are higher. Plus the interview that said that Nintendo wanted another golden Sun, the leaks of a new one already in developement and other stuff like the music being highly wanted, two characters in the character wishlist thing.
The main thing to realize is that this thread is more for over exaggerating Isaac's chances to get in, I mean, didn;t someone say that Sakurai said Golden Sun was one of his favourite games? We dont often use objective point of views here, so don't feel too annoyed if you think everyone is stupid here in their blind hope. It's all anyone has.

Oh, and ISAAC FOR BRAWL!!

 

[Magically Enhanced Hobo]

You thinking that doesn't change the fact that they've never been owned by Nintendo at all.

For God's sake, dude. Give it up. Nobody is arguing with you that Nintendo owns Camelot. That doesn't change the fact that they own Golden Sun, and they can do with it whatever they bloody well please, including put Isaac in this game.

We all know he's not extremely likely. We all know Olimar had three times his chances. People were just pointing out that they are Intellectual Properties that are owned-but not necessarily created by- Nintendo that came out between Melee and Brawl, and thus they can use them easily without the legal hassles of asking for a character such as Mega Man, Black Mage, Pac Man, etc. In this respect, Isaac and Olimar are in the same boat.

But seriously, stop with this crap. Not just you, just everybody. This thread is like the only good flame-free thread left on this board, and it'd be nice if we could keep it that way.

You'll have to forgive me for being so rude, I'm not angry at you or anything, because all your points have been valid. Durbl beat me to it, but the thing is that this thread is to just support Isaac, despite his chances, because his games all mean something to us, and we'd love for him to have a part in a gathering of the greatest games to come to Nintendo's consoles, and in this respect, I think we're all on the same page, right?

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Dude, someone said that Nintendo owns Camelot! How in the world is no one arguing that if they say it?

Olimar got in not only for Pikmin being the only big, new franchise Nintendo introduced last gen, but because it was one of the few new characters Miyamoto has created in the last six years.

The only thing I ever said is that if Isaac got in, it would be for reasons besides the reasons Olimar got in.

 

[Magically Enhanced Hobo]

Must have missed that post, forgive me for generalizing like that. Yes, if Isaac gets in, it will be because he had a good game that brought something to Nintendo, and because Sakurai thought he would make a worthy addition to Smash. Those are the only things that matter anyways.

You're not an Isaac detractor, in any case, so we shouldn't really argue amongst ourselves.

 

[RegalBuster]

Ninty used to own Camelot, Camelot is now 3rd party but Nintendo owns all characters, location, storylines of golden Sun.

 

[Arteen]

...bringing up WarioWare (but not Mario Strikers, for some reason),

Ah, thanks for another example.

The whole argument is "franchises Nintendo created"

I thought it was "franchises Nintendo owns."

Pikmin is the only great, new, successful franchise Nintendo introduced last gen, while GS is a great, new, successful franchise Camelot made, and WarioWare is a great, successful spin-off franchise Nintendo made.

And Stafy was a great, new, successful franchise TOSE made. TOSE, like Camelot, is a third-party company. Stafy made it into Brawl, did it not?

The only thing I ever said is that if Isaac got in, it would be for reasons besides the reasons Olimar got in.

Golden Sun and Pikmin certainly have some reasons for inclusion in common, though. Golden Sun can't rely on the "Miyamoto" factor, but that certainly can't be the only reason Pikmin is in Brawl.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

1. Another example? Has Wario been erased from existence until 2003?

2. Yeah, see, no, that wasn't the discussion. What the Hell is the point of stuff they own? We're talking about franchises that NINTENDO made. THEIR original inputs.

3. Stafy is Nintendo's property. And isn't as important as Pikmin, not even reasonably so.

4. The whole point is that Olimar has things going for him that Isaac doesn't have - Nintendo-made, Miyamoto-made, and, like I said, the star of the only major new franchise of last gen.

 

[Bassoonist]

1. Another example? Has Wario been erased from existence until 2003?

Don't you mean after instead of until?

Either way it doesn't matter. As we have told probably about, hm... maybe a billion times, Camelot has shown interest in making another Golden Sun game. They haven't forgotten about it. Isaac hasn't been erased from existence.

4. The whole point is that Olimar has things going for him that Isaac doesn't have - Nintendo-made, Miyamoto-made, and, like I said,

Why are you bringing this up...? He was saying that Golden Sun has some things going for it that Pikmin did too.

the star of the only major new franchise of last gen.

lol. Is that so? Out of EVERY SINGLE franchise from EVERY SINGLE company, Pikmin is the only major new franchise? Are you so sure of that?

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Don't you mean after instead of until?

Either way it doesn't matter. As we have told probably about, hm... maybe a billion times, Camelot has shown interest in making another Golden Sun game. They haven't forgotten about it. Isaac hasn't been erased from existence.



Why are you bringing this up...? He was saying that Golden Sun has some things going for it that Pikmin did too.



lol. Is that so? Out of EVERY SINGLE franchise from EVERY SINGLE company, Pikmin is the only major new franchise? Are you so sure of that?

1. No - you completely disregard that Wario was important before WarioWare, and it's not a new franchise.

2. Oh my God, you refuse to read, it seems. Do you realize that this conversation has LITERALLY NOTHING to do with Isaac's chances? I'm stating the simple fact that Pikmin is, by fact, the only new thing Nintendo made last gen that was huge.

3. Congratulations - the only good point you've made is that I mistyped. ...Nevermind, I forgot - that's a horrible thing for someone to tell you. You knew full well what I meant, and instead of addressing the point, you try to take advantage of my mistyping to avoid being indisputably wrong.

 

[Arteen]

1. Another example? Has Wario been erased from existence until 2003?

WarioWare is a popular series, distinct from Wario Land. Yes, both series end up being represented with a 'W,' but that's missing the point. WarioWare specifically is a huge, popular series that should (and did) get representation of its own, regardless of the previous Wario Land games. Mario Kart is another spin-off that grew to be a huge, popular series of its own, and that has its own representation in Brawl. Sure, the characters in all these Mario spinoff titles are the same, but many of them of become distinct, popular series of their own.

2. Yeah, see, no, that wasn't the discussion. What the Hell is the point of stuff they own? We're talking about franchises that NINTENDO made. THEIR original inputs.

I'm confused then. SSB doesn't seem to discriminate between Nintendo-owned and Nintendo-made, so I don't see why the discussion is relevant.

3. Stafy is Nintendo's property. And isn't as important as Pikmin, not even reasonably so.

I didn't say it was as important, but I do believe that Nintendo considers the series at least somewhat important. Sure, I'd consider Pikmin to be the most important new series from the last generation, but it isn't the only important one. Besides, it did get in, so as I stated above, the argument over who created the character is irrelevant.

The whole point is that Olimar has things going for him that Isaac doesn't have - Nintendo-made, Miyamoto-made, and, like I said, the star of the only major new franchise of last gen.

First point is irrelevant, second is true, and third is false. It's not "fact," as you state in the post above me.

Basically, Pikmin is the most notable new franchise, but it isn't the only important, new franchise. Pikmin has a few things going for it than Golden Sun does, but they share many reasons in common. Olimar in Brawl doesn't mean Isaac in Brawl. Pikmin was a shoo-in, but Golden Sun isn't.

 

[Bassoonist]

1. No - you completely disregard that Wario was important before WarioWare, and it's not a new franchise.

What you said was really confusing and it sounded like you were saying that Golden Sun has disappeared since 2003.

2. Oh my God, you refuse to read, it seems. Do you realize that this conversation has LITERALLY NOTHING to do with Isaac's chances? I'm stating the simple fact that Pikmin is, by fact, the only new thing Nintendo made last gen that was huge.

You brought up Isaac as well. You were responding to a post that Arteen made stating that Isaac has some of the things going for him that Olimar does.

3. Congratulations - the only good point you've made is that I mistyped. ...Nevermind, I forgot - that's a horrible thing for someone to tell you. You knew full well what I meant, and instead of addressing the point, you try to take advantage of my mistyping to avoid being indisputably wrong.

Take a joke. It's just a forum.

I'm not bringing up the point because it isn't relevant to Isaac's inclusion. Pikmin being Nintendo's most successful franchise of last generation has nothing to do with Golden Sun as you've stated... Golden Sun was pretty successful itself.

Everyone around here understands that Captain Olimar had better chances than Isaac. So just stop going into it.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

WarioWare is a popular series, distinct from Wario Land. Yes, both series end up being represented with a 'W,' but that's missing the point. WarioWare specifically is a huge, popular series that should (and did) get representation of its own, regardless of the previous Wario Land games. Mario Kart is another spin-off that grew to be a huge, popular series of its own, and that has its own representation in Brawl. Sure, the characters in all these Mario spinoff titles are the same, but many of them of become distinct, popular series of their own.


I'm confused then. SSB doesn't seem to discriminate between Nintendo-owned and Nintendo-made, so I don't see why the discussion is relevant.


I didn't say it was as important, but I do believe that Nintendo considers the series at least somewhat important. Sure, I'd consider Pikmin to be the most important new series from the last generation, but it isn't the only important one. Besides, it did get in, so as I stated above, the argument over who created the character is irrelevant.


First point is irrelevant, second is true, and third is false. It's not "fact," as you state in the post above me.

Basically, Pikmin is the most notable new franchise, but it isn't the only important, new franchise. Pikmin has a few things going for it than Golden Sun does, but they share many reasons in common. Olimar in Brawl doesn't mean Isaac in Brawl. Pikmin was a shoo-in, but Golden Sun isn't.

Why do people absolutely refuse to listen to me when I say that this argument is NOT ABOUT ANYTHING NINTENDO'S EVER PUBLISHED?

1. It doesn't matter. IT'S NOT A NEW FRANCHISE. It is a spin-off franchise.

2. Olimar is more notable because of anything Nintendo ever made last gen, he's the star of the only new, successful, quality franchise of the last generation from Nintendo.

3. The first point is not irrelevant. A character made by Miyamoto is more notable than a character made by a third party developer.

4. Name a single new franchise developed by Nintendo last gen that was both successful and considered great.

 

[Matt Silver]

Who cares? It seems that only you, Link Snitch, don't quite care for Isaac and all, but that's a minority IN THIS THREAD. Isaac for Brawl!

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Wow, another user who doesn't even read what the argument is about.

 

[SmashMac]

There has to be at least one slot open for Isaac.

 

[RegalBuster]

Isaac for brawl!

 

[Mini Mic]

Isaac for brawl!

Seconded, I can't see him being announced on the Dojo before the game is out though.

 

[VVayfarer]

3. The first point is not irrelevant. A character made by Miyamoto is more notable than a character made by a third party developer.

Er... that was your second point. Your first point was this:

4. The whole point is that Olimar has things going for him that Isaac doesn't have - Nintendo-made, Miyamoto-made, and, like I said, the star of the only major new franchise of last gen.

 

[The Great Tama]

Isaac will appear. Golden Sun is one of the new great series for Nintendo, with Pikmin. Like I said, Olimar= Isaac, heh.

 

[zagman505]

what's with all the arguing going on in here? and it's not even arguing about isaac really, but more about olimar -_-

link to the snitch, i think i understand what you're saying, but i think you're being too stubborn about defending your point. most of us understand that olimar had much greater chances of making it into brawl than isaac does (aside from the great tama), but they do share several things in common, such as being the stars of successful new last gen franchises that weren't released in time for melee (i think) and both being owned by nintendo. more specifically, olimar being nintendo/miyamoto created probably maybe did boost his chances quite a bit, but i think you're overstating how much of an advantage that might give him and being too stubborn in defending your point. again, most of us realize that isaac isn't a shoo-in, but he definitely does have a pretty good chance of making it in.

can we please stop arguing about this kind of stuff when we all want isaac in brawl?

 

[gangstajuice656]

i would wanna see isaac in brawl but he has a slim chance!!

 

[VVayfarer]

i would wanna see isaac in brawl but he has a slim chance!!

Why do you always have to shout?

 

[Matt Silver]

Don't be so negative. Be blissfully ignorant.

 

[Lecto2007]

Ive wanted isaac in fromthe beginning but its like noones else cares to put him in brawl i mean were all here making a commotion and stuff when we cant change anything Isaac PWNS!

 

[Deleted member]

XD.

What would happen if Felix was confrimed?

 

[Matt Silver]

Felix is still pretty cool - Isaac is a little better.

 

[raphtmarqui]

XD.

What would happen if Felix was confrimed?

I would be mad. Isaac is way better than Felix.

 

[Arteen]

XD.

What would happen if Felix was confrimed?

I'd be very, very happy, but also somewhat mad. Isaac is a better choice in my opinion.

 

[SmashALLSTAR]

It would make more sense to have Isaac in.
However, I guess I won't mind if Felix takes his place.

 

[SenorPresidente]

Felix would be nice but Isaac would be better.

 

[Lecto2007]

No i would be Inflamed at the idea of felix when isaac is more favourited out of the golden sun series. GO ISAAC!!

 

[Storm Eagle]

Let it be said: Felix will be the clone of Isaac.

 

[silver777]

one of them is fine in my book.

 

[Storm Eagle]

Yeah, one would be enough. But IF clones would return, Felix would be candidate number 1.