****ing Zelda.

[Brinzy]

Just shield/cancel the ****ing fireballs and kick him out of his stupid *** tornado.

 

[PolMex23]

This is a match up in which only if both characters are even in skill and there skill level is very high along with Knowledge on the match up than i believe...

Its 55:45 in Luigis favor...

Good day, most honest answer ever

If the zelda is better the zelda will win, along with the luigi

 

[Atash]

She has frame 5 and frame 8 lightning kicks, Jab, ftilt, and Fsmash that beat out everything that Luigi has except for his fireball (not to mention outrange him), and Nayru's to eat your attack and shoot you right back out. On the ground, she is beating Luigi, period. In the air, Luigi wins if he can keep her there, which he may not because he can't "combo" her past some early %s because she's floaty and can simply DI away from Luigi to avoid his stuff. Plus he dies super early.

@ dying super early:
Zelda's lightning kicks/smashes? What of Luigi's up-angled F-smash (which can hit out of a jab and kills at around 100% on Zelda) or FJP (40-50%)? Although, I must admit... a fresh B-air coming out at 71% and upwards on me would be quite scary... By the way, can she do those kicks out of shield? And do those

Personally, I'm not too scared of the lightning kicks unless I'm already in the air with Zelda and slightly below her (especially if I'm facing away - U-air wouldn't help much in the way or range in that position). Luigi's slow aerial movement would make it a pain to get away in that position. Besides that, though, watching a Zelda short-hopping towards me tends to result in me either moving the heck away, shielding and sliding the heck away, or power-shielding and reacting with a very happy set of jabs, smashes, you name it. An empty short hop into some buffered something (D-tilt combo/magical hands of death [freaking blue sparkles] anyone?) would be a little more effective than using the lightning kick in my opinion.

My personal list of major fears:
U-tilt (anything that beats me up for using aerials -.-')
JUSTICE KICK!!! when I'm in a bad position in the air (air dodge? Air dodge? Justice kick? You can't just air dodge the justice kick, it just isn't just!!! >_< lol, *cough* more seriously though... Zomg it comes out quickly. I wouldn't feel bad about comparing it with Luigi's up-angled F-smash at all for speed).
Din's fire while I'm recovering
D-air spike while I'm recovering (must recover high every time...)
Naryu's Love (because Naryu doesn't love me. Actually because it makes me feel bad about short-hopping towards her and/or fireballing.)

Just shield/cancel the ****ing fireballs and kick him out of his stupid *** tornado.

Kick him out of the tornado? Have you been playing people who initiate the tornado from half-way across the stage too much? As for the fireballs... they're not really meant to be used as a ranged weapon in this match in my opinion. They should be more like a slow disjointed hit-box that happens to allow for a great number of mix-ups.

Speaking of mix-ups... that's the problem with this match-up. Like many other match-ups, the only thing that can be said for the two characters is some generalization. In the same way that Zelda seems to have a variety of answers to a variety of Luigi tactics, Luigi has a variety of answers to a variety of Zelda tactics. A justice kick can be predicted and out-ranged and out-sped, a FJP can be punished badly for being whiffed (free justice kick). Zelda's justice kick can be spammed to no end, Luigi's F-smash can come out of any single jab. Zelda has range and power, Luigi has strings and power. Zelda ***** on the ground, Luigi likes it when the lady's on top (they switch positions when trying to kill each other). Zelda has a non-deterministic recovery and Luigi has a long-reaching uber-far return-to-final-destination-from-lower-right-corner recovery. Luigi has two kill options at wildly different percentages, but the first is extraordinarily punishable and the second comes into play at ~100%. Zelda has a concentrated option at a percentage in between Luigi's two early kill options.

Also, with regards to Zelda moving around the fireballs... Don't forget that Luigi can move as well. There is no simple "Lulz *****" strategy. If Luigi can manage to find openings for jabs (and he will), he'll deal a lot of damage or get a KO or taunt or *something*, or perhaps he'll mix it up and go for some other forms of approaches depending on the situation. Zelda can, and probably will, beat the crap out of him before and after whatever he does especially on the ground.

By the way... Question: Luigi's sliding D-smash vs. Zelda's F-smash/Jab/F-tilt/D-tilt? Would Luigi getting down on the ground while sliding around allow him to dodge Zelda's high hits and/or beat out Zelda's D-tilt? (by the way, this is a specific question specifically avoiding ideas surrounding Zelda's counter-attacks).

Anyway... yeah, that's my rant. Feel free to bust my bubble - I'm only partially aware of the match-up.

...

Forgot something: When did this thread go from being a 'give advice to the player' thread to a 'discuss the match-up at hand' thread? Not that I'm complaining or anything, just, ya know... hafta ask.

 

[Kataefi]

Basically, everything Atash said is very true. But Zelda can escape jab > whatever combos from Luigi with nayru's. It's been tested by one of our mains on the Zelda boards. It's a little secret

It's simple really... Zelda has the ground, Luigi has the air. Luigi cannot always juggle her if she fastfalls nayru's via a momentum drop, or if she FWs to the ground in time, or has good enough DI. At the same time, Zelda doesn't often stay in the air, and when she is in the air it's to punish with a sweetspot or uair for the kill.

Just be very aware of Zelda's dtilt combos. If she plays the stock well she can keep a good ratio of dtilt decay and enemy percentage to get some guaranteed combos whether from a trip or through hitstun. She does tend to outrange and outprioritise his everything on the ground though, and has some pretty good OoS options.

The matchup is a lot of fun because both characters have the tools to wreck each other if one isn't being consistent. It's anywhere from Luigi's advantage to her's IMO, which goes for a very 'back-and-forth' fight.

 

[Delvro]

Yeah, atash is right... although I generally can kill with UFsmash at 85% not 100%



Also, it really annoys me sitting around cursing other people out on the forums... don't do it -_-

 

[hippiedude92]

This one of the reasons why I hate this board. Dont talk ****ing **** bout a char unless you`ve fought A REAL GOOD PLAYER!
We`ve debated/discussed this @ Zelda boards. Sucessor pretty much backed up his points.
@ dying early : Both are dominating are punishers,floaties, high kill power, cant see y, luigi guys here dont know that zelda can kill luigi around (iirc) 80%s.
Ive played Ninjalinks zelda b4, its troubling if they space perfect range. Srsly.
Oh and luigi can still catch you even if u DI away, but in most cases it catchs him offguard if u always mix it up.Just sayin`
Matchup knowledge is EVERYTHING! considering both chars r underused....

 

[Magus420]

Basically, everything Atash said is very true. But Zelda can escape jab > whatever combos from Luigi with nayru's. It's been tested by one of our mains on the Zelda boards. It's a little secret

It's no secret at all. Literally every single character in the game can get out of everything after the jab except for the normal jab combo. Reacting to getting hit by it and being able to actually do something about it in time without expecting the hit beforehand is the limiting factor. Any vids of people legitimately reacting to (not anticipating) the jab in real matches in time to do this reliably (pretty much every single time if they are really reacting to it and not just predicting or getting lucky) before getting caught/stuck in their landing animation?

 

[Kataefi]

Sorry it's really difficult to convey light-heartedness on the internet >.< the 'secret' and wink was half-suggesting the nayru's thing isn't as good as I made it seem and half-suggesting it could be useful with the right reflexes. It does lean more towards the former though, you're right.

 

[hippiedude92]

You need lighting reflex to PS a 2 frame Jab lol.

 

[Kanzaki]

Who is this Zelda?

Doppleganger.

 

[PolMex23]

I PS jabs....

Call me reflexPolmex...

Um...like i said, the better player will win the match...

= talent at high skill level....Luigi..

That plus knowledge of the match up...Luigi...

Just by alill, ty...move on.

 

[Famous]

Jab>UpB on Zelda is dam near inescapable...

A good method is to keep zelda in the air...She can't really do anything if your under her.

Never attack over her head since she will USmash you to death...Keep the game grounded.

 

[sMexy-Blu]

*reads only the title*

I would love "****ing Zelda."

I lol'd at this sexist sence of humor.

 

[PolMex23]

Originally Posted by PhantomX View Post
*reads only the title*

I would love "****ing Zelda."
I lol'd at this sexist sence of humor.

When was that said???

**** me an me not reading the posts john that was brilliant xD

 

[sMexy-Blu]

Nice "Didn't see the post" john.

 

[PolMex23]

why ty sir...i believe an intellectual discussion might be afoot...since i can't stop thinking about intelligent things after seeing your avatar...something about the mustache...

It's affecting the way I think

 

[Atash]

why ty sir...i believe an intellectual discussion might be afoot...since i can't stop thinking about intelligent things after seeing your avatar...something about the mustache...

It's affecting the way I think

You used the word 'afoot' and 'intellectual'. And there is not a single misspelling in your post. What just happened!?

By the way, PolMex, you can go to the original quote by clicking on that little blue arrow in the quote box sMexy-Blu posted.

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So what's the direction of this discussion now?

 

[CR4SH]

Lol sorry about the dumb post earlier, I was a bit drunk, and just remembered that I put that there.

Anyway, I still think luigi beats zelda, but I already made myself look too dumb to actually argue it. So good luck all.