I'm curious.

[culexus・wau]

With the MU chart finally completed and seeing how numbers varied prior to its completion [very rarely did we all give the same answer]

what is your "personal MU" chart?


for me it goes.

[in increments of:
heavy advantage
advantage
slight advantage
even
slight disadvantage
disadvantage
heavy disadvantage]

Meta Knight- slight disadvantage
Snake- even - stressful
Wario - disadvantage - annoying
Diddy Kong - disadvantage - ****ING HELLA ANNOYING & STRESSFUL ASAGHERE RAGE ETC.
Falco - slight disadvantage - very annoying
King Dedede - disadvantage - stressful
Mr. Game & Watch - disadvantage - annoying
Marth - slight disadvantage
R.O.B. - advantage
Olimar - even, variable on pikmin plucks.
Pikachu - even
Ice Climbers - even
Kirby - slight advantage
Lucario - ditto MU
Zero Suit Samus - even
Toon Link - slight advantage
Donkey Kong - slight disadvantage
Pit - even
Peach - slight advantage - annoying
Sheik - advantage
Wolf - slight disadvantage - very annoying
Luigi - slight advantage - annoying
Fox - slight disadvantage - stressful
Zelda - heavy advantage
Bowser - slight advantage
Sonic - advantage
Ike - slight advantage
Pokémon Trainer
-Squirtle - slight disadvantage
-Ivysaur - heavy advantage
-Charizard - slight advantage
Lucas - even
Ness - even
Mario - advantage
Jigglypuff - heavy advantage
Link - advantage
Yoshi - heavy advantage
Captain Falcon - advantage
Ganondorf - heavy advantage
Samus - advantage


Just wondering.

 

[The_Bear735]

My opinion doesn't matter and I probably won't explain these unless asked to.

Meta Knight- slight disadvantage (45-55)
Snake- even
Wario - slight disadvantage (45-55)
Diddy Kong - disadvantage (40-60)
Falco - disadvantage (40-60)
King Dedede - heavy disadvantage (35-65)
Mr. Game & Watch - slight disadvantage (45-55)
Marth - slight disadvantage (45-55, it's really dependent on how well they can pressure)
R.O.B. - advantage (60-40)
Olimar - slight advantage (55-45)
Pikachu - advantage (60-40)
Ice Climbers - slight disadvantage (45-55)
Kirby - advantage (60-40, imo, this slides to slight advantage if the Kirby has better air control than the Lucario)
Lucario - **** amirite
Zero Suit Samus - slight advantage (55-45)
Toon Link - advantage (60-40)
Donkey Kong - heavy disadvantage (35-65, this is imo because I've played CBK somewhat regularly and DK seems to have a lot more priority until Lucario has enough aura, which is easy kill zone territory for DK)
Pit - advantage (60-40, I've been giving so many advantages to Lucario for chars like this lol)
Peach - disadvantage (60-40)
Sheik - advantage (60-40)
Wolf - even
Luigi - even
Fox - slight disadvantage (45-55)
Zelda - heavy advantage (65-35)
Bowser - advantage (60-40)
Sonic - heavy advantage (65-35)
Ike - slight advantage (55-45)
Pokémon Trainer
-Squirtle - slight advantage (55-45)
-Ivysaur - heavy advantage (65-35)
-Charizard - slight advantage (55-45)
Lucas - advantage (60-40)
Ness - slight advantage (55-45)
Mario - advantage (60-40)
Jigglypuff - heavy advantage (65-35)
Link - heavy advantage (65-35)
Yoshi - heavy advantage (65-35)
Captain Falcon - advantage (60-40)
Ganondorf - heavy advantage (65-35)
Samus - heavy advantage (65-35)


Most of this is off of personal experience, as limited as it is. I'm not saying this is fact, just what I've thought based on two years of playing Lucario.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Meta Knight- (40-60)
Snake- (45-55)
Wario - (45-55)
Diddy Kong - (55-45)
Falco - (50-50)
King Dedede - (40-60)
Mr. Game & Watch - (50-50)
Marth - (40-60)
R.O.B. - (50-50)
Olimar - (40-60)
Pikachu - (55-45)
Ice Climbers - (60-40)
Kirby - (50-50)
Lucario - (3.14159265-2.71828 18284 59045 23536)
Zero Suit Samus - (50-50)
Toon Link - (50-50)
Donkey Kong - (50-50)
Pit - (50-50)
Peach - (50-50)
Sheik - (60-40)
Wolf - (50-50)
Luigi - (50-50)
Fox - (50-50)
Zelda - (60-40)
Bowser - (60-40)
Sonic - (60-40)
Ike - (60-40)
Pokémon Trainer
-Squirtle - (55-45)
-Ivysaur - (65-35)
-Charizard - (55-45)
Lucas - (60-40)
Ness - (55-45)
Mario - (60-40)
Jigglypuff - (65-35)
Link - (60-40)
Yoshi - (65-35)
Captain Falcon - (70-30)
Ganondorf - (70-30)
Samus - (60-40)

 

[Zucco]

Meta Knight- 45-55
Snake- 45-55
Wario - 45:55
Diddy Kong 50-50
Falco -45-55
King Dedede 35-65
Mr. Game & Watch - 45-55 or 40-60
Marth - 40-60
R.O.B. 50-50
Olimar - 45-55 or 40-60
Pikachu - 60-40
Ice Climbers - 60-40
Kirby - 55-45
Lucario - gay
Zero Suit Samus 50-50
Toon Link - 45-55
Donkey Kong - 45-55
Pit - 50-50
Peach - 60-40
Sheik - 60-40
Wolf - 45-55
Luigi - 60-40
Fox - 50-50
Zelda -60-40
Bowser - 60-40
Sonic - 65-35
Ike - 60-40
Pokémon Trainer
-Squirtle - 55-45
-Ivysaur - 60-40
-Charizard - 60-40
Lucas - 50-50
Ness - 50-50
Mario - 60-40
Jigglypuff - 65-35
Link - 60-40
Yoshi - 60-40
Captain Falcon 0-100 we get *****
Ganondorf - 0-100 ^^^
Samus - 60-40

 

[phi1ny3]

choo-choo!

MK: 40:60/35:65
Snake: 45:55
Wario: 45:55/40:60
Diddy Kong: 45:55
Falco: 45:55
DDD: 40:60
G&W: 45:55/50:50
Marth: 40:60/45:55
ROB: 55:45
Olimar: 45:55
Pikachu: 55:45
ICs: 55:45/50:50
Kirby: 60:40/55:45
Lucario: "almost as bad as item play" status
ZSS: 50:50
TL: 45:55
DK: 45:55
Pit: 50:50
Peach: 55:45/60:40
Sheik: 60:40
Fox: 40:60/45:55
Wolf: 50:50/45:55
Luigi: 60:40
Zelda: 60:40/65:35
Bowser: 60:40
Ike: 60:40
Sonic: 65:35
PT: 55:45
Squirtle: 55:45/50:50
Ivysaur: 65:35
Charizard: 55:45
Lucas: 50:50/55:45
Ness: 60:40/55:45
Mario: 60:40
Jigglypuff: 65:35/60:40 (depends on how gay they can theoretically play, which I'd need to see in action more)
Samus: 60:40
Yoshi: 60:40/65:35
Captain Falcon: 65:35/60:40
Link: 60:40
Ganondorf: Purple flames v. blue flames

 

[Loota]

MK: 40:60
Snake: 45:55
Wario: 45:55
Diddy Kong: 50:50
Falco: 45:55
DDD: 40:60
G&W: 45:55
Marth: 45:55
ROB: 55:45
Olimar: 45:55
Pikachu: 55:45
ICs: 55:45
Kirby: 55:45
Lucario: *insert FWK's signature smiley here*
ZSS: 50:50
TL: 45:55
DK: 45:55
Pit: 50:50
Peach: 55:45
Sheik: 60:40
Fox: 50:50
Wolf: 45:55
Luigi: 60:40
Zelda: 65:35
Bowser: 60:40
Ike: 60:40
Sonic: 65:35
PT: 55:45
Squirtle: 55:45
Ivysaur: 65:35
Charizard: 55:45
Lucas: 55:45
Ness: 60:40
Mario: 60:40
Jigglypuff: 60:40
Samus: 60:40
Yoshi: 60:40
Captain Falcon: 65:35
Link: 60:40
Ganondorf: 80:20

 

[Browny]

how come you based it almost entirely on tier list 3.0 but some characters have moved up and down a few spots lol?

 

[Kitamerby]

1:99 Ness.

GASKLDGJASDGUIASIODGUASODIGUAOSDIGUASDPGUASDGPIAUS

Hate that character so much. I just can't fight Ness.


I don't really have anything else that deviates from most everyone else's lists other than that. D:

 

[ksizl4life]

mk 50-50
snake 40-60
ddd 0-100


im bored lol

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

We're all bored sometimes.

I'm surprised at the Toon Link, Wolf, and Fox ratios others are posting.

 

[Pitbuller26]

MK: 60-40 to 55-45. Depends on the MK
Snake: 50-50
Wario: 45-55
Diddy Kong: 55-45.
Falco: 50-50. (For me personally 55-45)
DDD: 40-60
G&W: 45-55~50-50
Marth: 40-60
ROB: 50-50
Olimar: 50-50
Pikachu: 55-45
IC: 55-45
Kirby: 50-50(Something tells me I'm playing the MU entirely wrong)
Lucario: Pitbull vs. Inspire
ZSS: 50-50
TL: 55-45
DK: 50-50. The monkey won't die.
Pit: 55-45
Peach: 60-40 more of a campfest.
Sheik: 60:40
Fox: 50:50~45-55
Wolf: 45:55~40-60. Camaman's Wolf is a testament to this.
Luigi: 60:40
Zelda: 65:35
Bowser: 60:40
Ike: 60:40
Sonic: 65:35 this MU drives me insane.
PT: 55:45
Squirtle: 55:45
Ivysaur: 65:35
Charizard: 55:45
Lucas: 55:45
Ness: 60:40
Mario: 55-45
Jigglypuff: 60:40
Samus: 60:40
Yoshi: 60:40
Captain Falcon: 65:35
Link: 60:40
Ganondorf: 80:20

 

[culexus・wau]

how come you based it almost entirely on tier list 3.0 but some characters have moved up and down a few spots lol?

all I did was copy and paste

from the 2nd list on that thread lol

 

[HyperEnergy]

Meta Knight - 45-55
Snake - 45-55
Wario - 45-55
Diddy Kong - 55-45
Falco - 60-40
King Dedede - 60-40
Mr. Game & Watch - 50-50
Marth - 50-50
R.O.B. - 45-55
Olimar - 30-70
Pikachu - Never Played
Ice Climbers - 45-55
Kirby - 60-40
Lucario - 99-1
Zero Suit Samus - 65-35
Toon Link - 50-50
Donkey Kong - 55-45
Pit - 40-60
Peach - 65-35
Sheik - 40-60
Wolf - 45-55
Luigi - 50-50
Fox - 45-55
Zelda - Zelda should never win except against Ganondorf
Bowser - 60-40
Sonic - 45-55
Ike - 50-50

And I'm cutting out the rest cause I've never really played them before...

 

[Shenlong]

MK: 40:60/45:55 (depends on the MK)
Snake: 45:55
Wario: 45:55
Diddy Kong: 50:50
Falco: 50:50
DDD: 40:60
G&W: 45:55/50:50
Marth: 40:60/45:55 (depends on the marth)
ROB: 50:50
Olimar: 45:55/40:60
Pikachu: 55:45
ICs: 55:45/50:50
Kirby: 60:40
Lucario: Worst ditto in the game bar none. Maybe Ice Climber or Olimar dittos are worse.
ZSS: 50:50
TL: 50:50
DK: 50:50
Pit: 50:50
Peach: 60:40 I fight them all the time :S
Sheik: 60:40
Fox: 50:50
Wolf: 50:50
Luigi: 60:40
Zelda: 60:40/65:35
Bowser: 60:40
Ike: 60:40
Sonic: 65:35
PT: 55:45
Squirtle: 50:50 darn aerodynamic turtle
Ivysaur: 65:35
Charizard: 55:45
Lucas: 50:50/55:45
Ness: 60:40/55:45
Mario: 55:45
Jigglypuff: 60:40
Samus: 60:40
Yoshi: 60:40/65:35
Captain Falcon: 65:35/60:40
Link: 60:40
Ganondorf: 65:35

 

[iLink]

Meta Knight- 40:60 </3 dsmash/shuttle loop
Snake- 50:50 I don't see this MU as much of a problem if you can get him in the air. The only thing I worry about is utilt
Wario - 45:55 Can't... f***ing... hit... him...
Diddy Kong - 45:55 Not sure about this one
Falco - 45:55 Hate laser/sideb camping
King Dedede - 40:60 Don't get grabbed
Mr. Game & Watch - 40:60 The turtle should be his own character
Marth - 45:55 Not that bad, just watch that fair
R.O.B. - 55:45 Keep him in the air
Olimar - 45:55 You really have no legit approach to this guy
Pikachu - 50:50 I think this match is fun, that is all lol
Ice Climbers - 50:50 I... hate... IC... so... much...
Kirby - 50:50 I hate small characters but its manageable
Lucario - I don't get why everyone here hates Lucario dittos : ( I think it's fun because I have to think about what I would do if I was in their position and sort of fight myself
Zero Suit Samus - 50:50 Meh... don't have much experience in this MU
Toon Link - 50:50 This MU would be so much harder if TL could KO better
Donkey Kong - 50:50 This MU could go either way depending on who has the right momentum during the match.
Pit - 50:50 Not much going on here
Peach - 50:50 This is my personal bad MU, her quick attacks and low aerial landing lag always surprises me.
Sheik - 60:40 Keep your distance and proper spacing doesn't make this very hard.
Wolf - 50:50 The only thing that's really annoying is his shine, everything else is pretty predictable.
Luigi - 55:45 Just space right
Fox - 50:50 This match could go either way, fox is just weird like that
Zelda - 60:40 Meh...
Bowser - 60:40 ^
Sonic - 60:40 His poor priority makes this not too difficult
Ike - 60:40 If there is ever a character that was easy to gimp...
Pokémon Trainer
-Squirtle - 45:55 His speed and size makes this annoying
-Ivysaur - 60:40 So I heard you need this here ledge I'm holding...
-Charizard - 55:45 Meh...
Lucas - 50:50 ^
Ness - 50:50 ^^
Mario - 55:45 Don't get caped
Jigglypuff - 65:35 Floating around is pretty annoying but besides that you should have much trouble
Link - 60:40 It's Link
Yoshi - 65:35 Besides a few kick attacks like his jab and nair, this isn't too hard
Captain Falcon - 60:40 It's Captain Falcon
Ganondorf - 70:30 FP FP FP FP FP FP FP CAMP GG
Samus - 60:40 Just stay near her

 

[The_Bear735]

Ganondorf - 70:30 FP FP FP FP FP FP FP CAMP GG

lol I hope that's not serious...

 

[iLink]

lol I hope that's not serious...

It's an inside joke...

 

[Zucco]

Inside jokes are just pointless if you post them on a public forum, mate!

happy new years everyone.

 

[G-Beast]

my MU order is Lucario:other character

only going to list who can actually threaten me

i do not think this is what the MU is necessarily, just how i find the characters for difficulty

Meta Knight : 45:55
Snake: 50:50
Falco: 55:45
Diddy: 60:40
Wario: 50:50
DK: 50:50
Marth: 50:50
Peach: 65:35
ROB: 55:45
Olimar: 65:35
Mr. Game & Watch: 45:55
Samus: 65:35
D3: 45:55

I don't really find anyone else to be even remotely threatening

i may have forgotten some characters....

 

[Alus]

Metaknight: 60-40 - If i land a hit, half the time it is a lucky one. If i dont, I take a lot of damage trying, if I get hit offstage, I die no second chances. Aurasphere is the heart and soul of this matchup for me. This and lucky F-smashes and Bairs.

Snake: 60-40 - To me there are two kinds of snakes around my area, the snakes that are actually snake, and the snakes that are trying to be snake. The latter is easier of course, juggle in the air, watch for explosives, F-tilt, and U-tilt. If you keep moving you can even camp with aurasphere.

The real snakes cut off my air. I'm not about to camp them, I can't touch them in close combat, they can fight me back in the air (I guess i'm bad at spacing) I can barely scratch them, and when i do it isn't hard to come back.

Wario: ??? - I'm not sure how this is for me... I only know of one Wario and that would be Blue Rouge. I think that you should stop chasing wario with aerials and jumping into him. And not to throw random F-smashes. I remember playing him and nearly beating him before, but I think that was because the actions that i took were so stupid...they worked!

Diddykong: 99-1 -
Throw a projectile,get *****.
Jump,get *****.
Shield,get *****.
Dodge,get *****.
Go offstage, get *****.
Game ends, get *****.
------------------------------------------

This is what I have for now...

 

[culexus・wau]

Metaknight: 60-45 - If i land a hit, half the time it is a lucky one. If i dont, I take a lot of damage trying, if I get hit offstage, I die no second chances. Aurasphere is the heart and soul of this matchup for me. This and lucky F-smashes and Bairs.

105 match-up ratios

Diddykong: 1-99 -
Throw a projectile,get *****.
Jump,get *****.
Shield,get *****.
Dodge,get *****.
Go offstage, get *****.
Game ends, get *****.
------------------------------------------
This is what I have for now...

I agree wholeheartedly .

 

[The_Bear735]

The Diddy Kong matchup is nowhere near as bad as Alus is making it out to be. I agree with it being a disadvantage, but only slightly. Diddy still has to rely on naners to prevent Lucario from ground controlling. Get Diddy into the air and you can do some decent damage. And his recovery is somewhat punishable, though lol if your opponent uses it obviously. (jose)

 

[IceDX]

My personal MU list is there vv


http://fashiongamers.nicetopic.net/...ach-upscontiendas-by-icedx-update-11-t134.htm

 

[Browny]

That list bears an uncanny resemblence to the mexican tier list >_> except with DK up like 20 spots lol

 

[IceDX]

That list bears an uncanny resemblence to the mexican tier list >_> except with DK up like 20 spots lol

umm I did not noticed that before =/ , but its only obvious that it ends up something close to it bc of lucario being an extreemely well balanced character, so only good characters can do good against it....

IMO..

 

[phi1ny3]

Except Ike is godly...

 

[IceDX]

Except Ike is godly...

Yeah just look at the incredibly awesome Tj Ike player weve got:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVfzoKEDek4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ef6QG0ghn0Y

 

[Browny]

well you know that pretty much sums up why the mexico tier list is so different... ike is a pain to approach, and how many times did the other player have a % lead (massive in snakes case) and yet they still approached and tried risky things? Sure hes a good ike, uses nair, jab and fair like a pro but still no doubt in my mind those matches would be constant 2-stocks of that ike if the other player waited for ike to approach, not the other way around.

 

[IceDX]

well you know that pretty much sums up why the mexico tier list is so different... ike is a pain to approach, and how many times did the other player have a % lead (massive in snakes case) and yet they still approached and tried risky things? Sure hes a good ike, uses nair, jab and fair like a pro but still no doubt in my mind those matches would be constant 2-stocks of that ike if the other player waited for ike to approach, not the other way around.

You should know better then to think people will make a tier list based out of individual players skill levels.........

 

[G-Beast]

diddy? disadvantage? is that some kind of sick joke??

ill be very honest, i find diddy to be somewhat easy... dangerous, but not hard

 

[Browny]

If you want to showcase an amazing ike player, can you show him vs some people of equal skill level then? It's hard to see him as godly when the other player is not on their level.

 

[IceDX]

diddy? disadvantage? is that some kind of sick joke??

ill be very honest, i find diddy to be somewhat easy... dangerous, but not hard

I agree...

If you want to showcase an amazing ike player, can you show him vs some people of equal skill level then? It's hard to see him as godly when the other player is not on their level.

ill get some vids of us playing when i get the chance then... he doest have any other vids atm...

 

[phi1ny3]

If you want to showcase an amazing ike player, can you show him vs some people of equal skill level then? It's hard to see him as godly when the other player is not on their level.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvSYz9TYaMQ

Mind you I personally felt Lee didn't play this MU correctly, but still.

I do have to say though it isn't an even or disadvantageous MU, although it's totally okay to say that a MU's disadvantageous if it's your personal list. Some people plainly suck at some MUs as a given character due to mental/playstyle constraints.

 

[IceDX]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvSYz9TYaMQ

Mind you I personally felt Lee didn't play this MU correctly, but still.

I do have to say though it isn't an even or disadvantageous MU, although it's totally okay to say that a MU's disadvantageous if it's your personal list. Some people plainly suck at some MUs as a given character due to mental/playstyle constraints.

Personally right now i can win almost every game but for what ive seen , it has a slight advantage over Lucario bc of its range and some other stuff.. but it might change to 50/50 but first i got to check some stuff...




And the Ike on the vid isnt that good..

 

[Alus]

EDIT my phone didnt show that some posts existed.

 

[iRJi]

.....? All of this talk about Ike beating lucario is dumb. Enough said.

 

[Alus]

I would like to hear what this "some other stuff" is before i jump to a conclusion.

 

[Aurasmash14]

Ike SHOULDN'T be beating you once you get familiar with him. AS is too good in this MU.

 

[IceDX]

Ike SHOULDN'T be beating you once you get familiar with him. AS is too good in this MU.

I will prob agree with you, but most people havent seen any good Ike players... so I will remain undecided for now

 

[phi1ny3]

Ike loses to good shield use.

It's true that he can outzone your grab most of the time, but that's what AS does for you, forces approach and offers punishment for any move that isn't quick in commitment.

Ike can outzone half the cast rangewise, but his aerials are still lackluster, most of the time he connects because of a mistake rather than an actual boon he holds over a character in a MU. Ike has one of the crappiest underbellies in the game, marth is pretty bad to begin with in terms of juggling him, but Ike is x10 worse because he has neither the aerial speed nor the tools in case the opponent makes a wrong move, and can be juggled really really badly. Another flaw is his recovery, literally if well spaced/timed, you can AS, fsmash, fullhop-> bair (not really recommended), and even DT his recovery when he's about to grab the ledge in the animation. What's worse is that at higher percents when knockback is significant, a good lucario can force his second jump pretty well and have enough time to charge a Fully charged on nearly fully charged AS for when he repeats the motion again. Ike can also be WoP'd offstage really well. Ike's low tier because of some really crappy exploitable weaknesses. Range shouldn't matter because as I've said, Ike outranges nearly everyone minus zair people, but that doesn't mean he has a tangible MU advantage of characters like Marth, MK, or even characters with crappy range like Falco or Wolf, right? Don't get me wrong fair is really, really long range, but there's a lot of weaknesses in Ike play that doesn't help him enough to warrant an advantage.