Ike E3 1.0.8 Patch changes + discussion

[XDaDePsak]

Does anyone have a graphical representation of Ike's hitboxes?

Like a gif which shows actual opaque boxes?

 

[Blubolouis]

I could hit a kirby with a short hop autocancelled fair on bf. Might be character/hitbox dependant, like how sheik's usmash only reached some specific characters' foot on the lower platforms of BF in brawl.
I'd really like some SA frames on eruption :/

 

[Ffamran]

So, updated Ike's frame data spreadsheet and the thread to the best of my ability. This thread which you all could use as a moveset discussion thread: http://smashboards.com/threads/im-perfectly-happy-being-boring-ike-moveset-data.402912/.

And Ike's Counter was buffed in 1.0.6, but nobody knew or mentioned it.

Ike
---
Counter
    hitbox
        kbg 74 -> 100

Ike
---
Jab1
    transition to jab2
        frame 13 -> 10
Jab2
    new hitbox added as hitbox 1; old hitbox 1 changed to hitbox 2
    hitbox 0
        y 8.0 -> 7.5
    new hitbox 1
        angle 80 (others are 65)
        kbg 80 (others are 80/100)
        wbg 25 (others are 40/50)
        size 3.5
Jab3
    hitboxes appear on frame 7 -> 6 (1 frame faster)
    hitbox 3
        size 2.5 -> 3.2
    hitbox duration 3 -> 4 frames
Dash Attack
    animation speed 1.25x for frames 0-17 (3 frames faster?)
    hitboxes appear on frame 18 -> 17 (4 frames faster total?)
    hitbox 0
        damage 10 -> 14
        angle 55 -> 52
        kbg 70 -> 78
        size 6.0 -> 6.3
        hitlag 1.0 -> 1.2
    hitbox 1
        damage 8 -> 11
        angle 55 -> 52
        kbg 70 -> 78
    hitbox 2
        damage 5 -> 9

Ftilt (all)
    animation speed 1.25x for frames 0-14 (2 frames faster?)
    hitboxes appear on frame 15 -> 14 (3 frames faster total?)
    all 3 old hitboxes replaced with 1 new one
    new hitbox
        bone 1000 -> 1
        damage 14/14/12 -> 12.5
Utilt
    initial hitbox
        y 12.0 -> 13.0
    delayed hitbox
        y 10.5 -> 12.0
        lasts until frame 19 -> 22 (duration 5 -> 8 frames)
Fair
    hitboxes appear on frame 16 -> 14 (2 frames faster)
    hitbox 0
        y 9.0 -> 10.5
    hitbox 1
        y 6.2 -> 6.75
    hitbox 2
        y 4.0 -> 3.0
Some 1.25x animation speed added to a couple unknown minor actions (non-attacks)

 

[MaximalGFX]

So, now this is super easy to do

 

[Ussi]

^ test with DI pls

 

[Mario766]

DI makes it a lot harder, though if the suction is better you might be able to force people into eating the spike when they try to edgeguard.

 

[Starfall11]

I feel Ike has improved drastically in this patch. My friends main Roy and Lucina respectively, and it's definitely winnable. It does get frustrating how difficult it is to punish for whiffed attacks though. For example, if my opponent misses their fsmash. I still have a difficult time punishing with something like dash > grab. But it's a work in progress.

I wondered how you guys handle it.

 

[anas abou]

i might sound crazy or nooby or like i'm riding the hype train but i legit think that ike might be high mid tier after this patch

 

[goose32]

Regarding his dash attack, I was able to kill a Luigi when he was around 80% or so. Granted, there were several factors contributing to this:

-He was near the ledge
-I was at like, 120%

 

[Mario766]

Ike's dash attack kills around 100 at the ledge.

It kills Mario with no DI at 80 with 0 rage.

 

[Starfall11]

It's stronger than PM Ike's dash attack now, which is saying a lot.

This is my impression of the FE characters post-patch:

High Tier: Roy

Upper-Mid: Ike/Marth

Lower-Mid: Lucina

Shulk is like in between high and upper-mid. They're all relatively good besides Lucina now. I feel all MUs are 60-40 at worst.

 

[Mario766]

I think Ike is higher than Marth with these buffs. He's close to Roy honestly.

 

[Starfall11]

He could be. I think us Ike players need to "get out more" or attend tournaments and represent this character that people seem to underrate. I'm going to try to get more involved with the east coast scene.

Fight for your friend guys!

 

[Mario766]

Or we don't

Get more buffs

THEN go out.

 

[Renegade TX2000]

LMFAO that strategy... We will sit in slumber until the time is right.

 

[Mario766]

Ike was in the hyperbolic time chamber

Time to put him back in.

 

[Starfall11]

We'll stay in the shadows until we're extremely overpowered. Hahaha.

 

[anas abou]

Shulk is like in between high and upper-mid

lol shulk is not a FE character he's a xenoblade chronicles

Or we don't Get more buffs THEN go out.

nah if vharacters like ______________andare getting sufficient tournament representation then there is no reason we have close to no representation

 

[Mario766]

It was a joke.

 

[anas abou]

It was a joke.

oh !! sorry for getting hot headed

 

[Starfall11]

oh !! sorry for getting hot headed

I know Shulk isn't a fire emblem character... But he's a swordsman, that's why I wanted to rank him. And that's why I ranked him separately.

 

[FlynnCL]

Quick question, did forward-tilt get a slight range buff? The old hitbubbles were removed and replaced with 1 new one, which sounded worrying but the range is really impressive.

 

[san.]

Quick question, did forward-tilt get a slight range buff? The old hitbubbles were removed and replaced with 1 new one, which sounded worrying but the range is really impressive.

Perhaps. Ftilt angled upwards used to have the best horizontal reach, but now it seems the default is superior in that direction. Default ftilt seems to extend past the visual swing. Both the upwards and downwards angles have some good reach vertically as well. Can't really tell at a first glance if it's better, but it pretty much gets to the max reach of the animation.

 

[sirchadakiss18]

 

[-RedX-]

Can't Ike just measure Aether so he spins parallel to the ledge? But then this might get him hit by Mac's Dsmash.
Something to keep in mind vs Mac I guess.

 

[MaximalGFX]

Most counters works against Ike as well... Not a lot of people knows about that, at least in For Glory.

 

[san.]

Can't Ike just measure Aether so he spins parallel to the ledge? But then this might get him hit by Mac's Dsmash.
Something to keep in mind vs Mac I guess.

Dsmash won't hit if you're prepared for it. Aim the sword at mac and recover low if need be. Also, the Ike could've recovered in that video, but released too early. Too many Ike players do that, when there's a significant portion below the ledge where Ike can autosnap. Any form of QD recovery is also easy.

Counters don't work as well as they used to since QD could recover most of the time.

 

[sirchadakiss18]

Can't Ike just measure Aether so he spins parallel to the ledge? But then this might get him hit by Mac's Dsmash.
Something to keep in mind vs Mac I guess.

Either way timed right ; Mac's Neutral B will hit Ike forcing him to jump to Up B again and recover low, forcing him away from away from the ledge more and more. then there's always the panic of trying to space the Aether perfect to the ledge and SDing. Also the timing is to release When Ike is coming down to snap to ledge. it like Guaranteed pretty much on up B.

Also what's up Red-X meyne ;v

 

[san.]

Either way timed right ; Mac's Neutral B will hit Ike forcing him to jump to Up B again and recover low, forcing him away from away from the ledge more and more. then there's always the panic of trying to space the Aether perfect to the ledge and SDing. Also the timing is to release When Ike is coming down to snap to ledge. it like Guaranteed pretty much on up B.

Also what's up Red-X meyne ;v

Neutral B: Hit mac with aether, DI the punch and QD back. When you QD, you can just react to whatever Mac wants to do or snap below the ledge if you want. Spacing aether is up to the skill of the player. It's not very hard. Aiming the spinning sword is more important anyways. In the end, both players suffered equivalent damage.

Smash attacks: Just hit Mac with the spinning sword before Mac has any chance to set up a smash attack. If Mac isn't at the very edge, Ike can also retreat the aether if the sword was mis-spaced.

 

[-RedX-]

Either way timed right ; Mac's Neutral B will hit Ike forcing him to jump to Up B again and recover low, forcing him away from away from the ledge more and more. then there's always the panic of trying to space the Aether perfect to the ledge and SDing. Also the timing is to release When Ike is coming down to snap to ledge. it like Guaranteed pretty much on up B.

Also what's up Red-X meyne ;v

Go to tournaments already.

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

I'm pretty happy with the buffs my boy Ike got this time around.

 

[sirchadakiss18]

Go to tournaments already.

Tryna make the next local soon, I'm due, time for Mac to shine :v

Neutral B: Hit mac with aether, DI the punch and QD back. When you QD, you can just react to whatever Mac wants to do or snap below the ledge if you want. Spacing aether is up to the skill of the player. It's not very hard. Aiming the spinning sword is more important anyways. In the end, both players suffered equivalent damage.

Smash attacks: Just hit Mac with the spinning sword before Mac has any chance to set up a smash attack. If Mac isn't at the very edge, Ike can also retreat the aether if the sword was mis-spaced.

this Strat. was developed for the sole purpose of baiting a low recovering Ike, not much I can do About high recovering QD yet except a possibly well place counter i guess, but the purpose of this Strat. is to Snipe Ike's Aether after a double jump, literally nothing he can do about it, srsly. don't know if you've noticed but Multi hit attacks with low K/B doesnt make Mac flinch during Straight Lunge.

I've practiced this a lot. Gonna catch @ Renegade TX2000 with this next :v lmao

 

[Starfall11]

I don't know if anyone watched ZeRo's video about Ike impressions following 1.08 patch. But he places Ike at the top of middle tier, and possibly the bottom of high tier if "played perfectly".

I wondered if you guys shared these impressions, or if you would place Ike higher/lower on the tier list. It seems about right to me. And I think this has been (by far) the most helpful patch for Ike since the game came out. If we get any more buffs, Ike will be A-tier without a doubt.

Edit: For anyone interested in watching the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHAwi8LAWO8

 

[LordShade67]

I don't know if anyone watched ZeRo's video about Ike impressions following 1.08 patch. But he places Ike at the top of middle tier, and possibly the bottom of high tier if "played perfectly".

I wondered if you guys shared these impressions, or if you would place Ike higher/lower on the tier list. It seems about right to me. And I think this has been (by far) the most helpful patch for Ike since the game came out. If we get any more buffs, Ike will be A-tier without a doubt.

Edit: For anyone interested in watching the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHAwi8LAWO8

Yeah, sorry, but I beat ya to the punch already. XD
Still, I'm legit surprised ZeRo even thinks highly of Ike.

 

[Zatchiel]

the purpose of this Strat. is to Snipe Ike's Aether after a double jump, literally nothing he can do about it, srsly.

In the video you posted, Ike didn't have to use his double jump to recover. He could've just used Aether. If he did that and took a hit from your neutral B or a counter he would have still had his double jump, while still being relatively close to the stage.

The f-air he did offstage that cost him the double jump was rather ballsy. Something I learned from Brawl Ike is not to use double jump when it isn't necessary or doesn't seem optimal.

 

[Arrei]

I think his point is, if Ike ever gets into a situation where he's forced to use Aether, Mac can end him with Straight Lunge. Meaning we need to keep that in mind against Mac.

 

[sirchadakiss18]

In the video you posted, Ike didn't have to use his double jump to recover. He could've just used Aether. If he did that and took a hit from your neutral B or a counter he would have still had his double jump, while still being relatively close to the stage.

The f-air he did offstage that cost him the double jump was rather ballsy. Something I learned from Brawl Ike is not to use double jump when it isn't necessary or doesn't seem optimal.

Had he not used the double jump after an Aether, I wouldve sniped him during Aether, then he wouldve been forced to Double jump then Aether again, then I wouldve sniped him again, and again, and again, till death :l

also I didnt know you was on these boards Zatch, sup meyne :v

damn all the Ikes are here, I might hang and chill over in these boards ;d

I think his point is, if Ike ever gets into a situation where he's forced to use Aether, Mac can end him with Straight Lunge. Meaning we need to keep that in mind against Mac.

pretty much yeah, If he recovers Low, Mac has an option against him now.

 

[Zatchiel]

I think his point is, if Ike ever gets into a situation where he's forced to use Aether, Mac can end him with Straight Lunge. Meaning we need to keep that in mind against Mac.

I understand. I think most Ikes know by now Little Mac can feasibly edgeguard Aether.

Had he not used the double jump after an Aether, I wouldve sniped him during Aether, then he wouldve been forced to Double jump then Aether again, then I wouldve sniped him again, and again, and again, till death :l

also I didnt know you was on these boards Zatch, sup meyne :v

Yeah, Ike's always been my main. It's nice to see you dude. <3

If you hit that guy out of the first Aether and he had his second jump, he wouldn't have been forced to Aether again. Quickdraw is way better than Aether for recovering when you're that close to the stage, and it can hit Mac out of Straight Lunge if need be.

pretty much yeah, If he recovers Low, Mac has an option against him now.

Down smash and counter seemed to be great options to me, as I play both characters, but my Mac is nowhere near your level.

I'm not saying that your idea isn't valid. But if Ike conserves his second jump and the first straight lunge doesn't kill him, odds are he's easily making it back if you decide to charge a second.

 

[Arrei]

It's almost been a month and I still can't get over how much of an improvement dash attack got. Having just now faced the first Rosalina who knew what they were doing on FG since the patch, I found it sends Luma surprisingly far now - like almost half the distance of FD. It's still punishable, of course, but it's REALLY good at killing it early.

 

[Starfall11]

It is amazing how when I'm exhausted and favor offensive play, I do absolutely terrible with Ike. But when I'm wide awake and play more conservatively, I tend to destroy many solid players. You really need to be awake to play Smash/Ike.