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IGN playing Smash Bros Brawl Again

phi1ny3

Not the Mama
Joined
Apr 15, 2008
Messages
9,649
Location
in my SCIENCE! lab
Haha, so I had a good experience with this recently. We went to a gaming "clique" that was just debuting recently, and I decided to just round up some people and just show them objectively the cool stuff about competitive smash. Mind you, most of these guys had played fighting games to at least some degree, but most were more low level/mid level players in those games, so I told them the beauty of having a game as accessible as this, and that while it was rough around the edges, that it had a great community behind it and fostered enough to make it competitively viable.

We plunked down, and gave a crash-course on smash, for those who didn't play it, or only played it in a more party/casual fashion prior. We went over basic stuff, like the pseudo RPS effect (attack/dodge > grab, grab > shield, shield > attack, although this is obviously really generic), what any character wants to use the most, setups, reading the opponent, edge play, etc.

The fun part was when we got to why items didn't exist in competitive play. Instead of just going "because they're stupid and you should feel stupid for thinking otherwise", I had them play with and without items. There were at first questions like "If they're in the game by default, why do you guys remove them?" I brought up that the same reason we patch games nowadays (constructively, mind you, not crying from every little advantage) is done for similar reasons why we remove items in smash. I told them briefly the reason it started (because it wasn't always the case, at least for Melee), and why it appeals to the competitive build. We showed them that items were definitely built with a "chaotic" game in mind, but that if the game had really been strictly a party game that nobody could change around, they wouldn't allow the option to turn them off. The game isn't worsened in any way doing either with or without items, but in order to make emphasis on spacing, skill, control, and options matter, one only needs to go to the game options to completely change the game. I wanted to make it clear that there are still a lot of competitive smashers that would be willing to go FFA and crazy with items, as long as it wasn't being used as a standard for competitive play, they had not forgotten smash's flexibility in that case, but find enjoyment by changing the game itself, and we also showed them how there had been other ways people have had fun doing crazy customized things, like Duelist Pro (I sure hope everyone here knows what that is, it's pretty fun as a little time killer lol), to show that Smash's strength is the combined ability to marry highly customizable gameplay, with an engine and design that is depthful enough to still let it become competitive in a sense.

Now when we actually played, I showed them/told them about different items and why some of them are literally game-breaking even on a casual level (the fan and some others, in particular, were definitely ones they agreed cheapened the experience), and I showed them that we've done some testing (albeit little) and found that items merely don't appeal to what we wanted out of it for a competitive build. They more or less agreed, and I even showed them how a match can look when it's a 1v1 on a more serious level. They agreed that while it was a different game, it wasn't necessarily bad. And I concluded that I love smash the way it is, I still play party-style, but when I want to dispense with the kid gloves, I get a good kick out of smash providing a more non-traditional fighter (I won't get into a debate on that, but I feel that's the best way to describe it, as so much of the core components are translatable into other fighting games), and enjoy how it allows me to flip between those options quickly on a dime. I would have to say that tbh, the best way to introduce the game is to go down to their level (even if that means you have to groan your way through items lol, imo it's worth it, and I personally still get a kick out of the craziness occasionally), enjoy it with them, and then compare it to how depthful it can become when you let all of the competitive aspect loose in a couple of matches. I've concluded that the growth of this game competitively can be achieved, but one must be a little more open-minded, and empathize with how they perceive the game, it's a process that needs to be met halfway, but smashers definitely need to step it up in opening doors imo.
 

Crizthakidd

Smash Champion
Joined
Oct 1, 2007
Messages
2,619
Location
NJ
Bingo
Haha, so I had a good experience with this recently. We went to a gaming "clique" that was just debuting recently, and I decided to just round up some people and just show them objectively the cool stuff about competitive smash. Mind you, most of these guys had played fighting games to at least some degree, but most were more low level/mid level players in those games, so I told them the beauty of having a game as accessible as this, and that while it was rough around the edges, that it had a great community behind it and fostered enough to make it competitively viable.

We plunked down, and gave a crash-course on smash, for those who didn't play it, or only played it in a more party/casual fashion prior. We went over basic stuff, like the pseudo RPS effect (attack/dodge > grab, grab > shield, shield > attack, although this is obviously really generic), what any character wants to use the most, setups, reading the opponent, edge play, etc.

The fun part was when we got to why items didn't exist in competitive play. Instead of just going "because they're stupid and you should feel stupid for thinking otherwise", I had them play with and without items. There were at first questions like "If they're in the game by default, why do you guys remove them?" I brought up that the same reason we patch games nowadays (constructively, mind you, not crying from every little advantage) is done for similar reasons why we remove items in smash. I told them briefly the reason it started (because it wasn't always the case, at least for Melee), and why it appeals to the competitive build. We showed them that items were definitely built with a "chaotic" game in mind, but that if the game had really been strictly a party game that nobody could change around, they wouldn't allow the option to turn them off. The game isn't worsened in any way doing either with or without items, but in order to make emphasis on spacing, skill, control, and options matter, one only needs to go to the game options to completely change the game. I wanted to make it clear that there are still a lot of competitive smashers that would be willing to go FFA and crazy with items, as long as it wasn't being used as a standard for competitive play, they had not forgotten smash's flexibility in that case, but find enjoyment by changing the game itself, and we also showed them how there had been other ways people have had fun doing crazy customized things, like Duelist Pro (I sure hope everyone here knows what that is, it's pretty fun as a little time killer lol), to show that Smash's strength is the combined ability to marry highly customizable gameplay, with an engine and design that is depthful enough to still let it become competitive in a sense.

Now when we actually played, I showed them/told them about different items and why some of them are literally game-breaking even on a casual level (the fan and some others, in particular, were definitely ones they agreed cheapened the experience), and I showed them that we've done some testing (albeit little) and found that items merely don't appeal to what we wanted out of it for a competitive build. They more or less agreed, and I even showed them how a match can look when it's a 1v1 on a more serious level. They agreed that while it was a different game, it wasn't necessarily bad. And I concluded that I love smash the way it is, I still play party-style, but when I want to dispense with the kid gloves, I get a good kick out of smash providing a more non-traditional fighter (I won't get into a debate on that, but I feel that's the best way to describe it, as so much of the core components are translatable into other fighting games), and enjoy how it allows me to flip between those options quickly on a dime. I would have to say that tbh, the best way to introduce the game is to go down to their level (even if that means you have to groan your way through items lol, imo it's worth it, and I personally still get a kick out of the craziness occasionally), enjoy it with them, and then compare it to how depthful it can become when you let all of the competitive aspect loose in a couple of matches. I've concluded that the growth of this game competitively can be achieved, but one must be a little more open-minded, and empathize with how they perceive the game, it's a process that needs to be met halfway, but smashers definitely need to step it up in opening doors imo.
:phone:
 

-LzR-

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Messages
7,649
Location
Finland
@phi1ny3: Awesome stuff. That is a great approach to use instead of ITEMS SUCK WE PLAY SRS BUSINESS NAWBS.
But tbh I don't care much about this IGN stuff or anything even if it seems cool. It makes no difference to me at least, but IF I am lucky, some random Finnish guys might use it find our little community which would be totally awesome.
 

Shawn101589

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 5, 2009
Messages
357
Location
Warwick, Rhode Island
Haha, so I had a good experience with this recently. We went to a gaming "clique" that was just debuting recently, and I decided to just round up some people and just show them objectively the cool stuff about competitive smash. Mind you, most of these guys had played fighting games to at least some degree, but most were more low level/mid level players in those games, so I told them the beauty of having a game as accessible as this, and that while it was rough around the edges, that it had a great community behind it and fostered enough to make it competitively viable.

We plunked down, and gave a crash-course on smash, for those who didn't play it, or only played it in a more party/casual fashion prior. We went over basic stuff, like the pseudo RPS effect (attack/dodge > grab, grab > shield, shield > attack, although this is obviously really generic), what any character wants to use the most, setups, reading the opponent, edge play, etc.

The fun part was when we got to why items didn't exist in competitive play. Instead of just going "because they're stupid and you should feel stupid for thinking otherwise", I had them play with and without items. There were at first questions like "If they're in the game by default, why do you guys remove them?" I brought up that the same reason we patch games nowadays (constructively, mind you, not crying from every little advantage) is done for similar reasons why we remove items in smash. I told them briefly the reason it started (because it wasn't always the case, at least for Melee), and why it appeals to the competitive build. We showed them that items were definitely built with a "chaotic" game in mind, but that if the game had really been strictly a party game that nobody could change around, they wouldn't allow the option to turn them off. The game isn't worsened in any way doing either with or without items, but in order to make emphasis on spacing, skill, control, and options matter, one only needs to go to the game options to completely change the game. I wanted to make it clear that there are still a lot of competitive smashers that would be willing to go FFA and crazy with items, as long as it wasn't being used as a standard for competitive play, they had not forgotten smash's flexibility in that case, but find enjoyment by changing the game itself, and we also showed them how there had been other ways people have had fun doing crazy customized things, like Duelist Pro (I sure hope everyone here knows what that is, it's pretty fun as a little time killer lol), to show that Smash's strength is the combined ability to marry highly customizable gameplay, with an engine and design that is depthful enough to still let it become competitive in a sense.

Now when we actually played, I showed them/told them about different items and why some of them are literally game-breaking even on a casual level (the fan and some others, in particular, were definitely ones they agreed cheapened the experience), and I showed them that we've done some testing (albeit little) and found that items merely don't appeal to what we wanted out of it for a competitive build. They more or less agreed, and I even showed them how a match can look when it's a 1v1 on a more serious level. They agreed that while it was a different game, it wasn't necessarily bad. And I concluded that I love smash the way it is, I still play party-style, but when I want to dispense with the kid gloves, I get a good kick out of smash providing a more non-traditional fighter (I won't get into a debate on that, but I feel that's the best way to describe it, as so much of the core components are translatable into other fighting games), and enjoy how it allows me to flip between those options quickly on a dime. I would have to say that tbh, the best way to introduce the game is to go down to their level (even if that means you have to groan your way through items lol, imo it's worth it, and I personally still get a kick out of the craziness occasionally), enjoy it with them, and then compare it to how depthful it can become when you let all of the competitive aspect loose in a couple of matches. I've concluded that the growth of this game competitively can be achieved, but one must be a little more open-minded, and empathize with how they perceive the game, it's a process that needs to be met halfway, but smashers definitely need to step it up in opening doors imo.
Spot on, and this is exactly what we need. It's not so much a matter of meeting half way, but of eliminating any signs of elitism that many smashers have, and explaining things in ways that make sense instead of disregarding any other opinion. Great post.
 

Shawn101589

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 5, 2009
Messages
357
Location
Warwick, Rhode Island
Just as an update for anyone still interested in this: I have emailed Richard twice since his original reply to me, and have yet to receive a reply (the last time being one week ago). I don't know if he's decided to scrap the idea, or what is going on, but it seems things are on stand still atm :urg:
 

Mr-R

Smash Champion
Joined
Dec 14, 2008
Messages
2,544
LOL I thought that link was legan at first since his name is also Corey.

But then I saw him play.......
 

John12346

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 24, 2009
Messages
3,534
Location
New York, NY
NNID
JohnNumbers
Someone from SWF should go over there to show some moves, it would make for an interesting IGN video. Anyone know where IGN headquarters is?

Oh, and someone else should introduce them to Brawl hacks. Y'know, stage textures, character vertexes, music hacks. I always love seeing how people react to these kinds of changes. :D
 

SupaSairentoZ7℠

Smash Hero
Joined
Nov 27, 2010
Messages
7,555
Location
Norfolk, Virginia
All I would want are the music hacks and to be able to record replays longer than 3 minutes and I'd be happy. Reading the comments on the video are the reasons why I enjoy watching those runs. Although I honestly doubt they know much about the game and just play it as a standard brawl.
 

MechaWave

Smash Champion
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Messages
2,227
I'm sorry. It was too horrific for me to watch. I saw those rolls and couldn't bare it.
 

DaBeast

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
506
Location
New Jersey
NNID
DaBessBeast
3DS FC
3566-1658-7713
If you watched the end, you would see that the link was actually using link as we do. Bombs everywhere lol. That link was very campy(not a bad thing) and very entertaining. Also , idk why but for a second at 6:10, i thought link was going to do a bomb->dair combo.
 

Johnknight1

Upward and Forward, Positive and Persistent
Joined
Feb 25, 2007
Messages
18,966
Location
Livermore, the Bay repping NorCal Smash!
NNID
Johnknight1
3DS FC
3540-0575-1486
Between a new member on Smash Boards with one arm tied behind his back and one of these guys, I would bet on the new member on Smash Boards with one arm tied behind his back.

Also, how the heck did that Meta Knight die so fast=??? Didn't they read the dojo post "YOU MUST RECOVERRRR!!!!!!!"
 

Mr.Jackpot

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 30, 2011
Messages
1,727
Location
WA
We could have competitive players play with a casual ruleset if that's what they want. It's a lot more fun to watch than this.
 

link2702

Smash Champion
Joined
May 10, 2008
Messages
2,778
IGN editors and most people reading comments from competitive players won't dare even accept a challenge from a competitive player, even if they're polite and friendly about it...
 
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