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I Will Believe In Myself: Miles "Tails" Prower Support Thread

SonicMario

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even IGN themselves wanted Tails in Smash which probably gave Tails more votes then he would have got.
Although I am surprised IGN out of everyone wanted Tails in Smash since they hate Sonic. Unless they just love Tails that much.
That might just be to whoever was the author of the article getting behind Tails being a Sonic fan while some of the reviewers for Sonic games weren't Sonic fans in the slightest. Or at the very least IGN is a huge supporter behind just the classic Sonic games that they feel the need to support a more classic character.
 

OptimisticStrifer

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If Tails got in; what would be the likelyhood of getting an Event based on the famous April Fools prank? We would have everything we need to recreate it.
 

volbound1700

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Unfortunately, it appears the Smash 4 poll is the main factor in deciding characters and Shadow had more votes than Tails. :(. Tails best chance would be DLC. Perhaps SEGA can make the call and push for Tails over Shadow.
 

SonicMario

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Unfortunately, it appears the Smash 4 poll is the main factor in deciding characters and Shadow had more votes than Tails. :(. Tails best chance would be DLC. Perhaps SEGA can make the call and push for Tails over Shadow.
We don't know that for sure, the Smash Ballot's results have never been released. Though I get how it can look like bad news when some of the exit polls have Shadow and Knuckles there but no Tails. Though quick reminder that not everyone who voted on the ballot participated in the exit polls. And I think it only truly matters for those who were top voted that were eligible (I really do think it was the ballot who brought back K. Rool at last) cause K. Rool definitely had to be quite high if he was #1 on most of the polls.

And it's still kind of a question that if Shadow was by far the highest voted Sonic character. Why did Tails and Knuckles get Mii costumes that have been shown to be consolation prizes/hints toward being playable, keep their already established assist role, or an upgraded role in Smash Ultimate while Shadow did not?
 

MacDaddyNook

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Unfortunately, it appears the Smash 4 poll is the main factor in deciding characters and Shadow had more votes than Tails. :(. Tails best chance would be DLC. Perhaps SEGA can make the call and push for Tails over Shadow.
Honestly, I don't know if Shadow did so hot on the ballot since general consensus was that AT characters didn't have a chance to make it in and therefore not worth wasting a vote on. I'm sure he got some votes, but I don't think he was the headlining Sonic character on the ballot.
 

Scamper52596

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Tails in general is simply a more important character than Shadow is, so it's possible Sakurai would want to prioritize him. Usually that's what happens when it comes to franchises getting more than one representative.
 

SchAlternate

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Shadow is almost certain to happen as an Echo Fighter. It makes too much sense for him not to happen.

Tails, though, could still make the jump to playable even if Shadow made it in. Echoes don't take development time from unique fighters, after all. And heck, maybe they realize that Tails is pretty much a gaming icon at this point, so they might think he's worth adding in. Though, honestly, I'm not sure how likely that is. Despite all the outstanding newcomers we've gotten so far, we're still not certain how the selection process went like. Guess it's a matter time until we know...
 

Jigglymaster

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Okay imma say it again. Any fan poll that ISN'T the ballot is BS because it is simply NOT the ballot. No matter how "likely" it may be, there are a lot of people just like myself that ONLY voted in the ballot, y'know, the one that mattered. This brings me back to my point that those fan polls are for more hardcore fans and not casual ones.


However, if we are to go by history, there was an official Sonic popularity contest many years back and the ranking order was Sonic, Shadow, Tails, Knuckles in that order. In the Smash Bros series, generally being an assist trophy means you're one step away from being a character.

So, if Shadow, being #2, was an assist trophy in Smash 4, then it should be assumed that no other Sonic character would make it into the game. But in Ultimate, Knuckles, the #4 spot, is now the assist trophy. I'm going to state again that it would be REALLY weird if #2 and #3 didn't have more important roles than #4. Unless somehow Knuckles got super popular recently which I doubt.

And it's still kind of a question that if Shadow was by far the highest voted Sonic character. Why did Tails and Knuckles get Mii costumes that have been shown to be consolation prizes/hints toward being playable, keep their already established assist role, or an upgraded role in Smash Ultimate while Shadow did not?
Thing is, Dark Samus did not get a Mii Costume either, rather she was an assist trophy, so that doesn't prevent a character from not making it in the game as a playable character.

I honestly think Shadow scoring higher than Tails is irrelevant, especially if he's going to be an echo. If Fire Emblem can get 7 reps and Castlevania can get 2 reps, and characters that haven't appeared in 10 years can be in the game, I really don't think Sakurai honestly cares about arbitrary numbers anymore, he just wants to put characters fans want into the roster. If Tails and Shadow are both highly requested characters, both of them will get in. Simple as that.
 
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SonicMario

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I honestly think Shadow scoring higher than Tails is irrelevant, especially if he's going to be an echo. If Fire Emblem can get 7 reps and Castlevania can get 2 reps, and characters that haven't appeared in 10 years can be in the game, I really don't think Sakurai honestly cares about arbitrary numbers anymore, he just wants to put characters fans want into the roster. If Tails and Shadow are both highly requested characters, both of them will get in. Simple as that.
Yeah, that's a good point that reps may not be quite as big of a deal this time around. The community will think it will still matters so if 3 Sonic reps happen there will still be that disbelief. But I suppose at this point we can't rule it out any longer.

Richter moved the goalposts from "2nd 3rd party franchise reps can't get in" to both "they can but they have to be echoes" and "they can only have two characters". Given both this game and Smash 4's history. It's yet another thing that can be broken. And Tails could certainly break both, even if it takes until DLC to do it.

For this to be the ultimate Smash bros. from a Sonic fan point of view. (I'm already satisfied generally as a Smash/Nintendo fan point of view. From that end it's already ultimate) Tails being playable for the classic crowd, and Shadow being playable as an echo for the Modern crowd would do just that. Unless you're a huge Knuckles fan and/or would much rather have Dr. Eggman playable (Though I bet at the very least he might get a cool Spirits boss) that should be plenty satisfaction for a Sonic fan coming into Ultimate.
 
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SonicMario

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CaptainAmerica CaptainAmerica , didn't realize you already made a post about EGM's April Fools joke before me. Whoops.
Shouldn't be too much of an issue, things like that hoax have provided support for other characters before. I actually do sort of credit it for helping Sonic get the huge demand that was so high they delayed Brawl to get him in (Even if we now know part of it was Sega at first said no but changed their minds just in time). It's only fair we keep mentioning it, as we want it to come into full fruition with Tails. It's ok if multiple people mention it. It's part of Smash history after all.
 

P1ZZ4CHU

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Shadow is almost certain to happen as an Echo Fighter. It makes too much sense for him not to happen.

Tails, though, could still make the jump to playable even if Shadow made it in. Echoes don't take development time from unique fighters, after all. And heck, maybe they realize that Tails is pretty much a gaming icon at this point, so they might think he's worth adding in. Though, honestly, I'm not sure how likely that is. Despite all the outstanding newcomers we've gotten so far, we're still not certain how the selection process went like. Guess it's a matter time until we know...
I still think the chances are pretty good. If Shadow really is a lock like people think, it means the Sonic series is on Sakurai's mind. That can only mean good things for Tails.
 

CaptainAmerica

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CaptainAmerica CaptainAmerica , didn't realize you already made a post about EGM's April Fools joke before me. Whoops.
No problem, go ahead anyway. We can never have too much support for Tails.

I'm wondering how much support these characters have outside of various fandoms. In the Sonic fandom, unfortunately Tails isn't the favorite - Shadow and Sonic are really close in popularity, and I think even Knux is ahead of Tails. Smash fans are considering Shadow a lock based on Richter as well.

It all makes me wonder about that 'silent majority' people like to reference - I don't really know much about Shadow since I only know Sonic's really early games. Tails is definitely more recognizable to me. Plus, with Sonic's moveset taking a lot from the early games (based on the number of spin moves, and that Sakurai's acknowledged the 'one-button' made it tough as the early games only had the button to spin) I'd be interested in whether the earlier games have priority (in which Tails would be favored since he'd be more recognizable to non-fans) or the later ones (in which Shadow would be favored since he's more popular among fans)

Or we could get both, I'd be okay with that too.
 

SonicMario

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No problem, go ahead anyway. We can never have too much support for Tails.

I'm wondering how much support these characters have outside of various fandoms. In the Sonic fandom, unfortunately Tails isn't the favorite - Shadow and Sonic are really close in popularity, and I think even Knux is ahead of Tails. Smash fans are considering Shadow a lock based on Richter as well.

It all makes me wonder about that 'silent majority' people like to reference - I don't really know much about Shadow since I only know Sonic's really early games. Tails is definitely more recognizable to me. Plus, with Sonic's moveset taking a lot from the early games (based on the number of spin moves, and that Sakurai's acknowledged the 'one-button' made it tough as the early games only had the button to spin) I'd be interested in whether the earlier games have priority (in which Tails would be favored since he'd be more recognizable to non-fans) or the later ones (in which Shadow would be favored since he's more popular among fans)

Or we could get both, I'd be okay with that too.
I think one strange thing about if Sakurai wanted to represent both Classic and Modern. That they didn't include a stage that is more based on a majority of Modern games. The only stage other then Green Hill Zone which is based on the first Sonic game is Sonic Lost World, which so happens to be one of the few modern games to go for a kind of neo-retro style for it's worlds including the checkered pattern of retro levels. Only some of the music and I guess the Homing Attack is all modern games get in terms of representing the Sonic Adventure and onwards era. Shadow getting in as an echo might make up for that entirely.

Though on another note, it's kinda strange on my part. Sonic Adventure 2 (:Battle to be precise) was my first Sonic game and it's what hooked me onto the series. And I can't get into the classics as most people due to them being kind of too hard for me. I can't beat them without some kind of cheat. Knowing that, you'd think I'd be all in for Shadow and not Tails. But I find myself in the opposite position. Tails became my favorite Sonic character in the first years of being a Sonic fan. Maybe I just liked the thought of a kid near my age at the time (Tails is 8, and I was like 9 or 10 when I was getting into the Sonic series) doing badass things like blowing things up in a mech and/or the absolute breeze that is Tails' flying levels in Sonic Adventure DX might of hooked me as well. Though it could also be partly that the Shadow the Hedgehog spin-off game kind of ruined Shadow for me
 

SonicMario

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I honestly think Tails and Knuckles are kind of on near Equal terms. Knuckles just seems louder because he has the memes (& Knuckles, his raps from the Adventure series (Though I kinda love those), and most recently that terrible Ugandan Knuckles meme) plus those who want him in Smash want him since he's "More of a natural fighter" while ignoring that Tails has been in the fray in many Sonic games including the two fighter titles (Sonic the Fighters and Sonic Battle)

Tails has the advantage of being the franchise's Luigi. Being one of the first images people come to mind when they think of Sonic with Tails following behind Sonic running through levels. And is almost always there even in games that limit the character cast.

Knuckles has that "cool" factor either because Knuckles is a hothead that punches and while not this part of his character isn't quite as relevant anymore, Knuckles had that guardian job that give him a demeanor of the silent guardian at times (Even if in games after Adventure 2 he can be seen abandoning the Master emerald to go air boarding in Sonic Riders and stuff like that)

Knuckles will seem cooler then Tails for the populace that look for tougher stuff then the "cowardly" sidekick. But I can't imagine a world where Wario gets in a game like Smash before Luigi. Which I think is the most apt Mario comparison. Wario's all-around tougher then Luigi and offers some sort of antagonist feel even if he's still kind of a hero in some games (Albeit Wario is probably alot closer to the villain scale then Knuckles ever was) like when he was in Super Mario 64 DS and I think most of the Wario Land games? But yeah for much the same reasons why Wario shouldn't be prioritized over Luigi, Knuckles shouldn't over Tails. I'd love it if the entire Team Sonic trio can be in Smash together. But for now Sonic & (Echo or not) Tails or Sonic & Tails & an Echo Shadow is all we've got to hope for with Knuckles as an Assist.
 

UnknownM

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Tails was the character who I voted for on the Smash Ballot! Reallyyyyy wanted him and was sad he didn't make it so here's hoping he's in Ultimate.
 

SonicMario

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Tails was the character who I voted for on the Smash Ballot! Reallyyyyy wanted him and was sad he didn't make it so here's hoping he's in Ultimate.
To be fair, only one character arguably got in Smash 4 because of the ballot. And that was Bayonetta, albeit if she was picked by the ballot it was because she had a surge of votes in just the first two weeks or so. As development on her started pretty fast.

Ultimate's newcomers however have been very much based on the ballot. We got K. Rool. Most of the Echoes probably did well though not quite high enough to get in as their own unique character. While we can't be too sure how the Belmonts did there may have been a decent push for them anyway (Though I imagine most Konami character votes went to Solid Snake for being a veteran)

But one thing that is kind of clear is that many of the Mii costumes we got may have been leaving hints for us on who was doing well. As certainly some of our newcomers had Mii costumes in the last game, and Tails was among the Mii costumes. It didn't quite pan out that way for Knuckles but he still became an Assist Trophy so hopefully something's coming for Tails in this game. Even if it's unfortunately not a playable status.
 

tailsBOOM!

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Tails is literally one of the biggest gaming icons. He's appeared in more games than many of Nintendo's own reps, and has even had two solo games (Plus one educational one). I want him so much that I told Nairo that I'd gift at least ten subs if he makes it it. And I will. Tails is more important than Shadow, and would make more sense to be playable!
 

SmashBro99

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I would have really preferred Knuckles, he's one of my favorite characters in video games and the moveset would have made itself, but atleast he's an AT now, so I'm supporting Tails! Shadow is a shoe in as a Sonic clone with some altered moves (I hope, straight echo would bug me) Tails would be an awesome newcomer.

Tails > Shadow, but Shadow would be easier to make, but with Nintendo's finest and the Sonic squad joining up for the olympics I really don't see why we couldnt get both.
 

RileyXY1

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Tails is literally one of the biggest gaming icons. He's appeared in more games than many of Nintendo's own reps, and has even had two solo games (Plus one educational one). I want him so much that I told Nairo that I'd gift at least ten subs if he makes it it. And I will. Tails is more important than Shadow, and would make more sense to be playable!
Yeah. Having Shadow and no Tails is like having Wario and no Luigi.
 

RineYFD

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To be fair, only one character arguably got in Smash 4 because of the ballot. And that was Bayonetta, albeit if she was picked by the ballot it was because she had a surge of votes in just the first two weeks or so. As development on her started pretty fast.
I wouldn't put it past that Bayonetta isn't at least on the Top Ten list. I did see her getting a LOT of support so for all we could know she was at least somewhere around the most voted.
Yeah. Having Shadow and no Tails is like having Wario and no Luigi.
Yeah. It is kind like having Mario and Wario in Smash, but no Luigi. Or having Link and Ganondorf without Zelda. It's kinda wrong if you ask me.
Honestly, I don't know if Shadow did so hot on the ballot since general consensus was that AT characters didn't have a chance to make it in and therefore not worth wasting a vote on. I'm sure he got some votes, but I don't think he was the headlining Sonic character on the ballot.
That is true. At the time Shadow was an Assist, so that may have degraded his votes a bit.
 

Peripuff

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Just dropping in to say I support Tails, he is my 2nd most wanted newcomer, and that I think he has a very high chance that not many people in the community realize. I think he might get a trailer alongside Shadow, similar to Robin/Lucina and Simon/Richter
 
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volbound1700

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I hope you guys are right. I would love to have both Tails and Shadow. Heck, add in Knuckles or Dr. Eggman as DLC.
 

CaptainAmerica

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Fun stuff!

So considering that Sonic's colors haven't changed that much from his original blue, I tried to make a set of colors for our boi without going nuts with his orange. I did go a bit more intense than they were, but it's hard to just do different wristbands.

Cap_Tails Colors.png


So:
  1. Default
  2. Green Chaos emeralds to go with Sonic's purple emerald recolor
  3. Purple fuzzy wristbands and a more purplish fur color to reference Blaze
  4. Vector's black wristbands and a darker, slightly greenish, color to go with it
  5. Blue glowy wristbands like Sonic's Crystal Ring one, but darker blue
  6. Gold rings and pinkish fur like Amy
  7. The red bands like the hands from the Sonic 2 Special Stage
  8. Sonic's Ark of the Cosmos bands, with a lighter fur like Silver.
Also calling Venus of the Desert Bloom Venus of the Desert Bloom since you're collecting recolor sets.
 

volbound1700

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Fun stuff!

So considering that Sonic's colors haven't changed that much from his original blue, I tried to make a set of colors for our boi without going nuts with his orange. I did go a bit more intense than they were, but it's hard to just do different wristbands.

View attachment 161707

So:
  1. Default
  2. Green Chaos emeralds to go with Sonic's purple emerald recolor
  3. Purple fuzzy wristbands and a more purplish fur color to reference Blaze
  4. Vector's black wristbands and a darker, slightly greenish, color to go with it
  5. Blue glowy wristbands like Sonic's Crystal Ring one, but darker blue
  6. Gold rings and pinkish fur like Amy
  7. The red bands like the hands from the Sonic 2 Special Stage
  8. Sonic's Ark of the Cosmos bands, with a lighter fur like Silver.
Also calling Venus of the Desert Bloom Venus of the Desert Bloom since you're collecting recolor sets.
Nice work
 

MajoraMoon

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Fun stuff!

So considering that Sonic's colors haven't changed that much from his original blue, I tried to make a set of colors for our boi without going nuts with his orange. I did go a bit more intense than they were, but it's hard to just do different wristbands.

View attachment 161707

So:
  1. Default
  2. Green Chaos emeralds to go with Sonic's purple emerald recolor
  3. Purple fuzzy wristbands and a more purplish fur color to reference Blaze
  4. Vector's black wristbands and a darker, slightly greenish, color to go with it
  5. Blue glowy wristbands like Sonic's Crystal Ring one, but darker blue
  6. Gold rings and pinkish fur like Amy
  7. The red bands like the hands from the Sonic 2 Special Stage
  8. Sonic's Ark of the Cosmos bands, with a lighter fur like Silver.
Also calling Venus of the Desert Bloom Venus of the Desert Bloom since you're collecting recolor sets.
It would be pretty sweet if they had a special alt costume being Ray the Flying Squirrel to celebrate Sonic Mania Plus. Like Olimar's Louie.
 
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SonicMario

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Fun stuff!

So considering that Sonic's colors haven't changed that much from his original blue, I tried to make a set of colors for our boi without going nuts with his orange. I did go a bit more intense than they were, but it's hard to just do different wristbands.

View attachment 161707

So:
  1. Default
  2. Green Chaos emeralds to go with Sonic's purple emerald recolor
  3. Purple fuzzy wristbands and a more purplish fur color to reference Blaze
  4. Vector's black wristbands and a darker, slightly greenish, color to go with it
  5. Blue glowy wristbands like Sonic's Crystal Ring one, but darker blue
  6. Gold rings and pinkish fur like Amy
  7. The red bands like the hands from the Sonic 2 Special Stage
  8. Sonic's Ark of the Cosmos bands, with a lighter fur like Silver.
Also calling Venus of the Desert Bloom Venus of the Desert Bloom since you're collecting recolor sets.
That last one would be a pretty neat "Arctic Fox" Alt. A pretty nice screenshot taken would be that Tails with Alolan Vulpix on the Ice Climber stage heh.

That 7th alt also kinda resembles the more brown tails of the Early Archie comics/SatAM
EDIT: Images still seem broke. Let me direct link it

 
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volbound1700

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The SATAM cartoon was great. I always thought SEGA should have done a Sonic game in the SATAM universe.
 

Mastermiine

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Fun stuff!

So considering that Sonic's colors haven't changed that much from his original blue, I tried to make a set of colors for our boi without going nuts with his orange. I did go a bit more intense than they were, but it's hard to just do different wristbands.

View attachment 161707

So:
  1. Default
  2. Green Chaos emeralds to go with Sonic's purple emerald recolor
  3. Purple fuzzy wristbands and a more purplish fur color to reference Blaze
  4. Vector's black wristbands and a darker, slightly greenish, color to go with it
  5. Blue glowy wristbands like Sonic's Crystal Ring one, but darker blue
  6. Gold rings and pinkish fur like Amy
  7. The red bands like the hands from the Sonic 2 Special Stage
  8. Sonic's Ark of the Cosmos bands, with a lighter fur like Silver.
Also calling Venus of the Desert Bloom Venus of the Desert Bloom since you're collecting recolor sets.
Wow so cool! By any chance can you do one for silver and shadow?
 

Takasmash

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I wonder why theres two Sonic Stages do that means is it possible that maybe Shadow wont be the only character thats joining. Can Tails could be joining in Ultimate I could see it then why bother bringing back Windy Hill Zone probably means nothing. Hey I want Tails in smash ultimate I would love it.
 

Mastermiine

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I wonder why theres two Sonic Stages do that means is it possible that maybe Shadow wont be the only character thats joining. Can Tails could be joining in Ultimate I could see it then why bother bringing back Windy Hill Zone probably means nothing. Hey I want Tails in smash ultimate I would love it.
Both Simon and Richter share a stage, so sonic characters could share one
 

MajoraMoon

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I wonder why theres two Sonic Stages do that means is it possible that maybe Shadow wont be the only character thats joining. Can Tails could be joining in Ultimate I could see it then why bother bringing back Windy Hill Zone probably means nothing. Hey I want Tails in smash ultimate I would love it.
I don't really see how returning stages mean anything. But it would seem a bit unfair if a non-nintendo series gets another fighter along with an echo. It would be pretty cool to see Tails in smash though.
 

Mastermiine

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Just out of curiosity, how many sonic characters are you all ok with having max?

Is two your max? Three, four, five?

Are their certain characters that will make you upset got in before others?
 

SonicMario

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I wonder why theres two Sonic Stages do that means is it possible that maybe Shadow wont be the only character thats joining. Can Tails could be joining in Ultimate I could see it then why bother bringing back Windy Hill Zone probably means nothing. Hey I want Tails in smash ultimate I would love it.
It is rather interesting that now Sonic is the only singular 3rd party franchise to get more then one stage in one game. (While Pac-Man did get Pac-Land and Pac-Maze in Smash 4 they were split amongst the 3DS and Wii U versions. And Pac-Maze didn't return. As much as I would of preferred that return much more then Pac-Land).

Not sure if it really means anything character-wise. But I suppose the funny thing is that if Shadow's an echo he's either going to get Green Hill Zone at a different angle or Windy Hill. Both games Shadow are not related to at all and Shadow may contrast against on a happy background (Albeit they could just put a red, grey, or black filter over it and say that's good enough) heh. I suppose if they cared that much they could also give him no background at all like with ROB. But so far ROB is the only character without a stage in their character profile on the site.

If Tails is playable though, Windy Hill being his background on the site would be perfect since he was in Sonic Lost World. So in some ways it may be a blessing in disguise for Tails that Forces didn't get a stage since that would of definitely been used for Shadow's background. Granted again, they could just put a dark filter on Green Hill or Windy Hill. But either way there won't be a stage that naturally "fits" Shadow in his background if he gets in since Shadow isn't a classic character nor was he in Lost World at all.

So while it's one of those straw gasping things that likely won't matter, the stages point to Tails more then Shadow since one is retro and the other is neo-retro style and a game Tails appeared in that Shadow did not.

Just out of curiosity, how many sonic characters are you all ok with having max?

Is two your max? Three, four, five?

Are their certain characters that will make you upset got in before others?
5-6 Would be the absolute max. Though for the sake of trying to make it a little more neutral with characters that even those outside of Sonic might be ok with. 3-4 might be something a little more palatable. Not counting deconfirms, I'd want the main Sonic trio of Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, and then maybe Eggman. If I was allowed the 5-6. Then it'd include Amy and/or Shadow. But for now I just want Tails. I'd honestly stop pining for any more characters if I got Tails. Cause that's two dream inclusions in Smash in one lifetime.

And obviously I'd be kinda upset from the Sonic side of things if they add Shadow as an echo and... that's literally all they do with Sonic. I'll still enjoy the game of course but admittedly the Sonic fan side of things might make me a little bitter they just went the easy echo route with Shadow and give Tails nothing. Also if anyone else got in as a Unique Sonic newcomer before Tails. I could probably at least take and understand Eggman if that happened, but I still would feel a little bummed out.
 

Jigglymaster

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Just out of curiosity, how many sonic characters are you all ok with having max?

Is two your max? Three, four, five?

Are their certain characters that will make you upset got in before others?
Three. Knuckles is the 4th most popular character in the series and it'd only make sense that anyone below him won't be getting into the game. Tails and Shadow are the only two not in the game yet that are more popular than he is. Eggman is also suited to look like a Boss character. Amy, Silver, and anyone else's fates are sealed IMO.

If it were up to me personally? I'd throw in Amy and Knuckles as playable characters. Amy is my 2nd favorite Sonic character behind Tails.
 
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