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I foresee a controller problem for future tournaments

AttackstorM

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Nintendo seems to have stopped production of Gamecube controllers. This will be a problem because over time it will be harder to find a replacement for a controller that starts to go bad. Also what about the people that already sold there GC controllers or didn't have a GC to begin with? So bottom line is if nintendo doesn't continue production then using a GC controller will become not an option anymore. Tournaments like mlg ban wireless controllers...so this can pose a problem....
 

Drclaw411

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First of all, banning wireless controllers is beyong ignorant.

Second of all, Nintendo still produces N64 and GameCube controllers, you just have to order them from the online store. Wavebirds are hard to find though.
 

Yosher

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I don't know where or when I read this, but I do remember a statement somewhere that they would re-release some similar controller just for Brawl. I don't know wether this is true though..
 

2007

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in all honesty, if people who wanted to use it for brawl don't have them, that's too bad for them, and they are n00bs for not trying and getting them after June 8 (4 kinds of control). Thatm was 5 months ago, and if they are scarce, then it looks like they have a... little bit of a problem.
On a more positive note, there's always used controllers at your local game store. that's what I have, and I've got no regrets.
=2007=
 

Elec Man EXE

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I think Nintendo still makes them. They might not distribute them to stores as much, though. You can probably still order them online, through Nintendo. I mean, the Wii is backwards compatible. They can't very well screw all the people who are going to buy GC games but don't have GC controllers. GC games NEED GC controllers, so they have no choice but to keep making them if they care about backwards-compatibility (and they must, or they wouldn't have included it). It would make zero sense for them to stop producing GC controllers.

And even in the off-chance Nintendo did stop making them altogether, a 3rd Party company will step in and keep on producing them. If there's a demand for controllers, someone will fill it. Hopefully someone that would do it with good quality.
 

AttackstorM

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in all honesty, if people who wanted to use it for brawl don't have them, that's too bad for them, and they are n00bs for not trying and getting them after June 8 (4 kinds of control). Thatm was 5 months ago, and if they are scarce, then it looks like they have a... little bit of a problem.
On a more positive note, there's always used controllers at your local game store. that's what I have, and I've got no regrets.
=2007=
a few months, a year,...2years into brawl how long will these controllers last?
 

Cless

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Wavebirds were banned. Wireless controllers won't be for this game. Most of the control options are wireless.
 

FireWater

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MLG is terrible anyway.

Wireless should not be an issue for any gaming tournament, why it was banned is beyond me.
 

Kio Iranez

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MLG is terrible anyway.

Wireless should not be an issue for any gaming tournament, why it was banned is beyond me.
Wavebird only has 16 frequencies, so with so many tvs and gamecubes around, you can't have more than 16 controllers. Also, battery issues caused many excuses and whatnot.
 

Sliq

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Wireless remotes may be soft-banned or even banned because of frequency issues, and the fact that you have to re-sync to a new Wii every time you have a match, which would take forever.

AFAIK, Nintendo still sells ALL of the controllers for ANY system, just not through retail stores. This may or may not, in fact, be 100% true.

I am almost positive Nintendo still sells GCN controllers themselves to those who order them.
 

Run Native

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Hopefully Nintendo will create a GC controller with memory storage similar to what the wiimote has. This way you will not have to bring your wiimote and GC controller with you wherever you go in order to use your personal control scheme.
 

Kio Iranez

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AFAIK, Nintendo still sells ALL of the controllers for ANY system, just not through retail stores. This may or may not, in fact, be 100% true.

I am almost positive Nintendo still sells GCN controllers themselves to those who order them.
Here's a link to the Nintendo Online Store.

They indeed have all parts for all Nintendo systems.
 

BRoomer
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I will make a big fuss and boycott tourneys that ban other control types. It takes all of 4 seconds to resync a wiimote.

talk about johns.
 

Drclaw411

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MLG is for moist ******s.

I mean seriously ALL THE CONSOLES OF THIS GENERATION USE WIRELESS CONTROLLERS! aside from the wii being gcn controller compatible for SOME games, only the 360 even has a wired controller available! its not even an option! MLG Fails.

wtf you cant say v a g i n a
 

SirroMinus1

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Nintendo seems to have stopped production of Gamecube controllers. This will be a problem because over time it will be harder to find a replacement for a controller that starts to go bad. Also what about the people that already sold there GC controllers or didn't have a GC to begin with? So bottom line is if nintendo doesn't continue production then using a GC controller will become not an option anymore. Tournaments like mlg ban wireless controllers...so this can pose a problem....
i know a store that still sells them Woot
 

TheBuzzSaw

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I will make a big fuss and boycott tourneys that ban other control types. It takes all of 4 seconds to resync a wiimote.

talk about johns.
Not everyone's Wii remote has wonderful sync time like yours. Mine fluctuate from being sync'd instantly to taking a full minute to sync properly. I would say that after so many seconds of failed sync time, there should a pre-sync'd remote that players can use (or plug their Classic Controller into). Personally, I will be using a Gamecube controller 100%, so I'll sit back and watch.

LOL @ all people who mock MLG. Sure, they're not perfect, but they are only the biggest console gaming league around. Boycott the NBA and NFL while you're at it.
 

MookieRah

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I mean seriously ALL THE CONSOLES OF THIS GENERATION USE WIRELESS CONTROLLERS! aside from the wii being gcn controller compatible for SOME games, only the 360 even has a wired controller available! its not even an option! MLG Fails.
You go and host massive tournaments across the country and tell me how things work out.
 

2.72

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You know, after hearing that MLG banned wireless controllers, my respect for them went way up.

I seriously think that Nintendo, along with other gaming companies, is jumping the gun on this one. The wireless technology is pretty good, but I have had fairly consistent problems synching wiimotes. In particular, my second wiimote (ie not the one that came with the wii) appears to spontaneously get desynched about every two weeks (very, very roughly), and it can take a while to get the stupid thing to actually synch itself in the first place.

I'm also concerned that trying to synch controllers to two different wii's in the same room might not work out well. You know, that could have been solved neatly if Nintendo allowed you to plug in Wiimotes like GC controllers, and then synched those plugged in.
 

Ritalin

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Wiimote banned. Slightly unfair because tourny***s too lazy to deal with people playing in a different way
Classic controller banned. Slightly unfair because tourny***s too lazy to deal with people playing in a different way
Nunchuck banned. Slightly unfair because tourny***s too lazy to deal with people playing in a different way

Everything banned.
 

TheBuzzSaw

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Wiimote banned. Slightly unfair because tourny***s too lazy to deal with people playing in a different way
Classic controller banned. Slightly unfair because tourny***s too lazy to deal with people playing in a different way
Nunchuck banned. Slightly unfair because tourny***s too lazy to deal with people playing in a different way

Everything banned.
Casual***s: too lazy to learn the Gamecube controller.

You have no idea how to run a large tournament. Don't even pretend you know the reasons wireless would be banned.
 

Xanderous

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Guys, wireless controllers (aside from the wavebird) are synced directly to a console. There's no reason it can't work.

For a Wii-mote to resync, you push the red button on the Wii and the red button in the battery area of the 'mote ONCE each. If you push it more than once, it'll take forever. If you just do them once each, it should take a few seconds.
 

Cless

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I dunno, maybe it'll work. We'll see.

You'll also have to deal with batteries and stuff, and you'll have to re-sync every time you move to a new Wii.
 

Kio Iranez

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Wiimote banned. Slightly unfair because tourny***s too lazy to deal with people playing in a different way
Classic controller banned. Slightly unfair because tourny***s too lazy to deal with people playing in a different way
Nunchuck banned. Slightly unfair because tourny***s too lazy to deal with people playing in a different way

Everything banned.
Well, frequency issues aside, there are still problems with batteries and synching. Besides, smashers attending (large) tournaments will either be familiar with the GCN controller or can learn how to use it pretty easily. With all the problems with the wireless ones, why wouldn't you? :ohwell:
 

TheBuzzSaw

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The funny part about all this is that while many of you are boycotting MLG tournaments because of your complaints about being unable to use wireless controllers, their tournaments will still have massive turnouts from people able to just suck it up and play with a Gamecube controller.
 

Stalky

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Just to clarify - Wavebirds use radio frequencies (I think) for wireless, of which you can use one of 16. Banned because you wouldn't be able to use more than 16 in one room, and even then you'd have to co-ordinate who was using which frequency.

The Wiimote, however, uses Bluetooth, which would have no problem at all, besides these supposed syncing errors people are talking about, that I have never experienced myself.

Anyone who bans wireless control on the Wii is being ridiculous. It's the industry default now - it needs to be embraced eventually.
 

Xanderous

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Just to clarify - Wavebirds use radio frequencies (I think) for wireless, of which you can use one of 16. Banned because you wouldn't be able to use more than 16 in one room, and even then you'd have to co-ordinate who was using which frequency.

The Wiimote, however, uses Bluetooth, which would have no problem at all, besides these supposed syncing errors people are talking about, that I have never experienced myself.

Anyone who bans wireless control on the Wii is being ridiculous. It's the industry default now - it needs to be embraced eventually.
I already tried to explain this. They're unwilling to accept it for some reason.
 

TheBuzzSaw

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The Wiimote, however, uses Bluetooth, which would have no problem at all, besides these supposed syncing errors people are talking about, that I have never experienced myself.
Have you ever been in a room with over 30 Wii consoles running and Wii remotes constantly resync'ing? The odds of accidentally sync'ing to another Wii in the room will be very high.
Anyone who bans wireless control on the Wii is being ridiculous. It's the industry default now - it needs to be embraced eventually.
It's not about "embracing the industry default". MLG is very aware of where the game industry is headed. Have you ever tried hosting massive tournaments all over the country? You make it sound like MLG sees wireless as an evil upgrade. It's just impractical in many situations.
 

PrettyGoodYear

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Have you ever been in a room with over 30 Wii consoles running and Wii remotes constantly resync'ing? The odds of accidentally sync'ing to another Wii in the room will be very high.
Patience is a virtue.

It's not about "embracing the industry default". MLG is very aware of where the game industry is headed. Have you ever tried hosting massive tournaments all over the country? You make it sound like MLG sees wireless as an evil upgrade. It's just impractical in many situations.
There could be ways around it. Yes, it will be hard to adapt, but if you don't try, then you'll never progress.
 

AlphaZealot

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m3d said:
802.11 networks, the kind of wireless technology that DS systems and Wiis use to connect to the web and each other, can handle about 50-100 devices being in the same area before things really grind to a halt. 802.11 devices use a narrow portion of 2.4 Ghz range to transmit and whenever a device "hears" another 802.11 packet of data from another device, it refrains from transmitting until that packet has passed. While a few devices won't have any issues under this system, once you start hitting any more than that, you will see some serious slow down and lag. Additionally, any strong radio waves in the immediate area or any large number of additional electronic devices in the immediate vicinity can increase that interference significantly.

The Wii also uses another wireless technology, Bluetooth, to connect to the wiimotes. Fortunately, wiimotes and the system communicate under passkeys that lock the Wii and the controller to one another. That's why you can see a series of stations at Nintendo events, all using wireless controllers, that function just fine close to other stations. Bluetooth devices also use a pseudo-random switching system, to make small changes to the frequency about 1600 times per second. This further prevents interference with the devices.

However, according to bluetooth experts, the chances of two bluetooth devices in close range creating interference for each other is 1/79. Considering that 1600 changes are made per second, you can see the bluetooth devices are robust enough to handle regular spurts of interference here and there. However, the more devices you pack into one space, the more often that 1-in-79 chance interference actually happens. Bluetooth devices are also more robust than 802.11 technology when it comes to outside interference from televisions, power cables, cell phones and other electronic devices because they use the entire 2.4Ghz range to communicate and change rapidly. Unfortunately, they are not 100% resistent, so the more devices you pack into a single space, the more potential interference you encounter.

So imagine for a moment that you are using the Wii and wireless controllers to run a local tournament. It's the beginning of th event, which means lots of 4-man warm-ups and teams matches following. That means at each station, you have 5 bluetooth enabled devices (Wii + 4 controllers). Assuming you have 10 stations set up, that's 50 bluetooth enabled devices, plus the televisions, power strips, cell phones, DS systems and computers. Bluetooth has a maximum range of about 30 feet and an optimal range of 15 feet, so the closer any of these devices come to one another, the more likely interference will occur. Additionally, if any of the devices are networked together, for instance, some players are using the DS to play Pokemon between rounds, the interference increases. That interference will hurt the game of Pokemon more than it will hurt the game of Smash, but it will effect the Wiimotes. I am not terribly good at math, so someone else will have to calculate how a 1/79 chance, each of the 1600 changes per second, times 50 devices will play out and how often we can expect interference to occur.

So considering all of this, the question is, what is an acceptable amount of interference? As you can see, even small events are going to experience it in some fashion. It might not be enough to make the tournament unplayable, but its possible that the interference will effect the outcome of the matches if normal device functionality is interupted for a fraction of a second, every few seconds. Imagine attempting to run an event the size of FC, with 30 stations, 150 devices, plus 200 people talking on cell phones, playing on their DS and laptops and running power to TVs across a mile or so of cable. Sure not ALL of the devices will be within the 30 foot range, but they will overlap with dozens of potentially interfering devices no matter how well that gymnasium is arranged.

On top of all that, one has to consider the actual operation of the tourament and what kind of effect resetting the system over and over again to sync controllers will have on the ability to run the tournament smoothly. It will waste about 5 minutes each time the system has to be reset and controllers are synced. And since you will run into more problems if any other systems are resynced within the 30-foot range at the same time, even more time will be wasted staggering the reboot of systems within a certain range. If we allow wireless controllers at Brawl events, tournament organizers can expect to run about 25-30% longer easily than they have with Melee.
So, maybe now some people will understand.
 
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