Q&A How to Wreck *****es with Ganon?- Linguini Q&A Thread

[Bwmat]

Damn n0ne, that video r0cked. The 'get rekt kage' is strong in this one, lol. I loved the music choices.

Also, I completely agree pseudo, aggro falco is free compared to campy falco. It's nigh unwinnable.

 

[n0ne]

@ n0ne good luck with that bro

Dont worry, im 75% sure im going.

Anyways, i hope that combo vid has decent amount of dorf footage. A bit long but it was intended since its falcon PLUS dorf.

 

[Coastward]

still unsure about evo, i wanna go but its a bit out of my price range right now, maybe CEO.

in other news, got 2nd at my weekly. beat a really good shiek thats had my number for a while, feels good. almost reset the bracket too in grands but i lost momentum.

ill be sure to post VODs. i think i need to play more just so that my mentality is also on the ball. gonna reach another weekly on sunday as well, gonna make some more money lmao.

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

Hoping to do work at bad moon rising this weekend.

 

[Coastward]

also, i might pick up peach for sheik

****s so hardddddddddddd.

HERE ARE MY VODS BTW:

vs Marth

vs Sheik

vs Ness

vs Puff

 

[PseudoTurtle]

I was going to pick up a secondary for sheik, but then Kage said something that convinced me to stick with ganon. Until you're at the higher levels of play, its really the player you're having the problem with. Yea, sheik is a ****ing terrible and boring matchup, but until you can learn to beat mid-level sheiks with ganon, it doesn't really matter because you're basically just using your secondary as a crutch.

I'm gonna stick with ganon until I think I've reached my peak (or close to it) and then **** around with puff for sheik. I also think falco will give me problems down the line, so puff might help there too. If you're looking for a good complement to ganondorf, IC is a good choice. Good against falco and sheik, bad against falcon and peach (and ganon can def take on falcon and peach).

 

[PseudoTurtle]

LOL I forgot about this set:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64vS1UFIeAQ

Ganon dittos are the best to **** around. I'll watch your vids in a few Coast, I'm about to enter a tournament.

 

[YvngFlameHoe]

What is it called when you grab ledge and waveland onto the stage, and how is it done?

 

[-ACE-]

What is it called when you grab ledge and waveland onto the stage, and how is it done?

Ledgedash homie.

You're not jumping soon enough so you're dropping frames between drop and jump, which doesn't let your jump get high enough. Either that or your not holding forward after you jump.

I drop, jump, and as I jump I'm rolling the stick to forward (like a haduken) and hitting R once I'm on stage.

Holding forward is only necessary for a bit, then you can hold any direction of slightly down to reduce the length of your ledgedash (like if you wanted to ledgedash + pivot grab someone close to the ledge).

 

[spider_sense]

I think I might just go to locals around the country. Btw, Renth and I are gonna team and call ourselves dank weed and pick only green team/double Ganon

 

[tm]

Tied for 9th at Sweet 19 (out of around 180), losing to two local falcos (who were both eliminated by vwins). Got to play watch and talk to Kage some for the first time in a while. @ Divinokage thanks for the games and the tips. I hope you do really well today back in Canada!

I need to commission a falco training partner and study the **** out of guini / SS in that MU.

 

[PseudoTurtle]

Tied for 9th at Sweet 19 (out of around 180), losing to two local falcos (who were both eliminated by vwins). Got to play watch and talk to Kage some for the first time in a while. @ Divinokage thanks for the games and the tips. I hope you do really well today back in Canada!

I need to commission a falco training partner and study the **** out of guini / SS in that MU.

Tm, nice job! That's an extremely high placing for such a large tournament- I'm lucky to get that at a Chicago monthly. Very well done. Was anything recorded, and if so where can I watch? Any wins over big names?

About your falco problems, watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1rIKqvVMS8&t=19m53s
It's a friendly with the #3 spot at my school.

There's some REALLY cool stuff in that match, if I do say so myself. Not a whole lot of "new" stuff per se, but it's a good example of how to capitalize on punishes, tech chase accordingly, and edge guard an unsafe firebird.

**** it, you guys should watch the whole thing if you're bored, but skip the falcon parts, they're boring. There's a lot of silly WF spikes and style going on. PRZ even meteor cancelled an RLD dair... Who does that??

 

[Coastward]

k, won another tourney, **** feels GOOOOOOD.

gonna upload VODs and **** once theyre uploaded.

2-0d everyone in my pool. bodied a fox R1 in bracket, played a sheik afterwards and won 2-1 (****ing *****), after that i 3-0d a peach/fox in semis, and then beat a falco 3-0(?) in winners finals. dont remember the set count but it doesnt really matter. then in grand finals i lost 3-0 to the falco, but brought it back in set 2 with a 3-1.

))))))))))))))))))))))))))

 

[Bwmat]

nice **** coast.

In comparison, my achievement of the week was taking $20 from a 15 year-old because he kept saltily requesting $5 bo5 falcon ditto MMs (he mains marth/shiek and falcon's just a secondary for me). He wanted to keep going to but I cut him off lol. He's actually really good though, might even be better than me (higher on the current pr, for sure).

Everyone always gets so salty when I beat them. I think it's because I'm rarely playing 'good' and mostly just winning because I get lucky by going for really stupid ****, or other 'jank'

 

[tm]

Tm, nice job! That's an extremely high placing for such a large tournament- I'm lucky to get that at a Chicago monthly. Very well done. Was anything recorded, and if so where can I watch? Any wins over big names?

About your falco problems, watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1rIKqvVMS8&t=19m53s
It's a friendly with the #3 spot at my school.

There's some REALLY cool stuff in that match, if I do say so myself. Not a whole lot of "new" stuff per se, but it's a good example of how to capitalize on punishes, tech chase accordingly, and edge guard an unsafe firebird.

**** it, you guys should watch the whole thing if you're bored, but skip the falcon parts, they're boring. There's a lot of silly WF spikes and style going on. PRZ even meteor cancelled an RLD dair... Who does that??

I'll watch your sets sometime soon.

Ya, the only match of me on stream was vs Moose, in losers bracket
tm (ganon) vs Moose (falco)
I did alright. Lots of airdodges (missed wavelands). A lot of bad choices OoS, like whiffing a grab that wasn't even close, or just doing something because of what I expected him to do even though he obviously didn't do whatever it was. I make way more tech flubs in that MU, and probably need to be a lot more patient too.

Any advice from everyone is appreciated as always =]

 

[Divinokage]

Damn that combo video . It's hell to avoid Falcon combos as Ganon, you'll get comboed to **** if the Falcon knows what's hes doing. You have to get Falcon off-stage first before that happens lol.

I did pretty well overall i'd say. I lost to Duck in WF at Sweet but I beat him back in Canada after he said I would not take a game again. Vwins and I only lost 1 game total in teams at Sweet and went undefeated at No man's LAN. Also we both rocked crews haha. I lost to Vwins/n0ne at NML and Duck/Vwins at Sweet. I'll get him eventually, i just need my punish game better and a few setups I think.

 

[-ACE-]

Bad Moon Rising was pretty boss, couldn't enter but I got to chill with my NC/FL boyz for a while. Should have MM'd some people but was too busy socializing and playing a few friendlies. You guys should get ready for the sequel to this tournament, possibly in early fall.

EDIT: FIRST TOURNAMENT I'VE EVER BEEN AT WHERE THERE WERE ENOUGH SETUPS FOR EVERYONE TO PLAY FRIENDLIES ESSENTIALLY WHENEVER THEY WANTED.

Which was seriously awesome.

 

[n0ne]

Damn that combo video . It's hell to avoid Falcon combos as Ganon, you'll get comboed to **** if the Falcon knows what's hes doing. You have to get Falcon off-stage first before that happens lol.

I did pretty well overall i'd say. I lost to Duck in WF at Sweet but I beat him back in Canada after he said I would not take a game again. Vwins and I only lost 1 game total in teams at Sweet and went undefeated at No man's LAN. Also we both rocked crews haha. I lost to Vwins/n0ne at NML and Duck/Vwins at Sweet. I'll get him eventually, i just need my punish game better and a few setups I think.

ets

If vwins doesnt go, lets team at the next sweet

 

[RedmanSSBM]

Well I had a fantastic weekend haha.

Bad Moon Rising had to have been one of the best tournaments I've been to in a long time, ranking just below CEO 2014 for me. I wasn't able to do match analysis on Friday because I left my place at like 4:15pm since we wanted to get there early and we had housing for Friday night. I'll be sure to make up for it this upcoming Friday. As for the tournament itself, before it even started I got to play Dizzkidboogie a good little bit in some friendlies where I was being housed since he was also there. I didn't know it was him at first but it was really cool meeting him actually, as he's a real homie. I asked him how long he had been playing for, and he replied telling me that he had been playing since December of 2013. So he had been playing for a shorter period of time than I had, but I bet he got pretty good from just going to all these tournaments all over the place and getting in some really quality experience with top players from around the country. I don't doubt for a minute that's one of the main reasons he got good. He's got the experience for sure.

As for the tournament itself, I was in wave 2 of pools again so I had to wait a bit to be called, but I went in on my pool. It was bracket pools, FYI. My first match was actually against a pretty solid Fox by the name of Goku. It was a seriously close first set. I won 2-1 with a nice clutch combo to get Fox off stage and then finished off with an up-air spike when he tried to sweetspot the ledge from his up-b from above the ledge. That seriously is one of the hardest angles to hit with upair, but I did it in a nice clutch moment to close out the set. Round 2 I had to face Oso, aka Eddie, another Fox main. I had faced him twice before over the last year and the last time I played him was at Stomp the Yard 2, where he 2-0ed me in two sort-of close games. This time around though, I started off strong taking the first game, and then he CPed me to Yoshi's and was able to beat me there. I wanted to go back to Yoshi's again and it was super close. I think I almost had a 3-stock comeback or something like that, but I was also so high percent that any strong move would have killed me. I ended up dying because I got a bit nervous and I forgot that I actually had a double jump when I was sent off stage and ended up jumping and up-bing right into a bair or nair from him. If I won I would had had to face Gahtzu right afterwards lol.

My Loser's side run was legit though. The first person I faced was a Kirby main though. I felt kind of bad for the guy. After that was yet another different Fox main that was okay and knew some tech skill, but I was able to win convincingly with a 2-0. Then I had to face Purple, a skilled Falco main with many good secondaries from the Raleigh area who I had lost a money match or two to him before. It was a close first game on Battlefield, but he got the better of me and was able to close out that game. I believe I then CPed to Dreamland, or maybe I went back to BF... I don't remember. I won on that stage though. Then he CPed me to Pokemon Stadium and I two stocked him there I then had to face Goku again. The first game was close again but this time I won on Dreamland. He then made an off decision by counterpicking as Ganondorf and going back to Dreamland. Of course I won in the Ganon ditto. He was doing just fine with his Fox haha. For my final match, I faced Dizzkidboogie. The first game was rough cause I got 3-stocked and wobbled a few times on Dreamland, but the second game on Yoshi's was much closer, taking him down to his last stock, and I think I only got wobbled once but I don't remember. He had a pretty good Sopo though and finished me off. So in the end, I went 5-2 and got 3rd in my pool, and 33rd for the entire tournament. Here's the challonge link in case you're interested: http://challonge.com/bmrpool12

As for the rest of the tournament, it was great. I did a few money matches, Purple actually MMed me right after my pool was done and he just barely won 3-2 last game last stock. He played Falcon, Marth and Fox. It felt pretty good to beat his Falcon on FD Alas, I had a rather silly SD on Battlefield in Game 4, where I could have closed the set out 3-1, but ah, **** happens sometimes. I also MMed Sharkz who ended up 3-0ing me. The first game was actually really close, I was in the lead for most of it until the very end. He had his clutch factor on haha. After that was just a lot of wobbling. A bit frustrating but at the same time I don't have a lot of Ice Climbers experience. That matchup is so dependent on good spacing in neutral it's not even funny haha. I do like it when I actually separate the climbers though and it just becomes a pseudo 2v1 between Popo and Nana hahahaha. I then MMed Pineapple, a pretty decent Falco main also from the Raleigh area. I could have won the set 3-0 but I got pineappled on Dreamland (ROFL THE IRONY). After that my momentum wasn't doing too well and it went to game 5, but then I was able to close it out on Dreamland again. The next day I did one more money match vs Smith, who I ended up 3-0ing on stream, so I'll probably post that in here for fun once it's up-loaded haha. Right after the MM was done he wanted to do double or nothing, in which I declined.

It was great getting to play @ -ACE- on the second day. The Ganon dittos were great and I learned a lot more about them. I also had a lot of fun just playing rnadom doubles LOL. Can't wait to do that again soon. It was also cool playing @ Эикельманн [РУС] in some dittos as well. I was humbled when he told me he would have liked to have me coach him for some tournament matches, but I guess hew forgot to ask or I wasn't around at the moment. I'll gladly do it next time Ian!

Also, I played SleepyK a lot at this tournament as well and he helped me realize that Ganondorf at the highest level just has a really hard time in neutral because in order for him to move to the best of his ability, he has to wavedash a lot in neutral, which is kind of bad really, and patient/campy spacies/sheik at a high level can deal with that without much thought to it. I like to dash dance in neutral a lot, so I decided to choose between Marth or Falcon as a different character to work on. I ended up choosing Marth, so I'll be playing him in friendlies to learn how to play as Marth efficiently and improve him, but of course I'll still enter tournaments and do money matches as Ganondorf. My ultimate goal is that my Ganondorf and Marth are of equal high skill and that I use Ganon for most matchups and Marth mostly for Fox, Falco, and Sheik. I'm never going to truly leave the Dark Lord, that's just not in my blood haha. I still feel like he's definitely able to win against Marth and everyone else below Sheik on the tier list. I don't expect my Marth to be at least decent until like mid-June. So I might start playing him in tournament at CEO 2015. Of course I'll still be doing the Ganon match analysis on Friday and I'll still watch any new Ganondorf video that comes up (and boy there's a lot now that I got back here LOL).


TL;DR: Became homies with Dizzkidboogie. I got 3rd in my pool at Bad Moon Rising. Won and lost a few Money Matches. Got to play some fun Ganon dittos vs Ace and Eikelmann. I'm working more on my Marth now. Marth in friendlies, Ganon in tournament/MMes.

 

[why]

I guess I missed a lot of the Ganon people out at BMR this weekend. I could only be there for Saturday, but if I had gone Sunday I would have played some more. I did get to play the Ganon ditto against Eikelmann in pools though, and that was a very educational match. I will probably hang around on the Ganon boards for a while in order to improve my Ganon.

Bad Moon Rising was an amazing tournament, and I learned much about my playing, but I still want to improve as a player.

 

[AquaBoogie]

I figured out a really, really effective way to kill spacies, unfortunately Bizzaro, it is probually the least swag thing in the world, but it is also really effective. Anyway to what it is, when a spacie Side bs onto the stage and you know he isn't going to grab the ledge, wizards foot from the stage so you are going sideways, you will meet somewhere in the middle but instead of clashing, you take priority and instakill them. I did this at a local tourney this weekend and it seemed like not many knew about it and they were caught off guard. If someone already does this and this whole post is useless, my b, but if not this is really effective and I thought I'd share it.

 

[-ACE-]

I figured out a really, really effective way to kill spacies, unfortunately Bizzaro, it is probually the least swag thing in the world, but it is also really effective. Anyway to what it is, when a spacie Side bs onto the stage and you know he isn't going to grab the ledge, wizards foot from the stage so you are going sideways, you will meet somewhere in the middle but instead of clashing, you take priority and instakill them. I did this at a local tourney this weekend and it seemed like not many knew about it and they were caught off guard. If someone already does this and this whole post is useless, my b, but if not this is really effective and I thought I'd share it.

I do this for luls, they can just sweetspot or tech. Instant death if you miss.

 

[AquaBoogie]

I do this for luls, they can just sweetspot or tech. Instant death if you miss.

Yeah, this only works if they don't sweetspot and they are level with the stage. If you land it right, you can still easily recover and they cannot tech because they are in the middle of the move. You do the down b not exactly on the ledge, but near it (about the beginning of the first platform on pokemon stadium) it is a simple and unavoidable kill

 

[Divinokage]

Megabus is always swag. =)

 

[Bwmat]

I always go for that stupid down-b offstage against spacies in friendlies. **** almost never works (since they just sweetspot...), but it feels so good when it does.

it is the DEFINITION of styling, lol

 

[iRanch]

I do this for luls, they can just sweetspot or tech. Instant death if you miss.

Can you megabus in the same direction as the illusion while on stage and still hit or will it get out prioritized or clank?

 

[-ACE-]

Can you megabus in the same direction as the illusion while on stage and still hit or will it get out prioritized or clank?

Yeah you'll win that battle every time. But there's too much cooldown time for it to be useful.

 

[RedmanSSBM]

Here's the Twitch VoD of me vs Smith from Bad Moon Rising. http://www.twitch.tv/kneedeepgaming/b/637302932?t=2h48m30s

If it's not up on youtube by this weekend I'll upload it myself haha

 

[YvngFlameHoe]

What is a good way to practice waveland moonwalks consistently?

 

[Orah]

What is a good way to practice waveland moonwalks consistently?

If you're just starting to moonwalk, it's good start with Captain Falcon or Link because of how far their normal moonwalk can go.
When you have a good feel for it, it's real easy to do it normally out a dash or walking animation. However Ganon's isn't super useful when performed this way.

As far as the wavelands just practice with Ganon using the name entry glitch (preferred) or training mode. You want to short hop and fast fall then immediately push the control stick left or right while air dodging to get maximum distance. Or you can Short hop instant double jump if that's easier. However I suggest learning to do it out of a short hop so it's not as predictable.

When you can do both consistently by themselves you can now add them together.
Example: Say you want to waveland moonwalk right
First short hop fast fall> hold right on control stick immediately pull back to left and down angle right while pressing L or R.
It should be all one fluid motion with your thumb.

Keep practicing and it will get easier. I haven't mastered the technique totally but I'm 10x more consistent at it then I was a few months ago. I'm new to Melee so I didn't know this immediately ( lol I feel stupid about it now) but make sure you're practicing on a crt and not a hdtv. This probably common knowledge but I can't emphasis enough how much easier it is to do tech skill on a crt compared with the input lag of an lcd hd tv.

Staying on the topic of moonwalking I'm kinda unsure about how to freeze walk (moonwalk+sticky walk). I know it's mostly flashy and more of a gimmick but it still be cool to know how to do it consistently. Hope y'all have a great day!

 

[Duel]

Tied for 9th at Sweet 19 (out of around 180), losing to two local falcos (who were both eliminated by vwins). Got to play watch and talk to Kage some for the first time in a while. @ Divinokage thanks for the games and the tips. I hope you do really well today back in Canada!

I need to commission a falco training partner and study the **** out of guini / SS in that MU.

We both lost to Moose lol. I was actually surprised how unprepared he seemed against ganon. Had I played a little bit better i really feel like a could have easily taken a game from him. I lost both games with him having 2 high percent stocks left, a few mistakes I made on edgeguards taken away and it would have been anyone's game.

 

[AquaBoogie]

so its called the megabus?

 

[-ACE-]

We always called it the Mexican truck in NC lol.

No insurance.

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

So does anyone have an exact count of how many people I've recruited here over the years?

 

[-ACE-]

So does anyone have an exact count of how many people I've recruited here over the years?

Yo, you and your recruitees need to be more active on the boards. Jk lol, but tbh I think whatsapp is the sickest app for discussing smash ****. If anyone wants to talk smash, download whatsapp and pm me for my number. Just holding a button and recording a voice message that the other person can listen/respond to at their leisure is sick. You can also send HD videos and text just like normal messaging. Maybe I'm saying this cause I'm not on Facebook anymore but whatsapp is a killer app.

 

[why]

On the topic of the megabus, what other uses are there for that move? Sometimes I use it as a kill move mixup in neutral, and it seems to be effective. Is this actually a viable option, or should I stop using it for that purpose?

 

[-ACE-]

Sure it's viable, but you need to use it very selectively.

 

[Bwmat]

It's one of those things that can work very well when used carefully and unpredictably, but it makes you look like an idiot, not to mention dead, if you whiff.

it's pretty good for recovering, xd

 

[Renth]

 

[-ACE-]

Mark's swag factor is climbing.