How Super Smash Bros Brawl SHOULD be.

[kin3tic-c4jun-3]

I agree with everything that the OP has said, along with Dylan and Pheonix.

I see absoluteley no point in arguing against this topic anymore. The - NON-BIASED- points have been given again and again. It's like denying that if I pushed my fist through a scrub's face, it wouldn't hurt, or that Pamela Anderson doesn't have implants.

FACT
Advanced techniques require more skill

FACT
Advanced techniques are not exploitation

FACT
Scrubs and 'casual' players who can't use advanced techniques are the ones who argue - with no knowledge of what they're talking about

There has never been anyone here on these forums who uses advanced techniques and has said 'advanced techniques suck'

 

[Viewtiful_Jeff]

Viewtiful_Jeff if you turn the item switch to ''ON'' in your copy of melee, I will track you down, hunt you, and kill you.

Dylan_Tnga has warned you.

And yes I am serious. I play with tournament rules and despite there already being a competitive community, I will take it upon myself to personally take a plane to the house of all casual players and force them to play smash without items by force.


And if you believe any of this, I'll kill you.

XD


edit : whoops, just saw phoenix's post.

Pretty much everything he said? Yeah, that's what I would have posted if I wasn't tired of doing so. Read his post and not mine

Doesn't that mean you'll kill me either way?

Seriously though, despite your lame sarcasm, you've done the same fantastic job of misinterpreting my point that everyone else in this thread has done.

You know what?

You still havn't told me the flaws in my logic, I answered back and you simply ignored. Let me find it now....

Did I ever say that they are in the same time zones? In fact, what I'm saying is that they are not in the same timezones and THATS why their matches need to be scheduled beforehand. Did I ever say that there is a very low amount of casual players? Socialization...Tell me, can you socialize whilst playing a match online? Is there a microphone? You have got it backwards, you are assuming that I think there are not a lot of casual players and they are in the same time zone and VoIP...meh..

1. If Brawl has random matches online (one would believe it does, as I believe Pokemon Battle Revolution does), there'd be absolutely no need to schedule matches, if there is, as you yourself admit, a lot of casual players in different time zones.

2. I don't think the idea of Nintendo making a mic add-on is too far fetched, considering the N64 had one. Maybe some connectivity with the DS or something, I dunno.

 

[Viewtiful_Jeff]

There has never been anyone here on these forums who uses advanced techniques and has said 'advanced techniques suck'

You didn't read this thread very closely, didja?

 

[Adi]

I consider the hardest technique in the game to be Reverse Lasering with both fox and falco, not to do once, but to do consistently. The slightest slip up and you illusion, either getting your butt combo'd to high damage or death, or just plain flying off the stage and dying.

Haha no way bro, that stuff becomes muscle memory after a while. Have you ever tried to do shine turn arounds into waveshined edgehogs, now that's some crazy **** =P.

Wavedashing I could do that 3 weeks after I started playing melee, along with shorthopping, other techniques such as JC grabs and whatnot I learned way later.

Yeah if anyone finds the basics like WD and Shffl hard they simply haven't put enough practice into it.

 

[Rx-]

I agree with everything that the OP has said, along with Dylan and Pheonix.

I see absoluteley no point in arguing against this topic anymore. The - NON-BIASED- points have been given again and again. It's like denying that if I pushed my fist through a scrub's face, it wouldn't hurt, or that Pamela Anderson doesn't have implants.

FACT
Advanced techniques require more skill

FACT
Advanced techniques are not exploitation

FACT
Scrubs and 'casual' players who can't use advanced techniques are the ones who argue - with no knowledge of what they're talking about

There has never been anyone here on these forums who uses advanced techniques and has said 'advanced techniques suck'

I use AT's and they suck so much.

 

[the grim lizard]

Seriously though, despite your lame sarcasm, you've done the same fantastic job of misinterpreting my point that everyone else in this thread has done.

How about this, then?: Let's stop wasting all of our time, and instead of playing dodge the bullet, state your stance very simply so that we may understand what "your point" is, without giving a 10-page explanation. Then, we can give you a proper response.

 

[Salaad]

^QTF. You keep switching it around, confusing me...

 

[Viewtiful_Jeff]

How about this, then?: Let's stop wasting all of our time, and instead of playing dodge the bullet, state your stance very simply so that we may understand what "your point" is, without giving a 10-page explanation. Then, we can give you a proper response.

Fine, but first, that reminds me of a 10-page essay I read last week...

srsly tho, my position is this: There should be more variety in tournaments. I'm not saying that the tournaments with advanced techs and whatever should be abolished (I'm not a big fan of Wavedashing, but I don't really think it should be taken out), I just think we should be allowed to have the choice of how to play if we want to go a tournament.

I also think tourney players can be really elitist sometimes, and that ticks me off, but that's neither here nor there (and yeah, casual players can be the same way, and even I can be sometimes, so, yeah).

 

[Salaad]

Fine, but first, that reminds me of a 10-page essay I read last week...

srsly tho, my position is this: There should be more variety in tournaments. I'm not saying that the tournaments with advanced techs and whatever should be abolished (I'm not a big fan of Wavedashing, but I don't really think it should be taken out), I just think we should be allowed to have the choice of how to play if we want to go a tournament.

I also think tourney players can be really elitist sometimes, and that ticks me off, but that's neither here nor there (and yeah, casual players can be the same way, and even I can be sometimes, so, yeah).

Look at your first post, it says "WaveDashing should be taken out of the game"

Yes, I agree with your second statement. xD

 

[Viewtiful_Jeff]

Look at your first post, it says "WaveDashing should be taken out of the game"

Yes, I agree with your second statement. xD

Yes, and now I'm retracting that statement, genius.

 

[the grim lizard]

Thank you, this makes things easier.

srsly tho, my position is this: There should be more variety in tournaments. I'm not saying that the tournaments with advanced techs and whatever should be abolished (I'm not a big fan of Wavedashing, but I don't really think it should be taken out), I just think we should be allowed to have the choice of how to play if we want to go a tournament.

People have said this before, but...you can host a tournament any style you want, but the vast majority of them want things that are neutral. When I play with my friends and there is a disagreement about what should be on/off/etc. I just do whatever is the most neutral...whatever will interfere with us the least. You can't really complain about neutrality.

Anyway, people host tournaments that way because they know that's what people want and that people will come that way. People will be less likely to come to tournaments which will tend to be less fair, or at least...less neutral. Yes, you may say, but I don't want to host a tournament. Well, for one, (as someone who has hosted a handful of tourneys), that that is just lazy. If you want something a certain way, then take action and do it. If you're saying you just wish there were more tourneys out there that fit your particular taste, then fine...but again, sometimes you have to be the instigator.

I also think tourney players can be really elitist sometimes, and that ticks me off, but that's neither here nor there (and yeah, casual players can be the same way, and even I can be sometimes, so, yeah).

The funny thing about competitive things like this...some of the cockiest people are the worst players. There are tons of scrubs I've run into in person, people that I just know that go to my school, who think they are great, and then they play someone like me (who isn't even that good, btw), and they get beaten more than normal.

I definitely understand you because there are people even around here (without naming names) who act like that. Same rules apply. They aren't the best, probably not even close. Most of the best players on Smash Boards couldn't touch the best players in the world. The best players in the world are players like Ken, Isai, Ani, etc... Most of the best players in the world are in Japan. And, I can tell you that the Japense are very humble people. One of them could cream you, and he would be as nice as ever to you. Americans in general could take a note from the Japanese in this regard.

Anyway, all of that to say that most people aren't going to be jerks about things, and the ones that are the worst about it are usually a lot worse than they think.

 

[ecstatic]

Sorry to come into the topic late. I read the first few pages, and then skipped to the last page. The big problem it seems right now is that the casuals (by casual I mean pro-luck) would like to be able to have tourneys their way. I don't think any competitives (by that I mean pro-current tourney rules) have any problems with tourneys like that, as long as their style of play isn't disrupted.

Basically, the only thing stopping casuals from having their tourneys is that no casuals have taken the time recently to organize those tourneys. I suggest for starters, to start a casual SWF, as in, not try to organize your tourneys here, because SWF is totally geared towards competitives.

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

I just think we should be allowed to have the choice of how to play if we want to go a tournament.

It's a tournament. The rules are decided beforehand and you must follow those rules in order to win your matches and hope to win.

With what you're suggesting, there would have to be 2 tournaments for every one tournament.

The rules of a smash tournament should be to the discression of the organizer of the tournament. If you want tournaments with items and banned stages well then perhaps you should organize a tournament with those rules with likeminded people.

Not saying that's what you do want, but meerly commenting on the fact that leaving each person a choice when it comes to rules and format of a tournment event, can only lead to chaos and disorganization.

You want your rules? make your own tournamanet.

Going to a tournament? Follow the ****in' rules.

I suggest for starters, to start a casual SWF, as in, not try to organize your tourneys here, because SWF is totally geared towards competitives.

Give this man a medal? That's the smartest thing I've ever seen posted in the brawl section, next to a few choice posts from phoenix fire and mookierah and also alpha zealot.

Aside from those guys, yeah this is the b3sT p0st Ev4r!!11
__________________

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

To sum up Viewtiful's argument:

Hi, i'm a casual smasher. I have never been to a tournament as of yet, I've seen professionals play, and I can't get better despite how much I NOT practice, but I have seen people on YouTube do it. I bare little to no knowledge on competative smash essantials, but I sure as hell THINK I know what i'm talking about.

*whine, whine, etc*

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

Hi, i'm a casual smasher. I have never been to a tournament as of yet, I've seen professionals play, and I can't get better despite how much I NOT practice, but I have seen people on YouTube do it. I bare little to no knowledge on competative smash essantials, but I sure as hell THINK I know what i'm talking about.

Can you blame him? We're ruining the game for him with cheats such as ''practicing the game and playing a large ammount of people so as to create a metagame with which to benefit the entire community'' and ''Airdodging diagonally into the ground''

Not to mention that jumping hack we all use. shame.

 

[the grim lizard]

Dylan, you really could be a little more tactful. Scrub or not, you should treat people with more respect. Whether or not EPF's description is accurate, don't give people a reason to say that "competitive players" are condescending. (That is, unless someone really deserves to be flamed...)

 

[Viewtiful_Jeff]

Lots of Stuff

The thing about neutrality is that, like fun, it's subjective. I for one think that playing with items is neutral because everybody has the same chance of getting a good item.

As for hosting my own tourney, maybe you're right. It'd be kinda hard (no Gamecube or copy of Melee, sadly) but it'd probably be worth it (then again, I could just wait until Dec. 3rd, at which point, organizing tournaments would become exponentially easier....as lazy as I am, that's probably best).

Also, eh, cockiness and lack of skill don't always go hand in hand. Yeah, you're right, there are some people whose egos greatly exceed their skill, but there are also people who have skill, but their ego still makes them a huge buttwipe.

To sum up Viewtiful's argument:

Hi, i'm a casual smasher. I have never been to a tournament as of yet, I've seen professionals play, and I can't get better despite how much I NOT practice, but I have seen people on YouTube do it. I bare little to no knowledge on competative smash essantials, but I sure as hell THINK I know what i'm talking about.

*whine, whine, etc*

Can you blame him? We're ruining the game for him with cheats such as ''practicing the game and playing a large ammount of people so as to create a metagame with which to benefit the entire community'' and ''Airdodging diagonally into the ground''

Not to mention that jumping hack we all use. shame.

Ah ha ha ha.

Normally, that might bug me, but I take solace in the fact that together, you two might have enough intelligence to come to the conclusion that the sky is blue and the grass is green.

Maybe.

 

[psicicle]

Playing with items is only neutral in the long run, meaning that within one match, item drops may give the advantage to a player.

That means you have to play more games in a set to be more fair if you wanted items and a fair tourney.

 

[Jigglymaster]

Since tourny matches are only best of 3 items can easily give an advantage to a player 2 games strait, which is possible. Any type of thing that could give a big advantage to one of the players is prevented. Like stages that give characters advantages are either banned or only for counter pick depending on how much of a counter it can be. I mean, any healing item, Hammer, Star, Home-Run Bat, Mushrooms, metalbox's, Freezes, bombs, Mines, Party Balls, Exploading creats, pokeballs, and the star rod can easily change the outcome of a game.

Reasons

Hammer - Can easily kill an opponent, also if your not too careful yourself you can be thrown off.

Healing Items - you can basicly recover a whole stock with a healing item if your are at high %

Star - causes invinsiblity, makes so its impossible for the opponent to attack back, can randomly appear anywhere.

HomeRun Bat - 1 hit Ko's, Spiking opponents while they are recovering

Mushrooms - can kill opponent or you at low %

MetalBox - like a semi star

Freeze's - sort of like the kirby cide but without you sacrificing yourself.

Bombs, Mines - Exlosives, edgegaurding and easily kill at low %

Party Balls - can contian any of kind of item and can expload

Exlpoading Creats - can easily kill a player if not opened correctly, can be used for edge gaurding.

Pokeballs - Random, can get a goldeen or get a legendary pokemon and kill your opponent even though you were about to die.

Star Rod - used as projectile, can be used for spiking.


Just because both players have the same chance at getting these items dosn't mean it will always turn out like that. Its like flipping a coin 3 times. You could get heads 3 times, you could get Tails 3 times. You could get heads 2 times and Tails 1 time. Its random. Just because there are chances dosn't mean that the results will end up as the chances predicted.

 

[Viewtiful_Jeff]

@Jigglymaster: Fair enough. In best of 3, stuff like the Hammer, Star, healing items, Home-Run Bat, etc. could really mess you up. But what about weapons like the saber, the laser, the fan and the super scope? I would think those are fairly harmless, aren't they?

 

[Jigglymaster]

Idk about the super scope but like every item that you can throw can be abused by throwing it off the edge at your opponent to stop them from recovering, and that really dosn't take much skill. But it dosn't spike as much as the star rod or the HRB would. I mean you could have tournaments with those kinda items in it, it would be fine. But I would like to keep those top MLG tournaments and stuff to be the same.

Like there can be 1v1, 2v2, Crew Battles, Low Tier, FFA, and Item Battle as a sperate tourny.

The low tier tournament is where you can only use low tier characters. And probably an Item Battle tournament is where you use items in the tournament.

A tournament with items in it would replace the regualr tournament rules, but you could add it as a seperate type of tournament.

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

I like items matches in ssb64, because meh I hate using them, throwing a bat or sword in n64 was funn though, so I still like items in ssb64..

in melee I felt the items to all be dull and kind of... odd. Not kind of meant for the game somehow in my mind and then I found this website, that was like... 3-4 years ago man.

I signed up this year after I thought I knew enough about how to play and had done ok in a tournament.... lol. not great but theres on coming up.

Anyway I got nothing against item matches, ask someone for one in friendlies

MM$ material anyone

Think about it, and do whatever the hell makes you enjoy the game..

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

The thing about neutrality is that, like fun, it's subjective. I for one think that playing with items is neutral because everybody has the same chance of getting a good item.

As for hosting my own tourney, maybe you're right. It'd be kinda hard (no Gamecube or copy of Melee, sadly) but it'd probably be worth it (then again, I could just wait until Dec. 3rd, at which point, organizing tournaments would become exponentially easier....as lazy as I am, that's probably best).

Also, eh, cockiness and lack of skill don't always go hand in hand. Yeah, you're right, there are some people whose egos greatly exceed their skill, but there are also people who have skill, but their ego still makes them a huge buttwipe.





Ah ha ha ha.

Normally, that might bug me, but I take solace in the fact that together, you two might have enough intelligence to come to the conclusion that the sky is blue and the grass is green.

Maybe.

Oh you're rich.

You conclude that i'm an idiot despite the fact that all of your arguments have been biased towards your point of view rather than viewing them from both sides of the spectrum.

Not only that, but you don't have a gamecube, which also allows us to say that you really don't know what you're talking about in regaurds of tournament play.

And if you possesed any intelligence, maybe you would know that just because we don't play on a casual level doesn't mean we want to destroy all means of casual play. Becaus we don't acknowledge casual play doesn't mean we have the desire to ruin it for others, but you want to ruin it for us. Why is that?

Competative players don't want to destroy all means of casual play, so why do casual players want to destroy all means of competative play?

Think about it rather than be a whiner.

 

[maxpower1227]

Playing with items is only neutral in the long run, meaning that within one match, item drops may give the advantage to a player.

That means you have to play more games in a set to be more fair if you wanted items and a fair tourney.

Are you implying that more Smash is a bad thing?

 

[Adi]

Well it's certainly not feasible...

 

[Viewtiful_Jeff]

Are you implying that more Smash is a bad thing?

ಠ_ಠ

Oh you're rich.

You conclude that i'm an idiot despite the fact that all of your arguments have been biased towards your point of view rather than viewing them from both sides of the spectrum.

Not only that, but you don't have a gamecube, which also allows us to say that you really don't know what you're talking about in regaurds of tournament play.

And if you possesed any intelligence, maybe you would know that just because we don't play on a casual level doesn't mean we want to destroy all means of casual play. Becaus we don't acknowledge casual play doesn't mean we have the desire to ruin it for others, but you want to ruin it for us. Why is that?

Competative players don't want to destroy all means of casual play, so why do casual players want to destroy all means of competative play?

Think about it rather than be a whiner.

I conclude that you're an idiot because you do idiotic things. That post that I quoted was a sterling example of idiocy, if I do say so. Contrary to popular belief, stupid sarcasm isn't funny. It's stupid.

I don't have a gamecube because the one I did have was stolen.

And I never said that tourney players want to destroy all means of casual play. For god's sake, if you read my posts at the end of the thread instead of just generalizing off of my first post, you would know that's not what I think at all.

You would also know I don't seriously want to destroy competitive play, just widen the scope, per se.

Think about that, rather than being a raving idiot.

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

im not trying to diss you here but if you want to ''widen the scope'' in tournmanets, youd better make yourself heard and gain support. This thread is a start but look at the reaction.. You cant make other people change, people will have to want to join your cause, and see a specific set of new rules, for starters. If these tournaments involved peoples money.

The fun of picking up a motion sensor and tossing it on to the ground and then giggling like a schoolgirl as the opponent steps on to it and takes a nice long trip into the sky

No children allowed in tourneys without their parents

 

[Salaad]

Oh you're rich.

You conclude that i'm an idiot despite the fact that all of your arguments have been biased towards your point of view rather than viewing them from both sides of the spectrum.

Not only that, but you don't have a gamecube, which also allows us to say that you really don't know what you're talking about in regaurds of tournament play.

And if you possesed any intelligence, maybe you would know that just because we don't play on a casual level doesn't mean we want to destroy all means of casual play. Becaus we don't acknowledge casual play doesn't mean we have the desire to ruin it for others, but you want to ruin it for us. Why is that?

Competative players don't want to destroy all means of casual play, so why do casual players want to destroy all means of competative play?

Think about it rather than be a whiner.

You. Are. My. Hero.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

I conclude that you're an idiot because you do idiotic things. That post that I quoted was a sterling example of idiocy, if I do say so. Contrary to popular belief, stupid sarcasm isn't funny. It's stupid.

Sarcasm isn't funny(to you), but I was intending to be funny, rather I was serious.

I don't have a gamecube because the one I did have was stolen.

That still doesn't make up for the minimal amount of knowledge you posses. Have you even been to a tournament? Not likely, which is why I think you are being so "anti-elitist" towards us.

And I never said that tourney players want to destroy all means of casual play. For god's sake, if you read my posts at the end of the thread instead of just generalizing off of my first post, you would know that's not what I think at all.

You still don't get it. Those "changes" you suggested would actually ruin tournament play. Despite how much effort you put into it, changing specific minor elements will ruin tournament play of the game despite what you may think.

Every casual player has made one of these kinds of post. Even though the context of what you're saying may be diffirent, the general message is clear.

You would also know I don't seriously want to destroy competitive play, just widen the scope, per se.

Think about that, rather than being a raving idiot.

You can call me an idiot all you want, get as much of an ego boost as you desire. It wont change the fact that your blatant hypocricy won't be tolerated here.

 

[the grim lizard]

Since tourny matches are only best of 3 items can easily give an advantage to a player 2 games strait, which is possible. Any type of thing that could give a big advantage to one of the players is prevented. Like stages that give characters advantages are either banned or only for counter pick depending on how much of a counter it can be. I mean, any healing item, Hammer, Star, Home-Run Bat, Mushrooms, metalbox's, Freezes, bombs, Mines, Party Balls, Exploading creats, pokeballs, and the star rod can easily change the outcome of a game.

Reasons

Hammer - Can easily kill an opponent, also if your not too careful yourself you can be thrown off.

Healing Items - you can basicly recover a whole stock with a healing item if your are at high %

Star - causes invinsiblity, makes so its impossible for the opponent to attack back, can randomly appear anywhere.

HomeRun Bat - 1 hit Ko's, Spiking opponents while they are recovering

Mushrooms - can kill opponent or you at low %

MetalBox - like a semi star

Freeze's - sort of like the kirby cide but without you sacrificing yourself.

Bombs, Mines - Exlosives, edgegaurding and easily kill at low %

Party Balls - can contian any of kind of item and can expload

Exlpoading Creats - can easily kill a player if not opened correctly, can be used for edge gaurding.

Pokeballs - Random, can get a goldeen or get a legendary pokemon and kill your opponent even though you were about to die.

Star Rod - used as projectile, can be used for spiking.


Just because both players have the same chance at getting these items dosn't mean it will always turn out like that. Its like flipping a coin 3 times. You could get heads 3 times, you could get Tails 3 times. You could get heads 2 times and Tails 1 time. Its random. Just because there are chances dosn't mean that the results will end up as the chances predicted.

I agree with you with everything except the Prox. Mine. This can be used as strategy, and both players have an equal chance of running into it. I think you should add to the list super scope, and especially the ray gun. Both of those shooting items are far worse than the star rod. Pokemon are mostly bad because of the legendary ones.

But, with projectile items like those...you have to consider that most characters have projectiles, and the players know you have the item, and they are avoidable. Thus, these really aren't fair because they are avoidable. Also, you sacrifice all of your A-moves for holding onto an item like that. I can see some discussion about that. But you are right, the vast majority of the items in Melee would be pointless to keep on.

 

[Viewtiful_Jeff]

Sarcasm isn't funny(to you), but I was intending to be funny, rather I was serious.

Apologies. Dylan's post was stupid sarcasm. Yours was just flat out wrong.

That still doesn't make up for the minimal amount of knowledge you posses. Have you even been to a tournament? Not likely, which is why I think you are being so "anti-elitist" towards us.

Admittedly not, but I think in my short time here I've learned enough.

And I'm being anti-elitist because I dislike elitists. No other reason.

You still don't get it. Those "changes" you suggested would actually ruin tournament play. Despite how much effort you put into it, changing specific minor elements will ruin tournament play of the game despite what you may think.

So uh, adding a second tournament would ruin tournament play? Explain that one, please.

You can call me an idiot all you want, get as much of an ego boost as you desire. It wont change the fact that your blatant hypocricy won't be tolerated here.

I'm not really getting an 'ego boost' or whatever out of this. And you can't really say what will or won't be tolerated here, 'cause I don't see any fancy lettering on your name.

 

[Adi]

Yeah, all the items that would even be considered for tournament play would just essentially amount to a free throwing item for whichever character happens to run across it.

The proximity mine is incredibly imbalanced in edgeguarding. Let's say you knock someone off the edge and a mine spawns next to you. If you slap it down on the edge the opponent has to edgetech or he is screwed, even if he sweet spots it.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

Apologies. Dylan's post was stupid sarcasm. Yours was just flat out wrong.

I really don't care.

Admittedly not, but I think in my short time here I've learned enough.

And I'm being anti-elitist because I dislike elitists. No other reason.

If you dislike elitism then why do you bother posting here?

So uh, adding a second tournament would ruin tournament play? Explain that one, please.

I never was talking about the item tournament in general, but they way you want to see tournaments in general. You say that you want to "widen the scope", but you want to do it from your perspective, which is the complete opposite of the tournament perspective. As Dylan said, why not just get good in tournaments based on the way we play now rather than doing it from a new perspective? Is it too difficult? Well, that's the point, not everyone can professional.

About item tournaments, that really wont allow you gauge skill. Th only thing that will determin the winner is the random variable. Even if the items really aren't that powerful, throwing an itm at a recovering character=easy win.

I'm not really getting an 'ego boost' or whatever out of this. And you can't really say what will or won't be tolerated here, 'cause I don't see any fancy lettering on your name.

I'm talking about us as a community won't tolerate it. Better yet, we won't acknowledge your attempts to make smash "better" in your opinion.

Oh, and if you don't think you sound like a hypocrite, just read the name of your topic.

How Super Smash Bros Brawl SHOULD be.

 

[psicicle]

Are you implying that more Smash is a bad thing?

Hah no way

but then tourneys would take too long I guess, since they already have a timer and stuff I would think that they operate under some time restraints or something

But then again, I don't actually have tourney experience... yet.

Anyway my personal reason for not using items is that they just annoy me. To me, they clutter up the battlefield and add unneccesary frames of hitstun and a lot of the time make parts of the battle field unaccessible. They are also too easy to pick up and a lot of the time they disable arial attacks because you are forced to throw them instead. Overall, they break up my combos and keep saving my opponent because he happens to get knocked just above a bob-omb or somthing that I have to avoid.

But my favorite item is the homerun bat because it gives your character the humiliation capabilities of captain falcon and you can just throw it at people and it kills them at like 30%.

My other favorite item is the... well actually I don't really like any of the other items.

"And I'm being anti-elitist because I dislike elitists. No other reason."

Elitism against elitists?

 

[Viewtiful_Jeff]

If you dislike elitism then why do you bother posting here?

Not everyone on this board is as big an *** as you.

I never was talking about the item tournament in general, but they way you want to see tournaments in general. You say that you want to "widen the scope", but you want to do it from your perspective, which is the complete opposite of the tournament perspective. As Dylan said, why not just get good in tournaments based on the way we play now rather than doing it from a new perspective? Is it too difficult? Well, that's the point, not everyone can professional.

I don't want to get good at tournaments as they are because they sound like a borefest rather than fun. And just to clarify, by "widen the scope", I mean adding other gametypes to the tournament, not changing them as they are.

About item tournaments, that really wont allow you gauge skill. Th only thing that will determin the winner is the random variable. Even if the items really aren't that powerful, throwing an itm at a recovering character=easy win.

I disagree, but why do you care, since you obviously wouldn't play at a tournament with items.

I'm talking about us as a community won't tolerate it. Better yet, we won't acknowledge your attempts to make smash "better" in your opinion.

You can't speak for the whole community, as you're only one person. And a bunch of people were saying 'You win, Jeff.' at the start of the thread anyway.

Oh, and if you don't think you sound like a hypocrite, just read the name of your topic.

The title of the thread (and most of what I posted in the first couple pages) was just to get a rise out of the board, which I thought was 100% people like you. Since then, I've realized it's not, and have carried on actual conversations and polite debates with several people.

 

[the grim lizard]

Just a word of advice, Jeff: You should probably try something before you judge whether you like it or not. In other words, go to at least one tournament before you decide that they are boring and elitist.

 

[Salaad]

A bunch of people were saying you win Jeff? I saw one. And the first post was....."I hate this thread" Personally I think he was being sarcastic. That's just me. I for one, am confused. People keep changing their views. >.<

 

[Viewtiful_Jeff]

Just a word of advice, Jeff: You should probably try something before you judge whether you like it or not. In other words, go to at least one tournament before you decide that they are boring and elitist.

I think the knowledge I've gained on the internet and in this board is enough, but I do intend to go to one to see if it's the same as my ideas of what it is....somewhere...eventually. Just gotta find one.

A bunch of people were saying you win Jeff? I saw one. And the first post was....."I hate this thread" Personally I think he was being sarcastic. That's just me. I for one, am confused. People keep changing their views. >.<

I count about five or six people expressing agreement or enjoyment from the first post in the first page. Look more closely.

 

[Tank McCannon]

Melee is awesome. Brawl is gonna be awesome too. You people argue too much. Ganondorf has meaty thighs.

 

[Viewtiful_Jeff]

Melee is awesome. Brawl is gonna be awesome too. You people argue too much. Ganondorf has meaty thighs.

You fool! It's all muscle!