Honor among Smashers

[dguy6789]

Leprechaun Drunk, in your boxing endeavors do you let the opponent hit you each time you land a hit? Do you suddenly stop if you are about to win so that you can give your opponent a chance? Do you go easy on someone when money is on the line? This is all similar to what you think smashers should do.

Boxing is what you take seriously, smash is what people here take seriously. Try and notice that they are exactly the same thing in this regard. Some people box for fun, some people box for money, some people do it for both. The same happens with smash, please try and see that.

 

[LP4Life666]

Leprechaun Drunk, in your boxing endeavors do you let the opponent hit you each time you land a hit? Do you suddenly stop if you are about to win so that you can give your opponent a chance? Do you go easy on someone when money is on the line? This is all similar to what you think smashers should do.

Boxing is what you take seriously, smash is what people here take seriously. Try and notice that they are exactly the same thing in this regard. Some people box for fun, some people box for money, some people do it for both. The same happens with smash, please try and see that.

Hey, I already said something like that in my reply... except in way too many words. I agree, though. It's not up for him to decide what people take seriously or not.

By the way, my grandparents live in Merritt Island. Hows the weather?

 

[dguy6789]

It's probably going to storm soon, been really hot lately.

 

[TKD+ITA+Mar=]

Earlier today I was playing against a Marth and he locked me against the hill on Pokemon Stadium 2 Earth terrain with his d-tilt and promptly KO'd me with an up-smash when my percentage was high enough.

Lol, sorry man, didn't know it would offend you. For some reason Marth's dtilt lock is quite satisfying.

 

[Hyper_Ridley]

If it doesn't violate the rules of the game (basically the programming and tournament rules) it's not dishonorable.


I think that unplugging your opponent's controller will help you win, but it's certainly dishonorable.

This.

Really, if a programmed feature in the game was truly "cheap" (I.E. Akuma in Street Fighter 2) it would be banned, but chaingrabs and edgeguarding definatley do not fall under this category.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

You want to talk about true "honor?" If you're the one with honor, you should feel insulted if your opponent doesn't edgehog you, or doesn't punish you for something you brought upon yourself, like going against a wall in the first place. Would you be happy if you just did an Up-B and were free falling to an opponent directly below you, but he decided not to up smash you because he felt it wasn't the right thing to do?

The most "honorable" thing for two players to do is to play their hardest against each other without holding anything back. Anything else, at least to me, is looking down on the loser. Which isn't honor in the least.

Great point SP, honor means going all out, not letting people get away with things just because its "honorable." Smash players should do what they can to win, not what's right, but if that is what you think smash is about, Union of Darkness, than good for you I gues...

 

[Zombieoficer]

If I'm way ahead of my opponent, instead of edgehogging, I just spam projectiles until they reach the edge, (If they reach the edge) to rack up damage.

But if I feel that my victory is on the line, I edgehog.

Like what SamuraiPanda said. If you see that your opponent isn't giving their fullest, that's not honorable.

And infinites, stricly my opinion only, are kinda cheap. If abused, to an extent; but they are also a learning experience. If you are matched up with someone like Marth or DDD, you have to learn to keep an adequate spacing.

Edit: and also, some characters would be broken if you didn't edgehog. Like Olimar. Edgehogging is the only way to actually beat them.

 

[jakeadactyl]

i always play without pants to show my opponent that i am comfortable around them. if they win, i even display my genitalia as a sign of respect, that i am humbled after my loss.

i think that this should be a more universal sign of respect, but no one else seems to >.<

 

[Saltix]

Personally, as a Falco mainer, I see many opportunities to Laser Lock. I don't follow up on them however.
I'm not really a Laser Locking fan, but I'm all for Chain spikes

Bottom line, In smash bros, you play to win. Edgehogging is a basic tactic, and to be honest this goes by "don't get hit." Edgehogging/Edgeguarding should be expected after you get knocked off the ledge. Don't allow yourself to take so much damage and get knocked off and get edgeguarded, because it's nobody's fault but your own.

 

[TKD+ITA+Mar=]

Oh, and Leprechaun Drunk in Boxing (or in my case TKD sparring), isn't more than 90% of our options limited?

 

[jakeadactyl]

whenever i box, i use three gloves. one for my right hand, one for my left hand, and one for my genitalia. because you also need to show respect in boxing by exposing your genitalia, at least thats the way i was raised...

 

[Dojo]

This isn't the middle ages. This is a video game. That has one point among the competitive smashers.

To win.
Dish it all out. Use every tactic you can. Cheap or uncheap, do whatever it takes to beat your opponent and move forward. It's what he's trying to do.

The only honor in this game, along with certain situations in life, is to know you gave it everything you had and never held anything back.

 

[jakeadactyl]

The only honor in this game, along with certain situations in life, is to know you gave it everything you had and never held anything back.

yeah, its true! the only way that you can really show what your made of is by, well, showing what you're made of.

please, if we can make a big fuss it may become tournament standard, we MUST remove our genitals from our pants and expose them during any match as a sign of respect and courage. it should really come as common courtesy but no one at tournaments takes me seriously when i do this

 

[Union of Darkness]

Very insightful opinions, everyone. As I thought, friendlies and competitive play are very separate scenes. I need to think about this before joining any kind of tournament. Breaking my naive habits is the only way I could win it seems.

When it comes down to it there is no mercy on the battlefield.

Thanks for the input and continue your thoughts.

Lol, sorry man, didn't know it would offend you. For some reason Marth's dtilt lock is quite satisfying.

Haha, it's no problem really. I'm over it. Let's play again sometime.

 

[jakeadactyl]

Very insightful opinions, everyone. As I thought, friendlies and competitive play are very separate scenes. I need to think about this before joining any kind of tournament. Breaking my naive habits is the only way I could win it seems.

When it comes down to it there is no mercy on the battlefield.

Thanks for the input and continue your thoughts.

yeah, make sure that if you attend a tournament, you do it with genitals exposed!

 

[SmashAura4]

In the case of honor, I'll probably go as far as my opponet to win. There are a couple of tactics that may leave a bad taste in my mouth, but a game is a game.

There is one thing I find dishonorable, and that's stealing someone's kill in multi-brawls.
*cough cough Ike cough*

 

[Ban3]

This thread needs moar essays.

On Topic: The only thing I find "dishonorable" is killing someone during their taunt. Other than that, play to win I guess.

quoted for the truth
thats the only thing that bothers me, like when i pull off a awesome combo, recover, and taunt, the opponent just kills me with a fsmash, evening up the game

 

[PCHU]

I don't see how killing during someone else's taunt is dishonorable.
They LEFT THEMSELVES OPEN, and it's their fault if their timing on that taunt sucks.

 

[Starwarrior27]

I agree that there should be some honor in the matches. I personally don't like to win because of a cheap tactic. I do think that edgehogging is fair though, and I use Olimar! I think that it just presents a challange for me to get around. As for chaingrabs against a wall, well I don't do that and wish that other people wouldn't do that either.

 

[Avsfreak18]

the only thing i see as unhonorable is running away (during a timed match)

i hate it when people run from me with 20 seconds left and im behind by one KO.... but edgehogging is perfectly fair imo

 

[deeds1]

I believe in honer when playing smash. Of course every now and then I'll push my friend out of his chair before he owns me, but other than that I'm somewhat honorable.

 

[munsif]

i agree with the not trapping against wall bit but not the edgehogging thing

 

[munsif]

yeh kuz itz onli fare wen u r teh 1 wif teh P4N7Z down or 47 13457 7H47Z wut m0m sed

wicked im begginning to understand you

 

[magiscoder]

I know exactly what you're talking about. I'm a Falco mainer, and I'm almost perfect with my chaingrabs to spikes, so I very often grab someone at 0% and promptly KO that person without giving him a chance. I cringe when I do it (and come to the verge of tears when it happens to me), but you gotta do what you gotta do.

 

[TheDuplexDuo]

Honour! Even in defeat I still earn a victory!

I have wanted to use Olimar for a long time so I did. But without the standard tatics that make me cringe, that dreaded Pikmin spam. It feels too cheap. Hiding all game beyond his range. So I took it upon myself to learn the ways of the N0limar. But after many games this felt foolish.

Now through my enlightenment I emerge as the UNO-limar! The Duplex duo! Me and a lone Pikmin! And I can tell you it feels sooooo goooooood!​

 

[Corigames]

Feels good man... I mean...

You know, you can take that amazing talent of the unolimar and multiply it by... IDK, about 8. Then you will be better and do well.

 

[Angrylobster]

Honour! Even in defeat I still earn a victory!

I have wanted to use Olimar for a long time so I did. But without the standard tatics that make me cringe, that dreaded Pikmin spam. It feels too cheap. Hiding all game beyond his range. So I took it upon myself to learn the ways of the N0limar. But after many games this felt foolish.

Now through my enlightenment I emerge as the UNO-limar! The Duplex duo! Me and a lone Pikmin! And I can tell you it feels sooooo goooooood!​

If you are serious about this, you are an idiot. Please tell me i've been trolled

 

[TheDuplexDuo]

If you are serious about this, you are an idiot. Please tell me i've been trolled

Yes, your a troll.​

 

[jyuuberu]

Honor exists where applicable. Me and my friends will try to get off infinites in friendlies just as a joke. We will then complain and moan when somebody breaks it up. The few of us that go to tournaments occasionally don't really hold back there.

At a local tournament a couple weeks ago my friend was playing ddd against a snake and the predetermined stage landed them on bridge of eldin. The friend admitted that he wouldn't chaingrab off the stage and seemed to be doing pretty well until he tripped into a charged forward smash and lost the match. He left angrily most of us acknowledging that he could have won. The stage has since been banned at the tournament in question.

 

[Anth0ny]

Honour? lol.

There is no honour in competitive gaming. You do what you gotta do to win, no matter what it is (within the rules of course).

 

[Overload]

for the most part I do whatever it takes to win in tourneys, but I won't resort to camping because that is no fun and I don't feel like I have accomplished much.

 

[Eaode]

Lol @ honor

 

[adumbrodeus]

Honour? lol.

There is no honour in competitive gaming. You do what you gotta do to win, no matter what it is (within the rules of course).

That is honor. Not using out of game factors and adhering to tournament rules is honor.

Along with good out of game conduct of course.

 

[dawgbowl]

I guess I have honor, or at least a little bit. I disagree with anything that remains unescapable on a stationary stage.

You got caught against one of the variations of Pkmn stadium, eventually the stage would change and let you out. I could be ok with that, because i'd know to avoid that spot in the future.

If it were used on corneria (I don't know if it works, but obviously DDD grab works) then I'd say, don't go down there... stay up on the top part.

I guess what I'll try my hardest to not let myself get in those situations, it sort of gives you an advantage because they WANT to get you in their little games but if you position yourself correctly on each stage you should be fine.

Also pick your counterpicks carefully, I'm a huge fan of norfair for more reasons then one.

I suppose I have honor that I would never do something you described, but I play lucas and if I get people into my dtilt lock I will play it out as long as i can before batting you off the stage... at this point your at a high enough percent it'll almost always kill so I feel like i've earned it.

I don't know, my best advice is just don't fall for their games and pick counterpicks carefully (if chaingrabs scare you go for small platforms (norfair))

I just sort of ranted and never answered much...soooo

Chain grabs against walls/Lucas-Ness Grab lockdowns I don't agree with and would never perform because they ruin the fight.

But anything that is potentially escapable or you'll get out of within time I don't have a problem with.

To the comment "fighting games don't have honor" you've apparently only played this fighting game.

 

[MrPhox]

Honor is a dead notion, now replaced with greed and bigotry. Nobody cares how they win, they care That they win. Assuming otherwise is simply naive. It's hardly satisfiying

Personally, I've tried to be as honorable as I can, but really, nowadays it's a dead concept. In fighting games it's not applicable. You play to win

dead notion? honor?
hah

like you have any idea what kind of honor men used to have for eachother. As far as i'm concerned we're all selfish animals.


to OP:
the principle of competition is to set a goal, and strive for it. This means learning and growing and developing your understanding of the competition according to your goal. Actions that increase your chance of success are a part of the learning experience. Playing smash is a journey of developement. A good-minded honest competitor who competes for the sake of competition and not just pride or honor. Competition is a philosophy and a way of life. Self betterment without judgement.

I dislike when a game allows certain tactics to undermine the intended principles. Like infinite wall combos. But you must understand that is apart of the "metagame" the ongoing developement. Because it exists, it's going to change people's perception and playstyle in relation to walls. It is a whole experience of learning in itself. It shifts the focus of the game ever so slightly.

But not many levels that are played in tournaments have walls. I'm sure you could get counterpicked into a level with them, but you still have the first match at a neutral stage and a counterpicked level if the guy screws you against the wall.


and as for edgehogging, it adds more to the game than trying to land deadly blows for every finish. The fact that you say edgehogging is not honorable means to me that you probably have a hard time recovering, and can't perform edgehogs that well yourself. You probably also have a hard time pushing people off the level by chasing them off of the ledge.

the fact that you never do it because it's dishonorable means you get no practice in it. You don't get any better at it either. So you can't really judge the tactic that well because you probably don't know it as well as the better players. You probably can't understand the depth and excitement it adds to the game.

You're probably just a sore loser and not some honorable fighter.


no offense

 

[Platformations]

Trashing.

Trash talking.

I fight a lot of scrubs/people under my level. To my face it's all "wow ur good".

Behind my back it's like "plat is amazin".

The most honorable thing I can do is not trash talk. And I don't. This was an extremely hard habit to break and I think it's a far too widespread habit.

My beef with the smash community is no one is very nice. A little friendlyness can go a long way.

I'm not saying I'm amazing or anything; I am easily beat. But when you beat someone easy try to be nice. People seem to forget that this game is a game.

 

[TheDuplexDuo]

Trash talking.

The most honorable thing I can do is not trash talk. And I don't. This was an extremely hard habit to break and I think it's a far too widespread habit.

My beef with the smash community is no one is very nice. A little friendlyness can go a long way.

I'm not saying I'm amazing or anything; I am easily beat. But when you beat someone easy try to be nice. People seem to forget that this game is a game.

Thats it! You've hit the nail on the head, with a FALCON PUANCH. You can't even escape it online in even the most casual of games before "OMG U SUCK" and "OWND!" after repeatly taunted in battles. Why do people have these?!​

 

[Union of Darkness]

Trash talking.

I fight a lot of scrubs/people under my level. To my face it's all "wow ur good".

Behind my back it's like "plat is amazin".

The most honorable thing I can do is not trash talk. And I don't. This was an extremely hard habit to break and I think it's a far too widespread habit.

My beef with the smash community is no one is very nice. A little friendlyness can go a long way.

I'm not saying I'm amazing or anything; I am easily beat. But when you beat someone easy try to be nice. People seem to forget that this game is a game.

Second.

Try to have good sportsmanship, people.

 

[Union of Darkness]

and as for edgehogging, it adds more to the game than trying to land deadly blows for every finish. The fact that you say edgehogging is not honorable means to me that you probably have a hard time recovering, and can't perform edgehogs that well yourself. You probably also have a hard time pushing people off the level by chasing them off of the ledge.

You're probably just a sore loser and not some honorable fighter.

no offense

Hurr.

I get the gist of what you mean but making misplaced assumptions is rather ignorant.

 

[DTKPch]

So I was playing smash with some friends, and there are more than 4 people, so the losers each round switch off with the people waiting. I myself am a big 1v1, neutral stage fan, but we ended up playing a 4-way FFA on temple...

So I pick Falcon, and the other 3 people immediately head for the cave, and pummel the crap out of each other. I'm standing at the top entrance, just waiting, dash-dancing, and screaming SHOW ME YOUR MOVES at the top of my lungs. Anyways, my friend says I have no honor since I'm not down in the pit getting my face smashed in.

Honor leads to tricky situations, people. It's based completely on moral sense, but frankly the game doesn't care about that. If you want to win (like hell I was going to give my controller to the guy waiting), you really can't harbor any negative feelings against things like camping, edgeguarding/hogging, spamming, etc.