Grand Old Thread: League of Legends!

[Wrath`]

In before GP skin where he drinks Snapple instead of eating citrus.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

I say it's bad because there are better options that scale into late game. So why pick good stuff when you can have better stuff.

better stuff is only better if you actually HAVE it. executioner's calling is way better than anything else you could put on pirate for the same amount of money.

I don't understand WHY nobody seems to be capable of thinking of anything except ideal late-game build when they talk about items.

executioner's calling costs only slightly more than a sheen and gives you tonnes of lifesteal and some crit. both which make pirate very very scary very very early on.

Add the fact that the item deals 32 damage over 8 seconds and is applied on hit INCLUDING parrlay and can actively reduce healing.... seriously. tell me what YOU are buying with 1300 gold that is going to get you NEARLY as much good.

by your logic nobody would ever be buying doran's items because they build into nothing and there are stronger items late game, and, yet, people will sometimes stack 3 or 4 doran's blades.

 

[-Vocal-]

better stuff is only better if you actually HAVE it. executioner's calling is way better than anything else you could put on pirate for the same amount of money.

I don't understand WHY nobody seems to be capable of thinking of anything except ideal late-game build when they talk about items.

executioner's calling costs only slightly more than a sheen and gives you tonnes of lifesteal and some crit. both which make pirate very very scary very very early on.

Add the fact that the item deals 32 damage over 8 seconds and is applied on hit INCLUDING parrlay and can actively reduce healing.... seriously. tell me what YOU are buying with 1300 gold that is going to get you NEARLY as much good.

by your logic nobody would ever be buying doran's items because they build into nothing and there are stronger items late game, and, yet, people will sometimes stack 3 or 4 doran's blades.

It's pretty much the same problem with Haunting Guise. It's a decent mid-game item, but if the game goes longer than that then you've wasted money you could have better spent elsewhere.

 

[S l o X]

i died inside*. i'm just gonna keep reading mogwai's posts and learn everything.

 

[DMG]

Doran items are different. They are EXTREMELY gold efficient for their cost. They are meant to be an item you consider stacking early on because of what they do for you Early game and how super efficient they are early on. Heck, 3 doran blades vs Executioner, and I bet Doran blades come out on top.

The problem is that you have the question of where in the world are you gonna be building it? If you are jungling, it's out of the question. You NEED Wriggles. After that, your best bet is to get damage. If you're laning, you're competing with rushing warmog, getting sheen and finishing IE, rushing Trinity Force, etc. GP isn't a character that gets a mid tier item here and there along the way of rushing stuff. He's not a WW where you can get madred visage then Sunfire full razer etc. He's a "Oh you got big damage item by x min mark, damn you're scary"

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

It's pretty much the same problem with Haunting Guise. It's a decent mid-game item, but if the game goes longer than that then you've wasted money you could have better spent elsewhere.

and, yet, people do it all the time.

vlad often grabs haunting guise for about the same price

warwick will often grab a wit's end despite the fact that it's also a mid-tier item.

phys carries will often grab 3 doran's blades and that ends up costing more money, actually.

Spirit visage is only a little more expensive and it goes on plenty of people

all sorts of junglers will grab a wriggle's lantern.


it's not wasted money unless you end up needing to sell the item AND you didn't get any advantage from buying the item. People REALLY tend to overestimate how often that actually hapens in a normal game. Seriously, it's not wasted money, it's solid stats, and the fact that the stats and the passive synergize with pirate mean that it's not putting yourself behind, it's actually giving yourself a cheap and easy boost. especially considering how easily pirate makes money, this really gives pirate the ability to have a huge advantage over his lane oponents in stats from a very early point.

Doran items are different. They are EXTREMELY gold efficient for their cost. They are meant to be an item you consider stacking early on because of what they do for you Early game and how super efficient they are early on. Heck, 3 doran blades vs Executioner, and I bet Doran blades come out on top.

The problem is that you have the question of where in the world are you gonna be building it?

it should be laneplank's first item. considering he can crit the BASE damage from parrlay, he's one of the few phys characters who do well getting crit right off the bat AND, seriously, 18% is a lot of lifesteal. AND the DoT gives you the maximum usefulness the earlier you get it.

Gangplank can get an exe call, realistically, before his lane oponent can finish any real item (besides challice, emblem of valour, mana manipulator or anything like that) and so if he rushes executioner's calling he gets a huge boost early. he's already scary early and the item synergizes with pirate 100%. this item is ALL ABOUT making his early game in lane super scary and it really really does it.

just try it and THEN you can feel free to bash it all you want. it works super well.

 

[Mogwai]

false. it's an EARLY game item. it's got really good stats for the price AND it has a DoT as an on hit effect.

it doesn't build into anything for late game, but, seriously, pirate's early game is ridiculous anyway. Giving him an item that puts him a head and shoulders above his lane foes early is just scary.

Don't just say "executioner's calling is bad" with no support for your statement other than common perception. Seriously, try it and see how good it is on pirate as his first item.

Crit is a late game stat. So is lifesteal. EC's DoT is tiny ticks over a long period of time, which is bad synergy with his high damage ticks over a short period of time from his passive (passive rewards attacking a lot over a short period, EC rewards tagging them with DoT and running -> repeat). So I guess I'm just trying to say that you're just wrong, sorry .

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Crit is a late game stat. So is lifesteal. EC's DoT is tiny ticks over a long period of time, which is bad synergy with his high damage ticks over a short period of time from his passive (passive rewards attacking a lot over a short period, EC rewards tagging them with DoT and running -> repeat). So I guess I'm just trying to say that you're just wrong, sorry .

pretty sure if I wanted I could find higher Elo pirates who agree with me. it's just good. really realy good.

crit on pirate is an all the time stat. you crit with a parrlay early and you can scare you foe away from the creep line for entire minutes during the laning phase.... that means something. poke with parrlay and even if they run away imediately you get a free 30 or so damage from exe call. you're already hard to harass and 18% lifesteal is gigantic. it makes you just that much harder to stop.

 

[UTDZac]

But if you get Exec Calling over Wriggles, then how you do drake?

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

But if you get Exec Calling over Wriggles, then how you do drake?

executioner's calling is for laneplank.

wriggle's lantern is for jungleplank.


been looking. so far I've found elementz being quoted as saying that rushing Exe Call as your first item on laneplank is almost brokenly good. Going to see if I can find more users who can back that up.


obviously you're paying some money for the active on exe call so if the other team has NO HEALS WHATSOEVER you probably don't want to pick it up.... but how often will that happen in a balanced team? Even if they don't have a healer it let's you outlane Vlad pretty easily, for example, or even, I suppose, lanewick.

 

[Mogwai]

pretty sure if I wanted I could find higher Elo pirates who agree with me. it's just good. really realy good.

crit on pirate is an all the time stat. you crit with a parrlay early and you can scare you foe away from the creep line for entire minutes during the laning phase.... that means something. poke with parrlay and even if they run away imediately you get a free 30 or so damage from exe call. you're already hard to harass and 18% lifesteal is gigantic. it makes you just that much harder to stop.

I find it odd that in trying to argue my points that I made specifically to not bring the fact that I'm top 100 on Solo Queue into the discussion, you decided to talk about players better than me. Ok, go for it chief, prove your point by posting some high elo names where we'll see consistent ECs in GP games in their match history. Especially since you just *****ed someone out for not providing an argument. I gave you an argument and rather than choosing to refute it with a counter argument, you give us a hypothetical appeal to authority...

Crit still scales best with more AD and more AS. I'm not saying it's bad early, but it's unquestionably more of a late game stat. Same with lifesteal. Your whole argument is based around "EC is an early game item" and I'm contesting that it's actually providing stats that are more geared towards late game. EC is a situational counter to laning vs. Nid/WW/Mundo/Vlad, and in those cases, it makes perfect sense. But without getting use out of the active, I don't see how you're gonna do better with an early EC than an early piece of trinity.

 

[ruin`]

^^ who's your daddy?

WHOOOO! Sonic get wrecked!

purple lettering and low tier mains not strong enough to climb outa this 1

 

[UTDZac]

For those who have an Andriod phone, I just found these apps that are really cool:

LoL Encyclopedia

Jungle Timer

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

I Crit still scales best with more AD and more AS. I'm not saying it's bad early, but it's unquestionably more of a late game stat. Same with lifesteal. Your whole argument is based around "EC is an early game item" and I'm contesting that it's actually providing stats that are more geared towards late game. EC is a situational counter to laning vs. Nid/WW/Mundo/Vlad, and in those cases, it makes perfect sense. But without getting use out of the active, I don't see how you're gonna do better with an early EC than an early piece of trinity.

crit does, of course, scale better the more AD you have but, unlike most (any?) other characters in the game, pirate has a skill that allows him to crit its base damage. it still, obviously, translates better as a late game stat but the point is that gangplank joins the ranks of the very few characters in LoL who can pretty much pick crit up out of the gate and make good use out of it.

Lifesteal is much the same, but lifesteal also gives you lane sustainability and 18% lifesteal including 18% lifesteal applying to a nuke of yours (that is a really solid and really good nuke.) is a LOT of lifesteal

Pirate's passive MAY have the bonus of being scary once you get all 5 stacks in, but that doesn't change the fact that pirates often use parrlay to poke their foes. their foes NORMALLY are aware that that means "Back the **** away before he hits me again" and, really, the ticks from exe call can provide substantial bonus damage in that situation.

The healing debuff just puts this item over the top as far as when you're laning against heals or self-regenning characters.

As far as doing better with exe call than an early piece of trinity, well, calling it an "early game item" may have been a misuse of words on my end, but the point I TRIED to make is still true: by being a cheap item that does not build into anything, it is really REALLY cost efficient as far as stats go, and no early piece of trinity force is going to be as good for pirate.
The AP on sheen means almost nothing to pirate, and he shouldn't REALLY need the mana either. The slow on phage is nice . . . if it procs, though the slow is LESS if it's parrrlay that procs it, and stat wise it's not as efficient anyway. And zeal . . . well, attack speed is more of a late-game stat than lifesteal, really, so it's not quite as good either.

not that any of the parts of tri-force are bad . . . they are actually quite good to get, but, really, especially when you can use that active on somebody, it just is really REALLY cost efficient and pirate can use the stats on exe call better than most can. obviously this isn't an item you'd get on jungleplank, but in a lane, it is certainly really really strong. the ONLY real downside is that it's not going to build into anything later, but until the point that you need to sell it, it's quite solid.



And besides that, I thought the original point of this was that I said you should buy Exe Call as your first item instead of trying to build tanky right out of the gate. Why do you argue going tanky early is superior to exe.call → boots → the rest of your build?


I'm not saying that you don't have more insight into the game than me, I'm just saying that my opinion isn't JUST my opinion. It works and it works well and I wish you'd give it more consideration than just brushing it asside because you can't see how it would be helpful to get those stats early.

purple lettering and low tier mains not strong enough to climb outa this 1

your mom likes my purple lettering. and she likes it every night.

Spoiler

I use purple lettering on the lovely dinner invitations that I send her

 

[Angbad]

Ranked solo is pretty easy so far.

Just got to 1500 playing SOna/SOraka

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Ranked solo is pretty easy so far.

Just got to 1500 playing SOna/SOraka

soraka = easymode climb through solo queue serioiusly. Anyone who wants to jump-start their climb through solo should use her. she gets you through the low Elo games really fast.

 

[Mogwai]

from a pure stat efficiency standpoint, EC gives you:
18% Lifesteal (675 value)
15% Crit (750 value)
that's 1425
it costs 1350

compare to phage:
225 HP (593 value)
18 AD (738 value)
that's 1331
it costs 1315

Both give very marginal extra stat efficiency, EC giving slightly better efficiency. Then compare 4 damage/second over 8 seconds + healing debuff vs. 25% chance of 2.5 second, 30% slow. If they have a heal, debuff makes EC better IMO, otherwise it's in Phage's favor IMO since a single slow proc ****s an opponent who cannot stand and fight you (note: this is every other character in the game right now). Then factor in the fact that Phage builds towards Triforce... I dunno, I'm just not seeing it.

And in terms of your 1 parley and done scenario, sheen's going to destroy EC in terms of average damage output. 80% base AD every time vs. 32 magic damage and a 15% chance of crit will consistently outperform it if you're just dancing around shooting people and running.

 

[UTDZac]

... if you're just dancing around shooting people and running.

This is why I play pirate :D

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

words

nothing you said was untrue; however, I think you may be undervaluing the 18% lifesteal. That's pretty sizable as far as lane sustainability's concerned.
(not undervaluing in gold cost... just in your analysis)

And, I DO agree that sheen is superior for a poking pirate and phage is supeirior for a diving pirate (unless you're unlucky) but it's the fact that exe call gives you good use in BOTH situations rather than good in one and subpar in the other.

But again, this originally arose from you saying to build pirate tanky out of the gate . . . I'm still not seeing that as being better.

 

[BunBun]

Mogwai, where do you find these Corgi gifs?

 

[Mogwai]

I just grab philo and then go for atmog's and grab a phage/sheen along the way if I feel like I have to, but usually I don't because I don't think I need more damage to beat most people up and feel better about my ability to farm safely in lane if I go for tanky items out the gate.

I was just talking to you about why I don't even think EC is a good offensive item to grab early (despite the fact that I don't tend to grab offensive items early in lane).

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

it could be that pirate is just so OP right now that ANY item would work.... but he DOES have good enough stat synergy to really make Exe Call actually effective offensively (and, to a point, defensively). And the fact that the item synergizes well certainly helps.

in any case, if the other end of your lane has ANY source of self healing or ally healing, there is no reason NOT to grab exe call right away.


also

to whoever asked, there are several GIFs here:
http://senorgif.memebase.com/tag/corgi/
and here:
http://www.gifsoup.com/tag-search-gifs/corgi

 

[S l o X]

This is amazing. (ffffff it's huge though and spoiler tags don't work . . . sorry mods x_x)

Spoiler

Thanks Ignatius (of Loyola)

 

[UTDZac]

Are those type of dogs expesnive? I want one :S

... to watch me play LoL /obligatoryleagueoflegends

 

[Wrath`]

I beat 3 different LanePlanks as Karthus. But my ELO is no where near others, I am still lv 23. I must say his Ulti is annoying now, before I didn't care, now its all "holy crap get out".


edit: that panth is godlike....... Kind of looks like Optimus Prime.

 

[BunBun]

Are those type of dogs expesnive? I want one :S

... to watch me play LoL /obligatoryleagueoflegends

They're midrange.

They are also great pets.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

This is amazing.

nothing says manly pantheon like MLP:FiM though, really

 

[safehaven]

It's all a numbers game. It's the decision of "Do I deal more damage with crit burst damage every couple seconds or auto attacking with mini-bursts added in?" Maybe Critplank can work sometimes, but it seems to me that Tankplank can make a more useful contribution to team fights by living longer, dealing damage, and added a little cc in addition.

its not a numbers game.
its a "hey im gonna do a subpar build so an hour later i can 1v5 their team."

I feel like you're theorycrafting here, have you played pirate since the buffs? His passive damage output is pretty much as strong as other similar AD carries that have 2-3 Doran's blades.

The extra 1400 gold after Warmogs takes about 2-3 minutes of farm in a game where most players are at the same time just getting their items that they are willing to seriously start moving towards map objectives team fighting with.

The DPS Output plus the Extra survivability for the most part is the best choice just because it increases your viability in a fight allowing you more chances to E for your team and more chances to apply your redonk passive in team fights.

I mean I know it's arguing on the internet and conceding a point where you may be wrong is way harder then just going down with the SS Egotistical but just think about it.

i played pirate for like 20 games before and about 10 since.
so its not theorycraft. i also try tons of builds with different champions. its just what i do to get better at them, so that was a bad guess

ok guess what: gp is so imbalanced u can do anything and win with him late game. anything u want. but what is best for him isnt necessarily what works

3000 gold for warmogs. 2200-2600 (i think) for atmas.
WHATTTTT if u build that every game, u are devoting all your resources to two items when other champions will be 2/3 through their build, AND will win teamfights

warmogs gp is just like tank garen
he hurts a little bit and doest die easily. wow hes really annoying but just destroy his whole team, and then kill him, cause he has hp but no armor or mr.
or u could build garen tanky dps (build gp without warmogs and atmas) and actually be more effective.

its not about egotism. its not like suddenly i am considering that gp can build atmogs.
its like why would u bother most of the time.

that last paragraph was pretty cute im sure you were really looking for an opportunity to use it. im sorry but i dont think this was the right one though, cause why should i concede to a bad argument? i mean u can make me feel egotistical or whatever for not changing my mind, but does that make u egotistical for not conceding your point?
tl;dr the condescending remarks arent winning u clever points brah

yea dude, I hate it when my teammates are unkillable damage dealers, you're right, I take it all back.

i hate it when the ad carry decides to build atmogs so we cant kill win a single fight til 40 minutes

how about every tanky dps champ in the game (every melee actually) build force of atmogs, bloodthirster, ga, and trinity force? WHAT COULD BE BETTER

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

how about every tanky dps champ in the game (every melee actually) build force of atmogs, bloodthirster, ga, and trinity force? WHAT COULD BE BETTER

I play atmogs sivir and just spam push towers . . . the game isn't a 5v5 deathmatch afterall.

even if the other team finds me . . . what are they going to do? they may kill me but I'm taking a tower with me because it'll take them a while to burn through my warmogs, veil and atma's resistances.

 

[safehaven]

meanwhile while your team get chain ***** 4v5

just a thought: why do people not do this in tournaments? ok

u can spend 10000 gold getting defensive items while they all get their amazing damage items. their carries will kill people and u will not kill people. they will win fights, get towers and snowball. your team will rage at u like they should

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

meanwhile while your team get chain ***** 4v5

just a thought: why do people not do this in tournaments? ok

not saying I always do it... but if your team can hold their own in a 4 v 5 for long enough it works fine.

And, fyi, there was a time back in beta where sivir was considered OP for her ability to push lanes so well.

I'm not saying it's the best strategy all the time, or even most of the time, but it's totally functional and it works partly because atmogs sivir doesn't die fast.




for what it's worth, I agree that your main carry shouldn't be an atmogs carry (unless you're pirate because you can do whatever you want) but if you have a secondary phys, it's not a bad option at all.

 

[safehaven]

it doesnt work though

if your team can hold a 4v5, then sell your warmogs, by 5 dorans blades and win the game

if your team can hold a 4v5 while you push a tower, then you can win any way u want

w/e u think atmogs pirate is good? so do i. do i build it every game? *** NO

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

if your team can hold a 4v5, then sell your warmogs, by 5 dorans blades and win the game

if your team can hold a 4v5 while you push a tower, then you can win any way u want

I didn't say they would WIN the 4 v 5 but if they can SURVIVE it, then you can push. and if you are tanky DPS, you can even afford to face tank the tower somewhat and/or shrug off the other team's attempt to stop you if they decide to send someone to aid the tower.

It's not the way you should always build, but it's not a BAD way to build when the situation allows it.

 

[JTB]

climbin dat elo

feels good man

 

[UTDZac]

[yt]oFk_BpAIsZc[/yt]

 

[Abel1994]

ot enough money so here

Pantheon or Mord?

Who should be next? Any pros and cons on them

 

[Turazrok]

Neither. Get pirate or taric instead.

 

[Abel1994]

>.< You gave me no reason but just a no

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

ot enough money so here

Pantheon or Mord?

Who should be next? Any pros and cons on them

they are both completely different characters. Morde is tanky magical DPS with a potentially game-changing ultimate. And pantheon is a physical caster carry.

really it all comes down to which one you like more. which one fits your style better and which one you have runes for I think.

I'm pretty sure morde is considered better than panth, but I could be wrong.... and from what I've heard, they've got a pantheon rework coming down the pipeline. they are going to make his ultimate non-golbal but buff his early game to compensate . . . such is what I have heard.

Neither. Get pirate or taric instead.

I think I'll disagree with buying pirate just because he's so good. Nothing good comes from buying a character accidentally overbuffed because, unless you get a lot of games in FAST or you have a tonne of extra points, they are going to be nerfed next patch anyway.

 

[Abel1994]

they are both completely different characters. Morde is tanky magical DPS with a potentially game-changing ultimate. And pantheon is a physical caster carry.

really it all comes down to which one you like more. which one fits your style better and which one you have runes for I think.

I'm pretty sure morde is considered better than panth, but I could be wrong.... and from what I've heard, they've got a pantheon rework coming down the pipeline. they are going to make his ultimate non-golbal but buff his early game to compensate . . . such is what I have heard.





I think I'll disagree with buying pirate just because he's so good. Nothing good comes from buying a character accidentally overbuffed because, unless you get a lot of games in FAST or you have a tonne of extra points, they are going to be nerfed next patch anyway.

hmm kinDA HARD LOOKING AT YOUTUBE VIDEOS AND STILL 50/50