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Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

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Tree Gelbman

100 Percent Done
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Sounds like Square Enix has pulled a successful bamboozle, as they do apparently.
This is honestly my thought on the Square situation. I'm to believe that an overprotective company let it be all but settled that Dragon Quest is coming to Smash and that Atlus of all companies was able to bamboozle everyone but they weren't?

I believe that Square has deliberately crafted a ''Dragon Quest ya'll!" narrative from having so much of it on the list, to now this.
 

Lime3037

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If anything, this may put an end to the people unironically requesting Goku for Smash.

Dragon Quest seems like pretty good leak bait. Not popular enough to be considered highly requested, but has been around long enough to make people think, "Oh yeah, that makes sense." Not wanting to sound "delusional", as I'm sure some GameFAQs visitor will call me as they read this, but I think it's plausible.
 

The Anigriffin

Smash Lord
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Messages
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If anything, this may put an end to the people unironically requesting Goku for Smash.

Dragon Quest seems like pretty good leak bait. Not popular enough to be considered highly requested, but has been around long enough to make people think, "Oh yeah, that makes sense." Not wanting to sound "delusional", as I'm sure some GameFAQs visitor will call me as they read this, but I think it's plausible.
Delusional on Gamefaqs simply means that you're not towing the line and caving to popular theory the way they want you to.

You'd think the vast majority are in Elementary school with their mob mentality btfo culture.
 
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Ovaltine

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If anything, this may put an end to the people unironically requesting Goku for Smash.

Dragon Quest seems like pretty good leak bait. Not popular enough to be considered highly requested, but has been around long enough to make people think, "Oh yeah, that makes sense." Not wanting to sound "delusional", as I'm sure some GameFAQs visitor will call me as they read this, but I think it's plausible.
Thinking it's plausible doesn't mean you're delusional and certain that, "Oh, Erdrick is DEFINITELY leakbait!" GameFAQs people will latch onto anything to fuel their anti-Geno agenda, honestly.

It could go either way. I'm sticking with the safer, "Erdrick is in," option myself, but the idea of him being leakbait is something that still should be considered, especially if you want Erdrick in. Keep your expectations tempered no matter what. Be realistic, be careful.
 

EricTheGamerman

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Let’s stop with the whole Dragonball FighterZ debacle meaning anything to Dragon Quest. I mean we technically don’t know who is responsible... but when you’re considering Toriyama who has had no no issues whatsoever, or the corporate ****ery of Toei who have a track record of doing copyright claims and just being **** all around.

Yeah, no, that’s an extreme leap at best. Don’t use this situation to mean anything for or against Geno, it’s an unrelated issue.
 

alemerltoucanet

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While I know this is unrelated, I just wanna wish y'all a merry Christmas Eve! I hope your day is going great, and that you're excited for Christmas tomorrow! :)

And if you don't celebrate, I hope your having an amazing day either way because you deserve it!
 

Fatmanonice

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On the topic of the Geno spirit, the significance isn't just the spirit but how it was treated along with other factors. It's one of the best spirits in the game (10k base power plus three support slots, it's also the only legendary that has a rounded number that isn't an upgrade) and you don't have to upgrade it. It also has balanced stats with almost equal attack and defense. It's only primary Square Enix spirit in the game too. It's also a legendary and definitely sticks out when compared to the other legendaries which are typically things like major bosses and gods/goddesses in their respective games. Overall, it was largely treated the best of any spirit that wasn't an alternative version of a playable character, boss, or assist trophy.

It's also interesting how it was treated compared to other fan favorites. A vast majority are simply ace spirits like Bomberman, Rayman, Shovel Knight, Shantae, and Bandana Waddle Dee. It really sticks out when you review the whole spirit list:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KbCiXTa72qI&t=225s

It all ties back to the "consolation prize" idea. Just about all the fan favorites were playable, assist trophies, or Mii costumes, basically something much more tangible than a spirit. Geno's honestly the exception. The Mii costume could still happen but for the time being it just really sticks out.
 
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The Anigriffin

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On the topic of the Geno spirit, the significance isn't just the spirit but how it was treated along with other factors. It's one of the best spirits in the game (10k base power plus three support slots, it's also the only legendary that has a rounded number that isn't an upgrade) and you don't have to upgrade it. It also has balanced stats with almost equal attack and defense. It's only primary Square Enix spirit in the game too. It's also a legendary and definitely sticks out when compared to the other legendaries which are typically things like major bosses and gods/goddesses in their respective games. Overall, it was largely treated the best of any spirit that wasn't an alternative version of a playable character, boss, or assist trophy.

It's also interesting how it was treated compared to other fan favorites. A vast majority are simply ace spirits like Bomberman, Rayman, Shovel Knight, Shantae, and Bandana Waddle Dee. It really sticks out when you review the whole spirit list:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KbCiXTa72qI&t=225s

It all ties back to the "consolation prize" idea. Just about all the fan favorites were playable, assist trophies, or Mii costumes, basically something much more tangible than a spirit. Geno's honestly the exception. The Mii costume could still happen but for the time being it just really sticks out.
Not just God’s, but other important characters as well. Hinawa and Ness’s Dad are legendaries which to me signifies their importance in their respective games despite not being the main character.

And Ninten is also the only Mother 1 legendary as well so that’s a wee bit interesting.
 

Loliko YnT

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Happy Christmas Eve everybody.

I Hope Santa Claus hear our request for Geno , he might do a detour to Star Road and talk to Geno about it.

By Santa Claus , I mean , NoJ , and by Star Road , I mean Square Enix.
 

Ovaltine

Smash Master
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Messages
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On the topic of the Geno spirit, the significance isn't just the spirit but how it was treated along with other factors. It's one of the best spirits in the game (10k base power plus three support slots, it's also the only legendary that has a rounded number that isn't an upgrade) and you don't have to upgrade it. It also has balanced stats with almost equal attack and defense. It's only primary Square Enix spirit in the game too. It's also a legendary and definitely sticks out when compared to the other legendaries which are typically things like major bosses and gods/goddesses in their respective games. Overall, it was largely treated the best of any spirit that wasn't an alternative version of a playable character, boss, or assist trophy.

It's also interesting how it was treated compared to other fan favorites. A vast majority are simply ace spirits like Bomberman, Rayman, Shovel Knight, Shantae, and Bandana Waddle Dee. It really sticks out when you review the whole spirit list:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KbCiXTa72qI&t=225s

It all ties back to the "consolation prize" idea. Just about all the fan favorites were playable, assist trophies, or Mii costumes, basically something much more tangible than a spirit. Geno's honestly the exception. The Mii costume could still happen but for the time being it just really sticks out.
Exactly. This could be a good or a bad thing. It could indicate that they do still have Geno on the mind, and this could be either a definitive consolation prize or a just in case consolation prize, in the case that Sakurai can't negotiate with NoJ and SE to get Geno playable. The Mii costume coming back would tie in to all of this and pretty much be our word.

I'm not saying Geno being made playable is impossible if we get the Mii costume back, given that they could just use it for a quick buck as a ported costume (unlike the fresh-made consolation ones like Isaac's and Lip's), but it definitely would make his chances plummet. If we couldn't get him, though, I'd be happy if we got the costume back. Without that and without Geno playable, the Spirit, in all of its attention, still feels like a downgrade.
 

Dr. Jojo Phantasma

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I definitely do believe that most spirit battles are flat out disconfirmations and consolation prizes for season 1, but a potential season 2 and beyond, it would all be fair game which I am sure Geno can board that train at least.
 
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Dynamic Worlok

Shunted into the bad timeline
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Without that and without Geno playable, the Spirit, in all of its attention, still feels like a downgrade.
Going from mii fighter costume to situationally usable PNG file is not only a downgrade, it's kind of an insult.
To me it reads as "the mii fighter costume was too good for you"
 
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Jovahexeon Joranvexeon

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The smash fanbase buys everything. There aren't any characters who would make more money than other characters
Eh....there's trouble with that logic. If that were the case then Nintendo wouldn't have to care WHO they put in. There wouldn't even in a be point in arguing for the likes of Geno or any other specific characters if it were that easy.

And as someone who didn't buy all the dlc characters from Smash 4, I disagree with that mentality as well. :U
 
D

Deleted member

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Eh....there's trouble with that logic. If that were the case then Nintendo wouldn't have to care WHO they put in. There wouldn't even in a be point in arguing for the likes of Geno or any other specific characters if it were that easy.

And as someone who didn't buy all the dlc characters from Smash 4, I disagree with that mentality as well. :U
We aren't using the "who would make more money" argument for any characters.

Again, the majority of people didn't like the inclusion of Corrin, but they still bought him.

I didn't like his inclusion as well, but I bought him. I wasn't very interested in Bayonetta and Mewtwo, but they were on my roster.

Why didn't you buy all the DLC characters in Smash 4? Was it lack of interest? What was the reason?
 

Datboigeno

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On the topic of the Geno spirit, the significance isn't just the spirit but how it was treated along with other factors. It's one of the best spirits in the game (10k base power plus three support slots, it's also the only legendary that has a rounded number that isn't an upgrade) and you don't have to upgrade it. It also has balanced stats with almost equal attack and defense. It's only primary Square Enix spirit in the game too. It's also a legendary and definitely sticks out when compared to the other legendaries which are typically things like major bosses and gods/goddesses in their respective games. Overall, it was largely treated the best of any spirit that wasn't an alternative version of a playable character, boss, or assist trophy.

It's also interesting how it was treated compared to other fan favorites. A vast majority are simply ace spirits like Bomberman, Rayman, Shovel Knight, Shantae, and Bandana Waddle Dee. It really sticks out when you review the whole spirit list:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KbCiXTa72qI&t=225s

It all ties back to the "consolation prize" idea. Just about all the fan favorites were playable, assist trophies, or Mii costumes, basically something much more tangible than a spirit. Geno's honestly the exception. The Mii costume could still happen but for the time being it just really sticks out.
I feel like if any character were to make the jump from spirit to playable it would be Geno. His spirit is given so much unspoken importance within the game in terms of stats and placement near Galeem. Just on a meta level it wouldn’t be too farfetched from a story perspective to have a Star spirit be the character that broke out of their imprisonment as a spirit to become playable.
 

Dynamic Worlok

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I feel like if any character were to make the jump from spirit to playable it would be Geno. His spirit is given so much unspoken importance within the game in terms of stats and placement near Galeem. Just on a meta level it wouldn’t be too farfetched from a story perspective to have a Star spirit be the character that broke out of their imprisonment as a spirit to become playable.
Heck, with him already being a spirit who posesses things, he could just possess his original body and bing bang boom, it makes sense.
 

beans

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We aren't using the "who would make more money" argument for any characters.

Again, the majority of people didn't like the inclusion of Corrin, but they still bought him.

I didn't like his inclusion as well, but I bought him. I wasn't very interested in Bayonetta and Mewtwo, but they were on my roster.

Why didn't you buy all the DLC characters in Smash 4? Was it lack of interest? What was the reason?
Corrin to me sound like his job was showing up.
Like one of those fliers, to remind/teach everyone that Fates is a thing, so that people buy the game.
 

Dynamic Worlok

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Corrin to me sound like his job was showing up.
Like one of those fliers, to remind/teach everyone that Fates is a thing, so that people buy the game.
I think I was actually less inclined to buy fates because of Corrin, and I really liked awakening.
 

Jovahexeon Joranvexeon

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We aren't using the "who would make more money" argument for any characters.
I mean, you're trying to argue that Geno would be logical because he'd be a guaranteed success on that front. Like I said, if every character were a guranteed success, Nintendo wouldn't have a reason TO CARE about which characters get in.
Again, the majority of people didn't like the inclusion of Corrin, but they still bought him.
Debatable. Got a source for that?
Why didn't you buy all the DLC characters in Smash 4? Was it lack of interest? What was the reason?
I mean, there doesn't have to be a reason. The character I didn't get was Lucas. Didn't have a tight connection with him, and I felt I'd gotten my fill of him in Brawl.
 

KirbyWorshipper2465

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I would also say that, due to Kamiya making a poll about DLC characters, the ones that he listed are also deconfirmed via NDA reasoning, too. (Those would be Wonder Red, Amaterasu, Dante, and... one other one? The name escapes me.) It makes me wonder if he's trying to work something out with Sakurai outside of Fighter's Pass, though...
Saddens me a bit that Viewtiful Joe gets forgotten these days, but I won't hold it against you.

That said, this would be an interesting possibility.

Although whether they can reliably balance Dante or not is a different kettle of fish.
 
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D

Deleted member

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I mean, you're trying to argue that Geno would be logical because he'd be a guaranteed success on that front. Like I said, if every character were a guranteed success, Nintendo wouldn't have a reason TO CARE about which characters get in.

Debatable. Got a source for that?

I mean, there doesn't have to be a reason. The character I didn't get was Lucas. Didn't have a tight connection with him, and I felt I'd gotten my fill of him in Brawl.
What I am arguing is that Geno is an interesting, unique character. Think about this: he is a puppet possessed by a star, who has a gun for a hand, who can fire beams, blasts, whirls, and flashes. He is unique. He is different. He is likely to appeal to children. Swordsman don't have that appeal.

Go on YouTube and see people who reacted to Corrin. They weren't pleased with the reveal. Later, when they played Sm4sh, they had Corrin on their roster.

Did you have a connection to Corrin or any of the other DLC?
 

GoodGrief741

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Wasn’t Corrin the worst-selling Sm4sh DLC though? So the ‘people buy anything’ argument does have its flaws.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
Merry Christmas Geno fans. I've been a bit harsh towards Geno in the past, so since it's Christmas I thought I'd do something nice to make up to the wooden warrior: Enjoy the major Geno section in my Christmas comic:

View attachment 184242
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View attachment 184247
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If you want to see the thing in it's entirity, please drop by the Captain Toad thread or click here:
Rest of the Christmas Comic can be found here! Merry ChriSmash!
I love that. And Merry Christmas to you!
 

Xigger

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Geno's spirit is too good, so he isn't DLC
Objectively, it only acknowledges his popularity. Whether you see it for or against him is an opinion.

Geno is a Spirit, can't be playable
False for 1 reason, provided 2 reasons anyways:

1. Mewtwo has a trophy in Smash 4, then was released as DLC after. (Lucas too)
2. Mewtwo as DLC started before game release. Yet his trophy was not removed.


 
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EricTheGamerman

Smash Master
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Messages
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Spirits shouldn’t deconfirm characters, but we still don’t know for certain. Again, no way of saying that they absolutely do or don’t for now.
 

Jovahexeon Joranvexeon

Smash Champion
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Messages
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Did you have a connection to Corrin or any of the other DLC?
Corrin, I bought because his gameplay interested me.

Doesn't mean that Smash fans did or would buy stuff in mass just because.
He is likely to appeal to children. Swordsman don't have that appeal.
That's a bit overtly subjective to suggest kids (who aren't even the sole target demographic when we've got games like Persona 5 entering the ring anyway) wouldn't have similar appeal.

I could just easily say that Geno wouldn't appeal to kids who don't like the puppets or gunners. It goes both ways.
Go on YouTube and see people who reacted to Corrin. They weren't pleased with the reveal. Later, when they played Sm4sh, they had Corrin on their roster.
Yeah. So? Doesn't speak for all or the majority of players concrete.
I am arguing is that Geno is an interesting, unique character. Think about this: he is a puppet possessed by a star, who has a gun for a hand, who can fire beams, blasts, whirls, and flashes. He is unique. He is different. He is likely to appeal to children. Swordsman don't have that appeal.
This is why I brought up the problem with your logic. If supposedly, the Smash fanbase will buy anything DLC-wise like you suggest, then however much Geno appeals compared to others wouldn't mean a lick cause then that would mean that Nintendo could pick just any characters for DLC as they so please, thus reducing any reason for them to bother going after Geno with the challenge and frustration of brokering such a deal with Square Enix.
 

Sovereign Trinity

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The way Square is so hard on leaks and known for spreading leakbait makes me wonder if Erdrick is actually just leakbait, spread thicker due to the fact that leaks got out that they didn't like.
Not that you've mentioned it, they really are throwing his name around more. Square is strict with leaks and like to throw their employees off with fake info, along with throwing their community off, so what if Erdrick really is leakbait?
Then... Then that means...

 

EricTheGamerman

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Hey, people who are claiming Corrin sold the worst, is there a source or a way to know that? Cause I’ve never actually seen or even heard that officially, I’ve only ever seen it used by fans for other arguments...
 

Sovereign Trinity

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Hey, people who are claiming Corrin sold the worst, is there a source or a way to know that? Cause I’ve never actually seen or even heard that officially, I’ve only ever seen it used by fans for other arguments...
Let's get to that down here.
Wasn’t Corrin the worst-selling Sm4sh DLC though? So the ‘people buy anything’ argument does have its flaws.
Most definitely. Here's my assumption on which DLC characters were bought most:
1. Mewtwo
2. Ryu
3. Bayonetta
4. Cloud
5. Lucas
6. Roy
7. Corrin

I only bought TWO of the seven DLC characters in Smash 4, since I don't like buying something in a game that I already bought, so I'll try not to be biased when sorting these out or anything, but let's think about it: Corrin was there for promotion, he wasn't fan service, not many wanted him and showed lots of hate towards him; people still don't even like Corrin. Fire Emblem is very despised in the Smash community, and lots have expressed their hate for constantly including new FE characters that are just swordsmen. Also, there are two FE characters as DLC, I'm sure most only bought Roy and weren't up for buying another FE character. Lucas and Roy are semi-clones, we already have Ness and Marth in for free so not many don't see the point in spending money for someone similar we already have. Cloud was one of the DLC characters I bought and was very hype, but many saw him as another "anime swordsman", so I'm not sure how many liked him, but he was definitely loved by a lot of people since he came from one of the best RPG games from the '90s. Bayonetta was hyped up as the final newcomer, and I've ran into THOUSANDS of Bayonetta players online, so she was definitely in the top 3, and possibly even on par with Ryu. Ryu is from Street Fighter, a classic from the '80s and one of the very first games to feature a fighting genre, and not many knew this amazing timeline could get any better. Most gamers are in their early 30s, and I'm sure LOTS recognized Ryu from the 1980s and wanted him ASAP.

NOW, as for Mewtwo, he's on a whole other level compared to the six others. Mewtwo was the first DLC character announced and has been wanted back in Smash since Brawl, since he was cut from Brawl. The moment he was announced, EVERYBODY lost their **** and wanted him RIGHT AWAY. The moment Mewtwo came out for DLC, people were constantly getting him ASAP. Mewtwo got another trailer in a Direct which led to even more hype, and his return also led us to a good start with the DLC. Not to mention that he was the first DLC character that came out, so Mewtwo already got a head start with the sales. I'm absolutely sure Mewtwo was the most sold DLC character.
What I am arguing is that Geno is an interesting, unique character. Think about this: he is a puppet possessed by a star, who has a gun for a hand, who can fire beams, blasts, whirls, and flashes. He is unique. He is different. He is likely to appeal to children. Swordsman don't have that appeal.

Go on YouTube and see people who reacted to Corrin. They weren't pleased with the reveal. Later, when they played Sm4sh, they had Corrin on their roster.

Did you have a connection to Corrin or any of the other DLC?
I really connected with Mewtwo and Cloud, they were the only DLC characters I bought. Melee was my first game and I lost my **** as a kid when Mewtwo came with his CHALLENGER APPROACHING screen, and despite him being slow as hell, I still loved Mewtwo and used him all the time in Melee. I never played Final Fantasy VII and never connected with Cloud since I haven't played his game, but I sure loved him because he came from the same office as Geno, came from a great RPG game from the '90s, and is a very unique character. Gosh, I hope to see the day Cloud and Geno are in the same game, because I REALLY want to make a comic of those two meeting in Smash.

You connect more with characters you've played as in their game before, an example of this would be like me playing Mario in one of his games, using Mewtwo in Pokémon, playing as Link in Ocarina of Time, etc. You get me from there, hopefully.
 
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D

Deleted member

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Corrin, I bought because his gameplay interested me.

Doesn't mean that Smash fans did or would buy stuff in mass just because.

That's a bit overtly subjective to suggest kids (who aren't even the sole target demographic when we've got games like Persona 5 entering the ring anyway) wouldn't have similar appeal.

I could just easily say that Geno wouldn't appeal to kids who don't like the puppets or gunners. It goes both ways.

Yeah. So? Doesn't speak for all or the majority of players concrete.

This is why I brought up the problem with your logic. If supposedly, the Smash fanbase will buy anything DLC-wise like you suggest, then however much Geno appeals compared to others wouldn't mean a lick cause then that would mean that Nintendo could pick just any characters for DLC as they so please, thus reducing any reason for them to bother going after Geno with the challenge and frustration of brokering such a deal with Square Enix.
So you are saying that uniqueness doesn't affect who buys the DLC, but you are saying you bought Corrin but not Lucas because Corrin interested you and not Lucas?

You contradicted yourself.

There are very few people who didn't buy Corrin because they hated his inclusion. YouTubers make up a good chunk of the Smash community. The majority didn't like his inclusion but bought him anyway.

It doesn't go both ways. Geno is different, and I described how in my previous post. Characters like Sephiroth and Eddy don't have that appeal to children. Slime and Geno, on the other hand, do. It helps that Geno is from a Mario game, which all Mario games are marketed to everyone - kids, adults, etc.

You also have to note the demand for Geno. This is the reason people will buy him. The Smash community makes up the majority of people who buy Smash, and Geno is an icon in the Smash community.
 

Lime3037

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Merry Christmas Geno fans. I've been a bit harsh towards Geno in the past, so since it's Christmas I thought I'd do something nice to make up to the wooden warrior: Enjoy the major Geno section in my Christmas comic:

View attachment 184242
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View attachment 184245
View attachment 184246
View attachment 184247
View attachment 184248
View attachment 184249

If you want to see the thing in it's entirity, please drop by the Captain Toad thread or click here:
Rest of the Christmas Comic can be found here! Merry ChriSmash!
I don't normally get choked up about things, especially today because I'm at work and it's busy, but this got me to smile. Thank you.
 

HolyKnight

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 29, 2008
Messages
251
Spirits shouldn’t deconfirm characters, but we still don’t know for certain. Again, no way of saying that they absolutely do or don’t for now.
people saying this act like Sakurai has rules or something. Spoilers, he has no rules, no limits, he does what he wants within the realm of possibility. We might see waluigi or issac playable at some point, meaning even AT's don't deconfirm characters. It's incredibly unlikely but, so are a lot of things.

I just hope we get a mostly good list. 3/5 And with what the "leakers" are saying, it sounds like 1/5, and I don't want to believe its that.
Geno is probably the only hope we have of even seeing a second SMRPG game happen, ever. Thats the reason I want this to happen, moreso than anything else.
 
D

Deleted member

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No. You were the one claiming such when you said that the Smash fans would buy any DLC regardless of who it was. Not me.
When I described Geno, I was commenting on his uniqueness and appeal to children because you said that not everyone bought the DLC, but you said the reason you didn't buy Lucas was because you weren't interested in him, but you bought Corrin because you were interested in him?

You claim that uniqueness affects who buys the DLC, but you also say that Geno being unique doesn't mean people will buy him over other characters?

Please give me a clear answer on your opinion of this
 
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