Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Deleted member]

thanks to Gum-Gum Smash I am subscribed to the "music menu theory" and we'll have three new series.

So one is Joker, and the other two I think will be Tales and Banjo-Kazooie

For the other 2 icons, Geno has to be one of them

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

So one is Joker, and the other two I think will be Tales and Banjo-Kazooie

For the other 2 icons, Geno has to be one of them

Tentatively I'm still gonna stick with Porky; but I could totally see them go **** it, and make everyone a third party. In that case, Crash or sans or somthing.

 

[Krooli]

Your source is incredible. The only thing that hasn't been confirmed or deconfirmed yet is them saying Geno being DLC. I swear, if your source said Rathalos would be a boss before being revealed, Shadow and Isaac would be assist trophies before being revealed, that there would be updated spirits, and said it was true that nobody knew the DLC... and it was true, then that's amazing! Things are looking good for Geno, everyone. Speaking of our puppet, I saw the Geno spirit in the shop today! BUT, I didn't have enough to get Geno's spirit! Ugh, hopefully he doesn't go away.

Even anyway, I LOVE THE SMASH ULTIMATE! I've unlocked over 30 characters in 6 hours, and I've been playing the game for countless hours now.


Indeed it is, sir. We're in for some good treats. Dragon Quest only appeals in Japan, but if this is supposed to appeal globally, I don't see a DQ character.
For a Square rep, I'm expecting: Geno, Sephiroth, or 2B. But from the looks of popularity and appealing, I'm going with Geno being the most likely. Even if Reggie said that all the DLC will be unexpected, many aren't expecting Geno because Sakurai didn't choose the DLC this time; so in this case, Geno DOES go along with Reggie's statement. Nintendo isn't aware of Geno's popularity, Sakurai is. Geno does go along with Reggie's statement. Still, even before Geno was a frontrunner, people didn't expect him due to his relevancy and ownership with Square, but because Geno just seems like an unlikely deal with Nintendo and Square, I can see it.

Here's my guess: Three reps will be third-party, two will be first-party.

1. Joker
2. Bandana Dee or Magalor
3. Geno
4. A Zelda character or Metroid character
5. Banjo and Kazooie

Honestly I feel as if you could remove Bandana dee/Magalor from the list and add Porky instead cause Bandana dee is anything but unexpected tbh sure he super popular globally but if you think about it pretty much everybody put Bandana dee on their Roster predictions before Ultimate came out for Magalor I just don’t see it happening sure he’d be fine but he’s not all that requested from what I’ve seen.

And Porky is the opposite of BDee, the only reason people belive porky could be in the game is cause his spirit is “Missing” but he’s also fairly popular based off of what I saw throughout the Speculation cycle quite a few want Porky definitely not as much as people want Geno or Banjo but he’s been frequently requested though written off.

 

[Necro Toad]

Well, now that the game is out. I’ll say that it’s damn good and I’ve loved the entirely too much of it I’ve played. I finished unlocking characters about a hour ago and that was fun, if a bit too long (66 unlocks with regards to characters IS a lot). There’s a lot to see and do in game, though it does feel barren in some areas of content without all the modes.

World of Light and Spirits have kept me entertained well beyond what I thought. But I’m only about four hours in and I wonder how much longer it’ll stay that way.

That said, the character select screen alone just is amazing. Regardless of speculation, enjoy the game friends. There’s a lot to love and it’s the definitive Smash as far as the most important content goes with stages and characters. I do wish we had more new stages though...


Last night was very interesting and I’m strangely hype. I love Persona 4 Golden on my Vita, but I haven’t gotten around to Persona 5 yet. I may not as a portable Persona 5 could very well be on the way with this happening. But I never seriously supported Persona in Smash. That said, the music alone will be amazing, and it just makes sense to me now that it’s real. My biggest surprise was the announcement as Smash. I’ll eat crow on that one, I absolutely did not expect a Smash announcement at the VGAs and we did indeed get one.

I don’t take it as a super good sign for Geno though. I mean I don’t take it as much of a sign at all, but Persona 5 is a very recent choice that only has some support overall. He’s not character that I think helps Geno at all. But hey, he does prove that insiders are full of **** and nobody knows anything about DLC!

Looks awesome, I didn't played the game yet! Are the characters the only thing that you have to unlock or there are other things too, like Mii Costumes, Musics, Stages, etc? I really like to unlock contents in games, especially in Smash. Smash 4 and Brawl had so much things: trophies, musics, characters, stages, mii costumes, stickers, custom parts, etc... But people are saying that in this game we just have the spirits and characters to unlock, and that SSBU almost has no new musics... I'm asking you instead of Google it to avoid spoilers, but is it true? I hope not, I hope not, I hope not...

'Eyyy. I normally don't sign up to forums or interact much with the Smash community, but I wanted to pop in here solely because of my unending support for this character. The fact that the fanbase for Geno is so dedicated and hopeful throughout the years has left me absolutely overjoyed. I love Super Mario RPG and all of its successors (except for some certain Paper Mario games we don't talk about, coughs), and every character in SMRPG left an impact on me. This especially includes Geno, a character so fascinating and open to all sorts of potential that it's just sad to see it all left to rot after Square decided to be... well, Square.

Funnily enough, I used to be one of those people whose belief was strongly rooted in Geno being very overrated. However, as I saw the love the fanbase had for him, I thought of digging a bit deeper into why he's so beloved. It honestly baffled me. Why? I'm not a young person, by any means, and I grew up with the (then brand new) Nintendo 64 as a little girl. Geno wasn't unknown to me. I'm not a 'zoomer', as the young'uns seem to call them these days. (You crazy kids and your newfangled terminology!) I felt like one of the few people my age and in my general group who didn't see that much appeal in the character, and didn't find him that incredible from my time playing SMRPG.

Then I started thinking of how well he'd fit in modern Mario today. The fact that Rosalina exists now, the way space lore in Mario has expanded so much, the Mario & Luigi series still going on relatively strong today, the innovative ideas the series has begun to utilize more (with Odyssey really being a standout to me)... I started really thinking about how impeccable a fit he would be. He's an interesting character that obviously captivated an audience, and I could see him becoming beloved by the younger crowd today, as well. In fact, I've worked with this generation many a time in my day, and I was pleasantly surprised at how many of them knew who Geno was and loved them. I honestly had no idea that Geno had such a large, young following, as well! I really thought it was just the older fans that cared, but now, my eyes are opened to how special this character is to so many people from all walks of life.

Why? His design is a very good start. From a casual observer's eye down to an artist's eye (as I myself am a long-time digital artist and freelancer), he just fits. He's a star spirit possessing a puppet, something that evokes childlike wonderment, and that very puppet is built in with freaking guns. His colors work so well together, his features are both cool and cute, and he stands out from the Mario universe as a whole. Mallow (who I also ADORE) seems more like a snug-to-the-hand fit like a glove, but Geno feels much like a quirky, yet welcome fit. He's different, and goodness knows different is always welcome in the Mario universe, where things can often feel pretty samey.

His lore. His lore has so much potential, especially when you compare it to the modern day. His character, mysterious, yet kind of dorky and lovable. A bonafide badass, to be sure, but one that comes with cute appeal and a benevolent, fun nature. It's just enough to make you want more, more that SMRPG just doesn't get to deliver. Maybe we could have gotten that... if Geno still remained in Nintendo's and Square's unified vision today. (Also, again, the whole fissure between them. Sighs.)

Then, of course, tech-wise, Geno would be an excellent, unique fit for Smash. I think this kind of just goes without saying and has been discussed ad nauseum, though.

I have a lot of love for this character. I really do. I've had a huge change of heart, and I can't help but love this star boy. He's a great character, one that's woefully not used to his fullest potential.

... but I'm afraid he probably won't be DLC.

However, I'm not saying this to be a debbie downer. In fact, if this is the case, we should use this disappointing possibility to make ourselves stronger. This isn't over yet. Seeing a return to form for Geno doesn't have to start with Smash, even if it would be a darn fine way to do so. Our outreach has already gotten us this far with a Mii outfit in Smash 4, a spirit and icon in Ultimate, and acknowledgement from Nintendo themselves in multiple forms otherwise. Why stop there? Why give up if he isn't in this Smash game?

Geno is a character focused on making wishes come true. We can make the impossible, possible. We just have to never give up. Don't get your hopes too high, of course, and be realistic, but don't let up on your passion. Make your voices heard (within reason, don't be a turdwaffle). Geno's been talked about around Nintendo's studios, and whether or not it's for Smash, it's a good sign that something is either in the works for him as we speak or something may be down the line. Square's relationship with Nintendo is getting better. The outcry is known. It's reaching them. We're making things happen, no matter what detractors say.

Let's view this hypothetically: Geno is not one of the DLC characters. We don't know what other surprises Nintendo might pull on us when it comes to Smash, however. The special gift option (which I presume will be used for Piranha Plant upon release, for those who got codes) in the Vault definitely got my brows raising. All signs pointing to DLC now are solely on Fighter's Pass with paid Mii DLC costumes being deconfirmed for the time being by Reggie. (I've lost the link to the interview amidst all the mania regarding Smash, but I know it was sometime after the November 1st direct that we got this one. If someone could dig that up, that would be incredible.) This could always change in the future, however, and we may even get Geno's mii costume back at some point... but what if even those don't grant our wishes?

For one, remember that Ultimate's modding community is likely to be pretty good. The firmware has been consistently hacked and meddled with, and there are already screenshots floating around of people making small texture mods (i.e. bringing Mario's fire alt back). I truly wouldn't be surprised if a team got together and made some good Smash mods, perhaps even the ultimate (heh) Geno mod. Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if some real talent is lurking this thread at any point as we speak. If we want Geno in Smash, at least unofficially to appease to us fans, we can absolutely do that. Nintendo can't stop us from doing that... or, well, they can't to an extent. (C&D's happen, but over a character mod? Highly unlikely (unless they pull an AM2R/Samus Returns, also unlikely). Also, hacking is always a risk, especially in terms of bans if you're not careful with your online usage. There's also bricking risks.) It's not official, and I know how much more symbolic official inclusion would be for Geno, but it's definitely something. It would at least appease our bubble, yeah?

Secondly, again, a revival for Geno need not be for Smash alone. I'd prefer it to be for Smash, and I'm sure we all do, as well, but if we keep vocalizing how much we want a return for this character, maybe Nintendo and Square themselves will do it. It's a bit farfetched, I know, mostly just because Square is Square, but again, we cannot give up in the face of adversity. Speak up. Make your voices known. Even if your hopes for Smash are dashed, don't let up on letting them know that we want a proper return. Nintendo has been delivering on fan requests more and more lately, and they've been changing some of their ways. Yes, they are often rather tone-deaf (cough, cough, Switch Online), but you can tell that they're still listening. At least in terms of Geno, we know for a fact that they hear us. We need to make sure they KEEP hearing us.

Thirdly, I know someone else mentioned it in my long, long time of lurking this thread shyly, but a campaign for Geno, much like K. Rool's, sounds excellent. Let's show Nintendo how much we love this character and everything he symbolizes for not only the Mario RPG series, but also the Mario series as a whole. Let's make it loud and clear, and if we can make it even louder and clearer, why stop? Make it louder! Clearer! Send our wishes out to the stars!

I may be very pessimistic about Geno's inclusion as DLC in Smash, and I've just about given up hope there, but in terms of Geno otherwise... I think there is still a lot of hope to be had.

Don't give up. Don't be unrealistic, but don't give up. I'm telling you this as a long time King K. Rool fan who finally had her dreams realized with Smash Ultimate. It's a long wait and a long struggle, a very hard fight against the impossible, but it is so worth it. Look at it from this very simple angle:

We may lose the battle.
However, we have not lost the war.

(I'm so sorry this is so long I promise I was just trying to inspire thought and positivity even during a dark time please put the home run bat away would you want to hurt a duck banana named after malt beverage I think not—)

I really like your post! I agree with "we are strong as a fanbase even without DLC or Smash" kind of thought.
This has been something that sometimes comes to my mind, "what will happen with all this fanbase if Geno got confirmed or deconfirmed? Will people stop fighting for him? Will people move on and let this cause die?". And the reason why I keep asking myself this is because Smash is an extremely important battle, but there are other possible battles as well that we can fight.
With all the people, strength and acknowledgment that we got over the last decade, I believe that we can make more noise and start fighting not only for Geno as DLC but fight for SMRPG sequel, SMRPG Remake, Mario & Luigi crossover, Paper Mario crossover, Geno for Mario Kart, etc... We have so much opportunities that we are not looking at right now.
We cannot let this fanbase lose it's strength with Geno confirmation or deconfirmation. Maybe we should have other places or forums to keep in touch (that are not exclusive to smash) and start showing Nintendo or Square even more about our love for this IP.
If we show to Nintendo, Square, AlphaDream (M&L), Intelligent Systems (Paper Mario), Ubisoft (Mario + Rabbids) and even Mario Tennis's, Mario Kart's, Mario Party's teams and other ones too, this demand we may get our first Geno milestone easier. With Smash there are so much fanbases that we hurt each other's chances, we're fighting all the relevant video game characters at the same time, but nobody is talking with this other studios!
If AlphaDream managed to get Geno as a cameo, if Sakurai managed to convince Nintendo about geting Sonic in Smash (in a game that did not have third parties until that moment), maybe someone other than Sakurai can bring Geno or SMRPG back.
We really should start fighting Geno/SMRPG's war, and not only this battle, while we're strong.

 

[Deleted member]

Ultimate is so much fun! I am going to hit the hay now, good night everyone

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

Honestly I feel as if you could remove Bandana dee/Magalor from the list and add Porky instead cause Bandana dee is anything but unexpected tbh sure he super popular globally but if you think about it pretty much everybody put Bandana dee on their Roster predictions before Ultimate came out for Magalor I just don’t see it happening sure he’d be fine but he’s not all that requested from what I’ve seen.

And Porky is the opposite of BDee, the only reason people belive porky could be in the game is cause his spirit is “Missing” but he’s also fairly popular based off of what I saw throughout the Speculation cycle quite a few want Porky definitely not as much as people want Geno or Banjo but he’s been frequently requested though written off.

As you wish.

 

[Gum-Gum Smash]

Honestly I feel as if you could remove Bandana dee/Magalor from the list and add Porky instead cause Bandana dee is anything but unexpected tbh sure he super popular globally but if you think about it pretty much everybody put Bandana dee on their Roster predictions before Ultimate came out for Magalor I just don’t see it happening sure he’d be fine but he’s not all that requested from what I’ve seen.

And Porky is the opposite of BDee, the only reason people belive porky could be in the game is cause his spirit is “Missing” but he’s also fairly popular based off of what I saw throughout the Speculation cycle quite a few want Porky definitely not as much as people want Geno or Banjo but he’s been frequently requested though written off.

Porky is popular in the Mother fan base for sure, not to mention a big name villian in Nintendo's history. Whether or not Spirits mean anything, I actually agree and think he's still got a better shot than most, especially with the 30th anniversary coming up (if Nintendo has something planned) so yeah. I've always thought of Porky as a character people wanted, but one that most didn't really think had a chance, so they wrote him off (though this pretty much goes for any character in the Mother/EarthBound franchise)

Even if people never played Mother, they at least know of him from his boss in Brawl

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

Ladies and Gentlemen, the State of the Geno™ address. Last night was amazing on a lot of fronts and I wanted to go over them in detail.

-Sephiroth's No Good Very Bad Day™: Given last night's events, I feel that I'm free to talk about this. Inside insider circles, Sephiroth now has almost as many people saying that he's flat out not going to be in as Sora. This makes sense based on yesterday's events. For starters, Joker is technically a SEGA character, adding pretty conclusive evidence that they are not going to double dip in third party franchises. My theory I made about brand saturation vs brand expansion seems to be spot on. If a franchise was going to double dip with a new unique character in Smash, Sonic was by far the most likely and these chances have gone down significantly, bringing everything else to a bottom level.

Another interesting thing that came out was the credits of Smash Ultimate. What was particularly interesting was the creative and content consultants for third party characters. Most had like 20-30 except Square Enix and Namco. Namco had one for Pac-Man. Makes sense as he's a simple arcade character with a number of references to other simple arcade games. It also helps that they're literally the ones developing the game so it's not like they needed to fly people in to ask any questions if they hit a snag with him.

Then there's Square Enix... It has three for all the Final Fantasy content. It's as bare minimum as you can get: basically the director of FF VII, Cloud's character designer, and one of the lead people for Advent Children. That's it. I'm willing to bet that even characters like Wii Fit have more creative consultants than this. More would definitely need to be on board if Sephiroth was seriously considered along with a second FF VII stage based on even the sizable number for characters like Bayonetta.

-Joker is very clearly not a corporate pick. Persona 5 has yet to be released on a Nintendo platform. Even if it's part of the sprawling Shin Megami Tensei series, this knowledge is esoteric to most people. You'd pretty much only know this if you were a fan of the franchise or cared to look it up. Your typical 12 year old isn't likely to know this series or even your typical Nintendo fan. SMT is fairly niche, especially on Nintendo platforms. This is a deliberate hook and hyper focused leading to my next point...

-A character like Joker is pretty much the exact opposite of a shill. Nintendo's not casting their net out wide with this pick, they are targeting a specific demographic. Maximum profit is not the goal, it's pleasing fans. Again, if this was Nintendo's leading concern, Tails would all be but confirmed to be the next SEGA character. Make no mistake, however, a decent number of people wanted SMT represented in Smash, they just thought it was nearly impossible. But we've seen this before. This was done with Cloud and Bayonetta largely for two reasons...

-Fans wanted the character and so did Sakurai. This is one of the biggest takeaways of last night. Sakurai has mentioned the importance of global appeal and choosing characters that not only people want but bring something new to the table. This is hard proof that Sakurai had a lot more power in choosing characters than originally thought. Again, Joker is a super niche pick but ultimately still wanted. I'd argue that this is a bullet in the head of Dragon Quest and Sephiroth that have virtually no Smash demand. Sakurai is listening to the fans and Nintendo is listening to Sakurai.

-In regards to Dragon Quest: with Sephiroth now being seen as being on as weak legs as Sora, a lot of people in insider circles have jumped onto the Dragon Quest ship, specifically Erdrick, without realizing they've boarded the Titanic and some idiot in the boiler room thinks he's discovered a quick way to remove the clutter of the excess propane tanks laying around. The reason for this is that most of them have flat out come out and said they only believe this because Nintendo wants to promote Dragon Quest Builders 2 and Dragon Quest XI S, two ports with one just being publically announced in September and without a clue when it will come out. That's it. People are banking on Nintendo to go into MAXIMUM OVERSHILL for this... It's extreme cynicism and pessimism rolled into one.

We've gone into depth about this topic but here are the biggest problems.

-The liscensing for the series is comically bad. On a base level, it's liscensed by Square Enix (asset holder), Armor Project (asset owner), Bird Studio (all characters), and Yoichi Sugiyama (all music). For Erdrick, yet another company has ownership by the name of Heart Beat, a liquidated company that still has share holders scattered around.

-The series is overwhelmingly more popular in Japan than anywhere else. It's estimated about 93% of its sales come from Japan. No prescence in Smash will ever change this.

-In its 32 year history, it's never been liscensed out for gaming crossovers. All crossovers like Fortune Street and Mario Sports Mix were developed by Square Enix, meaning that Nintendo was more willing to liscense out the most valuable IP in gaming than Square was their second most profitable IP. Let that sink in. Unless Armor Project and Bird Studio have creative control of the project, they want nothing to do with it.

-Even in Japan, demand for DQ content in Smash is near non existent. It's a complete ghost. In Japanese polls I've seen over the years, Slime is lucky to crack top 50. Yes, that's right... More DQ fans want the equivalent of a Goomba playable than any of the main characters. That's pretty telling.

So, to recap, no global appeal, no demand, and possibly the most complicated liscensing in all of gaming. Keep in mind that Sakurai has noted that Cloud was a huge struggle to get and Square fought him almost every step of the way and was constantly breathing down his neck. That's with just one IP share holder, imagine one character with up to four. I'm pretty sure my balls just shot up into my stomach just thinking about it... It's more hassle and more work for something virtually no one wants. Why bother? Add on top of this that everyone that predicted DQ to win anything or have anything shown off last night was dead wrong and LeakyPanda and Hitagi are unlikely to recover from it. On to the final point...

-People are taking Reggie's words too literally. It reminds me of "up until now" from the Brawl days, that even I fell for. There's definitely room for nuance and, let's be real, Geno would still be a huge surprise for a vast majority of people. Even as this thread has shown, Geno fans themselves are split and tons of people think the spirit/icon was a death sentence. I've watched you guys and your certainty shifts constantly. Even people on the inside are twisting themselves in knots to justify Dragon Quest despite its mountains of complications (which they probably just don't know about, to be honest).

Geno's assessed chances among insiders basically stems from Vergeben's main source's doubts. That's it. I've seen the message. He even explains that he doubts it for personal reasons he didn't want to openly talk about. That's Def-Con 1 suspicious on its own but, again, that's it when it comes to major doubts on the inside. Geno's regularly heard too and multiple people have reported on it. PolarPanda's source says it's literally the only Square Enix character he's heard this whole cycle. It's hardly a shut case and you shouldn't let anyone tell you otherwise. I can confirm everything good and bad for Geno is merely hearsay with the one bad thing coming from one person.

So, in conclusion, last night was an amazing night for Geno and people should feel optimistic. Sakurai's listening. Nintendo's listening. Third parties seem to be listening too. This is definitely DLC being made for fans. Things are very vague behind the scenes because, as evidenced last night, Nintendo is keeping DLC extremely secret. We'll be lucky to get crumbs from this point forward. Square Enix still seems likely by all of accounts and evidence emerging yesterday suggest Namco will either have Tales DLC or nothing at all for DLC with the former being more likely. Still, I want you guys to be patient and hang in there. We've come this far and things are looking up at this standpoint.

Thank you for taking your time into typing this. I know it was a lot, but it was so worth reading. My hopes went very high, and all these points you said make logical sense!

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Looks awesome, I didn't played the game yet! Are the characters the only thing that you have to unlock or there are other things too, like Mii Costumes, Musics, Stages, etc? I really like to unlock contents in games, especially in Smash. Smash 4 and Brawl had so much things: trophies, musics, characters, stages, mii costumes, stickers, custom parts, etc... But people are saying that in this game we just have the spirits and characters to unlock, and that SSBU almost has no new musics... I'm asking you instead of Google it to avoid spoilers, but is it true? I hope not, I hope not, I hope not...
.

There is more to unlock than just characters and Spirits. You earn currency through all the modes and then there is an in-game store. From there you can unlock stuff for World of Light, Mii Costumes, Spirits, and Music. Those same things can also be found World of Light as chests from going different routes.

There seems like a nice bit of stuff to unlock, but Spirits are probably the thing you will unlock the most often. There seems to be a good mix of stuff to unlock though.

All stages are unlocked from the beginning unfortunately though. I wish they would have had a couple of those be unlocks as well, but oh well.

 

[Datboigeno]

So I was on IGN and saw an interesting interview with Reggie about Joker/Smash DLC. I’m just going to post his quotes:

Of the Joker pick:
“It's emblematic of the approach that Mr. Sakurai and the team are taking with the DLC,” Fils-Aime told IGN. “He wants characters that are unique, different, to bring them into the Smash Bros. environment. So it's going to be tremendously exciting.”

In terms of the mindset regarding DLC:
“Mr. Sakurai, he's not only a student of Nintendo franchises, and obviously he's had his hand in a few, but he's a student of video games from a total perspective,” Fils-Aime said. “And so he's been the driver in really thinking about what type of character coming into Super Smash Bros. Ultimate would bring just a whole different level of fun and enjoyment for the player. That's been the approach. That's the thinking”

Of note is his comment regarding characters being unique and different. How many of you remember how Sakurai described Geno?

“Sakurai: Geno was actually a character I wanted to include as a fighter. He has a gun for an arm, and just seems like he'd fit absolutely perfectly into Smash.”

Geno to Sakurai is a character that stands out due to his unique features and potential as a fighter. And conversely do you think Sephiroth or Erdrick would feel that new or different compared to all the other sword fighters in the game when you really get down to it? Also notice nothing was said about all characters coming from franchises not in Nintendo or anything about characters that are already spirits deconfirming. I agree with other people that it seems like we’ll get 3 new franchises and 2 others that have been in the series prior.

 

[FalconFire93]

Ultimate is awesome, here’s hoping Geno gets to join in on the fun.

 

[Krooli]

Goodnight Genobros!

 

[childishgamgeno]

So I was on IGN and saw an interesting interview with Reggie about Joker/Smash DLC. I’m just going to post his quotes:

Of the Joker pick:
“It's emblematic of the approach that Mr. Sakurai and the team are taking with the DLC,” Fils-Aime told IGN. “He wants characters that are unique, different, to bring them into the Smash Bros. environment. So it's going to be tremendously exciting.”

In terms of the mindset regarding DLC:
“Mr. Sakurai, he's not only a student of Nintendo franchises, and obviously he's had his hand in a few, but he's a student of video games from a total perspective,” Fils-Aime said. “And so he's been the driver in really thinking about what type of character coming into Super Smash Bros. Ultimate would bring just a whole different level of fun and enjoyment for the player. That's been the approach. That's the thinking”

Of note is his comment regarding characters being unique and different. How many of you remember how Sakurai described Geno?

“Sakurai: Geno was actually a character I wanted to include as a fighter. He has a gun for an arm, and just seems like he'd fit absolutely perfectly into Smash.”

Geno to Sakurai is a character that stands out due to his unique features and potential as a fighter. And conversely do you think Sephiroth or Erdrick would feel that new or different compared to all the other sword fighters in the game when you really get down to it? Also notice nothing was said about all characters coming from franchises not in Nintendo or anything about characters that are already spirits deconfirming. I agree with other people that it seems like we’ll get 3 new franchises and 2 others that have been in the series prior.

Also can I note, Reggie said: [“....how SAKURAI AND THE TEAM are taking with DLC.”]

[“HE wants characters that are unique.”]

[“Sakurai is a student of Nintendo properties”]


First off, this HEAVILY implies that Sakurai at LEAST had SOME power and sway over who got picked for DLC. Even if NoJ picked the selection, this seems to imply Sakurai still has a final say

 

[Krooli]

Also can I note, Reggie said: [“....how SAKURAI AND THE TEAM are taking with DLC.”]

[“HE wants characters that are unique.”]

[“Sakurai is a student of Nintendo properties”]


First off, this HEAVILY implies that Sakurai at LEAST had SOME power and sway over who got picked for DLC. Even if NoJ picked the selection, this seems to imply Sakurai still has a final say

Wow. At this point Geno is at the very least very likely to make it in. We have so much stuff going in our favor it’s actually kinda exciting

 

[SSGuy]

Game has been super fun! I have been playing WOL mainly. I haven't found Geno or Mallow yet but it will be really cool when I run into them. I was very lucky to find Mega Man early so I have been grinding with him.

 

[Door Key Pig]

thanks to Gum-Gum Smash I am subscribed to the "music menu theory" and we'll have three new series.

What's that? Is that what the "Spoiler" topics for Square and Namco are to do with?

 

[beans]

What's that? Is that what the "Spoiler" topics for Square and Namco are to do with?

Nah.
The Music Menu revolves around the 3 free slots on the music menu.
We can deduce from the menu that there will be a max of 3 new franchises on the Fighter Pack, as to make a perfect square.
We have Persona, so there are 2 slots remaining

 

[Dynamic Worlok]

Looks awesome, I didn't played the game yet! Are the characters the only thing that you have to unlock or there are other things too, like Mii Costumes, Musics, Stages, etc? I really like to unlock contents in games, especially in Smash. Smash 4 and Brawl had so much things: trophies, musics, characters, stages, mii costumes, stickers, custom parts, etc... But people are saying that in this game we just have the spirits and characters to unlock, and that SSBU almost has no new musics... I'm asking you instead of Google it to avoid spoilers, but is it true? I hope not, I hope not, I hope not...


I really like your post! I agree with "we are strong as a fanbase even without DLC or Smash" kind of thought.
This has been something that sometimes comes to my mind, "what will happen with all this fanbase if Geno got confirmed or deconfirmed? Will people stop fighting for him? Will people move on and let this cause die?". And the reason why I keep asking myself this is because Smash is an extremely important battle, but there are other possible battles as well that we can fight.
With all the people, strength and acknowledgment that we got over the last decade, I believe that we can make more noise and start fighting not only for Geno as DLC but fight for SMRPG sequel, SMRPG Remake, Mario & Luigi crossover, Paper Mario crossover, Geno for Mario Kart, etc... We have so much opportunities that we are not looking at right now.
We cannot let this fanbase lose it's strength with Geno confirmation or deconfirmation. Maybe we should have other places or forums to keep in touch (that are not exclusive to smash) and start showing Nintendo or Square even more about our love for this IP.
If we show to Nintendo, Square, AlphaDream (M&L), Intelligent Systems (Paper Mario), Ubisoft (Mario + Rabbids) and even Mario Tennis's, Mario Kart's, Mario Party's teams and other ones too, this demand we may get our first Geno milestone easier. With Smash there are so much fanbases that we hurt each other's chances, we're fighting all the relevant video game characters at the same time, but nobody is talking with this other studios!
If AlphaDream managed to get Geno as a cameo, if Sakurai managed to convince Nintendo about geting Sonic in Smash (in a game that did not have third parties until that moment), maybe someone other than Sakurai can bring Geno or SMRPG back.
We really should start fighting Geno/SMRPG's war, and not only this battle, while we're strong.

Smash is just the battle. Full canonization is the war.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Seeing things going on behind the scenes, can we make a pact to not be terrible people if Geno's not in? Not naming names or fanbases but a good number of them are being really awful by harassing and threatening Nintendo employees over this game. It's kind of depressing. I've mentioned this before in my posts but when I do my big logical deconstructions and analyses, it's genuine. I'm not deliberately trying to mislead you all and when I say I'm optimistic, I mean it.

I still think Geno has a decent chance based on the current evidence. That said, if Geno's not in, don't take it out on anyone. Don't flood Nintendo with angry calls or emails. Don't single out people for harassment. That's all I ask. I say this because you all seem dedicated for the long haul and, worst case scenario, we may be waiting another year. Geno was literally discomfirmed in the Final Smash Direct of Smash 4 so proverbially losing right at the finish line is nothing new to us but please act responsibly. I'm kind of burned out and getting depressed by reading accounts of things happening to other people right now and I really just want this to not be what becomes of the Geno fanbase.

 

[KCCHIEFS27]

Hi gang, i’ve been MIA because i played something like 15 hours of smash in the past 30 hours.

Wanted to reiterate what I’ve seen some people post and that is Joker is nothing but good news for Geno with the type of character he is. The best thing to take away from this all is that insiders don’t know nearly as much as you would think, so just sit back and relax because whoever the Square character is won’t be shown off for maybe 6 months at this point.

Let’s all spend now getting good at the game so we can set an army of elite level Genos loose onto ranked when he is released

 

[The Anigriffin]

I'm... Not sure how the "he's popular" argument works for Porky... Maked Man from the Smash Ballot was easily just as popular or even more popular depending on who you ask. Ninten also got a lot of support back in the day. Saying he's the most likely Mother character based on a missing boss or an unnamed spirit is just simply false... Again, if Itoi wanted Sakurai to put Porky in, he most likely would have done it by now. Him having a Brawl boss before doesn't mean anything when a decent portion of the new playerbase never touched Brawl before. Also Nintendo seems to favor protagonists before antagonists. Look how long it took for just Ridley and K. Rool to join and those are from mainstream franchises. You can prefer Porky to another Mother rep, but saying he's the most likely because villain or he's popular is sorta disingenuous in my opinion.

I just know this post is gonna get me called biased.

As for Geno, after the VGA's, I think his likelihood shot way up due to Joker. Hard to judge just by one character, but Joker sends a message of them pleasing certain fanbases regardless of how niche the mainstream thinks they are which is super neat in my opinion. Honestly if Geno gets in, I see him coming at E3 next year.

 

[PhilosophicAnimal]

Hey all, been crazy busy with Smash and organizing a release party (it's tonight!), grinding out unlocks using the ten minute method so everyone will be available to use at the shindig. Finally got it down to just four: . Should be able to knock those out in time. But seriously, were the unlock fights SUPER difficult for anyone else? Like, level 8 cpu difficult? I got bodied by freaking Toon Link, of all people...

Still, enjoying the heck out of the game so far! K. Rool is as awesome as I expected him to be. Inkling is actually much funner than I expected, but I seem to be not great with her, as I get creamed quite a lot using her--couldn't use her for any unlocks. Had to call in ma boi Shulk to mop up. But I'm definitely invested in learning her.

By comparison, I find the Belmonts kinda boring. It's all pretty much "whip in this direction," lol. They do have some cool moves, though. Ridley doesn't do much for me either, except for pulling off that sweetspotted down special...man, is that satisfying. Not bothering with Incineroar at all.

Also, L link2702 , I'm having the same issue with the gameplay. Something is a little off, at least with certain characters. Maybe it's just being so used to 4, like you said, but I'm definitely feeling it, too. I thought it was just that I was using Joycons (the left one of which is messed up, lol.) Hopefully it will get a little easier going forward.

Overall though, I am loving it. World of light is better than I thought, though I do miss trashing non fighter enemies. The bosses are still there though, which is great.

Anyway, back to it! Oh, and my Geno hopes are rising again! I love the music select screen theory already--it just fits so well. Also, awesome post, Ovaltine ! Welcome to the thread.

Feel free to tell us your favorite pie

 

[The Anigriffin]

Hey all, been crazy busy with Smash and organizing a release party (it's tonight!), grinding out unlocks using the ten minute method so everyone will be available to use at the shindig. Finally got it down to just four: . Should be able to knock those out in time. But seriously, were the unlock fights SUPER difficult for anyone else? Like, level 8 cpu difficult? I got bodied by freaking Toon Link, of all people...

Still, enjoying the heck out of the game so far! K. Rool is as awesome as I expected him to be. Inkling is actually much funner than I expected, but I seem to be not great with her, as I get creamed quite a lot using her--couldn't use her for any unlocks. Had to call in ma boi Shulk to mop up. But I'm definitely invested in learning her.

By comparison, I find the Belmonts kinda boring. It's all pretty much "whip in this direction," lol. They do have some cool moves, though. Ridley doesn't do much for me either, except for pulling off that sweetspotted down special...man, is that satisfying. Not bothering with Incineroar at all.

Also, L link2702 , I'm having the same issue with the gameplay. Something is a little off, at least with certain characters. Maybe it's just being so used to 4, like you said, but I'm definitely feeling it, too. I thought it was just that I was using Joycons (the left one of which is messed up, lol.) Hopefully it will get a little easier going forward.

Overall though, I am loving it. World of light is better than I thought, though I do miss trashing non fighter enemies. The bosses are still there though, which is great.

Anyway, back to it! Oh, and my Geno hopes are rising again! I love the music select screen theory already--it just fits so well. Also, awesome post, Ovaltine ! Welcome to the thread.

Feel free to tell us your favorite pie

So from my understanding, there's two other slots for franchises? Am I hearing this correctly?

 

[PhilosophicAnimal]

So from my understanding, there's two other slots for franchises? Am I hearing this correctly?

It appears that way, yes, once Persona is taken into account.

The screen could just change, but three new series and two existing series reps sounds very fair. I hope it turns out that way.

 

[The Anigriffin]

It appears that way, yes, once Persona is taken into account.

The screen could just change, but three new series and two existing series reps sounds very fair. I hope it turns out that way.

Niiiiice. I'll certainly keep this in mind.

 

[Fatmanonice]

It appears that way, yes, once Persona is taken into account.

The screen could just change, but three new series and two existing series reps sounds very fair. I hope it turns out that way.

I feel like that's realistic, honestly. 4 of 7 of Smash 4's DLC characters were from existing franchises in Smash so I don't expect all 5 to be totally new. Based on what's come out in recent days, I'm more steadfast in believing Square Enix and Namco will be getting new reps but not necessarily from stand alone (AKA new) series. SEGA, Konami, and Capcom all have three reps now so I think they'll let the last two play catch up. I believe this also explains the inconclusive Monster Hunter data found in the game and the narrative going around that a rep was considered very, very early on but ultimately dropped for whatever reason.

 

[Ovaltine]

Seeing things going on behind the scenes, can we make a pact to not be terrible people if Geno's not in? Not naming names or fanbases but a good number of them are being really awful by harassing and threatening Nintendo employees over this game. It's kind of depressing. I've mentioned this before in my posts but when I do my big logical deconstructions and analyses, it's genuine. I'm not deliberately trying to mislead you all and when I say I'm optimistic, I mean it.

I still think Geno has a decent chance based on the current evidence. That said, if Geno's not in, don't take it out on anyone. Don't flood Nintendo with angry calls or emails. Don't single out people for harassment. That's all I ask. I say this because you all seem dedicated for the long haul and, worst case scenario, we may be waiting another year. Geno was literally discomfirmed in the Final Smash Direct of Smash 4 so proverbially losing right at the finish line is nothing new to us but please act responsibly. I'm kind of burned out and getting depressed by reading accounts of things happening to other people right now and I really just want this to not be what becomes of the Geno fanbase.

This. There is good evidence and, despite my pessimism, we can't give up yet. However, we absolutely must take into account the possibility that Geno will not get in this time around, and we need to keep our composure.

Being vocal is something I encourage, but it has to be done with maturity and respect. Again, as a K. Rool fan, I can tell you that strong rapport in the fanbase, persistence, and lots of love is what got K. Rool where he is today. Sure, I've seen some bad apples in the fanbase (doesn't every fanbase have some?), but generally, my experience with the rest of the Kremling Krew has been nothing but pleasant. When we made our outcry, we did it with negativity being absent from the outreach. We did it with positivity by showing our love for this character and what he would bring to the table. We showed not anger and riots, but peace in our pleading... and we won.

Don't start calling Nintendo employees and getting outraged at them. Don't start behaving out of line if Geno doesn't make it. The fanbase already has an unfortunate stigma as is, and we can't perpetuate that. It not only makes us look bad to the rest of the Smash community, but it also makes us look bad to Nintendo and Square. Vocal outreach and passion is highly encouraged, but don't let your emotions spearhead anything over the top. Make your outreach positive. Tell whoever you can in terms of higher powers about your love and appreciation for SMRPG and this character. Share your positive experiences and make your polite arguments. Don't lose yourself to your emotions, or it could be Geno's downfall ——— and even if it isn't, just... just have empathy for the people you're reaching out to. Nintendo employees aren't the ones at fault, yet they're being outright attacked by other people. Be reasonable. Be nice.

ETA: Also, my favorite pie is dutch apple a la mode with key lime being a close second. MMmmm...

 

[owjies]

Wait I’m confused. Are the missing icons for characters, or for icons representing series music? If the latter is the case, I don’t see how this affects Geno’s chances. If SMRPG music makes it in, it’ll probably be under Mario’s icon, similar to how if Bandanna Dee made it in with new music it would be with Kirby.

The same probably goes for if it’s a fighter icon. But Geno’s a special case.

By the way, someone on GameFAQs said this is what Reggie said:
"These are going to be characters that are new to the series, just like Joker from Persona 5. Characters that you would not anticipate to be in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate."

No where does this say all of the characters are only 3rd party, or only from new series. There are going to be characters that are new to THE series, as in Smash. Just in case anyone was worried

I actually think the missing music icons do help Geno's chances, but probably only a little. What's got me intrigued is that if this turns out to be true then there will be two fighters in the fighter's pass that already have a known series icon. Given the emphasis on guest characters and companies, Geno's status as a Mario character could mean that he takes one of those two spots even though he's a 3rd party character. Basically it just gives him another avenue to sneak his way in. Those spots could go to just about anyone, though. It could open a door for Sephiroth as well, for example.

That said, I'm more interested in it from a broad perspective. I hesitate to get too deep in speculation anymore, but characters from three new series and characters from three existing series (when including Piranha Plant) is nice and symmetrical. It reminds me a little of the Box Theory. It always seemed too literal to be true, but given that they didn't mind having that hint out in plain sight, it's feasible anyway that this theory could be true too. The final two new series might just be Tales and Dragon Quest or perhaps two more surprises similar to Persona.

 

[Fatmanonice]

I've gotten to the point that if Square's going to get a totally new series in Smash, it'll probably be Chrono. Fans love it. Chrono Trigger is an undisputed classic. It's not too legally complicated in comparison to most other Square series. It has a long history in the Smash fanbase. Like I keep harping on, people wanted Joker and Persona/SMT in Smash. You could maybe fill a KFC with the number of people globally who seriously want DQ content in Smash. Joker was a slight step down from a Cloud/Bayonetta reveal and you can tell this because of the sheer reaction it got. People flipped their ****. No DQ character would get that kind of reaction, I can guarantee it. The internet and especially the Smash fanbase would lose its collective mind over Chrono Trigger in Smash.

 

[Robertroid]

This. There is good evidence and, despite my pessimism, we can't give up yet. However, we absolutely must take into account the possibility that Geno will not get in this time around, and we need to keep our composure.

Being vocal is something I encourage, but it has to be done with maturity and respect. Again, as a K. Rool fan, I can tell you that strong rapport in the fanbase, persistence, and lots of love is what got K. Rool where he is today. Sure, I've seen some bad apples in the fanbase (doesn't every fanbase have some?), but generally, my experience with the rest of the Kremling Krew has been nothing but pleasant. When we made our outcry, we did it with negativity being absent from the outreach. We did it with positivity by showing our love for this character and what he would bring to the table. We showed not anger and riots, but peace in our pleading... and we won.

Don't start calling Nintendo employees and getting outraged at them. Don't start behaving out of line if Geno doesn't make it. The fanbase already has an unfortunate stigma as is, and we can't perpetuate that. It not only makes us look bad to the rest of the Smash community, but it also makes us look bad to Nintendo and Square. Vocal outreach and passion is highly encouraged, but don't let your emotions spearhead anything over the top. Make your outreach positive. Tell whoever you can in terms of higher powers about your love and appreciation for SMRPG and this character. Share your positive experiences and make your polite arguments. Don't lose yourself to your emotions, or it could be Geno's downfall ——— and even if it isn't, just... just have empathy for the people you're reaching out to. Nintendo employees aren't the ones at fault, yet they're being outright attacked by other people. Be reasonable. Be nice.

ETA: Also, my favorite pie is dutch apple a la mode with key lime being a close second. MMmmm...

This, basically. Let's keep our gaming hobby as it is, a hobby, and let's not turn into "Internet: Serious Business" mode.
I've been thinking, and it has to suck being a game developer at this time, where you try to put a vision of a fun game into production, sacrificing time, energy and body health to make the best of it and hoping to your clients to enjoy it, just to meet with angry selfish fans that can harass and threaten you just because their self-built hype was not meet. Also executive meddling.

Our new smash is full of content. Let's enjoy it

 

[owjies]

I've gotten to the point that if Square's going to get a totally new series in Smash, it'll probably be Chrono. Fans love it. Chrono Trigger is an undisputed classic. It's not too legally complicated in comparison to most other Square series. It has a long history in the Smash fanbase. Like I keep harping on, people wanted Joker and Persona/SMT in Smash. You could maybe fill a KFC with the number of people globally who seriously want DQ content in Smash. Joker was a slight step down from a Cloud/Bayonetta reveal and you can tell this because of the sheer reaction it got. People flipped their ****. No DQ character would get that kind of reaction, I can guarantee it. The internet and especially the Smash fanbase would lose its collective mind over Chrono Trigger in Smash.

I can see that. I've always gotten the feeling that Sakurai views himself as somewhat of a gaming historian, considering all the research he's done for Smash and his personal library of thousand of games. If Geno was off the table, Crono feels like a "Sakurai" pick to me. Erdrick might be appealing as one of the fathers of JRPGs so to speak, but Crono represents almost the fulfillment of the JRPG genre's potential (at least during that era of gaming). We'll have to see if the characters' series status comes into play as Persona is still going strong. On a side note, if symbolism and history do play a role, Geno certainly brings his own as a representation of Nintendo and Square's partnership during the height of their successes.

 

[Fatmanonice]

That partnership is important to note too because it really does highlight how crazy Geno's situation is. He's an original Mario character that was created by a third party more than two decades ago... And he still has a notable fanbase. Can any other third party make that boast? "Oh hey, we created a character for the biggest IP in gaming back before the internet went mainstream and he still has fans." Let me condense that even further: "we created a Nintendo character that people love." Can Capcom say that? Konami? SEGA? Namco? That's a big distinction that I think people regularly blow off.

 

[Datboigeno]

Damn guys I wasnt able to start playing SSBU until like 10 and ended up staying up until 5 in the morning. My gf basically had to recommend I sleep to get me to stop. Like holy **** this game is fun. The whole Spirit collection and customization aspect is way more interesting than I thought it’d be. The new fighters are also really fun. I unlocked K. Rool very early on and I’ve had a ton of fun experimenting with his gun. I can see him really pissing people off online lol. I just unlocked Ridley before I went to bed and am excited to try him out too. Simon is also a lot of fun. I don’t think I mentioned it before but I actually skipped Sm4sh because I never got a Wii U and got a 3DS only a couple years ago and never got around to buying Sm4sh for it. So this is my first time playing all the characters introduced there like Mega Man and Shulk and I’m having a blast with them too.

My perspective on the music stuff is that if anything I think it increases Geno’s chances. Joker fills one new spot and I genuinely see the other two being Lloyd from Tales and Banjo-Kazooie. I know that’s a big assumption but it genuinely feels like the stars are aligning for the bear and bird this time. That leaves two spots for returning series. And in terms of the SE reps we know that’s really either Geno or Sephiroth and from Reggie’s comments I don’t see it being Seph. At the same time if it came down to it I’d be cool with Crono and honestly Sora too over DQ stuff. Not trying to **** on DQ because I’ve really like the designs of that series (especially the monsters) but to me something like Erdrick or Crono would be anti-hype and really doesn’t seem to go in line with being unique or different.

 

[beans]

So uhh...
https://boards.fireden.net/v/thread/440346534/
This is a thing?

 

[Potatu]

I...don't have any hope left. Joker opened so many doors that now almost anybody can join Smash. I honestly think the base game was Geno's best shot. Nobody knows what's going to happen with the rest of DLC, so we're in for surprises, which is good. At this point, i just want the Geno costume back and i wanna know some things....

1. Why didn't we get any SMRPG music? The composer is already on board, so it seems very easy to get.
2. This is subjective, but why didn't Nintendo utilise the ballot more? Ridley, Simon and K Rool felt like the only ballot picks (i know Inkling and Isabelle were super popular, but still).
3. Why didn't they just show Geno's spirit battle in the November direct instead of showing his icon for like 2 seconds?

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

So uhh...
https://boards.fireden.net/v/thread/440346534/
This is a thing?

It's a 4chan leak.

In which none have been right so far

 

[Fatmanonice]

So uhh...
https://boards.fireden.net/v/thread/440346534/
This is a thing?

It is but I chalk it up more to "put enough monkeys in a room (4chan) with a typewriter, and they will correctly guess a DLC character." Someone having video access to all of it is near impossible too if even play testers say they haven't seen any of the DLC characters yet aside from Pirhana Plant.

 

[beans]

It's a 4chan leak.

In which none have been right so far

https://boards.fireden.net/v/thread/432868409/

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

https://boards.fireden.net/v/thread/432868409/

How is pirahna plant in a car similar to Bowser Jr.?

 

[beans]

How is pirahna plant in a car similar to Bowser Jr.?

I mean, if I saw a pic of it I wouldnt expect it to walk on roots.