Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Dr.DonPatch64]

Why is it so hard to believe that they would make costumes in bulk before they're released alongside a fighter? Why is it that people believe Mii Costumes are only made right before they're released?



Welcome, friend! Complimentary Geno hat for you:
View attachment 275795

Thanks

 

[CannonStreak]

Because what's the point? Mii Costumes aren't some huge timesink, they probably take a couple months to model and slap onto the Mii to make sure nothing clips before they're shipped out. Why would they sit on a couple of inconsequential hats for 7 months? Why would Square and Bethesda be fine with signing off on these just for them to sit in storage for so long?

It's not like the hats in the leak looked clearly unfinished. They look ready to ship out any day now, but they've just been content to let 'em collect dust for almost a year? I ain't buyin' it.

Not to mention, if I may add, Cacodemon and Mallow are the only ones we have seen who have been visually "leaked". The others so far were never leaked in pictures at all, and while those non-leaked costumes did come out, Cacodemon and Mallow have yet to be shown and released officially.

I was never personally with the idea of CacoMallow being real, anyways, personally speaking.

 

[Dr.DonPatch64]

I go 50/50 with leaks until officially announced by Sakurai himself, just to keep it safe

 

[axel_]

Because what's the point? Mii Costumes aren't some huge timesink, they probably take a couple months to model and slap onto the Mii to make sure nothing clips before they're shipped out. Why would they sit on a couple of inconsequential hats for 7 months? Why would Square and Bethesda be fine with signing off on these just for them to sit in storage for so long?

It's not like the hats in the leak looked clearly unfinished. They look ready to ship out any day now, but they've just been content to let 'em collect dust for almost a year? I ain't buyin' it.

Sora LTD. doesn't think as little of Mii Costumes as you do. They have plans for every piece of DLC content they have in the oven, so they're not just gonna release ANY Mii Costume with any Fighter at any time. The costumes have to make thematic sense and they need to work out schedule times with other companies.

 

[Dukefire]

I still say that there is a possibly another Indie Mii Costume will appear with fighter 77. Could go with odd number with Indie, but it might not be the case

 

[Hinata]

Sora LTD. doesn't think as little of Mii Costumes as you do. They have plans for every piece of DLC content they have in the oven, so they're not just gonna release ANY Mii Costume with any Fighter at any time. The costumes have to make thematic sense and they need to work out schedule times with other companies.

Ah, yes, because it makes total thematic sense to release a Fallout costume with an ARMS character. Releasing a Team Rocket costume and various Mega Man outfits with Banjo? How could I not see the obvious connection there? And of course, how could we forget the oh so obvious link between Byleth and the Rabbids?

 

[Sigran101]

I was only now able to watch the presentation and I haven't caught up here, so forgive me if all this has been talked about already.

Holy crap, Sakurai just stomped the life out of so many fan rules and detractor arguments! It was glorious!

Spirits deconfirm- Min Min

It has to start with the main character- Min Min

Assist trophies deconfirm- the reasoning for not adding Springman was that the developers wanted Min Min, not that he was an assist trophy.

"Nintendo would never go to Bethesda for just a Mii costume" (what about Ubisoft) "B-but that's different because reasons!"- Vault Boy

And as the cherry on top, that stupid ass "Hero V2" nonsense is finally dead!

Not to mention Sakurai said "at least" 5 more characters, implying more dlc is on the table!

What a great day!

 

[MattX20]

At the rate this thread is going, we'll reach 2900 pages by the end of the week

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Not to mention Sakurai said "at least" 5 more characters, implying more dlc is on the table!!

That's not really what he said. What he said was that he'll make sure we get at least five more characters, when talking about finishing the rest of the pass. He's putting hard work into making sure the pass will come out.

Many people missed that context, to be fair.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Let's be honest, if Cacomallow is real, it won't matter regarding Geno, because we'll see him before we see the mii costumes anyway. They sure would be cool to have, though. Maybe we'll at least get a Mallow hat/costume anyway if Mii Costume Guy is still going good.

 

[Fatmanonice]

While we're on the topic of 77, do you guys want to see some terrifying arcane magic? Brace yourselves...

Spoiler: You've been warned.

Spoiler: Knowledge the Devil himself fears.

We prayed for the impossible, unaware of the madness that would unfold.

 

[super88cloud]

Geno will be added when this thread will reach 3000 pages

This will not age well. This thread goes super fast. But there´s a chance that´s in the first hundred of the 3000.

 

[Droodle]

You know, I was thinking about it and came to the exact same conclusion. Consider this: ARMS itself may not have been one of the most highly requested games to get repped, but Min Min herself was undisputedly the most popular character in ARMS. Sakurai deliberately bypassed the two poster children (Springman and Ribbongirl) and went straight for the fan demand. I had my doubts when Fatman said that this pass would be fan service, but given what we've learned today, I really don't see how Geno isn't happening when Sakurai knows damn well how long and how vigorously people have been requesting him. I mean, why go so far out of his way to smash the spirits deconfirm rule? And the spirit battles rule? If this pass really is as fan servicey as it looks, I don't see how we could have it without Geno.

Nothing related to Geno but Yabuki himself had to ask for Min-Min, sure Sakurai said he was thinking between Ninjara or Min-Min, and it's implied he was willing to do Spring-Man as well; but I'm willing to bet he would have gone with Ninjara if Yabuki didn't support Min-Min too. So it's not really Sakurai bypassing Springman/Ribbongirl, but more so Yabuki; it showcases that developers do have some control in who gets added to Smash.

On the other hand, deconfirming the spirits fanrule doesn't make Geno a lock, there are plenty of other Spirits that people want to see become fighters. Characters like Bandana Dee, Rex and Pyra, Geno, Shantae, Rayman, all benefit from this; and I doubt that we are getting all of them in FP 2. There will definitely be snubs (hopefully not Geno).

Also remember, only Fatman has said that this pass is going to be fanservicy. The most Sakurai has said is that it's going to be extra, but extra has a lot of different interpretations attached to it. On that note, while Geno is definitely fanservicy; there are definitely ways to make a pass that is fansercvicy without Geno too.

It's still too early to decide if this pass will be fanservicy or not. My thoughts on Geno are still the same, he's likely but not a lock Fatman's amiibo theory is nice, but I think it's mostly just a coincidence rather then anything substantial. You could easily argue that it's also hinting at Rex because of the fact that Xeno originated with Square.

Sora LTD. doesn't think as little of Mii Costumes as you do. They have plans for every piece of DLC content they have in the oven, so they're not just gonna release ANY Mii Costume with any Fighter at any time. The costumes have to make thematic sense and they need to work out schedule times with other companies.

My argument against that is that if Nintendo cared a ton about official mii costumes, they would have done a better job securing them from video leaks. DLC Fighters tend avoid video leaks, and most leaks are relegated to texts. It's understandable for base game video leaks, because the game is largely done; DLC is a different game entirely.

Also I feel as the thematic sense rule sort if bit the dust as soon as we got rabbids + Cuphead with Byleth of all things, and getting Vault Boy with ARMS makes little sense unless you buy the 76 theory.

Now I don't completely discount Cacomallow, because I think a potential excuse is the fact that they're waiting for DOOM Eternal to hit the Switch before they release the mii costume. Sometimes things just leak, even if it doesn't really make sense for it too.

However, if Cacomallow is real; then I would find it super strange if Doomguy isn't revealed alongside Cacodemon (either as a fighter or as a mii costume), if Doomguy turns out to be a mii costume; and Geno still hasn't been confirmed playable at that point, then I would be a little more hesitant on his chances.

EDIT: Also I feel as though if a full blown fighter video leaked months ahead of time, then Nintendo/Sora LTD would do all in their power to take down videos of the leak even if it "confirmed" it. But yet people here argue that they don't care about the cacomallow costume leak enough to spoil the surprise, when if they really cared, they would actually take it down despite that.

 

[KCCHIEFS27]

Because what's the point? Mii Costumes aren't some huge timesink, they probably take a couple months to model and slap onto the Mii to make sure nothing clips before they're shipped out. Why would they sit on a couple of inconsequential hats for 7 months? Why would Square and Bethesda be fine with signing off on these just for them to sit in storage for so long?

It's not like the hats in the leak looked clearly unfinished. They look ready to ship out any day now, but they've just been content to let 'em collect dust for almost a year? I ain't buyin' it.

“I don’t know how the process works, but MY guess is more valuable than yours!”

You’re literally GUESSING how **** works when Sakurai literally said fighters take a year to make. It’s not a stretch to think they complete the mii costumes early on in the development process for each pack and then they sit there for a long time while they tweak the playable character for several months.

But nah. You refuse to even acknowledge that because then you can’t condescend on a forum and make baseless claims. The way you’re talking in certainties is coming dangerously close to “fan rules”, which are made up nonsense people say to fit whatever belief they already hold. It is entirely possible those mii costumes will be coming soon, and it’s also possible they’re fake. But your logic is straight up wrong for why they couldn’t possibly be real

 

[Firox]

And as the cherry on top, that stupid ass "Hero V2" nonsense is finally dead!

Man, you really took that "Hero" situation thing personally, huh? I think spirits deconfirming was the bigger takeaway here, but by all means, insult anyone that might have entertained a perfectly viable point of speculation. To be fair, the "spirits deconfirm" argument didn't even make logical sense (at least for season 2 of the DLC) and was primarily used by Geno detractors as a means of gatekeeping. As for the "Hero" idea, it was considered by a significant amount of people due to the ambiguity of the ARMS half-reveal back in April and the various unprecedented factors being taken into account. I don't recall anyone that supported the idea being blatantly disrespectful towards those that held a differing opinion.

 

[SSGuy]

“I don’t know how the process works, but MY guess is more valuable than yours!”

You’re literally GUESSING how **** works when Sakurai literally said fighters take a year to make. It’s not a stretch to think they complete the mii costumes early on in the development process for each pack and then they sit there for a long time while they tweak the playable character for several months.

But nah. You refuse to even acknowledge that because then it weakens your baseless claim. The way you’re talking in certainties is coming dangerously close to “fan rules”, which are made up nonsense people say to fit whatever belief they already hold. It is entirely possible those mii costumes will be coming soon, and it’s also possible they’re fake. But your logic is straight up wrong for why they couldn’t possibly be real

To play devil's advocate on the time it takes for Mii Costumes, you probably are looking at a scenario where most of these deals with Ubisoft/Bethesda/Studio MDHR/etc were completed and wrapped up around the same time Fighter's Pass 2 finished up. Then you look at a few contract to hire employees who are responsible for modeling and testing majority of these costumes, only for them to just await their return down the road.

Not entirely sure how Mii Costumes work, but I don't think it is too much of a stretch to think that they would want to work out a bunch of Mii Costumes and have them on hold for a period of time. If they are real, I am certain they will find a way into the game.

 

[MattX20]

Hmm...a thought occurred to me. Given that MinMin's spirit board incorporates the 4 base game spirits for ARMS, I get the feeling that the Mallow spirit will also return for Geno's

 

[UberMadman]

Geno will be added when this thread will reach 3000 pages

GENO BECOMES REAL IN 140 PAGES

 

[Spatulo]

SPIRITS DO NOT DECONFIRM

Sakurai was going to add Springman if the director said so so ASSIST TROPHIES DO NOT DECONFIRM

EVERYONE IS BACK ON THE TABLE

Celebrate, my friends

 

[DutchPichu]

Hmm...a thought occurred to me. Given that MinMin's spirit board incorporates the 4 base game spirits for ARMS, I get the feeling that the Mallow spirit will also return for Geno's

How do we know that Min Min's spirit board has the base game ARMS spirits on it?

 

[pinshadow]

• Another day of Cacomallow arguments

Christ, can everyone just stop pretending to know how Sakurai's team does everything? Yes, the fact that neither of the costumes have shown up yet is detrimental to the credibility of the leak. (though I would like to interject that the ARMS character was almost certainly delayed from an April release, so keep that in mind) Yes, Zenimax getting representation in Smash makes the idea of DOOM content coming down the line more plausible. There, done. Seriously, no one is going to convince anyone to change their stance at this point. And besides, it's not like Geno's chances hinge on the leak at all, we've just had our biggest victory since almost one year ago when the Geno costume failed to materialize and yet you people are arguing like you actually work for Sora LTD.

 

[Droodle]

“I don’t know how the process works, but MY guess is more valuable than yours!”

You’re literally GUESSING how **** works when Sakurai literally said fighters take a year to make. It’s not a stretch to think they complete the mii costumes early on in the development process for each pack and then they sit there for a long time while they tweak the playable character for several months.

But nah. You refuse to even acknowledge that because then you can’t condescend on a forum and make baseless claims. The way you’re talking in certainties is coming dangerously close to “fan rules”, which are made up nonsense people say to fit whatever belief they already hold. It is entirely possible those mii costumes will be coming soon, and it’s also possible they’re fake. But your logic is straight up wrong for why they couldn’t possibly be real

Actually, with most of the information we have in regards to timing, they work on 3 fighters at a time and usually the character takes about 6-8 months to complete. Chances are Joker entered full blown development when the Final Smash Ultimate pre-release presentation was released, and it took around 6-7 months to complete him. Hero and Banjo likely started some base work during that time as well.

Now if we are extremely generous, it is possible that they work on the Fighter's Packs content (mii costumes/spirits) around the time when that fighter's development really starts. We can assume ARMS had started base development around the time Banjo came out, FP 7 likely started work around the time Terry came out (October/November); and the Cacomallow costumes were largely functional during this time, by the time Byleth was ready (December/January) they should have started work on FP 8 (although we know that they likely took a break around this time).

That means that it is technically possible that Cacomallow is going to come with whoever 7 is going to be at minimum, and 8 maximum (although Square only likes other Square content, so Cacodemon likely wouldn't come with Mallow). Right now I'm on the side that Cacomallow is super unlikely (but I'm not dismissing it), but if FP 7 comes with 0 indication of any Cacomallow content, then I'll start saying its a completely dead leak.

 

[Just a random scrub]

How do we know that Min Min's spirit board has the base game ARMS spirits on it?

PushDustin revealed her Spirit Board

Here is Min Min's Spirit Board. pic.twitter.com/RZSYGp7G7e

— Will (PushDustIn) (@PushDustIn) June 22, 2020

 

[JoscarGamma]

What a glorious day. Spirits don’t deconfirm, the main protagonist doesn’t have to represent the series (even though they all are the protagonist wink wink), Lloyd looks likely as the Namco rep, and now it’s only a matter of time for Geno.

i’m looking forward to playing as Min Min, I just hope there won’t be a long wait for fighter 7 to be revealed... please don’t let it be September... release in September is fine, just no long wait for announcements please....

 

[QQS]

So the “Jiggy moment” here was the Ramen. When Geno gets released, it will probably be stars, dolls or a forest. Of course starring Mario and the gang. Probably also Kirby and Rosalina. It’s coming guys.

 

[JarBear]

Ah, she will come with a board, kinda interesting that it wasn’t in the presentation. Oh well.

im so curious if the Min Min spirit battle will change. It has to!

 

[*Verrix*]

Love the Gurren Lagaan avatar Uber.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Ah, she will come with a board, kinda interesting that it wasn’t in the presentation. Oh well.

im so curious if the Min Min spirit battle will change. It has to!

It's implied it will by Sakurai. He doesn't outright say it, but this one makes sense to.

It's also possible you may need to beat it to unlock her in WoL, since you can rematch that particular Spirit as many times as you like. But she also has a new Smash render, so probably not. I'm guessing she'll be unlocked immediately if you have DLC as an option.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Also, call me a pudding putz, but I kind of got choked up when I saw Min-Min got a cinematic trailer. Everybody is getting a trailer that we can rewatch and fawn over again and again. The fact that Geno could get a full pack complete with a cinematic trailer when around this time last year a lot of the fanbase would have happily taken the simple return of the Mii Costume, it's... It's an amazing feeling. We spent all last summer waiting for the axe to fall and it never did. Now the impossible dream of 7 year old me may soon be coming to a close. I look in the mirror and I see gray hairs and my father's face. Often growing up makes you jaded and forces you to give up on things you'd rather not and, for me, Super Mario RPG is just something from my childhood that will probably always mean something to me. I'm only about 4 years younger than my mom was in 1996 and it's just... No matter how bad things got, it's just something I've always carried with me and has always been a simple joy through the seasons of my life. As they say, it's hard to hold onto childhood things but the things most worth it are worth hanging onto...

 

[T2by4]

Someone made a good point in a thread I posted for fun. What if the next few fighters come in pairs one as a costume and one as a fighter? One of the MH costumes could be for the MH rep, Gil mii costume with Lloyd, and Chocobo costume with Geno costume. Could be possible.

 

[JarBear]

Hmm, do we need to keep an eye out after the new DLC for any visual glitches on fighters? I can see maybe Ness, Lucas, Mega Man could be the base used for Geno.

Hmmm.

 

[Akg0001]

In favor to Geno: all 3 premium Mii costumes are Mii gunners. Its time for some Mii brawler and Mii swordfighter.

 

[MisterMike]

Because what's the point?

So you'll have them done for when you actually need them rather than rushing them at the last minute.

Mii Costumes aren't some huge timesink, they probably take a couple months to model and slap onto the Mii to make sure nothing clips before they're shipped out. Why would they sit on a couple of inconsequential hats for 7 months? Why would Square and Bethesda be fine with signing off on these just for them to sit in storage for so long?[/QUOTE]
Why would they have an issue with that to begin with? If they're fine with them taking well over a year to make a character with their IP, why would they take issue with them making costumes using their IP and not releasing them until they're needed?

 

[SSGuy]

Hmm, do we need to keep an eye out after the new DLC for any visual glitches on fighters? I can see maybe Ness, Lucas, Mega Man could be the base used for Geno.

Hmmm.

The other two bugs/tech issues include Shiek (WOL exclusive bug) and Ness. But yeah, I am curious what 8.0 bugs we will get.

 

[Firox]

In favor to Geno: all 3 premium Mii costumes are Mii gunners. Its time for some Mii brawler and Mii swordfighter.

And inversely, ALL the DLC so far has consisted of Brawler and Swordfighter-type characters. We are WAY overdue for a Gunner type.

(No, Joker's Gun™ doesn't make him a "Gunner" type and Banjo is kind of a hybrid between Brawler and Gunner.)

 

[Deleted member]

We had a crazy morning Genobros. 3 things happened all in one morning.

- Min Min obliterates “SpIrITs DeCOnFirM” rule.

- After 6 waves of Mii costumes, Geno’s costume is still missing.

- Geno trending on twitter.

 

[Vector Victor]

The other two bugs/tech issues include Shiek (WOL exclusive bug) and Ness. But yeah, I am curious what 8.0 bugs we will get.

'At certain points in a random match, Megaman turns into Geno with a banner over him that reads 'Character 77.' I wonder if this means anything.'

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

In favor to Geno: all 3 premium Mii costumes are Mii gunners. Its time for some Mii brawler and Mii swordfighter.

There's only two Deluxe costumes. Vault Boy didn't come with music whatsoever, nor is he Indie regardless.

There's no real reason to label him that at this point. And him coming with some cool trailer music... means little when a ton of costumes, including non-Deluxe, come with those.

Though maybe CP7 will have a Deluxe costume?

 

[RingJ5]

This announcement only strengthens my personal theorized timeline of events, which I’m now calling the ChocoMallow Theory:

Mid 2018: The base and FP1 rosters are finalized. With no further DLC planned at the time, Geno is planned to be the first in a set of “Premium Costumes” that include songs. This could be why BTFM wasn’t in the base game’s tracklist, as it could have been saved for the costume. (Please note, because I had a few people misread last time I brought this up, I am talking about the situation nearly two years ago. I 100% think that we’re about to be getting a fully playable Geno as #77, this is just how I think events played out.)

Late 2018: The game releases, and the Fighter’s Pass makes a ****load of money.

Early 2019: Geno’s Mii costume is being prepped for release with #2, along with Mallow and Smithy hats. The costumes are fully done and ready to go for Hero’s reveal, alongside the Chocobo hat. Yes, it would mean that Wave 2 would have had a whopping eight costumes, but as seen from Smash 4’s special treatment, Geno’s worth it.

May 2019: A second pass is greenlit... and at pretty much the last second, Geno gets an upgrade to the seventh Challenger Pack to be released in over a year from then, and the costumes are shelved. The team realizes that just having the Chocobo hat without Geno would be particularly suspicious-looking, so that’s also cut.

With these six projected to be the final additions to the game, they start contacting friendly companies that didn’t quite make the cut about potential Mii Costumes: One(songless) full-body costume and one hat each. Ubisoft and Bethesda sign on, the former with Altair and a Rabbids hat, and the latter with Vault Boy and a Cacodemon hat.

June 2019: A legitimate leak gets out! With the DQ costumes packed away and ready for the presentation, a list of all the other non-premium costumes that were finished at the time manages to make its way onto Discord. Said leak includes every single costume coming in Wave 3, but also includes the hats cut from #2. Completed premium costumes are importantly not on this list, explaining the lack of both Geno and Sans.

July 2019: Hero’s presentation, and Geno is nowhere to be seen.

Mid-2019: The team works on #5’s Ubisoft costumes.

September 2019: Banjo’s presentation, and the leak is confirmed! Sans is a surprise to all, yet every single other non-Square costume was gotten exactly correct, leaving those three a mystery.

October 2019: The team works on #6’s Bethesda costumes. But... suddenly, another leak gets out! Someone took the Cacodemon hat, threw it together with the dormant Mallow hat that won’t be needed for a few months, and leaked them both! ****! Taking the leak down would spoil content that wouldn’t be out for like nine months at the earliest, and Square content at that! It would be possibly the earliest definitive leak that Smash has ever had! Legitimately, the best option is to do absolutely nothing in this case, particularly when the inclusion of Cacodemon would give the wrong impression of the characters to come, especially since...

January 2020: A bit before #5’s reveal, one of the top people at Id is interviewed about Doomguy’s Smash chances. He is quite open and blatant about how it’s not happening, but does mention that they have talked with Nintendo, making his statements a strong blow against Doomguy as a character yet a good indicator regarding the idea of a Mii Costume like Cacodemon existing.

Later, #5’s reveal happens, and with it, the Ubisoft costumes. Inexplicably, the Altair costume is literally just called “Altair” in America yet nowhere else, with the other broadcasts using the full series logo. FP2 is announced as well, with six characters.

March 2020: #6’s series is revealed as being from Arms. Behind the scenes, Nintendo is realizing they now have a similar quandary to the Chocobo hat: If they include it in the presentation, then that would confirm the leak and the existence of the Mallow hat. They decide to shelve it and give a bit of extra fanfare to Vault Boy.

May 2020: Both Cloud Amiibos are leaked for a reprint in September, along with some Mario characters.

June 2020: #6 is properly revealed, finally deconfirming “Spirits deconfirm” to the point where the Spirit Board discrepancies are officially addressed. The stream also confirms Joker and Hero Amiibos slated for Fall, and the Vault Boy costume. Vault Boy notably shares the same odd naming convention that Altair did, being “x Vault Boy” in America and “x Fallout” everywhere else.

Basically, in other words, I think Cacodemon was originally planned for this wave, but revealing it here would confirm the leak, so it was shelved. The Ubisoft and Bethesda “packs” would line up incredibly well in multiple ways otherwise.

In other words, I’m excited for Geno getting revealed as Challenger Pack #7 and fighter #77 at 7:07 on 7/7.

 

[JarBear]

ah, so there is a Ness visual bug. That could work as a base model.