Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Powerman293]

Polarthief It honestly just follows what I've been preaching forever in that Season 2 has a huge sense of finality to it not only because of the rumored degrees of fan service it's supposedly going to have but the scale of it. I don't think Season 2 is going to be like the Fighter's Pass. I think every pack is going to have some degree of a "wow" factor to it. For example, the hypothetical Namco pack basically being a total blow out of Namco content and not just Tales, Tekken, whatever. I think that's the intention and why I give credence to what I've heard. Geno wouldn't just be SMRPG stuff, he would probably come pretty heavy handed with Square content because it paints a picture of Nintendo trying to proactively squash sour grapes. They can't satisfy everyone but they're going to try pretty damn hard to at least tip their hats to as many fans as possible.

So it's just gonna be a ton more Mii Costumes? I mean.. that's cool I guess.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Just a question but do the Mii Costume rumors include characters that were already Mii Costumes in Smash 4, or are these completely new

All the third party Mii costumes are expected to return, even if certain characters wind up being playable. Namco with a Namco pack, Square with a Square pack, and Capcom with a Capcom pack. Namco has three missing with an additional three decently supported, Square is missing two with an additional three supported, and Capcom has two missing with one other being supported by multiple people. It sounds weird but I do believe that if Geno, Lloyd, or Heihachi become playable that their Mii costumes are coming too because it's basically free money to rerelease them even if they don't sell well because the actual character winds up playable.

 

[Firox]

TBH it's the FF7 hype that's annoying to me, not the FF7R hype. It's a bit different when it's a brand new game vs being 23 years old.
(and moreso when the company who owns the game continues to perpetuate that hype OVER TWENTY-THREE !@#$ING YEARS LATER)

That's fair. While FF7 as a sub-franchise is pretty epic, I agree that FF7, the original game, is HIGHLY overrated. I was just having a discussion with my brother over lunch that FF7 and FF10 were pretty much the high points of SE's career so that's why they're trying so hard to milk that success. You can even see how FF13 was SE's sad attempt at fusing elements from 7 and 10 into one game. They've been trying to recreate the magic for a decade now with little success which is why they resorted to simply remaking 7 in the first place.

 

[Powerman293]

I mean, I'd prefer if Square Enix added Geno first before any other character. Another FF character would be pretty down the list to add.

 

[MisterMike]

I don't know why I made this, but I did.

 

[Nicnac]

-"Western": This one is interesting because, Western wise, Indies seem to have more backing than major Western companies themselves. Of rumored Western company Mii costumes, Activision/Blizzard has two that are questionable but then you could arguably count Western Indies on two hands. There's also the fact that Activision is comically bad at keeping secrets so them leaking that they're going to be in Smash is kind of their MO.

Do you think it's possible that id software is getting a rep in place of Activision?

 

[Fatmanonice]

First and foremost, I highly disagree with you that he would just be a Cloud echo... It's just the same mentality as Banjo would be a Duck Hunt echo. The only "issue" that would come for him moveset wize would be his sword, and even that shouldn¨t really be an issue..

Also, about your argument of them not being able to argue for literal JPGs... Smash Ultimate is the first game that has any Square related stuff in the base game. Normally, when Square Enix is getting included, its through DLC. Just look at how they treated Dragon Quest in comparison.

It could just be that they asked for a bare minimum for Cloud so they could truly have "everyone is back"... Granted, we got only 2 tracks in Smash4 DLC but so did Ryu and I do believe Bayonetta too.

That's not what I'm getting at. What I'm getting at is that I seriously doubt Sephiroth is going to pop the cherry for first unique secondary third party character in Smash. I agree, Sephiroth as an Echo would be dumb as hell but that's what I'm saying. Literally nobody would be okay with that decision. My point is that of they were going to pull the trigger on a playable Sephiroth, they'd go all out. No cut corners. He'd probably have some sort of unique mechanic. The works. Despite this, I feel like Final Fantasy is reeeeeeeally far down the line of third party franchises that they would want to give secondary characters, especially in the light that so many Megaman and Sonic characters were AT'd.

 

[Icewolff92]

Despite this, I feel like Final Fantasy is reeeeeeeally far down the line of third party franchises that they would want to give secondary characters, especially in the light that so many Megaman and Sonic characters were AT'd.

I would have generally agreed with you if it were not for a simple fact. Sepiroth is one of the major poster-boys when it comes to iconic villains. You knew of him even if you haven¨t played Final Fantasy back in the day. Hell, you know of Aeri's death even if you haven¨t played nor heard of the series. Had the only iconic character been Cloud from the series.. then yes I would be with you..

And about the Sonic and Mega Man part... yeah, they have only one character (and quite frankly, I think Sonic deserves at least one more) but compare and contrast their representation.... Mega Man and Sonic would still end up with more representation in general, even if they have only 1 fighter each, they would still be more representative then what Final Fantasy is. In comparison. Fire Emblem might have 8 characters and Legend of Zelda has 6.. But taking the number of songs, assist theories, stages and items, Legend of Zelda beats Fire Emblem by a long shot, especially concidering the only thing Fire Emblem have in item supply is a killing edge and three assists trophies.

 

[Polarthief]

that doesn¨t change the fact though that Square Enix is usually less "stingy" when it comes to DLC vs base game.

Compared to what? Themselves? They're still stingy with DLC compared to any other company. SNK literally handed them 50 songs. Square is one of the stingiest in Smash atm.

FF 7-10 on the Switch

Old games they already had ported elsewhere. Free money.

while also bombarding the console with RPGs (Bravely Default 2 and Trials of Mana coming up, where the former is Switch exclusive)

Cool. What does this have to do with Smash?

Yes, I am biased. But I think with how their relationship has blossomed since Cloud got in and those DLC examples, I don¨t think its that impossible to get Geno and Sepiroth in some form.

A third party company puts games on a console: "Their relationship has blossomed". What? Sorry I don't quite understand this logic.
Regardless of how good or not good relations are with a company, that doesn't mean they'll get more than one slot on this season.

That's fair. While FF7 as a sub-franchise is pretty epic, I agree that FF7, the original game, is HIGHLY overrated. I was just having a discussion with my brother over lunch that FF7 and FF10 were pretty much the high points of SE's career so that's why they're trying so hard to milk that success.

FF6 was sadly very underrated (it got the Earthbound treatment of being underrated at release but being greatly praised later on) and SMRPG's timing was just downright awful.

FF7 I think was just the start of the 3D age, so it's what got a lot of hype for being "so different", even though it was still in that super awkward time of 3D. 10 was when it got "perfected" methinks since it was on the PS2, which by that point 3D games were definitely more understood.

Also, when you say 10 was the "high point", do you mean in terms of game design or what the fans enjoyed? I never hear people talking about FF10 (besides Tidus's laugh), even though it was my first FF (and one of my favorites, though I still want Geno well before I'd want any FF rep). Everything usually gets overshadowed by FF7 and to a lesser degree, FF6 (and some of the boomers who still call it FF3).

Fire Emblem might have 8 characters and Legend of Zelda has 6.. But taking the number of songs, assist theories, stages and items, Legend of Zelda beats Fire Emblem by a long shot, especially concidering the only thing Fire Emblem have in item supply is a killing edge and three assists trophies.

But at the end of the day, fighters are all that really matters when you consider 100% of players, super hardcore and casual, are affected by what fighters are in the game. Once you start getting into stages, competitive players will often go for BF/FD versions and don't play with items on, which makes the stage, item, and AT points absolutely moot. Songs are nice and all too, but they simply don't compare to a playable fighter. You shouldn't have to look at anything besides fighters to know Fire Emblem is extremely overrepresented, and it makes it so much worse when a lot of them play very similarly (3 are virtually identical to one another, 1 is different, but then has an echo that mirrors him and the 3 that are identical, all have swords as primary weapons, etc). We know that you love FE, but it really doesn't need you to defend it. I mean if songs are *that* important, then FF/KoF is definitely overrepresented, right?

Anyway, I really don't give a crap if Sephiroth gets in, but Geno deserves the spot more if only one of them can get it. FF7 is already represented, and it sure would suck to have a character come with a stage and 2 more songs without much of anything else. I just don't see him getting in, but I also do see Square wanting to circlejerk on FF7 harder, as usual.

 

[Icewolff92]

Compared to what? Themselves? They're still stingy with DLC compared to any other company. SNK literally handed them 50 songs. Square is one of the stingiest in Smash atm.

Super Smash Bros Ultimate is the first game to ever have any Square Enix content in a non-square Enix game. With DLC, they are more co-operative. That¨s what I¨m trying to point out

Old games they already had ported elsewhere. Free money.

Fair enough on that point

A third party company puts games on a console: "Their relationship has blossomed". What? Sorry I don't quite understand this logic.
Regardless of how good or not good relations are with a company, that doesn't mean they'll get more than one slot on this season.

If you look how the relationship was between Square prior to that, compared to now, you will know exactly what I¨m talking about And with this, I wanted to point out that it could be easier to get an FF character now, then how it was prior to Cloud in Smash 4 due to their mentality of DLC.

Cool. What does this have to do with Smash?

Se above.

But at the end of the day, fighters is all that really matters when you consider 100% of players, super hardcore and casual, are affected by what fighters are in the game. Once you start getting into stages, competitive players will often go for BF/FD versions and don't play with items on, which makes the stage, item, and AT points absolutely moot. Songs are nice and all too, but they simply don't compare to a playable fighter. You shouldn't have to look at anything besides fighters to know Fire Emblem is extremely overrepresented, and it makes it so much worse when a lot of them play very similarly (3 are virtually identical to one another, 1 is different, but then has an echo that mirrors him and the 3 that are identical, all have swords as primary weapons, etc). We know that you love FE, but it really doesn't need you to defend it.

First, of all, I wasn¨t trying to defend Fire Emblem here, I was only trying to give an example of the mindset that Sakurai seems to go with, even if it's not the most popular way, and compare and contrast the difference between Zelda and Fire Emblems representation was a good way of doing so. I don¨t need to go into detail on how the Fire Emblem fanbase (myself included) hates the way the series is representative in Smash then the Smash base, but whatever.

But even with "they only care with fighters in mind"... No offense to Mega Man, but do they really have any character outside of Zero that people are really pushing? And I highly doubt Zero would get in over the likes of Dante, or if we are talking already representative Capcom franchises, we have Street Fighter, and Zero getting in over the likes of Chun-Li? Can¨t see that for the life of me. Dante and Chun-Li (as far as I know) are way more requested. Sonic has Eggman to his benefits though unless they want to break the AT rule with Shadow (who could fit with the whole "fairness mentality" that Fatman has talked about)

 

[Spatulo]

I would have generally agreed with you if it were not for a simple fact. Sepiroth is one of the major poster-boys when it comes to iconic villains. You knew of him even if you haven¨t played Final Fantasy back in the day. Hell, you know of Aeri's death even if you haven¨t played nor heard of the series. Had the only iconic character been Cloud from the series.. then yes I would be with you..

And about the Sonic and Mega Man part... yeah, they have only one character (and quite frankly, I think Sonic deserves at least one more) but compare and contrast their representation.... Mega Man and Sonic would still end up with more representation in general, even if they have only 1 fighter each, they would still be more representative then what Final Fantasy is. In comparison. Fire Emblem might have 8 characters and Legend of Zelda has 6.. But taking the number of songs, assist theories, stages and items, Legend of Zelda beats Fire Emblem by a long shot, especially concidering the only thing Fire Emblem have in item supply is a killing edge and three assists trophies.

The two most iconic game villains not currently playable are Eggman and Sephiroth, change my mind

Legit, after those two I don’t think much of anyone comes close

 

[Megadoomer]

The two most iconic game villains not currently playable are Eggman and Sephiroth, change my mind

Legit, after those two I don’t think much of anyone comes close

I'd say that Heihachi's up there - I'm not exactly familiar with Tekken lore, but a good case could be made for him being the villain of the series. (I've only played Tekken 2, 7, and Tag Tournament 2, but it seems like him and Kazuya are competing for the position)

 

[Spatulo]

I'd say that Heihachi's up there - I'm not exactly familiar with Tekken lore, but a good case could be made for him being the villain of the series. (I've only played Tekken 2, 7, and Tag Tournament 2, but it seems like him and Kazuya are competing for the position)

My experience is similarly limited (having played 6, TT2, and seeing the characters in Project X Zone) but yeah that seems like a fair assessment. And then you’ve got guys like M Bison (who would be sick in Smash btw) and Shao Khan, fighting games are iconic for their characters after all so the main villains of those games are of course iconic. But even then I’d say these guys are at least one tier down from Ivo and Sephy.

 

[Polarthief]

Super Smash Bros Ultimate is the first game to ever have any Square Enix content in a non-square Enix game.

That doesn't prove anything about Square's stinginess (or contrary to it) though.

With DLC, they are more co-operative. That¨s what I¨m trying to point out

In what way? You have a Square character and an Enix character. The sample size is way too small and both characters were newcomers in DLC at some point, so that's hardly a relevant comparison.

If you look how the relationship was between Square prior to that, compared to now, you will know exactly what I¨m talking about And with this, I wanted to point out that it could be easier to get an FF character now, then how it was prior to Cloud in Smash 4 due to their mentality of DLC.

Their relationship couldn't have been that bad.

I was only trying to give an example of the mindset that Sakurai seems to go with, even if it's not the most popular way, and compare and contrast the difference between Zelda and Fire Emblems representation was a good way of doing so. I don¨t need to go into detail on how the Fire Emblem fanbase (myself included) hates the way the series is representative in Smash then the Smash base, but whatever.

My point was saying Zelda beats out Fire Emblem "by a long shot" isn't really fair when FE has 2 extra characters and is a ridiculously smaller franchise. Zelda is big everywhere; FE mostly known outside of Japan via Smash. Hell it was *literally* only via Smash that the West even knew FE existed back in the Gamecube era. Zelda's also been in the West since the start, as well as in Smash since 64. My point was it should be beating FE in *every* way, especially when it does have enough characters that could easily fill those empty spots to catch up. Every new FE game seems to just slap the protag-that-always-has-a-damn-sword on every newest Smash game.
Also for the record: I say this as a Fire Emblem fan. Not a total "must flip out at the fact that FE:H got some new characters" fan (jesus christ, my friend has his college buddies that weeb'd out over characters getting added to FE:H and I do not understand it), but a more casual fan of the series.

But even with "they only care with fighters in mind"... No offense to Mega Man, but do they really have any character outside of Zero that people are really pushing? And I highly doubt Zero would get in over the likes of Dante, or if we are talking already representative Capcom franchises, we have Street Fighter, and Zero getting in over the likes of Chun-Li? Can¨t see that for the life of me. Dante and Chun-Li (as far as I know) are way more requested. Sonic has Eggman to his benefits though unless they want to break the AT rule with Shadow (who could fit with the whole "fairness mentality" that Fatman has talked about)

That's a lot of third parties that I also wasn't talking about to begin with. I just think that third parties shouldn't hog slots when other franchises could get in instead. Capcom has tons of other games, as does Sega. Square sure loves to forget they made more than 1 game (FF7).

Edit: Like hell, if they aren't gonna go with Geno, at least go with another franchise, or even another FF game over THE SAME GAME.

The two most iconic game villains not currently playable are Eggman and Sephiroth, change my mind

That "not currently playable" part is very, very important. That said, Blue's pretty iconic to us 90s kids boomers, if you count rivals, or rather any antagonist as "villains".

TBH though Sephiroth is only "iconic" because of the massive overpraise and bandwagoning FF7 gets. Ffs he was in ONE GAME, and then started appearing in other games because that game just exploded both in the company and the fans. Robotnik's at least been in pretty much every Sonic game.

 

[Spatulo]

That "not currently playable" part is very, very important. That said, Blue's pretty iconic to us 90s kids boomers, if you count rivals, or rather any antagonist as "villains".

TBH though Sephiroth is only "iconic" because of the massive overpraise and bandwagoning FF7 gets. Ffs he was in ONE GAME, and then started appearing in other games because that game just exploded both in the company and the fans. Robotnik's at least been in pretty much every Sonic game.

Y’know, it’s really funny cause I was READY for someone to say Dr Wily, cause then I would’ve followed up with how he splits that duty with Blues (who is more of a rival like you said), Bass, and arguably Zero (rival again) and Sigma.

I can see the anti-love you’ve got for FF7 so I won’t press the point too much, but even if you see it as over hyped you can’t argue it isn’t popular. And yeah, Robotnik is in a higher percentage of Sonic games than Bowser is of Mario games (I think), it’s kinda nuts.

 

[Polarthief]

Y’know, it’s really funny cause I was READY for someone to say Dr Wily, cause then I would’ve followed up with how he splits that duty with Blues (who is more of a rival like you said), Bass, and arguably Zero (rival again) and Sigma.

I was thinking Wily but I wasn't gonna say it.

I can see the anti-love you’ve got for FF7 so I won’t press the point too much, but even if you see it as over hyped you can’t argue it isn’t popular.

Oh I know I'm a total **** when it comes to FF7 (even though I am interested in the remake when it's finally on PC), and I wasn't denying it's not popular. I just don't think "iconic" and "popular" are necessarily the same thing, and in today's day and age, I do question Sephiroth's "iconic" status.

And yeah, Robotnik is in a higher percentage of Sonic games than Bowser is of Mario games (I think), it’s kinda nuts.

Also to an outsider, Robotnik wins the "not yet playable" antagonist by far. Robotnik/Eggman's a weirdo scientist with a crazy neat mustache who turns animals into robots. That's ridiculous and awesome. Sephiroth is "mysterious dude with comically long sword", and while we didn't have too many of those back on the PS1, that has been hilariously overplayed by now which does retroactively make his "iconic" status a lot weaker, at least to me/outsiders. Also just to add Bowser in, to an outsider, he's a big turtle/dragon/Koopa/ox(???) that likes kidnapping one specific princess and sometimes other important people/objects when he feels like it. He's iconic in appearance (same with Robotnik), but not much else.

 

[Shinuto]

Here's what I think the prediction rumor whatever fatman posted means

Min Min
Geno
Shantae
KOS-MOS
Phoenix Wright
Steve

 

[SSGuy]

Here's what I think the prediction rumor whatever fatman posted means

Min Min
Geno
Shantae
KOS-MOS
Phoenix Wright
Steve

My list is close, I absolutely think we are getting Min Min if you piece together the Bayonetta Texture bug and apply it to the fact that Min Min's Arm changes model when powering up in ARMS. Give her an Option Mix Up Side Special similar to Zero Suit Samus' Down Special and you have yourself an ARMS character.

I actually think Geno is going to happen to with Phoenix Wright coming in as the Capcom character. However, I think Lloyd is coming in as a Namco's character over KOS-MOS. Crash is a possibility too. Although I think Min Min and Geno are the only two safe guesses I have and I like the characters enough to go down with the ship in case I am wrong. I won't be ashamed for being incorrect. Disappointed if it isn't Geno, but it won't be because I guessed him incorrectly.

So I'm going to just throw out my FP prediction being:

Min Min
Geno
Crash Bandicoot
Phoenix Wright
Lloyd Irving
& Rex

 

[Deleted member]

Min Min
Geno
Crash
Tekken
Dante
Sword and Shield Pokemon

 

[pinshadow]

New Spirit Event, Trials of Mana!

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Square? Letting Stuff in Smash? For FREE? What dimension are we living in?

 

[MrJudd]

New Spirit Event, Trials of Mana!

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Square? Letting Stuff in Smash? For FREE? What dimension are we living in?

The dimension where Nintendo just drops megaton reveals out of nowhere with no announcement lol. +1 to the evidence pile.

 

[Fatmanonice]

New Spirit Event, Trials of Mana!

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Square? Letting Stuff in Smash? For FREE? What dimension are we living in?

I was going to make the argument that there's a very real possibility of a FF7R spirit event eventually in tangent to the Sephiroth debate but I guess I don't have to now.

 

[Powerman293]

The dimension where Nintendo just drops megaton reveals out of nowhere with no announcement lol. +1 to the evidence pile.

But are Square Enix that stingy though with Mana stuff?

 

[andree123]

New Spirit Event, Trials of Mana!

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Square? Letting Stuff in Smash? For FREE? What dimension are we living in?

I am thinking that leads into a Geno Mii costume and a chocobo mii hat returning in the arms character update.

Because Resident Evil had a spirit event and later on the last two missing mega man mii costumes returned in the update that released Byleth into the game.

 

[Megadoomer]

The dimension where Nintendo just drops megaton reveals out of nowhere with no announcement lol. +1 to the evidence pile.

They've been making spirit event announcements or tournament announcements every Tuesday on that account, actually.

Still, kind of crazy that Trials of Mana has more spirits than Final Fantasy VII.

 

[Lagguino]

New Spirit Event, Trials of Mana!

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Square? Letting Stuff in Smash? For FREE? What dimension are we living in?

R.i.p my 4th square option. Also im not sure if this will work well or work against geno.

 

[Deleted member]

I am thinking that leads into a Geno Mii costume and a chocobo mii hat returning in the arms character update.

Because Resident Evil had a spirit event and later on the last two missing mega man mii costumes returned in the update that released Byleth into the game.

I don’t think that really means anything... also I doubt the costumes will comeback with a non Square character. If it’s possible, why didn’t they release the costumes in pack 1 especially with Hero or Byleth?

 

[SpiritOfRuin]

Out of curiosity, would you guys buy a Mii costume of a character who got promoted? Personally, I would buy Geno's because I absolutely want to support him as much as possible and I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is for him. But for other characters like Llyod or Heihachi I just don't see myself buying those if they were to become playable but I suppose it would still make sense for them to do that since fans of those characters might feel the same as I do about Geno.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Out of curiosity, would you guys buy a Mii costume of a character who got promoted? Personally, I would buy Geno's because I absolutely want to support him as much as possible and I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is for him. But for other characters like Llyod or Heihachi I just don't see myself buying those if they were to become playable but I suppose it would still make sense for them to do that since fans of those characters might feel the same as I do about Geno.

Of course. I want it all.

No exceptions. I'm a completionist.

 

[MattX20]

Trials of Mana eh? Well, it certainly indicates properties beyond FF and DQ are okay for spirit board events, and does seem to help Geno's chances

 

[cosmicB]

I don’t think that really means anything... also I doubt the costumes will comeback with a non Square character. If it’s possible, why didn’t they release the costumes in pack 1 especially with Hero or Byleth?

I think a lot of people kind of extrapolate a certain meaning from the mii costume number discrepancy with Hero when they have little context over how Armor Project operates and other factors with the DQ higher-ups. For example, I can 100% buy that Sugiyama flat out told Nintendo "only Dragon Quest in the presentation or I'm not letting you use my music!" I'm not saying that definitely happened, but it's a possibility few consider when it's just as believable as "other costumes were held back".

 

[AceAttorney9000]

So here's a fun little game. Let's say that, for Geno's DLC pack, the developers decide to go ham again and manage to include 50 music tracks again, just like they did with Terry and SNK music. The music will be a mix of tracks from Mario RPG games (Super Mario RPG, Paper Mario, and Mario & Luigi) and Square Enix games (Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Bravely Default, Octopath Traveler, etc... and since I know that "Square Enix is stingy" will be brought up, just pretend for this game that the developers managed to get through the necessary hoops for all of these).

Which 50 music tracks would you want included with Geno? Here's my personal choices...

1. Happy Adventure, Delightful Adventure (Super Mario RPG)
2. Fight Against Monsters (Super Mario RPG)
3. Fight Against a Somewhat Stronger Monster (Super Mario RPG)
4. Fight Against an Armed Boss (Super Mario RPG)
5. Beware the Forest's Mushrooms (Super Mario RPG)
6. Let's Go Down the Wine River (Super Mario RPG)
7. Docaty Mountain Railroad (Super Mario RPG)
8. Slope (Super Mario RPG)
9. Fight Against Smithy (Super Mario RPG)
10. Fight Against Smithy, Who Likes Transforming (Super Mario RPG)
11. Battle (Paper Mario)
12. Attack of the Koopa Bros. (Paper Mario)
13. Keeping Pace (Paper Mario)
14. Huffin' And Puffin' (Paper Mario)
15. Freeze! (Paper Mario)
16. King of the Koopas (Paper Mario)
17. Battle (Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door)
18. Event Battle (Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door)
19. Magnus von Grapple Battle (Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door)
20. Rawk Hawk Battle (Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door)
21. Macho Grubba Battle (Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door)
22. Doopliss Battle (Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door)
23. Cortez Battle (Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door)
24. Grodus Battle (Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door)
25. Shadow Peach Battle (Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door)
26. Come On! (Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga)
27. Come On, Again! (Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga)
28. Rookie and Popple (Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga)
29. The Final Stage (Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga)
30. The Last Cackletta (Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga)
31. Battle (Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time)
32. Boss Battle (Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time)
33. Bowser Battle (Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time)
34. Final Battle (Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time)
35. Battle (Final Fantasy I)
36. Last Battle (Final Fantasy I)
37. Battle (Final Fantasy IV)
38. Boss Battle / Fight Against Culex (Final Fantasy IV / Super Mario RPG)
39. Battle (Final Fantasy VI)
40. The Decisive Battle (Final Fantasy VI)
41. One Winged Angel (Final Fantasy VII)
42. A Monster Draws Near (Dragon Quest I)
43. Demon Attack (Dragon Quest II)
44. Gypsy Dance (Dragon Quest IV)
45. Monsters (Dragon Quest V)
46. Battle I (Octopath Traveler)
47. Decisive Battle I (Octopath Traveler)
48. Battle II (Octopath Traveler)
49. Decisive Battle II (Octopath Traveler)
50. Battle III (Octopath Traveler)

 

[Sigran101]

People often ask me why I've sided with my predictions and a lot of it has to do with rumors supporting representation of certain companies more so than just characters. For example, there was a lot of evidence supporting Nintendo getting a pack focusing on itself, specifically first party, and why I pulled the lever for Waluigi. As a recap, my predictions company wise have been since Mid January: Nintendo, Square, "Western", Namco, Capcom, and Microsoft. From there I filled things in with my personal predictions for each category: Waluigi, Geno, Crash, Lloyd, Dante, and Master Chief. Let me go into each one:

-Nintendo: this one is the most interesting. My theory about Nintendo not only starting with itself but also being first party was correct. This was backed up by a number of things like the Amiibo rerelease leak, the fact that 6 was such a boondoggle to figure out, how coincidentally the only rumored Nintendo Mii costumes were specifically tied to first party franchises, etc. Following Power of Six, Nintendo has the least rumored when it comes to Mii costumes which is very interesting because Square and Namco, for example, arguably have a full six. 6's content is being kept very heavy underwraps so I'm interested in what all they have planned.

On the topic of Nintendo, one idea that's been around since December but seems to be getting traction is that Season 2 is probably going to have multiple Nintendo characters but not necessarily multiple Nintendo packs. This is yet another reason why I went with Waluigi. In my opinion, if Nintendo was going to add one final first party character to Ultimate, it would be Waluigi. He also fit the descriptor for how people were describing Pack 6 before it was even announced. I talked about it a long time ago but for the longest time it was hotly debated if 6 was going to be a full pack or a standalone character. As time has gone on, I look back on this confusion and it's ba reason why I entertain the idea of bonus characters. I've always been of the mind that if he did get "bonuses", they would be first and second party and I still think this is a credible line of thought.

-Square: Again, all the rumored stuff is coincidentally specifically on the Square side of Square Enix. 5 Mii costumes that are very probable and the long floating question of Sephiroth paints a pretty complete picture.

-"Western": This one is interesting because, Western wise, Indies seem to have more backing than major Western companies themselves. Of rumored Western company Mii costumes, Activision/Blizzard has two that are questionable but then you could arguably count Western Indies on two hands. There's also the fact that Activision is comically bad at keeping secrets so them leaking that they're going to be in Smash is kind of their MO.

-Namco: 6 rumored Mii costumes from 6 different series. That's a hell of a coincidence. This is why I support the idea that the Namco rep is going to be like Terry and SNK and come with a ****ton of Namco content.

-Capcom: 3 heavily supported Mii costumes, 1 Mii costume that's questionable but probably going to happen, and a long history of accidentally leaking major announcements well in advance.

-Microsoft: At least 2 Mii costumes heavily associated with Microsoft and as many as three others that are rumored but questionable. There's a ton of evidence that Microsoft is very, very serious with improving its relationship with Nintendo basically to spite Sony and try to actually have a market in Asian countries. Based on recent history and several long-standing rumors, I'm pretty confident that Smash is part of this equation.

I'm with you on a lot of this, but I feel like I haven't heard you mention Rayman for the "western" character and evidence is starting to pile up for him. Between the Ubisoft Mii costumes with the mascot of the company who's already in base game as a spirit nowhere to be seen, the Ubisoft survey that came out just recently where the questions relating to smash Bros. got suspiciously removed after 24 hours, and now the new Rayman trademark update like what happened with Banjo.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Out of curiosity, would you guys buy a Mii costume of a character who got promoted? Personally, I would buy Geno's because I absolutely want to support him as much as possible and I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is for him. But for other characters like Llyod or Heihachi I just don't see myself buying those if they were to become playable but I suppose it would still make sense for them to do that since fans of those characters might feel the same as I do about Geno.

Yes if only because I think certain combinations would be funny. Plus, I want to get the Geno hat if only as a souvenir of the speculation cycle here. I really appreciate the Geno hat meme.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Out of curiosity, would you guys buy a Mii costume of a character who got promoted? Personally, I would buy Geno's because I absolutely want to support him as much as possible and I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is for him. But for other characters like Llyod or Heihachi I just don't see myself buying those if they were to become playable but I suppose it would still make sense for them to do that since fans of those characters might feel the same as I do about Geno.

I would definitely get the Geno costume even if Geno is a full fighter.

plus I think I still have enough gold points to get it for free anyway.

 

[UberPyro64]

My one problem with Fatmanonice 's prediction is that it lacks Ryu Hayabusa. Honestly, I'd be super surprised if he didn't get in.
https://gonintendo.com/stories/3578...r-collaborations-with-nintendo-have-been-impo
With how cozy Koei Tecmo has been with Nintendo lately and comments like these, it would seem baffling if someone wasn't added to Smash. And it would be equally baffling if it wasn't Ryu Hayabusa.

The rest sounds very likely. Crash, Dante, Geno, Lloyd, Master Chief. All logical picks, but one of them is getting the boot. I'd bet Lloyd personally.

 

[Lord Woomy]

Can't wait to see how the Trial of Mana spirits actually just deconfirm Geno again because the Smash community is nothing if not infuriatingly predictable.

 

[Spatulo]

New Spirit Event, Trials of Mana!

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Square? Letting Stuff in Smash? For FREE? What dimension are we living in?

FREE SQUARE ENIX SPIRITS

DISCARD YOUR HANDS AND DRAW, PEOPLE

THE GAME

HAS

CHANGED

 

[Icewolff92]

In what way? You have a Square character and an Enix character. The sample size is way too small and both characters were newcomers in DLC at some point, so that's hardly a relevant comparison.

I thought the fact that Ultimate is the only game that has Square stuff in the base game (and Cloud is said to be the toughest one to get back) should prove enough. Especially when you take how many SQ characters roam around as DLC for others IP, with one of them isn¨t even in an IP they have created themself (2B)

Also to an outsider, Robotnik wins the "not yet playable" antagonist by far. Robotnik/Eggman's a weirdo scientist with a crazy neat mustache who turns animals into robots. That's ridiculous and awesome. Sephiroth is "mysterious dude with comically long sword", and while we didn't have too many of those back on the PS1, that has been hilariously overplayed by now which does retroactively make his "iconic" status a lot weaker, at least to me/outsiders. Also just to add Bowser in, to an outsider, he's a big turtle/dragon/Koopa/ox(???) that likes kidnapping one specific princess and sometimes other important people/objects when he feels like it. He's iconic in appearance (same with Robotnik), but not much else.

Sorry, but calling Sepiroth less iconic due to "bad guy with a sword" in today's day and age I feel is pretty silly, concidering the status that FF7 has had over gaming, and as I said before, you knew who he was, or the Aerith death, etc for that matter, even if you haven¨t played the game. Are people more exposed to Robotnik and Bowser? Of course, we are, and I¨m foolish enough to say otherwise. But if FF7 was not such a big deal within videogames, then Cloud would not have gotten a fraction of the reaction he got back in Smash4. And Sepiroth is one of the reasons of what made that game such a big deal.

I will go so far to say that, if we are getting another Sword Fighter, the only one that would get good reception overall, it's Sepiroth (sorry Trials of fans...)

Their relationship couldn't have been that bad.

I shall be honest with you... I have either forgotten a lot of these games or totally missed them (shames in the corner). Then again, with everything that has gone on recently, my guess is on the former.

Edit: Like hell, if they aren't gonna go with Geno, at least go with another franchise or even another FF game over THE SAME GAME.

Both you and I know that if there will be another FF character, there will be from FF7. Especially now with the FF7R released. And if not Sepiroth, it is Tifa.
And like I said before. There is nothing to say that Geno stops Sepiroth or vice versa. Weirder **** has happened.

I was going to make the argument that there's a very real possibility of a FF7R spirit event eventually in tangent to the Sephiroth debate but I guess I don't have to now.

Maybe there is hope for both after all. Especially since Mana is from the Soft section of the company Dragon Quest is Enix, Final Fantasy is from Soft side you know. And by that I mean, if they manage to get free spirits from the Square Soft part that people argue is the most notorious part of the company... Who is to say that Nintendo won¨t be able to grab 2 if they really want

Out of curiosity, would you guys buy a Mii costume of a character who got promoted? Personally, I would buy Geno's because I absolutely want to support him as much as possible and I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is for him. But for other characters like Llyod or Heihachi I just don't see myself buying those if they were to become playable but I suppose it would still make sense for them to do that since fans of those characters might feel the same as I do about Geno.

I buy every costume for the same reason I buy all the characters. It annoys me if I don¨t have the game "complete

 

[QQS]

I don’t know if this has been posted so here it is. Probably my favorite Geno render up to date. This is porn to my eyes. Cant wait to see the true Ultimate Geno model as, hopefully, character #77 in June after the Arms reveal (#76). My faith is intact, for all the reasons and theories exposed and everything we know, for me Geno is 100% in as a playable character. Don’t blame me for my confidence or my optimism, I can believe what I want and I’m pretty sure he will be playable somewhere in the FP2. It all adds up, its too much facts and time in his favor.

Credits to all the people mentioned by Flambo237 on Twitter and all the creators of the design.

GENO AWAKENS!