Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Polarthief]

General directs, at least in recent memory, have pretty much always been announced the day before. Game specific directs tend to vary though.

Huh. Guess we'll know tomorrow then.
(My point still stands on Mandy. That's far from a "direct hint" even if it did point to the 212 area code)

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Then I mean this in the nicest way possible: Why are you a regular here in the Geno support thread?

because supporting people who want a character even I dont want is something I do. I may not want him, but i can support you all. if that isnt allowed, then Ill leave

 

[Fatmanonice]

I was pretty hyped for everyone minus Isabelle and Banjo

First of all:

Second of all:

Polarthief Yes, I think the release schedule will be quicker than originally thought. The super vague December 2021 deadline honestly struck me as a giveaway to this because dragging out any kind of project is wasted money and resources. If Season 2 really was greenlit last July, there's absolutely no reason for it to be dragged out 2 1/2 years. Like I said the other week, it's still asses in chairs and utilities Nintendo has to pay for whether a project takes 6 months or 6 years to complete and you can bet they want to put a bow on things as quickly as they can even while producing a quality product.

 

[Lord Woomy]

Huh. Guess we'll know tomorrow then.
(My point still stands on Mandy. That's far from a "direct hint" even if it did point to the 212 area code)

Oh yeah, I agree, Mandy is beyond full of it. It's just like whenever some random 4chan leak gets the next character right and people treat it like gospel until it's proven wrong. Mandy's like that but with even less reason to believe them due to the Twitter trick.

 

[waterhasataste]

Has there been an announcement on Tuesday for a Wednesday direct? That seems like not enough time. I haven't been following Directs for a long time (only a few years) so I don't know but pretty much all of them (in those few years) have been usually 2 days in advance (Tuesday Announcement for a Thursday Direct), sometimes a few more.



Then I mean this in the nicest way possible: Why are you a regular here in the Geno support thread?

Yeah, they usually are. The last direct was on September 4th and announced on September 3rd. Interestingly, the last Direct was also on a Wednesday, which is when 2/12 is

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

tbh, I forgot all about this so called Direct pf. Its been rumored time and time and time again but so called insiders but nothing has even proved any of them right

 

[TooManyToastahs]

because supporting people who want a character even I dont want is something I do. I may not want him, but i can support you all. if that isnt allowed, then Ill leave

Like hell we wouldn’t allow that, you’re a valued member of this thread. Just being nice and adding to the conversation is more than enough to make you welcome here in my book

 

[Polarthief]

Yes, I think the release schedule will be quicker than originally thought. The super vague December 2021 deadline honestly struck me as a giveaway to this because dragging out any kind of project is wasted money and resources. If Season 2 really was greenlit last July, there's absolutely no reason for it to be dragged out 2 1/2 years. Like I said the other week, it's still asses in chairs and utilities Nintendo has to pay for whether a project takes 6 months or 6 years to complete and you can bet they want to put a bow on things as quickly as they can even while producing a quality product.

Assume all the DLC is completed (not released/revealed) by E3 2021, maybe even December 2020. You can record the videos and post the reveals/directs/etc as you wish, while not having to continue paying for the project, since it's already done. Then you can put more money into FP3 if that's what's going to be made next, or not if DLC is done.

Or it could just be a lot faster, who knows. If they can push out 6 characters like that and move onto an FP3, that would make them truckloads of money since they're getting 50% of the game's base cost for this FP, and another 6-character FP3 would be another $30 per FP-buyer in their pockets.

Yeah, they usually are. The last direct was on September 4th and announced on September 3rd. Interestingly, the last Direct was also on a Wednesday, which is when 2/12 is

Well awesome then. The sooner this direct is, the sooner I can stop freaking out over info drought. I JUST WANNA KNOW ALREADY

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Like hell we wouldn’t allow that, you’re a valued member of this thread. Just being nice and adding to the conversation is more than enough to make you welcome here in my book

I know ai may talk rough about this place once in a while, But hopefully you get your character and if not as a fighter, as a Mii costume because thats better then nothing. Id kill for a layton costume if he wasnt gonna be a fighter ( though thats not happening either)

TLDR, I wish you all the best

 

[Luxent]

Has the caco/mallow video ever been debunked? I havent been keeping up with smash DLC speculation.

Also, I feel like if Geno WAS included, he would be the last one shown, as he is *THE* last one that fans have been rabidly requesting for a long time.
It was always King K Rool, Ridley, and Geno. Only Geno waits in the wings.

Some other characters have REALLY picked up movement, like Shantae, Elma, etc, but some other fan support has died, like Bandana Dee.

 

[ForsakenM]

What's the math look like?
We just got Byleth.
We're gonna average about three characters a year.
Assuming they'll be spread out some what evenly.
If we get one April/ May. then another at E3 in June.
Seems kinda close together and dense.
They could but do it, but Idk if it seems likely.
Maybe it does make sense, I haven't put thought into it.
Typing off the fly.

Gonna kill two things for you today, internet person who's name and pfp share two things I love in life. These are both arguments I've defeated with facts and logic before, and I would appreciate if people remember this much like how I did with CacoMallow being alive and well regardless of Doomguy's status so that I have to stop repeating it.

1. It's much more likely that the 2021 window is more for freedom and lack of an more thought out and realizable date. While it is completely possible that DLC can be spread out that long (just look at Mortal Kombat 11, the game that is mostly forgotten by everyone, including by EVO) it's not recommended to do so as having a steady stream of new content keeps players engaged as opposed to moving onto a new game and caring less about the new content (again, MK11 is a good example of this). When you add in how crazy they have been in terms of having characters and their content ready very quickly (my original theory that they were ahead of schedule because we were getting more DLC, proven correct) and how it's likely that they already have a lot of content coming in FP Vol 2 already done or 95% done (Sakurai himself said Fighter #6 is ready to go) it points to either having more wiggle room for MORE content that is already in the planning or semi-production stage (like a possible FP Vol 3 or just bonus characters and content with them that isn't tied to a pass) or more wiggle room in case they decide to do more content later rather than they just need more time, but it could entirely be possible that they just want more time to rest or need that much more time due to having an additional character...but that is much less likely due to the reasons I mentioned above. For a little more ammunition for the opposing side, leading with how all the characters in the first FP were clearly all finished before February 2020 and yet they waited to release the last one in January 2020 just before their deadline and that they could stick to the deadline regardless of the amount of content delivered.
2. I see in your predictions, you have Geno listed as a Premium Mii Costume and frankly, I'm tired of people pushing the narrative that this can happen. Even big name Geno fans like papagenos are giving more thought to this than needed, so let me hopefully nip this in the bud for any Geno fans currently in speculation circles: Geno being a Premium Mii Costume has a lowest chance of happening in any event related to Geno, including that we get nothing new and we only have his Spirit and Icon. Yes, Geno being playable as a brand new character, his old costume returning instead, or getting nothing else in regards to him are all much more likely than getting a Premium Costume with a music track. Why? Because of Square's nature, Sakurai's intent, and Yoko's ties to Smash.
   1. Square Enix by nature is a company that is VERY protective of their IPs and more often than not offers very little bang for their buck. There are many signs of proof of this all over and a known fact. Nintendo already has permission to Geno's likeness which would likely include the old costume as if that costume were to return that is something they would take care of in advance. If Square owns the rights to SMRPG music that isn't owned by Nintendo or another composer outside of Yoko (which is entirely likely as Yoko worked for Square from between 1993 and 2002), what sense does it make for Square to make 75 cents on a costume that is no updated to look better than the last one AND comes with a music track when they could just make the same amount of money on the OLD costume and NO music track? They already are making a lot of money with Smash Ultimate and the Premium Costumes thus far are all from smaller developers who can use both the money and representation, but Square doesn't. In fact, they would make MORE money by Geno being a playable character, so if they were to negotiate for ANY changes, why a Premium Costume with music that makes less money than a full-blown character with a stage, a bit more music, a Classic Run and Spirit Board that would make them WAAAAAAY more money AND would put them in good terms of both more representation ("Daddy Sakurai loves me best!") and with the fans who have been dying for the character for years?
   2. Sakurai has the intent to include Geno and that intent has not changed as far as we know. There interview statements as well as statements in directs in which Sakurai wants to include more fan favorite picks, and when you look at the line-up we have already, not only do we have proof of this but also we are running low on low-time requests and Geno is one of them. There is also a statement in which Sakurai admitted that Geno would be great for Smash, which means Sakurai considers the character unique and fun, things that are important for character moving forward in Ultimate DLC. Sakurai has wanted to include the character as far back as Brawl but has been unable to, meaning that doing so would fulfill a long-time goal for both him and the fandom. Sakurai has admitted that there are too many similar characters, such as swordfighters as well as Fire Emblem representation, and Geno is far removed from all of those things. Sakurai admitted that he looks for games with a legacy of between at least to some degree in a recent article, and SMRPG lines up with that perfect as it is over 20 years old while still being loved and remembered and producing Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi in it's wake. As long as Sakurai's intent doesn't drastically change, it would make no sense for Sakurai to have his team go the extra mile for just a Premium Costume for Geno.
   3. Yoko Shimomura has done arrangements for Smash since Brawl and thus has a history with the music of the series. If Yoko herself owns the rights to all her SMRPG music that wasn't already owned by Nintendo or other composers, it would be that much easier to get SMRPG music into the game and thus it would make little sense to include only a single track with a Premium Costume when you could honestly just get the music into the base game or later on with the same costume, Geno as playable or just the music in general. Since this has not happened it leads me to believe that Square owns the rights to SMRPG music aside from Nintendo and other composers. In other words, either the music is super easy to include and thus it would make little sense to only include one SMRPG track and work with Square to have a Premium Costume because they could have most of the tracks without even talking with Square, or it's more difficult to get because they have to negotiate with Square in which case why would Square make less money for more content? So, regardless of who owns the music rights, it goes against the likelihood of Geno being a Premium Costume.

There are other things like how Geno's costume should have shown up with Hero yet is still missing, how Sakurai would have negotiated for that update already due to both Geno's likeness being in the base game and talking with Square about Dragon Quest so we should have seen the costume already, how the pattern thus far is to give indie characters the best they can by having a detailed costume and their most popular music track, and how the costume is free money for Square yet even with Nintendo obviously having rights Geno's likeness the costume hasn't returned with even a dump.

Basically, there is no factual evidence that Geno would come back as a Premium Costume and the only reason people are saying that is because...

A. They are a Geno hater and don't want him playable for various reasons so they spread this **** like it's Vegamite.
B. They have been doom and gloom fear-mongered into believing this could affect Geno when there is literally no evidence.

Remember guys, there is nothing that has come out recently that has hurt either Geno or CacoMallow. Everything for Geno is either positive or neutral, and don't let doubters, naysayers and haters tell you otherwise - not because of being a dreamer or an echo chamber, but because we have facts and logic and they are ignoring them in terms of how they FEEL.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Another thing I've talked about is that getting any sort of insider info on Nintendo is really hard. Nintendo's pretty good at keeping secrets and is usually super harsh about stuff getting out. If something leaks for something like Smash Bros, it's because a third party company involved ****ed up somehow. I pointed this out the other day but this honestly happened with Smash 4 too. Rosalina, Greninja, Robin, and Lucina didn't leak and Bowser Jr and Duck Hunt only leaked because of the ESRB leak. With Ultimate's base, most of the returning previously cut characters weren't leaked and everyone but Simon in the August 2018 Direct didn't leak. That said, first party characters are historically really well protected outside of E3 announcements. This is yet another reason why I think 6 is first party because these characters are usually the best kept secrets while third is lucky to not be fumbled or leaked within days of their presentation.

 

[Dukefire]

That can vary depending on who has/knows the information regarding the precaution to avoid leaks to show up. Third party and First Party is all equal on speculation.

 

[Firox]

How'd they kill Yugioh?

I'm not sure how familiar you are with the actual card game or how long you may have played it, but long story short, they basically spent 10 years building up the speed of the game, creating new and fun ways to combine monsters (Synchro, Xyz, Contact fusion, Pendulum) and giving relevance to older decks. A few years ago, they decided to use stupid amounts of power creep to sell boosters and tins, forcing the game toward a fairly narrow meta of expensive must-have cards, and then, right as the game had hit a fever-pitch of speed, they created the new Link Monster/Zone mechanic that absolutely murdered 90% of all decks that came before by limiting players to only one extra deck monster on the field at a time unless you bought into the new Link Monster Meta. It slowed the game way down and strangled a ton of the creativity out of competitive deck building and literally wasted more of my money than I dare to admit. To be fair, pretty much ANY trading card game will eventually stagnate due to power creep since that's the sales model, but still, the method Konami used was just garbage. If you want to talk more about it, you can PM so we don't get too far off topic here.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Has the caco/mallow video ever been debunked? I havent been keeping up with smash DLC speculation.

It hasn't been. There's fair reasons to believe it's dead, though. Otherwise, "not looking great" is often a conclusion(I feel it's the most open-minded one since the evidence isn't stacked in favor of it being real).

-The large amount of time before the reveal. While not impossible for a costume to be done earlier, this casts doubt on it. To be more clear, we can't know when the costumes were started, or when they were negotiated for. We lack data. There's a lot of belief they don't take all that long to make, meaning that they're likely done last(which seems to be the implications that it's taking too long to reveal the two costumes). I'm not agreeing with this point, but I see where they're coming from.
-The tweet that talks about Doom content not going anywhere for "important" stuff. This is vague enough that it could still be a costume, but not an actual character. I don't remember the exact tweet, so I'd look it up and come to your own conclusion.
-It's impossible to replicate the exact model as is. A lot of modders have come fairly close, but this only means that it's possible to fake that level of quality, not that it outright is fake.
-The lack of any other content being shown(a DLC character with the costumes), but we already have two explanations for that; the leaker didn't want to show off anything(or couldn't because leakers sometimes only gets bits and pieces), or that it was made as a proof of concept but never went through to actually be released in the end. In the second scenario, however, this would mean it's real, but it didn't go far enough to be approved.

Basically, there's explanations for why it could be fake or real. As time goes on, even a costume made in advance starts to sound fishy to me. That's why I'm 30/70 on it myself. If somebody could re-link me the Tweet, that'd be helpful. Then I can be sure I understood it correctly. Cause the best I remember is I first misread it as "no Doom content", when it wasn't that blatant.

 

[ForsakenM]

Has the caco/mallow video ever been debunked? I havent been keeping up with smash DLC speculation.

Also, I feel like if Geno WAS included, he would be the last one shown, as he is *THE* last one that fans have been rabidly requesting for a long time.
It was always King K Rool, Ridley, and Geno. Only Geno waits in the wings.

Some other characters have REALLY picked up movement, like Shantae, Elma, etc, but some other fan support has died, like Bandana Dee.

No, CacoMallow remains undisproven regardless of what others my tell you. Nothing has hurt the potential leak in the slightest.

Also, I don't know about Elma or BWD, but I fail to see what could boost up Shantae or any indie rep. At best they seem to be fancy costumes with music with the exception of shovel knight being an AT.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Let me just do a quick visual representation of what leaks from certain companies typically are like:

Capcom, Activision, Bethesda, Konami, Ubisoft, anything Disney touches, etc:

Nintendo, the Pokemon Company, Square Enix, etc:

 

[T2by4]

Another thing I've talked about is that getting any sort of insider info on Nintendo is really hard. Nintendo's pretty good at keeping secrets and is usually super harsh about stuff getting out. If something leaks for something like Smash Bros, it's because a third party company involved ****ed up somehow. I pointed this out the other day but this honestly happened with Smash 4 too. Rosalina, Greninja, Robin, and Lucina didn't leak and Bowser Jr and Duck Hunt only leaked because of the ESRB leak. With Ultimate's base, most of the returning previously cut characters weren't leaked and everyone but Simon in the August 2018 Direct didn't leak. That said, first party characters are historically really well protected outside of E3 announcements. This is yet another reason why I think 6 is first party because these characters are usually the best kept secrets while third is lucky to not be fumbled or leaked within days of their presentation.

Oh dang, that's actually a really good point. Although, I think K Rool was leaked either an hour or day prior. Simon was way ahead of that, but K Rool was definitely way more protected than Simon was. Hopefully Geno gets that same security. I want to be surprised.

 

[Lyncario]

I'm not sure how familiar you are with the actual card game or how long you may have played it, but long story short, they basically spent 10 years building up the speed of the game, creating new and fun ways to combine monsters (Synchro, Xyz, Contact fusion, Pendulum) and giving relevance to older decks. A few years ago, they decided to use stupid amounts of power creep to sell boosters and tins, forcing the game toward a fairly narrow meta of expensive must-have cards, and then, right as the game had hit a fever-pitch of speed, they created the new Link Monster/Zone mechanic that absolutely murdered 90% of all decks that came before by limiting players to only one extra deck monster on the field at a time unless you bought into the new Link Monster Meta. It slowed the game way down and strangled a ton of the creativity out of competitive deck building and literally wasted more of my money than I dare to admit. To be fair, pretty much ANY trading card game will eventually stagnate due to power creep since that's the sales model, but still, the method Konami used was just garbage. If you want to talk more about it, you can PM so we don't get too far off topic here.

I got good news. Konami realised that they screwed up, and decided to rework Master Rule 4. Now, Fusion, Synchro, and XYZ monsters don't need to be put into the extra monster zone anymore.

 

[Deleted member]

It hasn't been. There's fair reasons to believe it's dead, though. Otherwise, "not looking great" is often a conclusion(I feel it's the most open-minded one since the evidence isn't stacked in favor of it being real).

-The extreme amount of time before the reveal.

We need to chill with this slight misinformation. The video and images were posted on November 3/4 (depending on your timezone) and Sakurai told us that Byleth was done and the video was made ... in November. I hope it isn't the case, but there's a possibility that we may have to wait until this November to be able to put the leak to bed as fake just based on the commonly accepted timeline for fighters (10 months to 1 year). Also note that I believe the rights to use Sans were acquired in mid 2018, likely well after the base game was in final testing. It really comes down to when you think the costumes were made - if the "Mii List" didn't have Mallow and Smithy thrown in as a troll, we're still looking at potentially waiting until June/July, and while I don't believe Geno is an E3 reveal, it's convenient timing.

I also think that the statement about Smash talks leading "nowhere serious" is perfect PR jargon for "our boy got Mii costumed, hope you can accept that".

 

[Firox]

Gonna kill two things for you today, internet person who's name and pfp share two things I love in life. These are both arguments I've defeated with facts and logic before, and I would appreciate if people remember this much like how I did with CacoMallow being alive and well regardless of Doomguy's status so that I have to stop repeating it.

1. It's much more likely that the 2021 window is more for freedom and lack of an more thought out and realizable date. While it is completely possible that DLC can be spread out that long (just look at Mortal Kombat 11, the game that is mostly forgotten by everyone, including by EVO) it's not recommended to do so as having a steady stream of new content keeps players engaged as opposed to moving onto a new game and caring less about the new content (again, MK11 is a good example of this). When you add in how crazy they have been in terms of having characters and their content ready very quickly (my original theory that they were ahead of schedule because we were getting more DLC, proven correct) and how it's likely that they already have a lot of content coming in FP Vol 2 already done or 95% done (Sakurai himself said Fighter #6 is ready to go) it points to either having more wiggle room for MORE content that is already in the planning or semi-production stage (like a possible FP Vol 3 or just bonus characters and content with them that isn't tied to a pass) or more wiggle room in case they decide to do more content later rather than they just need more time, but it could entirely be possible that they just want more time to rest or need that much more time due to having an additional character...but that is much less likely due to the reasons I mentioned above. For a little more ammunition for the opposing side, leading with how all the characters in the first FP were clearly all finished before February 2020 and yet they waited to release the last one in January 2020 just before their deadline and that they could stick to the deadline regardless of the amount of content delivered.
2. I see in your predictions, you have Geno listed as a Premium Mii Costume and frankly, I'm tired of people pushing the narrative that this can happen. Even big name Geno fans like papagenos are giving more thought to this than needed, so let me hopefully nip this in the bud for any Geno fans currently in speculation circles: Geno being a Premium Mii Costume has a lowest chance of happening in any event related to Geno, including that we get nothing new and we only have his Spirit and Icon. Yes, Geno being playable as a brand new character, his old costume returning instead, or getting nothing else in regards to him are all much more likely than getting a Premium Costume with a music track. Why? Because of Square's nature, Sakurai's intent, and Yoko's ties to Smash.
   1. Square Enix by nature is a company that is VERY protective of their IPs and more often than not offers very little bang for their buck. There are many signs of proof of this all over and a known fact. Nintendo already has permission to Geno's likeness which would likely include the old costume as if that costume were to return that is something they would take care of in advance. If Square owns the rights to SMRPG music that isn't owned by Nintendo or another composer outside of Yoko (which is entirely likely as Yoko worked for Square from between 1993 and 2002), what sense does it make for Square to make 75 cents on a costume that is no updated to look better than the last one AND comes with a music track when they could just make the same amount of money on the OLD costume and NO music track? They already are making a lot of money with Smash Ultimate and the Premium Costumes thus far are all from smaller developers who can use both the money and representation, but Square doesn't. In fact, they would make MORE money by Geno being a playable character, so if they were to negotiate for ANY changes, why a Premium Costume with music that makes less money than a full-blown character with a stage, a bit more music, a Classic Run and Spirit Board that would make them WAAAAAAY more money AND would put them in good terms of both more representation ("Daddy Sakurai loves me best!") and with the fans who have been dying for the character for years?
   2. Sakurai has the intent to include Geno and that intent has not changed as far as we know. There interview statements as well as statements in directs in which Sakurai wants to include more fan favorite picks, and when you look at the line-up we have already, not only do we have proof of this but also we are running low on low-time requests and Geno is one of them. There is also a statement in which Sakurai admitted that Geno would be great for Smash, which means Sakurai considers the character unique and fun, things that are important for character moving forward in Ultimate DLC. Sakurai has wanted to include the character as far back as Brawl but has been unable to, meaning that doing so would fulfill a long-time goal for both him and the fandom. Sakurai has admitted that there are too many similar characters, such as swordfighters as well as Fire Emblem representation, and Geno is far removed from all of those things. Sakurai admitted that he looks for games with a legacy of between at least to some degree in a recent article, and SMRPG lines up with that perfect as it is over 20 years old while still being loved and remembered and producing Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi in it's wake. As long as Sakurai's intent doesn't drastically change, it would make no sense for Sakurai to have his team go the extra mile for just a Premium Costume for Geno.
   3. Yoko Shimomura has done arrangements for Smash since Brawl and thus has a history with the music of the series. If Yoko herself owns the rights to all her SMRPG music that wasn't already owned by Nintendo or other composers, it would be that much easier to get SMRPG music into the game and thus it would make little sense to include only a single track with a Premium Costume when you could honestly just get the music into the base game or later on with the same costume, Geno as playable or just the music in general. Since this has not happened it leads me to believe that Square owns the rights to SMRPG music aside from Nintendo and other composers. In other words, either the music is super easy to include and thus it would make little sense to only include one SMRPG track and work with Square to have a Premium Costume because they could have most of the tracks without even talking with Square, or it's more difficult to get because they have to negotiate with Square in which case why would Square make less money for more content? So, regardless of who owns the music rights, it goes against the likelihood of Geno being a Premium Costume.

There are other things like how Geno's costume should have shown up with Hero yet is still missing, how Sakurai would have negotiated for that update already due to both Geno's likeness being in the base game and talking with Square about Dragon Quest so we should have seen the costume already, how the pattern thus far is to give indie characters the best they can by having a detailed costume and their most popular music track, and how the costume is free money for Square yet even with Nintendo obviously having rights Geno's likeness the costume hasn't returned with even a dump.

Basically, there is no factual evidence that Geno would come back as a Premium Costume and the only reason people are saying that is because...

A. They are a Geno hater and don't want him playable for various reasons so they spread this **** like it's Vegamite.
B. They have been doom and gloom fear-mongered into believing this could affect Geno when there is literally no evidence.

Remember guys, there is nothing that has come out recently that has hurt either Geno or CacoMallow. Everything for Geno is either positive or neutral, and don't let doubters, naysayers and haters tell you otherwise - not because of being a dreamer or an echo chamber, but because we have facts and logic and they are ignoring them in terms of how they FEEL.

Right on with knocking down that premium costume. I'm fully of the belief that if Geno is getting costumed, then they'll just drop the already existing costume. Why should they care more if they have no intent of ever adding him? Or why pour more effort into a costume that will likely cost about the same as the original? It doesn't make logistical sense. That said, the lack of a costume is still a very positive sign for Geno and it's important that people don't count him out until/unless he's out.

BTW, I don't know why, but whenever I read your posts, I imagine them being said in the voice of Jason Statham. Sort of edgy, yet authoritative.

I got good news. Konami realised that they screwed up, and decided to rework Master Rule 4. Now, Fusion, Synchro, and XYZ monsters don't need to be put into the extra monster zone anymore.

Whoa, FOR REAL???!!! You mean they actually acknowledged their screw up and made the game playable again?! HALLELUJAH!!!

 

[T2by4]

It's make it or break it for Mandy tomorrow.

 

[QQS]

Dont know who made this but it was on papagenos cover video. Looks amazing! Credits to the artist please.

 

[Lord Woomy]

View attachment 261767

It's make it or break it for Mandy tomorrow.

The final dawn, 24 hours remain

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

We need to chill with this slight misinformation. The video and images were posted on November 3/4 (depending on your timezone) and Sakurai told us that Byleth was done and the video was made ... in November. I hope it isn't the case, but there's a possibility that we may have to wait until this November to be able to put the leak to bed as fake just based on the commonly accepted timeline for fighters (10 months to 1 year). Also note that I believe the rights to use Sans were acquired in mid 2018, likely well after the base game was in final testing. It really comes down to when you think the costumes were made - if the "Mii List" didn't have Mallow and Smithy thrown in as a troll, we're still looking at potentially waiting until June/July, and while I don't believe Geno is an E3 reveal, it's convenient timing.

I also think that the statement about Smash talks leading "nowhere serious" is perfect PR jargon for "our boy got Mii costumed, hope you can accept that".

Don't cherrypick it. I already noted that it slowly makes it look likely as time goes on. If you're not going to reply to the full point being made, you're vastly misinterpreting it. Yes, it's a pretty hefty amount of time right now.

It's not misinformation. The longer it goes without a reveal, the more it casts doubt on it. Extreme I can concur is not the best term, but that's actually been how people are acting(which is silly, but I'm actually quoting what people are treating like it's fully debunked). 4 months is a lot of time. While I don't think it means that much, I can't blame people for finding it more likely to be fake as time goes on. Costumes are not the same as characters either, and many believe they take a lot less time(a full character takes as little as 6 months, and that's for non-Echoes to our knowledge). Time does matter.

We don't know when the Sans costume was actually negotiated for enough for it to be a real factor, though(we just know it had to be finished by when the episode was recorded, and that's not a useful timezone otherwise. We're missing the first half of teh puzzle). So I can't take that into consideration as evidence. I'll remove the word extreme, but it's not really as off as people are making it. Basically, we lack any information on negotiations and when the costumes got started for it to be a real factor. It's understandable nobody knows what to think in this case.

Also, as I noted, I want the actual tweet, not a quick quote of part of it. That matters for a lot of people because many treat it as a death sentence. I don't, but some do. It's pretty big evidence against the leak no matter how you slice it. "Nowhere serious" can easily mean "absolutely nothing was negotiated for in the end" just as much as "we didn't mean a playable character". It's got more than one interpretation. I don't think it's PR jargon, though. It's closer to more of an NDA specific way to deny anything happened despite it did, if the leak remains true. If it somehow means we could still get Doomslayer, then it's not about jargon. It's about directly lying to not let out information(which is the point behind an NDA. Deny everything is one way to fully do so).

 

[TX-55]

My reactions:

Snake's return (Everyone is Here): (sees familiar hangar door) NO ****ING WAY!!! SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE (continues screaming)

Wolf: And Wolf's back too, HELL YEAH!!

Daisy: for real?! She's in Smash, nice. BUT WAIT! could that mean that Wa-(Gets deconfirmed immediately) What did I expect? sigh, it's okay let's move on.

Ridley: (lots of screaming) SUCK IT HATERS!!

Simon: YES YES YES, finally, It's Simon Belmont.

Richter: WHAT?!! OH MY GOD! RICHTER'S HERE!!!
(Note: Dracula X on SNES was my first Castlevania game, so this was a hype reveal for me).

Dark Samus: Oh yeah, more Metroid representation. She looks so badass.

Chrom: Wait more Fire Emblem? (Sees Chrom) oh right, people were pissed that he wasn't Smash 4, at least he's an Echo in Ultimate, good for his fans.

King K Rool: He looks AMAZING! His movement and animations looks so smooth, definitely the best looking newcomer.
(Never played DKC, was still hyped for K. Rool)

Isabelle: Uhhh, she's cool I guess, not what I had in mind though.

Ken: The leaks were real, It's Ken Masters, baby. WHAT? Ken is a unique character?!! (Best Echo in the game imo)

Incineroar: Holycrap, this guy is gonna be a lot of fun when the game comes out.
(Not big on Pokemon, but I always wanted a wrestler in Smash.)
Damn, the grinch leak is dead. (Note: I was a grinch believer).

Fighters Pass & Piranha Plant: YES YES MORE, GIVE ME MORE CHARACTERS SAKURAI!! plz.
(PP trailer plays) Huh? What's this? GASP could it be?!
Wait what, a Piranha Plant? they're related to, so this could be a gimmick for, HOLY**** IT'S WA-(Nope, just regular ol' Piranha Plant)
Are you mocking me Sakurai?!! (Can barely keep a straight face at the absurdity of the reveal)
Well, okay, we can now play as a Piranha Plant in Smash. (Laughs hysterically at the prospect of picking PP as his main).

Joker: (completely stunned) Joker is in Smash, Joker from Persona 5 is in Smash, Persona is in Sma-(I was so shocked that my brain was still processing what I just witnessed)

Hero: The leaks were real, Hero is in Smash, but that’s not Erdrick shouldn't it be-(All Heroes show up) No way! The mad man actually did it.

Banjo&Kazooie: (sees Jiggy) OH MY GOD, they actually did it, Banjo's in SMASH!!
(Banjo&Kazooie finally show up)
Heeeeey, look who is back home.
Man this is so unreal, I've got to watch the reactions for this.

Terry & Fighters Pass 2 teaser: HELL YEAH, IT'S TERRY FREAKING BOGARD!!
(Gets blown away by Terry's presentation afterwards)
50 tracks! 50 ****ing tracks!! Square we're you at?!!
(sees there's more DLC fighters on the way)
There's a chance for redemption! 2020! LET'S GOOO!!

Byleth: (sees familiar art style)
Hmmm (gives them benefit of the doubt)
(sees Byleth)
Oh no, it's Fire Emblem (laughs at the incoming ****storm)
Well okay, let's keep watching. (Impressed by Byleth's gameplay style)
Damn, they look so cool I-(sees Garreg Mach Monastery)
So MAJESTIC!!
(sees Sakurai posting Byleth's new poster while giving a sly grin at the camera)
He knew what he was doing all along (Laughs hysterically)

 

[Firox]

View attachment 261767

It's make it or break it for Mandy tomorrow.

The fact that Mandy had the proverbial nuts to actually stand their ground on this makes me a lot more confident as well.

 

[Lord Woomy]

The fact that Mandy had the proverbial nuts to actually stand their ground on this makes me a lot more confident as well.

Or they've just chosen a hill to die on

 

[Fatmanonice]

Tinfoil hat territory but several Nintendo YouTube channels are advertising the Fighter's Pass for no reason today:

https://gonintendo.com/stories/354578-super-smash-bros-ultimate-fighters-pass-european-commercial

 

[OffBi]

Tinfoil hat territory but several Nintendo YouTube channels are advertising the Fighter's Pass for no reason today:

https://gonintendo.com/stories/354578-super-smash-bros-ultimate-fighters-pass-european-commercial

Well we are obviously getting fighter 6 soon in a nintendo direct that gets announced tomorrow

 

[valkiriforce]

Yeah, it seems like a lot of people have ruled out the possibility of getting Doomguy as a costume alongside the Cacodemon Mii hat, as farfetched a scenario as that may seem. As a Doomguy supporter I'd be sad he isn't a fighter, but I'd definitely take a Doomguy costume gunner over nothing - even better though if the CacoMallow does result in a playable Geno. Getting a Cacodemon Mii hat without any kind of Doomguy costume or playable character would be really freakin' weird and seems less likely to me. I'm all for it happening though if it means Geno finally gets his chance as a full-fledged fighter.

And as I've repeatedly said before, I'm still in the middle of it being either real or faked. For the most part I feel good about it not being disproven as time goes on, but who knows. As others have mentioned it's not even all of what Geno has going for him as well, so I'd say we're in a good spot either way but I really hope it does turn out real because we need CacoMallow team-ups to become a reality.

 

[Firox]

Or they've just chosen a hill to die on

True, but how many insiders actually own their claims these days? Most are so wishy washy and gutless they'd just say "A direct is coming soon." (Direct comes two months later) "See guys, I told you it was 'soon'. What I said was true...from a certain point of view."

 

[Lord Woomy]

True, but how many insiders actually own their claims these days? Most are so wishy washy and gutless they'd just say "A direct is coming soon." (Direct comes two months later) "See guys, I told you it was 'soon'. What I said was true...from a certain point of view."

Honestly, Mandy's confidence feels like the most suspicious thing about them. A lot of insiders like to sit on their hands and not make real predictions. Mandy seems to be extremely confident in anything and everything they say. It makes me feel like it's just a ruse for attention than anything else.

 

[Firox]

Honestly, Mandy's confidence feels like the most suspicious thing about them. A lot of insiders like to sit on their hands and not make real predictions. Mandy seems to be extremely confident in anything and everything they say. It makes me feel like it's just a ruse for attention than anything else.

Well, if you're right, then look on the bright side: If Mandy's wrong, then they'll be getting ZERO attention for the rest of their online career.

 

[MattX20]

Whether you agree with Mandy or not, we shall see for certain how credible they are soon enough.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Honestly, Mandy's confidence feels like the most suspicious thing about them. A lot of insiders like to sit on their hands and not make real predictions. Mandy seems to be extremely confident in anything and everything they say. It makes me feel like it's just a ruse for attention than anything else.

I wouldn't say this is a ruse and it's actually pretty typical. For people with insider info, they usually fall into one of two camps: Vague AF or Cocky AF. I try to be somewhere in the middle so I'm only mildly insufferable most days.

(Newcomer Speculation thread is typing...)

 

[Lyncario]

Whoa, FOR REAL???!!! You mean they actually acknowledged their screw up and made the game playable again?! HALLELUJAH!!!

Yup, but what may be even more surprising is how not only was Stratos unbanned, but he's at 3! And guess what? Trishula is also at 3! And Konami hit a bunch of key cards for most of the big tier 1 decks.

Also, for going more on topic, my reaction to each reveals:

Cloud: He's back? Nice! I didn't pay for the dlc in 4, so playing him will be nice.

Snake(Everyone is Here!): Wait, isn't that... no way... Snake! Snaaaaaaaaake! Wait, everyone is here? That's amazing!

Daisy: That's nice! Since she has the same qualification as Dark Pit and Lucina, I wonder what is going to differentiate her from Peach?(lol)

Ridley: Ok, Megaman just died... and so did Mario... considering only Samus is left, it can only means one thing... (see Ridley, and start to grin) Oh, hell yeah!

Simon: Nice.

Richter: Holy crap, he looks cool.

Dark Samus: This remix is amazing! Wait, Dark Samus as an echo... Oh! I get it!

Chrom: Ok. Wait, is he a Roy or Ike echo?

K.Rool: Oh, Dedede. You and Sakurai are suc trolls. This trailer is amazing!

Isabelle: That's amazing! She's so cute!

Ken: Of course he joins as Ryu's echo. I wonder when Shadow is going to get showned?

Incineroar: He looks fun!

That's it for base roster: Wait, Shadow isn't an echo?

Fighter pass: Fice more characters? That's so cool!

The Plant: Who is it? ...Wait, it can't be... AHHAHAHAHAHAHA! SAKURAI, YOU GENIUS MADMAN, YOU DID IT!

Joker: (note: I'm European, so time zones means that I slept trough TGA) What? Joker from Persona 5? How did I slept trough that?! That's awesome!

Hero: He looks nice. (See the other heroes) Wait, really? That's so cool!

Banjo: (see the DK hut) Wait, is it...(see the jiggie)...He did it. Sakueai did it. He took a Microsoft character, and put them in Smash. Congraculations to every Banjo supporters.

Terry: O think it's going to be Terry because of the leak... Oh, that trailer is so cool! And it's indeed Terry. Nice!

Byleth: ...

Sakurai...

You madman...

You did it again...

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAAHA! SAKURAI, YOU ARE THE GREATEST MADMAN THAT EVER TOUCHED THE EARTH!

 

[Deleted member]

Well while I dont want Geno, Im mostly rooting, well not rooting but cheering for Layton (my most wanted) Ammy, Pheonix, and Sora. But I know Layton is never ever gonna happen so Ive given up hope on him a long tine ago. Honestly, Ive giving up hope on most of my wanted, helps soften the blow when they inevitablely never show up

as for Isabelle, it didnt help she was before the AC switch announcement

Nevermind

 

[ForsakenM]

Bout to head to work, but I just want to add that I hope Mandy is legit if only to expand the scene. Right now, we only have Sabi who has decided to give us basically nothing worth noting anymore and Vergeben who is so worthless the only thing he could do is give us Mii Costumes literal moments before we saw them.

If Mandy is spot-on or even super ****ing close, this is good for the community as we have a breath of fresh air.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Whether you agree with Mandy or not, we shall see for certain how credible they are soon enough.

Nailing Direct dates is one thing but, like I said earlier today, nailing Smash announcements outside of E3 is beyond ridiculously hard. That said, if Mandycan is wrong about Crash, I hope people aren't awful to him because Nintendo safeguards Smash announcements so the chances of someone being right is very small anyways a vast majority of the time. Nintendo has those under hard lock and key and you would have to have ****in' Dr. Manhattan level contacts or Library of Alexandria intel to perfectly nail those.