MisterMike
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Jul 22, 2019
- Messages
- 2,252
Arlo is a really popular YouTuber who focuses on Nintendo stuff. He's not an insider whatsoever, he just likes to speculate. People consider it a big deal that he thinks Geno's coming to the game because he's popular, and having such a big name be in support of our boy is always welcome, such as Jirard the Completionist.
Agreed. I think Arlo's a great channel and produces some pretty great videos, though if I were to give one criticism it would be how he often tries to avoid making people mad at the cost of a solid, coherent argument. For context, he made a video around the time when the Link's Awakening Switch remake was announced and used that game as a springboard for talking about opinions and the nature of debate. Badly.
While I agree with the sentiment that disagreements should remain civil and everyone is entitled to their own opinions, he seems to labor under the delusions that A) There's a difference between a disagreement, a debate, and an argument (They're all synonyms for the same thing), and B) Objective analysis is tantamount to you saying that your opinion is correct. This latter point is very common amongst people who don't believe in a separation between objective and subjective criticism, and often misses the point of a separation between the two types of criticism.
To be objective means to not be biased in your assessment or statement, often this is achieved by having a scale to base said assessments or statements off of. For example, if you say that this Boxing Glove
is red, that would be an objective statement, since we have a scale for what does and does not qualify as the color red. It's not my opinion that it's red, I don't feel that it's red. The Boxing Glove is red. On the other hand, if I were to say that this Pac-Man Head is red, that would also be an objective statement, since it was made regardless of how I feel about it's color. It's not my opinion that it's red, I don't feel that it's red. The Pac-Man Head is red. In this instance however, I am wrong. It is yellow rather than red, since we have a scale for what does and does not qualify as the color yellow and this head, in fact, meets those qualifications rather than the qualifications for being red.This may seem like a no-brainer and you may be wondering why someone would say that the Pac-Man Head is red rather than yellow, so let's use another example: Let's say you are watching a movie and you spot an inconsistency in it's plot, a "plot hole" if you will, and you express this to your friend. Your friend then proceeds to counter your claim by referring to information you yourself failed to take into account, and upon taking a moment to corroborate what they're saying you realize that they were correct, and that that detail was indeed there when you had thought it not, which means the instance you thought was a plot hole was not a plot hole.
Your assment of the scene, the plot hole you pointed out, was an objective assessment based on the information you had at the time, which wasn't your opinion.
Your friend's counterclaim regarding that scene is also objective, since it was also based on the information he had at the time, which wasn't his opinion.
And to finish off this narrative tripling, let's go with a more thread-relevant example: I've made plenty of posts about what we've heard in terms of rumors and/or potential leaks regarding Geno coming to Smash Ultimate, the most notable of which being the Mii Costume List and the CacoMallow Post. In the past, I've gotten the distinct impression based on my discussion with a certain users, who we will collectively herein refer to as "Booster" so as to not single anyone out in particular, that gives me the impression that they believe my posts to be my opinion on such matters. This is incorrect.
If I wanted to express my opinions of Geno's chances, it would boil down to a single sentence wherein I state that I feel that Geno has a good chance based on what I've heard and I feel that he's most likely coming next year. Statements like this are very simplistic and have nowhere to go in terms of a discussion, because it's just my opinion, and you are free to agree or disagree with it as you please. If Booster felt the opposite, then there's nothing I can do to make them feel how I feel, because opinions don't exactly work like that. The only one who can change Booster's opinion is Booster themselves, and whether that's because of my or anyone else's arguments is entirely out of our hands.
My posts (and no doubt the posts of several others in this thread) aim to be as impersonal as possible with regards to the information provided. My assessment of the Mii Costume List is a perfect example of my methods in action. So far it has gotten 4 out of 7 of the costumes listed correct, or to put it another way 57.143% of that post is accurate. The same person who provided those Mii Costumes also provided a list of Spirits for Terry, which was 100.0% correct. It has also been corroborated by others who have directly spoken to this individual that they have also provided accurate information in the past. Based on this, it is reasonable to state that the remaining costumes on the Mii Fighter List is most likely also real.
Building off of this, if the Mii Fighter List is entirely true then it means that the Mallow, Smithy, and Chocobo Mii Hats/Costumes will be coming to the game. The list does not mention the Geno Mii Costume that had been added to Smash 4 as DLC, which leaves us with two possibilities:
1 - The Geno Costume is returning, but it wasn't on the list.
or
2 - The Geno Costume isn't returning, and Geno is being upgraded to fighter status.
For the first point, it's not unreasonable to think that the Geno Costume simply wasn't present on the list despite also coming back, since leaks can often have an incomplete or inaccurate picture of what's to come. For example, the Sans Costume wasn't on this list despite it getting the rest of the costumes that came with Banjo correct. It's also possible that Sakurai and company could've decided to do a better job at hiding that costume specifically from leakers because they intend to give it an upgrade a la the Sans Costume. After all, that was one of the main complaints people had with the costume in Smash 4, so maybe they considered that kind of upgrade worth doing a better job at hiding it from the prying eyes of leakers?
For the second point, it's also not unreasonable to think that this is indicative of Geno being upgraded to fighter status, since if the costume was to return, it would've been mentioned alongside the returning Chocobo Hat, what with it also being an old costume and thus being very low priority in terms of secrecy, which would make it child's play for a leaker (or any leakers for that matter) to have heard of it. There's also the fact that Geno himself is very popular with regards to Smash (Hell, this thread proof enough of that, being well over 2100 pages in length), and it stands to reason that Sakurai and company are aware of the character's popularity and demand. Hell, he said as much back in a 2016 interview.
Both of these points are possible, and both of them have arguments in favor of and against them, so how would we conclude which one is more likely? Well, we just have to ask some basic questions. Let's start with the second assertion first: Why would they upgrade Geno to a fighter instead of bringing back the costume? Well, he's a popular request with regards to Smash characters and having him in as a fighter would make the costume redundant. There is a precedence for characters who were formerly used for Mii Costume being upgraded to fighter status due to their immense popularity: King K. Rool, Chrom, Inkling and Isabelle were Mii Costumes in Smash 4 who were upgraded to full-fledged fighters in Smash Ultimate. It would also fit with the the Mallow, Smithy, and Chocobo Costumes/Hats, since two of them come from the same series as Geno and the remaining one is not only owned by the same company, but is also returning from Smash 4, and so far Smash Ultimate has been doing a good job of bringing back all of the third party costumes.
Now let's do the same with the first assertion: Why would they bring back the Geno Costume rather than upgrade Geno to a playable fighter? Well, they already have the Geno Costume in-hock, so they could easily just bring it over rather than make him a fighter. But if that were the case, why bother including two more costumes/hats based on other characters from the same game? You'd think the old costume coming back would be enough, surely. And if that's the case, how did this leaker (or any leaker for that matter) not hear of it? Surely if it were an old costume, someone would've have heard of it's return.
Well, maybe the costume itself is being upgraded a la the Sans Costume, with a more intricate design, a music track to go along with it, and a couple of other Mii Costumes/Hats to further sweeten the deal. And the reason this leaker (or any other leakers for that matter) has heard about it is because they consider this upgrade so special that they went above and beyond to prevent it from getting out. First off, there's no precedence of Sakurai and company upgrading any returning costumes aside from maybe a couple of minor visual touch-ups. Second, what exactly would make the Geno Costume special enough to warrant a revamp to that degree? As far as third-party costumes go, his doesn't really stand out from the crowd such that it would be just begging to be fixed compared to the Proto Man or Tails costumes for example.
Third, even assuming that it was for some reason chosen to be upgraded, why even include the Mallow and Smithy Costumes/Hats then? You'd think the upgraded costume would be enough for people. Fourth, why bother being so much more close-to-the-chest with it compared to everything else anyways? A slightly upgraded version of a returning costume isn't all that exciting, no matter who it is. Fifth, if they're going this far with it to keep this new costume so far under wraps that no leaker or insider has heard of it, why not do this kind of thing with everything, completely preventing any and all leaks forever?
Sixth, if the Geno Costume is coming back (whether slightly upgraded or not) alongside a Mallow and Smithy Costume/Hat, then who would they release alongside? With the sole exception of the Rex Costume which was a Fighter Pass preorder bonus, Mii Fighter Costumes have thus far been released in waves alongside the release of a new fighter, and so far we've never gotten more than 2 costumes from a series unrelated to the fighter's series of origin (Except for Banjo, who came with no costumes from his own series, but still only got a maximum of two costumes from an unrelated series.).
What this means is that the character who comes with the Geno, Mallow, Smithy and Chocobo Costumes/Hats has to come from SMRPG, but with all of the demand for Geno as a fighter, do you really think it's anywhere near likely that someone else from that game could come to Smash instead of him? This would be on par with thinking that a character from Kingdom Hearts is coming to Smash who isn't Sora, Kairi, Riku, or Xehanort, and those four instead come as costumes.
As you can see, there are a lot of assumptions being made with regards to the first assertion, plenty of questions that require answering in order to believe the Geno Costume is coming back compared to the idea that Geno is coming as a fighter, which means that it's most likely the case that Geno will be upgraded to a fighter rather than returning as a costume. And nowhere in this assessment did I have to refer to my personal feelings on the matter or some elaborate conspiracy theory. All I had to do was take in the objective information, ask relevant questions, and reach conslusions based on that.
... okay, I've just realized that I may have gone off-topic a bit, so I'll end with this: Arlo's explaination for why the Link's Awakening Remake's graphics style being bad were really terrible in terms of argumentation. I also have problems with the art style, but by god did he do a horrible job of arguing that point.
Well to be fair, if you were a doctor before your death and you came back to life, I think you'd still be considered a practicing doctor.After seeing the latest addition to the Dr. Mario app, I am 90% sure Geno could probably get a doctorate.
![]()
