Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Malo Mart]

Man it sure does suck when your favorite character is hated and tossed in the trash just because of the minority of bad eggs or trolls whom possibly don’t even care for the character, especially in Steve’s case where there’s a Grotesque Steve For Smash twitter with a header with rude depictions of salty, crying characters including the real Steve so it just makes it obvious they were all stupid trolls who also intentionally bother Steve fans whom hate them just as much as other characters’ fans (one Grotesque Steve poster even bothered me a bit when I tried to defend Steve from their render).

My goodness, that Grotesque Steve **** alone turned me from a Steve detractor to someone who wouldn't mind him in anymore. I just feel bad for his fans at this point.

 

[Organization XIII]

So all this talk about Reiji and Xiaomu brings up a very important question:
Namco when's Project X Zone 3?

 

[AdamBel731]

I welcome Nightmare's inclusion just based on the fact that he is a villain. Soul Calibur is also a storied and long respected franchise that has been on Nintendo platforms so that helps as well.

I've seen many images of Nightmare and I got to say... he looks a bit too "much" at times. That's not me saying that he can't make it in or anything, no not at all. I'm saying that in some artwork his design looks... "busy." Again, this has nothing to do with anything regarding his chances. I'm just giving my opinion on a character who I don't have too much familiarity with and saying his design in some instances has a lot going on.

Like the first two listed look fine (I hope that's how he'll look if included), but the bottom two just look too busy.

Regardless what he looks like, I'm all for more villains. And I generally find his design cool (especially the depiction in the first art listed).

 

[Sour Supreme]

I welcome Nightmare's inclusion just based on the fact that he is a villain. Soul Calibur is also a storied and long respected franchise that has been on Nintendo platforms so that helps as well.

I've seen many images of Nightmare and I got to say... he looks a bit too "much" at times. That's not me saying that he can't make it in or anything, no not at all. I'm saying that in some artwork his design looks... "busy." Again, this has nothing to do with anything regarding his chances. I'm just giving my opinion on a character who I don't have too much familiarity with and saying his design in some instances has a lot going on.

Like the first two listed look fine (I hope that's how he'll look if included). But the bottom two just look too busyView attachment 248883View attachment 248884View attachment 248885View attachment 248886

Regardless what he looks like, I'm all for more villains. And I generally find his design cool (especially the depiction in the first art listed).

Honestly, I agree. Though my most wanted SC character Yoshimitsu has also had some overwhelming physical appearances.

 

[AdamBel731]

Honestly, I agree. Though my most wanted SC character Yoshimitsu has also had some overwhelming physical appearances.

You appear to know a thing or two about Soul Calibur (or at least more than me). If Nightmare were included, what would his Boxing Ring title be? I didn't know if there was an obvious one like Sonic's "Blue Blur," Mega Man's "Blue Bomber," Terry's "Legendary Wolf," etc. Or if it could be one of multiple or something.

 

[Organization XIII]

You appear to know a thing or two about Soul Calibur (or at least more than me). If Nightmare were included, what would his Boxing Ring title be? I didn't know if there was an obvious one like Sonic's "Blue Blur," Mega Man's "Blue Bomber," Terry's "Legendary Wolf," etc. Or if it could be one of multiple or something.

His nickname is the Azure Knight so probably that.

 

[Malo Mart]

I welcome Nightmare's inclusion just based on the fact that he is a villain. Soul Calibur is also a storied and long respected franchise that has been on Nintendo platforms so that helps as well.

I've seen many images of Nightmare and I got to say... he looks a bit too "much" at times. That's not me saying that he can't make it in or anything, no not at all. I'm saying that in some artwork his design looks... "busy." Again, this has nothing to do with anything regarding his chances. I'm just giving my opinion on a character who I don't have too much familiarity with and saying his design in some instances has a lot going on.

Like the first two listed look fine (I hope that's how he'll look if included), but the bottom two just look too busy.View attachment 248883View attachment 248884View attachment 248885View attachment 248886

Regardless what he looks like, I'm all for more villains. And I generally find his design cool (especially the depiction in the first art listed).

As another complete stranger to Soul Calibur, I also do find Nightmare's design quite interesting, though you do have a point about it looking too... busy. It probably doesn't alter his chances much like you said, but I can imagine how much of a disaster his amiibo would be if they went with one of the bottom designs, oof.

I can't say which look would be best representative of him, but I'd go with the second one in your post myself because it's "cleaner" than the others and I just think it's the cooler one of the bunch. Whichever one they may go with though, I'm sure he would be a dope character in Smash.

 

[alemerltoucanet]

I love Nightmare's sword lol.

 

[Grumbo]

If we get Nightmare he’ll actually be our first 3rd party villain, and I think the only villain to get in over the hero. Pretty neat

 

[ZelDan]

I love Nightmare's sword lol.

I know, Nightmare has a real eye for swords.

 

[AdamBel731]

I know, Nightmare has a real eye for swords.

...

Eye don't get it.

 

[NintendoKnight]

I love Nightmare's sword lol.

That's the Soul Edge. It practically alters the world around it to the point of being the pivotal artifact that thrusts the Soul Calibur series' storyline into action. It's a cursed weapon, and it calls to the wickedness in the hearts of men with the promise of untold power. It eventually came into the possession of a greatsword wielder named Siegfried. In fact, the Soul Edge took such a liking to how Siegfried operated that it based everything about itself on him and his style. Fun fact, the Soul Edge takes the shape of the preferred weapon-style of its user. Once it came into contact with Siegfried, however, it adapted and kept the greatsword style it borrowed.

Things frickin' evil as crap, and super cool.

Edit: grammar.

 

[owjies]

Like the first two listed look fine (I hope that's how he'll look if included), but the bottom two just look too busy.

Regardless what he looks like, I'm all for more villains. And I generally find his design cool (especially the depiction in the first art listed).

I think you have it right. If Nightmare makes it in, those two versions are probably his most likely appearances. Here’s Nightmare’s Soul Calibur 1 design for reference:

Spoiler: Nightmare Soul Calibur 1

Soul Calibur 6 was essentially a reboot, so I think Nightmare’s appearance would be some combination of that design and SC1’s. If Nightmare gets an alt, it would most likely be SC2’s design as SC2 featured Link as a crossover character and stage on the GameCube version.

 

[alemerltoucanet]

That's the Soul Edge. It practically alters the world around it to the point of being the pivotal artifact that thrusts the Soul Calibur series' storyline into action. It's a cursed weapon, and it calls to the wickedness in the hearts of men with the promise of untold power. It eventually came into the possession of a greatsword wielder named Siegfried. In fact, the Soul Edge took such a liking to how Siegfried operated that it based everything about itself on him and his style. Fun fact, the Soul Edge takes the shape of the preferred weapon-style of its user. Once it came into contact with Siegfried, however, it adapted and kept the greatsword style it borrowed.

Things frickin' evil as crap, and super cool.

Edit: grammar.

Ayyy, thanks for the info on it! That's all really cool to know. Makes it even more sick!

 

[OffBi]

How's it poppin people?

 

[Sour Supreme]

How's it poppin people?

Spoiler

https://media0.giphy.com/media/NmYWojohg82sg/source.gif

You appear to know a thing or two about Soul Calibur (or at least more than me). If Nightmare were included, what would his Boxing Ring title be? I didn't know if there was an obvious one like Sonic's "Blue Blur," Mega Man's "Blue Bomber," Terry's "Legendary Wolf," etc. Or if it could be one of multiple or something.

I'm honestly not that well-versed. I played Soul Calibur II back in the day and have dabbled ever so sparingly in the newer titles since. Yoshimitsu is tight though, there's kind of... a lot of "Yoshimitsus" as I understand it. The name has belonged to more than one fighter across both Soul and Tekken, so they'd have a lot of iterations to pull moves from or choose aesthetically. Though, most of his appearances are universally hindered by their graphic nature in regards to the ... erm... exposure of bones and/or muscle.

Spoiler: Large Image!

This is one of my favorites and one of the least graphic, but iirc skulls are banned in Chinese media, which kind of lessens its potential for Smash.

I'd honestly be hip to any Tekken representatives. After seeing all of the characters on Terry's stage, it would be awesome to see how many Tekken cameos Sakurai could sneak in. Kind of baffles me that Heihachi is talked about so much and Bamco could be giving us our next fighter, yet no one talks about the potential of another series staple swooping in for a spot.

 

[OffBi]

Spoiler

https://media0.giphy.com/media/NmYWojohg82sg/source.gif

I didn't mean LITERALLY POPPING IN

 

[Plank08]

I’m back from the Newcomer thread, any Geno related things I missed?

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

If I didn’t know any better I’d think this would be the Nightmare support thread instead of the Geno one.

We could always use more supporters and discussion in the Nightmare thread if anybody wants to check it out (Click on the Nightmare Link in my signature)

 

[OffBi]

I’m back from the Newcomer thread, any Geno related things I missed?

Not really

 

[Spatulo]

I welcome Nightmare's inclusion just based on the fact that he is a villain. Soul Calibur is also a storied and long respected franchise that has been on Nintendo platforms so that helps as well.

I've seen many images of Nightmare and I got to say... he looks a bit too "much" at times. That's not me saying that he can't make it in or anything, no not at all. I'm saying that in some artwork his design looks... "busy." Again, this has nothing to do with anything regarding his chances. I'm just giving my opinion on a character who I don't have too much familiarity with and saying his design in some instances has a lot going on.

Like the first two listed look fine (I hope that's how he'll look if included), but the bottom two just look too busy.View attachment 248883View attachment 248884View attachment 248885View attachment 248886

Regardless what he looks like, I'm all for more villains. And I generally find his design cool (especially the depiction in the first art listed).

If it helps, those first two are Siegfried!Nightmare, which is when the main hero Siegfried was corrupted by the Soul Edge to become Nightmare, while the more busy designs are from when Nightmare became its own separate entity later. Given that SC6 is basically a reboot and Nightmare is back to being corrupted Siegfried, he’d probably look more like the first two in Smash since that’s the most recent game.

 

[MonkeyDLenny]

Shwing
Dun
Click

We pick up where Hero's reveal trailer left off, in the World of Light. Link has advanced farther than he had before, now climbing a tall peak to seemingly challenge Dharkon. He reaches the top, and we zoom in to a shot of Dharkon's eyeball... only it is not Dharkon. Panning back, we see that it is in fact the eyeball of Soul Edge! The blade is embedded into the ground and an armored hand effortlessly rips it out and hefting it over its shoulder as we fully pan back to see Nightmare

NIGHTMARE SWALLOWS YOUR SOUL

 

[Plank08]

I was thinking... what if FP5 WAS Doomslayer or Geno or something but the source gave Sabi misinformation? I have nothing to back this up, just food for thought

 

[Spatulo]

I just had a bit of a revelation. Whenever I looked at final destination in Smash 4

I ALWAYS thought it looked like the Soul Calibur and the Soul Edge clashing

COINCIDENCE? I think NOT!

 

[AdamBel731]

Ah, I truly do enjoy talking about new franchises that I am unfamiliar with joining the Smash family. No sarcasm there, I really do mean that. Sure getting your own desired characters is awesome, but sometimes learning about the history, impact, gameplay, etc., of a series unfamiliar to you is exciting in its own right!

...let's just hope Sabi or anyone doesn't march in and rains on Nightmare's parade. I'm a little tired of this happening. Usually I'm not such a Debby Downer, but there have been multiple instances where many things seem to line up for Fighter #5 being a character and then they get deconfirmed (heck Fatmanonice seemed pretty confident about Lloyd being #5 the other day). I don't even have any attachment to Nightmare, but the idea of him getting in is legitimately exciting to me because he is a villain coupled with a banger design! With the talks of Nightmare ramping up, I'm just bracing myself for yet another deconfirmation...

 

[catsforlife1]

Ah, I truly do enjoy talking about new franchises that I am unfamiliar with joining the Smash family. No sarcasm there, I really do mean that. Sure getting your own desired characters is awesome, but sometimes learning about the history, impact, gameplay, etc., of a series unfamiliar to you is exciting in its own right!

...let's just hope Sabi or anyone doesn't march in and rains on Nightmare's parade. I'm a little tired of this happening. Usually I'm not such a Debby Downer, but there have been multiple instances where many things seem to line up for Fighter #5 being a character and then they get deconfirmed (heck Fatmanonice seemed pretty confident about Lloyd being #5 the other day). I don't even have any attachment to Nightmare, but the idea of him getting in is legitimately exciting to me because he is a villain coupled with a banger design! With the talks of Nightmare ramping up, I'm just bracing myself for yet another deconfirmation...

Well according to sabi hes done disconfirming specific characters until the game awards passes

 

[Fatmanonice]

Fatmanonice, I have a genuine question, and it is legitimately not meant to come across rude.

But what makes Nightmare as Fighter #5 any different than the other characters that seemingly made sense? I know you're not a leaker, but a speculator. But (and I never thought I'd see the day), I agree with @wynn728. It seems like every single character that has kind of lined up or seemed likely for Fighter #5 gets shot down. It really is like that SpongeBob gif wynn pulls up. I know it could always be a curve ball like you have been saying also, but you just made a post on why Nightmare lines up so much and I just worry that it'll be nothing again and Sabi deconfirms him.

Recently you seemed so confident about Lloyd. You were saying how all these things make sense, but now you're saying he makes sense as post pass. (Again, I am NOT trying to be rude and my annoyance isn't at you, but rather the state of Smash speculation being essentially the opposite of Oprah at the moment.) I just wonder what makes Nightmare any different from the other times things lined up... only to get toppled down again. Once more, I'm not mad or anything at you Fatmanonice. I am very grateful that you even take the time to indulge inconsequential posts like this one and keep people like me in the loop.

Two words: Scientific Method. Like I've said, I'm not afraid of being wrong and part of the scientific method is being willing to change your view points in the face of newer and stronger evidence. You start with a hypothesis (character 5 will belong to Namco) and then you find evidence to support that hypothesis. Based on the evidence you find, you then draw certain conclusions (character 5 will probably be a Tales character) but then newer and stronger pieces of evidence can topple that (Sabi's source says that 5 absolutely is not from Tales) and you have to redirect your conclusions (character 5 will probably be from Soul Caliber). Of course, an honest scientist recognizes that the Scientific Method is not finite and that all conclusions should: 1. be carefully analyzed and reanalyzed, 2. regularly challenged and be able to "stand up for itself" and 3. be willing to be changed if newer and stronger evidence suggests that it's inaccurate or wrong.

Take for example the post I made earlier:

"Nightmare fits a lot of patterns that I've honestly been mulling over for literally two months:

-Fits my "Thank You" theory.

-Fits the Power of Six theory.

-Gives credence to why the four/five front runners in insider circles were all sword fighters: Lloyd, Nightmare, Sol, Dante, and Sephiroth.

-Follows the predominant "niche" theme of the Fighter's Pass.

-Follows past patterns of Smash games ending on niche/underwhelming characters to the general Smash fanbase.

-Pushing Lloyd to Post Pass gives credence to the strong theory that Post Pass will be pretty fanservicey based on the names heard and Lloyd definitely fits that bill a lot better than Nightmare.

-Fits Reggie's "entirely new to Smash" comments to a T.

Just like with Lloyd, I don't want to get too ahead of myself and if I were to revise my statement from the other day: Nightmare = rando >>> Sol >>>>>>>>>>>> anyone hard deconfirmed by Sabi's sources for 5."

Note how I said that Nightmare fits patterns that I've been analyzing for two months. When Sabi's source tossed out Lloyd/Tales, I didn't throw everything away, I merely went back to the drawing board to re-examine my conclusions. Upon my re-examination, I opened my thinking to new possibilities, possibilities that arguably created a stronger hypothesis.

Key point of redirected analysis: Nightmare has more in common with Joker, Hero, Banjo, and Terry than Lloyd does and fits the Fighter's Pass better.

-A running theme of all the Fighter's Pass characters is history of crossovers. As pointed out earlier, Soul Caliber is much stronger than Tales in that regard and coincidentally would be the strongest of the Fighter's Pass, a brand new conclusion based on redirected analysis.

-As many people have argued, Reggie said that the Fighter's Pass would introduce worlds and characters totally new to Smash. If we take this at absolute face value, Soul Caliber fits this better than Tales because Smash 4 has the Lloyd Mii costume while Soul Caliber has never had anything in Smash.

-Fighting game crossovers. Ultimate currently has content from: Street Fighter, Fatal Fury, King of Fighters, Samurai Showdown, Tekken, Virtua Fighter, the Megaman fighting games, the Sonic fighting games, Marvel vs Capcom, Garou, Joy Mech Fight, Marvel vs SNK, etc. Based on this, Soul Caliber would be a natural addition.

-Soul Caliber 2 had Link, the first time a major Nintendo IP was used in a third party franchise, a very notable event in Nintendo's history. Tales doesn't really have an event like this in its history that compares.

Again, these are new lines of thinking that opened up because we accepted that our original conclusion was wrong or at least a lot less likely to be true. On that note, Sabi's source could be wrong but that's an illogical conclusion. It's a possibility to consider but based on the evidence is not a smart thing to get hung up on. In the end, yes, sometimes it does seem like jumping from sinking ship to sinking ship but the Scientific Method is not static, it's dynamic. It's not stationary, it's proactive. This is ultimately the key to good and thoughtful speculation, no matter the topic.

 

[super88cloud]

I welcome Nightmare's inclusion just based on the fact that he is a villain. Soul Calibur is also a storied and long respected franchise that has been on Nintendo platforms so that helps as well.

I've seen many images of Nightmare and I got to say... he looks a bit too "much" at times. That's not me saying that he can't make it in or anything, no not at all. I'm saying that in some artwork his design looks... "busy." Again, this has nothing to do with anything regarding his chances. I'm just giving my opinion on a character who I don't have too much familiarity with and saying his design in some instances has a lot going on.

Like the first two listed look fine (I hope that's how he'll look if included), but the bottom two just look too busy.View attachment 248883View attachment 248884......

Regardless what he looks like, I'm all for more villains. And I generally find his design cool (especially the depiction in the first art listed).

Hopefully it´s the model from Soul calibur 2, never liked Nightmare´s other styles that much.

Well,if Sabi got baited, maybe Geno has a chance of being fighter 5. I still don´t think Geno is gonna be fighter 5. He´s seems like the perfect guy to start the bonus pass though.

 

[OffBi]

https://twitter.com/New_WabiSabi/status/1200691238090891264
Damn bros i can't believe we lost...

 

[UberMadman]

https://twitter.com/New_WabiSabi/status/1200691238090891264
Damn bros i can't believe we lost...

Honestly, I don’t know how you can interpret that as anything except a major boon to Geno’s chances.

 

[MonkeyDLenny]

-Soul Caliber 2 had Link, the first time a major Nintendo IP was used in a third party franchise, a very notable event in Nintendo's history. Tales doesn't really have an event like this in its history that compares.

This right here for me is the deal sealer: a decade later and that one crossover is STILL unprecedented on Nintendo's part.

You know they would hype up a big rematch between Link and Nightmare and that's the kind of thing Sakurai would gush about in his presentation

 

[MissingGlitch]

https://twitter.com/New_WabiSabi/status/1200691238090891264
Damn bros i can't believe we lost...
View attachment 248918

Pack it up boys. We're done here.

 

[TheCJBrine]

https://twitter.com/New_WabiSabi/status/1200691238090891264
Damn bros i can't believe we lost...
View attachment 248918

At least The Great Mighty Poo is in.

 

[Deleted member]

I don't have as much of a connection with Nightmare seeing as I've never really played Soul Calibur.

The last time I played SC was IV, specifically the PS3 version with Vader. This was back in what, 2008? Maybe 2009? A decade ago, at least, I was entering secondary school at that point.

I really wanted the 360 version to try out Yoda, but we never got it when I was a kid. I only played a little bit with my sis, but I remember I played Nightmare quite a bit if I wasn't playing as Vader. Both characters were lumbering, walking juggernauts. Kinda like Sauron from LOTR.
I'm not really sure why, but I just feel kinda drawn to those characters because they're easier to play, lol.

Seeing discussion of him does bring me back to those days. I hope he doesn't get deconfirmed for FP5 soon, I'd actually be a bit upset like I was with Doomguy being deconfirmed.

So overall I think I'd be pretty happy with Nightmare, even if I haven't played SC in years.

 

[Nicnac]

-Gives credence to why the four/five front runners in insider circles were all sword fighters: Lloyd, Nightmare, Sol, Dante, and Sephiroth.

I must have missed this one, why does this matter as much?

 

[Herocin]

People seem to be speculating a Soulcalibur character but there is a key reason I doubt that. We not only just got Terry but also as Lloyd is most likely a matter of when that means we'd be getting two Namco characters which isn't too likely. Geno is an exception due to the fact that he is viewed as a Nintendo character and is so highly requested

 

[osby]

People seem to be speculating a Soulcalibur character but there is a key reason I doubt that. We not only just got Terry but also as Lloyd is most likely a matter of when that means we'd be getting two Namco characters which isn't too likely. Geno is an exception due to the fact that he is viewed as a Nintendo character and is so highly requested

What's the point of making up fan rules if you're just going to create exceptions for them in the same breath?

 

[Herocin]

What's the point of making up fan rules if you're just going to make up exceptions for them in the same breath?

Because like I just stated Geno is a very popular character who has been requested next to characters like Banjo which cannot be said the same for in terms of a Soulcalibur character. I'd also appreciate if you didn't phrase your comment in a manner which suggested I invented the fan rule

 

[Dan]

I was thinking... what if FP5 WAS Doomslayer or Geno or something but the source gave Sabi misinformation? I have nothing to back this up, just food for thought

Anything's possible, but that would just kill speculation.

 

[osby]

Because like I just stated Geno is a very popular character who has been requested next to characters like Banjo which cannot be said the same for in terms of a Soulcalibur character. I'd also appreciate if you didn't phrase your comment in a manner which suggested I invented the fan rule

You're acting like characters need to have some special quality to broke a rule that doesn't even exist.

As far as we know, there's nothing that prevents Nintendo from adding another SEGA or Microsoft character after this pass is done. Plus, Lloyd isn't even 100% confirmed.

I don't think Soulcalibur is likely, but your argument isn't convincing at all.