Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Franco Geno]

You better get ready to BATTER UP!
View attachment 248000

Sh#t is about to go down!

 

[OffBi]

Oh ffs it's not Gordon Freeman
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/78195785?jumpto=41#41
Goddamn it

 

[Zac's Realm]

Welp, another to the deconfirmation pile, it seems. I'm at least glad that Verge straight up said it wasn't Gordon, since it'll spare discussion from being about that leak for a couple weeks or so.

I think with all these characters listed as 'not' Fighter 5, i'm gonna place my bets on a Namco character like most people seem to be doing right now. Lloyd seems likely, but i'm gonna say it here for the future so I can either be laughed at if i'm wrong or a prophet if i'm right. I think people are seriously sleeping on Agumon's chances. Imagine how legendary of an addition that would be, finally being able to have an official fight between a Pokemon and a Digimon.

I do think Lloyd is probably more likely, but I haven't seen as many people considering Agumon as a possibility and while I haven't played a Digimon game like. At all, I think people should give him more credence as a possibility perhaps.

Part of me is still gonna hope Fighter 5 is Monokuma, but i'm willing to accept that is very unlikely, lmao

At any rate, to not go too off-topic from Geno, I still feel like his chances are really good again and I'd be surprised if he wasn't in post-pass. I could even see him being the first post-pass reveal.

 

[Vector Victor]

To be fair, I was a little annoyed at the idea that character 5 could be Gordon Freeman. Valve does nothing with him for over 10 years, drags their feet on HF3, decides to finally release something and all of a sudden Gordon is bumped to the front of the line to ride Smash Mountain? I'm not saying the relevancy argument, but a new game and addition to the biggest crossover is too much at once for him. It comes off as Valve trying to make up for lost time to stay on fan's good side after ignoring them with an over the top gesture, like a parent who is absent from a kids life and then gives them a trip to Disney World to win them back.

 

[ForsakenM]

Dear Lord, the coattail-chasing Vergeben is the reason you give up on Gordon?

I mean, it was obvious that he never had a chance to be in Smash Ultimate, but why would you let Vergeben be the one to ruin your day over anyone else?

 

[Herocin]

I dunno why vergeben hasn't confirmed or deconfirmed every goddam character on the planet for fighter 5. Jokes aside I wonder who fighter 5 would be if all these deconfirmed are reliable. I can't imagine a small name like Lloyd being at the VGAs if fighter 5 is announced there so who could it be?

 

[Zac's Realm]

I dunno why vergeben hasn't confirmed or deconfirmed every goddam character on the planet for fighter 5. Jokes aside I wonder who fighter 5 would be if all these deconfirmed are reliable. I can't imagine a small name like Lloyd being at the VGAs if fighter 5 is announced there so who could it be?

Tales Of is like the third biggest JRPG franchise in existence, I wouldn't exactly consider Lloyd a small name.

Plus, I think ultimately if they plan to reveal Fighter 5 at the Game Awards, there's not much they can do to make sure the character 'fits the audience' or whatever, since Fighter 5 has likely been in production for a while now. If there's a reveal, there's a reveal.

At any rate, I wouldn't be too happy with Lloyd personally as I have literally 0 attachment to him, but underselling him is disingenuous imo.

 

[Herocin]

Tales Of is like the third biggest JRPG franchise in existence, I wouldn't exactly consider Lloyd a small name.

Plus, I think ultimately if they plan to reveal Fighter 5 at the Game Awards, there's not much they can do to make sure the character 'fits the audience' or whatever, since Fighter 5 has likely been in production for a while now. If there's a reveal, there's a reveal.

At any rate, I wouldn't be too happy with Lloyd personally as I have literally 0 attachment to him, but underselling him is disingenuous imo.

By small name I mean Joker levels. He'd probably raise more eyebrows to casual viewers and wouldn't raise many spirits to the smash fanboys as he has been talked about for months, is lesser known in the west than other characters and wields swords. Joker was an unexpected well known character but Lloyd can't really level with Joker at least on the levels he is at possibly to a lesser extent. And imo Joker was probably planned for the VGAs all along. Too coincidental that he was a well known character that no one expected who was revealed there and was a GOTY candidate the following year. And they even said that Joker was going to be announced there last minute so with that in mind it isn't Outlandish for it to be the case that they'd decide to announce Lloyd elsewhere or that they'd have planned ahead and decided to make Fighter 5 a VGA announcement

 

[AdamBel731]

For whoever believes John Cartwright has access to insider knowledge. I personally think he does at times, and I personally didn't know about Gordan Freeman's chances anyways.

 

[ForsakenM]

I dunno why vergeben hasn't confirmed or deconfirmed every goddam character on the planet for fighter 5. Jokes aside I wonder who fighter 5 would be if all these deconfirmed are reliable. I can't imagine a small name like Lloyd being at the VGAs if fighter 5 is announced there so who could it be?

See this is where people like you and RingJ5 seem to miss the idea the Lloyd...

• Is a big enough deal to announce at the VGAs, as every FP character has had a level of niche.
• Would make complete sense if Tales Of Arise gets any news at all.
• Thinking Lloyd is a small pick when he has been requested since Brawl
• Thinking one of the consistently most loved characters in the Tales Of series is a small name.

Adding onto that...

Tales Of is like the third biggest JRPG franchise in existence, I wouldn't exactly consider Lloyd a small name.

Plus, I think ultimately if they plan to reveal Fighter 5 at the Game Awards, there's not much they can do to make sure the character 'fits the audience' or whatever, since Fighter 5 has likely been in production for a while now. If there's a reveal, there's a reveal.

• The Tales Of series is the 7th-best-selling JRPG/RPG series of all time, beating out Dragon Ball RPGs but getting beat by the Souls franchise. Also outsells both the Persona and SMT franchises by a rather wide margin.
• Smash has been infamous for it's final reveals being pretty mediocre. It's just kinda it's thing. Not that Lloyd is really all that mediocre, but he's also not as big a pick as they could get, like Sora or Sephiroth or Doom Guy or Master Chief.

Also, fun fact, the top three are Pokemon (duh), Final Fantasy (again, duh) and Dragon Quest (oh baby, a triple!) but what I found very interesting was the giant disparity between the kings of RPGs. Pokemon has roughly 340,000,000 in sales, and Final Fantasy doesn't even make half of that, and Dragon Quest just barely makes half of that. Makes a lot more sense now why GameFreak thinks they are immortal, as they have no direct competitor and even other great RPGs don't come close to measuring up.

Another thing I noticed is that the Mario RPG series is just barely holding onto the 9th spot which I really find interesting what with all the other RPGS out there and apparently the original Bowser's Inside Story is the best selling Mario RPG game. Huh.

 

[OffBi]

Is a big enough deal to announce at the VGAs

Dude, no

 

[wynn728]

What's that? The Gordon leak was fake? Who would've thunk it? Don't worry, next leak is totally going to be real. And if not then there the next leak and the next leak and the next leak. Monkeys and Typewriters

 

[domriver]

Oh ffs it's not Gordon Freeman
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/78195785?jumpto=41#41
Goddamn it

Another disconfirmation. This shall be interesting.

 

[Vector Victor]

But, if Reggie's comments last year are true (and so far haven't been contradicted), then character 5 series will be new to Smash, or at the very least, the character will be. So under that logic, Tales can't be 5 due to the Lloyd costume from 4 or it can't be Lloyd as the Tales rep because of his costume.

If we take Reggie at pure face value, it's not Lloyd. But again, Sakurai can do what he wants, this is just for speculation.

 

[Spatulo]

Bowser's Inside Story is the best selling Mario RPG game.

At least there’s some justice in this world

 

[riggsbass]

I know who the next DLC character is!

It's Ge

 

[Midget Master]

I just don't buy Lloyd at the VGAs. Yeah, Arise. Yeah, Tales is big. Yeah, Joker was from a JRPG too.

But Persona 5 was gigantic over here, and still relatively new. Tales is very much a JRPG series, and the VGAs always tend to swing toward western tastes. Yeah, he's popular in the series and requested for Smash... But that doesn't mean he's recognizable to everyone. Everybody knew Joker, or at least knew Persona 5. But if they showed Lloyd there? I think it is entirely possible and within reason that a large chunk of the audience would be like "Who?"

And I think that's the one, single thing that you absolutely avoid when planning an event like this. Which is why I keep coming back to the idea that if Lloyd is actually FP5, we're going to see him before this event, and the first post-pass character will be shown there. It behooves them to have a big-ish name there that has a lot of appeal to the western audiences. That's why Doom made so much sense to me.

I dunno. Maybe I'm wrong. I'd love to be, I want Lloyd a LOT. But I just don't see it happening here. For what it's worth, though, I think if he's not FP5, he's got a great chance of showing up a little later on.

 

[Nicnac]

I know who the next DLC character is!

It's Ge

no

 

[Rikarte]

I know who the next DLC character is!

It's Ge

I can't believe Gex is in Smash

 

[StarLight42]

nessdeltarune00 Gordon leak has been pronounced fake by Vergeben; says Gordon is not Fighter 5

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/78195785?jumpto=41#41

Verge has been piggybacking and playing it safe a lot recently so this is one of his most bold claims in recent days

 

[T2by4]

Oh ffs it's not Gordon Freeman
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/78195785?jumpto=41#41
Goddamn it

Shocker. Also didn't someone mention that we might (probably not) get some news for smash tomorrow based on the otterposting or something. They would usually do a announcement for the direct for the day prior right? What time do they usually do that by?

 

[AdamBel731]

Maybe we should stop putting stock in Fighter #5 leaks, yeah? This is like a fifth chatacter deconfirmed for Fighter #5. I think it is clear based on how speculation is going right now that Nintendo is keeping Fighter #5 really well safeguarded and that hardly anyone truly knows.

I think the safe bet is a character that wasn't really leaked majorly beforehand like Piranha Plant and Joker. So a total "surprise" akin to Joker. I daresay that'll be it'll be the pass' "Last Surprise."

So if the most wanted chatacters not getting in yet and instead Sakurai choosing someone "not as popular," upsets you, well, brace yourself now. Because I'd rather not have a contest to see who can complain the most when Fighter #5 is announced (though that'll inevitability happen). Though I'm still surprised that people are shocked when smaller characters get in despite the countless smaller characters already in Smash. Stop acting super surpised all the time. Sakurai literally included Mr. Game & Watch in Melee. (That isn't to lessen the value of "smaller characters" like Mr. Game & Watch, I'm just saying that people really want huge characters like Sora, Crash Bandicoot, etc., and are just completely flabbergasted when Sakurai picks characters that aren't as known. "A character I don't know?! Gross. Give me MY character, Sakurai!")

 

[Grumbo]

Oh ffs it's not Gordon Freeman
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/78195785?jumpto=41#41
Goddamn it

So long Gordon, we hardly knew yee.

 

[Spatulo]

Shocker. Also didn't someone mention that we might (probably not) get some news for smash tomorrow based on the otterposting or something. They would usually do a announcement for the direct for the day prior right? What time do they usually do that by?

Well they usually post about Directs at 10 am eastern time sooo... three minutes ago lol

 

[RingJ5]

I just don't buy Lloyd at the VGAs. Yeah, Arise. Yeah, Tales is big. Yeah, Joker was from a JRPG too.

But Persona 5 was gigantic over here, and still relatively new. Tales is very much a JRPG series, and the VGAs always tend to swing toward western tastes. Yeah, he's popular in the series and requested for Smash... But that doesn't mean he's recognizable to everyone. Everybody knew Joker, or at least knew Persona 5. But if they showed Lloyd there? I think it is entirely possible and within reason that a large chunk of the audience would be like "Who?"

And I think that's the one, single thing that you absolutely avoid when planning an event like this. Which is why I keep coming back to the idea that if Lloyd is actually FP5, we're going to see him before this event, and the first post-pass character will be shown there. It behooves them to have a big-ish name there that has a lot of appeal to the western audiences. That's why Doom made so much sense to me.

I dunno. Maybe I'm wrong. I'd love to be, I want Lloyd a LOT. But I just don't see it happening here. For what it's worth, though, I think if he's not FP5, he's got a great chance of showing up a little later on.

This is basically my stance on things. Though I certainly might be quite vocal against him at the VGAs(and personally as #5 in general, even if revealed before that), I also consider him practically a lock for post-pass, being a Mii Costume promotion just like Geno.

People are really understating P5’s popularity while overstating Tales’ in order to try and make “Lloyd at the VGAs” sound like an equal reveal to “Joker at the VGAs”, when it wouldn’t even remotely have the same impact. It’s the main character of a contemporary Playstation-exclusive JRPG that has sold nearly three million copies in two years vs. the main character of a GameCube JRPG that has sold, from current metrics, about two million in... sixteen years. (1.7M by 2008, then the 125K from the re-release). Sure, Tales as a franchise might very well have more overall sales, but that in no way equals to international popularity, as seen from Dragon Quest.

There’s absolutely no big shock value there, just “oh, hey, another anime swordfighter.” And again, I don’t specifically have anything against the character, even though it probably sounds like I do. It’s just that... and I can’t believe I’m using this term yet again, that “Smash bubble” effect, where since a character is wanted enough by this specific niche that their reveal is treated as a far larger deal than it actually would be.

 

[MattX20]

If Lloyd happens, I think he will be part of the second season of DLC.

 

[Grumbo]

If we go with Fatman’s idea that #6 and #7 are based off Smash 4 assets, and we stick to third party, it’s very likely those are Lloyd and Geno

So for fighter #5, let’s rule out Lloyd, Geno, Crash, Ryu Hayabusa, Doomguy, Gordon, and for good measure throw in anyone else from SNK, Sega, Square, and Microsoft. I really can’t think of what we’re left with here. Reimu or Monokuma or any other indie character seem pretty unlikely for the pass. Level 5 may be possible. Fromsoftware with Dark Souls might happen but we don’t have much to suggest that. I’m kind of at a loss tbh

 

[ForsakenM]

I find it funny that you guys have some sort of weird set of rules and stipulations when pretty much everything we've gotten so far goes against those stipulations, but I mean hey, that's on you guys for limiting your scope when the facts exist all around you.

I also cannot understand anyone who TRULY thought Gordon Freeman had a chance. This fake leaker is a nobody and Valve has nothing really going for it in terms of Smash. We all know the limited pool of who we can trust, yet you guys act like a couple weeks of not knowing who the next character will be is some sort of torture and you start latching on to literally anything anyone says. Come on guys, do better than that!

Well they usually post about Directs at 10 am eastern time sooo... three minutes ago lol

I'm convinced that there is no point paying attention to the Otters in terms of Smash. Sure, maybe it means something else, but the fact that he posts them whenever he feels like and sometimes it's in relation to an announcement means that his otter postings are unreliable. Proof enough was the whole 'Starling' shenanigans in which otters were posted AND Sabi's NoA source dropped this hint of a leak and NOTHING HAS COME OF IT and likely nothing ever will.

Also RingJ5 I wasn't using sales as a reason to be included, which is what you are doing. I was merely showing that Tales Of is more popular overall than both the Persona and SMT franchises, and out of all the games that have come out since Symphonia...well, Lloyd Irving is still one of the most popular characters. Seems like someone was rather impactful in his own game to keep being that loved so many years later...could be why he would be an amazing inclusion in Smash. Could very easily make a trailer that seems like Lloyd will be in Tales Of Arise only to reveal the Smash symbol...just saying, super easy call to make.

No one is overstating Tales Of: it's actually just more popular than other series. No one is understating Persona: it's just only recently really popular with P5, and other than that never did super well worldwide. In other words...niche.

Now I will say that reflecting on how the pass has gone so far and Reggie's words at the last VGAs ringing true thus far, I feel a bit less confident in Lloyd's inclusion in the Fighter's Pass. I was VERY close to stating complete confidence like I did with B&K, but unless I hear something else big regarding him I'll stand firmly in the boat of "Lloyd could happen but I'm not confident, it seems we are in the dark for now."

 

[Sigran101]

So much for an announcement on Tuesday.

 

[Megadoomer]

For whoever believes John Cartwright has access to insider knowledge. I personally think he does at times, and I personally didn't know about Gordan Freeman's chances anyways.

Gordan Freeman likely won't be in Smash. Gordon Freeman, on the other hand...

probably won't, let's be honest. Though that reminds me that I should probably play Half-Life 2 - from what I recall, I stopped at a hovercraft section that controlled poorly and was dragging on for far too long.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Meh, they could still announce a direct tomorrow that’ll play on Wednesday our time, but I think Thursday and Friday will be skipped out of respect to the US... there’s never been a direct on Thanksgiving Day or the day after has there?

 

[MattX20]

I think we should wait for tomorrow to be sure before we call this whole thing dead.

 

[Spatulo]

Meh, they could still announce a direct tomorrow that’ll play on Wednesday our time, but I think Thursday and Friday will be skipped out of respect to the US... there’s never been a direct on Thanksgiving Day or the day after has there?

I mean I hope they’d let the NOA employees who handle video uploads and stuff take Thanksgiving off, and I’m pretty sure they’d never put a direct on Black Friday because they’d rather us be fighting to the death for Mario Kart 8 Deluxe bundles

 

[Dynamic Worlok]

Gordan Freeman likely won't be in Smash. Gordon Freeman, on the other hand...

probably won't, let's be honest. Though that reminds me that I should probably play Half-Life 2 - from what I recall, I stopped at a hovercraft section that controlled poorly and was dragging on for far too long.

If you think water hazard drags, just wait for ravenholm
(It's all worth it, I promise!)

 

[RingJ5]

I find it funny that you guys have some sort of weird set of rules and stipulations when pretty much everything we've gotten so far goes against those stipulations, but I mean hey, that's on you guys for limiting your scope when the facts exist all around you.

I also cannot understand anyone who TRULY thought Gordon Freeman had a chance. This fake leaker is a nobody and Valve has nothing really going for it in terms of Smash. We all know the limited pool of who we can trust, yet you guys act like a couple weeks of not knowing who the next character will be is some sort of torture and you start latching on to literally anything anyone says. Come on guys, do better than that!



I'm convinced that there is no point paying attention to the Otters in terms of Smash. Sure, maybe it means something else, but the fact that he posts them whenever he feels like and sometimes it's in relation to an announcement means that his otter postings are unreliable. Proof enough was the whole 'Starling' shenanigans in which otters were posted AND Sabi's NoA source dropped this hint of a leak and NOTHING HAS COME OF IT and likely nothing ever will.

Also RingJ5 I wasn't using sales as a reason to be included, which is what you are doing. I was merely showing that Tales Of is more popular overall than both the Persona and SMT franchises, and out of all the games that have come out since Symphonia...well, Lloyd Irving is still one of the most popular characters. Seems like someone was rather impactful in his own game to keep being that loved so many years later...could be why he would be an amazing inclusion in Smash. Could very easily make a trailer that seems like Lloyd will be in Tales Of Arise only to reveal the Smash symbol...just saying, super easy call to make.

No one is overstating Tales Of: it's actually just more popular than other series. No one is understating Persona: it's just only recently really popular with P5, and other than that never did super well worldwide. In other words...niche.

Now I will say that reflecting on how the pass has gone so far and Reggie's words at the last VGAs ringing true thus far, I feel a bit less confident in Lloyd's inclusion in the Fighter's Pass. I was VERY close to stating complete confidence like I did with B&K, but unless I hear something else big regarding him I'll stand firmly in the boat of "Lloyd could happen but I'm not confident, it seems we are in the dark for now."

Tales is not even remotely more popular than Persona is right now, what metric are you using? Especially since you seem to be saying that it has nothing to do with overall sales.

The popularity of a single game can absolutely break a franchise out of a niche, it’s not like it’s going to be some random outlier and 6 is going to be really obscure again.

 

[Antho]

You know, there still might be a chance for a Smash announcement this week. Nintendo or Nintendo Versus hasn't tweeted at all today yet, and Smash specific announcements are usually made later in the day, except for one time which was the November 1st Direct. I'm expecting to just be waiting until The Game Awards happen, though.

 

[wynn728]

Yeah, I don't think we're going to be getting any announcement this week. Why? Devil May Cry 3 just got announced for the Switch https://twitter.com/DevilMayCry/status/1198994983434571778?s=20

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

Yeah, I don't think we're going to be getting any announcement this week. Why? Devil May Cry 3 just got announced for the Switch https://twitter.com/DevilMayCry/status/1198994983434571778?s=20

People on Twitter already think this means Dante is coming. I would be cool with Dante myself, but didn't the creator de-confirm for the Fighter's Pass a while back?

 

[StarLight42]

https://twitter.com/monsun__/status/1199006031021400071

Gordon “leaker”

 

[Griselda]

I'm back(maybe). I'm working on something I think all of you will enjoy.