Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[QQS]

Dude I know you said English is not your native language, but you spelled KKR aka King K. Rool as KKK. You should edit that not trying to be mean, but it's the name of a racist group.

My mistake. Already fixed brother.

 

[N3ON]

There is a difference between Assist Trophies & Pokeball. Sure it's all RNG, but when I throw a Pokeball I know that whatever comes out it's not really going to hurt me (unless it's Electrode and I get too close). With Assist Trophies there's a good chance they can harm me like Nightmare, Skull Kid, Nintendogs, Squid Sisters and other ones that I can't really remember at this moment. Needless to say when using an Assist Trophy it can bite you in the ***.

Right. So when you say they wasted their time with those 59 Assist Trophies like a page ago, you mean those four Assist Trophies. When you say, "they all suck" you mean, "they all suck, except for 55 of them". I'm not buying it dude, your argument has already shifted; you're clearly biased.

And hey, if a few obstructing ATs are enough to taint the entire well, don't forget about Togepi, Palkia and Exeggutor. The former of which turns the screen black, which is the same effect as "the worst Assist Trophy you can get".
Lotta holes...

Also with Pokeball I'm in control of it. I get to choose when and where I summon it. If I want I can throw it off a cliff, throw it at my opponent for extra damage, or throw it at my feet to summon them immediately. It's not that many options but it's more than what Assist Trophies gives me. The worst one to get is Goldeen that does nothing while the worst Assist Trophy you can get turns the entire screen black. Also seeing how Master Balls are an item you're guarentee something great from that one.

It may not be a lot but those little things make Pokeball a step up from Assist Trophies. Plus Pokeball doesn't have a constant reminder of how thay one character you thought had a chance of being playable is actually dead in a ditch and will never be playable with a red weed is dabbing on their graves.

Yeah, holding the Pokeball eliminates all aspects of RNG from it.

Plus, Pokeballs may carry a reminder of Pokemon you wanted. Depends who you like. There were Mimikyu supporters. There were Tapu Koko supporters. Zoroark, Victini, Deoxys, Meowth, Eevee, Blastoise, at some point in the series all these characters had people behind them. For a while some poor souls thought a Gardevoir leak had merit.

 

[Door Key Pig]

Quick question for any "veteran" Geno fans here: in terms of the utmost "classic" requested dream characters for Smash Bros that have only now been included in Ultimate for the most part, in the least revisionist manner possible, who would be in this apart from Ridley, King K Rool, Banjo Kazooie (?) and Geno?

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I rather like the assists, especially now that you can fight them off. Makes them feel more interactive.

And it doesn't make the Starfy fans sad, because their character isn't the only AT that gets beaten up anymore.

Quick question for any "veteran" Geno fans here: in terms of the utmost "classic" requested dream characters for Smash Bros that have only now been included in Ultimate for the most part, in the least revisionist manner possible, who would be in this apart from Ridley, King K Rool, Banjo Kazooie (?) and Geno?

Simon and Daisy have been expected for a good while.

...The question is about long-time requests that made it in, right?

 

[kiteinthesky]

Quick question for any "veteran" Geno fans here: in terms of the utmost "classic" requested dream characters for Smash Bros that have only now been included in Ultimate for the most part, in the least revisionist manner possible, who would be in this apart from Ridley, King K Rool, Banjo Kazooie (?) and Geno?

Mach Rider maybe. Possibly Sephiroth if Geno doesn't make the cut.

 

[ZelDan]

There's nothing wrong with assist trophies conceptually, but they definitely aren't a proper or worthwhile way to represent characters people actually wanted. Kind of hard to get excited at a character who only has a 1/59 chance of showing up, and that's if an assist trophy even shows up on screen, and THAT's if people even have the things turned on in the first place. Ideally assist trophies would have been saved for normal enemies like koopas, metroids, deku babas, etc. Or characters that maybe wouldn't work as well as a fighter or would be a lot harder to translate into one, like the pong assist trophy.

It's also valid to be upset with a character being an assist trophy if, say, the character in question isn't properly represented themself. Looking at Isaac, while I'm upset at him being an AT, I'm also bothered because I think it does a bad job of showing off Isaac.

For one, I really dislike that they brought back his Brawl voice, considering it's too high-pitched and unfitting for him. He's supposed to be 16/17 years old, not 9/10 years old. Secondly, While they did give Isaac more moves in his assist trophy, he still doesn't have any of his earth-bending or plant-based venus psynergy, which is a pretty big facet of Isaac.

I guess I'll also add that, while there's nothing conceptually wrong with ATs, there's nothing really wrong with fan-requested characters being assists either, or atleast there wouldn't be if Smash had a more noteworthy assist feature. If they handled it like other fighters where you can actually choose what assists you have and if you had actual control on when or maybe what your assist does, and assist had an overall much larger presence, then I think many people would be much less against seeing characters they like being assists. if I could play as Megaman and have Shovel Knight and Isaac by my side at all times, I'd be a hell of alot happier with that than with "well, if I play with items on maybe I'll get lucky and gets to see Shovel Knight and Isaac for 10 seconds.."

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Really doubt they would make a section for just one fighter. Why not label all of them as DLCs? I mean, you can buy the chars from the fighters pass individually. This is deliberate separation. And they are using plural there. This is no accident

Because you want to clearly separate the Fighter’s Pass from the individual DLC as much as possible, so there isn’t any chance people think they get Piranha Plant with the Pass. They’ve built all the advertising around the Pass and want to clearly define that as much as possible for consumers and separate (what will likely be) the single first party character from all the third parties to further separate the pass from Plant. It’s also future proofing in case they want to make other individual fighters down the road, but there’s nothing to really imply that they’ve already decided on more individual DLC already.

With all the stuff going on, I’m still confident about that Geno is coming as a fighter. I don’t think all of these are mere coincidence, so here are THE TOP 15 REASONS WHY GENO WILL BE PLAYABLE:

1) Lack of Mii costume.

2) Forest Maze & Armed Boss copyrighted by Nintendo. The same amount of Square songs for Cloud + each of the Heroes. Plus, probably the most iconic songs to represent Geno, if you have to choose one iconic for him, and one for battles.

3) The Starling (just a theory, but it adds up).

4) The extra Slot in the Stage Select Screen.

5) The extra Slot in the Sound Section.

6) The first Bonus was Piranha Plant. The second and probably last Bonus could be Geno. Both from Mario Universe. The Bonus DLC even have their own section in the Smash Page, I don’t believe they put it just to have the Plant there. Also Geno fits in this concept cause he is very long requested and loved, but not the type of character like maybe Crash or Doomguy that could fit and sell better in the Fighter Pass.

7) Fans have been heard and pleased. Of course with Sonic, Mega Man, Pac-Man, Ryu, Bayonetta, Cloud, Snake, Joker and Simon (they even put Richter to satisfy both sides of the world). But speaking of long-terms + current scenario, fans have been 100% heard with Ridley, KKR and Banjo. 3/4 of “forgotten and impossible characters” that are playable now, only missing Geno.

8) Even Sakurai acknowledges Geno. So we aren’t talking just for talking. Beloved and unique character with a gun in his arm; perfectly fitting Smash’s style.

9) Geno has his own and unique Splash-Art even as a Mii costume.

10) Inkling, Chrom, KKR and Isabelle were from being costumes in Smash Wii U to being fighters in Ultimate, only missing Geno again.

11) What a better way to conclude the DLC (Fighter Pass or Bonus) with the most requested character by now, and finish this Two Decades Fan Demand with him.

12) If I remember well, Sakurai said something like that the Next Smash could perfectly be in ten years more. I think it’s the exact time for this Smash to last longer than it predecessors, which were: 1999-2001-2008-2014. With that being said, Geno in 2020 (where he should be playable) will be 24 years since his 1996 birth.

13) You have so many ideas to make Geno’s Reveal Trailer: Toys style like the Smash 64 intro; Mario-Peach-Bowser acting with Geno; or even starring Kirby and Rosalina for the Star concepts.

14) Geno has been evolving. Since Melee he was top in the polls; in Brawl he was an idea that escaped Sakurai’s hands; in Wii U he was a Mii costume; and in Ultimate he is “a Spirit”. He is also acknowledged in a way by the Megasmilax reference. If you ask me, Nintendo already have the permission and now, finally, it’s in Sakurai’s hands. He is just waiting for the perfect moment to reveal it, probably in the DLC #4 or #5 reveals, or maybe after it to finish the roster.

15) “A Spirit” that will come to life in Ultimate, after it possesses our wooden puppet doll.

*English is not my native language.

Oh, for god’s sake. THERE IS NO EXTRA SPACE ON STAGE SELECT. It already has a function in game that completes that screen in the Random Stage Selection option when you make a Custom Rule Set. Go to edit rules and you’ll see it there.

Not that they can’t add more stages later by adjusting the UI or whatever they want, but there’s not an intentional space planned there.

Similarly, the voice lines don’t really give us any information. The Hero Alts each got a slot, if one of the final fighters in the pass has an Alt with unique voice lines, the perfect rectangle will also be complete. And not to mention, there’s nothing to imply the voice lines have to be a perfect rectangle to begin with.

 

[Door Key Pig]

Hey EricTheGamerman , looking at your signature there, was Isaac ever under the kind of classic "never-evers" of Smash? Or would saying so be revisionist?

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Hey EricTheGamerman , looking at your signature there, was Isaac ever under the kind of classic "never-evers" of Smash? Or would saying so be revisionist?

I would say Issac hasn't always been a never ever as he was relevant in Brawl and somewhat relevant/dead during Smash 4. His last game was Dark Dawn on the DS back in 2010 I believe.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Okay, seriously, can anyone clarify what kiteinthesky's question is about? Long-time wants that finally got in, or aren't in yet?

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Hey EricTheGamerman , looking at your signature there, was Isaac ever under the kind of classic "never-evers" of Smash? Or would saying so be revisionist?

The characters in my signature just represent who I wanted, not the never evers. I had many more including Isaac during base game discussion, but removed all the Assist Trophies earlier this year.

That said, Isaac seemed to take off more during Smash 4 speculation from what I know and have seen. I don’t know if Brawl had as large of an Isaac support scene, but it definitely became a bigger thing during Smash 4’s era which was much more of hoping for an upgrade like Little Mac at the time. It wasn’t until Isaac was completely missing from base game that he went through his primary shift to gaining more support in the Smash 4 DLC era and that naturally carried over to Ultimate’s speculation.

Honestly, from what I know, the never-evers aren’t really a consistent body of characters. Banjo-Kazooie wasn’t really a huge part of speculation until Phil Spencer made his comments in the Smash 4 Ballot era. King K Rool didn’t explode until Smash 4 post Diddy Kong in Brawl. Geno honestly dropped off during Smash 4’s speculation pretty hard. Krystal fell off completely post Brawl. Bandanna Dee started gaining momentum during Smash 4 and exploded during DLC.

Like the main popular choices have shifted a lot with only Ridley maintaining the popularity he has from the beginning (and expanding too). I get that they aren’t all never-Evers in the traditional sense, but I never found it super helpful to define them as such since they have all occupied that terminology at one point or another, and the main popular picks are worth examining across the field beyond just the never-ever traditional.

 

[xpnc]

[W]as Isaac ever under the kind of classic "never-evers" of Smash? Or would saying so be revisionist?

These are the canonical never-evers. Anyone who tells you otherwise is misinformed or has some kind of weird agenda.

 

[MattX20]

These are the canonical never-evers. Anyone who tells you otherwise is misinformed or has some kind of weird agenda.

At the very least Isaac wasn't left out of the game this time like he was in Smash 4. It sucks that he's not playable as I know he was one of the most highly wanted characters, but at least he wasn't forgotten.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

Okay, seriously, can anyone clarify what kiteinthesky's question is about? Long-time wants that finally got in, or aren't in yet?

No

Jokes aside, I think he's asking people who else is a supposed never ever like Isaac, Geno, etc.

 

[Door Key Pig]

These are the canonical never-evers. Anyone who tells you otherwise is misinformed or has some kind of weird agenda.
View attachment 234376

Isaac counts? Was that before or after his AT reveal for Ultimate?

 

[Bob-Omber]

Adding on to the idea that the Geno spirit in WOL is of the doll and not the star spirit, do you guys think that they would switch the current Geno spirit image to his fighter spirit and replace his WOL spirit with this?

Spoiler

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

No

Jokes aside, I think he's asking people who else is a supposed never ever like Isaac, Geno, etc.

Ahh, I see.

Well, I guess there is Lip and Takamaru, seeing as JP-centric series haven't gotten a playable character in Smash since Melee. The former finally got properly acknowledged in Ultimate, which is a step up from only her Stick hinting at her existence.

 

[Ze Diglett]

Ahh, I see.

Well, I guess there is Lip and Takamaru, seeing as JP-centric series haven't gotten a playable character in Smash since Melee.

We literally just got Dragon Quest, though...

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

We literally just got Dragon Quest, though...

I mean in the sense of "never got their stuff released overseas, period". At least Takamaru finally got his game here (albeit too late for it to matter immediately for Ultimate), whereas Panel De Pon just got the Kirby's Avalanche treatment for over a decade, on top of the series itself eventually being cancelled thanks to Planet Puzzle League.

 

[wynn728]

Right. So when you say they wasted their time with those 59 Assist Trophies like a page ago, you mean those four Assist Trophies. When you say, "they all suck" you mean, "they all suck, except for 55 of them". I'm not buying it dude, your argument has already shifted; you're clearly biased.

And hey, if a few obstructing ATs are enough to taint the entire well, don't forget about Togepi, Palkia and Exeggutor. The former of which turns the screen black, which is the same effect as "the worst Assist Trophy you can get".
Lotta holes...


Yeah, holding the Pokeball eliminates all aspects of RNG from it.

Plus, Pokeballs may carry a reminder of Pokemon you wanted. Depends who you like. There were Mimikyu supporters. There were Tapu Koko supporters. Zoroark, Victini, Deoxys, Meowth, Eevee, Blastoise, at some point in the series all these characters had people behind them. For a while some poor souls thought a Gardevoir leak had merit.

Each Assist Trophies have variation of garbage. Just because I say they all suck doesn't mean they all equally suck. Those four that I mentioned are the worst while others can just be extremely pointless like Thwomp, Stafy, and ect. There are Assist Trophies that can benefit others like Riki. I'm not going to go through all 59 Assist Trophies saying why each one are garbage. I personally hate them, call me bias all you want, I don't care. This is my opinion and I will keep my disgust with these worthless addition because Sakurai believes that making these characters into Assist Trophies is suppose to be great fanservice while it's actually just a giant middle finger to the fans of those characters.

I already admit that Pokeballs still have RNG, but I said there's more control to them than Assist Trophies which makes it better. If there's going to be some RNG I rather be in control on how it get's started, not pick it up and immediately get started.

Also, no offense to anyone, but you have to be a complete moron if you believed that any of those Pokemon had a chance of being playable. There is never going to be a Gen 3 & Gen 5 rep, it's too late for them. They only put in the current Pokemon Generation with the exception to Gen 1 since that's the one everyone knows. Once X & Y was out during Smash Bro 4 there was no hope for Zoroark or Victini. Diamond & Pearl being out during Brawl meant that Generation 3 is no long in consideration. And anyone who believed the Gardevoir "leak" all deserved to feel disappointed because anyone can tell you that was never going to happen. I felt no pity for those "poor" souls. They're never going to add a Pokemon from a previous generation as a fighter because we already know how this work, everyone is just setting themselves up for disappointment despite Sakurai coming out telling people how this whole thing works.

Assist Trophies are always going to be garbage and there's nothing that anyone can ever say is going to change my mind. I will tell Sakurai in his face that he wasted everyone's time with their development and rather he was at a beach sleeping on a hammock instead of making 59 Assist Trophies.

 

[T2by4]

Tfw 4chan keeps making fake leaks as soon as anything comes up that may hint at geno and then in the end it not end up coming true. I really hope this starling hint isn't bogus. Honestly, why can't the leaker just come out and put us out of our misery and say if it is Geno or not.

 

[ForsakenM]

There's nothing wrong with assist trophies conceptually, but they definitely aren't a proper or worthwhile way to represent characters people actually wanted. Kind of hard to get excited at a character who only has a 1/59 chance of showing up, and that's if an assist trophy even shows up on screen, and THAT's if people even have the things turned on in the first place. Ideally assist trophies would have been saved for normal enemies like koopas, metroids, deku babas, etc. Or characters that maybe wouldn't work as well as a fighter or would be a lot harder to translate into one, like the pong assist trophy.

It's also valid to be upset with a character being an assist trophy if, say, the character in question isn't properly represented themself. Looking at Isaac, while I'm upset at him being an AT, I'm also bothered because I think it does a bad job of showing off Isaac.

For one, I really dislike that they brought back his Brawl voice, considering it's too high-pitched and unfitting for him. He's supposed to be 16/17 years old, not 9/10 years old. Secondly, While they did give Isaac more moves in his assist trophy, he still doesn't have any of his earth-bending or plant-based venus psynergy, which is a pretty big facet of Isaac.

I guess I'll also add that, while there's nothing conceptually wrong with ATs, there's nothing really wrong with fan-requested characters being assists either, or atleast there wouldn't be if Smash had a more noteworthy assist feature. If they handled it like other fighters where you can actually choose what assists you have and if you had actual control on when or maybe what your assist does, and assist had an overall much larger presence, then I think many people would be much less against seeing characters they like being assists. if I could play as Megaman and have Shovel Knight and Isaac by my side at all times, I'd be a hell of alot happier with that than with "well, if I play with items on maybe I'll get lucky and gets to see Shovel Knight and Isaac for 10 seconds.."

You are a chill dude, so I hate to disagree and kind play with your own words, but...ATs ARE characters that wouldn't work well as a fighter/would be harder to make work as one. Most of the ATs and Pokemon are just too cool and crazy in their own right that, for Smash, they can't be really made into a fighter. Either their basic design or their core features can't be translated into a fighter without stretching or not being faithful to the series or character, and thus ATs and Pokemon exist. This rings true for most ATs and Pokemon.

Then there are a few like Isaac and Alucard and Zero and Knuckles. These are characters who are made into ATs due to a lack of time, priority or focus, or a lack of awareness. ATs like this have enough potential from their series to both properly feel like a fighter (so unlike Alolan Exeggcutor or PONG or Nintendogs) and have a fleshed out moveset unlike others who are only known for one or two things, but either Sakurai and his team didn't have enough time or resources OR other characters were a more important focus (like Simon and Joker) OR it was just unknown to Nintendo how clamored for that character was (aka Shadow or Isaac). Even so, these factors attribute to 'wouldn't work well as a fighter/would be hard to make work as one' as why would you spend time and resources you don't have to make a character playable if there doesn't seem to be a lot of demand (or you just aren't aware of it) and there are other characters that you know have big demand? Also, Sakurai sees it as a good thing, and it is a good thing. Fans are just insatiable and greedy. Not every character can be in Smash as playable, but they may be able to be in as an AT. Alucard was never going to be playable because Simon was the character people wanted, so throwing him in as an AT was just the icing on the Castlevania cake!

I wish people could understand this.

Isaac counts? Was that before or after his AT reveal for Ultimate?

While I think xpnc pretty much covered it with that pic, I'll go into detail here.

First off, a never-ever pick doesn't stop being a never-ever pick until they get in or Smash stops getting content and new games before that character gets in. Doesn't matter if they are an AT or Spirit or Pokemon or part of a stage or a boss.

Secondly, when it comes to 'never-ever' picks, I'd like to say the best way to describe them is the characters that everyone was talking about online during the Brawl speculation era. Characters like Ridley, King K. Rool, Geno, Banjo-Kazooie, and Isaac were heavily speculated around then, though I would also include Rayman and Lloyd Irving as I remember them being talked about a fair amount as well around then. Some people say Bandanna Waddle Dee and Waluigi had a lot of buzz around that time, but I really do not recall this: These two seem more like Smash 4/Smash Ultimate era buzz than Brawl.

Fun fact: I vaguely remembered something about a Smash Dojo the other day and looked it up. As it turned out, I was way into the speculation scene during Brawl as I remember looking at that webpage religiously in high school and waiting to see who got revealed. I thought I wasn't but I think I just wasn't on the forums much as my only forum activity was text role-play and I stopped doing that as much after middle school. I remember there was speculation around what 'Zero Suit Samus' was for people who didn't know Metroid and the running gag was that she would have 'zero suit' meaning she would be naked.

Ahh, simpler times.

 

[StarLight42]

If the Starling is a hint for Geno...then he has to be a Fighter's Pass character, right? I'm just kind of confused as to how they'd hear about a bonus character months and months off before hearing about the Fighter's Pass characters we are getting next.

I mean, unless they throw Bonus DLC into the middle of the pack, but I highly doubt they would do that.

 

[Geno Boost]

Hey guys, so I know this is PURE speculation, but I just wanted to brings a couple of things up.

First, ya boi Dooliss brought up something interesting in chat during my stream. There is a certain basic Mii Costume that did not get brought back for Ultimate, and that is:

Spoiler: Missing Mii Costume

Yep, randomly the Samurai Mii Costume for Mii Swordsman is missing, and we haven't had any sort of replacement that really fits it. But, you know what could replace it and make sense?

Spoiler: Cool Mii Costume Idea

So...how crazy would it be if we got a Boomer Mii Costume.

Also, if you are looking for possible dates, I would suggest looking towards either the new Nintendo tournament in August (which I highly doubt but it's there) or the tournament event in October that could show us something. Other than that, I have no idea other than to hurry up and wait and obviously the easy calls like a Fall Direct and a VGA announcement.

Since I am the only one who modeled Boomer in 3D I think I might try to make render of a mii sword fighter wearing a Boomer costume if I had enough time
Or make a fake leak picture about it lol

 

[ForsakenM]

Tfw 4chan keeps making fake leaks as soon as anything comes up that may hint at geno and then in the end it not end up coming true. I really hope this starling hint isn't bogus. Honestly, why can't the leaker just come out and put us out of our misery and say if it is Geno or not.

I mean, I feel like it should be obvious as to why. Obviously his standing with Nintendo and reputation. Also, he likes to be a little coy about big reveals from Nintendo. Never forget that Link's Awakening was a picture of a blue crab and even Sabi didn't get it until the NoA source spelled it out for her.

Also, don't take the Banjo-Kazooie image hint as a pattern break for his cryptic nature. I cannot see a way you COULD be cryptic about Banjo-Kazooie via an image unless you tried REALLY hard. However, I will say that so far his Smash image leaks have been straight forward, which could mean this image of the starling is for something that isn't Smash-related.

If the Starling is a hint for Geno...then he has to be a Fighter's Pass character, right? I'm just kind of confused as to how they'd hear about a bonus character months and months off before hearing about the Fighter's Pass characters we are getting next.

I mean, unless they throw Bonus DLC into the middle of the pack, but I highly doubt they would do that.

Nintendo can do whatever they want, cuz they Nintendo.

 

[GenoStrike]

I think the biggest piece of evidence for Geno is the 2 copyright claims made by Nintendo on SMRPG songs. Square has been consistent in only giving 2 songs per game/character and this would make sense why Nintendo made the claim as they would have some sort of rights to them for Smash.

I dunno if I buy the "starling" image as Geno evidence.

 

[SSGuy]

I think the biggest piece of evidence for Geno is the 2 copyright claims made by Nintendo on SMRPG songs. Square has been consistent in only giving 2 songs per game/character and this would make sense why Nintendo made the claim as they would have some sort of rights to them for Smash.

I dunno if I buy the "starling" image as Geno evidence.

It's more how the Banjo music was claimed which is making me wonder if this is the pattern repeating itself.

 

[wynn728]

At the very least Isaac wasn't left out of the game this time like he was in Smash 4. It sucks that he's not playable as I know he was one of the most highly wanted characters, but at least he wasn't forgotten.

I rather he was left out like in Smash Bros 4 instead of being an Assist Trophy. Sure he wasn't forgotten, but Sakurai remind us by saying he wasn't worth consider being playable while Piranha Plant is.

 

[GenoStrike]

It's more how the Banjo music was claimed which is making me wonder if this is the pattern repeating itself.

Didn't hear about that. Could you elaborate please? Banjo songs claimed by Nintendo prior to his announcement, I guess?

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Tfw 4chan keeps making fake leaks as soon as anything comes up that may hint at geno and then in the end it not end up coming true. I really hope this starling hint isn't bogus. Honestly, why can't the leaker just come out and put us out of our misery and say if it is Geno or not.

Because attachment-related will happen.

Just remember, good things come to those who wait. One simply doesn't know how long the wait has to be.

Didn't hear about that. Could you elaborate please? Banjo songs claimed by Nintendo prior to his announcement, I guess?

Long story short, an account that posted Ultimate rips also uploaded fan remixes, some of which are for BK. Fans mostly wrote it off as a simple consequence of a thoughtless manhunt for any copyrighted material, rather than tipping off that the series was intended to be used in Smash and the intern thought those fan remixes might have been a leak.

 

[Loog]

Spoiler

If the Starling is a hint for Geno...then he has to be a Fighter's Pass character, right? I'm just kind of confused as to how they'd hear about a bonus character months and months off before hearing about the Fighter's Pass characters we are getting next.

I mean, unless they throw Bonus DLC into the middle of the pack, but I highly doubt they would do that.

Maybe an anouncement is arriving sooner than we think?

 

[StarLight42]

Maybe an anouncement is arriving sooner than we think?

I mean i hope but at this point its seeming the hint may be for something far off in the future

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Ahh, I see.

Well, I guess there is Lip and Takamaru, seeing as JP-centric series haven't gotten a playable character in Smash since Melee. The former finally got properly acknowledged in Ultimate, which is a step up from only her Stick hinting at her existence.

Lucas was added in Brawl and his specific game, Mother 3, was Japan-only. Though to be fair, Sakurai was confident Mother 3 would be localized when he was adding Lucas, and that turned out to not be the case

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

We've been waiting for years, a few more months won't hurt. It's potentially not nearly as far as it used to be.

It's best to not expect anything until August ends.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

If the Starling is a hint for Geno...then he has to be a Fighter's Pass character, right? I'm just kind of confused as to how they'd hear about a bonus character months and months off before hearing about the Fighter's Pass characters we are getting next.

I mean, unless they throw Bonus DLC into the middle of the pack, but I highly doubt they would do that.

Well if you take this picture below into account.

A bonus fighter doesn't seem that impossible of an idea for Geno.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I find the whole thing silly.

We're not supposed to expect other fighter passes after this, but individual bonus characters are somehow a-okay?

I honestly wonder if Street Fighter V fans used this reasoning for Kage being released by himself before E. Honda, Lucia and Poison's reveals happened...

 

[Door Key Pig]

You are a chill dude, so I hate to disagree and kind play with your own words, but...ATs ARE characters that wouldn't work well as a fighter/would be harder to make work as one. Most of the ATs and Pokemon are just too cool and crazy in their own right that, for Smash, they can't be really made into a fighter. Either their basic design or their core features can't be translated into a fighter without stretching or not being faithful to the series or character, and thus ATs and Pokemon exist. This rings true for most ATs and Pokemon.

Then there are a few like Isaac and Alucard and Zero and Knuckles. These are characters who are made into ATs due to a lack of time, priority or focus, or a lack of awareness. ATs like this have enough potential from their series to both properly feel like a fighter (so unlike Alolan Exeggcutor or PONG or Nintendogs) and have a fleshed out moveset unlike others who are only known for one or two things, but either Sakurai and his team didn't have enough time or resources OR other characters were a more important focus (like Simon and Joker) OR it was just unknown to Nintendo how clamored for that character was (aka Shadow or Isaac). Even so, these factors attribute to 'wouldn't work well as a fighter/would be hard to make work as one' as why would you spend time and resources you don't have to make a character playable if there doesn't seem to be a lot of demand (or you just aren't aware of it) and there are other characters that you know have big demand? Also, Sakurai sees it as a good thing, and it is a good thing. Fans are just insatiable and greedy. Not every character can be in Smash as playable, but they may be able to be in as an AT. Alucard was never going to be playable because Simon was the character people wanted, so throwing him in as an AT was just the icing on the Castlevania cake!

I wish people could understand this.



While I think xpnc pretty much covered it with that pic, I'll go into detail here.

First off, a never-ever pick doesn't stop being a never-ever pick until they get in or Smash stops getting content and new games before that character gets in. Doesn't matter if they are an AT or Spirit or Pokemon or part of a stage or a boss.

Secondly, when it comes to 'never-ever' picks, I'd like to say the best way to describe them is the characters that everyone was talking about online during the Brawl speculation era. Characters like Ridley, King K. Rool, Geno, Banjo-Kazooie, and Isaac were heavily speculated around then, though I would also include Rayman and Lloyd Irving as I remember them being talked about a fair amount as well around then. Some people say Bandanna Waddle Dee and Waluigi had a lot of buzz around that time, but I really do not recall this: These two seem more like Smash 4/Smash Ultimate era buzz than Brawl.

Fun fact: I vaguely remembered something about a Smash Dojo the other day and looked it up. As it turned out, I was way into the speculation scene during Brawl as I remember looking at that webpage religiously in high school and waiting to see who got revealed. I thought I wasn't but I think I just wasn't on the forums much as my only forum activity was text role-play and I stopped doing that as much after middle school. I remember there was speculation around what 'Zero Suit Samus' was for people who didn't know Metroid and the running gag was that she would have 'zero suit' meaning she would be naked.

Ahh, simpler times.

I mean hey, if Geno gets in that's at least all the "never-evers" Nintendo was aware of at the time, right? That'd still be really impressive. Tho maybe Isaac's support wasn't on their level then?
EDIT: Also, oh poor Shadow, not getting Nintendo notice like that...

 

[xpnc]

Isaac counts? Was that before or after his AT reveal for Ultimate?

I don't know what you mean. Isaac has been one of the most heavily requested characters for over a decade.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

I find the whole thing silly.

We're not supposed to expect other fighter passes after this, but individual bonus characters are somehow a-okay?

I honestly wonder if Street Fighter V fans used this reasoning for Kage being released by himself before E. Honda, Lucia and Poison's reveals happened...

Well in terms of what a Bonus character would entail, Geno would be a playable character with two music tracks (Probably original tracks knowing Square Enix) to go with the Super Mario series stages so pretty much like Corrin from Smash 4. That's far less work than a Character, a unique stage with both Battlefield and Ω forms along with a seemingly consistent list of 8 music tracks, two being remixes with the other 6 being originals and an extra mode to go along with it.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I mean hey, if Geno gets in that's at least all the "never-evers" Nintendo was aware of at the time, right? That'd still be really impressive. Tho maybe Isaac's support wasn't on their level then?
EDIT: Also, oh poor Shadow, not getting Nintendo notice like that...

Well, to be fair, the Sonic fanbase can't seem to agree on much of anything, so character support doesn't appear to have budged since Brawl in that area. Also, Smash's apparent focus on other Sega-related characters in the meantime. Maybe the Grinch incident is the bucket of ice cold water in the face that was needed to finally get their act together and focus on one character first (preferably Tails or Eggman).