Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[StarLight42]

Which has nothing to do with the point I was talking about with Spirits. As well as unrelated entirely? I was talking about Fighter's Pass stuff only.

Whether or not it was planned for base game, the Spirits would've been removed either way. It was either moved to DLC or going to be that from the start, and when related Spirits were put in separately by his staff, they removed them.

It’s not unrelated at all. Not sure how you’re seeing in that way.

The Piranha spirit was saved until he himself came out.

The only other characters we have from the fighter pass as of now are ones who likely wouldn’t have had a spirit if they were not in either way.

So your argument comes off as weak, most spirits deconfirm arguments do to me.

 

[wynn728]

It's crazy how many people still have the "spirits deconfirm" mindset, even though no actual evidence that proves that spirits deconfirm actually exists. Not to mention, trophies didn't deconfirm Mewtwo and Lucas in Smash 4. Both of their trophies even had different models.

I would say that the DLC for Smash Ultimate was more planned out than compare to Smash 4. When Smash Bros 3DS was release it seems like they weren't sure if they were going to make DLC or not, then a month later with the 50-Fact video about Smash Bros Wii U they showed off an incomplete model of Mewtwo being announced. So that means they just started working on DLC like Mewtwo when Smash 3DS was released. So my assumption is that Sakurai & his team spent most of their time working on the 3DS version without thinking that they would do DLC, so when selecting fighters Mewtwo & Lucas being trophies wasn't holding them back.

But with Ultimate they're more prepared with the DLC. They know exactly how many fighters they want to make and created full CGI trailers for each DLC character. These characters were chosen way in advance during the development of Ultimate when compare to Smash Bros 4 DLC. So I believe that if they knew who they were going to choose as DLC then they would turn all the other characters not involved into Spirits.

I'm not saying that those png files are holding these characters back, I'm saying that they got those Spirits because there wasn't any plans for them. If they were to make a bonus fighter or a second wave of DLC then Spirits aren't going to hold any character back, I even go on the argument that even Assist Trophies & Mii Costume won't hold any character back for a second wave DLC. But for the current Fighters Pass seems unlikely seeing how each new Fighter brings their own Spirit Board which means that they really planned this out for Ultimate. Ultimate was developed with DLC in mind.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

It’s not unrelated at all. Not sure how you’re seeing in that way.

The Piranha spirit was saved until he himself came out.

The only other characters we have from the fighter pass as of now are ones who likely wouldn’t have had a spirit if they were not in either way.

So your argument comes off as weak, most spirits deconfirm arguments do to me.

Oh, I see, you mistook what I meant. I was never once talking about PP earlier. I was solely referring to the Fighter's Pass.

PP was planned to be in the game from day one, DLC or not. Fighter's Pass is a completely different story and decided on way later.

For Sakurai, it made perfect sense to remove the Spirits related to PP before the final decision was made, because at that point, PP was already going to be DLC(again, it doesn't matter if it was planned for base or not, because it'd be decided most likely before Spirits were finished anyway in for it to even relate to the Spirits being removed).

What I'm talking about is the decision for the Fighter's Pass characters might've happened around when Sakurai finished removing Spirits, or was even looking at both at the same time while figuring out things. That's the only real correlation Spirits have to Fighter's Pass characters. Otherwise, he's not going to worry about over 1000 Spirits as is. That's overthinking it. Especially when you don't need to make new file names or even new character names.

 

[Vector Victor]

The annoying thing with spirits deconfirm argument is that the World of Light can easily debunk it and make use of spirits to DLC fighters in-story. The base roster were the ones ready to fight while the DLC group didn't reach the meeting point. Everyone gets zapped, but they use base roster to make the puppet fighters which the base fight to free the spirits. Why can't DLC fighters be spirits who were freed, recovered their bodies and decide to join the fight afterwards? That seems less crazy than immediately writing off 1300+ characters from being considered as Ultimate fighters.

 

[MissingGlitch]

"Spirits totally deconfirm characters you guys"
Me: *looks over and sees the 40 different Mario spirits*
"No not like that"

 

[riggsbass]

Friendly reminder that if I keep trolling the people who hate Geno on the GameFAQs board with "He's in boys" commentslong enough, there is no way that Sakurai could refuse to let our boy in.

So... he's in, boys.

 

[wynn728]

The annoying thing with spirits deconfirm argument is that the World of Light can easily debunk it and make use of spirits to DLC fighters in-story. The base roster were the ones ready to fight while the DLC group didn't reach the meeting point. Everyone gets zapped, but they use base roster to make the puppet fighters which the base fight to free the spirits. Why can't DLC fighters be spirits who were freed, recovered their bodies and decide to join the fight afterwards? That seems less crazy than immediately writing off 1300+ characters from being considered as Ultimate fighters.

In game explanation says that those spirits are the characters that lost their bodies and unable to return to the real world, and when we get rid of a Spirit it's our way to return them to the real world. Basically freeing them. As for the DLC characters that didn't just not show up in the meeting place, they were never there to begin with. Galeem attack covered the entire world and Sakurai said the only way Kirby escape was because he warped out of there, being the only character that could do that; even saying that Bayonetta couldn't escape if she went to Purgatorio. So each DLC character were never there in that world. How they showed up? I dunno, magic.

But the spirits aren't deconfirming the characters, they were turn into Spirits because there was no plan for them to be part of the DLC.

 

[Door Key Pig]

So, not getting the Chocobo hat is one thing, Final Fantasy in that whole copyright stinginess stuff.

But Mario RPG was the one other Square thing to get content in the form of spirits (as well as Palutena's Guidance references) whilst Final Fantasy couldn't even get the alternate origin artwork PNGs for Cloud's. And they totally could have coupled the old costume with Hero ala Tails and Knuckles's with Joker.

Is just odd is all.

 

[Vector Victor]

"Spirits totally deconfirm characters you guys"
Me: *looks over and sees the 40 different Mario spirits*
"No not like that"

Kaptain K Rool and K Roolenstien are spirits, so that means K Rool can't be playable as they are all the SAME PERSON. Checkmate.

Again, the above, Petey evolving from Nipper, random objects as spirits (help, I'm possessed by a race car!), Masked Man being ripped from fan art instead of using his official sprite, Porky missing completely, young Samus being a spirit. Clearly there is some inconsistencies done when spirits were made.

Plus, we have playable Mario and playable Doctor Mario, who is just Mario in an outfit, side by side, but that doesn't break reality, but Geno's jpg image is the deal breaker for believability?

 

[Deleted member]

It is also worth to note that Sakurai could just use his fighter render for Geno's new spirit as he did with Robin and Cloud.

 

[Firox]

I go to SmashFAQs (as I have no standards apparently) and immediately see two threads celebrating that the Mii costume wasn't shown, but they're celebrating because they think this means the costume isn't coming back and they HOPE Geno gets nothing in the end.

Geno is the new Ridley: the anti group has become far more vocal, obnoxious and obsessed with Geno than the fans.

These are the people I will find great joy shoving that sweet crow down their throats when Geno finally gets in.

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

Considering the lineup of fighters for DLC, I think Geno is in. This is ignoring all the fan rules, like Spirits and stuff. Here's my thoughts on it:
Reggie's words can be taken so many different ways. "Unexpected." "Something new to Smash." Could mean a franchise. Could mean a choice people would doubt in. Looking at the three characters we have, we've gotten:
Joker
Hero (Eleven, Eight, Solo, and Erdrick)
Banjo & Kazooie

What do they have in common?
They're all really popular characters in their own right.
Joker- A pretty recognizable JRPG protagonist
Hero- Heavily recognizable JRPG protagonists
Banjo & Kazooie- Massive Smash request

Considering each character's popularity, it's safe to assume that #4 & #5 will likely be big characters in their own right too. Geno is a very big character to this fandom and Sakurai has made note of that plenty of times before.

Not only that but all these characters have unique mechanics:
Joker- Arsene
Hero- JRPG Commands
Banjo & Kazooie- Not yet revealed but seems to be collectathon themed attacks.
Geno would fit this common trait too, utilizing the highly speculated timed hit mechanic.

That doesn't guarantee him a slot but that's my food for thought on the matter.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Happy birthday, Geno Boost !

———————

The problem I have with the Spirits Disconfirm argument is that it’s very likely all the Spirits stuff was worked on in 2017 if not as early as 2016, and they could’ve allowed and helped to get Spirits like Geno before finishing their DLC plans, which were only shared with Sakurai and his team in January last year, with Sakurai having some form of control over it. We have no evidence that they would’ve removed Spirits later on due to being DLC, either. They likely wouldn’t remove any that were probably already allowed in, anyway, as there wouldn’t really be a need to. You can already have multiple Geno spirits and stuff, anyway.

Seriously, all Spirits aside from the masters are literally just stickers or trophies with buffs, and nothing makes sense because you can have multiple of each. They can just add (SMRPG) to Geno’s current Spirit and just use his fighter render for his fighter spirit, just like Cloud and Wii Fit.

I really doubt they would’ve removed Geno’s spirit; there’s no need to, it was likely already planned and worked on, and it’s not really any different from the Lucas and Mewtwo situation in Smash 4. It’s not like we don’t already have equippable Spirits like Pit (Classic) and Super Sonic, which are canonically the same character as their base fighters and should really just prove they’re fancy stickers.

 

[MissingGlitch]

Kaptain K Rool and K Roolenstien are spirits, so that means K Rool can't be playable as they are all the SAME PERSON. Checkmate.

Again, the above, Petey evolving from Nipper, random objects as spirits (help, I'm possessed by a race car!), Masked Man being ripped from fan art instead of using his official sprite, Porky missing completely, young Samus being a spirit. Clearly there is some inconsistencies done when spirits were made.

Plus, we have playable Mario and playable Doctor Mario, who is just Mario in an outfit, side by side, but that doesn't break reality, but Geno's jpg image is the deal breaker for believability?

Make Geno's Fighter Spirit his Smash render like they did with Cloud. Boom problem solved. I'll take my paycheck now Nintendo.

 

[Deleted member]

On the topic of unexpected comebacks....

JOHNNY THUNDER IS RETURNING AS PART OF THE UPCOMING LEGO CMF SERIES!!!

Sorry for the off-topic news, but this is a huge deal for me.

 

[RingJ5]

I’ve noticed a particular pattern with Mii Costumes that could indicate Geno’s overall chances if we hear nothing regarding him before Banjo releases.

Joker: Four costumes from his home series, and two costumes from other franchises by his company.
Hero: Four costumes from his home series, and nothing else.

If Banjo releases with four Banjo/Rare costumes, and two other Microsoft ones(like, Steve and Master Chief or maybe Steve and Creeper Head) then suddenly a pattern emerges that makes the missing Square costumes especially strange, and could be a great indicator of something later on down the line.

Of course, this theory could be ruined if Banjo comes with more than six costumes, but it’s worth keeping in mind.

 

[StarLight42]

Considering the lineup of fighters for DLC, I think Geno is in. This is ignoring all the fan rules, like Spirits and stuff. Here's my thoughts on it:
Reggie's words can be taken so many different ways. "Unexpected." "Something new to Smash." Could mean a franchise. Could mean a choice people would doubt in. Looking at the three characters we have, we've gotten:
Joker
Hero (Eleven, Eight, Solo, and Erdrick)
Banjo & Kazooie

What do they have in common?
They're all really popular characters in their own right.
Joker- A pretty recognizable JRPG protagonist
Hero- Heavily recognizable JRPG protagonists
Banjo & Kazooie- Massive Smash request

Considering each character's popularity, it's safe to assume that #4 & #5 will likely be big characters in their own right too. Geno is a very big character to this fandom and Sakurai has made note of that plenty of times before.

Not only that but all these characters have unique mechanics:
Joker- Arsene
Hero- JRPG Commands
Banjo & Kazooie- Not yet revealed but seems to be collectathon themed attacks.
Geno would fit this common trait too, utilizing the highly speculated timed hit mechanic.

That doesn't guarantee him a slot but that's my food for thought on the matter.

This seems like wishful thinking to me. Joker really isn’t that recognizable (flashbacks to December when a bunch of people were asking who he was). DQ is recognizable but way more in Japan, Hero seems like fanservice for Japan, while an advertisement for DQXIS in the states. Banjo was the only one who was pure fanservice and not much else.

I’m still thinking Joker got in because of Sakurai. Doesn’t seem like a character Nintendo would pick.

 

[ivanlerma]

Damn, I didn't get added

Neither have I, I think we'll be added later.

 

[Vector Victor]

Make Geno's Fighter Spirit his Smash render like they did with Cloud. Boom problem solved. I'll take my paycheck now Nintendo.

-Rolled up newspaper to nose- No. NO. Its impossible. Completely ironclad impossible.


And as people try to use Nipper turning into Petey and Plant not having a spirit, remember how this is the same development team who made a specific model for Alfonzo to drive the spirit train as Toon Link the conductor and fighter would be too confusing to people and unrealistic (how can be fight if he's driving a train!) but didn't change Robin's final Smash or victory (despite changing others) so you can have Robin summon Chrom to attack Chrom while Chrom then lightly applauds Chrom and Robin's victory.

Not every action is they do is ironclad. Exceptions exist.

 

[MomijiInubashiri630]

I was just thinking his fighter spirit image could just be his sprite lol

 

[RingJ5]

This seems like wishful thinking to me. Joker really isn’t that recognizable (flashbacks to December when a bunch of people were asking who he was). DQ is recognizable but way more in Japan, Hero seems like fanservice for Japan, while an advertisement for DQXIS in the states. Banjo was the only one who was pure fanservice and not much else.

I’m still thinking Joker got in because of Sakurai. Doesn’t seem like a character Nintendo would pick.

Joker’s quite recognizable on the PS4 side of things which added massive shock value to the first reveal, and basically acts as the Cloud of SMT, which itself is a series with a massive Nintendo-specific history. I wouldn’t be surprised if Nintendo specifically wanted “a SMT rep”, and Sakurai went “I know he’s not really on Nintendo systems, but does Joker count?” And the rest is history.

 

[SSGuy]

Just a small PSA

Let's be sure to be humble in our research. Don't go out bragging that 'Geno is in' to GameSpot, 4chan, etc when we literally have no idea if he is in or not.

I don't want to turn our group into a bunch of Soras and have people despise us just for the sake or being arrogant and obnoxious to others.

Just keep the hype in check and be patient and logical. Don't end up looking like a clown in the event we get Blyth or something. It just provides others with more ammunition and creates a Plant Gang 2.0 scenario.

I strongly believe we are better than that.

 

[YsDisciple]

Following up with what I brought up earlier, looking back at the August 8, 2018 Smash Direct; said Direct began with Simon, and Richter Belmont's reveal (characters that have been requested for Smash since a long time), and ended with King K. Rool's reveal (another requested character that many thought had little chances). EVO 2018 ended on August 5th (three days prior to the Smash Direct).

If Nintendo and Sakurai are going with a patter here, I could see the following outcomes of a potential Smash Direct post EVO 2019.

a. Smash Direct starts with Banjo & Kazooie gameplay, Sakurai goes over the character and later on discusses upcoming content. The Direct ends with the reveal of either:
1. Bonus DLC character (Geno), or
2. DLC Fighter #4

b. Smash Direct starts with the reveal of DLC Fighter #4 (CG trailer, and a bit of gameplay). Direct ends with the reveal of DLC Fighter #5.

c. The Smash Direct could contain information that no one expected.

 

[MissingGlitch]

I was just thinking his fighter spirit image could just be his sprite lol

That pose only reminds me of one thing.

 

[Datboigeno]

Just a small PSA

Let's be sure to be humble in our research. Don't go out bragging that 'Geno is in' to GameSpot, 4chan, etc when we literally have no idea if he is in or not.

I don't want to turn our group into a bunch of Soras and have people despise us just for the sake or being arrogant and obnoxious to others.

Just keep the hype in check and be patient and logical. Don't end up looking like a clown in the event we get Blyth or something. It just provides others with more ammunition and creates a Plant Gang 2.0 scenario.

I strongly believe we are better than that.

Are a sizable amount of people actually doing this though? I see much more people outside of the thread saying he’s absolutely not it and never going to be in, and more people here warning people off from “being embarrassing” and delusional than people actually saying he’s absolutely in and being embarrassing.

 

[riggsbass]

Just a small PSA

Let's be sure to be humble in our research. Don't go out bragging that 'Geno is in' to GameSpot, 4chan, etc when we literally have no idea if he is in or not.

I don't want to turn our group into a bunch of Soras and have people despise us just for the sake or being arrogant and obnoxious to others.

Just keep the hype in check and be patient and logical. Don't end up looking like a clown in the event we get Blyth or something. It just provides others with more ammunition and creates a Plant Gang 2.0 scenario.

I strongly believe we are better than that.

As an admitted proprietor of this, I mostly have done it to combat the Geno hate on the GameFAQs forum... I'm mostly trolling, but in retrospect I think this is a good wake up call to stop and let it be... I guess I just can't tolerate (nor understand) the hate. I don't think our fandom for this guy really calls for the hate we receive. We're definitely the underdogs here, so I just keep the confidence because I can't see why not. But when someone throws one of those cliche'd reasons at us, I just wanna argue it....

At the benefit of the community, I'll keep it down.

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

This seems like wishful thinking to me. Joker really isn’t that recognizable (flashbacks to December when a bunch of people were asking who he was). DQ is recognizable but way more in Japan, Hero seems like fanservice for Japan, while an advertisement for DQXIS in the states. Banjo was the only one who was pure fanservice and not much else.

I’m still thinking Joker got in because of Sakurai. Doesn’t seem like a character Nintendo would pick.

I meant that Hero and Joker are big characters in Japan while Banjo was an overall fan pick.

 

[MattX20]

Happy Birthday Geno Boost

 

[MissingGlitch]

My Birthday is on the 7th. If Nintendo can just go ahead and announce Geno before that date, it would make a great birthday gift thanks.

 

[MajoraMan28]

The annoying thing with spirits deconfirm argument is that the World of Light can easily debunk it and make use of spirits to DLC fighters in-story. The base roster were the ones ready to fight while the DLC group didn't reach the meeting point. Everyone gets zapped, but they use base roster to make the puppet fighters which the base fight to free the spirits. Why can't DLC fighters be spirits who were freed, recovered their bodies and decide to join the fight afterwards? That seems less crazy than immediately writing off 1300+ characters from being considered as Ultimate fighters.

It doesn't debunk it, though. The idea is that fighter spirits are different from regular spirits, both mechanically and in naming standards.
DLC fighters haven't brought anything conflicting to the general state of the game.

 

[Deleted member]

Yeah Happy Birthday Geno Boost !

 

[StarLight42]

Just a small PSA

Let's be sure to be humble in our research. Don't go out bragging that 'Geno is in' to GameSpot, 4chan, etc when we literally have no idea if he is in or not.

I don't want to turn our group into a bunch of Soras and have people despise us just for the sake or being arrogant and obnoxious to others.

Just keep the hype in check and be patient and logical. Don't end up looking like a clown in the event we get Blyth or something. It just provides others with more ammunition and creates a Plant Gang 2.0 scenario.

I strongly believe we are better than that.

Pretty much every Smash community gets toxic at the topic of Geno. Mention him once, and you’ll get a barrage of “waaaah irrelevant”, “he’s a spirit”, “(hawkeye dont give me hope meme)”, “he’ll never be in smash”.

It’s especially bad on GameFAQS, the community that seems to think lacking the Geno Mii Costume in the Hero demo makes him out of the running for good... ummm, what? That’s literally the opposite of what Mii Costumes do.

All in all; if this is indeed finally a victory for the Geno bros, make sure to only flaunt that victory after the fact. Don’t celebrate early.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Honestly looking at that thread on resetera it pretty much seemed like several people who have written off Geno’s chances of being playable circlejerking how impossible it is and then someone posted what sabi said in discord without the context that Sabi is legally on thin ice to **** on the whole starling hint and make you look like a liar. Some people still really don’t want to believe Geno has any chance whatsoever to get in this game.

It looked to me like ResetEra people were misconstruing information deliberately to adhere to their biases. When we have witnesses saying it's the same NoA source besides Sabi, it looks more like covering herself and, particularly, her source(s) after that C&D.

I think you're both being too harsh on ResetERA. I frequent the Smash threads over there quite a bit these days to get a perspective outside of SmashBoards. There really isn't a whole lot of bias against or any towards Geno over there. It's mostly just people dismissing his chances for different reasons that are pretty arguably valid in many instances and then sometimes people show some real support. The only issues here are the Sabi quote (which to be entirely honest, Sabi could have also just said nothing, but she specifically chose to comment on this matter in that way, which you have to admit is curious... not to mention Sabi's whole C&D thing has always been kind of a weird point and she still talks more about Nintendo than I thought would be reasonable for someone threatened with legal action) and people thinking that the "bird picture" stuff is absurd and stupid (I agree completely on that point). Honestly, ResetERA has always seemed like one of the more rational and reasonable places for Geno discussion.

"Spirits totally deconfirm characters you guys"
Me: *looks over and sees the 40 different Mario spirits*
"No not like that"

Kaptain K Rool and K Roolenstien are spirits, so that means K Rool can't be playable as they are all the SAME PERSON. Checkmate.

Again, the above, Petey evolving from Nipper, random objects as spirits (help, I'm possessed by a race car!), Masked Man being ripped from fan art instead of using his official sprite, Porky missing completely, young Samus being a spirit. Clearly there is some inconsistencies done when spirits were made.

Plus, we have playable Mario and playable Doctor Mario, who is just Mario in an outfit, side by side, but that doesn't break reality, but Geno's jpg image is the deal breaker for believability?

Stop mischaracterizing the point people make with Spirits and deconfirms for the Fighter's Pass, I'm tired of seeing this brought up every time someone makes a legitimate point about Spirits and the Fighter's Pass. Base game doesn't affect base game and is completely different from DLC. As Verde Coeden Scalesworth pointed out, Sakurai would have just removed Spirits at the end of development if they were going to be DLC since there are 1300 already and five won't matter (assuming any Fighter's Pass character even has anything close to a chance of being a Spirit, none of the three so far did). You wouldn't scrub the Spirits of existing planned fighters that are already in the base game because there is nothing to spoil or to show off at a later point, the entire base game drops at once. And this only impacts the Fighter's Pass because they would have been worked on concurrently and all DLC would have been decided prior to the game going gold, which we know for a fact. That doesn't mean future characters or bonus characters can't have had Spirits, but the Fighter's Pass was clearly developed/planned alongside the base game and its Spirits, where it would make sense to scrub (and given our current DLC) two Spirits if they were somehow planned for the Fighter's Pass (I guess three since you'd have to take Mallow out as well, but we didn't really expect Super Mario RPG Spirits to begin with, so their absence wouldn't have been super noteworthy). It's not that you couldn't have the Spirit next to the character, it's why would you choose to leave the Spirit in when you knew the DLC was coming with them later on? It's not a big deal to drop a couple Spirits when you have 1300 others.

 

[osby]

This seems like wishful thinking to me. Joker really isn’t that recognizable (flashbacks to December when a bunch of people were asking who he was). DQ is recognizable but way more in Japan, Hero seems like fanservice for Japan, while an advertisement for DQXIS in the states. Banjo was the only one who was pure fanservice and not much else.

I’m still thinking Joker got in because of Sakurai. Doesn’t seem like a character Nintendo would pick.

I meant that Hero and Joker are big characters in Japan while Banjo was an overall fan pick.

And Japanese people can't be fans because?

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

And Japanese people can't be fans because?

I didn't say they weren't Smash fans, I said that they're pretty big in Japan, regardless of Smash Bros or in general

 

[StarLight42]

And Japanese people can't be fans because?

That’s a pretty baseless accusation. When did I ever say that?

 

[bardbowman]

I think people are misinterpreting a lot of the hype around here.

Most of us aren’t saying Geno’s confirmed. Heck, a fair number of us weren’t saying that pre-release, despite everything seemingly pointing his way.

It’s just that, in the past few months, we’ve seen things. Things that suggest there might still be hope.

And remember, before the starling picture, and before the Hero presentation, the majority of the people here felt his chances were basically dead.

So to go from that to seeing once again that he might still get in after all? That’s huge. That’s exciting. That presents possibilities where there used to be none at all.

But it doesn’t confirm Geno. And we all know this.

So...I guess I’m saying don’t interpret our excitement over a possibility as excitement over a belief that he’s a lock.

 

[osby]

I didn't say they weren't Smash fans, I said that they're pretty big in Japan, regardless of Smash Bros or in general

Banjo is also pretty popular in Japan for a N64 game. And I wouldn't say Persona 5 is unknown in the West.

That’s a pretty baseless accusation. When did I ever say that?

You literally said Banjo is the only "pure" fanservice pick right after saying Hero is added for fanservice to Japanese fans.

 

[StarLight42]

I think you're both being too harsh on ResetERA. I frequent the Smash threads over there quite a bit these days to get a perspective outside of SmashBoards. There really isn't a whole lot of bias against or any towards Geno over there. It's mostly just people dismissing his chances for different reasons that are pretty arguably valid in many instances and then sometimes people show some real support. The only issues here are the Sabi quote (which to be entirely honest, Sabi could have also just said nothing, but she specifically chose to comment on this matter in that way, which you have to admit is curious... not to mention Sabi's whole C&D thing has always been kind of a weird point and she still talks more about Nintendo than I thought would be reasonable for someone threatened with legal action) and people thinking that the "bird picture" stuff is absurd and stupid (I agree completely on that point). Honestly, ResetERA has always seemed like one of the more rational and reasonable places for Geno discussion.




Stop mischaracterizing the point people make with Spirits and deconfirms for the Fighter's Pass, I'm tired of seeing this brought up every time someone makes a legitimate point about Spirits and the Fighter's Pass. Base game doesn't affect base game and is completely different from DLC. As Verde Coeden Scalesworth pointed out, Sakurai would have just removed Spirits at the end of development if they were going to be DLC since there are 1300 already and five won't matter (assuming any Fighter's Pass character even has anything close to a chance of being a Spirit, none of the three so far did). You wouldn't scrub the Spirits of existing planned fighters that are already in the base game because there is nothing to spoil or to show off at a later point, the entire base game drops at once. And this only impacts the Fighter's Pass because they would have been worked on concurrently and all DLC would have been decided prior to the game going gold, which we know for a fact. That doesn't mean future characters or bonus characters can't have had Spirits, but the Fighter's Pass was clearly developed/planned alongside the base game and its Spirits, where it would make sense to scrub (and given our current DLC) two Spirits if they were somehow planned for the Fighter's Pass (I guess three since you'd have to take Mallow out as well, but we didn't really expect Super Mario RPG Spirits to begin with, so their absence wouldn't have been super noteworthy). It's not that you couldn't have the Spirit next to the character, it's why would you choose to leave the Spirit in when you knew the DLC was coming with them later on? It's not a big deal to drop a couple Spirits when you have 1300 others.

Uhh, I highly doubt Banjo, Hero, or Joker would’ve been spirits if they were not planned as DLC. This just kind of ruins this whole argument. Every single “spirits deconfirm” argument I see has loopholes like this.

 

[TheCJBrine]

I think you're both being too harsh on ResetERA. I frequent the Smash threads over there quite a bit these days to get a perspective outside of SmashBoards. There really isn't a whole lot of bias against or any towards Geno over there. It's mostly just people dismissing his chances for different reasons that are pretty arguably valid in many instances and then sometimes people show some real support. The only issues here are the Sabi quote (which to be entirely honest, Sabi could have also just said nothing, but she specifically chose to comment on this matter in that way, which you have to admit is curious... not to mention Sabi's whole C&D thing has always been kind of a weird point and she still talks more about Nintendo than I thought would be reasonable for someone threatened with legal action) and people thinking that the "bird picture" stuff is absurd and stupid (I agree completely on that point). Honestly, ResetERA has always seemed like one of the more rational and reasonable places for Geno discussion.




Stop mischaracterizing the point people make with Spirits and deconfirms for the Fighter's Pass, I'm tired of seeing this brought up every time someone makes a legitimate point about Spirits and the Fighter's Pass. Base game doesn't affect base game and is completely different from DLC. As Verde Coeden Scalesworth pointed out, Sakurai would have just removed Spirits at the end of development if they were going to be DLC since there are 1300 already and five won't matter (assuming any Fighter's Pass character even has anything close to a chance of being a Spirit, none of the three so far did). You wouldn't scrub the Spirits of existing planned fighters that are already in the base game because there is nothing to spoil or to show off at a later point, the entire base game drops at once. And this only impacts the Fighter's Pass because they would have been worked on concurrently and all DLC would have been decided prior to the game going gold, which we know for a fact. That doesn't mean future characters or bonus characters can't have had Spirits, but the Fighter's Pass was clearly developed/planned alongside the base game and its Spirits, where it would make sense to scrub (and given our current DLC) two Spirits if they were somehow planned for the Fighter's Pass (I guess three since you'd have to take Mallow out as well, but we didn't really expect Super Mario RPG Spirits to begin with, so their absence wouldn't have been super noteworthy). It's not that you couldn't have the Spirit next to the character, it's why would you choose to leave the Spirit in when you knew the DLC was coming with them later on? It's not a big deal to drop a couple Spirits when you have 1300 others.

But if the spirits were worked on before the DLC plans were given to Sakurai last year, which he seems to have some form of control over, and they negotiated for the Geno spirit and possibly the Shantae spirit before then as well, then they wouldn't remove them. We have no proof Sakurai wouldn't have wanted something extra, anyway.

You don't negotiate something, add it, and then fall back on those negotiations. This also applies if Sakurai wanted Geno as a fighter and Nintendo and SE allowed it, later.