Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[T2by4]

Phone were the friends we made along the way.

Serious note, if/when Geno is revealed, I intend to FINALLY get online so I can learn with y'all.

I told everyone if he gets in im going full one trick and will crush locals with him. He will be my utlimate main.

 

[cosmicB]

Apparently some people are insulting or questioning fatman and I can’t see who because I have whoever it is already on ignore.

So for the offenders: **** off.

Y’all are insufferable

I... literally made an account today and made 2 posts referencing the guy. I don't think what I said would be considered insulting him, I just find the terminology and implications surrounding what does and doesn't constitute a leaker/insider odd. It's just me being OCD, nothing malicious.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

103 pages to go until we surpass the Smash 4 Ridley thread.

 

[TipperTheScales]

...unless we also assume that we shouldn't take Sabi's info as gospel either.

Honestly at this point we should only really be taking what Nintendo actively confirms / their interns accidentally leak / something gets taken down on their instruction (thinking ESRB here) that implies a confirmation as gospel. Insiders aren’t infallible (shocking I know).

 

[Malo Mart]

103 pages to go until we surpass the Smash 4 Ridley thread.

That'll be quite a big achievement. Haha... ha.... ha this joke's been dead since last year...

 

[nessdeltarune00]

Apparently some people are insulting or questioning fatman and I can’t see who because I have whoever it is already on ignore.

So for the offenders: **** off.

Y’all are insufferable

I don’t think it is wrong to express doubt in what people say from time to time.

And I never once insulted him personally. I literally tried going in the nicest way I possibly could.

 

[Deleted member]

Why are you throwing such a fit

welp, you've brought it out of me, the dreaded meme arrow.

>throwing a fit
>just discussing the implications

yeah whatever, tiger.

 

[Grumbo]

*CRAZY THEORY MODE ACTIVATE, HUGE POST INCOMING*

Let me introduce you to something I call...

The WAH theory...

Hear me out, i'm gonna say this before Fighter 5 gets leaked and i'm totally wrong...

Fighter 5 might actually be ****ing WALUIGI.

https://twitter.com/NanaKarobi/status/1200208052479315968

*People have told me that this account is a sabi alt or related to him in someway but I can't find anything to confirm that*

*EDIT: Sabi has confirmed this is NOT his alt*

This is the Paragon leak. It came right before E3 and was one of the few leaks to guess LUMINARY over Erdrick. Luminary is key here because we know for a fact that the Dragon Quest character was never going to be just Erdrick alone. Now, it's possible that Erdrick may have been planned to be the default costume at one point, but the fact that Luminary existed from the get-go, the fact that he represents DQ XI over just DQ in general, and the fact that he would be arguably more relevant overseas compared to Erdrick, contributing to a more worldwide appeal, even if mainly aimed towards Japan makes me think he was probably always destined to be the default.

Now obviously the big fly in the soup here is Frisk instead of Terry, but I have talked with Paragon about this and I distinctly remember him saying (even during late E3 season when this leak was a hot topic) that Frisk is more of a general prediction towards Undertale content. And basically, Paragon assumed a fighter due to the music existing because no Mii Fighters had ever come with songs before. AND, his prediction of not Sans did end up true, to be fair. The whole thing is summarized really well here, with Paragon correcting some of my misinterpretations.

Now, Paragon says he agrees with Fatmanonice here in that Waluigi is not Fighter 5. (Fatman himself doesn't comment on Waluigi understandably, because of the prospect of death threats similar to the ones Paragon received, but he has said on Discord before that he believes FP 5 likely isn't a first party character, which is a category that Waluigi undoubtedly falls under)

This is where Imran Khan comes in. If you guys don't know he's basically a resetera dude from GameInformer and has an extremely credible track record. He was one of those "big guys" who went seriously against the Grinch leak. Think of it like this, in terms of where he stands in credibility, call him Shinobi's Echo Fighter.

If you watch Imran's reaction to the Sept. 4th Direct from a backup of his livestream that day, he clearly knows about the extra fighters, and then goes onto claim that Nintendo made the decision to do extra Smash Bros. Ultimate DLC around E3 time. What's worth nothing is Paragon heard Waluigi AS EARLY AS FEBRUARY, and he heard that he was "last".

At one point, the Final Fighter's Pass character was going to be the last new Smash character for a LONG time, and most people assume that the next game will be a reboot, making the prospect of new characters slim. Waluigi is obviously not in line with ending on a character like Incineroar or Bayonetta, but that's not to say he wouldn't be a controversial ending to many people, that's pretty hard to deny. In that sense, I think he makes perfect sense as the "ultimate ending, the ultimate troll, the ultimate whateveryouwannasay". I can see at one point that this would be the character that Sakurai would decide to basically end Smash Ultimate on.

And then to end this off, i'd like to conclude on going back to Jon's video posted today, where he went ALL in on Spirits and Assist Trophies not deconfirming anyone for DLC and specifically made points about fighter 5 potentially being someone like Rex and Pyra. Obviously Jon wouldn't flat out say who the character is in a GameXplain video, so this makes me think this is a cover up for a different character. Notice how Jon specifically didn't mention obvious candidates for upgrades like cough Geno or COUGHCOUGH Waluigi. I specifically don't think Rex is DLC 5 (even if he still could be post pass) because of this statement:

Keep in mind, Jon made a similar stance on the Grinch leak, even went as far to bet he would have to sit in a wet puddle for a long time if the Grinch was real. He sounds really confident in this and I doubt he'd go all in on this like he is if he was to be proven wrong and the rest of DLC would just be third party characters with no Assist Trophies/Spirits upgraded.

And with that, I think my stance here is concluded. I COMPLETELY realize that this may end up looking incredibly stupid when Lloyd or some other 3rd party we could have expected ends up being DLC 5, but I think it's still fun to speculate around the information we have now.

Feel free to look at this and laugh, say haha stupid theory this guy knows jack **** about what he's talking about. But like I said, it was still fun to form such a speculative theory that goes a long distance from what type of characters most people predict from FP 5. If you dislike Waluigi, please try not to attack me i'm not saying you have to like him or anything, i'm just forming a theory around him.

TLDR | Waluigi is Fighter 5, Geno very good shot for post pass

Consider this V1.1 of this post since there might be some edits I need to make later.

Waluigi would open the door for Isaac in wave two, so I’m all for it

 

[AugustusB]

I... literally made an account today and made 2 posts referencing the guy. I don't think what I said would be considered insulting him, I just find the terminology and implications surrounding what does and doesn't constitute a leaker/insider odd. It's just me being OCD, nothing malicious.

Allow me to step in. Thank you for stopping by and saying hello!

If you do not know, Fatman has been on the Geno campaign for a veeerry long time. He has happened to befriend a very notable insider (WabiSabi) and it has given him some insight as to what is being discussed around the "insider circle"

Fatman speculates on what has been heard...BUT he will only do so, if given permission by "those in the know".

This is just from my own understanding. I really take his word as speculation and speculation only. Also, I do not think or other boy meant that towards you. Hopefully you can stick around and enjoy the Geno Thread. Believe it or not, we do talk about Geno from time to time lol.

 

[Sigran101]

I don’t think it is wrong to express doubt in what people say from time to time.

And I never once insulted him personally. I literally tried going in the nicest way I possibly could.

Maybe consider for a second why you're the first person to have this problem. Everyone else here likes and respects fatman. You don't have to agree with us, but I guarantee continuing to press and question him and being agressive about it will just land you on more ignore lists and make you a pariah around here. Might want to lay off at this point.

 

[Convoy]

If Geno is in smash...who was phone???

KONO DIO DA!

 

[cosmicB]

Honestly at this point we should only really be taking what Nintendo actively confirms / their interns accidentally leak / something gets taken down on their instruction (thinking ESRB here) that implies a confirmation as gospel. Insiders aren’t infallible (shocking I know).

I suppose "as gospel" wasn't the best term to use.

I guess to break it down further, what I wonder is why we aren't treating Fatman as almost analogous to a slightly less-informed Sabi. "He's just speculating" and "he knows the 10 names that insiders are fairly certain will mostly make up the final roster" seem inherently contradictory.

 

[Datboigeno]

I... literally made an account today and made 2 posts referencing the guy. I don't think what I said would be considered insulting him, I just find the terminology and implications surrounding what does and doesn't constitute a leaker/insider odd. It's just me being OCD, nothing malicious.

You’re accusing him of being smug and insulting just because he jokingly said 4chan willed Reimu into Smash speculation existence as if that’s not true and there’s not a huge contingent of people in /v/ that are pro-Reimu. Besides to consider that a legitimate “insult” is a combination of a huge stretch and paper thin skin. So a lot of support for a character you like started on a certain website. Why does that matter?

It’s just wild to me that randos jump into the thread to project some sort of sketchy or malicious intent on a longtime member of the fandom for perceived slights or weird semantic bull**** about whether he is or isn’t a “insider”. Genuinely what does that matter in the grand scheme of things?

None of this **** is that important. It’s just figuring out what video game characters are going to get into another video game. Be happy that someone is willing to share information with a group of people who can at times be genuinely ungrateful and entitled when things aren’t completely sugar coated or look good for whichever character you want in.

 

[Fatmanonice]

If I’m wrong, feel free to refute this.

I dug around the thread a bit, and i found this preceding the Lloyd posts.

View attachment 248622

Here is what I can infer from this, you hinted at a mysterious character, and Sabi went and confirmed you were talking about Lloyd.

If this is correct, you were still the first to publicly (keyword, publicly) hint at Lloyd. And I’m sorry to say, but that would certainly contradict what you are saying right now.

(I'm about to end this man's whole career.)

My Lloyd "hint":

https://smashboards.com/threads/geno-♪-return-of-the-starsend-savior.446378/page-433#post-22787393

 

[Sigran101]

I... literally made an account today and made 2 posts referencing the guy. I don't think what I said would be considered insulting him, I just find the terminology and implications surrounding what does and doesn't constitute a leaker/insider odd. It's just me being OCD, nothing malicious.

I guarantee you you're not on anyones ignore list so quickly, so he must not have been referring to you. Don't worry about it, and welcome to the thread!

 

[Deleted member]

I suppose "as gospel" wasn't the best term to use.

I guess to break it down further, what I wonder is why we aren't treating Fatman as almost analogous to a slightly less-informed Sabi. "He's just speculating" and "he knows the 10 names that insiders are fairly certain will mostly make up the final roster" seem inherently contradictory.

Most of the characters he speculates on have typically already been put out by other insiders beforehand or ones that the group he's in feel okay with him talking about (I could be wrong on this and he's free to correct me)
He knows about as much as we do really, just with the benefit of being better informed

 

[AdamBel731]

Now hang on Datboigeno , C cosmicB is new here and he said he wasn't trying to attack Fatmanonice in his original post. If he doesn't know information about Fatmanonice that is reasonable. He seems to be merely speculating something that I think is totally fair for a new person here. He wasn't constantly pushing at Fatmanonice or anything, he just was genuinely wondering.

 

[Sigran101]

You’re accusing him of being smug and insulting just because he jokingly said 4chan willed Reimu into Smash speculation existence as if that’s not true and there’s not a huge contingent of people in /v/ that are pro-Reimu. Besides to consider that a legitimate “insult” is a combination of a huge stretch and paper thin skin. So a lot of support for a character you like started on a certain website. Why does that matter?

It’s just wild to me that randos jump into the thread to project some sort of sketchy or malicious intent on a longtime member of the fandom for perceived slights or weird semantic bull**** about whether he is or isn’t a “insider”. Genuinely what does that matter in the grand scheme of things?

None of this **** is that important. It’s just figuring out what video game characters are going to get into another video game. Be happy that someone is willing to share information with a group of people who can at times be genuinely ungrateful and entitled when things aren’t completely sugar coated or look good for whichever character you want in.

Dude just calm down. There's no reason to react like this, especially to a new user.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Smug and insulting? My guy, there's an inside joke among insiders that characters like Reimu, Tracer, Shantae, 2B, and Kos-Mos are "Weeaboo Waifu Trash Tier" and regular comments made against people that support them. What I've said is downright tame compared to the people I've talked to. If my comments of "don't expect them because we haven't heard any females or indie yet" are "harsh", you'd be crushed to dust if you saw the full, uncensored opinions of some of these guys. Hell, I like Shantae and want her playable in Smash and it gives me no joy in delivering this news. Imagine actually being able to talk to insiders and get full on roasted for bringing up certain characters and then slapped in the face with evidence like a frozen trout that they're probably not coming. Besides, shouldn't that make it all the more satisfying if their intel is wrong?

**** like that is what makes insiders not really worth paying attention to.

welp, you've brought it out of me, the dreaded meme arrow.

>throwing a fit
>just discussing the implications

yeah whatever, tiger.

You've posted multiple times bemoaning your personal conclusion that Nintendo/Sakurai don't care enough about Geno to personally satisfy some arbitrary notions of priority. Which is based upon a little bit of potential info from Fatman and little else. I'd call it throwing a fit without hesitation.

 

[AugustusB]

I suppose "as gospel" wasn't the best term to use.

I guess to break it down further, what I wonder is why we aren't treating Fatman as almost analogous to a slightly less-informed Sabi. "He's just speculating" and "he knows the 10 names that insiders are fairly certain will mostly make up the final roster" seem inherently contradictory.

Now this is true. You do bring up a good point. It does seem unfair to treat this a little different than any old Insider/Leaker.

The 10 names thing is not exactly that. We only know that there are 10 names in the insiders void. Whether they are legit or leakbait is an entirely different question. And that, we do not know about. For all we know, one of the names could be someone we KNOW 100% is not getting in (Like Goku).

I do not wish to be a cop out, but we do not know 100% what the roles of the names are. If by some miracle Lloyd is indeed Fighter 5...Then we actually lucked out with all this. If he turns out as leakbait...then nothing was ever "leaked".

 

[cosmicB]

Allow me to step in. Thank you for stopping by and saying hello!

If you do not know, Fatman has been on the Geno campaign for a veeerry long time. He has happened to befriend a very notable insider (WabiSabi) and it has given him some insight as to what is being discussed around the "insider circle"

Fatman speculates on what has been heard...BUT he will only do so, if given permission by "those in the know".

This is just from my own understanding. I really take his word as speculation and speculation only. Also, I do not think or other boy meant that towards you. Hopefully you can stick around and enjoy the Geno Thread. Believe it or not, we do talk about Geno from time to time lol.

Oh, I intend to stick around assuming I haven't destroyed any first impressions already, lol. Thanks for welcoming me to the thread :D

I suppose "informed speculation" would be a good signifier?

I guarantee you you're not on anyones ignore list so quickly, so he must not have been referring to you. Don't worry about it, and welcome to the thread!

Heh, I suppose that's reassuring, and thanks for the welcome!

Most of the characters he speculates on have typically already been put out by other insiders beforehand or ones that the group he's in feel okay with him talking about (I could be wrong on this and he's free to correct me)
He knows about as much as we do really, just with the benefit of being better informed

That makes sense. It's really the deconfirms rather than the confirms that bug me, but I'll drop it.

 

[AdamBel731]

Guys c'mon, today is Thanksgiving... you know, the day of THANKS and giving blessings. Why don't we take the time to pause and reflect all that Sakurai and his team have done for us? I think the Lloyd supporters and detractors have said their peace, so let's just calm down about all of that. I don't want new folks like C cosmicB to be scared off.

I'll start, I'm most thankful for Sakurai's passion. Somehow some people think he doesn't care for us, but when a man goes into work with an IV... yeah, I'm gonna be thankful for that man's dedication and passion.

 

[TipperTheScales]

I suppose "as gospel" wasn't the best term to use.

I guess to break it down further, what I wonder is why we aren't treating Fatman as almost analogous to a slightly less-informed Sabi. "He's just speculating" and "he knows the 10 names that insiders are fairly certain will mostly make up the final roster" seem inherently contradictory.

Most of the characters he speculates on have typically already been put out by other insiders beforehand or ones that the group he's in feel okay with him talking about (I could be wrong on this and he's free to correct me)
He knows about as much as we do really, just with the benefit of being slightly more well-informed

Admittedly I’ve not really followed the SB speculation threads for long but my lurk history here is reasonable enough to say that I think people imply insiders to be those with a DIRECT and consistent link / communication channel to an industry source. I don’t believe Fatman’s presence in the Discord quite counts for this as he’s not going to be the first point of call when new information gets disseminated.

The different levels of informedness and speculating based on that is kinda like a game of Mafia / Werewolf if you want to think it like that, I guess?

Also the 10 names haven’t been demonstrated to convincingly imply future roster presence, just that they are common names of discussion in insider/higher level discussion. AugustusB got to this before I did, lol. He does bring up a valid point, and cosmicB yeah informed speculation is pretty much where we’re at from Fatman’s POV.

(Can someone kindly remind me how to tag a member again? Been a while since I’ve used messageboard markup rip)

 

[Datboigeno]

Now hang on Datboigeno , C cosmicB is new here and he said he wasn't trying to attack Fatmanonice in his original post. He seems to be merely speculating something that I think is totally fair for a new person here.

The implication that Fatman was being smug and insulting is just bull**** and the whole thing from him and the other poster feels overly entitled. If he’s new then there are better ways to address someone he doesn’t know. What is there to speculate? Fatman doesn’t consider himself an insider and neither do other people in that private server. So what’s the point of debating semantics and labeling him as something he doesn’t see as accurate? What does it matter?

 

[cosmicB]

You’re accusing him of being smug and insulting just because he jokingly said 4chan willed Reimu into Smash speculation existence as if that’s not true and there’s not a huge contingent of people in /v/ that are pro-Reimu. Besides to consider that a legitimate “insult” is a combination of a huge stretch and paper thin skin. So a lot of support for a character you like started on a certain website. Why does that matter?

It’s just wild to me that randos jump into the thread to project some sort of sketchy or malicious intent on a longtime member of the fandom for perceived slights or weird semantic bull**** about whether he is or isn’t a “insider”. Genuinely what does that matter in the grand scheme of things?

None of this **** is that important. It’s just figuring out what video game characters are going to get into another video game. Be happy that someone is willing to share information with a group of people who can at times be genuinely ungrateful and entitled when things aren’t completely sugar coated or look good for whichever character you want in.

Sorry, I meant to respond in my other post but had it in a separate tab.

I can assure you I'm not intentionally projecting malicious or sketchy intent onto Fatman. I'm not even trying to question his qualifications. What I was bothered by in the first place was actually how he's viewed rather than what he himself has put out. I have some issues with absolutism in general when it comes to stuff like this and I'm always working on it. No offense was meant toward anyone and I sincerely apologize if it came off that way.

And just a sidenote, from what I've seen, a lot of people on /v/ REALLY hate the idea of Reimu in, lol.

 

[Fatmanonice]

I suppose "as gospel" wasn't the best term to use.

I guess to break it down further, what I wonder is why we aren't treating Fatman as almost analogous to a slightly less-informed Sabi. "He's just speculating" and "he knows the 10 names that insiders are fairly certain will mostly make up the final roster" seem inherently contradictory.

The difference is longevity. I've been here since 2006 and people in this thread like KCCHIEFS27 (probably one of my closest Geno allies) have known me since 2005. I was a moderator both in the Brawl days and Smash 4. People listen to what I say because I've been doing this for longer than some of them have been alive and I often explain my thoughts and theories in agonizing detail with very careful research. Aside from being an occasional ****poster and ham at times, I've had a pretty good reputation for over a decade in the Smash community.

 

[Franco Geno]

Guys c'mon, today is Thanksgiving... you know, the day of THANKS and giving blessings. Why don't we take the time to pause and reflect all that Sakurai and his team have done for us? I think the Lloyd supporters and detractors have said their peace, so let's just calm down about all of that. I don't want new folks like C cosmicB to be scared off.

I'll start, I'm most thankful for Sakurai's passion. Somehow some people think he doesn't care for us, but when a man goes into work with an IV... yeah, I'm gonna be thankful for that man's dedication and passion.

Sakurai is a wonderful person, he always puts so much love in every character he adds to Smash that it really is worth it seing how your favorite characters join the battle

 

[Datboigeno]

Dude just calm down. There's no reason to react like this, especially to a new user.

Nothing I said was inflammatory. I don’t care that they’re new lol I’m responding to them like I’d respond to anyone else making wild implications about another person that’s just sharing information. It’s very annoying for the thread to be derailed over this weird questioning of what Fatman is or isn’t.

 

[AdamBel731]

The implication that Fatman was being smug and insulting is just bull**** and the whole thing from him and the other poster feels overly entitled. If he’s new then there are better ways to address someone he doesn’t know. What is there to speculate? Fatman doesn’t consider himself an insider and neither do other people in that private server. So what’s the point of debating semantics and labeling him as something he doesn’t see as accurate? What does it matter?

Could there have been a better way for cosmic to address the situation? Perhaps. But dude, he is new here, and is unacquainted with people. There is no need to lash out. As a new user, it is perfectly reasonable to see the comments about "willing characters into existence" as rude or something. He doesn't know Fatmanonice so how would he know? That's why he calmly asked. If the dude made a mistake, calmly tell him. There's no need to lash out. Especially since he asked in a calm, respectful manner.

 

[Sigran101]

The implication that Fatman was being smug and insulting is just bull**** and the whole thing from him and the other poster feels overly entitled. If he’s new then there are better ways to address someone he doesn’t know. What is there to speculate? Fatman doesn’t consider himself an insider and neither do other people in that private server. So what’s the point of debating semantics and labeling him as something he doesn’t see as accurate? What does it matter?

Can you just stop already? It was one comment. The rest of us have moved on.

 

[cosmicB]

The difference is longevity. I've been here since 2006 and people in this thread like KCCHIEFS27 (probably one of my closest Geno allies) have known me since 2005. I was a moderator both in the Brawl days and Smash 4. People listen to what I say because I've been doing this for longer than some of them have been alive and I often explain my thoughts and theories in agonizing detail with very careful research. Aside from being an occasional ****poster and ham at times, I've had a pretty good reputation for over a decade in the Smash community.

That's all fair. I won't dwell on this any longer and hope to talk about Geno whenever the thread decides to go on topic (off topic? lol)

 

[Sigran101]

Nothing I said was inflammatory. I don’t care that they’re new lol I’m responding to them like I’d respond to anyone else making wild implications about another person that’s just sharing information. It’s very annoying for the thread to be derailed over this weird questioning of what Fatman is or isn’t.

I'd call cussing at someone inflamatory actually.

 

[AugustusB]

I am not good with photo shop, but I really want a Geno hat on my Mr. Rime.

It would be perfect. Any takers? I'll be your best friend!

 

[Datboigeno]

Sorry, I meant to respond in my other post but had it in a separate tab.

I can assure you I'm not intentionally projecting malicious or sketchy intent onto Fatman. I'm not even trying to question his qualifications. What I was bothered by in the first place was actually how he's viewed rather than what he himself has put out. I have some issues with absolutism in general when it comes to stuff like this and I'm always working on it. No offense was meant toward anyone and I sincerely apologize if it came off that way.

And just a sidenote, from what I've seen, a lot of people on /v/ REALLY hate the idea of Reimu in, lol.

At the end of the day the label of “insider” doesn’t really matter. It’s all just random people sharing information about video games. He’s privy to certain information but honestly at a certain point it’s like calling everyone in the thread an insider because we’re privy to these talks and discussions in a way others aren’t. No ones actively going to Fatman to share corporate leaks so in that sense he’s not an “insider” he’s just someone privy to certain information before other people.

 

[nessdeltarune00]

(I'm about to end this man's whole career.)

My Lloyd "hint":

https://smashboards.com/threads/geno-♪-return-of-the-starsend-savior.446378/page-433#post-22787393

Pretty sure going by this logic, I guess Tansut never hinted at Cloud, since that was super cryptic as well, and no one realized it until his reveal.

Simply put, no matter how cryptic you were, you were still referring to Lloyd before any insider did publicly at the end of the day, as you just stated right now if I’m not mistaken.

 

[AdamBel731]

nessdeltarune00 if you have any questions for Fatmanonice , why not just private DM him? Rather than going on and on about it in here.

 

[catsforlife1]

Ok people look i know we are upset right now but lets just try and calm down. Its thanksgiving time so lets try and chill out. ... please?

 

[nessdeltarune00]

nessdeltarune00 if you have any questions for Fatmanonice , why not just private DM him? Rather than going on and on about it in here.

I tried that once, but his DMs were closed for me.

I had an entire message written out, but I had to bin it entirely because of this.

 

[GenoFlash]

Can we talk about something besides leakers?

When was the last time we got a good ol' fashioned hypothetical moveset going?

 

[Datboigeno]

Can you just stop already? It was one comment. The rest of us have moved on.

I'd call cussing at someone inflamatory actually.

lmao none of this really matters.