Fizz-sama
Smash Ace
I was expecting it to be bs, but it's hard to tell at times since it's the internet. :/ Non the less, thanks for clarifying AlphaDragoon2002.
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General Ike Discussion, Q&A, and Video Archive
- Thread starter SCOTU
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AlphaDragoon2002
Smash Ace
SCOTU
Smash Hero
it's effectiveness lies in it's low % KO power. The way you land it is hitting someone with large amounts of lag. Examples include edge rolls, tech chases (by guess), roll chases, moving out of the way of an aerial, and fsmashing them on the way down (to hit them as they're in landing lag), hitting them out of recovery (char dependent, and i can't really think of any applicable recoveries).
Ike's Fsmash does what it does: it comes out slow, and hits really hard. Don't miss. And as UmbreonMow says: the best Ike combo is observe>Fsmash.
Ike_Rules_A7X
Smash Rookie
im nearing un-beatabl with Ike, i hav a awesome 3 hit KO combo with him (which i wont reavl due to online battle in the future)
My brother rekons that Ike is broked because i can send his charater flying wen his charater is at 70+
dose anyone else think Ie is broken?
My brother rekons that Ike is broked because i can send his charater flying wen his charater is at 70+
dose anyone else think Ie is broken?
Duker
Smash Journeyman
Nah he's not broken, he's a BEAST!
http://www.smashbros.com/en_us/gamemode/wi-fi/wi-fi01.html
Just read the third paragraph for proof.
Edit: Meh, might aswell post it: "But because this form of communication is greatly affected by the distance between you and your opponent, your brawls may not run smoothly if you’re really far apart—like, for instance, if you’re connecting between Japan and America."
They did change one very major thing: The voices. Even then it is meant to be possible worldwide.
Just read the third paragraph for proof.
Edit: Meh, might aswell post it: "But because this form of communication is greatly affected by the distance between you and your opponent, your brawls may not run smoothly if you’re really far apart—like, for instance, if you’re connecting between Japan and America."
Ike_Rules_A7X
Smash Rookie
bit like Ganon then lol
kenkowtow
Smash Apprentice
Just like many of you I started playing yesterday.
Now I have a question.
Granted that I've only had the game for about 1 day. Granted that I'm definitely not anywhere near pro-level prediction. Granted that I fail to effectively use the spot dodge. Granted that not every character is equal.
How in the world does Ike overcome a laser spamming Falco?
Naturally it doesn't work all the time, but let me set up the scenario.
Let's take Smashville for example. Falco on one side and Ike on the other. Running directly towards Falco would be running into lasers. jumping up and down onto Falco with a Fair would result in either a dodge, shine, roll, or preemptive aerial.
But let's say that I get within Fsmash distance. Doing a high startup time move would result in a shine or a roll. QuickDraw works for the most part, but I believe Falco's Fsmash over-prioritizes or matches the QD. Going for a Jab Combo normally works, for the most part, but would require me to be close (which is what I am having trouble on).
Obviously my opponent doesn't have super reflexes. Not all the time is he able to do whatever. It's only for the most part (I would say 6/7 times) that he is able to choose something, perhaps not the best choice, the would keep me away from him.
So I ask for the Ike boards help. Thank you in advance.
Now I have a question.
Granted that I've only had the game for about 1 day. Granted that I'm definitely not anywhere near pro-level prediction. Granted that I fail to effectively use the spot dodge. Granted that not every character is equal.
How in the world does Ike overcome a laser spamming Falco?
Naturally it doesn't work all the time, but let me set up the scenario.
Let's take Smashville for example. Falco on one side and Ike on the other. Running directly towards Falco would be running into lasers. jumping up and down onto Falco with a Fair would result in either a dodge, shine, roll, or preemptive aerial.
But let's say that I get within Fsmash distance. Doing a high startup time move would result in a shine or a roll. QuickDraw works for the most part, but I believe Falco's Fsmash over-prioritizes or matches the QD. Going for a Jab Combo normally works, for the most part, but would require me to be close (which is what I am having trouble on).
Obviously my opponent doesn't have super reflexes. Not all the time is he able to do whatever. It's only for the most part (I would say 6/7 times) that he is able to choose something, perhaps not the best choice, the would keep me away from him.
So I ask for the Ike boards help. Thank you in advance.
Ike_Rules_A7X
Smash Rookie
simple to falco laser spamer
wat you do is jump above the laser then while in flight Quick draw that should get to behine falco, then smash
get it
wat you do is jump above the laser then while in flight Quick draw that should get to behine falco, then smash
get it
Hostility
Smash Ace
You're not good.
Dublio
Smash Ace
My timing with Ike's counter is extremely bad, any idea on how I can improve my timing in Brawl? I think Ike's counter has a start-up time as well but I'm unsure. Any tips on how exactly to practice timing?
Tin
Smash Journeyman
I'm not an Ike player, but I do have a question. Can Ike's jab be DI'd out of?
Fizz-sama
Smash Ace
Ike is a ****ing beast. I know this post doesn't really contribute, but it should. Ike is insane in my opinion. I'm not spouting off anything about tiers, but wow...
chaosGanondorf
Smash Cadet
Can you find vids from any where besides youtube? thanks.
SCOTU
Smash Hero
Unless your combo is AAA, then there is no 3 hit combo that you can KO someone with. Your friends just don't realize that they can jump/ air-dodge/ attack between any of your hits.
What about Japanese Wiis in America? But i was talking about changes that affect gameplay anyway.
I'd like to know about this as well, cause Ike has even more problems against Pit's arrows.
This is just going to get you ownd. esp. if you try to smash.
Just use moves a bunch in games until you get the hang of it. That's the best way to do it.
yes.
try google video, but it's unlikely.
Also, anyone have any advice on dealing w/ a campy Pit?
Fizz-sama
Smash Ace
In my opinion, one of the hardest things is giving the right advice. The problem majorly being we can't play the same person you are, and don't know how they play. It's times like these that it becomes very much Smash Bros. Theory in a sense.
I've played against Falco with Ike maybe a few times, but I honestly can't remember. For the approach, there really isn't much to say. QD'ing of course isn't the best option. Airdodging into shielding seems viable, but I don't know how quick you can put up your shield after landing. I'm pretty sure it's quick enough, but I don't want to assume. Due to power shielding being so much easier to pull off in this game, I'd really suggest trying to run up and power shield as much as you can until you can punish with his AAA or a grab game of some sort.
When you're within fsmash range, I'm not too sure what to do. The only things I can think of are dash in with a grab if you can, try your AAA approach, the ftilt(but that will probably backfire), and that's all I can think of really. What I would do is probably jump high enough and do a fair while DI'ing backwards. Whether it connects or not, it's better to use a "retreating" fair, therefore spacing yourself and your opponent and possibly getting hit by another laser than jumping towards him with a fair at that distance and being shield grabbed and who knows what from there. Getting cg'd by Falco isn't fun.
The Great Gonzales
Smash Ace
one thing i notice Ike gets destroyes by people who turtle with projectiles there's just no easy way of getting in, thats his waekness. I laugh when people say he's gonna be top tier, he has weaknesses a good player will aknolege those weaknesses. There's better characters out there people just cant see it yet
BTW AAA combo can be DI'ed however if you start it at close distance and dont delay the three hits they connect. What you need to learn is his Jab cancel that way you can use AA cancel wait for them to DI out and keep pressuring with short hoped nairs since they have almost no lag or if they dont DI the AA just do the AAA combo cause the last hit is whtat your aiming to hit
BTW AAA combo can be DI'ed however if you start it at close distance and dont delay the three hits they connect. What you need to learn is his Jab cancel that way you can use AA cancel wait for them to DI out and keep pressuring with short hoped nairs since they have almost no lag or if they dont DI the AA just do the AAA combo cause the last hit is whtat your aiming to hit
nitro-blazer
Smash Lord
Any advicve for campy pits, Toon links, Lucas, Falco?
Right now, All I can thing of is short hop airdodge to shield. And unless I roll or airdodge I get shield grabbed.
Right now, All I can thing of is short hop airdodge to shield. And unless I roll or airdodge I get shield grabbed.
Airdodge goes into shield almost immediately upon landing.
nonamedn00b
Smash Cadet
Any advice vs. Sonic?
He's just too **** fast. I can't even hit him with A. The only thing I can do is to grab which is hard because he rolls so quickly.
Also I need help on how to edge-guard against pikachu. His recovery's also way to fast.
I thought that I might just wait for him to land and quick draw but if he grabs the ledge there's nothing I can do.
He's just too **** fast. I can't even hit him with A. The only thing I can do is to grab which is hard because he rolls so quickly.
Also I need help on how to edge-guard against pikachu. His recovery's also way to fast.
I thought that I might just wait for him to land and quick draw but if he grabs the ledge there's nothing I can do.
SCOTU
Smash Hero
against Pika, you can drop out a Dair in front of the ledge. If they go for the edge, they'll get spiked, if they go for teh stage, Aether them.
nitro-blazer
Smash Lord
Not much, but as I said earlier, the only approach I can even think of against campers is airdodge -> shield. Even then, they catch on and shield grab. I'm still working to see how fast ou can airdodge -> shield -> Sidestep or roll, if you can do that immediately it'll be a good approach. Especially if you sidestep a Toon link grab.
On a semi-related note, I demonstrate the above in this vid. Ike vs Toon Link (Corneria)
On an unrelated note, I thought I'd post the rest of my vids in hope of recieving some constructive criticism.
Ike vs Lucas (Smashville)
Ike vs Toon Link (Luigi's Mansio)
Ike vs Wolf (Halberd)
When i play against sonic I end up neutral airing a lot... As far as I know sonic has bad priority so he gets hit out of **** well everything, and neutral air covers you pretty well. I usually try to counterpick... Jungle japes hurts him cause he's got no room. I dunno much abot Sonic, I usually go Diddy on him. =x
K20AFoozbal
Smash Apprentice
couple things about your toon link video, nitro. (also plz note this is meant to be constructive criticism and not to be taken in any sense but to help you improve. you're a **** good ike but it's still early in brawl's life ^_^)
during links first life... you got him to 50% with some nice moves thrown in keeping your distance and playing safe. then you went for the kill til he died. just because you can ko someone at 35% doesnt mean you need to attempt it all the time.
learn to RAR, it's one of his best abilities. his bair is pretty much perfect. i wanted to bair him so much in that mansion vid.
i wanted you to grab more on the mansion fight. So many times you went AAA instead of a grab. to me that's comparable to tilting someone who is dazed from a shield-break... some grabs (especially after he missed with his chain cuz he did that at least 5 times) or after you dodge one of his fsmash would set up some nice dmg and is more reliable imo.
nice use of the shield and qd btw. you played very well for the most part (i only watched the Tlink ones cuz i have trouble v him... lol)
Now for the generic ike discussion
something to point out, if you dont know how to these are things that are **** near essential....
RAR -- as i mentioned to nitro, the RAR is probably one of the most handy things for ike in his chase game. so much power, so fast and great recovery.
Foxtrot -- This is the new wave dash. It feels like it and sets up for covering a lot of ground quickly while being able to do your non-dash attacks in a heart beat. i personally enjoy the trot-grab and trot-Utilt. he has a nice trot-chain-grab which proves to be rather handy in stacking up about 40% dmg with little risk of it not happening (from my experiences). So just grab, throw, trot into another grab. very very sexy.
(Chain grabbing can be done with Fthrow or Dthrow up to 100% i believe)
something i'm having trouble with (which has happened to me since SSB64 -_-) is playing defensively... i smash too often and it gets me in trouble. I'm still getting used to his range but it seems that once i get that under my belt, it'll be nice having things like Fdash, Ftilt, AAA and the hyphen-Usmash in a secure spot in my arsenal. range is the key. and if you havent noticed, his blade works similarly to marths... dealing a harder hit the closer to the tip (or so it seems in my testing).
EDIT -- after testing it, there appears to be no difference in dmg dealt or distance your opponent is thrown based on where the blade makes contact. the blade is strong throughout. and rightfully so.
during links first life... you got him to 50% with some nice moves thrown in keeping your distance and playing safe. then you went for the kill til he died. just because you can ko someone at 35% doesnt mean you need to attempt it all the time.
learn to RAR, it's one of his best abilities. his bair is pretty much perfect. i wanted to bair him so much in that mansion vid.
i wanted you to grab more on the mansion fight. So many times you went AAA instead of a grab. to me that's comparable to tilting someone who is dazed from a shield-break... some grabs (especially after he missed with his chain cuz he did that at least 5 times) or after you dodge one of his fsmash would set up some nice dmg and is more reliable imo.
nice use of the shield and qd btw. you played very well for the most part (i only watched the Tlink ones cuz i have trouble v him... lol)
Now for the generic ike discussion
something to point out, if you dont know how to these are things that are **** near essential....
RAR -- as i mentioned to nitro, the RAR is probably one of the most handy things for ike in his chase game. so much power, so fast and great recovery.
Foxtrot -- This is the new wave dash. It feels like it and sets up for covering a lot of ground quickly while being able to do your non-dash attacks in a heart beat. i personally enjoy the trot-grab and trot-Utilt. he has a nice trot-chain-grab which proves to be rather handy in stacking up about 40% dmg with little risk of it not happening (from my experiences). So just grab, throw, trot into another grab. very very sexy.
(Chain grabbing can be done with Fthrow or Dthrow up to 100% i believe)
something i'm having trouble with (which has happened to me since SSB64 -_-) is playing defensively... i smash too often and it gets me in trouble. I'm still getting used to his range but it seems that once i get that under my belt, it'll be nice having things like Fdash, Ftilt, AAA and the hyphen-Usmash in a secure spot in my arsenal. range is the key. and if you havent noticed, his blade works similarly to marths... dealing a harder hit the closer to the tip (or so it seems in my testing).
EDIT -- after testing it, there appears to be no difference in dmg dealt or distance your opponent is thrown based on where the blade makes contact. the blade is strong throughout. and rightfully so.
nitro-blazer
Smash Lord
Thanks for the advice. Yeah, I suppose Grabbing mroe would be a better idea, especially when the Jab's get weakened by the stale moves effect. I'll remember that a lot in the future. And I noticed that as well, I got pissed at hte spam and just went blindly offensive. X_x
I do RAR BAIR a lot, just not on Toon link, cause I'm not that great at spacing it cause he's so short. In the Lucas video I do one perfectly for a kill, but Even Lucas is too short for me to land it easily. I need to practice the timing for it.
K20AFoozbal
Smash Apprentice
ok yea, i see your point. i guess i've just had more practice against a toon link... but i probably would've f**ked up the rar on him if i had tried lol...
the lucas vid was sexy. 2 stocked with some nice moves. i like how you chased the balloons btw. classic lol.
i really wish the wifi wasnt so terrible... id like to try this on other players... but i'm not always able to chill with friends cuz of work/school... fail =/
the lucas vid was sexy. 2 stocked with some nice moves. i like how you chased the balloons btw. classic lol.
i really wish the wifi wasnt so terrible... id like to try this on other players... but i'm not always able to chill with friends cuz of work/school... fail =/
KosukeKGA
Smash Champion
What does RAR stand for?
nitro-blazer
Smash Lord
Reverse Aerial Rush.
Anyway, I've been working it, and I can get the timing for Kirby now, (Standing, I'm pretty sure crouching either takes frame perfect timing or is impossible). I'm pretty sure he's shortest in the game.
Optimus124
Smash Rookie
Ike is a monster. I was saddened by Roy's departure, but I love this guy. Anyway, one thing I have noticed is that his Final Smash can affect a character that's behind him. I've done this once before this incident, and tried again afterwards.
http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=4152026&postcount=1
http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=4152026&postcount=1
SCOTU
Smash Hero
who cares? The only way you could tell is if they went to the same tournament. Online play doesn't count for ****.
aznxk3vi17
Smash Cadet
Any other Ike enthusiasts having trouble with campy Falcos?
I searched the thread but only came upon some rudimentary advice, so I'll ask again.
In particular, one Falco I play with is extremely frustrating to play against. He runs to the other side of any stage and begins spamming lasers. The second I get near him, he either smashes (which is faster than any moves I can dish out before reaching him), or does side+B. This either goes through me and hits me, or I dodge. Either way, he's still out of range, and he repeats by running to the other side and laser spamming.
I've tried a million types of approaches. Quick Draw gets me smashed. F-air gets rolled, which is followed by a smash. N-air is rolled. A ground approach is nigh-impossible, but if I manage to ever get near him on the ground, but not quite in range of any attacks, the side+B comes out. If I get hit (which I do often, as the lag between us is not so fantastic), he can go to town with aerials, or run away and laser spam. If I dodge it, he's out of range, and then he can resume running and laser spamming.
Now, I realize that projectile spammers are one of Ike's weaknesses, but not knowing how to counter such simple strategies such as this is very frustrating.
I searched the thread but only came upon some rudimentary advice, so I'll ask again.
In particular, one Falco I play with is extremely frustrating to play against. He runs to the other side of any stage and begins spamming lasers. The second I get near him, he either smashes (which is faster than any moves I can dish out before reaching him), or does side+B. This either goes through me and hits me, or I dodge. Either way, he's still out of range, and he repeats by running to the other side and laser spamming.
I've tried a million types of approaches. Quick Draw gets me smashed. F-air gets rolled, which is followed by a smash. N-air is rolled. A ground approach is nigh-impossible, but if I manage to ever get near him on the ground, but not quite in range of any attacks, the side+B comes out. If I get hit (which I do often, as the lag between us is not so fantastic), he can go to town with aerials, or run away and laser spam. If I dodge it, he's out of range, and then he can resume running and laser spamming.
Now, I realize that projectile spammers are one of Ike's weaknesses, but not knowing how to counter such simple strategies such as this is very frustrating.
AlphaDragoon2002
Smash Ace
Wow, first time I've ever heard of somebody having trouble against Sonic with Ike. I'll attempt to help out.
Sonic's priority is TERRIBLE. Pretty much all of his attacks can be snuffed flat out by the AAA, and spin dash spam gets owned by Counter. The Homing Attack can be annoying at times, but if he's coming above you use the Up Tilt. Sonic also has great trouble getting a KO on Ike, so you've got plenty of time to make him screwup and eat a big attack.
SCOTU
Smash Hero
because of course your opponent can't attack you straight out of your roll before your slow counter comes out.
anyway, if you're hit upward in a killing fashion, DI and dair. It can save you for ~ an extra 20% from a jiggs rest.
anyway, if you're hit upward in a killing fashion, DI and dair. It can save you for ~ an extra 20% from a jiggs rest.
SCOTU
Smash Hero
Actually, Doing the Dair and DIing will just add a large amount of % on to your life against vertical KOs on any stage. The 20% figure is on FD though.
No. Ike's counter is not particularly useful.
No. Ike's counter is not particularly useful.
~Atomic Sushi~
Smash Rookie
Well maybe if this Brawl channel thing happens, Roy will be one of the character downloads.
dingostar29
Smash Rookie
Is it possible to use Ike's down+b to counter and kill Marth's Final Smash?
SCOTU
Smash Hero
IIRC, Marth's invincible during his Final Smash.
dingostar29
Smash Rookie
But does the counter still stop the damage?
SCOTU
Smash Hero
haven't tested, and won't be able to for several days. If you have the game, just go into training mode and try it out.
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