PokemonMasterIRL
Smash Master
Teczero is the homie.
-
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Social General Ice Climber Chat
- Thread starter dj asakura
- Start date
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
Everyone probably already knows this, but I'll say it anyway:
Belay > Dolphin Slash
Seriously... You can, like, do a Belay straight above Marth as he tries to Dolphin Slash, and watch him hit the bottom climber and get knocked away.
Belay > Dolphin Slash
Seriously... You can, like, do a Belay straight above Marth as he tries to Dolphin Slash, and watch him hit the bottom climber and get knocked away.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Mindgames, *****!
Binx
Smash Master
wow... videos please =D
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
I'll try and get a video.
Just to explain a bit better...:
Popo
\
..\
....\
......\
.......Nana
..............^
..........Marth
If Marth does his up-b while Belay's hit-boxes are still out, he gets out-prioritized by Nana and gets knocked away a reasonable distance.
Just to explain a bit better...:
Popo
\
..\
....\
......\
.......Nana
..............^
..........Marth
If Marth does his up-b while Belay's hit-boxes are still out, he gets out-prioritized by Nana and gets knocked away a reasonable distance.
Belay will never kill though. Marth, by pressing UpB will be DI'ing perfectly, so he will go almost straight up, and he won't die until about 160-170. Not to mention how risky this is.
I guess you could use it to do a suprise stage spike, but they could tech it, and it would be even harder to get that spacing right.
I will play around with it.
BTW, I am having a super hard time doing the nair falloff>hit marth. IDK why but it never works for me.
Also, I discovered a way to get nana onto the ledge quicker, it is easier than belay OoS, and popo takes much less lag. Video today I hope.
I guess you could use it to do a suprise stage spike, but they could tech it, and it would be even harder to get that spacing right.
I will play around with it.
BTW, I am having a super hard time doing the nair falloff>hit marth. IDK why but it never works for me.
Also, I discovered a way to get nana onto the ledge quicker, it is easier than belay OoS, and popo takes much less lag. Video today I hope.
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
The knockback was like... pretty much a semi-spike man. It knocked him too far away to recover.
Kyu Puff
Smash Champion
Dash toward -> dash away + roll?
No...how would that put nana on the ledge?
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
If that Belay thing is legit then good stuff.
voorhese
Smash Master
idk about you peef, but when i recover, once my character is going to the ledge i hold in in case i have to tech...so that DI theory of urs is false (on me anyway, but im sure im not the only person who does that)
Kyu Puff
Smash Champion
For some reason she slides off backwards. It's hard to explain, but it works.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
tec0 and me are gonna play ic vs mario at his house
**** JUST GOT REAL
**** JUST GOT REAL
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
Is Popo grab release > Nana wave-grab a legit combo? xD
PokemonMasterIRL
Smash Master
No need to wavedash.
Just grab, yeah its legit, but less consistent than Handing off because of varying grab break times.
AshuRawRun
Smash Apprentice
This, makes the thing impossible if the oppenent has a brain and doesn't drop his controller...
But this might be possible in TAS even with air breakout I guess.
AshuRawRun
Smash Apprentice
I'm not sure either of how we do it, that ain't a shame IMO it's quite useless 95% of the time.
I guess you just have to put your stick up when the grab is released
AshuRawRun
Smash Apprentice
Nevermind ^^
PokemonMasterIRL
Smash Master
I wish Ice Climbers knew Rocksmash.
choknater
Smash Obsessed
doc is so balanced
theres no 1 solution to this matchup
gotta know all the situations. very tough
definitely preppin to beat shroomed. LOL
so today i was training ic's vs lvl 9 doc. learning many situations, like how to deal with pills, and some edgeguarding. i have a lot of 2007~2008 experience with HMW's doc, but shroomed is loads different. i tried playing my doc vs lvl 9 ic's and imitating shroomed... and wow doc has soooo many good reliable tools against them. they can't really combo each other so i think of peach vs puff... just a really balanced matchup. both chars can punish hard, both can recover, both can edgeguard, and neither can play really gay... ahhhhh. tough stuff.
stuff to watch out for
1. doc's dsmash, and jab->dsmash. too good
2. random nair approach. space this sh*t, or challenge it with blizzard/fsmash if you're cool. dont shield grab
3. doc can cover all options when edgeguarding... gotta think of good ways to fake him out
4. usmash/uairs/utilt... doc from beneath is pretty good
5. bthrow. invincible + hitbox =
good tools
1. ice block spam. he has no trouble with blizzard, so at least this forces him to jump or challenge our spamming with pills.
2. for some reason fsmash really ***** in this matchup.
3. ic's like being below
4. just gotta abuse ground speed... this matchup really comes down to our committed approaches. fast wd can hit him through openings, but just gotta know when he can guard himself with jab/utilt/pill/dsmash.
basically... defense is good on both sides, but offense is better. we cant camp doc forever and doc is too vulnerable to wd approach mixups if he plays too defensively.
ahhhhh.... 2007 all over again...
i wanna beat shroomed
theres no 1 solution to this matchup
gotta know all the situations. very tough
definitely preppin to beat shroomed. LOL
so today i was training ic's vs lvl 9 doc. learning many situations, like how to deal with pills, and some edgeguarding. i have a lot of 2007~2008 experience with HMW's doc, but shroomed is loads different. i tried playing my doc vs lvl 9 ic's and imitating shroomed... and wow doc has soooo many good reliable tools against them. they can't really combo each other so i think of peach vs puff... just a really balanced matchup. both chars can punish hard, both can recover, both can edgeguard, and neither can play really gay... ahhhhh. tough stuff.
stuff to watch out for
1. doc's dsmash, and jab->dsmash. too good
2. random nair approach. space this sh*t, or challenge it with blizzard/fsmash if you're cool. dont shield grab
3. doc can cover all options when edgeguarding... gotta think of good ways to fake him out
4. usmash/uairs/utilt... doc from beneath is pretty good
5. bthrow. invincible + hitbox =
good tools
1. ice block spam. he has no trouble with blizzard, so at least this forces him to jump or challenge our spamming with pills.
2. for some reason fsmash really ***** in this matchup.
3. ic's like being below
4. just gotta abuse ground speed... this matchup really comes down to our committed approaches. fast wd can hit him through openings, but just gotta know when he can guard himself with jab/utilt/pill/dsmash.
basically... defense is good on both sides, but offense is better. we cant camp doc forever and doc is too vulnerable to wd approach mixups if he plays too defensively.
ahhhhh.... 2007 all over again...
i wanna beat shroomed
Fly_Amanita
Master of Caribou
I second the notion that ice blocks are really good against Doc. Retreating is also really good since he isn't fast on the ground. The last time I played HMW, he had a hard time punishing backwards wavedashes even when he read them, which was kind of funny. Sporadic dash attacks also seem great for stopping Doc's approaches, since they cut through Doc's moves nicely and put him in a bad position.
Blizzard isn't totally useless. There are always ways to sneak it in here or there, although I agree that ICs can't really on it all that much against him. My favorite time to use blizzard against Doc is when he is pressuring me with pills, but I don't want to retreat; just short hop blizzard toward him or walk forward and have Nana blizzard when Popo is in hitstun from the pill; the blizzard usually won't connect, but it does give you some breathing room for a second and it can lead to a short combo if Doc does fall into it.
Blizzard isn't totally useless. There are always ways to sneak it in here or there, although I agree that ICs can't really on it all that much against him. My favorite time to use blizzard against Doc is when he is pressuring me with pills, but I don't want to retreat; just short hop blizzard toward him or walk forward and have Nana blizzard when Popo is in hitstun from the pill; the blizzard usually won't connect, but it does give you some breathing room for a second and it can lead to a short combo if Doc does fall into it.
PokemonMasterIRL
Smash Master
all this good advice now I am going to be Hokage......
i mean beat shroomed
i mean beat shroomed
choknater
Smash Obsessed
lols. no matchup is as strange as the ic's ditto
id like to try my luck against fly again haha. the matchup is so crazy and difficult. dsmash is so good
id like to try my luck against fly again haha. the matchup is so crazy and difficult. dsmash is so good
Fly_Amanita
Master of Caribou
I just mean wavedashing away from the opponent.
choknater
Smash Obsessed
not a bad strategy LOL
but yeah... this matchup is kinda like samus matchup where u just gotta know the right things to do in each situation.. can't really have a single general strategy, just gotta have experience and adaptability
other matchups i just have a single thought in my mind and win
fox: **** (or be *****)
falco: one hit = ko
falcon: **** (or be *****)
marth: blizzard
puff: blizzard block uair dair
sheik: camp till i can grab her
ganon: patience. if all else fails pick falco
but for doc and samus... i gotta think about every move lol.
PokemonMasterIRL
Smash Master
and your one sentence Peach MU summary?
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
Counter-pick Young Link.
john!
Smash Hero
Get rocked.
Call Wobbles in to play it for you unless it's Armada.
You're right, if I wanted tips on the Matchup I'd have to call wobbles to play it for me because he won't tell us hao he dooes it =[
AshuRawRun
Smash Apprentice
Hahahaha too good!
Only way to beat peach seems to be more experienced then the peach in the matchup.
So even though it sounds wierd, not playing the matchup in practice should help, since otherwise, the peachplayer will learn matchup specific things and it'll get harder then it allready is(might be written by a very chancebased mindset).
Easy way:
Pick puff, redifine airplanking(plattform/aircamping, since that's what the peach will do with her float otherwise against IC's) and use trix hbox doesn't use and it'll be a much easier way towards winning.
Going the hard way and actually winning against a top peach as IC's(no charswitch) will benefit more in the long run even though it's gonna be really hard but possible. A step in the right direction is to never get hit by fair, that move is probably atleast as good as puffs rest in general (atleast against one IC) so hit them before they hit you or don't even stay in the situation that you can get hit by it. Blizzard spaced well can work in some situations, as do suprise shorthopped forward-b. If you have her close to a platform where an iceblock would hit, iceblock so she looses the float. Also, learn to infinite, it's the key to have a slight chance of beating peach (something I still have to work on )
So even though it sounds wierd, not playing the matchup in practice should help, since otherwise, the peachplayer will learn matchup specific things and it'll get harder then it allready is(might be written by a very chancebased mindset).
Easy way:
Pick puff, redifine airplanking(plattform/aircamping, since that's what the peach will do with her float otherwise against IC's) and use trix hbox doesn't use and it'll be a much easier way towards winning.
Going the hard way and actually winning against a top peach as IC's(no charswitch) will benefit more in the long run even though it's gonna be really hard but possible. A step in the right direction is to never get hit by fair, that move is probably atleast as good as puffs rest in general (atleast against one IC) so hit them before they hit you or don't even stay in the situation that you can get hit by it. Blizzard spaced well can work in some situations, as do suprise shorthopped forward-b. If you have her close to a platform where an iceblock would hit, iceblock so she looses the float. Also, learn to infinite, it's the key to have a slight chance of beating peach (something I still have to work on
)
choknater
Smash Obsessed
there are certain peach players who i wouldnt mind staying ics against (macd)
but for the most part yeah i just use a counter pick lol
yeah i could play ics but
i would go into the match without a lot of confidence lol
but for the most part yeah i just use a counter pick lol
yeah i could play ics but
i would go into the match without a lot of confidence lol
*P*L*U*R*
Smash Hero
Actually, Bair is really good vs Peach if you can space it right. IT beats all her air moves when spaced. Don't go for sheild grabs.
I've noticed that with IC, sheildgrabbing is unsafe as HELL because of our traction and bad grab range. High risk, High reward.
Anyways, I have a few videos of myself from a tournament last weekend.
Disclaimer = I was playing really bad all day, messing up easy stuff and I just generally couldn't move like I wanted to.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMJDwgktL1A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWBvZepfyew
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tE8yzKnUd14
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Av_1DShArOs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cwciVa5Q9A
nh;rfiuajpiofdsjfkodfj
Sooo bad. ugh.
I've noticed that with IC, sheildgrabbing is unsafe as HELL because of our traction and bad grab range. High risk, High reward.
Anyways, I have a few videos of myself from a tournament last weekend.
Disclaimer = I was playing really bad all day, messing up easy stuff and I just generally couldn't move like I wanted to.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMJDwgktL1A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWBvZepfyew
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tE8yzKnUd14
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Av_1DShArOs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cwciVa5Q9A
nh;rfiuajpiofdsjfkodfj
Sooo bad. ugh.