~Gardevoir~ Most Awesome Shield-Caster Ever. Or so.

[HipsterKid]

oh yeah, and about this whole thing of gardy representing emotion... wah? where did that theory come from?

Gardevoir is a "naturally emotional pokemon" believing in self-sacrifice for it's trainer, etc.

 

[Brawlman]

And her discription is the "Embrace" Pokemon....Embrace=Hug=Happyness=Emotion.

XP

 

[FiErCe_oNi]

there is a difference between being loyal and being emotional. saying gardy is emotional for that reason is like saying arcanine is an emotional pokemon, and if you're gonna do that, you may as well call every pokemon emotional. i don't see why gardy has such superior emotions as to make them one of her traits.

and anyway, seeing as mewtwo is the smartest pokemon, doesn't that just about make him the most emotional pokemon?

 

[HipsterKid]

And her discription is the "Embrace" Pokemon....Embrace=Hug=Happyness=Emotion.

XP

Yeah, what he said. (Jiggly Wants to be Embraced :D)

BTW, How come there still hasn't been a comic/story update?!

there is a difference between being loyal and being emotional. saying gardy is emotional for that reason is like saying arcanine is an emotional pokemon, and if you're gonna do that, you may as well call every pokemon emotional. i don't see why gardy has such superior emotions as to make them one of her traits.

I really doubt that every single Pokemon would be loyal enough to do that. Heck, I'm not even so sure Arcanine would do that. And with Gardevoir, it's more of a duty than a choice (the self-suicide thing).

 

[MysticKenji]

pichu was a failure though, and even if it didn't suck, i still would've seen it as a waste of space, like i'd probably see gardy. anyway, the pikachu in smash seems to be based on the anime pikachu, which is supposedly just about the god of electric types. its more powerful than other raichu at least.

I'd like to see a match between Pikachu and Raikou...

well i think the whole generation representation theory is BS. sakurai already kinda added 3 pokemon from first gen as characters, so he doesn't seem to care about what gen pokemon are from.

QFT

anyway, i'm not doubting that gardy couldnt be unique. its the same thing with pikachu and pichu. why have one of pikachu's petty worshippers when you could have other characters that auctually deserve spots?

Technically, the only Pokemon that actually deserves a spot is Pikachu, due to being a mascot. And "deserve" is a bit vague anyway. Who really "deserves" a spot?

oh yeah, and about this whole thing of gardy representing emotion... wah? where did that theory come from?

Mainy from her pokedex entries...

 

[Brawlman]

Yeah, what he said. (Jiggly Wants to be Embraced :D)

BTW, How come there still hasn't been a comic/story update?!

Blame Life.

 

[LightLink17]

You see that little Red thing in between her...

That thing senses emotions in Ralts, and I see no reason to assume that it doesn't do the same thing in Kirlia and Gardevoir. Ralts senses emotions, Kirlia happens to always be in the same emotional state as its trainer, and Gardevoir has an amazing sense of concern for it's owner, obviously because it's incredibly emotionally attached.

 

[FiErCe_oNi]

I really doubt that every single Pokemon would be loyal enough to do that. Heck, I'm not even so sure Arcanine would do that. And with Gardevoir, it's more of a duty than a choice (the self-suicide thing).

the fact that its a duty over a choice makes it less emotional... isnt that obvious?

Technically, the only Pokemon that actually deserves a spot is Pikachu, due to being a mascot. And "deserve" is a bit vague anyway. Who really "deserves" a spot?

well brawl only has a limited amount of character spaces and gardy getting in could deny the access to some retro fan favourite or something, not that i care... but still

Mainy from her pokedex entries...

i don't see any references to her being emotional in her entry. sure, maybe ralts can sense emotions, but then again so can growlithe

You see that little Red thing in between her...

That thing senses emotions in Ralts, and I see no reason to assume that it doesn't do the same thing in Kirlia and Gardevoir. Ralts senses emotions, Kirlia happens to always be in the same emotional state as its trainer, and Gardevoir has an amazing sense of concern for it's owner, obviously because it's incredibly emotionally attached.

growlithe can also sense emotions, not that anyone cares. kirlia mimicking emotions doesn't make it more emotional. nothing says gardy is concerned, just extremely loyal (and loyalty isnt an emotion)

 

[HipsterKid]

Blame Life.

Ah well.
It'll come when it comes.
Hopefully you'll lose your life soon! (Just kidding, Please Take No Offense)

And no, just because it is it's duty doesn't mean it's less emotional.
Gardevoir is emotionally attached to it's trainer.
Whether the trainer is a complete jerk or not.
In other cases, the pokemon would ditch the jerk trainer.
Gardevoir's emotions make her the embrace pokemon.

 

[FiErCe_oNi]

And no, just because it is it's duty doesn't mean it's less emotional.

emotions are based on choices. natural instincts are not emotional. by your logic, a salmon having to climb up a river is emotional, while its just an instinct, like gardys loyalty which you could compare with that of a dogs.

Gardevoir is emotionally attached to it's trainer.
Whether the trainer is a complete jerk or not.
In other cases, the pokemon would ditch the jerk trainer.

every pokemon is like that, not just gardy. has there ever been an incident where a pokemon chose to leave its trainer?

Gardevoir's emotions make her the embrace pokemon.

no, her DNA makes her the embrace pokemon. emotions are based on choices, and gardy has no choice of being gardy.

 

[HipsterKid]

every pokemon is like that, not just gardy. has there ever been an incident where a pokemon chose to leave its trainer?

Meowth attempting to leave Team Rocket?

no, her DNA makes her the embrace pokemon. emotions are based on choices, and gardy has no choice of being gardy.

How can DNA make her the embrace pokemon when embrace means: a close affectionate and protective acceptance.

Basing it on that definition and off of your impositions, the acceptance part of it is based of a choice therefore, in your view, making it emotional. Affection is just based of emotion. (affection being a feeling and feelings being emotions)

 

[FiErCe_oNi]

Meowth attempting to leave Team Rocket?

meowth doesnt have a trainer, so thats different, not that i know of when that happened. anyway, i guess you could say that is more emotional because its a decision that required his intelligence

How can DNA make her the embrace pokemon when embrace means: a close affectionate and protective acceptance.

Basing it on that definition and off of your impositions, the acceptance part of it is based of a choice therefore, in your view, making it emotional. Affection is just based of emotion. (affection being a feeling and feelings being emotions)

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/embrace
i thought embrace means "to hug"

 

[HipsterKid]

meowth doesnt have a trainer, so thats different, not that i know of when that happened. anyway, i guess you could say that is more emotional because its a decision that required his intelligence

I guess you could call Jesse and James his "Trainers"
I think it was some situation in which they ignored or let me down or something.
It was a long time ago.

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/embrace
i thought embrace means "to hug"

That's one definition.

http://www.onelook.com/?w=embrace&ls=a
Look at the right side.

 

[FiErCe_oNi]

I guess you could call Jesse and James his "Trainers"
I think it was some situation in which they ignored or let me down or something.
It was a long time ago.

well, TR meowth is different from every other pokemon. his intelligence lets him make choices that other pokemon are too stupid to make, such as leaving dumb trainers/organisations. i doubt regular meowth act like him.

That's one definition.

http://www.onelook.com/?w=embrace&ls=a
Look at the right side.

are you sure that they intended to have "embrace" defined like that? i mean, that seems to be a pretty unpopular meaning of the word, seeing as how it wasnt featured on wiktionary.

anyway, even if "embrace" was meant to be defined like that, it still wouldnt make gardy any more emotional. having natural affection in your DNA may make you different emotionally, but it wouldnt make you any more emotionally superior. its just 1 type of emotion after all. if gardy has more affection, that would mean that it would have less... whatever the opposite of affection is. you could call gardy an affectionate pokemon, but that doesnt make its emotions important enough to list

and being more accepting is less emotional, because that would decrease the amount of choices you would make (such as not accepting something) and therefore the amount of emotions you could feel, such as regret

 

[HipsterKid]

It was on dictionary.com (which is equally if not more popular than wiktionary).

Anyway, I think it does make Gardevoir more emotional because for one, affection is defined as "A positive feeling of liking" and feeling means "experiencing emotions." So in other words Affection's "Liking Positive Emotions". Just because it has more positive emotions doesn't mean those emotions of disgust (opposite of affection; meaning a "strong feeling of dislike") aren't there. There are just small amounts of it. Since the meaning of disgust had "feeling" in it, I inferred that it was talking about many different emotions. Through this, one can infer that Gardevior has tons of emotions of both affection and disgust, making it emotional.

Through the accepting part, it seems to me like a filter. Gardevoir can accept which emotions she prefers (probably the ones of affection seeing as she is the "embrace pokemon".) That doesn't say that she always accepts the good ones all the time. This could mean accepting the bad ones as well.

 

[xianfeng]

Gardevoir is more emotional because she's a woman. Sounds sexist but really when you think about it's true women are a lot more emotional than men (with the expetion of lesbos like Miranda from sex and the city or Rosie O'Donnel)

 

[HipsterKid]

Gardevoir is more emotional because she's a woman. Sounds sexist but really when you think about it's true women are a lot more emotional than men (with the expetion of lesbos like Miranda from sex and the city or Rosie O'Donnel)

If you're basing this on homosexuality, why not go ahead and say some gay men are more emotional then women? Emotions are based on a person, not on gender because what a person goes through in their life influences how emotional they are.

Example: Boy with a drastic life being more emotional than a girl with a less-hectic one.

 

[FiErCe_oNi]

well my point is, gardy's emotions are not superior to that of any other pokemon. sure, maybe it has superior positive emotions but that also means it has inferior negative emotions, so it balances itself back to unsuperior emotions. the only thing i can see increasing emotional superiority is increased intelligence, because that increases the amount of feelings you can have. therefore, the only emotionally superior pokemon include TR meowth and mewtwo. so all in all, mewtwo is completely superior in gardevoir, even in terms of emotion. so now i go back to my first point, why have a petty follower when you have the god? there are plenty of emotions mewtwo can feel that gardy cant, i mean mewtwo auctually questions his meaning. that just proves how emotionally superior he is.

 

[HipsterKid]

well my point is, gardy's emotions are not superior to that of any other pokemon. sure, maybe it has superior positive emotions but that also means it has inferior negative emotions, so it balances itself back to unsuperior emotions. the only thing i can see increasing emotional superiority is increased intelligence, because that increases the amount of feelings you can have. therefore, the only emotionally superior pokemon include TR meowth and mewtwo. so all in all, mewtwo is completely superior in gardevoir, even in terms of emotion. so now i go back to my first point, why have a petty follower when you have the god? there are plenty of emotions mewtwo can feel that gardy cant, i mean mewtwo auctually questions his meaning. that just proves how emotionally superior he is.

No one insisted that Mewtwo be taken out for Gardevoir. Many people in this thread would like to see them both appear. And personally, I wouldn't consider Gardevoir a follower of Mewtwo because they aren't really much alike at all.
Mewtwo is actually a clone of Mew so I would consider Mew the god, Mewtwo the supreme follower, and Gardevoir just another psychic pokemon.
And just because Gardevior can't telepathically talk and tell everyone what it's feeling, etc. doesn't mean it isn't "questioning it's meaning." Mewtwo is just capable of actually telling the watchers of the movies how he feels. Gardevoir can't really do that since it can't telepathically talk.

 

[FiErCe_oNi]

mewtwo isnt just a clone of mew. mewtwo also has human DNA, and that makes him superior to mew. thats what also makes him emotionally superior. everyone agrees humans are emotionally superior to animals, so the same workds here. animals dont question their existance. anyway, im not worried about mewtwo leaving. im just saying gardy would be unnecesary.

 

[Fawriel]

...why do I always miss out on the good parts?

Anyway, it's a bold assumption that emotions have something to do at all with intelligence, though I guess in a way it's correct.
Now what is up with "emotional superiority"? The way you said it, that's apparently the ability to feel more emotions, not more emotion, because of "negative emotions" or something. So that means Mewtwo has some emotions that you suppose it can feel better than Gardevoir, who, it can be assumed, is emotionally on the level of a human? What emotions would that be, fnargle and grmsmald?
Or do you suppose that "superior emotion" comes from having a larger scale of potential emotions, like 0 to 20 instead of 0 to 10?

But let's get back to the intelligence thing.
You think emotions are based on choices. Now that, I would argue, is incorrect. Choices are based on common sense. Emotions are pretty much the opposite of that.
For instance, let's look at protective devotion in reality. You may think of Gardevoir as being some kinda natural-born yojimbo or something. How about you think of her as a caring parent? Imagine it, a mother protecting her child from potential death, despite impossible odds. Emotional? I'd say so. That's anger, sadness, love, potential happiness, concern, fear, and so on, all in one spot.

Now let's carry this further. What really makes one emotional?
Let's get on with some more real-life examples. I am Mewtwo, my ex-girlfriend is Gardevoir.
Mewtwo is more intelligent and has emotions, yeah. I am also, currently, more intelligent than her ( she's younger, might surpass me at some point ), and I am very sensitive and have a great scope of emotions. Yet, I do not act upon them. I suppress them and base my decisions on common sense. Same with Mewtwo. You don't really see Mewtwo being anything but TEH FURY most of the time, and in the end he actually listened to reason despite being all angsty and such. And even despite his trauma, he remains cool and calculating. Common sense right there.

Now Gardevoir ACTS according to emotion. Emotions may or may not increase in scope with intelligence, but they are not directly related. One could argue that a demented child feels more powerful emotions. I've known some borderline-syndrome people very well, it's the same in a way. As intelligent as you may be, if your emotions are strong, you won't be able to resist even if you know that it would be reasonable to. That's what really makes one emotional.
The girl I used to be with was the same, to the point where she'd cry very frequently and smile at all other times and listens to music only for the music, disregarding any lyrics or even the music video if there is one. She's intelligent, but basically a volcano of emotions.

Now which one is emotionally "superior"?


In the end, though, it's not like that matters, because you're still comparing a shaved psycho-kitten to a French ballroom dancer.

 

[Brawlman]

Shaved psycho kitten and french ballroom dancer. XD

 

[Staz]

i dont really mind if hes a character that would be niice

 

[FiErCe_oNi]

ah well, im sick of arguing about emotions

 

[Brawlman]

Good....Now for something to start a little discussion

How would Gardevoir fit into Subspace Emissary?

 

[HipsterKid]

I knew Fawriel would be able to explain the whole Emotions thing.
I know I'm horrible at arguing during the whole thing so I was just going to say "Let Fawriel explain it to you in the morning." But oh well. That's over with.

How Gardevoir would fit into Subspace emissary? Good question. My best bet would be having to do something with.... idk. I'm stumped :/

 

[adumbrodeus]

Good....Now for something to start a little discussion

How would Gardevoir fit into Subspace Emissary?

Protecting somebody that's involved in the story?

Who would be a question, but an attachment could certainly be arranged.

 

[:034:]

Good....Now for something to start a little discussion

How would Gardevoir fit into Subspace Emissary?

Hmm.. Tough question, most certainly. Well, since we don't know much about the general story, soo... I'll just make something up?

Gardevoir's Promise

A lone Gardevoir walks into the stadium, trying to get her mind off things. Her trainer died or something a couple days back, she'd do good to distract herself. Then she sees what was going to be the Mario VS Kirby fight, and the Primid come in. Scary stuff. Gardevoir tries to protect as many people as possible and leads people out of the stadium. She couldn't save them all.. Overflown by her emotions, she makes a decision: destroy the Primid to protect the world.

--

Something like that? I dunno...

 

[Fawriel]

Hmm.. Tough question, most certainly. Well, since we don't know much about the general story, soo... I'll just make something up?

Gardevoir's Promise

A lone Gardevoir walks into the stadium, trying to get her mind off things. Her trainer died or something a couple days back, she'd do good to distract herself. Then she sees what was going to be the Mario VS Kirby fight, and the Primid come in. Scary stuff. Gardevoir tries to protect as many people as possible and leads people out of the stadium. She couldn't save them all.. Overflown by her emotions, she makes a decision: destroy the Primid to protect the world.

--

Something like that? I dunno...

Whoa whoa whoa.

...actually, that is quite cool.
Unfortunately, it's probably too deep for SE; keep in mind that this is a simple story and will probably be told without a narrative. It also seems slightly out of character... I don't picture her as being vengeful, at least. Although I guess she might as well be.

A likely way would be much simpler:
We have the Pokemon Trainer, right? And he's apparently going to be a starter... so it's most likely that he'll take part in the story.
Imagine the PT fighting for whatever reason he sees to be fighting, then suddenly being overwhelmed by the Primid. Maybe along with a big boss, even.
Surrounded from all sides, he tries to come up with a plan to get out of this predicament... when the area is suddenly flooded with green light and everything turns silent for a moment, until a powerful green barrier surrounds PT and pushes the Primid away, defeating them.
The green light slowly fades and materializes in the form of Gardevoir, who stands protectively in front of the Pokemon Trainer, who she feels has a worthy heart to protect.
She nods at PT, he nods back.
It's up against the big boss together! \o/

...on the other hand. Gardy will most likely be unlockable. Who knows what role the unlockables play in SE... if any. Maybe the boss is a secret one and this is the way to unlock her...
It would make even more sense than usually to beat her like this, since you'd sort of "catch" her as the Pokemon Trainer. ^^

 

[Brawlman]

I think that every playale character will have part of the story in Subspace. Maybe it will work like Soul Calibur?

 

[Fawriel]

That would be easier to judge if you told us what it's like in Soul Calibur.

 

[Brawlman]

Oh....XP

In Soul Calibur...At least Soul Calibur 3....You did an adventure mode, much like the one in Brawl. (Without the side scrolling stages)

YOu start out by choosing one of the starter characters, and you go through their story. If you meet an unlockable character and beat them, you unlock them and can play through the story in their eyes.

Basicly what I'm saying is, you fight a character, you unlock them, they get a part of the story to themselves.

......I am cunfuzzled. XP

 

[:034:]

Whoa whoa whoa.

...actually, that is quite cool.
Unfortunately, it's probably too deep for SE; keep in mind that this is a simple story and will probably be told without a narrative. It also seems slightly out of character... I don't picture her as being vengeful, at least. Although I guess she might as well be.

A likely way would be much simpler:
We have the Pokemon Trainer, right? And he's apparently going to be a starter... so it's most likely that he'll take part in the story.
Imagine the PT fighting for whatever reason he sees to be fighting, then suddenly being overwhelmed by the Primid. Maybe along with a big boss, even.
Surrounded from all sides, he tries to come up with a plan to get out of this predicament... when the area is suddenly flooded with green light and everything turns silent for a moment, until a powerful green barrier surrounds PT and pushes the Primid away, defeating them.
The green light slowly fades and materializes in the form of Gardevoir, who stands protectively in front of the Pokemon Trainer, who she feels has a worthy heart to protect.
She nods at PT, he nods back.
It's up against the big boss together! \o/

...on the other hand. Gardy will most likely be unlockable. Who knows what role the unlockables play in SE... if any. Maybe the boss is a secret one and this is the way to unlock her...
It would make even more sense than usually to beat her like this, since you'd sort of "catch" her as the Pokemon Trainer. ^^

I wouldn't really say it's 'revenge'.. Basically, she's trainerless and belongs to the world, so she wants to protect the world from the Primid.

But your version is much better, actually. XD

 

[NukeA6]

Oh....XP

In Soul Calibur...At least Soul Calibur 3....You did an adventure mode, much like the one in Brawl. (Without the side scrolling stages)

YOu start out by choosing one of the starter characters, and you go through their story. If you meet an unlockable character and beat them, you unlock them and can play through the story in their eyes.

Basicly what I'm saying is, you fight a character, you unlock them, they get a part of the story to themselves.

......I am cunfuzzled. XP

Not always. The bonus characters had no part in Tales of Souls. This also includes Abyss.

 

[Brawlman]

Not always. The bonus characters had no part in Tales of Souls. This also includes Abyss.

Those are bonus...Not secret.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Good....Now for something to start a little discussion

How would Gardevoir fit into Subspace Emissary?

I did have one idea, but it involved using Link and Yoshi. Too bad I can't remember it.

 

[Brawlman]

3rd page!? I THINK NOT!!!


SIRNIGHT FOR BRAWL!!!

 

[RBinator]

I see this topic got quite a bit active lately, mainly with a talk of emotions I rather not get into.

I thought we all knew that Mewtwo hated everyone and everything because well umm... I dunno, he just does Gardevoir seems to be the opposite of that..

Brains!

Super special awesome!

I suppose. The plot induced stupidity allowed him to be "defeated" with the power of love and thunderstrike (mostly love).

It's actually a running joke with my smash-buddies that Pikachu is actually the strongest pokemon, because in the show and films, he seems to be able to beat anything with thunderstrike and love.

"The Strongest Pokemon" in general is a running joke, to where Samus could be "The strongest Pokemon" if I win when somebody was any other pokemon in melee. Samus is the strongest pokemon quite often, unless Fox or Falco is.

Can't wait till Gardevoir is confirmed so she could be The Strongest Pokemon.

She'd win everything.

Ash's Pikachu is broken, that it's either level 100 or much weaker during the times it does lose. As for love...

The power of friendship is even stronger then Chuck Norris!

Spoiler

In America!

 

[LightLink17]

After thinking about, I've come to the conclusion that Gardevoir has just as much chance, if not greater, of getting in as Lucario.

They're a bit difficult to compare when you think about it since they are from different generations, but in general it is true that Gardevoir is popular, here and over there. She was on Sakurai's poll. She's the only reasonable rep for her generation now that Deoxys has been deconfirmed, is a female, of which Sakurai stated there needed to be more of, etc etc.

While Lucario has his own reasons why he might be included, I simply don't see a reason why a lot of people instinctively decide he has much higher chances than Gardevoir.

 

[Mr. Who]

Maybe?

Maybe Gardevoir may make it in Brawl as a playable character.

I too found some significance in Ralts. I had played pokemon games before. But the Pokemon were not very creative much. Then I found Ralts.

But when you consider all the facts, it's more likely that Gardevoir will be a Pokeball Pokemon.

But you never know. People thought the Ice Climbers wouldn't be in, but they are.