Ganondorf Patch 1.0.6

[Blobface]

It always had fixed wight based knockback. It won't combo on CF without rage because he is a fast faller that isn't also a lightweight.

Did Ganon's pummel always do 3%? The only real change I've noticed was jab damage buffs and maybe this pummel damage buff. Jab still hits on frame 8 sadly. Still laggy too. His grab still whiffs on small crouch/landings.

Can you confirm if Ganon's endlag is shorter? Judging by the F-smash buff I think he may have gotten a small endlag buff on a lot of his moves, like last patch did with his aerials.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Dark fists has always killed at insane %'s. It killed Mario at 36% on FD with full rage. Anyone want to test this?

Didn't kill at 36%, but it did kill at 54% tho.

 

[HeavyLobster]

Dark fists has always killed at insane %'s. It killed Mario at 36% on FD with full rage. Anyone want to test this?

Killed level 1 Mario with DF with 150% of rage at 40% on FD. Handicap only does intervals of 10.

 

[Dr. Krumm]

Less laggy F-Smash and stronger a Jab? I'll take what I can get! Thanks Sakurai!

 

[Scarlet Jile]

1% jab difference and like 2 frames of Fsmash end lag cut? Well, at least Diddy got nerfed.

 

[Z1GMA]

This is pretty hilarious... It appears Mewtwo IS one of those "Jab Only Chars".

 

[Dumbfire]

Is it just me or did the knockback of aerial Down B get nerfed? Also, didn't Btrow kill before?

 

[Z1GMA]

Is it just me or did the knockback of aerial Down B get nerfed? Also, didn't Btrow kill before?

No, Bthrow never killed. Pretty lame considering how strong C.Falcon's Bthrow is.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Someone quickly tell me when Ganon's Jab KOs. I would assume the 10% sweetspot now kills around ~160%ish if I know anything about the knockback formula.

Also just to be really thorough, set a CPU to walk, have them walk into Ganon's back, and test how much damage the extreme close range hitbox of Jab does. Does 4% in the old versions.

Also would like someone just to make sure whether or not we got any lingering frames on Jab. Try to see first if it clanks against another Ganon F-tilt in frame advance.

 

[Blaziken77]

Maybe all placebo, but his bair hitbox looks larger, his dair feels like it has a frame or two less of landing lag, and his fair feels like it both starts and ends faster by a frame or two.

 

[Ray_Kalm]

This is good.

Ganon keeps getting buffs while those above him get mainly nerfs. This leads him into becoming more viable than he was before, even if it is just a small gap.

I always thought jab did low damage considering his very high damage input (the highest in the game in fact). - This leads to better match-ups against characters like Link and Samus (whom we already beat).

Fsmash having 2 less frames of lag is also huge. The move has 'unique' uses. The pushback it gave shield made it hard to punish, now with 2 less frames of lag, even more. You can also whiff it up on a landing opponent more safely.

All in all, Ganon got much better with this patch. What does the Lucas patch await us with?

 

[adom4]

This is good.

Ganon keeps getting buffs while those above him get mainly nerfs. This leads him into becoming more viable than he was before, even if it is just a small gap.

I always thought jab did low damage considering his very high damage input (the highest in the game in fact). - This leads to better match-ups against characters like Link and Samus (whom we already beat).

Fsmash having 2 less frames of lag is also huge. The move has 'unique' uses. The pushback it gave shield made it hard to punish, now with 2 less frames of lag, even more. You can also whiff it up on a landing opponent more safely.

All in all, Ganon got much better with this patch. What does the Lucas patch await us with?

Honestly i only really noticed the jab buff & f-throw buff (13%->14%)
Was the F-smash buff confirmed?
Were there any other confirmed changes?

 

[Corgian]

Was the F-smash buff confirmed?

There was a vine linked in this very thread confirming it.

 

[Dumbfire]

I always thought jab did low damage considering his very high damage input (the highest in the game in fact). - This leads to better match-ups against characters like Link and Samus (whom we already beat).

Link MU is certainly made a lot better too by the fact that Link no longer has a Jab lock on Ganon that used to work from 5%!

 

[Muskrat Catcher]

My flame choke just went through an inhaling D3, it pulled me in and choke won. Was it always like this?

Really? King Dedede's swallow used to win against flame choke. That sucks for us Dedede mains if this is true. Can we get a second person to confirm this? Maybe it was a strange situation. That's a very strangely specific buff to give Ganon if it was intentional. At least it doesn't go through gordos.

Ignore this. Swallow never beat flame choke.

 

[Ray_Kalm]

Really? King Dedede's swallow used to win against flame choke. That sucks for us Dedede mains if this is true. I need to test that. At least it doesn't go through gordos.

Swallow never won against choke. I can confirm this.

..brain.

 

[Muskrat Catcher]

Swallow never won against choke. I can confirm this.

..brain.

Really? Well, I guess I didn't pay enough attention before. Must have been a combination of gordos stopping flame choke, and/or the move ending right as Ganon entered the swallow whirlwind. Thanks for confirming that.

 

[adom4]

Can someone confirm the 1% fthrow buff?

If i'm not mistaken it did 13% before the patch, every match i fought it did 14%.

 

[Ray_Kalm]

If i'm not mistaken it did 13% before the patch, every match i fought it did 14%.

It did 13% in training mode and 14% in regular play pre-patch.

No changes.

 

[Blobface]

All of Ganon's throws except Down throw have definitely had their hitlag properties changed. They previous were a slightly laggy first hit followed by an actual throw. This lag is almost nonexistant, to the point I at first thought they were just a single hit. This is technically a buff since it's harder to slightly DI them.

And I'm not completely sure about this yet but all of his throws besides Down-throw seem a little stronger Knockback wise. Either way, Back-throw kills at 120-130% with full rage.

Jab kills at about 120-130% near the edge with full rage on Mario. Ganon has yet another kill move.

 

[Watulio]

There's somethinf I need people to confirm for me to confirm it's not some kind of placebo.

Is ganondorf's down throw animation faster

 

[JmacAttack]

All of Ganon's throws except Down throw have definitely had their hitlag properties changed. They previous were a slightly laggy first hit followed by an actual throw. This lag is almost nonexistant, to the point I at first thought they were just a single hit. This is technically a buff since it's harder to slightly DI them.

I'll take it.

And I'm not completely sure about this yet but all of his throws besides Down-throw seem a little stronger Knockback wise. Either way, Back-throw kills at 120-130% with full rage.

Jab kills at about 120-130% near the edge with full rage on Mario. Ganon has yet another kill move.

It's been that way since the beginning. No change.

 

[Thinkaman]

I've been going nuts testing f-smash. I think it feels ever-so-slightly faster/safer, and the video is compelling--but I have been testing 1.0.5/1.0.6 3DS and 1.0.6 WiiU side-by-side-by-side and I swear they are exactly the same.

My best theory is that the Ganon f-smash change was actually part of 1.0.4 -> 1.0.5, and overlooked.

 

[Big O]

I tested it out myself and there is no change in endlag or startup for Fsmash. I am disappointed, but the reported change was pretty minor regardless.

 

[Blobface]

There's somethinf I need people to confirm for me to confirm it's not some kind of placebo.

Is ganondorf's down throw animation faster

Well, just remember, Ganondorf's Down throw (and most other throws) have slightly different speed depending on the weight of the character being thrown.

 

[Watulio]

Well, just remember, Ganondorf's Down throw (and most other throws) have slightly different speed depending on the weight of the character being thrown.

Is this true?

 

[Blobface]

Is this true?

Try D-throwing Bowser then Jigglypuff. It's not impossible for it to be changed in this patch, but it'd be unlikely.

 

[Deleted member 269706]

I barely play Ganon, but I swear his recovery got buffed. Can anyone confirm or deny this?

 

[Jerbear9]

idk whether dthrow's knockback scaling or victim weight variable was changed but i definitely can't follow up with an uair the same. won't take long to get used to but some property was changed.

 

[Scarlet Jile]

I wasn't going to say anything because I don't have anything to compare it with, but I was definitely struggling to follow up my downthrows today as well.

His recovery did not get buffed as far as I can tell, @Rawkstar.

 

[Deleted member 269706]

I wasn't going to say anything because I don't have anything to compare it with, but I was definitely struggling to follow up my downthrows today as well.

His recovery did not get buffed as far as I can tell, @Rawkstar.

Interesting...always seemed like it was so much worse than it is now, but maybe the placebo is getting to me. Oh well.

 

[Blobface]

Did you account for rage? As far as I know D-throw is unchanged.

With that said I can confirm with certainty that Ganon's Forward, Back, and Up throws got weird changes. The first hit of each throw has very low lag now, when they previously had fairly high lag. This is technically a buff since it's harder to DI his throws now, but it's fairly unimportant.

 

[HeavyLobster]

This is good.

Ganon keeps getting buffs while those above him get mainly nerfs. This leads him into becoming more viable than he was before, even if it is just a small gap.

I always thought jab did low damage considering his very high damage input (the highest in the game in fact). - This leads to better match-ups against characters like Link and Samus (whom we already beat).

Fsmash having 2 less frames of lag is also huge. The move has 'unique' uses. The pushback it gave shield made it hard to punish, now with 2 less frames of lag, even more. You can also whiff it up on a landing opponent more safely.

All in all, Ganon got much better with this patch. What does the Lucas patch await us with?

While Ganon's viability in singles has improved a bit, his doubles viability is what's really gotten better, as you can no longer turn to Diddy as a ridiculously safe easy kill power character, and this creates a lot more room for other power characters to shine. Ganondorf was already devastating in doubles before the patch, but was overshadowed due to the presence of high tiers like Diddy and Sonic who could also get kills in addition to everything else they brought to the table. The damage buff is definitely a nice touch that highlights the fact that basically all of Ganon's moves are kill moves. With customs on, Ganon's one of the best stock tanks in the game and can rack up kills effortlessly, and now that the do-everything high tiers are somewhat less able to actually do everything, there's a lot more room for characters with more specialized skillsets to shine, and Ganon's one of the most potent of these.

 

[Jerbear9]

was having troubles following up dthrow because they were too close, maybe i needed more rage but i don't think so. could have been DI changes in the AIs i was fighting though.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

was having troubles following up dthrow because they were too close, maybe i needed more rage but i don't think so. could have been DI changes in the AIs i was fighting though.

Yeah, for some reason the AI DI's differently for some reason.

 

[King9999]

Did nobody notice that ground Flame Choke does 12% damage now? Also, can anyone confirm if Ganon falls slightly faster?

 

[HeavyLobster]

Did nobody notice that ground Flame Choke does 12% damage now? Also, can anyone confirm if Ganon falls slightly faster?

Flame Choke has always done 12% in Smash 4. Also I'm pretty sure that his fallspeed is the same.

 

[King9999]

Flame Choke has always done 12% in Smash 4. Also I'm pretty sure that his fallspeed is the same.

I swear it did 11% before. I even wrote it down in my guide.

I thought he fell faster. Placebo effects are too strong in Smash.

 

[jmanup85]

Did you account for rage? As far as I know D-throw is unchanged.

With that said I can confirm with certainty that Ganon's Forward, Back, and Up throws got weird changes. The first hit of each throw has very low lag now, when they previously had fairly high lag. This is technically a buff since it's harder to DI his throws now, but it's fairly unimportant.

That's actually a pretty good thing because now I can up throw C.Falcon and get him in better juggles without the player DI'ing every single time. I used it to great effect today against a Falcon player. The throws feel smoother and down throw feels the same to me.

 

[Z1GMA]

Gerudo always did 12%. I remember it did 3% more than its brawl counterpart on release.