Ganondorf Patch 1.0.6

[Ray_Kalm]

12 hours from now we will get version 1.0.6 of SSB Wii U.

Created this thread a day earlier for us to begin speculating the changes Ganondorf may receive.

I'll pile the list of changes here once they are properly confirmed for easy finding.

 

[Brinzy]

Hopefully Ganon will explode upon kidnapping Zelda.

We need a 100-0 matchup.

 

[Z1GMA]

A Frame 6 Jab, and he's ready to rock.

Not only would it generally be a much better move and compliment, but it'd also probably give us a garantueed Jab on the whole cast after a Gerudo.

 

[A2ZOMG]

A Frame 6 Jab, and he's ready to rock.

Not only would it generally be a much better move and compliment, but it'd also probably give us a garantueed Jab on the whole cast after a Gerudo.

Test that in slow motion against characters that have frame 6 grabs.

I might delay patching so that I can finish recording some select replays.

 

[Z1GMA]

I'm not following you, A2.

 

[A2ZOMG]

I'm not following you, A2.

We have a big existing frame data resource, so we know the startup times of all moves (barring obscure changes that will happen post patch). http://pastebin.com/PzTjdtx8

Basically if you go to training mode, and set it on frame advance, you can put Ganon next to a character with a 6 frame grab, and then you have them start the move at the same time before allowing playback. Ideally if we got any frame data changes, we will see Ganon's Jab trading with the grab, as opposed to being interrupted.

I suspect grabs are among moves that are extremely unlikely to get frame data changes, hence why I suggested them as test subjects.

 

[Xinc]

A list of wants for Santa Sakurai to deliver (Most will do):

Faster jab;
non-techable flame choke
Wizkick aerial jump replenisher
Thunderstorm/less lag down air

I think I might hold off on patch changing as well. Got some stuff to do, so I'll patch tomorrow most likely.

 

[Waluigi is too big]

I might just take any buffs I can get honestly.

 

[Xinc]

I might just take any buffs I can get honestly.

Really, I foresee Ganon probably getting 1 or 2 buffs, but what it is remains to be seen.

 

[adom4]

Ganoncide is still in, i don't notice anything different so far.

 

[HeavyLobster]

Ganon's Jab does 10% in training mode now. Unsure about other changes.

 

[Vermanubis]

Yeah, tip of jab does 10%. Everything else seems pretty similar.

DIsappointing.

 

[HeavyLobster]

Yeah, tip of jab does 10%. Everything else seems pretty similar.

DIsappointing.

Well at least the characters in front of him saw some nerfs and his strengths seem to be intact.

 

[Pyr]

Does his fair have less landing lag, or is that just me?

 

[HeavyLobster]

Does his fair have less landing lag, or is that just me?

Need to wait on the data dump to know for sure, but I thought it might have a bit less. Could be placebo too, it's not more than a couple frames if anything.

 

[Kyzon Xin]

Dark Fist was buffed. The Squat (startup) now has fixed knockback so it combos into the punch at any percentage.

 

[adom4]

F-throw now does 14%.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

I think Warlock Blade was nerfed a bit.

It says 24% damage on Thinkaman's Damage value table thing, but the most I can get out of a tippered Warlock Blade is 22%.

Can anyone confirm this?

 

[JmacAttack]

F-throw now does 14%.

Double check that you aren't testing against "random" CPUs with customs on. Fthrow still does 13% for me.

Jab does 8-10% now instead of 6-7%.

I think Warlock Blade was nerfed a bit.

It says 24% damage on Thinkaman's Damage value table thing, but the most I can get out of a tippered Warlock Blade is 22%.

Can anyone confirm this?

I can confirm that Thinkaman's damage table was inaccurate. It's been 18-22% since at least two patches ago.

 

[Pyr]

Dark Fist was buffed. The Squat (startup) now has fixed knockback so it combos into the punch at any percentage.

Can't get it to combo on Falcon at any percent, no rage. Can you confirm?

 

[JmacAttack]

Dark Fist was buffed. The Squat (startup) now has fixed knockback so it combos into the punch at any percentage.

Deconfirming this. Falcon and Bowser still fall out of it with no rage.

 

[Big O]

Can't get it to combo on Falcon at any percent, no rage. Can you confirm?

It always had fixed wight based knockback. It won't combo on CF without rage because he is a fast faller that isn't also a lightweight.

Did Ganon's pummel always do 3%? The only real change I've noticed was jab damage buffs and maybe this pummel damage buff. Jab still hits on frame 8 sadly. Still laggy too. His grab still whiffs on small crouch/landings.

 

[JmacAttack]

It always had fixed wight based knockback. It won't combo on CF without rage because he is a fast faller that isn't also a lightweight.

Did Ganon's pummel always do 3%? The only real change I've noticed was jab damage buffs and maybe this pummel damage buff. Jab still hits on frame 8 sadly. Still laggy too. His grab still whiffs on small crouch/landings.

Yes, pummel was always 3% in Sm4sh. It was 2% in Brawl.

 

[adom4]

From what i've tested F-tilt, D-tilt & Jab work on Mewtwo after chokes, also D-tilt hits if he tech rolls away.
EDIT: does anyone want to play right now so i can confirm this?

 

[Z1GMA]

I'm imagining they added a new sound effect to Dark Vault, and that Warlock Burst has better initial knockback and better knockback plus damage on sweetspot - still a worthless move, though.
I'm also imagining Dtilt has just slighty less cooldown, but that's probably just wishful thinking.

Kinda disapointed. No nerfs, though, and batter Jab Damage is at least better than nothing.
I was a bit over-hyped about this :/

I haven't been able to test Dsmash on shield.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Still haven't updated. But Gungnir tested F-smash. https://twitter.com/ganon_gungnir/status/588270383834382336

 

[Dark Phazon]

Did anything change for Ganon except jab doing 2% more? From what im hearing

 

[A2ZOMG]

Did anything change for Ganon except jab doing 2% more? From what im hearing

Less ending lag on F-smash (probably 2 frames) according to testing Gungnir (see above link).

 

[Dark Phazon]

Ow kool
the same thing for Down Air would have been better imo.

 

[Opana]

No more frame canceling

Helldrop remains, as does the similar ledge trick

My flame choke just went through an inhaling D3, it pulled me in and choke won. Was it always like this?

 

[HeavyLobster]

No more frame canceling

Frame canceling is definitely still in, though it does feel harder to do. It might force you to land with the first frame of the hitbox rather than at any time during the hitbox(not sure though) but I've definitely pulled it off in training mode.

 

[Godman]

So ive been playing on single player and training with both ai that doesn't do anything and amiibo and standard ai...

Can Ganondorf now Ftilt link if link misses a choke tech? Or am I going completely insane? And if this does work on link now does it on more characters who couldn't be hit before?

Also... it seems that the first of our King's Dsmash always links into the second instead of those rare instances where it just threw someone forward and didn't connect, can someone else confirm or am I just delusional?

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

So ive been playing on single player and training with both ai that doesn't do anything and amiibo and standard ai...

Can Ganondorf now Ftilt link if link misses a choke tech? Or am I going completely insane? and if this is a thing does it work on more characters?

Also... it seems that the first of our King's Dsmash always links into the second instead of those rare instances where it doesn't connect, can someone else confirm or am I just delusional?

Yes for both.


Also, couldn't Ganondorf always do an Ftilt off a missed choke tech?

 

[adom4]

Ganondorf can only jab link out of a choke.

 

[Blobface]

Haven't had a chance to test, but it's likely we got another general end lag buff, judging by Gungnirs clip. We'll likely have to wait for the data dump to know for sure though.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Dark Fists isn't consistently killing at 90% for me.


Hmmm....

 

[Blobface]

Dark Fists isn't consistently killing at 90% for me.


Hmmm....

Dark fists has always killed at insane %'s. It killed Mario at 36% on FD with full rage. Anyone want to test this?

 

[Godman]

Yes for both.


Also, couldn't Ganondorf always do an Ftilt off a missed choke tech?

It was (maybe still is) character specific because I think I remember before the patch we didn't have any sort of follow up unless we tech chased him

 

[adom4]

I just faced Mewtwo with Dorf, unfortunately D-tilt & F-tilt don't work after a choke, not sure about jab.
D-tilt hits him if he tech rolls away though.

 

[Opana]

Apparently we can't choke through inhale unless we start it at the right distance at close range, not sure if this was possible before but pretty cool albeit situational due to the strictness of it.

I'm almost positive about frame cancelling, I'll try some more.