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G4S5 Results Thread (Columbus, GA March 1st)

Nite

Nite

Smash Champion
Joined
Dec 29, 2005
Messages
2,538
Location
Memphis, TN
ama(m/t) said:
i <3 jigglypuff
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Thanks. LOL Just playing. <3 Tong

And about all the drama, I don't really see the point. Internet debates NEVER go anywhere. You might as well spend your time getting better at the game instead of posting on smashboards, like Iori does. Congrats Iori.
 
Smooth Criminal

Smooth Criminal

Da Cheef
Joined
Oct 18, 2006
Messages
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Location
Hinckley, Minnesota
NNID
boundless_light
chaddd said:
BAWWWWWW camping BAWWWWWWWWWW three hours of sleep and caffeine BAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW lack of food BAWWWWWWWW .
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Christ on a cracker. Though I was fortunate enough to have sufficient funds to eat (through Nica and Kong), I got even less sleep than your happy ***.

Wait? WHAT'S THIS? Less sleep? You heard it here. I pretty much stayed up all night at Prac's place and got all of MAYBE an hour of shut-eye (hell, Tom got even LESS sleep than me and he still played **** well at the tourneys). Is that the reason I lost? **** no; it's because I suck *** at Melee and I played people that were just that much better than me.

It doesn't take a pro to realize that you're being a little *****, Chaddd. As I recall, you've won plenty of other tourneys or have at least placed very well. Take your lumps and move on. Perhaps you'll get over your god**** camping deficiency and learn how to man up.

Smooth Criminal
 
J

JMOAN

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 30, 2006
Messages
157
Location
State College, PA
chaddd said:
No offense dude, but please shut up. Shut the hell up. If you were JMAN, I'd have some respect for you, but since you're J*****AndMoan, I don't give half a sh*t what you have to say, as many times as I've seen your name up on the top 10 list. I said nothing about camping being a problem, I said it's incredibly annoying when I'm just trying to play to win on 3 hours of sleep, and there's always some douche motherf*cker who wants to run my patience dry 2 rounds before winner's finals.

I don't need to justify myself to you, but you seem to think I would have read that entire BS filled post of yours you spent verbally masturbating Chad and Iori.

And as for 'Camping doesn't work' and the 'prove it' remark, **** off with the bullsh*t. I believe everyone saw winner's finals. I also believe I won the Fox ditto on that god awful Poke Floats, despite Iori's constant laser camping. Then the caffeine wears off before loser's bracket catches up, and I'm wondering how I'm going to make the 3 hour drive home alive.

Quit proving that you're ignorant.
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Chaddd, I'll give you one thing. The name "JB1tchAndMoan" is pure genius, if inaccurate. Seriously, I lol'd IRL.

(Though I'm not sure how I ***** and moan... I get down on myself from time to time, but I always realize when I lose it's because I just straight up lost. Period. Any errors on my part I should endeavor to fix, and any "gayness" on my opponent's part must have been effective.)

First of all, I hardly think the "no offense dude" was sincere...

Now, please don't misunderstand me. You're good at the game. That's for d4mn sure. Your Ganon is a beast, and I have felt his cold hard F-air of Fury upon my Sheik before. It hurts me in my face, it hurts in my body, it hurts in my soul, and I die shortly thereafter. No amount of chain grabbing seems to matter, either. I love watching you play and I must admit you've made me want to play Ganon more. (Yes, everyone, that's my bast4rd confession.)

But it seems to me that you're still unduly insulting campers (specifically Chaddd and Iori). How can you claim it's not a problem, and imply that you think it's alright to camp, yet still call campers "douche motherf*cker"s? You say you were playing to win on 3 hours of sleep, so why would you get upset at someone else that is "playing to win" also? Not everyone has the same style when they play to win, and some people happen to use camping because it's an effective strategy. I've already indicated how I think camping can be irritating to play against, but that is exactly why camping can be effective.

Not only can it work but it can p1ss off your opponent sometimes...as you have clearly demonstrated, Chaddd. I can tell you first hand I've laser-camped against someone with Fox SIMPLY because I knew it would affect their game by making them p1ssed off. I mean, that's one of the reasons I choose Brinstar against Falcos/Foxes. Ask Viperboy if you want to hear about how much Brinstar can throw off someone's game. At INN5, it upset him so much, it affected his play in the third round and allowed me to win the match! It wasn't that I was better than Viperboy necessarily, it's that I used a tactic that I knew would throw him off. And it worked.

Obviously, whatever Iori did in his matches was a good idea, because he won. Perhaps upsetting you was all part of the strategy. Iori is basically a walking mind game anyway, I'm sure if he saw that you were getting upset at his camping, that would only encourage him to camp more.

And with that, I'm gonna quit elongating this pointless debate. Ultimately all that matters are tournament results, and since mine are less than stellar, I'm gonna take Nite's advice and just practice more. Like Iori. Now, if only there were more people in Middle TN...


(On a final note, I hate that cuss words are edited out... The average poster isn't 14 anymore, guys, c'mon!)
 
Tom

Tom

Bulletproof Doublevoter
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i appreciate the mention, smooth, because it is true that i got maybe an hour of sleep from thursday morning --> the end of the tournament, and that was at prac's house when nobody would play brawl with me anymore. LOL <3 brawl

however, its also true that chaddd is on a whole different level of smash than I am, so the fact that i got no sleep and played well (for tom, at least) shouldn't detract from anything he says.

(edit: theres even proof to that LOL chaddd played me in brackets and although it was very fun for me, i was schooled harder than helen keller)

i love everyone. if i even hated a single person in the south community, which i dont, it wouldn't make a difference because i would at least respect their abilities.
 
XIF

XIF

Smash Master
Joined
Nov 30, 2003
Messages
4,711
Location
ZOMG Duluth, GA mostly... sometimes Weston, FL
If anyone has read playing to win by Sirlin then they'll be able to follow me by saying this.

PTW is not just about being good at a game, its about being good at a game at a tournament level. You could have the most talent on the face of the earth, but if you crack under pressure...

or more importantly something that is cited specifically...

if you cannot handle the stress and length of a tournament, from fatigue to boredom to being smelly, then you are not the best yet. Part about being the best is overcoming every unavoidable obstacle in your way. Having to stay up past the limit of exaughstion is a fact of tournaments, having to deal with smelly *** hobos is another fact (during FCD I dont think half the people showered, I know I never got the chance to because I was playing tournament matches almost constantly.)

But being good at a game is handling your opponent and the enviroment within reason. If someone is poking you the entire time thats a completely different story. But this is a fact of fatigue, and its something we all must deal with.

Now as for johns...

I of all people should be understanding of people who john at tournaments. It hurts to lose bottom line, and if you need to displace some of that disappointment then I think its understandable. I think most people who are even somewhat smart about tournaments once they get over the loss can easily admit that their defeat is their own fault, unless once again we get to a point where the problem at hand is something they think should not be allowed in the first place. Myself like I said Green Greens and Corneria are stages that should be banned, and I dont think its entirely unreasonable for me to say I'll attribute my match loss in part because of those stages because I truly believe that they are imbalanced. For a set loss to a lesser extent but I will explain that later. But for me to blame my opponent would be ludicrous, its a fundamental problem with the tournament. And for every tournament with stages like that allowed, I have always suggested WEEKS AND WEEKS in advance that they should change the stage rules. I dont start complaining only after I lose... before, after, during, win, or lose they are dumb stages and I will always think they should be banned.

Now as for attributing entire set losses to stages...

I think stages have a lesser effect on sets (due to their nature), but I do not think it is a valid argument to say that stages should be allowed because even if they are busted you have the other matches to work with. This asks for the opponent to be significantly better than his adversary in order to win, instead of any better at all. Let me illustrate.

---

In a best of 3, you have player 1 who is the favorite to win based on a probability distribution of the 6 neutrals. The expected win-loss ratio between player 1 and player 2 based on the average of the 6 neutrals is something like 60-40.

Player 1 is a supporter of neutral stages, and as such, only plays on neutrals. Player 2 on the other hand is a supporter of larger stage variety, and as such will never hesitate to pick a really obscure stage as a counterpick. Player 1 can obviously ban a stage but Player 2 has a plethora of other stages to pick from, and we'll say that on average with those stages and characters that player 2 is bound to use it gives us a 70-30 advantage for player 2.

I was gonna type out all the possible permutations with these contrived possibilities and outcomes, but it boils down to what is a solid advantage for player 1 given neutral stages becomes a much less pronounced advantage for player 1 and even provides a disadvantage in some instances which would have otherwise not been there. Because while everything can be solved by just being better, it asks for the player to have a developed ability with a character that exceeds the natural advantage a stage gives another character. Player 1 has to build a house with hammers and screw drivers and saws, while Player 2 has powertools. If player 1 were an accomplished carpenter than sure he could build a better house but you cannot deny that player 2 has an unfair advantage.

Now of course the counter argument to this is that player 1 needs to learn more of the game, (or use powertools!), but the point here is that Smash Bros like any fighter needs to have defined rules. We need to be playing the same game here, and we need to decide what the best game is. This is mostly redundant but it almost bears repeating. You can tell me just learn Fox or just learn Marth but then what? You pick Corneria and now you've basically created a scenario where its in our best interests to consider fox and fox only. What kind of game is that? Thats been done and its called Street Fighter 1... Ken vs Ryu. Thats such an entirely shallow game because there's no room for character development (I refer to both the first street fighter and to playing smash on Corneria).

---

now with all of that said I just got an idea. What would be an interesting idea for a tournament is to allow EVERY stage and limit the character selection to Fox. No stage bans, and now all of a sudden we have a game where the entire point is not developing characters but developing stages. My point for this not being a serious tournament being that even a tournament like that would end up becoming fairly shallow because Hyrule temple would be snorefest 2008.
 
KOkingpin

KOkingpin

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Joined
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Messages
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Murfreesboro, TN
honestly stage selection allows Chars like Pikachu, Mewtwo, and Yoshi hang with the likes of chars like Ganon, Peach, and Fox.

I lost at this tournament. Period. no because or anything like that. I had fun at this tournament Playing Yoshi the whole time. Most fun ive had yet.

If you dont like the stage selection at this tournament hold your own. and ban everything but FD if you want to. i made some odd stages legal at my tournament and everyone was like "WTF?" do i give a crap? no. in the end everything was good and we all had fun. Camping is gonna happen in any game that is can possibly happen in, because its a viable strategy. Sometimes just bombing the crap outta someone works (ei. WW2)(america for C..). Pokefloats is a fair stage for one reason. its not really fair to anyone cause the stage can gimp you at any moment. any strategy that is not banned is legit.
XIF said:
Player 1 has to build a house with hammers and screw drivers and saws, while Player 2 has powertools. If player 1 were an accomplished carpenter than sure he could build a better house but you cannot deny that player 2 has an unfair advantage..
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The problem with this statement is that player 1 didnt use intelligence to his advantage. Player 1 had the Powertools but didnt use them.player 2 played it smart and took the long road to learn other stages that other people wouldnt bother with. That makes him better in the strategy department. Its a massive flaw it the "fair Play" system. because even when you ban stages that are advantageous to low tiers you make it basically Top/high tier vs Top/high tier. which is ********. Though i still see the point you are trying to make. That still doesnt make picking odd stages unfair.

Ban too little and its Fox onry. Ban too much and its top Tier onry. Finding the middle is the hard part.

To win it take 3 things in melee from what ive seen.

Skill
Strategy
Mindgames

ps. im excited for brawl's coming. yoshi is gonna be top tier.

JMOAN said:
I can tell you first hand I've laser-camped against someone with Fox SIMPLY because I knew it would affect their game by making them p1ssed off
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coughcoughSunchasercough
 
-Chad-

-Chad-

Slackerator
Joined
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Messages
2,718
Location
Southaven, Mississippi
@XIF- the problem with your example is that both players aren't denied the right to practice and learn effective strategies on every stage with any character.
 
theONEjanitor

theONEjanitor

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Messages
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Birmingham, AL
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the1janitor
i just wanted to point out how XIF is able to disagree with people without being a jerk about it.

there are many many people in this region that need to take that hint

kfanx
 
nicaboy

nicaboy

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Messages
2,981
Location
channeling death lotus
there is always going to be camping are we still talking about this. move on and live camping is unvoidable in games in which it can happen
 
G

GA Peach

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 6, 2005
Messages
1,122
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CHUG! CHUG! CHUG!
...this is why other fighting games are better than smash. you don't have to worry about stages playing a role in anything(except in Tekken 4 and Rage of the Dragons, but those games blow anyway)
 
A

ama(m/t)

Smash Lord
Joined
Dec 30, 2007
Messages
1,174
in melty blood the back alley is better for characters with large area attacks fyi
 
daniel-zaman

daniel-zaman

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 10, 2006
Messages
292
Location
newnan georgia
In The ZONE said:
lol @ Chaddd calling me out for not making any money. I had way more fun than you did Chaddd and I've been playing for a lot less time. And shouldn't the fun factor be what these tournaments are about? I mean if you came to every tournament and lost to a shineless fox that came from the losers bracket I think every tournament would be so much better, especially because of your huge jerk factor that you bring to the table. Theres a reason no one cheered for you when you got a kill bro. TRU
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your a ****ing moron. chaddds been playing this game less than any one who made the top ten, and he made 2nd. no one cheered for chaddd because no one is up his *** like iori. every one hates chadd because he picks this game up and pwnz.
 
A

ama(m/t)

Smash Lord
Joined
Dec 30, 2007
Messages
1,174
i played thsi game for the first iem at the tournament

also i have a 2400 sat and 160 iq
i got into oxford at 12
 
XIF

XIF

Smash Master
Joined
Nov 30, 2003
Messages
4,711
Location
ZOMG Duluth, GA mostly... sometimes Weston, FL
-Chad- said:
@XIF- the problem with your example is that both players aren't denied the right to practice and learn effective strategies on every stage with any character.
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And that is absolutely right, however, my entire point is that when you introduce these stages you're essentially forcing people to learn these new strategies, and that'd be fine by me if it weren't for the fact that I think it makes for an entirely shallow, uninteresting, and not fun game when this happens. My entire thesis is that Game A is better than Game B, as it has more depth, more variety (Or different variety you could say), and is alot more fun.

I propose game A and some propose game B.

KO: I have hosted tournaments, FIVE tournaments. And my rules have been FD, DL64, and Pokemon Stadium only.

An excerpt from Your post: The problem with this statement is that player 1 didnt use intelligence to his advantage. Player 1 had the Powertools but didnt use them.player 2 played it smart and took the long road to learn other stages that other people wouldnt bother with. That makes him better in the strategy department. Its a massive flaw it the "fair Play" system. because even when you ban stages that are advantageous to low tiers you make it basically Top/high tier vs Top/high tier. which is ********. Though i still see the point you are trying to make. That still doesnt make picking odd stages unfair.


This was meant simply to illustrate the imbalance, and how you cant ask for people to simply be significantly better than their opponent because of stupid stages. I've already explained why I think the strategies in stages and choosing stages I think are not enough to offset the negative side effects. I understand perfectly well that there's legitimate strategy involved in using stages effectively and knowing when to use stages. But like I said, They remove also alot of room for character development because it becomes so concentrated on using stages.

And I have also covered banning more stages boiling down to the higher tiers, and my response to that was and still is that the Japanese entirely disprove that notion.

and also...

I'm not necessarily insinuating that you guys have disregarded my posts, but you're responses I dont feel really respond to my arguments adequately. I put alot of time into those posts, and while I could care less whether or not anyone reads them, I'd rather not see people just pick out one thing and type up a response. An argument is no argument without all its parts for support. You cant respond to an entire argument by just refuting one point, because there's so many more there which support, qualify, etc.
 
Dogysamich

Dogysamich

The Designated Hype Man!
BRoomer
Joined
Jul 3, 2002
Messages
6,140
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Warner Robins, Georgia
/me pulls a Doc keychain out of his pocket.

What's that Doc? Ram's gunna turn 23 and still spends his time playin kids games rather than hangin with hot girls? That's what he gets for hanging with loser Luigi. XD
 
Handorin

Handorin

Smash Hero
Joined
Dec 2, 2005
Messages
6,013
Happy Birthday, RAM. You look younger than 23, but that may be a good thing?
 
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