G3S Mafia #4 | Game over - Town wins!

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

mfw you vote a null read oevr a scum one zen

 

[Xivii]

Scary is fodder. An acceptable D1 lynch. Both the nulls would be vigbait if Fromarsh wasn't occupying the entire isle of seats.

 

[Magic Bounce]

Vote: Scary

[collapse=Update]Town: Zen, Rake, Kantrip, Ruy, Kafkaesque

Null: Scary, Xatres

Vigbait: frozenmarsh (possibly trying to draw in the mafia kill by playing like a PR? Whatevs vig this dude for real)

Weak Scum Lean: Joey, Magic Bounce

Strong Scum Lean: Sokr [/collapse]

I'm only here momentarily. I saw your explanation on the next page but this still doesn't really sit well with me. Of all your scumreads, you've said I'm the only one that you would accept leaving around simply due to wanting more, and yet you bypass them all for a null guy.

 

[Kafkaesque]

What SHOULD i be attacking him for ?

I already pointed out the backtrack and I haven't even MENTIONED that he was fully willing to go to Ryu with me (for no rhyme or reason on my part by the way, I just asked).

Double standard OP.

I want you to tell me what you thought of the backtrack though.

Yeah I'm aware that you've pointed out the back track. When I said that you were attacking Scary for the wrong things, I was referring to how you've attacked him for responding to your fake pressure. Basically I don't think it's fair to say that there's anything telling about a player getting frustrated with baseless pressure, especially a newbie player. What I DO think is telling is that Scary is not looking for scum and he cares about his apperence, and the back track is evidence of that. I don't know about Scary's meta but he's being too nice for my liking. Being nice in itself is not scummy, but I think he wants to be perceived as nice, which is scummy. I'll quote more after work today.

RR what do you think about this?

 

[Magic Bounce]

ebwop: "fodder" doesn't really justify a lynch over "other guys are scum". i know what you're playing at here and i'm telling you after mp2 i will never be down with that kind of horse**** philosophy.

 

[Magic Bounce]

Vote: Scary

Oh we in there!

vote hopping all day
no responsibilities
no direct call-outs for actions

let's stop playing ginger with this slot because it's occupied by frozenflame/marshy

Vote: FroMarsh

 

[Magic Bounce]

I agree with you that Rake is mostly attacking Scary for the wrong things, but what did you make of what I brought up about Scary's backtrack? Noob mistake, or was he truly being uncommitted? Is him backing away like that what you would expect from a OMGUS?

It's the one thing about his actions that I actually don't much like. Everything else at least makes sense given his level of skill, and to an extent so does this as it seems that a lot of people were calling Rake town from his perspective. This might've given Scary pause and made him back off. If that's not the case, it's a lot more shady than I imagine and is one of the reasons this slot currently sits at null on my list, as I have yet to see enough of his play to determine either way yet.

 

[Xivii]

I'm only here momentarily. I saw your explanation on the next page but this still doesn't really sit well with me. Of all your scumreads, you've said I'm the only one that you would accept leaving around simply due to wanting more, and yet you bypass them all for a null guy.

You have to realize that I'm really not so good at reading people early game. I'm wrong far more often than I am right. It's beneficial to town if I'm more willing to work with others. And as I said, Scary is fodder. Most of dgames doesn't like to lynch fodder (inactives, scummy people who are given a pass because they are newbs, scummy people who are given a pass because their claim) the first two days. I do.

 

[Xivii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8bcyJ9iOvQ&list=FLuO1JynoacyhjvwdSFLNxUw

 

[Kafkaesque]

Wow, totally didn't expect Zen to join me like that. 0_0 What a weird wagon. Zen your scumreads still have momentum behind them, so why get rid of Scary toDay? Not complaining, but it's still curious.

It's the one thing about his actions that I actually don't much like. Everything else at least makes sense given his level of skill, and to an extent so does this as it seems that a lot of people were calling Rake town from his perspective. This might've given Scary pause and made him back off. If that's not the case, it's a lot more shady than I imagine and is one of the reasons this slot currently sits at null on my list, as I have yet to see enough of his play to determine either way yet.

I'll quote more after work to see what you think of it.

 

[Kafkaesque]

You have to realize that I'm really not so good at reading people early game. I'm wrong far more often than I am right. It's beneficial to town if I'm more willing to work with others. And as I said, Scary is fodder. Most of dgames doesn't like to lynch fodder (inactives, scummy people who are given a pass because they are newbs, scummy people who are given a pass because their claim) the first two days. I do.

ninja'd

 

[Xivii]

Also in the fodder category:
People who play scummy but aren't lynched because of their meta
People who play scummy but aren't lynched because they are power players

(See Fromarsh)

 

[~ Gheb ~]

frozenmarsh751 [2] - Xatres, Magic Bounce
Sokr [1] - Anomandaris_Rake
Xatres [1] - Potassium
ScaryLB59 [3] - Kafkaesque, frozenmarsh751, Zen

Not voting [4] - ScaryLB59, Masquerain, Sokr, Red Ryu;

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

So if I understand this correctly Zen, I'm on the road to getting lynched over scum leans because of an admittedly awful OMGUS and subsequent backtracking. Oof.

With that said, I am with magic bounce on the vote of Fromarsh. I know it's been repeated but the dude has jumped onto each wagon that has gained traction. He's only had one post that did any sort of explaining and even in that post he wants everyone not to care about his vote-hopping. Something is just bugging me in his wording.

Vote: FroMarsh

@Zen: Does FroMarsh fit those two fodder categories you added? If so, then why null fodder over scum lean fodder according to your current reads?

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

What about his wording bugs you.

What makes his play scummy over antitown

 

[Sokr]

Vote: Frozenmarsh

This isn't even for his votehopping. I'll post more on this when I get to a computer.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

>not for the only thing Marshy is essentially doing
>can't wait to hear this

 

[#HBC | Scary]

What about his wording bugs you.

What makes his play scummy over antitown

He's really contributed next to nothing except planting his vote anywhere he can. I'm struggling to see anything helpful with him throwing his vote around like that.

Come to think of it. Zen, in your #460 you said you would be fine with him going essentially. However you decide to place your vote on me when you have both me and fromarsh falling under the fodder category. Take it as you will but since I see me as a null and then him as the same read as you had in #460, I cannot help but think something is amiss.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Yeah I'm aware that you've pointed out the back track. When I said that you were attacking Scary for the wrong things, I was referring to how you've attacked him for responding to your fake pressure. Basically I don't think it's fair to say that there's anything telling about a player getting frustrated with baseless pressure, especially a newbie player. What I DO think is telling is that Scary is not looking for scum and he cares about his apperence, and the back track is evidence of that. I don't know about Scary's meta but he's being too nice for my liking. Being nice in itself is not scummy, but I think he wants to be perceived as nice, which is scummy. I'll quote more after work today.

RR what do you think about this?

Depends, he was a t a tournament and claims comp troubles along with posting on his phone.

I want to talk to him more before any kind of vote, if he keeps playing content dodge, you have my vote. If not then I really don't see him doing anything that scummy.

Not giving content, hit or miss on this if he keeps dodging giving this, then yes he an die.

If he is trying to give content that is a different story, I need more from him first.

Why are you A-ok with FroMar, their play benefits only them and fits what I expect from Scum Marshy.

Vote: Fromar

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

FRO MARSH IS AT L-1

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

unvote

 

[frozenmarsh751]

Ruy, I don't see what's scummy about vote jumping. I'm sirprised you think I'm scum for it when normally as scum I just tunnel and say LYNCHLYNCHLYNCH.

Lol @ Scary voting me and "something bugging him about my wording" and that my posts aren't helpful. Neither is concrete. Town needs to stop giving this dude the benefit of the doubt because he is new. Note that I'm being voted for "wahh unhelpful" and the only dude who has even tried to explain scumminess in my play is Ruy. And y'all call me lazy.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Again, I have no idea what your meta is. Probably a disadvantage of being new, so I'm going off what I have and all I have is you jumping into each wagon, some post about a lion which lead to a vote, a few questions for discussion, and wanting votes from Rake.

My gut tells me that Zen is keeping you around for more than just Vig bait and I'm going to stick with that unless something blows my mind.

 

[Xivii]

Scary the thing is you haven't looked at anyone who hasn't voted you. You're only going after people who vote you. Don't like it and don't like your "Feels and guts" as your only explanations. I don't remember this play from you in the newbie game we played. Going to go check that out now for reference actually.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Ruy, I don't see what's scummy about vote jumping. I'm sirprised you think I'm scum for it when normally as scum I just tunnel and say LYNCHLYNCHLYNCH.

Lol @ Scary voting me and "something bugging him about my wording" and that my posts aren't helpful. Neither is concrete. Town needs to stop giving this dude the benefit of the doubt because he is new. Note that I'm being voted for "wahh unhelpful" and the only dude who has even tried to explain scumminess in my play is Ruy. And y'all call me lazy.

I feel like when you are scum.

You put a fascade on to try and emulate how you normally are, when you're town, you throw yourself into the game. Not giving one **** what anyone says and don't give a damn about claims.

But you have purpose to it, purpose to why you are doing what you are doing for town.

Help me see that.

Because as scum, you can't explain it well this is why I thought you were scum in Hearts and Sephroth mafia.

Here though, help me be a bro if you're town.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Scary the thing is you haven't looked at anyone who hasn't voted you. You're only going after people who vote you. Don't like it and don't like your "Feels and guts" as your only explanations. I don't remember this play from you in the newbie game we played. Going to go check that out now for reference actually.

Also read Murica vs Canehdia

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Again, I have no idea what your meta is. Probably a disadvantage of being new, so I'm going off what I have and all I have is you jumping into each wagon, some post about a lion which lead to a vote, a few questions for discussion, and wanting votes from Rake.

My gut tells me that Zen is keeping you around for more than just Vig bait and I'm going to stick with that unless something blows my mind.

This bugs me.

Ive asked you to substantiate more than a few people and you've been sitting on stuff like this, unable to explain yourself but willing to vote.

Let's jump back a peg.

Why did you vote me or were willing to vote me when Rake asked?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Vote: Scary

Votes are wasted on Marshy, been rereading Scary's posts in the newbies, he can substantiate better than this.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

RR, I never voted you or thought of voting you after coming through that fire Rake dragged me through. I really only would have voted you if I had a case but I do not.

When you say "sitting on stuff like this", what do you mean?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

RR, I never voted you or thought of voting you after coming through that fire Rake dragged me through. I really only would have voted you if I had a case but I do not.

When you say "sitting on stuff like this", what do you mean?

This behavior is odd on a reread of Murica vs Canehdia.

You've voted back, but only when people voted you.

When you do vote, it seems like your reasoning is almost always hard to define.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Welp, not the cop either.

@Disfunkshunal; We can still be friends lol. I actually really like the case you presented against Capps. A lot of it makes sense. When you included pawn in your argument for Capps, it made me think... "If we lynch Capps, and he comes up scum, should we immediately jump on Pawn because of the previous interactions?" Same thing for vice versa if we were to lynch pawn, would we then hit Capps right away?

At the moment, either of those sound good to me, especially since no CC has challenged Poke yet.

What I mean is things like this, you were far more engaged and involved when you were town, here I don't see that.

Even more when you're relying on a lot of feels.

 

[Xivii]

Yeah just skimmed through those two games. I do think Scary is scum here. Scary was genuinely hunting in those games and as Ruy said he very much has the ability to substantiate on his reasoning. Also in Dr. Who mafia he did not react at all the way he did here when people called him scum. Ran got on Scary early D1 for backtracking in that game and Scary let the votes on him pass right through. His defensive reaction here feels bogus and far too self preservative compared to being voted for in the past.

 

[Sokr]

Thought that just occurred to me: Scary's diction and content seem to have changed in the past couple posts. I'm thinking this is either him picking up his game or a scum partner helping him out. I dunno, maybe I'm crazy.

 

[Sokr]

Wow. Ninja'd.

 

[Xivii]

You on CPU?

 

[#HBC | Scary]

You on CPU?

Yea, although sometimes my router cuts in and out.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

EBWOP: I managed to fix the wireless card problem. Now its just the internet of the house vs. me.

 

[Xivii]

(Was asking Sokr :3)

 

[#HBC | Scary]

What I mean is things like this, you were far more engaged and involved when you were town, here I don't see that.

Even more when you're relying on a lot of feels.

That is fair to think, but things were much more clear in those games. There was so much more to go with. We already had a claim and clearer scum reads. They were a bit easier to read. Here, everything is unclear and it's much tougher to make a read out of something that I'm not even sure of. In the game where I reacted cool to pressure, the pressure was nothing compared to what Rake through. I thought I was in trouble right from the get go, so I floundered poorly until Rake opened my eyes with his explanations; on that, I stepped back and tried to think a lot more with any content since I already fell apart once in this game. Hence why I'm sticking on the read I finally ended up making. I don't want to waffle anymore than I already have.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

If scary is scum, his partner wasn't around to coach him at first and is now, the diction has def changed but I'm stil lwaffling on it's intent.

Especially if it were fromarsh, he'd sooner throw his newbscum mate under the bus, so the vote by him seems dicey .It maybe that mb / joeys interference has allowed marshy to regaon hope.

I need to think on if im going to let scary basically get waya with saying : "thy are different games so i reacted different"