Fox - Guide and Discussion Thread

[Sangoku]

Bro, your English makes little to no sense, and you gotta cut the whole know-it-all thing out, especially because you don't.

I don't think I've ever read a post so close to what I think. Semp you're the man lol.

 

[TANK64]

Pete posted what I was thinking xD.

 

[SSBPete]

Pete posted what I was thinking xD.

great minds love taylor swift think alike

 

[Han Solo]

Any tips for using Fox against Falcon and Pika on Dreamland? Fox gets gimped SOOOOOO badly by these two characters, it's insane. I've played Battlecow's Falcon, and basically as soon as he gets a grab or up-smash, I'm done. His Pika is pretty good at gimping too.

So, what do you guys do against these characters? For Falcon, I try to shine-gimp as much as possible which works pretty well. I've also found that SHL is more useful than SHDL when Falcon is running because usually both my lasers go over Falcon when he's in the sprint animation. Pika is harder for me because you can't gimp it. I SHDL and jab a lot. Any other advice?

 

[ballin4life]

if your SHDL goes above falcon then time your second laser a little later. it's fine to just use single laser but i'm just saying it's not an inherent property of SHDL that it will go over falcon

against falcon laser -> grab -> gimp works. should get good at that because if you mess it up you gonna get usmashed

against pika i mostly try to do death combos so it's a bit more difficult. you can't really low percent gimp pika and you need to get him to really high percents to kill off the sides or the bottom (unless you can hit somehow with an fsmash or dsmash) so i tend to get most of my kills off top. you can still throw pika off the edge and try to punish his recovery to rack up damage - you're just not likely to get the gimp kill then and there

 

[SheerMadness]

Low laser tech chase Falcon around the stage. You can literally do this 3-4 times then just throw them off and gimp if you want.

Vs Pika control the stage with lasers. Retreating fairs really makes it hard for them to approach. Example, run at them like you're approaching but when you're close jump back and fair. Or just do stationary retreating fairs if they're really aggro. If they're at 90+ % edge guard by running off the stage then jumping back on with an up air. It's a fun and very winnable match up IMO, unless you're playing against one of the best pikas in the world.

 

[ciaza]

no wonder his upsmash is so powerful

http://nintendoeverything.com/81986/star-fox-had-metal-legs/

 

[SuPeRbOoM]

holy ****

 

[Sempiternity]

how has nobody...

whoa

this picture is making me question my sexuality

 

[asianaussie]

jesus christ, that contrast actually rendered me speechless

 

[Han Solo]

So, in my hours of watching fox players on youtube, I always see them use utilt and/or jab for shield pressure. Why is that? I can see it working against characters that can't quick-grab you (samus, link, yoshi), but against everyone else, it seems like it shouldn't work well.

Or maybe I play too many falcons who destroy my fox with upsmash OoS.

 

[The Star King]

Utilt for shield pressure? I don't see that at all. I don't think it's a great idea.

 

[SSBPete]

dtilt and jab are ok to catch people off gaurd but most good players will punish you for it

a grab is usually your best option on a shield

 

[ballin4life]

utilt is terrible on shield but i do it accidentally sometimes

 

[SheerMadness]

Jab -> jump back low laser.

Inch forward and jab -> jump back low laser again.

Technically frame wise they can roll out or w/e but it works very well. People don't know wtf to do usually.

 

[The Star King]

Until they get used to you, like a certain King

 

[SSBPete]

just did the coolest play with fox

nair - firefox tech chase - uair land on top dl platform - firefox ko

 

[ballin4life]

what percent allowed the fire fox to kill?

sounds pretty awesome

 

[SSBPete]

can't remember, ill have to try replicate it in training mode

 

[wiztick]

it looks like everything is w/ fox is just lazer lazer lazer =/
oh and hia im new to the forums

 

[The Star King]

Welcome.

But no.

 

[asianaussie]

there are some jabs now and then

 

[King Omega]

Shine jabs if you're fancy.

 

[wiztick]

either way do you NEED to use the lazer for most things? im just going into fox now and out of mario

 

[The Star King]

Not sure what you mean by "most things" but it's an essential tool for Fox yeah

But you could become a legendary laserless Fox lol, that sounds like fun

 

[Han Solo]

You don't have to use lasers, but it's probably the safest approach Fox has.

 

[wiztick]

thanks i cant get the hang doing them quickly thats why im so anti lazer with fox

 

[SSBPete]

practice

.

 

[wiztick]

i dont really know much about how to do it thats the problem =(

 

[Han Solo]

Here's some laser knowledge coming your way. There's a ton of different ways you can use Fox's laser most notably:

SHDL- Short Hop Double Laser. This is where you short hop and fire two lasers. This is probably the most useful laser technique Fox has, and a Fox main will probably use this many, many times in a match. You want to use the left C-button to short hop and then press B twice. Basically, you want the first laser to come out as soon as possible while you're jumping up, and you have a few frames to decide where you want the second laser to come out (the lower the second laser the better).

SHL - Short Hop Laser. First you short hop, and then you laser. The height of the laser depends on when you press B during the short hop. I use it when aggressive enemies (falcons particularly) are sprinting towards me and I do a retreating short hop laser to stop them. In most cases, SHDL is better suited.

Full Hop Laser- You do a full jump and you laser. Up to three laser can come out in one full jump. I use it when opponents are off the ledge and I want to hit them with lasers, and I also use it when my mess up my SHDL and I do this accidentally.

Standing laser- This is what happens when you press B and don't do anything else. You'll want to avoid this as much as possible because of all the lag the move has. However, this is the easiest way to hit a crouching opponent with lasers IMO.

Laser from the ledge- When Fox is on the ledge, you can drop down, jump back up and do two lasers. I think it's one of Fox's best get-up options depending on the stage and how far away your opponent is. You can do this in the same way you do a SHDL.

 

[ballin4life]

short hop single laser is very useful if you can get the laser to be low to the ground. it's very difficult to do a short hop double laser if you are running when you do the jump so in that case a single low laser is probably better.

 

[Battlecow]

people need to do the LHDL more. I remember sheer doing it and being just amazed that I hadn't seen it before, considering how effective it was against me in terms of damage/followup or else positional advantage if I took the safe route and just hopped on a platform or something 9001 miles away from the ledge... but no other good foxes really ever tried it, or at least didn't abuse it to the extent they could've (against me, at least).

 

[ballin4life]

what is LHDL?

 

[Han Solo]

LHDL = ledge hop double laser?

 

[The Star King]

people need to do the LHDL more. I remember sheer doing it and being just amazed that I hadn't seen it before, considering how effective it was against me in terms of damage/followup or else positional advantage if I took the safe route and just hopped on a platform or something 9001 miles away from the ledge... but no other good foxes really ever tried it, or at least didn't abuse it to the extent they could've (against me, at least).

Wut I do it. And I'm not even sure Sheer does it much. Are you sure you're not thinking of me?

The Dreamland platforms kind of protect you from fullhop -> fastfall aerial punish (don't do it if they're sitting on the platform obviously). You can still punish it with short hop sometimes depending on character/how high they do it.

Run-off stage -> jump double laser with Kirby is imba though

 

[clubbadubba]

Just a note, with SHDL its easiest if you slide your thumb from left-c to b in one quick motion in order to shorthop and fire the first laser. The second laser you can then time for the height you want.

LHDL is my favorite getup for fox, its so good. Run-off jump back up double laser is viable for fox too. I remember boom doing that if I ever gave him enough space.

 

[Mahie]

LHDL has been the thing in Europe since like 2008, what Fox players really need to learn, and 64 players in general, is shield dropping.


Also on DreamLand, people need to learn Ledgehop -> Shine land on the platform, that's a really fast mix-up and decently safe in many match-ups.

 

[The Star King]

While we're talking about things people need to learn, they need to learn to use uair more in Fox combos on heavyweights/fastfallers

A uair after like a dtilt or utilt is better than dair or fair or whatever pretty much always on chars like Falcon

And even on floaties it's often better, i.e. if you're anywhere underneath the Hyrule platforms you can often uair chain them into a usmash on the top platform or just a straight-up uair kill

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

LHDL has been the thing in Europe since like 2008, what Fox players really need to learn, and 64 players in general, is shield dropping.


Also on DreamLand, people need to learn Ledgehop -> Shine land on the platform, that's a really fast mix-up and decently safe in many match-ups.

This this this. I don't see many players utilize Shield Dropping like they should, You have way more options with shield dropping, not to mention it looks cool.

I'd say a huge suggestion for Fox right now is practice learning the basics, Lasers can help win a game but don't rely on them. Work on getting a feel for Fox by practicing simple combos like dair>dtilt>dair, or any other variant. Those can get you started and then get a feel for fox's other attacks. Most foxes usually don't get to the curve where they stop relying on simplistic combos so they never improve, after you feel like you've mastered simple things like that, work on fundamentals like your spacing and DI. Don't forget Edgegauring either, Fox's bair is pretty standard for edgegaurding, if you're wondering.

Really coulda gone in more detail about this but I digress.

 

[Sempiternity]

people don't shield drop?

news to me