Fire Emblem: Awakening Mafia | GAME OVER: Not Equal To The Challenge

[Kantrip]

Getting annoyed with my logic doesn't give you an out to my questions, and avoiding them is scummy, Zen.

 

[Kantrip]

@Kary: How would your reads change if Xastrn flipped scum?

 

[Xivii]

Getting annoyed with my logic doesn't give you an out to my questions, and avoiding them is scummy, Zen.

Oh.

 

[Xivii]

Be back later tonight.

 

[ranmaru]

This is bad, man. You need to be willing to reassess your reads.

Have you read my Kary and Xastrn cases? What do you think of them?

True. I haven't. I didn't even notice a Kary case from you. :s Especially your Xastrn case, as I was catching up and would read it later. I'll read them and give thoughts once I do.

I townread Kantrip, Kary, FML, that's about it. What I mean by 'my reads not likely changing' is I would narrow it down to the nulls. Obviously I want to keep my townreads, but I am willing to re-assess them if I have to. I don't think this is the time for that, yet I'll look at your cases still.

 

[Kantrip]

Thanks. I just basically want your opinion on if they have merit, if I'm reaching on points, what you agree/disagree with.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

@Kary: How would your reads change if Xastrn flipped scum?

I haven't thought about it and don't plan to really. I will probably be less suspicious of RR. I will probably be more suspicious of Zen. & etc.
Still doesn't tell me anything about the likes of Ran, dabuz.

 

[ranmaru]

You are welcome, I got you.

Ran I'll answer you in time. What is your dabuz meta coming from?

I'm waiting. I'll answer this but I at least want a name. Meta for Dabuz:

Walmart Mafia: He was obv town, and I had a town read on him there.
GS3#3: He was traitor. I didn't have a initial scum read but we got 'em later on in the day anyways. He super lurked there.

I think he may have been scum somewhere else but the name escapes me. But to me, his play seems like he is only posting to post. I mean look, he posted some mechanics thing about Xast.

WHEEEE

 

[#HBC | Kary]

My discussion regarding Zen has been in private with Sokr. I've posted some of it in my Xastrn case.

I don't know if Xastrn can really be scum without Zen, though Zen could be scum without Xastrn. This relates to the manner in which Zen picked up on Xastrn's crumbs and basically claimed for him later on. There are individual things I have disliked about Zen, and I hate the reads that he has shared (not sure if the one's he is hiding can be much better). There's the threatening to shoot Xastrn and then using that as a basis to do a 180 on his read of Xastrn that connected them for me when I was rereading Xastrn at Night.

#1 so you think that Zen is scum whether Xast is town or scum? But you haven't been pursuing him?

Zen says his read didn't change because of his threatening to shoot, it was because he caught Xast's crumb.

You've said that you thought that their interactions were scum distancing, but why did you even think that in the first place? Surely that's getting ahead of yourself?


I feel like if you do have a scumread on Zen you've been sitting on it all Day, and that's weird.



One more thing. You never did follow up about why Xast would choose to shoot soup and not wait for Raz:

Even if this weapon was so important, they could have let Raz kill soup, and then killed Raz to get the weapon.

Do I buy his crappy explanation? The short answer is yes. Their slot, as far as I can tell, has a completely laughable understanding of what's actually important in the game. For them to completely misread a situation like the end of yesterDay and think it was smart to shoot soup, is completely in line with the rest of their play. This is frankly an incredible act to be getting out of a scum slot, that they would put so much effort into talking about irrelevant bull**** just to try and maintain a pro-town facade.

 

[Kantrip]

#1 so you think that Zen is scum whether Xast is town or scum? But you haven't been pursuing him?

Zen says his read didn't change because of his threatening to shoot, it was because he caught Xast's crumb.

You've said that you thought that their interactions were scum distancing, but why did you even think that in the first place? Surely that's getting ahead of yourself?


I feel like if you do have a scumread on Zen you've been sitting on it all Day, and that's weird.



One more thing. You never did follow up about why Xast would choose to shoot soup and not wait for Raz:

I think Xastrn is a way bigger distraction to the game, and my scumread on him is stronger. If he flips scum, then I'd go after Zen. Zen can be scum without Xastrn, but my individual scumread on Xastrn is stronger and removing him from the game is more beneficial. I hope that makes sense.

I thought it was scum distancing because of my huge scumread on Xastrn, but the fact that I did find it strange how he behaved towards Zen's threats of death. I also didn't like Zen very much, so I don't think it's getting too ahead of myself to conclude that the strange behaviour could be a result of SvS interaction.

I know Zen later said the 180 was from Xastrn's role, but initially he tried to use the reasoning that it was because Xastrn wasn't backing down when being threatened.

My scumread on Zen is a lean that would be solidified on a Xastrn flip. I've been sitting on it all Day because, while I don't like him at all, he's not a priority.

Xastrn had already established a soup scumread. He had not fleshed out a Raz scumread. It wouldn't be so easy as "just shooting Raz", as scum would have to be sure they have a good, non-suspicious reason to shoot Raz. If you mean Night Kill, I don't think Night Kills use the same rules as Day Kills, seeing as how we didn't hear of anyone's weapon breaking at Night. I don't think there's anything saying scum picks up their Night Kill's weapon(s).

 

[Kantrip]

All that said, I am starting to get into my Zen read more recently.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Xastrn had already established a soup scumread. He had not fleshed out a Raz scumread. It wouldn't be so easy as "just shooting Raz", as scum would have to be sure they have a good, non-suspicious reason to shoot Raz. If you mean Night Kill, I don't think Night Kills use the same rules as Day Kills, seeing as how we didn't hear of anyone's weapon breaking at Night. I don't think there's anything saying scum picks up their Night Kill's weapon(s).

I do mean Night Kill. I don't see why night kills and daykills would use different rules. I don't see any reason why scum wouldn't pick up the weapons of people they Night Kill.

But even if Night Kills did use different rules, that suggests that scum probably doesn't need an unbreakable weapon.

 

[Kantrip]

I do mean Night Kill. I don't see why night kills and daykills would use different rules. I don't see any reason why scum wouldn't pick up the weapons of people they Night Kill.

But even if Night Kills did use different rules, that suggests that scum probably doesn't need an unbreakable weapon.

Scum can use their unbreakable weapon in the Day, and they would want to keep it out of town's hands. So yes, they would still need it.

Why do you think we didn't get a message saying someone's weapon broke during the Night phase?

 

[Xivii]

You are welcome, I got you.




I'm waiting. I'll answer this but I at least want a name. Meta for Dabuz:

Walmart Mafia: He was obv town, and I had a town read on him there.
GS3#3: He was traitor. I didn't have a initial scum read but we got 'em later on in the day anyways. He super lurked there.

I think he may have been scum somewhere else but the name escapes me. But to me, his play seems like he is only posting to post. I mean look, he posted some mechanics thing about Xast.

WHEEEE

ಠ_ಠ


But didn't he lurk in Walmart as well? I hardly even remembered that he was in that game. dabuz was scum in Ryker's game wasn't he? His play was the same there as it was in walmart and ever other game. You're other reasoning for dabuz scum was his read on Xast (not having it yesterday, but having it today). Is that all?

 

[Xivii]

I know Zen later said the 180 was from Xastrn's role, but initially he tried to use the reasoning that it was because Xastrn wasn't backing down when being threatened.

Thing is, you're not trying to see this from the town perspective at all. Of course I had to give some reasoning then when Raz asked, clearly I didn't want to have to reveal the role info.

 

[Kantrip]

Thing is, you're not trying to see this from the town perspective at all. Of course I had to give some reasoning then when Raz asked, clearly I didn't want to have to reveal the role info.

Yes I recognize that. I actually did think you had merit to that comment though. It was strange that Xastrn wasn't backing down to your threats.

 

[Xivii]

Yeah...

 

[Xivii]

I think he's just like that. Pride or something. Someone like OS would do it too.

 

[Xivii]

btw Kantrip you haven't given any reasoning for your supposed individual scum read on myself. You say that you think I'm scummy outside of Xastrn, but all the reasoning you've given is from my interaction with Xastrn.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Scum can use their unbreakable weapon in the Day, and they would want to keep it out of town's hands. So yes, they would still need it.

Why do you think we didn't get a message saying someone's weapon broke during the Night phase?

Scum can shoot Raz to stop town having the weapon. And the idea that scum would need an unbreakable weapon for Daykills, when they all start with a weapon is daft.


We didn't get a message because no weapons broke. Maybe that's to do with some sort of ability. Maybe it's a weapon. Regardless, it doesn't suggest that night kills and daykills use different systems.

 

[Kantrip]

btw Kantrip you haven't given any reasoning for your supposed individual scum read on myself. You say that you think I'm scummy outside of Xastrn, but all the reasoning you've given is from my interaction with Xastrn.

I dislike how you separated with soup. I dislike how you said a lot of agreeable stuff about the mechanics of the game in D1 but nothing more than that. I dislike your reads but find it hard to scrutinize the reasoning when you keep so much to yourself. I want you to share more but when asked you always put it off.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

You are welcome, I got you.




I'm waiting. I'll answer this but I at least want a name. Meta for Dabuz:

Walmart Mafia: He was obv town, and I had a town read on him there.
GS3#3: He was traitor. I didn't have a initial scum read but we got 'em later on in the day anyways. He super lurked there.

I think he may have been scum somewhere else but the name escapes me. But to me, his play seems like he is only posting to post. I mean look, he posted some mechanics thing about Xast.

WHEEEE

I've played with the dude in the BBR and other places far more than most DGamers, his meta of lurking is semi legit but he is also a busy guy. So people tend to confuse that with lurking.

I think he is genuinely interested in the game which is a good sign.

If he was posting a lot of fluff and less on following a questionare, then he is more likely scum off meta. He really isn't going into a scum mindset imo, or at least one that is obvious.

 

[Xivii]

I dislike how you separated with soup.
Ryker, Raz two confirmed town also wanted soup dead (as I said before). Why do see me as different?

I dislike your reads but find it hard to scrutinize the reasoning when you keep so much to yourself.
Ryker, Raz two confirmed town also wanted soup dead (as I said before). Why do see me as different?

I dislike how you said a lot of agreeable stuff about the mechanics of the game in D1 but nothing more than that.
Pretty sure I had more content than many peeps. dabuz, sokr, ruy, ryker, pawn. Again you're distinguishing me using attributes that many people have this game.

soup case, soup private chat that I posted, xastrn + Sokr/Pawn dislike early on.

 

[Kantrip]

Zen what I'm most curious about is who you want dead toDay. You have said you'll get to it later but I don't see what you're waiting for.

If I was about to shoot between Xastrn and Kary but let you pick which one, who would you choose?

 

[Xivii]

Kantrip do you think that Sokr's reasoning for not wanting to shoot is reasonable?

 

[Kantrip]

I dislike how you separated with soup.
Ryker, Raz two confirmed town also wanted soup dead (as I said before). Why do see me as different?

I dislike your reads but find it hard to scrutinize the reasoning when you keep so much to yourself.
Ryker, Raz two confirmed town also wanted soup dead (as I said before). Why do see me as different?

I dislike how you said a lot of agreeable stuff about the mechanics of the game in D1 but nothing more than that.
Pretty sure I had more content than many peeps. dabuz, sokr, ruy, ryker, pawn. Again you're distinguishing me using attributes that many people have this game.

soup case, soup private chat that I posted, xastrn + Sokr/Pawn dislike early on.

You were asked to wait on the Separate, and soup couldn't do anything while supporting you. You brought the Day to an abrupt end when we could have had time to wait for the chaos to die down. That is scummy and I don't care what you say about dead players wanting him dead.

 

[Kantrip]

Kantrip do you think that Sokr's reasoning for not wanting to shoot is reasonable?

No, not really, but it's not scummy either

 

[Xivii]

Zen what I'm most curious about is who you want dead toDay. You have said you'll get to it later but I don't see what you're waiting for.

If I was about to shoot between Xastrn and Kary but let you pick which one, who would you choose?

Neither.

Who I want dead has yet to be determined. I'm sorry, but you can wait.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Kary - Not sure, going back and forth on this one. Like the Xastrn posts when Kary pointed out his BS but not the lack of commitment nor how it amounted to a town read.

Red Ryu - Town.

dabuz - leaning town,d1 posts and his continuing posts seem fine to me. I think he has interest in the game.

Potassium - Town, I like his posts and general interest in the game in finding out reads and connections. Something a lot of players are trying to go for.

pawndidater2 Ranmaru - Not sure here, might need some looking into.

Xastrn - Scum, I explained this multiple times.

Colonel Stars Zen - leanign scum, really don't like how he used the roles to call each other masons and the lack of clarity for people to understand him.

Sokr - Null, like Kary hit or miss but more so not sure how to read him over posts that send me mixed signals.

Anomandaris_Rake FullMetalLynch - Death Bear knows he is town.

 

[Dabuz]

Still reading, but since I see RR here:

Attack: Xastrn

RR, did you know your attack couldn't go through when you posted this?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Kantrip do you think that Sokr's reasoning for not wanting to shoot is reasonable?

I need to remember what he said about not wanting to shoot, was it who he preferred to shoot or the someone else taking a shot?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Still reading, but since I see RR here:


RR, did you know your attack couldn't go through when you posted this?

No thought people were reversed in the jointing.

My fault for not really reading the OP right multiple times.

 

[Xivii]

You were asked to wait on the Separate, and soup couldn't do anything while supporting you. You brought the Day to an abrupt end when we could have had time to wait for the chaos to die down. That is scummy and I don't care what you say about dead players wanting him dead.

I was not aware at the time that I was asked to separate. It was an instinctive decision. I told you that I thought soup was trying to get someone to waste a weapon. Do you not believe that I thought that?

The reason why the dead players are important is because it completely disproves your reasoning. You're trying to attribute the soup shenanigans as a scum attribute, when it has been disproved already as so. It should be a complete null tell because you know for a fact that it was of the town mindset.

 

[Dabuz]

RR town. Ryu, what do you think of Potassium? I've noticed in my reread that the majority of his focus this game has been on Xast, and has used most connections just to go back to Xast. I understand tunneling can be town, but it hurts town IMO because a lot of the content ends up being focused on Xast which leads us no where except back to Xast.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I was not aware at the time that I was asked to separate. It was an instinctive decision. I told you that I thought soup was trying to get someone to waste a weapon. Do you not believe that I thought that?

The reason why the dead players are important is because it completely disproves your reasoning. You're trying to attribute the soup shenanigans as a scum attribute, when it has been disproved already as so. It should be a complete null tell because you know for a fact that it was of the town mindset.

Except the problem is instead of letting people try and read into Soup and get an idea of where his anger was coming from you opened the door to letting Xastrn take the shot.

I'm not as bothered by what you did, but Xastrn who 180'd on telling people not to shoot and then doing it.

 

[Kantrip]

Xastrn, when you claimed, did you claim your character?

If not, do so as soon as you see this.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

RR town. Ryu, what do you think of Potassium? I've noticed in my reread that the majority of his focus this game has been on Xast, and has used most connections just to go back to Xast. I understand tunneling can be town, but it hurts town IMO because a lot of the content ends up being focused on Xast which leads us no where except back to Xast.

I'm fine with him.

Later posts show him expanding on where Xast leads in terms of connections and how other players relate to Xast. He has a direction of where to look and how ti relates to everyone as a whole.

In a way he is tunneling, so am I though, but at this point I just don't care to question Xast anymore and just shoot him, finding the person to shoot him is what needs to be done.

 

[Xivii]

@Ruy:

Also, if we decide to seperate, and it will be a joint decision by me and orbo if we do, i think sokr / kary should do the deed.




Any opposed ?

Yes. I am. I am not convinced that xast is scum and I am starting to see his side of things. Mine is a weapon for town. We have a limited number of those so I am not going to waste my one shot on someone unless I am almost certain that they are scum. Yes I realize refusing to do this can be seen as going against towns wishes and therefore scummy. I don't care. If xast is town then I can guarentee that there will be scum trying to push us to kill him. I'm not going to submit to possible scum.


FML, what do you think about Xastrn's claim that his and zen's abilities would be OP in scum's hands.

I found this really odd because Sokr has seemed to me one of the biggest dislikers of Xast. So I feel like him disagreeing to shooting him is uncanny.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I'll be back in a hour or so, running time.

 

[ranmaru]

ಠ_ಠ
But didn't he lurk in Walmart as well? I hardly even remembered that he was in that game. dabuz was scum in Ryker's game wasn't he? His play was the same there as it was in walmart and ever other game. You're other reasoning for dabuz scum was his read on Xast (not having it yesterday, but having it today). Is that all?

I'm saying lurk more than usual. Like I caught up and didn't see his presence FELT as I thought I would seeing from a town dabuz. These next two posts are NOT fluff at all. This is after you asking him about the two names thing in Walmart Mafia.

Eh, I misread it then, what I get for playing mafia when tired >_>;

KBG could have made a legit slip but who knows, just seems like something a much more inexperienced scum player would do and KBG has about 30 games apparently.

Also, what's your read on Ranmaru individually of a KBG-Ranmaru connection?




What KBG said was derp and makes him extremely easy for scum to pile on or town to attack because it was so derp. For scum it's some easy townie points and potentially getting rid of a liability. For town it's just hard to not want to push KBG after what he said because it could be a slip. That's if he's scum. If he's town it's such an easy wagon to push for both scum and town players.

I'm worried about Zen already. It'd be best to explain why a bit later.

Responses which can help me find leads to go on.

So if Ranmaru is one of your scum picks, why aren't you voting him?

Regarding KBG, I don't see how you went from scum pick to leaning town just because you agree with one of Zen's points. Are you that quick to completely throw out your initial logic?

Also, referring to the highlight, you're implying you may go back to voting him so that shows you still have some reason to think he's scum.





Says that by making everyone pick 2 names, Traitor's options in RVS will be limited. I can't see how it limits traitor in RVS but I can see it being a really easy way for traitor to let his scum buddies know he is traitor. Zen would vote one of the two slots he thinks will be inactive if he has to vote, that seems overly safe. I understand not liking them, but it doesn't help town if he would vote the potential inactive before anyone else but doesn't actually do it. (129) I'm not worried about him as much though after reading 144 - 149 because before those posts I felt like he was purposefully avoiding addressing the more active or powerful slots in this game.




Also Soup, i'm gonna sheep your dislike of Orbo since I didn't notice his contradiction in voting KBG until you quoted it.

He continued to read Joey as scum but compared to here, he didn't really push for anyone. He simply egged on FML (early game). Yet notice in this game, his first 'wall' were fluffy questions, not really analysis or assertions. His content is lacking as opposed to his town play in Walmart Mafia.