Arkaether
Smash Ace
Very well then, ignore me, I'm a ******.
-
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Final Destination: Workshop General social thread
- Thread starter zxeon
- Start date
Sukai
Smash Champion
If it's too fast, yeah.
Just like with a small increase in size, a small increase in speed wouldn't break the character, just make the attack more useful, people adapt to stuff like that and it'll be considered as nothing more than a mere advantage in a match, nothing game/character breaking.
I guess, a moves come out a few frames faster, like 1-4 frames faster, it will help and wont be that fast.
Combine that with damage buffs and hitbox increases and you can easily balance out a character with alot of testing.
Combine that with damage buffs and hitbox increases and you can easily balance out a character with alot of testing.
Sukai
Smash Champion
D
Deleted member
Guest
well we can't predict everyrhing by theoretical balancing, then you end up with something as vBrawl with less glitches
thesage
Smash Hero
I think we should balance the cast out before we make adv. techs.
I'll admit I loled pretty hard. Using an ISO?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3OwckBn9OU&feature=related
Edit: forgot link, awesome.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3OwckBn9OU&feature=related
Edit: forgot link, awesome.
cookieM0Nster
Smash Champion
I gotta try out music hacking in the summer. 
looks awesome
looks awesome
Sukai
Smash Champion
It's all too tempting, but I won't bother.
Arkaether
Smash Ace
I want to hack the "nice boat" bgm onto pirate ship.
Sukai
Smash Champion
Nah.
The most suitable word is "Lazy".
Sukai
Smash Champion
My 1,000th post begs to differ.
shadowtroop
Smash Ace
I don't have good dvd's or a hardrive/sd card/flashdrive that holds 8 GB.
Revven
FrankerZ
Why would we need to? She's not broken or OP. =\
Arkaether
Smash Ace
You know who's gayer? Dr. Mario.
Ohsnaps. I just went there. :v
Ohsnaps. I just went there. :v
leafgreen386
Dirty camper
Ok nubs. Time to clear up some stuff about priority.
"Priority" is a combination of five factors:
1) Damage the move deals; if two ground moves deal within 10% of each other, they will clank. Which is why moves that do around 10% clash with frickin everything. This only applies to ground moves, though. If there's an aerial involved, the attacks will either trade hits or only one will go through, using the below rules. It's worth noting that damage priority is the only "true priority" in the game, since it's the only time that hitboxes come into contact with each other and one or both are stopped. Aerials just keep going until they hit something.
2) Range and disjointedness; if your opponent can't reach your hurtbox with their attack, there's no way for them to "win" in the collision. Disjointeness is the primary indicator for priority on aerials, since they don't clash with anything. If the hitboxes of two attacks are overlapping, but only one of those hitboxes is overlapping the opponent's hurtbox, then only that attack will go through. If both hitboxes overlap the opponent's hurtbox on the same frame, you will trade hits. If you're both using ground attacks, even if one is very disjointed, and two hitboxes come into contact with each other, then they will clash. This is the reason why falcon is generally regarded as having trash priority - he has very little actual disjointeness on his attacks that matter (namely, his aerials).
3) Speed of a move; if your attack gets there before your opponent, it's going to win. Period. Jabs are a great example of this. They're very fast, but they do horrid damage and typically don't have all that much disjointedness, so if they were to collide with another attack they would probably either clash or be beaten out, but they're fast enough to sneak in under most attacks. This is the other factor that goes into aerial priority, since if you can get your hitbox in there before they can get their own out, you win by default.
4) Invincibility or super armour; if the character is impervious during their attack, they will be able to plow through whatever the opponent throws their way, as long as the attacks do not clash. This is what gives moves like marth's upB (in brawl) and fox's shine (in brawl or melee) that feeling of "infinite priority." Nothing can hit them out of it, so at worst they'll end up clashing with something or just plain invincible through it, and at best they'll beat it out. Fox's shine definitely does clash in melee, btw, it's just that it's such a fast attack that you rarely see it happen.
5) Transcendent priority; certain moves, such as marth's sideB (or almost everything MK has) will not clash even if they normally meet the requirements for clashing with a foe. Moves with this property are treated like aerials and are governed solely by hitbox/hurtbox interactions.
The only things on this list that we do not have control over are 4 and 5, which are rarely seen to begin with. Well, actually, I think we might have some limited control over transcendent priority, in that we can remove it from moves by changing their hit-type. I haven't tried it, yet, though, to see if it works.
The funny thing is that damage priority, the only true priority in the game is frequently the one that matters the least in an actual match since people use aerials so much, so a lot of times moves in an actual game are simply governed by their hitbox/hurtbox interactions, thus making speed and disjointedness the two most important aspects to a move's priority.
"Priority" is a combination of five factors:
1) Damage the move deals; if two ground moves deal within 10% of each other, they will clank. Which is why moves that do around 10% clash with frickin everything. This only applies to ground moves, though. If there's an aerial involved, the attacks will either trade hits or only one will go through, using the below rules. It's worth noting that damage priority is the only "true priority" in the game, since it's the only time that hitboxes come into contact with each other and one or both are stopped. Aerials just keep going until they hit something.
2) Range and disjointedness; if your opponent can't reach your hurtbox with their attack, there's no way for them to "win" in the collision. Disjointeness is the primary indicator for priority on aerials, since they don't clash with anything. If the hitboxes of two attacks are overlapping, but only one of those hitboxes is overlapping the opponent's hurtbox, then only that attack will go through. If both hitboxes overlap the opponent's hurtbox on the same frame, you will trade hits. If you're both using ground attacks, even if one is very disjointed, and two hitboxes come into contact with each other, then they will clash. This is the reason why falcon is generally regarded as having trash priority - he has very little actual disjointeness on his attacks that matter (namely, his aerials).
3) Speed of a move; if your attack gets there before your opponent, it's going to win. Period. Jabs are a great example of this. They're very fast, but they do horrid damage and typically don't have all that much disjointedness, so if they were to collide with another attack they would probably either clash or be beaten out, but they're fast enough to sneak in under most attacks. This is the other factor that goes into aerial priority, since if you can get your hitbox in there before they can get their own out, you win by default.
4) Invincibility or super armour; if the character is impervious during their attack, they will be able to plow through whatever the opponent throws their way, as long as the attacks do not clash. This is what gives moves like marth's upB (in brawl) and fox's shine (in brawl or melee) that feeling of "infinite priority." Nothing can hit them out of it, so at worst they'll end up clashing with something or just plain invincible through it, and at best they'll beat it out. Fox's shine definitely does clash in melee, btw, it's just that it's such a fast attack that you rarely see it happen.
5) Transcendent priority; certain moves, such as marth's sideB (or almost everything MK has) will not clash even if they normally meet the requirements for clashing with a foe. Moves with this property are treated like aerials and are governed solely by hitbox/hurtbox interactions.
The only things on this list that we do not have control over are 4 and 5, which are rarely seen to begin with. Well, actually, I think we might have some limited control over transcendent priority, in that we can remove it from moves by changing their hit-type. I haven't tried it, yet, though, to see if it works.
The funny thing is that damage priority, the only true priority in the game is frequently the one that matters the least in an actual match since people use aerials so much, so a lot of times moves in an actual game are simply governed by their hitbox/hurtbox interactions, thus making speed and disjointedness the two most important aspects to a move's priority.
shanus
Smash Hero
- Joined
- Nov 17, 2005
- Messages
- 6,055
PM me your current complaints DMG. Who do you often play B+ with as well?
goodoldganon
Smash Champion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnd6P28c7kI&feature=related
Made me lol though it's not really all that good.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDFFKwc6fyA&feature=related
We need this back so much.
Made me lol though it's not really all that good.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDFFKwc6fyA&feature=related
We need this back so much.
Arkaether
Smash Ace
Yes. Yes we do. Can you just imagine taunt cancel > knee > taunt?
Okay. If taunt canceling ever became possible, there has to be some rules.
Rule 1:
Sonic CANNOT taunt cancel.
Rule 2:
Pit CANNOT taunt cancel.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-OJm94pBOg
I would quit Brawl+ if they were allowed to.
Rule 1:
Sonic CANNOT taunt cancel.
Rule 2:
Pit CANNOT taunt cancel.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-OJm94pBOg
I would quit Brawl+ if they were allowed to.
Sukai
Smash Champion
So it's not like we were wrong, we just skipped a few details. Most of which didn't matter, because it can't be changed.
I hear ya....oh wait, no I dont. That video made me lose my hearing lol.
Why can't Pit taunt Cancel though? At least we should be thankful that it wouldnt be his Japanese VA
leafgreen386
Dirty camper
I just wanted to clear everything up in one comprehensive post, which I did. In fact, I should probably save a copy of that post for future reference so I don't ever have to type that all out again.
Sukai
Smash Champion
goodoldganon
Smash Champion
Everytime I play Brawl+ I look like this:
Sukai
Smash Champion
I don't think Sakurai did the programming, he just stood there naked laughing in his pool full of money (American currency) with the words "Licensed by Nintendo" written across it.
This gif surprisingly goes well with http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAlsykuilJUEverytime I play Brawl+ I look like this:
Sukai
Smash Champion
SHAKE IT PAT!
w00t!!
Because nobody wants to hear how the fight is on. Over. And over. And over.I hear ya....oh wait, no I dont. That video made me lose my hearing lol.
Why can't Pit taunt Cancel though? At least we should be thankful that it wouldnt be his Japanese VA
Arkaether
Smash Ace
Everyone wants to show Falcon their moves, though. I think taunt cancelling should be the #2 priority for the WBR.
I agree with this.
Aside from nipple comets, that would be the only true thing Falcon needs. Heck, I bet his guide would have a whole section dedicated to it! It would truly expand his Metagame.
leafgreen386
Dirty camper
Sakurai claims to have personally balanced this game in an interview. Take that as you will.