Final Destination: Workshop General social thread

[GHNeko]

However, you'd have to be EXTREMELY careful not to make the hitboxes so huge that they are as long or as big as Marth's sword swings are. >_>

I'm not confident on increasing any of Falcon's hitboxes in size... unless you wanted to do it for Nair or Bair. But, honestly, I don't know, low priority for him has kinda been his weakness since Melee (and I even think 64).

But Melee Falcon still had more priority than Brawl falcon in my opinion. Uair felt like it had disjointed boxes.

Hey Magus, can you give us hitbox data on falcon?

 

[goodoldganon]

Doc is the second worst character in Smash history and I hope he never comes back! MWHAHA

 

[GHNeko]

Doc is the second worst character in Smash history and I hope he never comes back! MWHAHA

....Pick your favorite spot.

I will bury you there.

​

 

[goodoldganon]

Good thing I know you're black...so you look nothing like that.

 

[Arkaether]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cb0feM6imXE

Edit: Almas would infract me for posting this in the relevant thread, so I have no option but to reply to GoG here:

Ganondorf is even one of those characters that plays WORSE with items on so it's like he was purposefully made to be awful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gEOzGX6OFc

 

[GHNeko]

Yea. Seroiusly GoG. Shut up.

 

[goodoldganon]

I see nothing any decent opponent that plays with items would fall for. Everything is so unbelievable situational it isn't even funny. Besides, you have to be the first one to those items and Ganon is 2nd slowest.

 

[GHNeko]

...The sword lock with ganon is anything BUT situational. Same thing with the spicy curry and the green shell AND the spring.


Wtf are you on.

 

[Arkaether]

Wtf GoG. Do you not understand the ideals and mindset of a true man? Can you not see the beauty of Captain Falcon? Does the awesomeness fail to make an impact on you?!

Edit: GHNeko makes good points. BUT THAT DOESN'T MATTER.

 

[goodoldganon]

...The sword lock with ganon is anything BUT situational. Same thing with the spicy curry and the green shell AND the spring.


Wtf are you on.

Can't the green shell and spring be done with anyone? Either way, still meh...

Everyone does that with spicy curry, just gotta set it up.

Cool on the sword lock I guess.

EDIT: I never said the video wasn't cool and hilarious. Just that the tricks are just for lulz and some situational ****. I favorited the video still, since it's awesome.

 

[Arkaether]

Situational and lulz tricks are still **** epic.

 

[GHNeko]

No one ever said anything about you not liking the video. but there are plenty of things that ganon can do in the video better than other characters or just only he can do.

The spicy curry thing, anyone can do, but can anyone set it up easier than ganon? No. Also, I dont think the green shell thing can be done with everyone, IIRC, Falco and Ganon. there are others, but I doubt the whole roster can do it.

 

[goodoldganon]

Guess I haven't played with items in a while to see any of this as making him suddenly even decent in Brawl. That being said, I do retract my statement that he is worse overall with items on. He still sucks hard in vBrawl in all facets of the game.

 

[GHNeko]

Agreed.


So, how about that new official release?

 

[goodoldganon]

Almas is cracking down. Can't say I don't like it, but I feel like you guys are all too afraid to post. Makes me lol

Is the chain jacket glitch still in B+? I'm watching T1 atm and can't test. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzpP4h-ngV8&NR=1

 

[GHNeko]

Yes. Chain jacket is still in B+. Meaning, despite how situational it is, the potential NOW is way past worth mastering.

And yes, I am afraid to post in that thread. I got an infraction AND a warning. :V

Almas doesn't like me. ;___;

Spoiler

jkjk

 

[Arkaether]

Almas seems to be getting very strict lately. It's horrible. ;_;

 

[GHNeko]

We should complain to JV and send hurtful emails to almas.

Maybe Sakurai's semen in a jar on his pillow would make him understand we mean business.

 

[Arkaether]

...
Oh my god.
That's going way overboard. I was going to suggest a bucket of dead rats, but jesus.

That's just cruel.

 

[GHNeko]

He deserves it.

SWF Hitler imo.

 

[Arkaether]

ALMAS! SIEG HEIL! JAWOHL, MEIN FUHRER!

I WAS JUST KIDDING please don't ban me ;_;

 

[goodoldganon]

Not funny...

Almas is a good mod and has finally decided to crackdown. Tons of bads (not saying you two) think they know what is good for Brawl+ or their character because they lost and instead of learning how to play people would rather hack their way around it because we can.

Fact is we are getting close to our first gold copy and people need to realize that very soon here unless there is indisputable proof something needs changed we aren't going to hack things anymore. We need a metagame and Almas is helping us get one by preventing bads from making stupid posts that do nothing but hurt Brawl+ and our image.

In short: Almas got strict out of no where but it's a good thing.

 

[Sukai]

Larger hitboxes on certain moves. These moves, in my head, will give him more aerial priority, and less trade offs will happen, as well as falcon might win more battles in terms of who's hitbox reaches the other's hurtbox first. :V

Sounds pretty plausible.
I think priority is just relative. Perhaps an uncontrollable instance that comes with the character and hitbox design.
It could possibly be the distance between the hitbox and the character's hurtbox. Or rather size comparison. If it's distance based, then your theory just might work.
But that would mean that projectiles have their own properties of priority.
If it's based on size, like "X" attack's hitbox covers "X"'s hurt box like this. Then your theory again could work, but in a different fashion, generally saying the bigger hitbox has more priority, the better it covers the hurt box, the more likely it will trade off with or eat through attacks.
The Mach Tornado would make a lot of sense if this was true.
Projectiles would count here to, as the bigger projectile hitbox would have more priority, even when clashing with melee attacks.

Spoiler

Brainstorming

 

[Arkaether]

Not funny...

Almas is a good mod and has finally decided to crackdown. Tons of bads (not saying you two) think they know what is good for Brawl+ or their character because they lost and instead of learning how to play people would rather hack their way around it because we can.

Fact is we are getting close to our first gold copy and people need to realize that very soon here unless there is indisputable proof something needs changed we aren't going to hack things anymore. We need a metagame and Almas is helping us get one by preventing bads from making stupid posts that do nothing but hurt Brawl+ and our image.

In short: Almas got strict out of no where but it's a good thing.

...we were kidding.

 

[GHNeko]

Not funny...

Almas is a good mod and has finally decided to crackdown. Tons of bads (not saying you two) think they know what is good for Brawl+ or their character because they lost and instead of learning how to play people would rather hack their way around it because we can.

Fact is we are getting close to our first gold copy and people need to realize that very soon here unless there is indisputable proof something needs changed we aren't going to hack things anymore. We need a metagame and Almas is helping us get one by preventing bads from making stupid posts that do nothing but hurt Brawl+ and our image.

In short: Almas got strict out of no where but it's a good thing.

I know. I'm just poking fun of the sudden strictness thats all. Almas is a 2gud mod. Top Tier imo.

Sounds pretty plausible.
I think priority is just relative. Perhaps an uncontrollable instance that comes with the character and hitbox design.
It could possibly be the distance between the hitbox and the character's hurtbox. Or rather size comparison. If it's distance based, then your theory just might work.
But that would mean that projectiles have their own properties of priority.
If it's based on size, like "X" attack's hitbox covers "X"'s hurt box like this. Then your theory again could work, but in a different fashion, generally saying the bigger hitbox has more priority, the better it covers the hurt box, the more likely it will trade off with or eat through attacks.
The Mach Tornado would make a lot of sense if this was true.
Projectiles would count here to, as the bigger projectile hitbox would have more priority, even when clashing with Melee attacks.

Spoiler

Brainstorming

priority lies in a few factors. Right now, we have control over 2 forms of priority, hitbox and percents. Percent priority only works on the ground. Hitbox priority works all the time, but is more noticable in aerial combat.

Increasing percent on moves causes less clashes on ground (ie bowser with percent buffs will be less contested on the ground.

But by increasing hitboxes by a miniscule amount, you allow characters more power in aerial and on ground. Moves because slightly more save to use, they reach farther, and aiming them becomes easier. It also gives a character a better chance of winning in the air. That's why you dont see character's like Marth trade hits in air.

 

[Arkaether]

So G&W has a lot of priority.
Jigglypuff does not.

Jigglypuff is supposed to be THE aerial character.

What's up with that?

 

[GHNeko]

Because she is still an aerial goddess. Bair and fair have alot of priority. :V

Because you know...they're disjointed.

 

[Arkaether]

Not enough to beat G&W. And if she's an aerial goddess, then what does that make G&W? Sakurai's incarnation in Brawl?

 

[goodoldganon]

IRC down for anyone else?

 

[Sukai]

priority lies in a few factors. Right now, we have control over 2 forms of priority, hitbox and percents. Percent priority only works on the ground. Hitbox priority works all the time, but is more noticable in aerial combat.

Increasing percent on moves causes less clashes on ground (ie bowser with percent buffs will be less contested on the ground.

But by increasing hitboxes by a miniscule amount, you allow characters more power in aerial and on ground. Moves because slightly more save to use, they reach farther, and aiming them becomes easier. It also gives a character a better chance of winning in the air. That's why you dont see character's like Marth trade hits in air.

Because he has more range, which is hitbox priority.
I see, and damage output is percent priority?
Then what about speed? I'm not sure of whether or not this directly effects priority, but the attack that hits faster won't have to trade off, like Melee Fox's shine.
Speed could be something to consider when talking about priority, perhaps instead of buffing the hitbox, you can decrease the frame where the hitbox appears.
Alternatives.

 

[GHNeko]

Not enough to beat G&W. And if she's an aerial goddess, then what does that make G&W? Sakurai's incarnation in Brawl?

Jiggs is better in air than GaW, he just has more prority. Once jiggs gets in, GaW is ****ed.

IRC down for anyone else?

No. Lrn2IRCclient.

Because he has more range, which is hitbox priority.
I see, and damage output is percent priority?
Then what about speed? I'm not sure of whether or not this directly effects priority, but the attack that hits faster won't have to trade off, like Melee Fox's shine.
Speed could be something to consider when talking about priority, perhaps instead of buffing the hitbox, you can decrease the frame where the hitbox appears.
Alternatives.

Damage output is a faux form of priority really. :V

Fox's Shine in melee couldnt clank anyways. It had transcendent priority IIRC. I could be wrong.

Also the issue with speeding up moves is that they dont fit certain characters, like Ike and Bowser and ganon. They dont have alot of speedy attacks. Making attacks come out faster wouldnt really effect priority as well. it could just switch what kind of attacks it can clank with.

 

[Arkaether]

G&W can just sit back and spam bair/nair/priority all day.

GoG: IRC's not down, mibbit's down. Use a real IRC client.

 

[goodoldganon]

Sorry I'm not as pro as you guys.

 

[Arkaether]

GHNeko's not pro, he can't even admin his own channel without outside help.

 

[GHNeko]

G&W can just sit back and spam bair/nair/priority all day.

GoG: IRC's not down, mibbit's down. Use a real IRC client.

He's still worse than GaW in terms of aerial ability. Only reason why he looks good in air is cuz his attacks in air have alot of priority.

Sorry I'm not as pro as you guys.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...SbOvhOhXeNIBdowXA&sig2=Qbc3hstwFnYeHV9CkNsQ2Q

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...PygBP2Vu3KZIa3_BA&sig2=l8ZKW7zsZ4rQAA0Mhkn-tA

 

[Arkaether]

Like I said. If jiggs is so bad in the air, and she's an "aerial goddess", what does that make G&W?

 

[Sukai]

Damage output is a faux form of priority really. :V

Fox's Shine in melee couldnt clank anyways. It had transcendent priority IIRC. I could be wrong.

Also the issue with speeding up moves is that they dont fit certain characters, like Ike and Bowser and ganon. They dont have alot of speedy attacks. Making attacks come out faster wouldnt really effect priority as well. it could just switch what kind of attacks it can clank with.

Melee Fox's shine hit on frame 1.
If guffaws at priority, and it doesn't clash because no other character has an attack that hit on frame 1, except Falco, and the hitboxes are so small, I've never seen them clash.

I think speed would fix priority issues to an extent, because faster attacks won't clash or be eaten through. Yes it slims the number of attacks that can chew through it, but isn't that a benefit? Yeah, slower characters wouldn't need speed ups--and Ganon only moves slow, save for his specials, most of his attacks come out fast--but buffing the hitbox wouldn't particularly help much if it's still out-spaced.
I'm just saying sometimes, making the attack faster would provide better results than buffing the hitbox.

 

[Arkaether]

knux, I'm pretty sure that Fox's shine can't clash. Iirc, it had a priority on a class of it's own, above everything else.

 

[GHNeko]

Melee Fox's shine hit on frame 1.
If guffaws at priority, and it doesn't clash because no other character has an attack that hit on frame 1, except Falco, and the hitboxes are so small, I've never seen them clash.

I think speed would fix priority issues to an extent, because faster attacks won't clash or be eaten through. Yes it slims the number of attacks that can chew through it, but isn't that a benefit? Yeah, slower characters wouldn't need speed ups--and Ganon only moves slow, save for his specials, most of his attacks come out fast--but buffing the hitbox wouldn't particularly help much if it's still out-spaced.
I'm just saying sometimes, making the attack faster would provide better results than buffing the hitbox.

But then it breaks character, which is the issue.

 

[~tgm_Zeej]

I clank shines with a friend of mine with astounding frequency.

It has no transcendent priority, it was just stupid fast.