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FAE's Lucas Advanced Techniques Guide

FightAdamantEevee

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 14, 2009
Messages
1,059
Location
St. Louis, Missouri
I finally had some time to put this together. Any help with this would be appreciated.

Terminology:
N-Air - A attack in the air
U-Air – Up A attack in air
D-Air – Down A attack in air
F-Air – Forward A attack in air
B-Air – Back A attack in air
Z-Air -- Grab button in the air
PK Thunder 2 – When Lucas hits himself with PK Thunder
B-Stick – Setting C-Stick to Specials
U-Smash – Up smash attack
D-Smash – Down smash attack
F-Smash – Forward smash attack
U-Tilt – Up tilt attack
F-Tilt – Forward tilt attack
D-Tilt – Down tilt attack


Zap Jump
Description:
Lucas shoots high in the sky with PK Fire
Input: Up on control stick (or jump button) > double jump +PK Fire


Zap Throw
Description:
Lucas shoots high in the sky with an item
Input: Up on control stick (or jump button) > double jump + A, or C-Stick



Magnet Pull
Description:
Lucas’s PSI Magnet gains a horizontal boost in the air (the more momentum Lucas has, the bigger boost PSI Magnet gets)
Input: PK Fire > PSI Magnet

Four Different Outcomes of Magnet Pull
Description: Kinda hard to explain without me messing something up, so the gifs and controls would probably be more help.
Input: (With B-Stick) Gif 1: Jump > B-Stick Fire to the left/right (opposite way you’re going) > PSI Magnet.
Gif 2: Jump > B-Stick PK Fire to the left/right (opposite way you’re going) > PSI Magnet with the Control Stick in the Down-Left or Down-Right position (same way the PK Fire pushed you)
Gif 3: Jump > B-Stick PK Fire to the left/right (opposite way you’re going) > PSI Magnet with the Control Stick in the Down-Left or Down-Right position (same way you’re going) > quickly slide the Control Stick along the bottom to the Down-Left or Down-Right position (opposite direction the PSI Magnet started)
Gif 4: Jump > B-Stick PK Fire to the left/right (opposite way you’re going) > PSI Magnet with the Control Stick in the Down-Left or Down-Right position (opposite way you’re going) > quickly slide the Control Stick along the bottom to the Down-Left or Down-Right position (opposite direction the PSI Magnet started)



Magnet Pull Double Jump Renewal
Description:
If Lucas slides from the ground to off of the ledge with Magnet Pull when he has no jumps left, he’ll regain his double jump.
Input: Magnet Pull close to the ground where Lucas will slide off the ledge



Thundersliding
Description:
Lucas slides off of the ledge with PK Thunder, similar to Mario’s sliding Cape and DK’s sliding Headbutt
Input: Run off the edge of a platform > PK Thunder


PK Thunder 2 Cancelling (With Thunderslide)
Description:
Lucas cancels his Thunderslide on a lower platform (easiest to learn on Battlefield)
Input: Thunderslide off of a higher platform onto the edge of a lower platform


PK Thunder 2 Cancelling (Without Thunderslide)
Description:
Lucas cancels his PK Thunder 2 on the edge of a platform.
Input: Jump to a point where you can PK Thunder for a bit without falling much > aim the PK Thunder up then guide it downwards towards the back of Lucas's head or the front of Lucas's head (make it hit him in the direction of the edge.


PK Thunder 2 on Final Destination’s Lips
Description:
Lucas’s PK Thunder 2 slides up Final Destinations lips. The trajectory of the PK Thunder 2 is different for both sides. The left side is easier to do than the right side.


Tailwhipping
Description:
Lucas swirls his PK Thunder around an opponent’s shield so the head of the PK Thunder doesn’t get cancelled and the opponent might take damage


Aerial PK Thunder Loop
Description:
Lucas’s PK Thunder loops around him in the air, then shoots him downward
Input: PK Thunder in a reasonable height in the air > move your Control Stick in a circle around Lucas > Make the PK Thunder hit him in the back of his head


PK Thunder Ledge Regrab
Description:
Lucas uses PK Thunder while on the ledge and aims it at the stage or opponent, then regrabs the ledge before he falls in helpless
Input: Tap left or right on the Control Stick (whichever is away from the stage) > PK Thunder > Move your Control Stick in a quarter circle towards the stage


Single Loop PK Thunder 2
Description:
Lucas loops his PK Thunder one time before he hits himself
Input: PK Thunder Movement (if going to the right): ^ < v > ^ < v >>>, PK Thunder Movement (if going to the left): ^ > v < ^ > v <<<


Down Tilt Tripping
Description:
Lucas’s D-Tilt has the highest trip rate at the tip of his shoe.


Grab Release > D-Tilt Trip > U-Smash
Description:
Some characters when ground released out of Lucas’s grab are at the right distance to be D-Tilt tripped (not a true followup out of a grab release, but it usually works if it the D-tilt hits), and can be followed up with a U-Smash
Input: Grab > Pummel > D-Tilt > U-Smash


Down Tilt Lock
Description:
Like a Jab Lock, when an opponent fails to tech the ground, Lucas locks his opponent with D-Tilt across the stage and forces them to get up
Input: D-Tilt, walk forward slightly, D-Tilt, walk forward slightly, etc.


Attacked Shield on Platform > D-Tilt Lock
Description:
When Lucas attacks someone shielding on the edge of a platform, he can follow up with a D-Tilt lock if they don’t do anything before they hit the ground.


Ledge-hopped PSI Magnet
Description:
Lucas’s vertical momentum after a ledgehop is cancelled by PSI Magnet
Input: Ledgehop > PSI Magnet


Magnet Stalling
Description:
Lucas’s downward momentum is halted briefly by PSI Magnet.
Input: PSI Magnet while falling


Wavebounced PSI Magnet
Description:
Lucas’s PSI Magnet gains a slight backwards push in the air
Input: Jump to the right > B-Stick a PSI Magnet in the Down-Left position. OR Jump to the left > B-Stick a PSI Magnet in the Down-Right position.


Magnet Cancelling
Description:
Lucas’s PSI Magnet cancels all ending lag after absorbing a projectile.
Input: PSI Magnet > (after absorbing projectile) Left (Roll), Right (Roll), Up (Jump), or Down (Spotdodge)


Dustersliding
Description:
Lucas goes from the ledge to the stage laglessly with Z-Air (easiest to do when all 3 Z-Airs have been used)
Input: (On ledge) Left on control stick to drop from ledge > Double Jump and DI towards the stage > Z-Air when passing the stage


Slopedashing
Description:
On certain stages, Lucas can gain a slide from a slope into any sliding attack. Stages it can be done on are: Rainbow Cruise (right side of ship), Pictochat (waves), Pokemon Stadium 1 (Fire transformation between the tree and house), Corneria (The right side of the top where it bends), Yoshi’s Island [(Melee) The top of the left pipe]
Input: Tap Jump - Move the Control Stick in a quarter circle starting from the top of the Control Stick towards the slope


Rising B-Air/N-Air/F-Air to Fastfall F-Air/U-Air
Description:
When Lucas does a rising B-Air, N-Air, or F-Air in a full hop, he can fastfall a F-Air or U-Air on the way down.
Input: Jump + B-Air/N-Air/F-Air > F-Air or U-Air when you’re falling


Hitlag Extension
Description:
When Lucas’s attacks come in contact with a stage object such as Castle Siege’s statues or the lumpy things on Brinstar, the attack will last longer. This is most helpful with U-Smash and D-Smash.


F-Smash Reflection
Description:
Lucas's F-Smash reflects all projectiles (Diddy's Bananas, Snake's Grenades, etc). If the projectile is stationary, it won't move after being F-Smashed. Instead it'll not damage Lucas but damage the other person if they run into it (Ness's PK Fire Pillar).


Down Throw to Utilt/Nair/Uair
Description:
At low %’s depending on the opponent character, Lucas can follow up D-Throw with U-Tilt, N-Air, or U-Air
Input: D-Throw > U-Tilt/U-Air/N-Air (immediately double jumping before N-Airing or U-Airing works better than just Full hopping)
 

rPSIvysaur

[ɑɹsaɪ]
Joined
Jun 7, 2009
Messages
16,415
I like all the .gifs :)

Elongated Attacks should be renamed to Stage Hurtbox Hitlag or just Hitlag Extension
 

Tokaio

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 24, 2009
Messages
251
Location
Edmonton, AB
Wow...good job FAE!
Just one question: for the Magnet Pull Double Jump Renewal, do you actually have to touch the ground (like a ledge cancel) for the jump renewal?
 

Cracker1204

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 24, 2008
Messages
108
zair cancel

yo lucas mains, i don't know if you guys know this but I'm telling you anyway

If you airdodge and zair (preferably with a double jump, single jump is'nt usefull) you will cancel your upward momentum. you can use this to get from the edge lagless, to get to the top platform on battlefield the fastest way ( big jump, double jump, airdodge, zair ).
you could run from the stage on let's say battlefield, double jump back and zair cancel back on the stage or a platform with no lag for mindgames or something.

If you do zair immediatly after the airdodge or too late it won't cancel momentum, but there's a pretty wide time frame.

If you do this technique correctly to get on a platform it should look like a platform cancel only a bit slower, if you're too slow you will see the snake in full zair animation, if you do it perfectly you will see only the first few frames of zair before you land.

I think this i known already but I'm not a lucas player and I didn't see it in your AT guide so :p
 

FightAdamantEevee

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 14, 2009
Messages
1,059
Location
St. Louis, Missouri
Wow...good job FAE!
Just one question: for the Magnet Pull Double Jump Renewal, do you actually have to touch the ground (like a ledge cancel) for the jump renewal?
Yeah, you have to touch the ground and slide off to get the double jump back.

T-block said:
Nice guide.

You should put the GIFs in collapse tags imo.
What are collapse tags?
 

rPSIvysaur

[ɑɹsaɪ]
Joined
Jun 7, 2009
Messages
16,415
Collapse tags are
[collapse="These are collapse tags"]The code is [.collapse="Title"]Info[./collapse][/collapse]

Edit: I did it for you, it was slowing down my CPU too much.
 

Randum

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 9, 2010
Messages
23
Location
SoCal
Holy crap this is amazing.

Great job FAE, the gif files were creative <3


EDIT: Hang on you forgot something!


ZJUA (smirk)
 

Crimson Child

Smash Cadet
Joined
Feb 14, 2009
Messages
39
Location
Norway
NNID
crimchild
Really nice. You should add the grab release on MK on SV's moving platform and grab release usmash. Grab release usmash works best on Ness/Lucas, since they anticipate a regrab and will dodge (if they don't, regrab a few times to make them aware of it), which makes the usmash a guaranteed hit. It's also relatively safe by the ledge, since it will push them offstage if they just shield.
I've found that it works surprisingly often on other characters too.
 

~Nasty~

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 11, 2008
Messages
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Location
Dtilt locking u across the stage
This is great if you B-stick. I'd translate all these controls into the C-bouncing method if i had enough time, lolz... but unfortunately i've been super busy.

Good stuff in here FAE.
 

MeLL0W

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jan 23, 2009
Messages
78
Location
Tampa, FL
Woot! Nice guide FAE. :D

who are the best ppl to dtilt after grab release?
The characters that can be tripped by GR > Dtilt are
Mario
Link
Samus
Kirby
Fox
Marth
Mr. Game & Watch
Sheik
Falco
Charizard
Snake
Peach
Ganon
Wolf
Dedede**
Bowser
Toon Link
Olimar
Since the Tip does not always garuntee a trip there isn't really anyone who it can be used reliably against dissapointingly but its possible to be used on all the above characters.

** Also Dedede comes to special attention as his Release slides him both just out of range AND just right within range as sometimes the Dtilt wont connect but sometimes it does. :p I have no idea why that is really. :/

Some characters like
Ivysaur
Lucario
Wario
ROB
Jigglypuff
Dtilt will always connect after the Release but will never trip due to their slide being to close to be hit by the tip.

Any characters that were not mentioned slide to far away to be hit with Dtilt but Idk if and doubt that DI would have a role in affecting it much.
 

rPSIvysaur

[ɑɹsaɪ]
Joined
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Messages
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DI has a huge role in affecting it. It's why I never made a list for it.
Also, the D-tilt is not guaranteed and will be powershielded on most occasions.
 

MeLL0W

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jan 23, 2009
Messages
78
Location
Tampa, FL
In general its not a reliable move to use anyway but the above characters are more easier to perform it on then all the others. Kinda like it will never work on Luigi or Meta Knight even with any kind of DI.
 

Randum

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 9, 2010
Messages
23
Location
SoCal
This thread still needs more replies.

Also, I figured out how to wavebounce, magnet pull, reverse magnet pull (facing both ways) etc, without any alterations to the controls. It's basically just massive buffering. Salem taught me lol.
 

AMKalmar

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
887
Location
Hamilton ON CA
All the gifs are broked for me.

If you ledgehop > tether (or dusterslide as you call it) you can get a uair or fair out before you land.

There are 4 different zap jumps (8 if you count bounced zap jumps separately), you only mention one. They are:
- DJ fwd > PKF fwd, this results in the highest jump, horizontal momentum is stopped. Bounce this to get a full zap height zap jump and face the other way.
- DJ rev > PKF rev, this results in a lower jump and you face the other direction, horizontal momentum is stopped. Bounce for a low zap jump facing the same direction as you initial were.
- DJ fwd > PKF rev, reverse zap jump + momentum.
- DJ rev > PKF fwd, forward zap jump + reverse momentum.
I don't remember how high those last two jumps are, it's been a long while since I've played. The first two can be used to snipe people when they're recovering from above, the second two are good for recovering.

This thread should also go over the different control schemes for bouncing. Most obvious is b-stick, then there's setting a L/R/Z to special and pressing special on the same frame that you smash the c-stick (takes some practice), or you can just press fwd > rev + B > fwd. I prefer the last one, you just have to be fast for the bounces and I find it best for zap jumping.
 

xzx

Smash Lord
Joined
May 1, 2009
Messages
1,139
Location
Sweden
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHV8-3anSGw

Is this already known? I found it when I played Subspace and by mistake pressed the A-button and the jump-button at the same time (while holding the Trophy Stand) and flew upwards (like the Zap Jump).

Well? Discuss!

EDIT: Aww, I saw this was already in the description, which means I haven't founded this AT! =/ At least you guys got a video from me! n_n
 

Randum

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 9, 2010
Messages
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Location
SoCal
I'm pretty sure that wavebouncing with no special control setup requires buffering. If you think about it, you can wavebounce PK fire by RAR'ing to a b-reversed PK Fire. It gives the same effect as a wavebounce. When you wavebounce without RARing, you buffer a reverse pk fire, but then B-reverse it. It ends up with a wavebounce. I'm pretty sure you need to buffer the turn around pk fire. Correct me if I'm wrong.
 

rPSIvysaur

[ɑɹsaɪ]
Joined
Jun 7, 2009
Messages
16,415
That isn't buffering though. Buffering is inputting an action in the last frames ten frames of something else. In order to B-Reverse, you have to input the opposite direction AFTER you input the special, which means it CANNOT be buffered.
 

Randum

Smash Rookie
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Exactly. You input a normal reverse of the pk fire and then buffer the b reversed PK fire.
 

Kole

Smash Lord
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Feb 6, 2010
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UCLA
is it just me or is there no wavebounced PKF on the front page?
 

Randum

Smash Rookie
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I've always mained Lucas but stayed on AiB. I like this new layout so I decided to come here more often.
 

DatBass

Smash Cadet
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Mar 28, 2011
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Breakin' yo t.v.
Agreed with Kole. It's nice to have everything in one convenient location for reference when you're practicing. You have an opinion from a beginning Lucas main now xD
 

KoozyK

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 31, 2010
Messages
715
Location
ECU or Greensboro NC,
Agreed with Kole. It's nice to have everything in one convenient location for reference when you're practicing. You have an opinion from a beginning Lucas main now xD
Trust in your main, and dont give up on playing lucas.
most people quit becuase they realize lucas gets ***** alot. but if you mind game and read youre opponent u can win anything
 

Randum

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 9, 2010
Messages
23
Location
SoCal
I don't think you can win soley on mindgames.

The only reason Lucas can win is because of one reason.

People don't know the MU.

Lucas is not a good character, and not a bad one. But very few people ever play Lucas and don't know what to do against him. This is what we have up our sleeves.

Imo, at least.
 
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