Evo's Ruleset Announcement (UPDATED RULES)

[BigRick]

I know, but it'd be nice to get recognition from somebody. Like nobody else likes this community, not other competitive players, some uniformed casual players, even the game designers. It'd be nice to be accepted elsewhere y'know? I know this is already a big community, but it'd be nice if we got the recognition that other fighters (which are more "respectable") get. Also I plan on attending the next major tournament that is in or more east than Indiana. I actually was planning to go to Evo cause my mom wanted to take me to Las Vegas for my birthday (Sept. 1) so I actually could convince her to spend the money to send me. I don't want to go if these rules are in place lol.

sry buddy but were in North America... you wont get recognized for playing a fighting game

not tryin to be mean but if you wanna be recognized go play sum football or sumtin

It sucks, because I love the other fighting games they host, but now that I see that they're total gigantic douchebags, I don't even want to go for those.

come on its not the whole community... theres douches everywhere you know? I donno but the SF2 OGs are simply awesome... its incredible the amount of tricks that they give away on the boards (much more than our own top players) if youre a fan of other games you should really go, but you dont have to bother with smash (or you could still enter cause you will have increased chances of winning kekeke)

 

[Meteor!]

It's been everyone I've ever talked to on there.

 

[ROFL]

if you dont have time to run a tournament with proper rules, i dont think you should run it at all.

i think thats what evo was thinking about when they made these rules. items for faster and cheaper kills, probly a smaller custom stage, less stock and redic time limits.

i say we help them make the tournament go fast and NOT GO.

if we support this tournament they will not change the rules.

the worst thing that happens if we dont go, is they dont hold another one. who cares? are you really gonna go to a place with this ****ty of rules every year anyway? the best thing that happens is they listen to the players or maybe reach a compromise somewhere in between so that we can save time but keep things competitive.

 

[thesage]

Well I don't think this forum hates Ultimate MK. I haven't heard anybody flaming it. I haven't heard of it because I'm bad at fighters in general. Don't ask me why I'm worth anything in smash. I do however respect what the Mortal Kombat people have done with their game (as well as anyone who takes a videogame to the next level). What SRK is doing is just plain outright hate.

Edit: Lol I'm not asking to be a football star popularity. Just saying there shouldn't be so much hate lol.

 

[BigRick]

It's been everyone I've ever talked to on there.

but well did you actually visit the boards or did you just rushed the evo brawl ruleset thread with a flamethrower

the way I see it SRK is doing what SWF should've done... trying to break the game down

they do this all the time because they always want to improve

just look at SF2, seriously

- they tried HSF2 but ended up with a game that was considered too imbalanced
- then they tried a new ST port (supervised by Sirlin) but the japanese complained about input delay and refused to play after the tourney
- this year theyre trying to run it on ST HD remix but the game isnt even released yet!?!?!?

lol its kinda annoying but thats just the way they are

 

[Meteor!]

if you dont have time to run a tournament with proper rules, i dont think you should run it at all.

i think thats what evo was thinking about when they made these rules. items for faster and cheaper kills, probly a smaller custom stage, less stock and redic time limits.

i say we help them make the tournament go fast and NOT GO.

if we support this tournament they will not change the rules.

the worst thing that happens if we dont go, is they dont hold another one. who cares? are you really gonna go to a place with this ****ty of rules every year anyway? the best thing that happens is they listen to the players or maybe reach a compromise somewhere in between so that we can save time but keep things competitive.

At least a dozen reputable Smashers, including PC Chris, have gone into that thread and posted about the rules with complete explanations as to why they should be changed. They were completely and utterly ignored. SRK has no intention of changing anything.

Well I don't think this forum hates Ultimate MK. I haven't heard anybody flaming it. I haven't heard of it because I'm bad at fighters in general. Don't ask me why I'm worth anything in smash. I do however respect what the Mortal Kombat people have done with their game (as well as anyone who takes a videogame to the next level). What SRK is doing is just plain outright hate.

Edit: Lol I'm not asking to be a football star popularity. Just saying there shouldn't be so much hate lol.

Nobody outright hates on it, but if you ask, most people on this board will lol @ MK and vice versa.

 

[Meteor!]

but well did you actually visit the boards or did you just rushed the evo brawl ruleset thread with a flamethrower

the way I see it SRK is doing what SWF should've done... trying to break the game down

they do this all the time because they always want to improve

just look at SF2, seriously

- they tried HSF2 but ended up with a game that was considered too imbalanced
- then they tried a new ST port (supervised by Sirlin) but the japanese complained about input delay and refused to play after the tourney
- this year theyre trying to run it on ST HD remix but the game isnt even released yet!?!?!?

My account was about 8 months old. I went there to try and talk about other fighters I liked, but the community is just cold and unwelcoming to anything new. They don't give a crap about games that aren't on Evo, and talking about them gets you flamed.

 

[BigRick]

At least a dozen reputable Smashers, including PC Chris, have gone into that thread and posted about the rules with complete explanations as to why they should be changed. They were completely and utterly ignored. SRK has no intention of changing anything.

Seriously this thread should be made public because I bet that even I wouldn't have been convinced by the arguments that the Back Room had to give.

EDIT: Then Im sorry that you had a bad experience... that wasn't the case for me.

 

[Meteor!]

Seriously this thread should be made public because I bet that even I wouldn't have been convinced by the arguments that the Back Room had to give.

EDIT: Then Im sorry that you had a bad experience... that wasn't the case for me.

http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=155899&page=1

Have at it.

 

[BigRick]

http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=155899&page=1

Have at it.

lol I actually have a few posts in the thread already.

Seriously Im not against what they're doing because I do not think that items break the game. They simply don't to my eyes. The reason why I play no items is simply because I find it more fun, that's all.

Trying to run a large scale items tourney is a great idea, because if theres really something wrong with them then we will find it!

To me this whole thing is just an experiment.

 

[Meteor!]

lol I actually have a few posts in the thread already.

Seriously Im not against what they're doing because I do not think that items break the game. They simply don't to my eyes. The reason why I play no items is simply because I find it more fun, that's all.

Trying to run a large scale items tourney is a great idea, because if theres really something wrong with them then we will find it!

To me this whole thing is just an experiment.

Oh, I must have been too busy getting banned to notice you. But seriously, here's your item proof: http://youtube.com/watch?v=44i-EM2thqo

 

[BigRick]

Oh, I must have been too busy getting banned to notice you. But seriously, here's your item proof: http://youtube.com/watch?v=44i-EM2thqo

I'm a little disappointed that you didn't manage to come with something better. I will overlook the fact that it's not even Brawl.

I know the Marth is Kizzu... but lol he did not use the mine correctly.

He is fighting Sheik on FD and hes throwing the mine on his own side instead of the Sheik's. Space control anyone?

At the 8 sec mark Kizzu was trapped between the mine and a needle. Just by seeing this it proves that the mine was badly positioned and for that period it was used against him.

If Kizzu's objective was to throw Sheik on the mine than he was delusional. The Sheik look quite skilled and he would've been able to camp the Marth out.

And camping him out was easier for him, because Kizzu put a dangerous remote mine right next to himself!!! reducing his own vital space!

I'm sorry but this was a bad example IMO it is true Kizzu got thrown randomly into the mine but it was the bad mine usage that led to this... Items are dbl-edged swds thats the first thing to remember.

 

[thesage]

I'm a little disappointed that you didn't manage to come with something better. I will overlook the fact that it's not even Brawl.

I know the Marth is Kizzu... but lol he did not use the mine correctly.

He is fighting Sheik on FD and hes throwing the mine on his own side instead of the Sheik's. Space control anyone?

At the 8 sec mark Kizzu was trapped between the mine and a needle. Just by seeing this it proves that the mine was badly positioned and for that period it was used against him.

If Kizzu's objective was to throw Sheik on the mine than he was delusional. The Sheik look quite skilled and he would've been able to camp the Marth out.

And camping him out was easier for him, because Kizzu put a dangerous remote mine right next to himself!!! reducing his own vital space!

I'm sorry but this was a bad example IMO

But... the capsule... :

 

[BigRick]

But... the capsule... :

well yea if its about the exploding ones you can turn them off in Brawl no?

and with Brawl's floatier mechanics and reduced hitstun, do you think that Marth wouldn't have been able to avoid landing on the mine after the capsule hit him?

since youre using a melee vid to prove something in Brawl I kinda understand why Wiz didnt want to believe you guys

 

[Meteor!]

It's just an example. Items are pretty much the same in both games. It's not that he didn't believe it, it's that he has no intention of changing it.

 

[BigRick]

It's just an example. Items are pretty much the same in both games. It's not that he didn't believe it, it's that he has no intention of changing it.

but we dont really know... we are not the guy

thats why I wanna see the thread, because maybe the arguments provided were pretty poor and not good enough to influence the final decision

 

[Meteor!]

I don't think that matters. He outright lied when he said it was open to debate. That says something.

 

[thesage]

Bigrick, I'm talking about the capsule in the video. It spawned right after the Marth d-throwed the Sheik. It hit Sheik into the mine. Marth then threw the Star Rod that came from that capsule at sheik ftw.

 

[Pink Reaper]

You have that backwards sage, it was SHEIK who threw Marth and got the Star Rod and the kill.

 

[Yuna]

3 stock and 5 minutes is still idiotic. One half of their matches will most probably time out due to this. At least there's no Sudden Death.

Banning camping (but only if the organizers feel its' excessive) is also moronic. Since when was this ever banned? And does it count as camping if you have projectiles? I mean, if Pit hits hit opponent once in a while with his arrows, does that then not count towards excessive camping? Way to gimp anyone who doesn't have projectiles even more.

Could someone just put together a really long post on why Final Smashes in particular and items in general should be banned? Or should I? I think I've actually got an SRK-account.

Wow, they banned Mushroomy Kingdom because, and I quote, "You can get stuck behind the pipes"... um... what about Rainbow Cruise? Or Big Blue? Or any other stage where you could "get stuck and die" if you don't pay enough attention?

How is Final Destination super unfair now? Why not have more than one Neutral Stage? And why is he taking the words of random nobodies who've probably played the game for less than 5 hours? You can have an open debate open to everyone when forming the rules of Competitive play because everyone isn't even a Competitive player.

Oh screw it, I'm gonna go write a Wall of Text over at SRK.

 

[Seventh Sword]

"Evo: Luck-based Fighting Game Championships"

*Facepalm*

 

[Crazy Cloud]

A Wall of text isn't going to do any good Yuna. After reading the 12 pages of flames/trolls, it seems obvious they/Mr. Wiz aren't going to listen.

They keep telling us to support our stand on no-items with video proof, but they never provided video proof that items deserve a new chance at one of the biggest tournaments of the year. Then bringing up something similar to "you need evidence to win a case", so where is their evidence? The law system isn't one sided, anyways. Then posts that are actually well written, just get ignored all together, like AZ and sage and Samurai Panda. It shouldn't take any proof to see that smash is a better series without items. But, even when a video is shown with items being random and/or broken, they just come up with a belittling excuse calling it situational or something of the like.

I don't get why they're going with the 10 people at SRK that like items (and who's idea was that sorry "counter-pick" system?), rather than sticking to the tournament standard no-items/counter-picking that's been established years ago and used by hundreds of TOs.

 

[The Bino]

OMG! Look at the rules, lets all ***** about it within Smashboards instead of taking it to Shoryuken itself... come on ppl think, i've only recognized Samurai Panda's posts over there

But here's an idea, maybe im crazy... but majority of u guys say the rules suck, so DON'T GO!... its as easy as that

 

[Yuna]

A Wall of text isn't going to do any good Yuna. After reading the 12 pages of flames/trolls, it seems obvious they/Mr. Wiz aren't going to listen.

They keep telling us to support our stand on no-items with video proof, but they never provided video proof that items deserve a new chance at one of the biggest tournaments of the year. Then bringing up something similar to "you need evidence to win a case", so where is their evidence? The law system isn't one sided, anyways. Then posts that are actually well written, just get ignored all together, like AZ and sage and Samurai Panda. It shouldn't take any proof to see that smash is a better series without items. But, even when a video is shown with items being random and/or broken, they just come up with a belittling excuse calling it situational or something of the like.

I don't get why they're going with the 10 people at SRK that like items (and who's idea was that sorry "counter-pick" system?), rather than sticking to the tournament standard no-items/counter-picking that's been established years ago and used by hundreds of TOs.

Why the hell would you need video proof when logical thinking and simply playing the game will prove it?!

Ultimately, how SRK feels about the Smash series should be irrelevant to you and its competitive community at large. Trust me when I say EVO holds zero weight in any scheme that does not involve pillaring itself or the Smash community's growth potential.

Indirect impact:
Lots of idiots will be saying "We should do it this way! EVO's doing it!" (items, Final Smashes, 75m, etc.)

 

[memphischains]

Why the hell would you need video proof when logical thinking and simply playing the game will prove it?!

Brawl player, cmon Yuna

 

[Yuna]

I posted 3 long posts on everything that was wrong with the ruleset. Anyone with an SRK-account or just time on their hands and who feels up to it, can you back me up? And no "Quoted for truth!". We need eloquent and intelligent replies.

At least explain why you agree with me, etc. And add to my argument if you can.

 

[Endless Nightmares]

OMG! Look at the rules, lets all ***** about it within Smashboards instead of taking it to Shoryuken itself... come on ppl think, i've only recognized Samurai Panda's posts over there

You can't really argue against these rules over there...you just get flamed and/or ignored.

 

[-Wolfy-]

Yeah, the SWF community doesn't exactly have a strong standing with SRK. We're elitists, remember?

 

[Endless Nightmares]

SMASH doesn't exactly have a strong standing with SRK.

 

[memphischains]

SiYkO posted on it, and he knows what he is talking about on SRK. Plus AZ and Samurai are throwing their two cents on it

 

[BigRick]

Bigrick, I'm talking about the capsule in the video. It spawned right after the Marth d-throwed the Sheik. It hit Sheik into the mine. Marth then threw the Star Rod that came from that capsule at sheik ftw.

Items or not, the marth would've been ***** by sheik's dthrow anyways.

The vid was just an instance of a move randomly doing more damage than usual, and the sheik correctly using the opportunity to follow up with a KO. I'm being impartial here.

 

[SynikaL]

Why the hell would you need video proof when logical thinking and simply playing the game will prove it?!


Indirect impact:
Lots of idiots will be saying "We should do it this way! EVO's doing it!" (items, Final Smashes, 75m, etc.)

So your fear is that EVO may inspire others to hold Item Tournaments? I fail to see the problem there -- and if you truly find that to be a problem, maybe this community is being elitist.

Because that's an arrangement for animosity not inspired by corrupt decision making, but a faction of your own community members encouraged to try something different. It is highly unlikely for a Item Tournament splinter to encroach upon, endanger or usurp the Non-Item Tournament majority. There is no threat here worth preemptively protesting.

Though I know this won't stop any of you, you are all wasting your own time. I've literally dealt with that community upon subjects such as this one for years -- likely longer and more in-depth than any other member of this community. You will not change any minds.


Videogame communities are generally host to immature and callow individuals (including this one), but SRK specifically, houses a racial minority collective with a level of unreasonableness that leaves them insufferable.

-Kimosabae

 

[AlphaZealot]

I don't think anyone should boycott EVO. Just treat it like the Nintendo tournament or Gamestop tournament, it would have been nice to have the skill prestige also attached to the victory at EVO, but now it'll always carry an asterisk.

 

[Yuna]

So your fear is that EVO may inspire others to hold Item Tournaments? I fail to see the problem there -- and if you truly find that to be a problem, maybe this community is being elitist.

I'm sorry, I said that when? And since when have I not on at least 20 separate occasions in the past few months alone encouraged other to hold their own tournaments if they want items on?

What I fear is even more whining here on Smashboards about how the tournament standard "needs" to change and how items is the only/best way to go because, hey, EVO's doing it! And you know SRK, they obviously know better than SWF!

Seriously, the whining about items had kinda died down lately. Imagine the resurgence once this gets more attention.

I don't think anyone should boycott EVO. Just treat it like the Nintendo tournament or Gamestop tournament, it would have been nice to have the skill prestige also attached to the victory at EVO, but now it'll always carry an asterisk.

Not surprisingly, any posts containing irrefutable arguments against items over at SRK are being ignored by most of its users. Has MrWizard even addressed some of the points you, SamuraiPanda and others have brought up?

I posted 3 lengthy posts but I fear those will go ignored as well.

 

[SynikaL]

I'm sorry, I said that when? And since when have I not on at least 20 separate occasions in the past few months alone encouraged other to hold their own tournaments if they want items on?

What I fear is even more whining here on Smashboards about how the tournament standard "needs" to change and how items is the only/best way to go because, hey, EVO's doing it! And you know SRK, they obviously know better than SWF!

Seriously, the whining about items had kinda died down lately. Imagine the resurgence once this gets more attention.

As expected, your response is weightless and bloated. My statements are derived from the most obvious of implications to be derived from your own. The ideas you've presented need not be explicit. My last post addressed everything you're prophesizing about here.

This "whining" you're so charitably attempting to forestall, would be an unavoidable manifestation of the changes that would take place if EVO's tournament manages to provoke any notable lineage. I would recommend you stay away from the boards if it bothers you that much.

-Syn

 

[Sinz]

Yuna I read them all, I think. So don't fear any longer. I have just finished reading the entire SRK Evo thread. And I am surprised. There are so many great posts about having items off. Why are they being ignored? Because they are probably too long for the SRK to spend their precious time reading.

Yuna is your account name fallenangel II because those were some good posts.

 

[Yuna]

As expected, your response is weightless and bloated. My statements are derived from the most obvious of implications to be derived from your own. The ideas you've presented need not be explicit.

I was unclear, I realize that. I apologize for that. But you know me and my posting history. In fact, you've posted in the threads I speak of. You should know that your initial reaction was wrong or at least have found it peculiar that I would say something like that.

This "whining" you're so charitably attempting to forestall, would be an unavoidable manifestation of the changes that would take place if EVO's tournament manages to provoke any notable lineage. I would recommend you stay away from the boards if it bothers you that much.

It doesn't need to change the scene or anything. EVO is one of the world's largest fighting game tournaments. The world will undoubtedly spread, both here, on SRK and on GameFAQs and other places.

Random people will soon be flooding the boards requesting the norm be changed. You've seen this, even without any major tournaments even considering allowing items. What do you think will happen now when EVO is considering it/doing it for real?

More threads where people say "Itemzzzz!", that's what.

 

[Yuna]

Yuna I read them all, I think. So don't fear any longer. I have just finished reading the entire SRK Evo thread. And I am surprised. There are so many great posts about having items off. Why are they being ignored? Because they are probably too long for the SRK to spend their precious time reading.

Yuna is your account name fallenangel II because those were some good posts.

Yes, I am he. FallenAngelII was my old nick (funny story, there was already a Fallen Angel on my first forum so I just went with II... except on Deviantart where I'm FallenAngelIII because there was already a FallenAngelII ) years before I got the nickname Yuna after crossplaying as Summoner Yuna at my first animeconvention just for the heck of it (I really liked the game and had just finished it at the time).

Since then, I've taken the nick Yuna on all boards where it's available. Oh, and FAII is the shortened version of FallenAngelII if you ever see that one (I use it sometimes too).

Thank you for the compliments.

 

[Sinz]

This weekend (I have finals this week) I will be having a smashfest and will be video taping matches using their rules. I will have video proof.

Offtopic: Am I one of the only people who thought you were a man from the beginning?

 

[BigRick]

This weekend (I have finals this week) I will be having a smashfest and will be video taping matches using their rules. I will have video proof.

Offtopic: Am I one of the only people who thought you were a man from the beginning?

Finally someone is trying to do something about this