Ethnicity

[Omnicron's Baklava Enterprises]

Religion is not at all the same as ethnicity, accent, or skin color.

Religion is an idea, a statement, a claim to truth; as such, it has a truth value (i.e., true or false). Ethnicity, accent, and skin color are simply attributes, and do not inherently have any truth value. Statements (i.e., claims to truth) concerning ethnicity, accent, and skin color can have truth values, but the attributes themselves do not.

I wasn't trying to compare the latter together.

Humans just base their hatred off of those traits of Religion, ethnicity, et cetera, that's why I was stating it.

 

[CRASHiC]

Unless his opposition to religion is based on the irrational premise

Except this isn't just, Religion is not true, its People who believe in Religion are the scum of the earth. He cares much more about religious people more than he does religion itself. He automatically assumes that if someone is religious they must be irrational, stupid, and mostly immoral. The whole thing is caused about when my mother 'committed suicide' that he got incredibly offended when the decetive assigned to the case said that he labeled her death as suicided because "I knew her and she was possessed by the devil," thus, her death was legally labeled as a suicide, and my step father disappeared never to be seen again leaving my father was great hate towards anyone with any religion, even the atheist religions lacking deities like Buddhist. He doesn't hate them out of rationality, he hates them out of pure biggotry based off this single experience with one man. He honestly believes that all Musliums are like the one who went on a killing spree in Fort Hood. My father's a biggot towards religious people, to the point in which he would want to commit a genocide to all of the middle east.

Probably because of its depiction in western media.

No, not at all. He's actually a very educated man and almost majored in theology. Though, he interprets the Koran as a 'guide to take over the world,' able to provide a reason for every thing in the Koran as a helpful way to take over a country, such as the Let others practice their religion, but they can not promote it, and the You may not convert backwards to a former prophet. Its a combination of this misinterpretation of the Koran and his already huge animosity towards the religious. Another reason is again based off a single individual in his life. In his English Literautre class, a very educated, very rich, very liberal Islamic woman all of a sudden came into class in full traditional arab clothing, head scarf that covers the face except the eyes, and said she realized she wasn't being true to Allah. From this he assumes that all Islamic people will always be extremist deep down and the liberals are 'two-faced' that will one day turn.

 

[mountain_tiger]

Religion on its own is OK. It's the way it's exploited by soem peopl that I hate.

I hate it when people use religion to justify crimes or hatred or anything of that sort. Religion is, at its core, generally meant to be about helping other people and doing good. Oh, and those who take everything in it literally too. I'm dumbfounded at how many people seem to think that the world is 6,000 years old and was literally created in six days...

Also, I dislike it when it's used to stop scientific progress. 'Oh, you can't use embryos to do stem cell research. That's against God's plan, and it's murder'. Well, if using a newly conceived embryo is murder, I guess would make masturbation mass genocide. Or when it's used to stop people using contraception. I mean, if no one used contraception, every couple would have eight or nine children and the world population problems would be even more out of control than they already are. Besides, it's not a sin, because you aren't actually killing anything by using contraception; you're merely preventing the possibility of a child being born. It's no worse than if you decide to remain celibate, and thus not have children by not having sex.

And stuff like not giving their children vaccinations on religious grounds, or gay-bashing on religious grounds and... you get the idea. Oh, and people who feel the need to constantly preach about 'the divine truth' to people. If you follow a certain religion, then I respect that. So please respect that I don't follow your religion. You shouldn't go trying to force your beliefs down someone else's throats, and act as if any other belief leads to hell.

The way that certain people abuse religion is frankly making me sick just typing it all out, so I guess I'd better stop now...

tl;dr Religion is fine on its own, but it's too easy to manipulate the wrong way.

 

[Yink]

I emailed the Professor yesterday, and I just got an email back from him today. He said he did nothing wrong in making me empty my bag. He then accused me of accusing him of being racist.

Man, I hate this college sometimes. :/ I'm going to talk to the President about this, he's obviously going to do stuff like this again, if not to myself to someone else.

Thanks everyone for putting so much thought and reason into this issue. There's a lot of intelligent and thoughtful people here at SWF.

 

[Sucumbio]

I emailed the Professor yesterday, and I just got an email back from him today. He said he did nothing wrong in making me empty my bag. He then accused me of accusing him of being racist.

Man, I hate this college sometimes. :/ I'm going to talk to the President about this, he's obviously going to do stuff like this again, if not to myself to someone else.

Thanks everyone for putting so much thought and reason into this issue. There's a lot of intelligent and thoughtful people here at SWF.

He's not very bright for a Professor! Hah, woooow. Well let him hang himself, hope you saved that email.

It wasn't that he searched your belongings. It was HOW he did... in such a humiliating fashion.

And if he accused you of accusing him of being racist, I'd have to read the email you sent him to know if that assessment was accurate. But it's kinda moot. How he made you feel, is what's at hand. Civil liberties aren't things that get thrown around like cheap commodities. They're principles by which we live and die for. It seems as if he did this on purpose, to evoke this very scenario, and using you in this manner is inappropriate, regardless of what class he's teaching, or how he wishes to go about it.

on a side note: I dated the notorious Rosa Spiller from Northeastern University. You may still even find links about her brawl against the school. Be prepared in case this president squashes it with you on the losing end. Schools are as political as government itself, and they rarely back down, even if the ACLU gets involved on your behalf. Just a forewarning is all, I know you'll do the right thing, but doing the right thing doesn't always turn out well.

 

[.Marik]

The problem isn't religion

Not entirely, but it is a very large factor that contributes to worldwide problems as a result of humans being flawed.

If religion did not exist, these problems wouldn't be as persistent and elitism so recurrent.

 

[Teran]

Not entirely, but it is a very large factor that contributes to worldwide problems as a result of humans being flawed.

If religion did not exist, these problems wouldn't be as persistent and elitism so recurrent.

If religion didn't exist, the world as we know it today would not exist.

Although you may not believe it, religion has been the cause for as much progress as regression, be it directly or indirectly.

 

[.Marik]

If religion didn't exist, the world as we know it today would not exist.

That may not be a bad thing.

Although you may not believe it, religion has been the cause for as much progress as regression, be it directly or indirectly.

This is plausible, although these statements are merely opinions, pretty hard to prove or disprove.

 

[mountain_tiger]

If religion didn't exist, the world as we know it today would not exist.

Although you may not believe it, religion has been the cause for as much progress as regression, be it directly or indirectly.

That's probably true. Chances are without religion we'd still be dwelling in caves, hunting for food and dying before 30. Not to mention that there'd be no Christmas.

And the argument that religion causes wars is generally erroneous. Sometimes it's true, but the extent to which is causes conflict is often exaggerated. The most commonly given example is the crusades for religion-fuelled conflict. However, when you look at it carefully, it seems highly unlikely that it was purely for religious reasons. Religion was simply a convenient excuse for them to go and take land that they wanted. Chances are they'd have found some other justification if need be.

Would the world be better off without religion in the modern world? Possibly. Is it ever going to happen? Not a chance. Until someone can empirically prove that God isn't real (which is basically impossible), it's something we'll have to live with.

 

[.Marik]

Sometimes it's true, but the extent to which is causes conflict is often exaggerated. The most commonly given example is the crusades for religion-fuelled conflict. However, when you look at it carefully, it seems highly unlikely that it was purely for religious reasons. Religion was simply a convenient excuse for them to go and take land that they wanted.

Hmm.

I agree with the bolded part, but sometimes it -really- does have to do with religious bias.

Israel? Palestine? Somalia? These people are usually so engrossed within their own limited cultural perspective that they truly feel hostility and anger at other people if they choose to profess another faith, especially if they're in the minority and the antagonist hasn't been raised in a world where these sort of actions are considered wrong.

I have a lot of Muslim friends, so don't take this personally. See, many people dislike the Islamic faith because of the stereotypes associated with it, and as you fully well know, stereotypes always have a foundation of truth embedded deep down within the lie.

Terrorist attacks? Prime example. No, I'm not talking about the 9/11 episode, which was probably staged and planned by the Bush administration themselves. Simply put, it was a conspiracy to get money and oil, and they used religion as a scapegoat. "War on terrorism", as they call it.

Now, radical Muslims most often cause problems within their own countries, is what I'm trying to say. Not all Muslims are radical, obviously, and my ex-girlfriend is Egyptian, and comes from a Islamic-based culture.

But, the unorthodox and violent manner in which they approach things, causes strife in the modern world, on their lands and Christian and Jewish lands.

Around 4,000 Christians are murdered every year by radical Muslims in countries such as Indonesia, and Somalia. How is this at all beneficial to mankind advancing?

Religion seems completely and utterly primitive and seems to be holding us back. Now that we have scientific explanations for various causes, no wonder religion is slowly dissolving from everyday life.

It's ridiculously meticulous and causes barriers due to ignorance and stupidity.

Ancient battles? Some of these were land-based, but were motivated by religious causes. It was the secondary want, that urged these men to exterminate the enemies.

No religion? Sure, other problems would exist, but -would- we be as advanced medically and technologically? Yes, perhaps even moreso, because if science was the mainstream notion accepted thousands of years ago... who knows.

I support the idea of people believing in science and religion equally, but bias often causes individuals to cross that invisible line which inevitably causes problems in society.

Now, imagine a world without religious strife.

Sounds pretty nice. This will never be, but just try to imagine.

Now, what her professor did to her was completely unfair. But, if religion did not exist... it never would have happened, and maybe sexism and racism would exist, but it wouldn't be as enforced as much.

Religion is poison. Sad, but true. Now, if everyone practiced their own faith and kept to themselves and let complete strangers and such practice another faith without negative thoughts, maybe this wouldn't be the case.

But you know, we're such an idiotic species with many flaws and irregularities.

 

[mountain_tiger]

Basically, you're saying that religion is fine if kept to yourself, but in the grand scheme of things the way it's used to justify atrocities and the likes outweight the benefits it has, right? Because if so, then I basically agree.

It's us humans that ruin these things. That's just the way mankind's mindset works. IMO, the closest thing that could exist to a god is some sort of abstract, emotionless force created all the elements, and then basically left things to evolve on their own, but religion at its simplest isn't too bad.

However, some of the messages preached in certain religions are not good at all. Take Christianty, for example. You mostly hear stuff about 'turning the other cheek' and 'love your neighbour' etc., but there's also some really gruesome/nonsensical stuff, especially in the Old Testament, such as it being OK to own slaves, kill people that God hates etc. and it's not OK to masturbate or let women do much of anything. And if you break any rules then God will basically kill you in the most brutal way possible.

In fact, God kills at least three million people throughout the Bible, probably considerably more when counting non-specified numbers of people. Here's an interesting but useless fact. 75% of Americans are Christian, and 75% of the prison population is Christian. Meanwhile, around 10% of Americans are atheist, yet only 0.2% of the prison population is. Yet according to fundamentalist Christians atheists are the evil ones. *shrugs*

 

[.Marik]

Basically, you're saying that religion is fine if kept to yourself, but in the grand scheme of things the way it's used to justify atrocities and the likes outweight the benefits it has, right? Because if so, then I basically agree.

Yeah, that's pretty much the jist of my post.

Here's an interesting but useless fact. 75% of Americans are Christian, and 75% of the prison population is Christian. Meanwhile, around 10% of Americans are atheist, yet only 0.2% of the prison population is. Yet according to fundamentalist Christians atheists are the evil ones. *shrugs*

Interesting...

I don't consider that useless at all, the connection is pretty visible.

Keep in mind, however, many people convert to Christianity while incarcerated for motivational/inspirational purposes.

 

[CRASHiC]

Here's an interesting but useless fact. 75% of Americans are Christian, and 75% of the prison population is Christian. Meanwhile, around 10% of Americans are atheist, yet only 0.2% of the prison population is. Yet according to fundamentalist Christians atheists are the evil ones. *shrugs*

That's just an exploitation of statistics. Atheist tend to be the more upper class people and the religious tend to be the poorer people. Imagine that, poor people are going to commit more crimes.

 

[.Marik]

^ Because once you have money, you don't need religion!

:\

What you said is -probably- true, but obviously subjective.

 

[GreenKirby]

If religion didn't exist, the world as we know it today would not exist.

Although you may not believe it, religion has been the cause for as much progress as regression, be it directly or indirectly.

So has race and nationality. Yet people never seem to critique those two.

Well race I can understand why not. But not nationality.

 

[Teran]

I just find it sad that everything has to boil down to religion in this place.

I thought this was about ethnicity. Jesus, we've exhausted the religion topic enough as it is (pun intended).

 

[Jim Morrison]

Yea, I was gonna reply a few hours ago, but I didn't feel like mixing in the religious debate YET AGAIN.

Ethnicity, as stupid as it is, is not just something you can "look past". EVERYONE sees a person as a certain group. You see me, you think "lol european", I think the same about most Middle Eastern people, or people that look like that.

Prejudices aren't bad as long as you won't start living by it.

EDIT: Nvm this post, even I don't understand what I just wrote.

 

[Sucumbio]

I really dig ambiguously ethnic people. "What... ARE you???" It's fascinating. I'm almost sure one day we'll all be some mixed versions of one another, that no one will be able to really see the roots anymore.

As for why religion plays into this? It's... because of the ... OP.

We discussed Iran (where I'm from) and almost everyone in the room made some sort of remark about terrorists. I can understand that, but then someone even went so far as to say all the common people are linked to terrorists somehow.

Because of the whole bomb bag thing (I have to admit, I'd prolly have joked that too lol! >.>) this part of the OP pretty much got missed, but by a few.

It's about a culture of fear... the coining into popular media of such phrase as "Radical Islam" that makes students like above believe deep down that somehow all Iranians are terrorists on some level. They may not be holding bombs in their lunchboxes (gah, you won't live that down, I'm afraid @ Yink) but it's because their very -religion- has been deemed Anti-American. Anti-Freedom. Ridiculous of course, to think that The Nation of Islam is indeed a Society vs America. But... there ARE radical factions within the nation of Islam which DO wish to continue the fight, going back to the Crusades, so the Spin is viable and dumb Americans eat it up.

Also, I should point out that the Crusades were NOT just some fight over land. It was to recapture Jerusalem, and to restore control of "the Holy Land" to the Holy Roman Empire, and so was ordered by Pope Urban II answering the distress call of the Byzantines to help stop the advancing Muslim Turks, who had been killing Pilgrims to the Holy Land after the Byzantine Empire was allowed to rebuild the Church of the Holy Sepulchre (which the Muslims originally destroyed several years before). I won't condone the violence of the time period, of course, but I will say that it's not far fetched to understand why there's so much ingrained hatred between Christians and Muslims. Ethnicity, unfortunately, plays into this if you're Muslim. Just looking at your darker skin, your shapely eyes, maybe your hair... these turn into tell-tale signs of "different!" in the brain, then the brain says "different, how?" then it fills in the gaps, all within microseconds... and the gaps are filled with junk you see on TV, crap you hear on the radio, bull you read online. "She's Iranian??? Terrorist!" Sad sad truth. And what's really ridiculous is the people of Iran held demonstrations in the democratic vein against their so-called election results, and yet we still view them in this light. Hypocrisy, much? The Media has just as much responsibility, as the White House in this. By slanting the whole country against 1 man and his terror cell (9/11) we've jumped backward 30 years in mentality. Muslims are the new Blacks. Airports? A breeding ground for humiliation and unjust treatment. And now apparently, so too have classrooms become.

 

[CRASHiC]

I really dig ambiguously ethnic people. "What... ARE you???" It's fascinating. I'm almost sure one day we'll all be some mixed versions of one another, that no one will be able to really see the roots anymore.

You ever seen Martina Topley-Bird? She's like, the hottest chick alive, is from obscure island I've never heard (later moved to the UK) of a (very) mixed race. She's basically already achieved what you are talking about.

check at 2:06 for her hottness
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiXQynouMTY

 

[GunmasterLombardi]

People stop the religion stuff.

I think it's bad enough that scrubs look at my comments simply having the words (God, Heaven, Hell) in them, and then flame me off thinking I'm trying to force my beliefs. It makes no sense for people to think like that. Not everyone believes the same thing so why bother being so stressful over people who simply discuss it in public?

Had to get that out mah muscle memory...about ethnicity, where I live black people are admired more. But at lunch people still make sex and black jokes.

 

[Signia]

^ Because once you have money, you don't need religion!

:\

What you said is -probably- true, but obviously subjective.

what do you think is not true?

Poor people are more likely to be religous.
Poor people are more likely to commit crimes.
Upper class people are usually more educated.
More educated people are more likely to not follow a religion.

All this is true.

 

[Sucumbio]

You ever seen Martina Topley-Bird? She's like, the hottest chick alive, is from obscure island I've never heard (later moved to the UK) of a (very) mixed race. She's basically already achieved what you are talking about.

check at 2:06 for her hottness
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiXQynouMTY

I love Gorillaz!! Martina is so hot, GREAT voice. Miho Hatori is hot too..

People stop the religion stuff.

I think it's bad enough that scrubs look at my comments simply having the words (God, Heaven, Hell) in them, and then flame me off thinking I'm trying to force my beliefs. It makes no sense for people to think like that. Not everyone believes the same thing so why bother being so stressful over people who simply discuss it in public?

Had to get that out mah muscle memory...about ethnicity, where I live black people are admired more. But at lunch people still make sex and black jokes.

Little late to the game on this one It isn't that this topic is risking boiling down into a useless debate on religion, which many other topics may. It's that fear of religion (Islam) is at the heart of her classroom's fear against different ethnicity from the middle east (Iranians).

 

[.Marik]

what do you think is not true?

Poor people are more likely to be religous.
Poor people are more likely to commit crimes.
Upper class people are usually more educated.
More educated people are more likely to not follow a religion.

All this is true.

Because it's a subjective assumption.

Poor people are not always religious.

Rich people can be religious and commit crimes too. Ever heard of something called the "Mafia"?

Money corrupts people. Rich people can still ****, murder, and plan insurance scams. Since they actually have money and possibly governmental ties, they may be able to accomplish certain motives.

The last point is true, at least to a degree. Catholic District School Boards much?

 

[El Nino]

Poor people are more likely to be religous.

That may not have anything to do with education, and certainly not intelligence.

Prayer distracts you when your stomach is empty, and it gets you through another day in a harsh life. It makes you feel better when you're sick and can't afford to see a doctor; it makes you feel safer when bombs are dropping outside and your neighbors are shooting each other.

When you're rich, well-fed and well-off, you don't need to pray. You pray because you want to, but that is not the same, nor will your devotion be as intense, because your devotion is not tied to a physical need.

Religion gets people through tough times, but it also makes them vulnerable when someone else uses that religion to control them for political ends.

"Someone else" is usually someone with money and motives. Politics isn't cheap.

Religion, as a factor in conflict, is a variable; money and resources, on the other hand....

 

[Chis]

Ignoring the random Religious debate...

I emailed the Professor yesterday, and I just got an email back from him today. He said he did nothing wrong in making me empty my bag. He then accused me of accusing him of being racist.

Man, I hate this college sometimes. :/ I'm going to talk to the President about this, he's obviously going to do stuff like this again, if not to myself to someone else.

Thanks everyone for putting so much thought and reason into this issue. There's a lot of intelligent and thoughtful people here at SWF.

So how did that go Yink? Hopefully they'll do something to that idiot.

 

[Yink]

So how did that go Yink? Hopefully they'll do something to that idiot.

They gave him a "warning". Still, he didn't look like he apologized and meant it. He is just...one of those Professors (or people) who feel like they're always right about what they say.

He made me do it in front of the lecture class. I still don't know what he was trying to prove by doing that. Was he trying to make the rest of the class feel "safe" or something? I don't know.

 

[Sucumbio]

You should ask him. I get the feeling he did that to prove a point on how racist your classmates are (If I read your OP correctly the search happened -after- they all balked about terrorism and Iranians). He may have seen an opportunity (when your friend joked) and exploited it, but without rehearsing it, and getting your consent, it obviously made you feel embarrassed to say the least, and its certainly no excuse.

has anything been said since the incident by any of your classmates, or by the Professor in front the class about this? Or has this exchange pretty much killed this section of his lecture and now you're studying china or something, lol

 

[-Mars-]

Though there's one thing I don't get. How come if a black person calls another black person the n word, that's OK, but if a white person says it, everyone brands him as unforgivably racist? Surely it's bad regardless of who says it?

*** ger- the word that was created to bring our race down.

*** ga- the word that we created ourselves to pretty much put up a big middle finger to those people.

It's a cultural thing. Generally when somebody who isn't black says it they pronounce it with the er so it does get under our skin.

 

[Red Arremer]

Upper class people commit crimes all the time, lol. They just don't go and kill or break into appartments.

 

[Teran]

Is it just me, or are white people the ones committing all the most "horrific" crimes?

I mean, most of the crimes I see black people committing are petty in nature, and at worst is murder but murder is a universal thing.

I swear I have never seen anything other than a white pedophile, and on top of that, they nearly always have a good social standing, (as well as having glasses and greying hair but that's not the point).

Every time I see some story about a school shooting it's a white guy (except for that Korean guy). Most nutjob serial killers I've heard of are white.

What's important is how the media and society portrays an ethnic group. I can walk down the street with no suspicion, most black guys can't, and I've done things I'm not proud of too.

Also the upper classes all evade tax here.

 

[Sucumbio]

Oh no, I wear glasses and have graying hair ... *runs*

LOL but anyway, where is "here" if I may ask?

You have actually pointed out a conundrum that faces us here in America (dunno about anywhere else) ... one of several. Whites do actually commit more crimes than Blacks and yet Blacks (and other minorities) outnumber Whites in jails by a huge margin.

I was gonna point out the next conundrum but it's a banned subject.

These trends are indeed rooted in a racially motivated and systematic attempt to 'purify' our nation. If we didn't sit so strongly upon the UN's lap we may very well find ourselves one day on trial for crimes against humanity, but that'd never happen. We are a freedom-based nation, and so too it is our government's freedom to literally do (or at least try) as they please to anyone, anywhere at anytime, even to our own.

 

[Teran]

I live in England,

Here's a fact of life. You're not free, never have been, never will be. You have no rights, you have what your government gives you.