boss8
Smash Hero
Qft.................
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ECRC event #2 - XII.E.S.T.I.C.L.E. Results Thread
- Thread starter Cobra
- Start date
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- Apr 23, 2005
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- 2,617
G-Reg - Whenever I see you next, MM?
Same for Boss
Same for Boss
boss8
Smash Hero
sure how much???
- Joined
- Apr 23, 2005
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$3-$5 sounds good? Mario vs Rob
boss8
Smash Hero
i mean................im down >_>
rice
Smash Journeyman
rob's upsmash hurts
Snakeee
Smash Master
**** M2K that was harsh. I know Dire has won at least one or two weekly in NYC. And our weekly's are really tough with close to 50 people and at least half of them pretty high end players.
Eazy23
Smash Lord
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- Aug 6, 2007
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Ganon hit really hard did he not?
Takes more 2 win besides dealing mad damage.
Any character who can outcamp snake(toonlink, fox, falco, olimar,sheik,rob?), chaingrab snake(pika, d3, falco), or hit hard just like him(dk, bowser,) is a serious problem.
I've also heard of snakes having problems with peach.
Not to mention that marth, meta can flat out fight snake.You may say that snake wins, but Regardless its VERY close, and worth mentioning while talking down snake.
While people are getting better n better with these characters, snake becomes less n less of a threat. The gap between meta n snake is HUGE!!!! Whatever secret techniques you are thinking of, better be so dominating that cg's dont **** snake, getting completely outspammed doesnt **** snake, and getting hit harder than he hits...doesnt **** snake. If they do, I'll shutup lol
Takes more 2 win besides dealing mad damage.
Any character who can outcamp snake(toonlink, fox, falco, olimar,sheik,rob?), chaingrab snake(pika, d3, falco), or hit hard just like him(dk, bowser,) is a serious problem.
I've also heard of snakes having problems with peach.
Not to mention that marth, meta can flat out fight snake.You may say that snake wins, but Regardless its VERY close, and worth mentioning while talking down snake.
While people are getting better n better with these characters, snake becomes less n less of a threat. The gap between meta n snake is HUGE!!!! Whatever secret techniques you are thinking of, better be so dominating that cg's dont **** snake, getting completely outspammed doesnt **** snake, and getting hit harder than he hits...doesnt **** snake. If they do, I'll shutup lol
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Out camping and out spamming Snake...a good Snake...is getting more and more difficult now that they have a better grasp on their projectiles. It can be difficult to approach them and I use Rob so I know how to spam **** correctly, but the explosions can be a huge threat if the Snake player is smart.
Eazy23
Smash Lord
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I use toonlink vs snake. It is not a hard matchup imo. I've fought good snakes in tourny, and practice with one of the smartest and most patient smashers in the community.
Rob is something Im pretty unsure about, I dont use the character at all hence the ? I put after his name lol
Characters with fast rate of fire, such as toonlink n falco are def more equiped to out camp snake then ROB...I guess.
lol wow at me saying definitely..I guess
Oh and umm, approach? In brawl? Why would you ever do that? Especially if you are already winning the camping battle lol
Rob is something Im pretty unsure about, I dont use the character at all hence the ? I put after his name lol
Characters with fast rate of fire, such as toonlink n falco are def more equiped to out camp snake then ROB...I guess.
lol wow at me saying definitely..I guess
Oh and umm, approach? In brawl? Why would you ever do that? Especially if you are already winning the camping battle lol
boss8
Smash Hero
camping is gay and half the time it doesnt work...i just trade camping with combos......combos=more damage....and i can just cape projectiles all day....
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If you don't approach with some characters...you don't win...period. Not every character in this game has to camp, and the people that do camp heavily all the time regardless are generally really ****ty players.
LOL_Master
Smash Lord
that...sucks...
Eazy23
Smash Lord
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yea umm about that, you're very very wrong.
I've seen plenty of tourny sets decided by high level players simply planking until the clock ran out. It's so easy to do in this game, and seeing as though most people don't care about being seen as a gay player, said planking will be executed.
Yea it does suck that people will camp to that extent, but if it gets you the win it gets you the win.
Brawl forces the LOSING player to approach. Regardless of what character you are, you can play campy with a %lead.
But yea, saying that hardcore campers are ****ty players is completely inaccurate.
I myself am not even a campy player, I just know what CAN be done, if need be.
Edit- Boss ma dude. I know that in brawl camping is gay as hell, but the reason its gay as hell....IS because it works, and like everyone can do it.
I've seen plenty of tourny sets decided by high level players simply planking until the clock ran out. It's so easy to do in this game, and seeing as though most people don't care about being seen as a gay player, said planking will be executed.
Yea it does suck that people will camp to that extent, but if it gets you the win it gets you the win.
Brawl forces the LOSING player to approach. Regardless of what character you are, you can play campy with a %lead.
But yea, saying that hardcore campers are ****ty players is completely inaccurate.
I myself am not even a campy player, I just know what CAN be done, if need be.
Edit- Boss ma dude. I know that in brawl camping is gay as hell, but the reason its gay as hell....IS because it works, and like everyone can do it.
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I said generally, not all. I understand soem people can pull it off quite well (plank and overswarm etc) but a good amount of people who try to do it, suck. That was my point.
JesiahTEG
Smash Master
OK, I'll just say what's on my mind.
In the end, it won't matter how many people "know" how to fight Snake. Regardless of how much you know about him, it doesn't change the fact that he's still an amazing character and can play a simple mix up game that's effectiveness will always remain among the top strategies.
For example. If you walk up to Snake with anything besides a shield, you take 21% damage from a forward tilt. You walk up and shield and you get grabbed. If you use the wrong get up attack that's around 35% damage right there...12% from the throw, and 21% from the ensuing forward tilt, not to mention the neutral A attack while you're in the grab. You spotdodge and if Snake waits and Ftilts or throws you, you're screwed.
It doesn't matter how much you know about that, I laid it out for you right there, a simple Snake strategy. Doesn't change the fact that if you guess wrong you take between 20 and 35 percent damage.
And a ton of Snake's game is unexplored. His edgeguarding for one is pretty unexplored. That's one of the things that I believe makes Snake vs DDD even or I'd even put it in Snake's advantage maybe...Snake can edgeguard DDD just as well as DDD can edgeguard him, sometimes even better.
A smart campy Snake can be extremely effective. It's like trying to kick a soccer ball through a brick wall. No matter how many times you kick it, it's not going to go through. Not to mention, I've thought of things that Snake can do while someone is on the ledge that literally has them trapped and you will take a hit if I do it correctly.
And btw I am by no way/shape/form saying I'm an amazing player. I do have amazing ideas though and I'm practicing them a lot.
To Omegawhitemage- But a player that is smart and camps is really hard to beat.
To Eazy- A lot of what you said is wrong. First off, Snake dominates peach. Second off, even IF people have an advantage over Snake, a lot of times it doesn't matter. Take Toon Link for example. Sure he can outcamp Snake but Snake outranges him with Ftilt, lives till forever and kills Toon Link incredibly quickly.
That's something a ton of people seem to forget about Snake. Sure there are characters that can outcamp him. Snake still has his shield, powershield, jab to beat the projectiles, and airdodging/rolling. Ok, you outcamp me with Toon Link. You force me to approach. I spend about a minute trying to catch you, and in the process take at most 15% damage. Then I catch you and Ftilt you for 21%.
Falco's lasers are sort of a problem for Snake. It just means no mortar sliding. Crawling under them is really really easy and effective.
You have to look at Snake as a character, while including matchup stats. A good example is Snake vs Pikachu.
I play a GOOD Pikachu player often in tournament and in friendlies. He CG's me off the stage, edgeguards me either to death or to a high percent, generally above the hundreds, then when I finally get back ON the stage, he runs away and camps/ledgecamps with neutral B until he can throw me off the edge and kill me or hit me with a kill move.
Pika definitely has more on Snake than Snake has on Pika, but I still win that match vs him 60/40 normally in tournament. First off, it's hard to grab Snake. Very hard. Second, it only takes about 5 Ftilt/Utilts to get Pika into killing range. He does all this work CG'ing and Edgeguarding me, then I get back on, try to get around his camping, Ftilt him a few times and all of a sudden the match is even.
Not to mention, all of the characters that do outcamp Snake besides one are at a disadvantage up close, and the characters that do well vs Snake up close get outcamped by him. The only character that beats Snake up close and far away is R.O.B. R.O.B. I think is Snake's hardest matchup, but EVEN THEN Snake can do it. Snake will get jabbed/ftilted/dsmashed away from R.O.B. 3-5 times before he hits R.O.B. once, and then his Ftilt/Dair does so much damage that the percent is even.
The only real thing I'll agree on is that Snake doesn't have as many options as other character. However, he has more options than people think. Also, a smart Snake played with very basic gameplay is still a huge threat just because of his range, speed, and how much damage he deals. I don't know what's going on in terms of why Snake isn't placing well, but I hope that later on I'll be able to show people that Snake still has the potential to win large tournaments.
In the end, it won't matter how many people "know" how to fight Snake. Regardless of how much you know about him, it doesn't change the fact that he's still an amazing character and can play a simple mix up game that's effectiveness will always remain among the top strategies.
For example. If you walk up to Snake with anything besides a shield, you take 21% damage from a forward tilt. You walk up and shield and you get grabbed. If you use the wrong get up attack that's around 35% damage right there...12% from the throw, and 21% from the ensuing forward tilt, not to mention the neutral A attack while you're in the grab. You spotdodge and if Snake waits and Ftilts or throws you, you're screwed.
It doesn't matter how much you know about that, I laid it out for you right there, a simple Snake strategy. Doesn't change the fact that if you guess wrong you take between 20 and 35 percent damage.
And a ton of Snake's game is unexplored. His edgeguarding for one is pretty unexplored. That's one of the things that I believe makes Snake vs DDD even or I'd even put it in Snake's advantage maybe...Snake can edgeguard DDD just as well as DDD can edgeguard him, sometimes even better.
A smart campy Snake can be extremely effective. It's like trying to kick a soccer ball through a brick wall. No matter how many times you kick it, it's not going to go through. Not to mention, I've thought of things that Snake can do while someone is on the ledge that literally has them trapped and you will take a hit if I do it correctly.
And btw I am by no way/shape/form saying I'm an amazing player. I do have amazing ideas though and I'm practicing them a lot.
To Omegawhitemage- But a player that is smart and camps is really hard to beat.
To Eazy- A lot of what you said is wrong. First off, Snake dominates peach. Second off, even IF people have an advantage over Snake, a lot of times it doesn't matter. Take Toon Link for example. Sure he can outcamp Snake but Snake outranges him with Ftilt, lives till forever and kills Toon Link incredibly quickly.
That's something a ton of people seem to forget about Snake. Sure there are characters that can outcamp him. Snake still has his shield, powershield, jab to beat the projectiles, and airdodging/rolling. Ok, you outcamp me with Toon Link. You force me to approach. I spend about a minute trying to catch you, and in the process take at most 15% damage. Then I catch you and Ftilt you for 21%.
Falco's lasers are sort of a problem for Snake. It just means no mortar sliding. Crawling under them is really really easy and effective.
You have to look at Snake as a character, while including matchup stats. A good example is Snake vs Pikachu.
I play a GOOD Pikachu player often in tournament and in friendlies. He CG's me off the stage, edgeguards me either to death or to a high percent, generally above the hundreds, then when I finally get back ON the stage, he runs away and camps/ledgecamps with neutral B until he can throw me off the edge and kill me or hit me with a kill move.
Pika definitely has more on Snake than Snake has on Pika, but I still win that match vs him 60/40 normally in tournament. First off, it's hard to grab Snake. Very hard. Second, it only takes about 5 Ftilt/Utilts to get Pika into killing range. He does all this work CG'ing and Edgeguarding me, then I get back on, try to get around his camping, Ftilt him a few times and all of a sudden the match is even.
Not to mention, all of the characters that do outcamp Snake besides one are at a disadvantage up close, and the characters that do well vs Snake up close get outcamped by him. The only character that beats Snake up close and far away is R.O.B. R.O.B. I think is Snake's hardest matchup, but EVEN THEN Snake can do it. Snake will get jabbed/ftilted/dsmashed away from R.O.B. 3-5 times before he hits R.O.B. once, and then his Ftilt/Dair does so much damage that the percent is even.
The only real thing I'll agree on is that Snake doesn't have as many options as other character. However, he has more options than people think. Also, a smart Snake played with very basic gameplay is still a huge threat just because of his range, speed, and how much damage he deals. I don't know what's going on in terms of why Snake isn't placing well, but I hope that later on I'll be able to show people that Snake still has the potential to win large tournaments.
Eazy23
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Aug 6, 2007
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- 1,383
ahh I c.
This whole thing was about snake though. I personally feel that a campy snake is much tougher to deal with than one that is not so campy. Snake playing stonewall campy is the most effective play style so of course when I'm speaking of who can beat him and how, I'm referring to that.
I played solid Jake, who was a good snake but wasnt very campy. In comparison to a player like nj's YEHS, who is VERY campy the match can be alot tougher. If you dont camp, you are honorable yes, but you put yourself in a worse position thats all.
This whole thing was about snake though. I personally feel that a campy snake is much tougher to deal with than one that is not so campy. Snake playing stonewall campy is the most effective play style so of course when I'm speaking of who can beat him and how, I'm referring to that.
I played solid Jake, who was a good snake but wasnt very campy. In comparison to a player like nj's YEHS, who is VERY campy the match can be alot tougher. If you dont camp, you are honorable yes, but you put yourself in a worse position thats all.
boss8
Smash Hero
so basically........im amazing.....any questions???
JesiahTEG
Smash Master
I don't think about my playstyle really, it always changes depending on the matchup. There's no "best" playstyle for Snake. The point is, a smart Snake will do what he needs to win.
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I have a question, why does hova think he's good? Also, why does he talk tons of **** and refuse MM's like a *****?
boss8
Smash Hero
hova is good..... idk y he doesnt MM...
thumbswayup
Smash Master
ROFL I don't know why I laughed so hard at this.
boss8
Smash Hero
cause i just wanted to end all this campy crap......
rice
Smash Journeyman
mario has a mustache
boss8
Smash Hero
wow that wuz random.......
thumbswayup
Smash Master
Diddy has no pants
boss8
Smash Hero
i call homo.........
is it a curly mustache?
- Joined
- Apr 23, 2005
- Messages
- 2,617
Rob has no emotions and a thirst for blood...ok maybe that's me.
boss8
Smash Hero
arent u the blade breaker who looks like andy milonakis???
Inui
Banned via Warnings
Only Bum wins those. Nobody else. You always split with him instead of beating his random trash characters or chaingrabbing his DK to death with Dedede.
boss8
Smash Hero
so basically im amazing.....any questions???
memphischains
Smash hhkj'
Nope, me, best, no one else, cool, i'm not
Snakeee
Smash Master
No, he has legitimately lost before. The first time I won when I split with PC, Bum used DK the whole time and was knocked out of loser's by Ron.
DireVulcan
Smash Lord
Shows how much you know, because you must be offended at what I said about you and Captain Falcon...but that was a rhetorical statement really meant as sarcasm towards Plank..there's nothing in there that can realistically be considered an insult since all I did was say what happened with no exaggeration.
Tell you what, win as many tournies as you like, but until you discard your years-old pathetic high-school grudge against me, you're pretty much still losing the real life tourney.
JesiahTEG
Smash Master
Hmmm...
I wish my real life was winning money doing something I love with a passion.
I wish my real life was winning money doing something I love with a passion.
da K.I.D.
Smash Hero
same... but i have to get through your stupid behind b4 i can start doing that, and even than ill have to hope that i either get lucky or that yannick knocks pika out again...lol
everyone just needs to stop hating.
and about the snake thing. most people know that their snake strats are simple and effective, and that ends up turning into a crutch for them because they get so set in their rediculously easy strat that once the opponent does something crazy and breaks through, the snake has no idea what to do after that. thats why snakes dont always do great in high level play. because pros are usually the best at getting people off-guard and adapting to new situations. tha latter of which goes against pretty much the whole philosophy of snake.
everyone just needs to stop hating.
and about the snake thing. most people know that their snake strats are simple and effective, and that ends up turning into a crutch for them because they get so set in their rediculously easy strat that once the opponent does something crazy and breaks through, the snake has no idea what to do after that. thats why snakes dont always do great in high level play. because pros are usually the best at getting people off-guard and adapting to new situations. tha latter of which goes against pretty much the whole philosophy of snake.
This.
Most snake players are EXPECTING ftilt spam to win matches, so when it doesnt work they have little to fall back on. I 3 stocked Yayuz's snake at FAST1 because he coumterpicked him thinking Ftilt would be enough.
Anyone who can space for **** can beat snakes who arent on top of their game.
DSL gave me a phobia of fighting snake in general though *shudders*
But if you want to beat snake, Falco SHL, chaingrab, DAC, and spike are insane ****. Otherwise, skill and knowledge of snake himself works fine.
JesiahTEG
Smash Master
Any Snake who Ftilts only is ******** and cannot be included in your argument lol. Also Goggles, I know you're a good player and have the potential to make it to the top. You just gotta work hard.
Prince Of Fire
Smash Lord
That was incredible Banks.