Each Ganon's personal MU-ratio 2010 - (Finished)

[Z1GMA]

Moving on:

Vs

Z1GMA: 37 - 63
Comment: Zelda has her Usmash Combo on us at like 0% - Deals around 30%,
plus possible follow-up, so maybe 40%.
She can Dtilt Lock us from like 40% to like 80%.
Her Grabgame is effective Vs Ganon.
...Outside of this, Zelda has nothing, NOTHING on Ganon.

Her Usmash Combos:
Ganon can do pretty much the same to her at like 0% (via Stomp or Gerudo),
so we're pretty even at that point.

She is one of the easiest characters to juggle in the game.
We outrange and outpriorize her all day.
Gerudo -> iDA is fun when she's at around 95%.
If we get the lead, we shouldn't lose, 'cause she can't approach us really well.

 

[smashkng]

If you mean grab combos with Dthrow, I'm pretty sure you can DI behind her preventing any follow-ups she tries to do unless you fall offstage for that. Plus her grab has like 12 frames start-up in her standing grab and 14 frames in her dash and pivot grab.

 

[Nickelbacker]

35-65
I think this is Zelda's only time where Din's fire is used in this Matchup. LOL

 

[Exalted]

Moving on:

Vs

Z1GMA: 37 - 63
Comment: Zelda has her Usmash Combo on us at like 0% - Deals around 30%,
plus possible follow-up, so maybe 40%.
She can Dtilt Lock us from like 40% to like 80%.
Her Grabgame is effective Vs Ganon.
...Outside of this, Zelda has nothing, NOTHING on Ganon.

Her Usmash Combos:
Ganon can do pretty much the same to her at like 0% (via Stomp or Gerudo),
so we're pretty even at that point.

She is one of the easiest characters to juggle in the game.
We outrange and outpriorize her all day.
Gerudo -> iDA is fun when she's at around 95%.
If we get the lead, we shouldn't lose, 'cause she can't approach us really well.

Exalted: 35 - 65
Comment: The major things to look out for are her Usmash and Dtilt.
Nayru's Love is annoying , but that's about it.
Din's Fire has a HUGE blast radius at the cost of being slow and predictable.
She's pretty much helpless once you land a Dair or hit her far enough offstage.

 

[Z1GMA]

If you mean grab combos with Dthrow, I'm pretty sure you can DI behind her preventing any follow-ups she tries to do unless you fall offstage for that.

Why do you keep finding stuff I never said?

 

[A2ZOMG]

Vs

Z1GMA: 37 - 63
Comment: Zelda has her Usmash Combo on us at like 0% - Deals around 30%,
plus possible follow-up, so maybe 40%.
She can Dtilt Lock us from like 40% to like 80%.
Her Grabgame is effective Vs Ganon.
...Outside of this, Zelda has nothing, NOTHING on Ganon.

Her Usmash Combos:
Ganon can do pretty much the same to her at like 0% (via Stomp or Gerudo),
so we're pretty even at that point.

She is one of the easiest characters to juggle in the game.
We outrange and outpriorize her all day.
Gerudo -> iDA is fun when she's at around 95%.
If we get the lead, we shouldn't lose, 'cause she can't approach us really well.

Exalted: 35 - 65
Comment: The major things to look out for are her Usmash and Dtilt.
Nayru's Love is annoying , but that's about it.
Din's Fire has a HUGE blast radius at the cost of being slow and predictable.
She's pretty much helpless once you land a Dair or hit her far enough offstage.

A2ZOMG: 40/60
A boring and tedious matchup. Generally you have to work harder than Zelda because her Smashes are really stupid, but you have little to lose by waiting her out. Then juggling her and edgeguarding her is pretty awesome. This matchup in many ways is like going against Lucario, with minor differences. If you do well against one, you'll do well against the other.

35-65
I think this is Zelda's only time where Din's fire is used in this Matchup. LOL

Zelda actually gets REALLY good use of Din's Fire against DDD and the Ice Climbers. And the move actually isn't horrible against Metaknight either.

 

[Terodactyl Yelnats]

If you mean grab combos with Dthrow, I'm pretty sure you can DI behind her preventing any follow-ups she tries to do unless you fall offstage for that. Plus her grab has like 12 frames start-up in her standing grab and 14 frames in her dash and pivot grab.

Lol. Grab game =/= Grab combos

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Vs

Z1GMA: 37 - 63
Comment: Zelda has her Usmash Combo on us at like 0% - Deals around 30%,
plus possible follow-up, so maybe 40%.
She can Dtilt Lock us from like 40% to like 80%.
Her Grabgame is effective Vs Ganon.
...Outside of this, Zelda has nothing, NOTHING on Ganon.

Her Usmash Combos:
Ganon can do pretty much the same to her at like 0% (via Stomp or Gerudo),
so we're pretty even at that point.

She is one of the easiest characters to juggle in the game.
We outrange and outpriorize her all day.
Gerudo -> iDA is fun when she's at around 95%.
If we get the lead, we shouldn't lose, 'cause she can't approach us really well.

Exalted: 35 - 65
Comment: The major things to look out for are her Usmash and Dtilt.
Nayru's Love is annoying , but that's about it.
Din's Fire has a HUGE blast radius at the cost of being slow and predictable.
She's pretty much helpless once you land a Dair or hit her far enough offstage.

A2ZOMG: 40/60
A boring and tedious matchup. Generally you have to work harder than Zelda because her Smashes are really stupid, but you have little to lose by waiting her out. Then juggling her and edgeguarding her is pretty awesome. This matchup in many ways is like going against Lucario, with minor differences. If you do well against one, you'll do well against the other.

Supreme Dirt: 45:55
This is annoying. It's easy compared to most matchups. Generally, you knock her into the air and she's used her doublejump, just FAir, BAir, or UAir, get her offstage, and she loses a stock because she's so easy to edgeguard. Don't let yourself fall into a DTilt lock, and avoiding USmash should go without saying. You must approach, she can camp you all day with Din's, but she doesn't have many options to prevent you from doing so. If you're good at spacing, this should be fairly easy to win.

 

[Makke]

...................

 

[Fuujin]

Z1GMA: 37 - 63
Comment: Zelda has her Usmash Combo on us at like 0% - Deals around 30%,
plus possible follow-up, so maybe 40%.
She can Dtilt Lock us from like 40% to like 80%.
Her Grabgame is effective Vs Ganon.
...Outside of this, Zelda has nothing, NOTHING on Ganon.

Her Usmash Combos:
Ganon can do pretty much the same to her at like 0% (via Stomp or Gerudo),
so we're pretty even at that point.

She is one of the easiest characters to juggle in the game.
We outrange and outpriorize her all day.
Gerudo -> iDA is fun when she's at around 95%.
If we get the lead, we shouldn't lose, 'cause she can't approach us really well.

Exalted: 35 - 65
Comment: The major things to look out for are her Usmash and Dtilt.
Nayru's Love is annoying , but that's about it.
Din's Fire has a HUGE blast radius at the cost of being slow and predictable.
She's pretty much helpless once you land a Dair or hit her far enough offstage.

A2ZOMG: 40/60
A boring and tedious matchup. Generally you have to work harder than Zelda because her Smashes are really stupid, but you have little to lose by waiting her out. Then juggling her and edgeguarding her is pretty awesome. This matchup in many ways is like going against Lucario, with minor differences. If you do well against one, you'll do well against the other.

Supreme Dirt: 45:55
This is annoying. It's easy compared to most matchups. Generally, you knock her into the air and she's used her doublejump, just FAir, BAir, or UAir, get her offstage, and she loses a stock because she's so easy to edgeguard. Don't let yourself fall into a DTilt lock, and avoiding USmash should go without saying. You must approach, she can camp you all day with Din's, but she doesn't have many options to prevent you from doing so. If you're good at spacing, this should be fairly easy to win.


Makke: ? - ? (Need more EXP)
Usmash is a trap!!
Surprising Dtilt into a quick Dsmash setup good edge guard on us, Powershield Din´s fire and DI away from her Dtilt, it CANT lock u if u use DI lol.
Zelda also have poor Defense (Tall, Light, Foaty)
Ganon outrange Zelda.....but watch out for her utilt!!, is a very good Killing move :S

Fujin:45-55
(50-50 on stages like Halberd or I'm willing to say 55-45 on Lylat and Brinstar)
It's pretty sad how good people seem to think Zelda is..

Seriously you guys need to go re read this.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=11385459&postcount=11
In no way is this match up anywhere near 65-35 in her favor.
I understand the post is supposed to be brief but no one really seems to understand how bad she is.
D tilt lock from 40-80....???
Lrn2DI

*also Din's fire is only good in the IC's match up.
If the Dedede youre playing is ******** and spams waddle dee toss the entire time without realizing Din's fire over powers it, then yes I suppose it is "really good" in that match up.
If the Dedede is smart enough to realize he shouldn't use it in that match up it's useless for the most part.

For real though, she sucks, A LOT. There are people who legitimately beleive she's worse than/just as bad as Ganondorf.

 

[Exalted]

I can't press this enough, but these personal ratios are based on what we've experienced brawling Zeldas.

 

[Z1GMA]

Fuujin, you're right in that Zelda is a horrible character.
But, you're overestimating Ganon.

Both Ganon & Zelda lacks consistency, which is important in Brawl.

 

[Fuujin]

Fuujin, you're right in that Zelda is a horrible character.
But, you're overestimating Ganon.

Both Ganon & Zelda lacks consistency, which is important in Brawl.

But I don't think the distance they have in how much they both suck is 35-65 worthy or anywhere near that ratio.

 

[Vermanubis]

But I don't think the distance they have in how much they both suck is 35-65 worthy or anywhere near that ratio.

You always say Zelda sucks, but no one who's played Ed, Riot, Jujux or Darkmusician sees it. Zelda has limited options, but the options she does have are incredible. Especially against Ganon.

 

[Exalted]

I suppose Verm would know that

 

[Vermanubis]

I suppose Verm would know that

lol jex soke.

 

[Exalted]

cetter lhange.

 

[Fuujin]

You always say Zelda sucks, but no one who's played Ed, Riot, Jujux or Darkmusician sees it. Zelda has limited options, but the options she does have are incredible. Especially against Ganon.

Fill me in on anything she has that's incredible other than transformation.
When you played any of them can you honestly say you were really competent in the MU?
Did you DI her side smash?
U air Din's?
Not approach unless you were behind?
Punish her recovery?

I've beaten several good players with her who don't know how to play against her and think she's incredibly obnoxious to fight (which is tremendously helpful in tournament), based solely on inexperience.
I think every Ganon/Zelda main just thrives off their opponent not knowing the match up.
Honestly that's the only way you manage to get far in tournaments.

 

[Exalted]

*Being the Devil's advocate"

I believe Verm, as the best Ganon and someone who plays top Zelda(s) alot (especially Ed, iirc) should know what she's capable of.

 

[Fuujin]

*Being the Devil's advocate"

I believe Verm, as the best Ganon and someone who plays top Zelda(s) alot (especially Ed, iirc) should know what she's capable of.

 

[Exalted]

say waaaat

 

[Terodactyl Yelnats]

Seriously you guys need to go re read this.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=11385459&postcount=11

I didn't know Zelda was unpublishable, now I can't patent ****

 

[Exalted]

Z1G should move on the next character so we don't have to deal with people trying to force their opinions on others.

 

[Heartstring]

seconded.
although if you come across zelda's that literally spend all their time sweetspotting her side and down aerials. it really is a pain..a guy over here alsmot never misses the sweetspot, its pretty annoying

 

[Makke]

...................

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I've played Rion, and can honestly say Zelda is an extremely legit character. I just don't see her as having a major advantage over any character, but the options she has gives her the ability to do quite a bit.

 

[Z1GMA]

edit: didn't work.

 

[Exalted]

That ain't Falco!

 

[Z1GMA]

Moving on:

Vs

Z1GMA: 45 - 55
Comment: We have all the tools needed to destroy Bowser.
Everytime we land a Gerudo we'll deal around 666% damage.
No, really, Gerudo leads to HUGE damage, every time.

Dtilt outspaces him (Though we can get shieldgrabbed), and sets him up for landchasing
- perferably a chance to Gerudo him
SH Bairs make a pretty solid wall against him.
Stomp >>>>>>>>> Bowser's recovery... Tipman too.

Bowser's grabs ***** us hard, though.
The MU is even, but Bowser has a small advantage.

 

[the king of murder]

Z1GMA: 45 - 55
Comment: We have all the tools needed to destroy Bowser.

Everytime we land a Gerudo we'll deal around 666% damage.
No, really, Gerudo leads to HUGE damage, every time.

Dtilt outspaces him (Though we can get shieldgrabbed), and sets him up for landchasing
- perferably a chance to Gerudo him

SH Bairs make a pretty solid wall against him.

Stomp >>>>>>>>> Bowser's recovery.
...Tipman too.

Bowser's grabs ***** us hard, though.
The MU is even, but Bowser has a small advantage.

the king of murder: 40-60
I ****ing love that MU. Bowser's spot dodge sucks which greatly benefits Ganon. His recovery is bad. You can easily edge hog it if Bowser recovers from a good amount of distance or like Z1g said, Tipman him. I find stomp a really fun move to use against Bowser for sending him in the air(Ganon wrecks Bowser in the air though be careful that you won't get Klawed). Once you get a Gerudo on him, ggs Bowser. I find his GUA easy to PS and his rolls are short and slow.

Bowser has his F-air, GR Chaingrab, his Fire Breath for edgeguarding, his Klaw and his heavy weight makes it difficult for Ganon to K.O him early if we don't gimp him that is.

 

[Fuujin]

honestly say Zelda is an extremely legit character.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Z1GMA: 45 - 55
Comment: We have all the tools needed to destroy Bowser.

Everytime we land a Gerudo we'll deal around 666% damage.
No, really, Gerudo leads to HUGE damage, every time.

Dtilt outspaces him (Though we can get shieldgrabbed), and sets him up for landchasing
- perferably a chance to Gerudo him

SH Bairs make a pretty solid wall against him.

Stomp >>>>>>>>> Bowser's recovery.
...Tipman too.

Bowser's grabs ***** us hard, though.
The MU is even, but Bowser has a small advantage.

the king of murder: 40-60
I ****ing love that MU. Bowser's spot dodge sucks which greatly benefits Ganon. His recovery is bad. You can easily edge hog it if Bowser recovers from a good amount of distance or like Z1g said, Tipman him. I find stomp a really fun move to use against Bowser for sending him in the air(Ganon wrecks Bowser in the air though be careful that you won't get Klawed). Once you get a Gerudo on him, ggs Bowser. I find his GUA easy to PS and his rolls are short and slow.

Bowser has his F-air, GR Chaingrab, his Fire Breath for edgeguarding, his Klaw and his heavy weight makes it difficult for Ganon to K.O him early if we don't gimp him that is.

Supreme Dirt: 55:45
I actually believe this to be positive. Bowser is bad. Really, really bad. He has a grab release, can pretend to be Marth with FAir, and Fire Breath. Klaw gets a mention, and being extremely heavy as well, but Bowser is bad.

If he's recovering, a spaced FSmash if he Fortresses onto the stage, otherwise just spike him, it's really, really easy. One Gerudo pretty much guarantees you getting him to kill percentage. Play this matchup carefully. Try to avoid going offstage, you will take quite a bit coming back. Remember that if he's in the air, his UAir is incredibly dangerous. Think Skull Crush Punch with vertical knockback.

It's roughly even, I give us a slight advantage due to us being pretty much guaranteed a kill after a Flame Choke.

GTFO.

 

[Z1GMA]

Supreme Dirt: 55:45

I like this.
Honestly.

 

[Exalted]

Z1GMA: 45 - 55
Comment: We have all the tools needed to destroy Bowser.

Everytime we land a Gerudo we'll deal around 666% damage.
No, really, Gerudo leads to HUGE damage, every time.

Dtilt outspaces him (Though we can get shieldgrabbed), and sets him up for landchasing
- perferably a chance to Gerudo him

SH Bairs make a pretty solid wall against him.

Stomp >>>>>>>>> Bowser's recovery.
...Tipman too.

Bowser's grabs ***** us hard, though.
The MU is even, but Bowser has a small advantage.

the king of murder: 40-60
I ****ing love that MU. Bowser's spot dodge sucks which greatly benefits Ganon. His recovery is bad. You can easily edge hog it if Bowser recovers from a good amount of distance or like Z1g said, Tipman him. I find stomp a really fun move to use against Bowser for sending him in the air(Ganon wrecks Bowser in the air though be careful that you won't get Klawed). Once you get a Gerudo on him, ggs Bowser. I find his GUA easy to PS and his rolls are short and slow.

Bowser has his F-air, GR Chaingrab, his Fire Breath for edgeguarding, his Klaw and his heavy weight makes it difficult for Ganon to K.O him early if we don't gimp him that is.

Supreme Dirt: 55:45
I actually believe this to be positive. Bowser is bad. Really, really bad. He has a grab release, can pretend to be Marth with FAir, and Fire Breath. Klaw gets a mention, and being extremely heavy as well, but Bowser is bad.

If he's recovering, a spaced FSmash if he Fortresses onto the stage, otherwise just spike him, it's really, really easy. One Gerudo pretty much guarantees you getting him to kill percentage. Play this matchup carefully. Try to avoid going offstage, you will take quite a bit coming back. Remember that if he's in the air, his UAir is incredibly dangerous. Think Skull Crush Punch with vertical knockback.

It's roughly even, I give us a slight advantage due to us being pretty much guaranteed a kill after a Flame Choke.

Exalted: 47-53
Comment: Pretty much what these guys have already said, Gerudos and Thunderstomps spell disaster for Bowser. The major threats in this MU are FAirs, Fire Breath edgeguard and GR -> Jab/Tilt shenanigans. Bowser's Klaw is a nuisance, especially if the player is good at reading you. His recovery easily gets shot down by our Thunderstomp.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Z1GMA: 45 - 55
Comment: We have all the tools needed to destroy Bowser.

Everytime we land a Gerudo we'll deal around 666% damage.
No, really, Gerudo leads to HUGE damage, every time.

Dtilt outspaces him (Though we can get shieldgrabbed), and sets him up for landchasing
- perferably a chance to Gerudo him

SH Bairs make a pretty solid wall against him.

Stomp >>>>>>>>> Bowser's recovery.
...Tipman too.

Bowser's grabs ***** us hard, though.
The MU is even, but Bowser has a small advantage.

the king of murder: 40-60
I ****ing love that MU. Bowser's spot dodge sucks which greatly benefits Ganon. His recovery is bad. You can easily edge hog it if Bowser recovers from a good amount of distance or like Z1g said, Tipman him. I find stomp a really fun move to use against Bowser for sending him in the air(Ganon wrecks Bowser in the air though be careful that you won't get Klawed). Once you get a Gerudo on him, ggs Bowser. I find his GUA easy to PS and his rolls are short and slow.

Bowser has his F-air, GR Chaingrab, his Fire Breath for edgeguarding, his Klaw and his heavy weight makes it difficult for Ganon to K.O him early if we don't gimp him that is.

Supreme Dirt: 55:45
I actually believe this to be positive. Bowser is bad. Really, really bad. He has a grab release, can pretend to be Marth with FAir, and Fire Breath. Klaw gets a mention, and being extremely heavy as well, but Bowser is bad.

If he's recovering, a spaced FSmash if he Fortresses onto the stage, otherwise just spike him, it's really, really easy. One Gerudo pretty much guarantees you getting him to kill percentage. Play this matchup carefully. Try to avoid going offstage, you will take quite a bit coming back. Remember that if he's in the air, his UAir is incredibly dangerous. Think Skull Crush Punch with vertical knockback.

It's roughly even, I give us a slight advantage due to us being pretty much guaranteed a kill after a Flame Choke.

Exalted: 47-53
Comment: Pretty much what these guys have already said, Gerudos and Thunderstomps spell disaster for Bowser. The major threats in this MU are FAirs, Fire Breath edgeguard and GR -> Jab/Tilt shenanigans. Bowser's Klaw is a nuisance, especially if the player is good at reading you. His recovery easily gets shot down by our Thunderstomp.

A2ZOMG: 5/5
To be honest, I think Ganon does actually win this matchup on some stages. And I'm with Supreme Dirt that this matchup may in fact possibly be 55/45 Ganon. This is by far his best matchup, and Bowser is an awful character who realistically is close to the same tier as Ganon.

The most Bowser really has on Ganon is some grab release stuff (shouldn't kill you that early unless your DI is terrible), and his Jab is annoying. Ganon however can compete well with Bowser's spacing with D-tilt and aerials. Outside of that Ganon just controls Bowser much better when he's in control. He juggles Bowser better, he can techchase Bowser quite well, and most importantly he edgeguards Bowser MUCH better than the other way around.

Bowser literally should never make it back to the stage if you are good at edgeguarding him. Ganon's options for utterly destroying Bowser's recovery are frankly beyond overkill. Watch Ijosh's combo video "And now at the bottom" if you need to see an example of how to edgeguard Bowser. All of Ganon's aerials just flat out beat Bowser's recovery, which keep in mind, Bowser's Up-b is in fact NOT invincible on startup. If by some remote chance he even does make it to the ledge, you still can punish him extremely hard on reaction no matter how he gets up from the ledge.

 

[Terodactyl Yelnats]

Z1GMA: 45 - 55
Comment: We have all the tools needed to destroy Bowser.

Everytime we land a Gerudo we'll deal around 666% damage.
No, really, Gerudo leads to HUGE damage, every time.

Dtilt outspaces him (Though we can get shieldgrabbed), and sets him up for landchasing
- perferably a chance to Gerudo him

SH Bairs make a pretty solid wall against him.

Stomp >>>>>>>>> Bowser's recovery.
...Tipman too.

Bowser's grabs ***** us hard, though.
The MU is even, but Bowser has a small advantage.

the king of murder: 40-60
I ****ing love that MU. Bowser's spot dodge sucks which greatly benefits Ganon. His recovery is bad. You can easily edge hog it if Bowser recovers from a good amount of distance or like Z1g said, Tipman him. I find stomp a really fun move to use against Bowser for sending him in the air(Ganon wrecks Bowser in the air though be careful that you won't get Klawed). Once you get a Gerudo on him, ggs Bowser. I find his GUA easy to PS and his rolls are short and slow.

Bowser has his F-air, GR Chaingrab, his Fire Breath for edgeguarding, his Klaw and his heavy weight makes it difficult for Ganon to K.O him early if we don't gimp him that is.

Supreme Dirt: 55:45
I actually believe this to be positive. Bowser is bad. Really, really bad. He has a grab release, can pretend to be Marth with FAir, and Fire Breath. Klaw gets a mention, and being extremely heavy as well, but Bowser is bad.

If he's recovering, a spaced FSmash if he Fortresses onto the stage, otherwise just spike him, it's really, really easy. One Gerudo pretty much guarantees you getting him to kill percentage. Play this matchup carefully. Try to avoid going offstage, you will take quite a bit coming back. Remember that if he's in the air, his UAir is incredibly dangerous. Think Skull Crush Punch with vertical knockback.

It's roughly even, I give us a slight advantage due to us being pretty much guaranteed a kill after a Flame Choke.

Exalted: 47-53
Comment: Pretty much what these guys have already said, Gerudos and Thunderstomps spell disaster for Bowser. The major threats in this MU are FAirs, Fire Breath edgeguard and GR -> Jab/Tilt shenanigans. Bowser's Klaw is a nuisance, especially if the player is good at reading you. His recovery easily gets shot down by our Thunderstomp.

A2ZOMG: 5/5
To be honest, I think Ganon does actually win this matchup on some stages. And I'm with Supreme Dirt that this matchup may in fact possibly be 55/45 Ganon. This is by far his best matchup, and Bowser is an awful character who realistically is close to the same tier as Ganon.

The most Bowser really has on Ganon is some grab release stuff (shouldn't kill you that early unless your DI is terrible), and his Jab is annoying. Ganon however can compete well with Bowser's spacing with D-tilt and aerials. Outside of that Ganon just controls Bowser much better when he's in control. He juggles Bowser better, he can techchase Bowser quite well, and most importantly he edgeguards Bowser MUCH better than the other way around.

Bowser literally should never make it back to the stage if you are good at edgeguarding him. Ganon's options for utterly destroying Bowser's recovery are frankly beyond overkill. Watch Ijosh's combo video "And now at the bottom" if you need to see an example of how to edgeguard Bowser. All of Ganon's aerials just flat out beat Bowser's recovery, which keep in mind, Bowser's Up-b is in fact NOT invincible on startup. If by some remote chance he even does make it to the ledge, you still can punish him extremely hard on reaction no matter how he gets up from the ledge.

Terodactyl Yelnats: 55:45

One tipman, one tipman is all you ever need after he uses his double jump. Bowser loses all momentum after being hit and will never gets back to the ledge when edgehogged.

Can you say flipman? Flipman is undoubtedly the best thing in this entire Match Up along with sideB. When Bowser is recovering we either have to ledgedrop and uair to gimp him easily, or get up if he tries to land on the stage. Flipman solves both these problems. You get to hit him with uair and land on the stage, or land on the stage to punish his landing. The vertical hitbox outranges his fair anyway, and he will NOT airdodge offstage.

If he's further away from the stage to not get hit by flipman uair, just ledge jump and double jump away to uair.

Also is you get him in a gerudo at the edge of the stage, you have so much opportunity for ****. He either get up attacks or gets hit. fsmash will hit him where ever he goes. Roll behind/ forward and get up all get hit by fsmash. His get up attack is slow and has a unique start up animation that you can powershield easily. If you predict his get up attack and powershield it just sideB him again and laugh, laugh harder than ever before.

 

[Z1GMA]

Moving on:

Vs

Vid: Z1gma(Fox) Vs Tonsana(Ganon)
This match is from 2008, I think, lol.

Z1GMA: 30 - 70
Comment: Fox ***** us in Close Range and Long Range
- We **** him in Middle Range and in the air.

He's quick and can shut us down with his fast attacks.
Don't get stuck in his Utilt Combos at low%, as they'll deal 40%+.
His Usmash kills us at around 115%.

His lasers will deal a little damage, but that's pretty much it.
He's not Falco, ya know.

 

[Heartstring]

Vs

Vid: Z1gma(Fox) Vs Tonsana(Ganon)
This match is from 2008, I think, lol.

Z1GMA: 30 - 70
Comment: Fox ***** us in Close Range and Long Range
- We **** him in Middle Range and in the air.

He's quick and can shut us down with his fast attacks.
Don't get stuck in his Utilt Combos at low%, as they'll deal 40%+.
His Usmash kills us at around 115%.

His lasers will deal a little damage, but that's pretty much it.
He's not Falco, ya know.

G~P: 70-30.
typically fox is a good character with a glaring weakness that only a few characters can take advantage of truly. sadly ganon is not one of those characters, which means that fox can cause serious problems for us, his u-smash is far too powerful for a vulpine creature, which kills us about 120% with DI.
the one thing that makes this slightly bearable is the face that d-air will destroy fox if we can actually ladn it, and the fact that his lasers don't stun.
if we get in the right position, we can chain d-tilt's till a relatively high percentage. and because of his insane fall speed it appears offstage tipman gmping is a pretty effective way of fox-hunting
edit: i almost forgot, his stupidly high speed means hell be moving around us and we can hardly keep up. also his d-air approaches are extremely hard for us to block/punish

 

[A2ZOMG]

Vid: Z1gma(Fox) Vs Tonsana(Ganon)
This match is from 2008, I think, lol.

Z1GMA: 30 - 70
Comment: Fox ***** us in Close Range and Long Range
- We **** him in Middle Range and in the air.

He's quick and can shut us down with his fast attacks.
Don't get stuck in his Utilt Combos at low%, as they'll deal 40%+.
His Usmash kills us at around 115%.

His lasers will deal a little damage, but that's pretty much it.
He's not Falco, ya know.

G~P: 30-70 (EDITED FOR CLARITY).
typically fox is a good character with a glaring weakness that only a few characters can take advantage of truly. sadly ganon is not one of those characters, which means that fox can cause serious problems for us, his u-smash is far too powerful for a vulpine creature, which kills us about 120% with DI.
the one thing that makes this slightly bearable is the face that d-air will destroy fox if we can actually ladn it, and the fact that his lasers don't stun.
if we get in the right position, we can chain d-tilt's till a relatively high percentage. and because of his insane fall speed it appears offstage tipman gmping is a pretty effective way of fox-hunting
edit: i almost forgot, his stupidly high speed means hell be moving around us and we can hardly keep up. also his d-air approaches are extremely hard for us to block/punish

A2ZOMG: 40/60
Fox isn't that bad for Ganon. You lose little by waiting in this matchup, while almost all of Fox's kills require you to first make a mistake that is either whiffing or failing to angle your shield correctly. And the key thing is almost all of his kill moves and KO setups are unsafe on block. Due to Fox's low horizontal air mobility and low range, he generally is easy to punish on block, and this is a matchup where your shieldgrab is VERY useful.

Thunderstorming is great in this matchup as long as you aren't too predictable with it. He's not exactly very good at punishing it. Flame Choke combos are awesome on Fox and not unreasonably hard to set up due to his low range. Waiting in Dash Attack range is a good way to pressure him. Also edgeguarding him is low risk and high reward. You don't have to take too many risks to get into Fox's comfort zone and pressure him into making mistakes. The only reason why Ganon loses is pretty much just because of lasers by default giving Fox the lead.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I have 0 Fox MU experience, gonna have to sit another one out.