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Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

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Nekoo

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Sakurai, plz

How can we hype responsibly if you not once, but twice, hype this sgit up.
Yeah, and the fact that he talk about Celebratiom of Gaming.
God damnit, why is he hyping me up....please don't ve Cinderace. I beg you Sakurai.
 

Guybrush20X6

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Also Double post but.


One last celebration of gaming.
I'm probably reading too much into this but "one last celebration of gaming" says to me that it's gotta be something big.

And what bigger gaming franchise is there than

?
 

Hydreigonfan01

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Also Double post but.


One last celebration of gaming.
I've said this before but I'm really thinking this is going to be some massive character with how much they're hyping this up. No, I don't think it's Sora.

Not sure who it could be though.
 

The Stoopid Unikorn

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I will say this, calling it a celebration of gaming once more is funny as it implies that once again, "No it has to all be low key Nintendo characters because pass 1 took all the budget" is gonna get blown the **** out
Or it'd be hilarious in hindsight because we'd get some lowkey first-party. :4pacman:
 

Guybrush20X6

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I've said this before but I'm really thinking this is going to be some massive character with how much they're hyping this up. No, I don't think it's Sora.

Not sure who it could be though.
Well in terms of massive characters there is Master Chief, there is Crash Bandicoot, there's the dreaded Fortnite rep, a second Sonic character and the best selling computer game franchise of all time, The Sims.
 

Flyboy

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My gut is saying Waluigi or a pick like Ayumi Tachibana.

My heart is saying Sora, Master Chief, Lara Croft, Phoenix Wright.

But more than anything, more than the identity of the final fighter, I'm just thinking about how much I'm going to miss all this. I've grown and changed a lot and been through a lot during the Ultimate cycle. I owe this whole speculation period a lot for getting me through some of the darkest times in my life. I've been delighted in different ways for every character and every phase of speculation and what I want more than anything following the final fighter is to sit back and look at the completed mural and smile, no matter who it is. This game is a miracle and I can't wait to keep playing it.
 

PLATINUM7

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Can't believe this'll be our second fighter to have Fly Me To The Moon get shafted in the OST


EDIT: WAIT BAYO WAS LAST FOR SMASH 4 TOO YOU'RE ON TO SOMETHING
Sakurai talked about avoiding Evangelion spoilers earlier this year.

Oh **** we really have figured this out.
 

Jondolio

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I didn't vote for Joker because the trailer titled "the masked rebel" isn't the same as his TGA trailer but that was the greatest one
Voted for Banjo, Sephiroth, and Kazuya. Banjo's was wholesome, Sephiroth's was awesome, and Kazuya's was just really funny.
The last fighter is to shill N64 online.
aw yeah baby time to beat up incineroar while vibing to the 3 AM depression song
 

Hydreigonfan01

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Wait a minute...
What other franchise getting in Smash would be a big enough celebration of gaming then GTA? GTA was considered near impossible for a multiple of reasons but Sakurai has shattered our reasons and theories multiple times over at this point. GTA is also ****ing huge, like the second biggest Western franchise huge (Only smaller then Call of Duty) and it's also popular in Japan.

He's going to follow the Smash train.
 
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The Stoopid Unikorn

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Wait a minute...
What other franchise getting in Smash would be a big enough celebration of gaming then GTA? GTA was considered near impossible for a multiple of reasons but Sakurai has shattered our reasons and theories multiple times over at this point. GTA is also ****ing huge, like the biggest Western franchise huge and it's also popular in Japan.

He's going to follow the Smash train.
If it's CJ and the trailer isn't named "Here We Go Again", I'm asking for a refund :4pacman:
 

Cutie Gwen

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Didn't we never figure out what that Mecha figurine Sakurai bought was for



:troll:
That fake fanpoll with a Gundam in the top 10 most requested characters gonna look real stupid after all. Also smh the true Hideaki Anno rep is gonna be a shill pick


Wow this is the second time I get to post this while being on topic here huh
 

LAA9000

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For me, the presentation starts at 15:00. Sounds like a perfect time to air it, right?

Problem is, I finish school at 16:00, which means I'll barely miss the livestream and have to make do with watching it on demand. By that time, Nintendo will have changed the title and thumbnail to reflect the fighter announced in it. This leaves me having to conduct a world-class spy operation of:
  1. Muting social media the morning before the reveal
  2. Saving the link to the livestream
  3. Clicking the link in the afternoon once I return home
  4. Entering fullscreen while shutting my eyes so the title and recommendations don't spoil it
  5. Skipping the minutes of nothing at the start while not looking at the top of the screen because the title keep popping up
Unless my Spanish teacher lets me watch a Smash reveal in her class (I doubt she would), or I'm forced to self-isolate (I wouldn't wish that on anyone), I have to make do with what I can.

Or maybe I'm just taking a video game reveal too seriously.
 

waddledeeonredyoshi

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Also Double post but.


One last celebration of gaming.
Sakurai tweeting in english. "Let your imagination run wild" and "celebration of gaming".

None of that gives of Gen 8 Pokemon energy.

So that's why it probably will be one.:4pacman:
 

The Stoopid Unikorn

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For me, the presentation starts at 15:00. Sounds like a perfect time to air it, right?

Problem is, I finish school at 16:00, which means I'll barely miss the livestream and have to make do with watching it on demand. By that time, Nintendo will have changed the title and thumbnail to reflect the fighter announced in it. This leaves me having to conduct a world-class spy operation of:
  1. Muting social media the morning before the reveal
  2. Saving the link to the livestream
  3. Clicking the link in the afternoon once I return home
  4. Entering fullscreen while shutting my eyes so the title and recommendations don't spoil it
  5. Skipping the minutes of nothing at the start while not looking at the top of the screen because the title keep popping up
Unless my Spanish teacher lets me watch a Smash reveal in her class (I doubt she would), or I'm forced to self-isolate (I wouldn't wish that on anyone), I have to make do with what I can.

Or maybe I'm just taking a video game reveal too seriously.
I'm in the same boat as you, except it's at 10 for me and I work 8 to 5.

At least, I have a lunch break, so not all is doom and gloom......as long as my phone battery lasts.
 
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Guybrush20X6

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For me, the presentation starts at 15:00. Sounds like a perfect time to air it, right?

Problem is, I finish school at 16:00, which means I'll barely miss the livestream and have to make do with watching it on demand. By that time, Nintendo will have changed the title and thumbnail to reflect the fighter announced in it. This leaves me having to conduct a world-class spy operation of:
  1. Muting social media the morning before the reveal
  2. Saving the link to the livestream
  3. Clicking the link in the afternoon once I return home
  4. Entering fullscreen while shutting my eyes so the title and recommendations don't spoil it
  5. Skipping the minutes of nothing at the start while not looking at the top of the screen because the title keep popping up
Unless my Spanish teacher lets me watch a Smash reveal in her class (I doubt she would), or I'm forced to self-isolate (I wouldn't wish that on anyone), I have to make do with what I can.

Or maybe I'm just taking a video game reveal too seriously.
The way around that is to have someone you trust set up the video, full screen it and hold their hand over the title at the top until it fades.
 

The Stoopid Unikorn

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The way around that is to have someone you trust set up the video, full screen it and hold their hand over the title at the top until it fades.
Or he could use his own hand to cover it if he doesn't trust anyone. :4pacman:

But honestly, I've come to terms with not being able to see it live, so I kinda stopped caring about being spoiled the identity of Challenger 11, as long as everything else is unspoiled.
 
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SKX31

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Day 10: Pyra/Mythra :ultpyra::ultmythra:

I remember waking up the morning the February 2021 Nintendo Direct was announced, doubting the announcement I was seeing on my phone. After all, it had been since September 2019 that we got a standard Nintendo direct, so I thought standard Nintendo Directs as we knew them were a thing of the past. Boy, was I glad to be wrong. Not only that, but the announcement promised the reveal of the next Smash Ultimate DLC character, making me even more excited about it. Of course, when that direct finally aired, the character that was revealed ended up being the Aegis (Pyra/Mythra).

Pyra and Mythra were characters I didn't particularly want in the game, but they looked very cool. I’ve mentioned outside of these forums that a stance change character would be a great addition to the game, and a character like Pyra/Mythra was exactly what I was looking for. I felt that Xenoblade 2 deserved a rep as well, so the reveal went better for me than I expected. Not only that, Pyra and Mythra were the second and third DLC newcomers that had spirits in Ultimate’s base game, further reinforcing that spirits did not eliminate a character’s chances for DLC. It managed to get even better after they came out, as they felt really good to play when I picked them up for the first time (mostly because they’re easy to play, but I digress). Pyra and Mythra ended up becoming powerful characters in their own right as well, with players nowadays placing them somewhere in the Top 3 and them even being a candidate for the best character in the game.
Okay, so :ultpyra: / :ultmythra: . A very tumultuos journey from the speculation side. "What?! I thought I was gonna be in Smash!" Mythra's sudden appearance.

Friendship.

As the above indicates, while Pyra was a popular candidate within the speculation scene... it was with Rex. Mythra wasn't as much in the picture really. And this rollercoaster did not really cease with their reveal - not just because of the fact that they were revealed without Rex, but for a myriad of other reasons - related to XC2 or otherwise. Still though, their release period went without issues, and their reputation began to improve. XC2 as a game did recieve a major boost from the inclusion as well, what with copies of the game selling out and several notable streamers picking it up.

Competititively speaking, they established an extremely good reputation early and never looked back. Part of it is because of early tech discoveries, but another major reason is that a couple top-level players swapped to them. Their flagbearer is universally agreed to be Sparg0, a :ultcloud: progidy who picked them up as his co-main alongside Cloud. While he already was on the rise during the pandemic since he sat atop the Wi-Fi Warrior Rankings, the Aegis proved to gel with him extremely well: and his results with the Aegis (3rd at two very important tournaments, including a supermajor) is a main reason why he's currently solidifying his claim as a top 10 player. Cosmos is another notable main of theirs, as he's reguarily getting top 8 placings at majors. While it remains to be seen how effective they are, the Aegis are generally agreed to be amongst the Top 10 characters in the game, with quite a few claims that they're Top 3 (although there's a really fuzzy distinction between the two, lets be real).

Their Specials certainly help them here, alongside them complimenting each other via their stats. Pyra has access to Flame Nova, a usually commital if powerful "Get off me!" attack that can be a really good response to some ledge scenarios. Blazing End sees her throwing her sword a set distance - its spin not only covers a huge area, but also is highly damaging. If Pyra can reach the opponent in time it's possible to get a footstool setup. The catch with Blazing End is if it whiffs Pyra can't do much, but Pyra will take that trade off. Prominence Revolt is likewise extremely committal - it does little shield damage and its horizontal drift is lacking - but it has a huge hitbox and extreme power to go along it.

Swap, their shared down B, works much the same as :ultpokemontrainer: . Although with the key caveat that Pyra / Mythra aren't intangible until Frame 6 - unlike PT, whose Mons are intangible instantly (IIRC). This does make swapping between them a little riskier, but it's not a humongous commitment. Pyra's the slow but heavy-hitting of the duo: she might be a mediumweight in the code, but plays like a superheavy. She's the 6th slowest dash speed in the game, for instance (although her air speed is above average, her air acceleration is slightly below average). That said, Pyra does bring loads of power to bear. Mythra is the speedster of the partnership, possessing the 5th fastest running speed and is likewise fast in the air - with the caveat that her full hop height is below average, and her other jump heights average. While her hits are not strong individually - they're excellent at starting / maintaining combos.

Mythra's Specials help to reinforce them. Her Neutral B is Lightning Buster, a chargeable series of slashes that can "trap" opponents in its buzzsaw. I'm not entirely sure if this move needed 15 intangibility frames, but those make its start up difficult to challenge and it regardless is a great combo ender. Photon Edge is the most anime move in all of Smash period - she performs a series of teleporting slashes that's great at racking up damage assuming she hits. The trade off is that it does very little shield damage and is incredibly punishable on whiff, but it has its value regardless. Ray of Punishment / Chroma Dust begins with an upward slash followed by her shooting projectiles of choice to the opponent's face - making it another useful combo ender and decent if not amazing recovery.

Their normals have shared animations, but that does highlight their differences in stats even more. Mythra's D-Tilt excels at starting combos / juggles, Pyra's combo routes are less extensive but nevertheless damaging. Pyra's F-Tilt and U-Tilt work as spacing moves, while Mythra's versions are combo starters / extenders. N-Air is great for both of them - Mythra's a combo extender and sorta good "Get off me!", while Pyra has access to a N-Air like :ultike: 's. Mythra's U-Air is one of the best juggling moves in the game period because of its low risk and high reward, while Pyra's is a good follow up from D-Air and kills pretty early thanks to its generous 2 frames of spiking window. Their Smash Attacks are usually heavily commital, but Mythra's does a good job kill confirming and can in D-Smash's case send at an awkward angle, while Pyra's kill very early. Her U-Smash is (in)famously a potential kill confirm off of D-Air.

Their grab games are decent - their D-Throws are excellent combo starters, while their other throws are mostly used for positional advantage. Mythra has interestingly the stronger throws and can take some more advantage of them. U-Throw is of particular note here since that puts the opponent in a position for continuous U-Air use or Pyra swap.

In particular, Mythra has access to Foresight on her dodges akin to Bat Within - Foresight's delays Mythra's dodge a bit, but if it activates she takes half damage and no knockback, while the victim will be slowed for 36 frames (bit more than half a second). It's an excellent combo breaker if it activates - with the caveat being that it won't activate often in your standard Smash game. Still, given how much Mythra can combo / juggle opponents, it's a welcome aspect of her arsenal.

Still, they aren't without weaknesses. Their primary shared weakness is recovery: Prominence Revolt doesn't have great horizontal movement and doesn't spike like Aether on the way down, making it unsuitable as a sacrifical KO and meaning it can be challenged. Ray of Punishment / Chroma Dust is vurnerable to counters on the ascent and has a tendency to not snap to ledge until the end - making it very vurnerable to edgeguards and 2 frames. Photon Edge likewise doesn't snap until the end. In particular, both Pyra and Mythra heavily dislike semi-spikes that send diagonally down. Their disadvantage is generally poor due to their not-amazing air speed and rather fast fall speed making them susceptible to being comboed / juggled. Mythra doesn't have many answers outside of Foresight and Pyra relies on N-Air / the kinda slow D-Air in these situations. Pyra is liable to being punished on shield, while Mythra really lacks KO confirms outside of her Smash attacks and Lightning Buster, making her KO game rather linear.

Casually, Pyra seems to be the favorite. No surprise there - heavyweights traditionally do really well in this environment since long combos / juggles are nowhere near as common in the casual environment (plus any distractions presumably help heavyweights). Her trademark power does a lot to solidify this, as does her ability to control the stage with Blazing End and normals (especially Smash attacks akin to :ultganondorf: 's). Mythra does have the speed, but she has a pretty steep learning curve initially because her moves do not do a lot of damage individually and the only really beginner friendly moves are Lightning Buster and Photon Edge. Expect to see those two a lot.

Their Challenger Pack is pretty damn good. The stage is one of the better-looking ones, with quite a few cameos and Gramps himself reacting to the surroundings. My main issue is that the stage's right side is uncomfortably close to the blast zone, but still a great stage. The music is pretty good too - now I've not played XC2 (only watched bits and pieces) so I can't comment on which tracks are missing. Still, I definetely don't mind the tracks that got included. As for the Spirits, the major XC2 characters are included and I don't mind that.

All in all, Pyra and Mythra proved to be fun and interesting characters. Their design encourages swapping between them - while I don't believe Mythra auto-wins neutral, she's nevertheless excellent at doing so. She's also great at maintaining advantage for that matter. Pyra does her best work when the duo has the advantage already and she can come in to seal the stocks or otherwise keep the opponent on their toes.

(EDIT: Weird character interaction sidenote: Remember :ultshulk: challenging the duo at the end of the trailer? How would it go? Well, the Aegis seem to have an even matchup vs. Shulk, with quite a lot of volatility. In particular, the Aegis need to watch out for Shulk's Speed / Buster shenaningas since Shulk can match or even exceed the Aegis' reach on their normals, while Shulk has an answer to Mythra's combos in the form of Shield. Oh and Shulk has no problem going deep offstage to KO them that way. On the other hand, Shulk need to be careful not to be blown up quickly thanks to Buster's trade off of taking more damage himself, Foresight, and the Aegis can likewise kill Shulk early if he chooses Buster or Smash at the wrong time... or if he has recently exhausted Shield.)
 
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