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Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

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LAA9000

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Heads up: PracticalBrush12 has started 'predicting' E3 and SGF 2021:
They claim these are predictions and not leaks, but some of them feel too specific to be predictions, and we know their track record with leaks.
 

Shroob

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Heads up: PracticalBrush12 has started 'predicting' E3 and SGF 2021:
They claim these are predictions and not leaks, but some of them feel too specific to be predictions, and we know their track record with leaks.
DDLC Plus

....well that's not a game I'd expect to see at E3.
 

ZelDan

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Heads up: PracticalBrush12 has started 'predicting' E3 and SGF 2021:
They claim these are predictions and not leaks, but some of them feel too specific to be predictions, and we know their track record with leaks.
Wizard with a Gun

Didn't think we'd be getting this in game form but I'm not complaining:

 
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SpectreJordan

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Heads up: PracticalBrush12 has started 'predicting' E3 and SGF 2021:
They claim these are predictions and not leaks, but some of them feel too specific to be predictions, and we know their track record with leaks.
Nothing too outlandish here. I’m also doubting he’ll have anything for Smash, it was like the one thing he didn’t have with the March Direct.
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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If I had a time machine, the only thing I’m doing is hunting down whoever made Cacomallow and making them endure the torment of a thousand ughs.

10,000 Years of Geno discussion! A fitting punishment:4pacman:
I'd rather they just say show their work. Cause it's pretty nice work, but anyone can claim they make a model these days(and making Mii Hats wasn't easy at the time). It'd also help modding way better. The thing is, a claim isn't proof anymore. They need to have a video of how it's done for the claim to be meaningful.

So... that's why nobody came out to claim Cacomallow at this point. They don't have the evidence they actually did it. Cause obviously Nintendo didn't take it down.
 

Staarih

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Heads up: PracticalBrush12 has started 'predicting' E3 and SGF 2021:
They claim these are predictions and not leaks, but some of them feel too specific to be predictions, and we know their track record with leaks.

Anyway, yeah, nothing too special really. I doubt he'll leak any Smash news or maybe Nintendo in general, unless at the very last minute.

Or so I hope. I love to be surprised but I'm also super bad at avoiding/ignoring leaks lol.
 

Twilord

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So it seems we might be getting a double character based on glitch theory.

I don't know what would be funnier in my circles:

Dixie & Kiddy - would drive a pretty well known acquaintance of mine crazy

Gabumon & Agumon - because in my circles that still counts more as me being wrong

Baby Mario & Luigi - the general reaction for the gaming public would be wild

Plusle & Minun - just such a random inclusion, but it would be neat to see them finally exist in Smash
 
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Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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So it seems we might be getting a double character based on glitch theory.

I don't know what would be funnier in my circles:

Dixie & Kiddy - would drive a pretty well known acquaintance of mine crazy

Gabumon & Agumon - because in my circles that still counts more as me being wrong

Baby Mario & Luigi - the general reaction for the gaming public would be wild

Plusle & Minun - just such a random inclusion, but it would be neat to see them finally exist in Smash
If Agumon and Gabumon evolve, they'd also double as Transformation characters. I can't see Agumon show up without evolutions, though. That's literally the most iconic past of Digimon. Partner or not(for a double character), Transformation is going to be important.

They're all Transformation characters if they're not like Ice Climbers, Pikmin & Olimar(though you can run this one solo somewhat easily), and Rosalina & Luma(almost impossible to run solo, since Luma auto-respawns. You can do so for a bit, I guess).

The thing is, with Dixie and Kiddy, the whole point is them switching between each other as a mechanic, so it's a transformation character, not something akin to Ice Climbers etc.
 

Twilord

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If Agumon and Gabumon evolve, they'd also double as Transformation characters. I can't see Agumon show up without evolutions, though. That's literally the most iconic past of Digimon. Partner or not(for a double character), Transformation is going to be important.

They're all Transformation characters if they're not like Ice Climbers, Pikmin & Olimar(though you can run this one solo somewhat easily), and Rosalina & Luma(almost impossible to run solo, since Luma auto-respawns. You can do so for a bit, I guess).

The thing is, with Dixie and Kiddy, the whole point is them switching between each other as a mechanic, so it's a transformation character, not something akin to Ice Climbers etc.

Honestly in both the Digikong and Donkeymon cases I think it would involve a mechanic where you could swap between them.


In Digimon's case it might even be a situation of swapping between Greymon & Gabumon and Garurumon & Agumon. That would actually work to simulate the concept of consequences and of having a duty of care.



In either case it would put just enough of a spin on the mechanics to separate them out from The Ice Climbers while still making perfect sense to use them as a basis.
 

ForsakenM

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Honestly in both the Digikong and Donkeymon cases I think it would involve a mechanic where you could swap between them.


In Digimon's case it might even be a situation of swapping between Greymon & Gabumon and Garurumon & Agumon. That would actually work to simulate the concept of consequences and of having a duty of care.



In either case it would put just enough of a spin on the mechanics to separate them out from The Ice Climbers while still making perfect sense to use them as a basis.
Are the Climbers glitching? And if so, what in particular is this glitch? Sometimes it's WHAT is glitching rather than WHO that is important.

Also, remember that glitches are also not infallible, as when Bayo was having issues it turned out Min Min mostly took from Capt Falcon who had no such thing at the time.
 

WeirdChillFever

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So it seems we might be getting a double character based on glitch theory.

I don't know what would be funnier in my circles:

Dixie & Kiddy - would drive a pretty well known acquaintance of mine crazy

Gabumon & Agumon - because in my circles that still counts more as me being wrong

Baby Mario & Luigi - the general reaction for the gaming public would be wild

Plusle & Minun - just such a random inclusion, but it would be neat to see them finally exist in Smash
My final prediction is locked and loaded: The final two are Lu Bu and Off The Hook
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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Honestly in both the Digikong and Donkeymon cases I think it would involve a mechanic where you could swap between them.


In Digimon's case it might even be a situation of swapping between Greymon & Gabumon and Garurumon & Agumon. That would actually work to simulate the concept of consequences and of having a duty of care.



In either case it would put just enough of a spin on the mechanics to separate them out from The Ice Climbers while still making perfect sense to use them as a basis.
When you shift into other forms, it's a clear transformation. A temporary move like what Pac-Man does isn't the same as full-out transformations. Digimon's whole point is taking another full form, so.

Switching between partners is identical to what transformations are.

To be clear, Transformation character means swapping in gamplay to another full character. If the other character is always active, you likely can't control them. If you can control them, though, it's a bit different. That's often called a Puppet Character. Basically there's three types for multiple characters in some way;

  • Transformation: Directly swaps to another moveset.
  • There's no clear name for having another character onscreen with you that fights with A.I. You don't have that much control in all cases. However, it's clear you still partially control their actions at some point.
  • Puppet Character: You fully control two characters at once. Their A.I., if any, is generally to counterattack once in a while and then come back to you(with or without respawning). These are super simple A.I.
I'm not sure how Garurumon and Gabumon would fight here. Are they going to mirror your movements, but often attack on their own? Or only do stuff when you say so by default? Obviously it's still a transformation character in context, but it entirely depends upon how the A.I. works.
 

Gengar84

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If Agumon and Gabumon evolve, they'd also double as Transformation characters. I can't see Agumon show up without evolutions, though. That's literally the most iconic past of Digimon. Partner or not(for a double character), Transformation is going to be important.

They're all Transformation characters if they're not like Ice Climbers, Pikmin & Olimar(though you can run this one solo somewhat easily), and Rosalina & Luma(almost impossible to run solo, since Luma auto-respawns. You can do so for a bit, I guess).

The thing is, with Dixie and Kiddy, the whole point is them switching between each other as a mechanic, so it's a transformation character, not something akin to Ice Climbers etc.
Dixie and Kiddy do tag in and out but both are always visible on screen and the active Kong can pick up and throw the inactive one so Ice Climbers may still be applicable.

I know Astral Chain had a spirit event but Akira Howard fits an Ice Climber style really well.
 

Twilord

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Are the Climbers glitching? And if so, what in particular is this glitch? Sometimes it's WHAT is glitching rather than WHO that is important.

Also, remember that glitches are also not infallible, as when Bayo was having issues it turned out Min Min mostly took from Capt Falcon who had no such thing at the time.
You are absolutely correct.

When they used a move which causes them to act as one (their spin) it resulted in the teleportation of one of them. Which suggests a glitch with the duo mechanic itself.


My final prediction is locked and loaded: The final two are Lu Bu and Off The Hook

I don't know who Lu Bu is but honestly one of the idol sets from Splatoon would be a very smart inclusion that the rest of us may all be sleeping on.
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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Dixie and Kiddy do tag in and out but both are always visible on screen and the active Kong can pick up and throw the inactive one so Ice Climbers may still be applicable.

I know Astral Chain had a spirit event but Akira Howard fits an Ice Climber style really well.
Transformation doesn't actually refer to offscreen and onscreen. It just refers to having two separate controllable movesets. If you're swapping between characters, not just controlling two at once, it uses the term transformation in general. Though yeah, it is true that it'd be different from the other kinds. This is probably why Dixie couldn't work, because the other character cannot be onscreen and inactive without some issues. Pokemon Trainer themselves are onscreen in cases outside of 8-Player Smash(if I remember that bit right).

Ice Climbers never has you hard control Nana. Her A.I. is supposed to mirror your button inputs as long as she's synced with you. Rosalina & Luma on the other hand are a Puppet Character because Luma always does what Rosalina's button command is, regardless of distance. I don't remember if that's the traditional way a puppet character works, though. But Smash isn't traditional, so. Pikmin & Olimar are a bit different since they're kind of each, as they have their own A.I., but it's way simpler than Nana's, and Olimar himself doesn't have a lot of natural attacks, throwing the Pikmin instead. It's kind of a cross between a double character and a puppet character.
 

WeirdChillFever

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You are absolutely correct.

When they used a move which causes them to act as one (their spin) it resulted in the teleportation of one of them. Which suggests a glitch with the duo mechanic itself.





I don't know who Lu Bu is but honestly one of the idol sets from Splatoon would be a very smart inclusion that the rest of us may all be sleeping on.
Lu Bu is, from what I’ve been told, the head honcho of the Dynasty Warriors series and I want that combat style/button input style in Smash yesterday.
I think Splatoon-related speculation in general is kinda stifled by the whole “Octoling Echo next“ idea. There’s so many fun and popular characters that could make for weirdly unexpected sets. Of course that includes Octoling but that discussion usually ends in “Do we want a perfect Isabelle/Echo as DLC?”
 

ShrimpScampi

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Saw this image dropped in a few /v/ threads as "ye olde hint leak"





There's no text to go along with the image, so I just assume that the idea behind it is the 2 characters main colors being broken down, which, they're obviously Demifiend and Crash.


But it's a "ye old hint" leak and like 99.9% fake


But god I want this outcome lol.
My first thought when I saw that left color scheme was Subaru Natsuki from Re:Zero

I don’t even watch Re:Zero and I can definitely see how it’s Demi-fiend now that you mention it, but that top part looked a lot like Subaru’s jacket lol
 

Twilord

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When you shift into other forms, it's a clear transformation. A temporary move like what Pac-Man does isn't the same as full-out transformations. Digimon's whole point is taking another full form, so.

Switching between partners is identical to what transformations are.

To be clear, Transformation character means swapping in gamplay to another full character. If the other character is always active, you likely can't control them. If you can control them, though, it's a bit different. That's often called a Puppet Character. Basically there's three types for multiple characters in some way;

  • Transformation: Directly swaps to another moveset.
  • There's no clear name for having another character onscreen with you that fights with A.I. You don't have that much control in all cases. However, it's clear you still partially control their actions at some point.
  • Puppet Character: You fully control two characters at once. Their A.I., if any, is generally to counterattack once in a while and then come back to you(with or without respawning). These are super simple A.I.
I'm not sure how Garurumon and Gabumon would fight here. Are they going to mirror your movements, but often attack on their own? Or only do stuff when you say so by default? Obviously it's still a transformation character in context, but it entirely depends upon how the A.I. works.
To clarify my meaning is you would constantly be in control of whichever one is Champion level. Some possible limits include 'you can only swap when they're in range' OR 'you must be grounded to swap'. The main gimmick in either case and for either franchise's duo would be that if one dies you lose the ability to swap.

Having 2 V-Pets at once has been a bit of a design revolution in Digimon, both the most recent World game and the even the throwback Digital Monster Anniversary Model had it added to them; it's proven a very well received upgrade.

Whatever augmentation to your abilities provided by Agumon and Gabumon would be secondary to being able to swap between Greymon and Garurumon.
 
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Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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Half of Ice Climbers' alts: Am I a joke to you?
Unless Popo actually becomes the A.I. in programming, cause I remember those being color changes, not the literal character, then it's a good joke. I'm speaking purely on how the moveset works, not fun alts that emulate the idea of controlling the other. But either way, then you're not hard-controlling Popo in that alt, so it still is the same moveset factor I'm talking about. Nothing legit changes in the context I mean.

To clarify my meaning is you would constantly be in control of whichever one is Champion level. Some possible limits include 'you can only swap when they're in range' OR 'you must be grounded to swap'. The main gimmick in either case and for either franchise's duo would be that if one dies you lose the ability to swap.

Having 2 V-Pets at once has been a bit of a design revolution in Digimon, both the most recent World game and the even the throwback Digital Monster Anniversary Model had it added to them; it's proven a very well received upgrade.

Whatever augmentation to your abilities provided by Agumon and Gabumon would be secondary to being able to swap between Greymon and Garurumon.
This does sound interesting, but I have a feeling it's extremely difficult to implement. It's why I only expect a multi-transformation character via evolution. They have yet to do a Double and Transformation Character at once. I don't think it's impossible or anything, but it could be that it has technical issues.

Either way, after watching Data Squad, where it's very common for GeoGreymon and Gaogamon to team up(Sunflomon barely gets any time to shine on the team...), I can see that kind of fun stuff in action in my mind easily.
 

LiveStudioAudience

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Something I just realized is that given we're this late in the week with no news about it, if there is anything resembling credence to the Switch Pro coming soon speculation (no guarantee of that mind you) then we might actually get it revealed at the E3 presentation. Either that or we see the unusual event of Nintendo showing it off on the weekend or the day before their biggest showcase.

Or it could be that all the leakers/insiders/tech bloggers were all dead wrong about it the whole thing time and we get nothing about for another year. Who knows?
 

osby

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Unless Popo actually becomes the A.I. in programming, cause I remember those being color changes, not the literal character, then it's a good joke. I'm speaking purely on how the moveset works, not fun alts that emulate the idea of controlling the other. But either way, then you're not hard-controlling Popo in that alt, so it still is the same moveset factor I'm talking about. Nothing legit changes in the context I mean.
1623408342516.png


You get to control Nana if you chose their 5th, 6th, 7th and 8th costumes.

They're pretty similar, so I guess it's natural a lot of people don't know this. Still, it's funny when you see people making live commentaries about a match and refer them with wrong names for the entire thing.
 

Gengar84

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Lu Bu is, from what I’ve been told, the head honcho of the Dynasty Warriors series and I want that combat style/button input style in Smash yesterday.
I think Splatoon-related speculation in general is kinda stifled by the whole “Octoling Echo next“ idea. There’s so many fun and popular characters that could make for weirdly unexpected sets. Of course that includes Octoling but that discussion usually ends in “Do we want a perfect Isabelle/Echo as DLC?”
Dynasty Warriors basically has two poster characters, Zhao Yun and Lu Bu. Zhao Yun is the most promoted hero while Lu Bu is the most promoted villain. Basically, they are equivalent to Jin and Heihachi in that way. I would love any Dynasty Warriors character but I’ve always liked Lu Bu much more than Zhao Yun.

With the release of Persona 5 Strikers, there are now four franchises in Smash that have had a Warriors spinoff (Zelda, Fire Emblem, Dragon Quest, and Persona). I think it would be awesome if a Warriors character like Lu Bu was able to make it into Smash. Koei has a great relationship with Nintendo and Warriors games are not only a lot of fun, but actually have some history with characters in Smash. The only issue is the fact that they are based on real people but they are so divorced from their source that they pretty much count as their own character.

This is Lu Bu for those that don’t know who he is. His weapon is a giant halberd.

1623408553491.jpeg
 
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Mamboo07

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Just wondering why do people want western characters in Smash?

(I think it's because there's not much of them)
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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View attachment 318601

You get to control Nana if you chose their 5th, 6th, 7th and 8th costumes.

They're pretty similar, so I guess it's natural a lot of people don't know this. Still, it's funny when you see people making live commentaries about a match and refer them with wrong names for the entire thing.
Though my question is if Popo is the actual A.I. during those. I’m interested in the programming here.
 

LiveStudioAudience

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Just wondering why do people want western characters in Smash?

(I think it's because there's not much of them)
Presumably because many people are fans of Western franchises and think it would be cool/exciting to see them in a crossover game like Smash. I suspect for most, the thinking probably isn't much beyond "I like Halo/Doom/Crash/Rayman/etc) and I like Ultimate, so having mixing both would be awesome."
 
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Rie Sonomura

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Is this a glitch on my end (mobile) or is the totally fake text leak from yesterday back up? Idk why but I can see it in its entirety again
 

Twilord

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This does sound interesting, but I have a feeling it's extremely difficult to implement. It's why I only expect a multi-transformation character via evolution. They have yet to do a Double and Transformation Character at once. I don't think it's impossible or anything, but it could be that it has technical issues.

Completely agree; the thing is the only duo characters that ever get floated in my community tend to be Dixie x Kiddy, and Agumon x Gabumon - I mean at one point so was Rex but that didn't work out.

All of those would be some combo of a transforming duo.

Admittedly the Kongs and the 'Mon are much simpler designs, but I've literally predicted against both of them as duo characters for this reason. - Which is funny to me because if this glitch means anything there is a perfectly possible timeline where my unfalsifiable assertion of 'a Digimon is a noteworthy possibility' is objectively proven right, and I'm still wrong.





I’m getting unreasonably hype. It really seems like there’s so many possibilities for this reveal.

And even if it isn’t someone I like, the last three (Steve, Sephiroth, Mythra) are among my most-played characters. Life is good!


I've gotten my most wanted character in each step of this process.

Base 4 - Shulk; DLC - Bayonetta; Base Ultimate - Inkling; DLC - someone who works as a Torna rep. At this point I can't complain.



But having predictions is more fun, so I might as well declare for one last character. (As you can see, I've done so.)
 
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Gengar84

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Does anyone else have any games they love but they don’t really care for the main character? I’m a huge Tales, Kingdom Hearts, and Xenoblade fan but I never really liked Lloyd, Sora, or Rex very much as characters so I didn’t really care much about any them making it into Smash despite enjoying their games. I feel like I’m in the minority with thinking this way.
 
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WeirdChillFever

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Dynasty Warriors basically has two poster characters, Zhao Yun and Lu Bu. Zhao Yun is the most promoted hero while Lu Bu is the most promoted villain. Basically, they are equivalent to Jin and Heihachi in that way. I would love any Dynasty Warriors character but I’ve always liked Lu Bu much more than Zhao Yun.

With the release of Persona 5 Strikers, there are now four franchises in Smash that have had a Warriors spinoff (Zelda, Fire Emblem, Dragon Quest, and Persona). I think it would be awesome if a Warriors character like Lu Bu was able to make it into Smash. Koei has a great relationship with Nintendo and Warriors games are not only a lot of fun, but actually have some history with characters in Smash. The only issue is the fact that they are based on real people but they are so divorced from their source that they pretty much count as their own character.

This is Lu Bu for those that don’t know who he is. His weapon is a giant halberd.

View attachment 318602
Oooh, getting big Volga Hyrule Warriors vibes from him.

I’m getting unreasonably hype. It really seems like there’s so many possibilities for this reveal.

And even if it isn’t someone I like, the last three (Steve, Sephiroth, Mythra) are among my most-played characters. Life is good!
Yeah, I’m satiated both playstyle-wise and speculation-wise as well. I’m just seeing what’s up for dessert.
 

Speed Weed

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I’m getting unreasonably hype. It really seems like there’s so many possibilities for this reveal.

And even if it isn’t someone I like, the last three (Steve, Sephiroth, Mythra) are among my most-played characters. Life is good!
holy ****ing **** it's groose from the legend of zelda skyward sword for the nintendo wii
 
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