Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Cutie Gwen]

Thats a fair point, though I might have to pull the Mother 3 card on you there.
And as for Hero, I did specify America. I’m part Welsh so forgetting about Europe would be pretty embarrassing.

Oh no Mother 3's the same situation as MK, deliberately not localized, it's just that Sakurai never got the memo it'd stay in Japan as he's said that Lucas was only in due to Sakurai not knowing that there were no plans of localization

Fair point lmao, I'm used to people pretending the series has no presence outside Japan

 

[Momotsuki]

Spoiler: Tall image

Let us have a bit of fun. Make a tier list representing your favorite DLC fighters thus far! Not in terms of competitive viability, simply how much you like the fighters and their inclusions. Mine is seen in the spoiler above.

 

[cothero]

Plus, MK is a gigantic and iconic worldwide franchise, no one can't deny that. Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat are still the most famous fighting game franchises ever and MK has even more general sales than SF. The fact that it didn't was well received by Japan's censorship for its gory nature can of course difficult a character inclusion chances, but it doesn't mean **** in the end.

 

[Momotsuki]

It's always the same people who feel the need to talk down. You know who you are~!
I can't say I'm exactly confident in his odds, but Scorpion would be nifty and anyone supporting him shouldn't let this kind of nastiness make them feel bad about that.
If you respond to this as though it is addressed towards you, that is an admission, just saying!

 

[cothero]

Accidental double post.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Spoiler: Tall image

View attachment 297271

Let us have a bit of fun. Make a tier list representing your favorite DLC fighters thus far! Not in terms of competitive viability, simply how much you like the fighters and their inclusions. Mine is seen in the spoiler above.

Holy ****

Cool

Eh

Yuck



These are the most correct opinions on this site

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

Oh no Mother 3's the same situation as MK, deliberately not localized, it's just that Sakurai never got the memo it'd stay in Japan as he's said that Lucas was only in due to Sakurai not knowing that there were no plans of localization

Oh damn, didn’t know about that. Though Lucas was included as DLC in Smash 4, when it was quite clear Mother 3 wasn’t looking too hot. Perhaps another Hero Banjo situation is possible, 2 characters known in vastly different places getting revealed at once.

 

[Arcanir]

I don’t really see a character not having representation in a certain country as a big issue.
Banjo has basically no presence in non english speaking places, like at all.
Hero isn’t known much in america, the only semi known character was 8.
So I think Scorpion and other characters not known in certain places have a far better chance than people give them.

Banjo-Kazooie sold over 400K in Japan and his reveal was reportedly very popularly received.

DQ is not as popular in the west as it is in Japan, but it does have more consistent releases, DQ8 was considered a success, DQ9 furthered that, and DQ11 doubled its sales even before the Switch version.

Mortal Kombat hasn't had that. It has trouble getting its games localized there due to the gore and violence being offputting to the audience in general, and the games that did release there tend not to sell well so it's not considered worth investing in the market. That's a major hurdle as we've had situations where characters are outright rejected due to a lack of presence in other regions (ex. Takamaru) or if they were included, had caveats (ex. Lucas, who had Ness return as a response to Mother 3 not getting localized). That is going to be its biggest barrier to break through to get included, especially when we're talking about a game that's developed in the region where Mortal Kombat is at its weakest.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

I know you're an anime fan tpc, don't pretend that they don't get gory as **** there with their anime.


In all seriousness, it can't be worse than the likes of 'I use hardcore BDSM combined with guillotines until everything becomes a gory explosion'. I don't really care for MK but this is a weak ass excuse, especially when A: MK's had non-gory stuff even rather recently, and B: You have a perfect reason to shut down an MK character by pointing out the deliberate decision not to localize the games in Japan. That's a much better argument than banning blood or some ****

Bayonetta had very special circumstances that facilitated her inclusion (Nintendo straight up funding Bayonetta 2 & 3) and the capability for her moveset to be toned down.

While the Japanese do create media with blood and gore (insensitivity doesn't mean complete revulsion or opposition), it's never excessive nor is it a focus (except in fringe cases) whereas in the case of Mortal Kombat it is both of those. I don't think it's a series Nintendo would want to advertise nor is it a series that could be brought to Smash given how significant of a focus the blood and gore is.

I didn't know that the series wasn't officially localized in Japan, however. That's a significant blow if I've ever heard one.

But there's more to Mortal Kombat than the blood and gore though

If that's all it had it would have never been so much of the success it is today. The Character designs, Lore, even some of the Campyness, and more are reason Mortal Kombat still lives on. The Story mode in Fighting games was something that MK9 was a pioneer of, and is something other Fighting games these days try to Replicate

Anyway I Imagine Scorpion would be for more of the Mature Audience rather than geared towards Kids. Steve is a Character that heavily appeals to Kids in all regions (granted it also appeals to everyone, but you know).

Like I said, Nintendo and WB have talked before in regards to MK11 being on the Switch, and it was Nintendo that suggested there's an audience for Mortal Kombat. Now I Imagine that was Nintendo of America that was in the forefront of the conversation, but there's also the fact that I think Nintendo of JP is not the only branch of Nintendo that has a voice in Character choosing for Smash. Nintendo of America and Nintendo of Europe, despite mostly dealing with Localization, probably have a good grasp of the American and European audience, among other things, and that is something that is useful to the discussion when discussing potential Smash characters

Except the blood and gore is a major focus. You can say "oh yeah there's so much more to it!" but at the end of the day the increasingly brutal fatalities are a highlight of the series, much more than any other major feature.

And while Nintendo of American and Nintendo of Europe may understand their audiences well, and Nintendo of Japan may consult them (we don't explicitly know if this is the case as far as I'm aware), at the end of the day Nintendo of Japan and Sakurai are the ones calling the shots. I don't imagine Nintendo of Japan even trying for a Mortal Kombat character when there are plenty of other series they can choose from that are actually a thing in Japan.

 

[7NATOR]

Spoiler: Tall image

View attachment 297271

Let us have a bit of fun. Make a tier list representing your favorite DLC fighters thus far! Not in terms of competitive viability, simply how much you like the fighters and their inclusions. Mine is seen in the spoiler above.

I Don't know where you found the Tier List maker, but

S Tier: Sephiroth

A Tier: Hero

B Tier: Min-Min, Arsene Joker

C Tier: Joker, Terry, Byleth, Steve

C- Tier: Banjo, Plant

It's always the same people who feel the need to talk down. You know who you are~!
I can't say I'm exactly confident in his odds, but Scorpion would be nifty and anyone supporting him shouldn't let this kind of nastiness make them feel bad about that.
If you respond to this as though it is addressed towards you, that is an admission, just saying!

I mean, from what I noticed, It didn't seem like people were talking down, just giving out their opinions about how they don't feel Scorpion is Likely addition

I can't get mad at that. I Disagree with people thinking he's as impossible as it might be made out to be, But it's not like they looking at me as a lesser Speculator or anything.

 

[Lamperouge]

Spoiler: Tall image

View attachment 297271

Let us have a bit of fun. Make a tier list representing your favorite DLC fighters thus far! Not in terms of competitive viability, simply how much you like the fighters and their inclusions. Mine is seen in the spoiler above.

S:
A:
B:
C:
D:

For the record, I actually do like all of these guys and find them fun...well, expect for Plant.

 

[N3ON]

If you get to the point the company doesn't make the game for the region, and the only option is import copies, that's about the lowest rung of the series existing there. Not only will that kind of existence likely not be acknowledged by the likes of Smash, but when people say the game barely exists there they don't mean that your copy will evaporate once you enter Japanese territory.

If you count importing, every game is worldwide. But that's clearly not what people mean.

 

[Cosmic77]

Spoiler: Tall image

View attachment 297271

Let us have a bit of fun. Make a tier list representing your favorite DLC fighters thus far! Not in terms of competitive viability, simply how much you like the fighters and their inclusions. Mine is seen in the spoiler above.

Let's see how many people dismiss my list once they see where Steve and Banjo are.

Characters in tiers are ordered by when the were revealed, not by how much I like them.

S:
A:
B:
C:

We have characters I liked, characters I didn't want but liked, characters I didn't want and am mostly indifferent to, and a character I didn't want.

 

[MagnesD3]

S: Banjo, Sephiroth

A: Terry

B: Steve

C: Hero, Joker

D: Min Min, Pirahna Plant

F: Byleth

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Oh damn, didn’t know about that. Though Lucas was included as DLC in Smash 4, when it was quite clear Mother 3 wasn’t looking too hot. Perhaps another Hero Banjo situation is possible, 2 characters known in vastly different places getting revealed at once.

At that point, Lucas was a veteran, which does change the context as the world already knew who he was and asked for him because "I miss the funny blonde kid from the last game".

Bayonetta had very special circumstances that facilitated her inclusion (Nintendo straight up funding Bayonetta 2 & 3) and the capability for her moveset to be toned down.

While the Japanese do create media with blood and gore (insensitivity doesn't mean complete revulsion or opposition), it's never excessive nor is it a focus (except in fringe cases) whereas in the case of Mortal Kombat it is both of those. I don't think it's a series Nintendo would want to advertise nor is it a series that could be brought to Smash given how significant of a focus the blood and gore is.

I didn't know that the series wasn't officially localized in Japan, however. That's a significant blow

I know it's a big part of the franchise's identity but isn't over the top sexual empowerment a core aspect of Bayonetta yet almost entirely absent in Smash? Especially when MK's willing to tone down gore for other stuff as recent as Injustice 2, it just feels like "I don't like it so it doesn't count compared to the thing I do like"

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

DLC Rankings?
S:
A:
B:
C:

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Mortal Kombat: Competition Edition Release Information for Super Nintendo - GameFAQs

For Mortal Kombat: Competition Edition on the Super Nintendo, the GameFAQs information page shows all known release data and credits.

gamefaqs.gamespot.com

Just to point out, it did get released in Japan overall. The SNES version.

There's no doubt it has a poor presence in Japan, but "never been localized" is actually incorrect.

Mortal Kombat II as well is localized in Japan. The Arcade versions aren't. It's a pretty small amount of localization. And forget the newer games either way. It has a very tiny presence in Japan, but it doesn't lack a fanbase.

Now I do agree with the point that it'd be harder to sell due to having few potential Japanese customers, as that's still the core fanbase of Smash. One thing is if Sakurai is choosing, but he's not. Nintendo is. You can't find the newer games properly available for the systems in Japan, so it wouldn't be a good advertisement choice in itself. I do see Nintendo avoiding the series for Smash, yeah.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

Banjo-Kazooie sold over 400K in Japan and his reveal was reportedly very popularly received.

DQ is not as popular in the west as it is in Japan, but it does have more consistent releases, DQ8 was considered a success, DQ9 furthered that, and DQ11 doubled its sales even before the Switch version.

Mortal Kombat hasn't had that. It has trouble getting its games localized there due to the gore and violence being offputting to the audience in general, and the games that did release there tend not to sell well so it's not considered worth investing in the market. That's a major hurdle as we've had situations where characters are outright rejected due to a lack of presence in other regions (ex. Takamaru) or if they were included, had caveats (ex. Lucas, who had Ness return as a response to Mother 3 not getting localized). That is going to be its biggest barrier to break through to get included, especially when we're talking about a game that's developed in the region where Mortal Kombat is at its weakest.

I wasn’t aware of Banjos apparent popularity. While DQ has been on the rise, its quite clear Heros inclusion was made for eastern audiences rather than western, though DQ undeniably has a growing presence.
MK certainly has less going for it than our current examples, but given the fact we have quite a few similar situations; I standby that MK and others have a better shot than people think.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

At that point, Lucas was a veteran, which does change the context as the world already knew who he was and asked for him because "I miss the funny blonde kid from the last game".

Again, a fair point. Though characters like Wolf got passed over in favor of Lucas, despite having an actual presence in more of the world.

 

[JOJONumber691]

I think I have Something to Contribute to this Conversation, so I might as well mention DFO/DNF due to the upcoming ArcSys Spinoff. It is MASSIVE in South Eastern Asia (including Japan to some extent), and has a plethora of Classes that could make for unique Smash Fighters. My personal standout is the Creator, though it has plenty of others who are just as unique. This series has been trying to broaden it's Western Popularity, so I definitely think a DNF Fighter is certainly a possibility. IMAGINE THE SALT THOUGH!

 

[Garteam]

Doing each tier in order of release rather than preference:
Literally Popped Off: ,
Pretty neat: , , , ,
Didn't do much for me, but are fun enough: , ,
Cool, but I wish it was a different character from the same franchise/game: ,

All in all, I'm pretty satisfied with the DLC packs. There hasn't been a ton of additions that really hyped me up, but there hasn't been anything that has made me regret my purchase or anything like that. I do prefer the additions to Ultimate's base roster more than its DLC, but it was has been far from bad thus far.

 

[7NATOR]

Bayonetta had very special circumstances that facilitated her inclusion (Nintendo straight up funding Bayonetta 2 & 3) and the capability for her moveset to be toned down.

While the Japanese do create media with blood and gore (insensitivity doesn't mean complete revulsion or opposition), it's never excessive nor is it a focus (except in fringe cases) whereas in the case of Mortal Kombat it is both of those. I don't think it's a series Nintendo would want to advertise nor is it a series that could be brought to Smash given how significant of a focus the blood and gore is.

I didn't know that the series wasn't officially localized in Japan, however. That's a significant blow if I've ever heard one.

Except the blood and gore is a major focus. You can say "oh yeah there's so much more to it!" but at the end of the day the increasingly brutal fatalities are a highlight of the series, much more than any other major feature.

And while Nintendo of American and Nintendo of Europe may understand their audiences well, and Nintendo of Japan may consult them (we don't explicitly know if this is the case as far as I'm aware), at the end of the day Nintendo of Japan and Sakurai are the ones calling the shots. I don't imagine Nintendo of Japan even trying for a Mortal Kombat character when there are plenty of other series they can choose from that are actually a thing in Japan.

Yeah, Mortal Kombat isn't banned, so much as it isn't localized for the Japanesse Audience

with that being said, Yes the Blood and Gore is a major focus, and Big Advertising Standpoint of Mortal Kombat, but I'm just saying is that that's not there is to Mortal Kombat, and is not the only Reason Mortal Kombat still lives on today

The Characters (both the MK Characters and Guest Characters), Story Mode, High Production Values, and more are also big things that make Mortal Kombat the success it is today. People don't just like tearing people limb by limb, they love doing it with a Cool Character like Scorpion, or Sub-Zero. They love playing the story mode and paying attention to the lore (for better or for worse) and etc

You could still have Fatalities in Smash. Now they wouldn't be Dismembering Mario or anything like that, but you can still incorporate the more brutal Aspect of Mortal Kombat, kind of like how Ridley is presented as a Brutal Character in Smash. you can also use the campyness that Mortal Kombat has to it's advantage as well. Mortal Kombat isn't serious all the time, it also can have fun at times as well

And as for Nintendo of Japan, I don't think Mortal Kombat would be the First option in mind, but keep in mind that Ed Boon has been a big supporter of Mortal Kombat in Smash. Like you said in your League Paragraph, the support of the 3rd party company goes a long way in securing a Character for Smash. Sakurai even mentions that as a requirement for a 3rd party character. this 3rd party support is also a big Reason Banjo is in the game, because Phil was very supportive of the idea

So even if Nintendo of Japan might not have Mortal Kombat at the top of the list, Ed Boon perhaps starting the conversation could lead to places that could lead to Mortal Kombat characters in Smash. Of course it's not that simple, as you also got to talk to the WB Games higher ups and stuff like that. It also doesn't automatically mean a Character, since Bethesda did probably start the conversation about One of their I.Ps in Smash, and Vault boy is just a Mii costume, with Doomguy no where to be seen

but it's still something that has to be considered and still a very real Possiblity.

 

[ZelDan]

Hype:

Cool:

Meh:

Super meh:

****ing why tho:

 

[JOJONumber691]

Yeah, Mortal Kombat isn't banned, so much as it isn't localized for the Japanesse Audience

with that being said, Yes the Blood and Gore is a major focus, and Big Advertising Standpoint of Mortal Kombat, but I'm just saying is that that's not there is to Mortal Kombat, and is not the only Reason Mortal Kombat still lives on today

The Characters (both the MK Characters and Guest Characters), Story Mode, High Production Values, and more are also big things that make Mortal Kombat the success it is today. People don't just like tearing people limb by limb, they love doing it with a Cool Character like Scorpion, or Sub-Zero. They love playing the story mode and paying attention to the lore (for better or for worse) and etc

You could still have Fatalities in Smash. Now they wouldn't be Dismembering Mario or anything like that, but you can still incorporate the more brutal Aspect of Mortal Kombat, kind of like how Ridley is presented as a Brutal Character in Smash. you can also use the campyness that Mortal Kombat has to it's advantage as well. Mortal Kombat isn't serious all the time, it also can have fun at times as well

And as for Nintendo of Japan, I don't think Mortal Kombat would be the First option in mind, but keep in mind that Ed Boon has been a big supporter of Mortal Kombat in Smash. Like you said in your League Paragraph, the support of the 3rd party company goes a long way in securing a Character for Smash. Sakurai even mentions that as a requirement for a 3rd party character. this 3rd party support is also a big Reason Banjo is in the game, because Phil was very supportive of the idea

So even if Nintendo of Japan might not have Mortal Kombat at the top of the list, Ed Boon perhaps starting the conversation could lead to places that could lead to Mortal Kombat characters in Smash. Of course it's not that simple, as you also got to talk to the WB Games higher ups and stuff like that. It also doesn't automatically mean a Character, since Bethesda did probably start the conversation about One of their I.Ps in Smash, and Vault boy is just a Mii costume, with Doomguy no where to be seen

but it's still something that has to be considered and still a very real Possiblity.

Mortal Kombat is more popular in Japan than people realize... there's another country with a Straight Up Mortal Kombat Ban instead of Japan's Console Ban isn't there? Germany has banned every single Mortal Kombat Title from any and all store fronts. That alone kills Scorpion's chances for me. Especially since, unlike Dragalia's Gacha Ban, this one may as well be an IP Ban.

 

[ROBnWatch]

Spoiler: Tall image

View attachment 297271

Let us have a bit of fun. Make a tier list representing your favorite DLC fighters thus far! Not in terms of competitive viability, simply how much you like the fighters and their inclusions. Mine is seen in the spoiler above.

A disclaimer that each tier in both of these lists is based solely on fighter number order, not necessarily “I like this character in A tier over that character in A tier.”

Spoiler: Initial Reveal

S:
A:
B:
C:
D:
F:

Spoiler: Since Playing

S:
A:
B:
C:
D:

Wow...not much has changed it seems. Lol.

 

[cashregister9]

This list is based on personal hype levels on their release

S:
A:
B:
C:
D:

 

[JOJONumber691]

Also, for the Tier List:

I $!$!@!$!$#!$#!$#!$ CALLED IT!:

Laughed HYSTERICALLY!:

Happy for their fans.:

.......Meh.......:

She's Cute and Legal and all, but why Smash though?:

 

[pinshadow]

Why not.

Top 5 Most Wanted For Ultimate :

Very Cool :

Meh, but at least it's a new franchise :

Why are you here? :

Why are YOU here?, except the rest of your pack should have been base game :

Bleh :

Not Funny, Didn't Laugh :

If we're talking how they are to play, honestly they're all pretty fun except Joker.

 

[Noler_Mass]

****ing why tho:

 

[Lamperouge]

She's Cute and Legal and all, but why Smash though?:

Why does that matter? lol

 

[Speed Weed]

DLC rankerinos

penguinz0 voice WOOOOOOOOOOOO:

pretty frickin' epic:

Cool:

meh:

:

 

[Noler_Mass]

ULTRA MEGA OH MY GOD HYPE:
MEGA HYPE:
HYPE:
HYPE?:
not hype, until I saw their moveset which is HYPE:

 

[TCT~Phantom]

Do I think Scorpion deserves a spot in Smash? Yes. Do I think he is cool? Yes. Do I think he is likely? Nope. Having a soft ban on your games in Japan is a real negative sign at least in my eyes in terms of chance.

Anywho, DLC tiering.

Hype:
Good Picks:
OK:
Meh (Pre Order Bonus tbh so it shouldn't count):
Whyleth:

 

[JOJONumber691]

Why does that matter? lol

ARMS had everything going for it except Gameplay, so while I liked the Character Design, THE LORE, and Backstory a lot, I sincerely didn't like ARMS as a Game, so that automatically made me dislike the idea of it getting a Character in Smash.

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

ARMS had everything going for it except Gameplay, so while I liked the Character Design, THE LORE, and Backstory a lot, I sincerely didn't like ARMS as a Game, so that automatically made me dislike the idea of it getting a Character in Smash.

Okay, but why does her being legal matter?

 

[Noler_Mass]

Bonus base game:

ULTRA MEGA OH MY GOD HYPE:
MEGA HYPE:
(choking back tears) h-h-hype?:
REPLACE WITH TOM NOOK IMMEDIATELY:

 

[Lamperouge]

ARMS had everything going for it except Gameplay, so while I liked the Character Design, THE LORE, and Backstory a lot, I sincerely didn't like ARMS as a Game, so that automatically made me dislike the idea of it getting a Character in Smash.

Okay, but why does it matter if she's legal? It ain't like she's real anyway.

Sorry but I just found that bit funny.

 

[TCT~Phantom]

Okay, but why does it matter if she's legal? It ain't like she's real anyway.

Sorry but I just found that bit funny.

Given how much the Japanese community hates her competitively, she might not be legal in two years /s.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Given how much the Japanese community hates her competitively, she might not be legal in two years /s.

Time to bust this out then.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

It ain't like she's real anyway.

That's what they make you believe /s