Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Louie G.]

I agree that Tails is a probably a possibility that is being slept on quite a bit, but I have a feeling that they're going to put already represented franchises only if there's a big lack of content, which Sonic doesn't really have.

I think this is a fair assumption, but I also believe that assuming this may be yet another fallacy that we see uprooted somehow. Sonic certainly has most of the necessary spirits covered, although Pyra and Mythra show us that we don't really need to add that many. Tikal, Mighty, Ray, Deadly Six, Flickies? Chao? Maybe a Perfect Chaos evolved spirit? There's definitely enough to work with there. Music and stage-wise, Sonic's potential is pretty much limitless.

I have always asserted that Sonic isn't in as poor a situation as people have assumed it to be. But I will admit that it leaves a lot to be desired. It has a fair amount of content, and yet it feels pretty empty. Taking the opportunity to maybe get some of those classic tracks that may have run into legal issues, not unlike the boost in FF7 content, may be something worth looking into on a higher more centralized budget. Bringing in a new stage from a location that isn't a grassland, maybe implementing Dr. Eggman as a stage element. All things considered, Sonic feels quite underexplored. So I think there's at least a case to be made here - one that I was a little bit ignorant about prior, because I wanted to believe in Puyo really badly and it caused me to resent the cries for more Sonic for a bit.

I think your pespective is valid though. I'm just under the impression that it's one of the weaker assumptions primed to be broken, too.

Besides, I personally still think Puyo puyo have pretty big chances. It's probably not going to be the huge e3 announcement, but let's assume that the e3 announcement is a more western character, maybe the final fighter could please more to Japan, which Puyo puyo would fit.

There's still a chance. I'd just rather subvert my expectations elsewhere for the time being so that I don't get my hopes up too much. I don't think the chance is very great, on account of the third parties being more "mass appeal" picks like I mentioned before and Puyo falling into somewhat of a niche. I think if we got a new Sega IP it would be Puyo Puyo, but I lean further toward believing they would double up on Sonic before bringing in anything else.

Pessimistic? Maybe, but I also believe it to be realistic. Sonic is still Sega's bread and butter. I see it panning out just as Sephiroth was prioritized over various other smaller Square Enix IPs. There isn't really another Sega character as big as Tails or Eggman, just as Sephiroth kinda trumped everyone else in his department. We just weren't thinking it was possible to expand on Final Fantasy in any meaningful way.

Because let's face it, Sonic is not only substantially more profitable and successful worldwide than Puyo but also way easier to envision a fighter from. I'm starting to believe we just gotta wait until base game next time around for Sakurai to decide to do something quirky and fun like a puzzle game character again. I'm not sure that's a niche that corporate Nintendo suits are particularly interested in (or creative enough to suggest). DLC has bit a bit too safe in that department if I'm being completely honest.

 

[UltimateCyborgOverlord]

Tails, personally. Laying it out, a new Sonic character is something that makes an increasing amount of sense to me.

- I'm personally anticipating another SEGA character since it is the only company other than SNK with nothing this pass, and how DLC thus far has been companies that were already involved with DLC previously. Pattern susceptible to be broken, but I believe this has a good chance of playing out.

- I've been contemplating which other series could be expanded on, seeing how 3/4 of our DLC characters are from IPs that already had some form of content in Smash (and then half of them were from series that already had characters). With the previous point in mind I began to think about Sonic. Out of SEGA's options, I believe more Sonic makes the most sense - as much as I want Arle to be in, Tails (or Eggman) would just please more people. See below.

- Steve and Sephiroth are mass appeal third parties who would please both the "hardcore" fans and the casuals. The hardcore fans likely will have bought DLC anyway, so I believe the deals this time around are generally bigger more widely popular characters to a general audience. Another Sonic character fits this bill pretty nicely, and has been requested for a particularly long time. I imagine Tails, Knuckles and Shadow all have a pretty solid ballot presence.

- If we were gonna get a Sonic character, E3 would be a good time for it. Sonic is notably more popular in the west, and Sonic's 30th Anniversary lands sometime this May. So it would be both fitting and timely.

And then I opt for Tails over Eggman because I'm just having a difficult time imagining them picking Eggman. When there's a clear Player 2, they usually opt for them over the villain. Tails is a Mii Costume, but since it was released all the way back in April 2019 it remains in a bit of a grey area. Since Rex was part of the original Pyra project plan, which was likely being worked out sometime that year, I think Tails is similarly fair game.

I think Tails is perfectly right outside the realm of expectation while also making enough sense in retrospect. I think people are quick to count him out for the aforementioned reason, and with the influx in Eggman support he's gotten a bit left by the wayside. I tend not to back characters just because they "break fan rules" or are gonna blindside people but I'm just trying to get a hard read on what can happen next before it happens. Most characters we've gotten so far were ignored or counted out for one assumption or another. It's productive to try stretch outside the box a little bit.

For similar reasons I also predict another Sonic fighter.

I semi-joked before but like... E3 often reveals multiple characters, so them revealing the final two at “E3” or its equivalent would be par the course. Maybe “Shadow and Waluigi” being the last two fighters ISN’T so crazy. Just... BREAK OPEN that last “fan rule” and promote the two most popular assist trophies and (both due to E3 and the two of them being promoted assists) reveal them at the same time/event.

To ME... that’s the “Ultimate” way for Ultimate to end.

but yeah, one way or another I am thinking another Sonic character is in the cards for the reasons you listed. Everyone’s thinking of all these games/companies that haven’t been in Smash, “Oh it’s Crash! Chief! Hayabusa! Fortnite!” when in reality I’m thinking more like “Another Sonic character and another Pokémon or Mario character”

 

[SnowClaws]

Just dropping in to said that this Nintendo direct is airing in 7 minutes:

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Just dropping in to said that this Nintendo direct is airing in 7 minutes:

Well...Dragalia Digest anyways. Interesting that they're still on schedule even during COVID-19.

 

[KillerCage]

pic.twitter.com/B41KXgyftD

— Walmart Canada Gaming (@WalmartCAGaming) March 24, 2021

Who would you pick?

I’d go with B. I wanna pick A for Crash, but…it’s also got Jonesy.

Got to go with Master Chief.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

The three musketeers.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

Sonic content is odd in that its not really lacking like FFVII was prior to Sephiroth, it just feels so bog standard and basic in stages or songs that it feels like its marked off a minimal to average checklist about what to include. Its so lacking in interesting pulls for either levels or tracks that Wind Hill Zone is the closest to novel just because how buried Lost World has become in the time since its release and clearly would never be something selected for Smash if not for 4's 2014 release year.

 

[AreJay25]

The only issue I have with getting a 2nd unique Sonic character is that they're almost guaranteed to have a more imaginative moveset than Sonic himself despite him appearing in 3 straight games over the course of 13 years

No I'm not bitter about it why do you ask

 

[Louie G.]

The only issue I have with getting a 2nd unique Sonic character is that they're almost guaranteed to have a more imaginative moveset than Sonic himself despite him appearing in 3 straight games over the course of 13 years

No I'm not bitter about it why do you ask

I've thought about that too. I doubt Sakurai would let it limit himself, but thinking about how they could make someone like Tails or Eggman so expressive and creative... and then bland looking Sonic with his outdated moveset and emotionless animations. Like, again that's no reason to avoid adding them or intentionally limiting those characters, but it may come off a bit jarring.

Sonic content is odd in that its not really lacking like FFVII was prior to Sephiroth, it just feels so bog standard and basic in stages or songs that it feels like its marked off a minimal to average checklist about what to include. Its so lacking in interesting pulls for either that Wind Hill Zone is the closest to novel just because how buried Lost World has become in the time since its release and would never be something selected for Smash if not for 4's 2014 release year.

That's pretty much how I see it too. We have a full span of songs through the series history, two stages... but it's just some of the most basic, boring content possible for the series. That span across the series kinda just makes the tracklist a bunch of main themes and first-level tracks. It just feels "serviceable" rather than a loving display of the series like most other third parties have gotten. Adding say, Tails as a second character with maybe a Chemical Plant stage and an Eggman stage cameo? That checks off a bunch of new boxes that feel strikingly absent (although I personally believe he would come with more Adventure-skewed content).

I personally feel the same way about Street Fighter also, for different reasons, but that's another story. Particularly just how none of the other Street Fighter cast members have a significant role or a stage cameo or anything (Suzaku Castle feels so empty, with KOF Stadium in tow especially), and how games other than SF2 don't exist as far as the tracklist is concerned. I think SF and Sonic have the most room for growth. Well, maybe Pac-Man too actually.

Man, for some of the OG third parties these series deserve better huh?

 

[Geno Boost]

It’s seems I found the echo fighter for Sephiroth which Nintendo has lol

Einsatz
First appearance: Soma Bringer (DS) pic.twitter.com/2MB06w4l4s

— Obscure Nintendo Characters (@oncotd) March 24, 2021

 

[7NATOR]

Final Fantasy didn't need a new stage to be honest, especially another one from 7. It did need some Music and Spirits, but Usually I imagine the biggest part of the packs are the Character and Stage, since those take the most effort to make

I think Sonic can get away with more stuff, since the main selling point of the Pack would be the character, Since that's the main thing people want, just like how people want Sephiroth. It's an added bonus that people do want more interesting stage and more songs

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

It’s seems I found the echo fighter for Sephiroth which Nintendo has lol

My first thought was literally "how did they get pink on an official Sephiroth outfit?" lol

Also, if I didn't know all of the major characters of Xenoblade Chronicles, I would probably believe you if you said it was his first appearance.

 

[Peripuff]

I think this is a fair assumption, but I also believe that assuming this may be yet another fallacy that we see uprooted somehow. Sonic certainly has most of the necessary spirits covered, although Pyra and Mythra show us that we don't really need to add that many. Tikal, Mighty, Ray, Deadly Six, Flickies? Chao? Maybe a Perfect Chaos evolved spirit? There's definitely enough to work with there. Music and stage-wise, Sonic's potential is pretty much limitless.

I have always asserted that Sonic isn't in as poor a situation as people have assumed it to be. But I will admit that it leaves a lot to be desired. It has a fair amount of content, and yet it feels pretty empty. Taking the opportunity to maybe get some of those classic tracks that may have run into legal issues, not unlike the boost in FF7 content, may be something worth looking into. Bringing in a new stage from a location that isn't a grassland, maybe implementing Dr. Eggman as a stage element. All things considered, Sonic feels quite underexplored. So I think there's at least a case to be made here - one that I was a little bit ignorant about prior, because I wanted to believe in Puyo really badly and it caused me to resent the cries for more Sonic for a bit.

I think your pespective is valid though. I'm just under the impression that it's one of the weaker assumptions primed to be broken, too.



There's still a chance. I'd just rather subvert my expectations elsewhere for the time being so that I don't get my hopes up too much. I don't think the chance is very great, on account of the third parties being more "mass appeal" picks like I mentioned before and Puyo falling into somewhat of a niche. I think if we got a new Sega IP it would be Puyo Puyo, but I lean further toward believing they would double up on Sonic before bringing in anything else.

Pessimistic? Maybe, but I also believe it to be realistic. Sonic is still Sega's bread and butter. I see it panning out just as Sephiroth was prioritized over various other smaller Square Enix IPs. There isn't really another Sega character as big as Tails or Eggman, just as Sephiroth kinda trumped everyone else in his department. We just weren't thinking it was possible to expand on Final Fantasy in any meaningful way.

Because let's face it, Sonic is not only substantially more profitable and successful worldwide than Puyo but also way easier to envision a fighter from. I'm starting to believe we just gotta wait until base game next time around for Sakurai to decide to do something quirky and fun like a puzzle game character again. I'm not sure that's a niche that corporate Nintendo suits are particularly interested in (or creative enough to suggest).

The more I think about it the more I agree. I really do hope he makes it in. If he doesn't get in I'll be upset and I'm holding you accountable

 

[Icedragonadam]

As long as it's the Adventure Tails and not the one that cowers at the sight of the basic form of a mutated water chao.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

As long as it's the Adventure Tails and not the one that cowers at the sight of the basic form of a mutated water chao.

Put Chaos 0 in smash instead

 

[SpecterFlower]

MY EEEEEYES!!!

Seriously though, Another Dimension is so ugly. Maybe I'd like it if the yellow was super subdued but...

The stage geometry would be super interesting at least.

ouch, sorry, it's the most iconic location to come out of modern Kirby so that's what i thought would fit it the most, Nutty Noon could be good too.

this is another of it's appearances

 

[cashregister9]

I think a Sonic character could very well happen, I just don't think it will be Tails or Knuckles.

Eggman has the fact that he is practically Guaranteed in any piece of sonic media. Amy has the "Shock Value" and uniqueness area cornered. Tails could happen but I see Eggman happening first

AND THEN ZAVOK COMES IN OUT OF NOWHERE!!!

 

[Louie G.]

I think a Sonic character could very well happen, I just don't think it will be Tails or Knuckles.

Eggman has the fact that he is practically Guaranteed in any piece of sonic media. Amy has the "Shock Value" and uniqueness area cornered. Tails could happen but I see Eggman happening first

AND THEN ZAVOK COMES IN OUT OF NOWHERE!!!

I can't really argue that hard against Eggman, I just have a real deep gut feeling that he won't make it. Probably has something to do with just how hard they went with the whole "Sephiroth is a BAD GUY" deal, it makes it feel like having this iconic villain and boss character is a one-time thing this pass.

Tails just feels right to me. Reasonable enough for nobody to be THAT surprised, but unexpected enough to be right outside that realm of community expectations. Makes just as much sense as the second character but was counted out for potentially irrelevant reasons. He's one of those characters who would technically be a subversion but everyone would look back on and be like "ah yeah, why weren't we thinking about that?" For what it's worth too, Bowser and Peach generally appear more often in Mario games than Luigi. But Mario and Luigi are definitely THE duo. I see Sonic and Tails kinda like that.

Also, Zavok making it in would probably be the funniest thing ever. I just want a peek into the universe where that goes down.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

this is another of it's appearances

Better. Floor is still ugly, but at least it's not as aggressively ugly as it is in the mainline titles.

AND THEN ZAVOK COMES IN OUT OF NOWHERE!!!

Sonic: Lost World X Mother 3 confirmed.

 

[Icedragonadam]

Better. Floor is still ugly, but at least it's not as aggressively ugly as it is in the mainline titles.


Sonic: Lost World X Mother 3 confirmed.

Well Mother 3 and SatAm & Archie Sonic had the same theme of animals being turned into cyborgs.

 

[SpecterFlower]

Better. Floor is still ugly, but at least it's not as aggressively ugly as it is in the mainline titles.

that's return to dreamland lol. that was actually it's first appearance.

would this be a better version of it?

 

[DarthEnderX]

I wasn't trying to imply that all vague answers are cover ups, as there are other reasons as to why they can be made. It's just that "no" means no and not "they're lying anyway so it doesn't matter".

And all I'm trying to say is that, in that apple thief example, one of them is lying. And assuming it's definitely one of the "hard no"s over one of the evasive ones is erroneous at best.

It is a rapier, a traditional one. When most people think rapier they are picturing the extremely thin ones used for fencing. But rapiers were actually much more "blade" shaped back in the day.

A lot of people actually incorrectly picture an epee or fencing foil when they hear rapier.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

that's return to dreamland lol. that was actually it's first appearance.

No, that's Kirby Fighters. Another Dimension is a shoot 'em up level in Kirby's Return to Dreamland.

would this be a better version of it?

Heck yeah! Too bad the closest we'll get to a pretty blue stage like that is probably Infinite Azure. (Well...Kalos Pokémon League comes very close.)

 

[SpecterFlower]

No, that's Kirby Fighters. Another Dimension is a shoot 'em up level in Kirby's Return to Dreamland.


Heck yeah! Too bad the closest we'll get to a pretty blue stage like that is probably Infinite Azure. (Well...Kalos Pokémon League comes very close.)

oh yeah it is, though kirby's dreamlands version of it looked the same, it was where you fought the doomers. and of course the shooter level.

i think a mix of the three design's would be cool, the blue but it still has the celestial purple.

 

[SharkLord]

Sonic content is odd in that its not really lacking like FFVII was prior to Sephiroth, it just feels so bog standard and basic in stages or songs that it feels like its marked off a minimal to average checklist about what to include. Its so lacking in interesting pulls for either levels or tracks that Wind Hill Zone is the closest to novel just because how buried Lost World has become in the time since its release and clearly would never be something selected for Smash if not for 4's 2014 release year.

Yeah, Sonic's in that nasty sourspot. It doesn't have enough to feel truly complete like the others do, but at the same time it has enough that a DLC pack doesn't seem absolutely necessarily, like with XC2 and Final Fantasy. Poor Sonic just got screwed over.

 

[ZelDan]

Assuming Bandana Waddle Dee was to be the next Kirby character, I'd think the most logical games to take stages from would be either

1. The most recent mainline Kirby game
2. Kirby Return to Dreamland (The first game that made BWD playable and gave him that "4th party member status")

For the first one, well, if we assume BWD would be added because of a new game we don't know about, then we obviously wouldn't know what stage we could get from it either. The most recent mainline game we got now is Star Allies, and with that game, the alter you fight the squidward-looking mother****er at could make for a good stage, or the ship where you fight the 3 sisters (I haven't played Star Allies in a while if me forgetting names didn't make that obvious...).

For the second possibility, Return to Dreamland. The Lor Cutter could maybe be the stage and work as a traveling stage, traveling to spots within KRtD or maybe even other locales within the Kirby series (It is supposed to be dimensional I think so...)

 

[7NATOR]

One thing I will say is that with the 3rd Parties we have gotten, they've been different type of Characters

Castlevania: Richter is the new age protagnist

Street Fighter: Ken is the Best friend Duo Archetype Mixed with Rivalness

Final Fantasy: Sephiroth is a full villain

I only say this because I know people think that for a 2nd character, they go for Certain types of characters, but I think it all depnds on the Franchise that's being talked about. It's not like there's mission to put in the Sidekicks first, or the Rival first, or the Villains first

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

oh yeah it is, though kirby's dreamlands version of it looked the same, it was where you fought the doomers. and of course the shooter level.

Looking back at some footage, it's not that bad. I think Kirby Star Allies just ruined the aesthetic by making the yellow blindingly bright.

The most recent mainline game we got now is Star Allies, and with that game, the alter you fight the squidward-looking mother****er at could make for a good stage, or the ship where you fight the 3 sisters (I haven't played Star Allies in a while if me forgetting names didn't make that obvious...).

Hyness, and The Three Mage Sisters: Zan Partisane (I think that's how you spell it), Flamberge, and Francisca. Why do I know their individual names off hand? I...I don't know.

Also, I think people are sleeping on a Castle Dedede stage for Bandana Waddle Dee specifically.

 

[ZelDan]

One thing I will say is that with the 3rd Parties we have gotten, they've been different type of Characters

Castlevania: Richter is the new age protagnist

Street Fighter: Ken is the Best friend Duo Archetype Mixed with Rivalness

Final Fantasy: Sephiroth is a full villain

I only say this because I know people think that for a 2nd character, they go for Certain types of characters, but I think it all depnds on the Franchise that's being talked about. It's not like there's mission to put in the Sidekicks first, or the Rival first, or the Villains first

Wouldn't Ganondorf, Ridley and K Rool be "full" villains as well? I don't recall them working with their enemies (Link, Samus, or DK repsectively) in their actual game franchises, and don't know if I'd count Ganondorf working with Link and Zelda in Brawl's SSE when I don't know how much weight or value we should really put in SSE's lore or whatever.

or am I not understanding whatever the hell a "full" villain is supposed to mean?

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Wouldn't Ganondorf, Ridley and K Rool be "full" villains as well? I don't recall them working with their enemies (Link, Samus, or DK repsectively) in their actual game franchises, and don't know if I'd count Ganondorf working with Link and Zelda in Brawl's SSE when I don't know how much weight or value we should really put in SSE's lore or whatever.

or am I not understanding whatever the hell a "full" villain is supposed to mean?

He's not saying that other characters aren't full villains, just that Sephiroth is one, and he's only talking about 3rd party characters (from franchises that already have a character) in this context.

 

[ZelDan]

He's not saying that other characters aren't full villains, just that Sephiroth is one, and he's only talking about 3rd party characters (from franchises that already have a character) in this context.

Oh right.

Fair.

 

[TCT~Phantom]

I can't really argue that hard against Eggman, I just have a real deep gut feeling that he won't make it. Probably has something to do with just how hard they went with the whole "Sephiroth is a BAD GUY" deal, it makes it feel like having this iconic villain and boss character is a one-time thing this pass.

Tails just feels right to me. Reasonable enough for nobody to be THAT surprised, but unexpected enough to be right outside that realm of community expectations. Makes just as much sense as the second character but was counted out for potentially irrelevant reasons. He's one of those characters who would technically be a subversion but everyone would look back on and be like "ah yeah, why weren't we thinking about that?" For what it's worth too, Bowser and Peach generally appear more often in Mario games than Luigi. But Mario and Luigi are definitely THE duo. I see Sonic and Tails kinda like that.

Also, Zavok making it in would probably be the funniest thing ever. I just want a peek into the universe where that goes down.

The universe Zavok happens is bad because Zavok is objectively one of the worst designed...things in Sonic. I do not know why Sega loves him so much.

Personally, I am the opposite where if there is a second Sonic character, it probably is Eggman in my eyes. Even setting aside the Mii Costume of Tails for a minute, I still think that Eggman has the edge. While Sephiroth's presentation was definately meant to sell him as "the bad guy" complete with a boss mode, I still think that Eggman makes more sense than Tails since Ultimate seems to have a thing for villains. Really, Tails and Eggman both make a ton of sense for the next Sonic character, and most of the arguments used for one of them could be used for the other. They are the only consistent presences in modern Sonic apart from...Sonic. I also think Eggman is easier to pitch a strong DLC pass for. There are so many "villanous" themes in Sonic that would fit into a fighters pass for Eggman, I might as well post one I think would be good.

Spoiler

Just a small selection of some songs that would be perfect for an Eggman challenger pack.

Basically, Eggman has the edge over Tails just because while both make sense, Tails imo is mainly screwed by the Mii costume.

 

[SharkLord]

Assuming Bandana Waddle Dee was to be the next Kirby character, I'd think the most logical games to take stages from would be either

1. The most recent mainline Kirby game
2. Kirby Return to Dreamland (The first game that made BWD playable and gave him that "4th party member status")

For the first one, well, if we assume BWD would be added because of a new game we don't know about, then we obviously wouldn't know what stage we could get from it either. The most recent mainline game we got now is Star Allies, and with that game, the alter you fight the squidward-looking mother****er at could make for a good stage, or the ship where you fight the 3 sisters (I haven't played Star Allies in a while if me forgetting names didn't make that obvious...).

For the second possibility, Return to Dreamland. The Lor Cutter could maybe be the stage and work as a traveling stage, traveling to spots within KRtD or maybe even other locales within the Kirby series (It is supposed to be dimensional I think so...)

Eeyup. The Starcutter is how Magolor gets to Pop Star to meet with Kirby, since his planet is actually in another dimension as well.

Looking back at some footage, it's not that bad. I think Kirby Star Allies just ruined the aesthetic by making the yellow blindingly bright.


Hyness, and The Three Mage Sisters: Zan Partisane (I think that's how you spell it), Flamberge, and Francisca. Why do I know their individual names off hand? I...I don't know.

Also, I think people are sleeping on a Castle Dedede stage for Bandana Waddle Dee specifically.

I kinda doubt Castle Dedede because it's not connected to anyone more than Dedede himself. Sure, we got Spring Man's stage with Min Min, but ARMS didn't have a fighter yet, so it could get away with a general stage. We already have three Kirby characters, including Dedede, so it would be weird for Dedede's stage to not come with him when he's already there. That, and Bandana Dee's been slowly drifting away from Dedede anyways.

 

[Louie G.]

Now's as good a time as any to say I've always taken a bit of issue with the suggestion that say, Sephiroth was only able to make it in because of the relative lack of Final Fantasy 7 content. It falls under the logic that when a series doesn't have a proper amount of basic representation, such as music and spirits, the answer is to... add a whole ass new character? It feels like a bit of over compensation, no?

With Pyra / Mythra, sure because Xenoblade 2 is a completely different game. Sephiroth is from FF7, and brings the content that FF7 "should have already had". But when we lay it out that way it really just feels like a happy side effect to Sephiroth's inclusion. In the end, I believe that if a character is significant enough in their own right they justify themselves. I don't particularly think they went in with the explicit mindset of "fixing" FF7.

Sephiroth, Chun-Li, Tails, Eggman... Sephiroth had the "advantage" of coming from a series with less content, but I don't think that's the be all end all. It's certainly not like Sonic or Street Fighter don't have room to grow as well. One could argue the lack of notable classic Sonic content due to copyright or the lack of Street Fighter content beyond SF2 are glaring enough omissions to mend with a brand new character in a similar vein. I think it's one of several factors that allowed Sephiroth to join, but one of many and probably not the most significant one either.

Basically, Eggman has the edge over Tails just because while both make sense, Tails imo is mainly screwed by the Mii costume.

I agree that Eggman's content is a bit more clear cut. Much easier to imagine a pass with a bunch of boss themes and final zone themes, but fortunately no matter who they would go with there's no lack of Sonic music to add.

I don't believe the Mii Costume impacts very much at the moment, but we'll have to wait and see. That limbo between December 2018 and E3 2019 is a weird little spot where I'm not wholly convinced the costumes are as damning as they would be in any pass that followed.

And after all, they're only one measly dollar. Perhaps we've been weighing this a little too heavily and selling a Tails costume two years ago was a means of tiding fans over until the real thing - simply because he was easy enough to bring back from last game (that's pretty important to me, if it was a brand new costume then I would agree with you). I'm sure nobody who bought the costume would mind forking over the additional fee to play as the real deal.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

The universe Zavok happens is bad because Zavok is objectively one of the worst designed...things in Sonic.

So I probably shouldn't mention that he's one of my favorite character designs in the Sonic the Hedgehog series huh...

I wanted this to read like a "haha SMAAASH!! Puppy like bad thing" but for the life of me I cannot figure out a way to word this that isn't dripping with sarcasm.

 

[SharkLord]

AND THEN ZAVOK COMES IN OUT OF NOWHERE!!!

I remember when someone added Zavok to their roster of hated characters. The tagline was, and I quote:

ZAVOK ZAVOKS INTO BATTLE I FORGOT WHAT HE DOES

 

[Peripuff]

The only issue I have with getting a 2nd unique Sonic character is that they're almost guaranteed to have a more imaginative moveset than Sonic himself despite him appearing in 3 straight games over the course of 13 years

No I'm not bitter about it why do you ask

Wouldn't that be a good thing? A big part of the reason I want Tails specifically instead of someone like Eggman, besides just the fact that he's my 3rd favourite Sonic character (my top 2 don't even have a remote chance lol), is because I really want to see them build a good Sonic moveset using the speed and mobility that the series is known for. Sonic's moveset is lacking in a lot of ways and I really think including Tails would serve to remedy this issue.

Sephiroth, Chun-Li, Tails, Eggman... Sephiroth had the "advantage" of coming from a series with less content, but I don't think that's the be all end all. It's certainly not like Sonic or Street Fighter don't have room to grow as well. One could argue the lack of notable classic Sonic content due to copyright or the lack of Street Fighter content beyond SF2 are glaring enough omissions to mend with a brand new character in a similar vein. I think it's one of several factors that allowed Sephiroth to join, but one of many and probably not the most significant one either.

In a lot of ways, adding a Sonic character really feels like a natural progression for FP2 overall, following Min Min, Sephiroth, and the Aegises especially. If Tails does happen for CP10, I've gotta say Chun-Li would be looking pretty likely in my opinion, especially since SF is like the next step in that regard. I hope what I'm saying makes sense.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

God of War double reveal:

Kratos Unleashes his Wrath!

And then Along Came Zeus! He Hurled his Thunderbolt!

 

[Louie G.]

In a lot of ways, adding a Sonic character really feels like a natural progression for FP2 overall, following Min Min, Sephiroth, and the Aegises especially. If Tails does happen for CP10, I've gotta say Chun-Li would be looking pretty likely in my opinion, especially since SF is like the next step in that regard. I hope what I'm saying makes sense.

I was feeling pretty good about Chun-Li until the Capcom costumes came to rain on my parade. Monster Hunter was the Capcom pick I was anticipating, but Chun-Li was my backup choice and I believed that a new opportunity was opened up for her. Not because Sephiroth necessarily guaranteed further building on top of already represented third parties, but because he showed that the worth of a character is more significant than simply the notion of "reps". Sephiroth got in because he's Sephiroth, Chun-Li could get in because she's Chun-Li and she's one of the most famous video game characters ever.

For what it's worth though, I'm convinced she's one of those characters who will definitely join Smash someday. Tails too, probably.

I actually feel a bit different about Sonic though, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Sakurai had some free reign over which character they went with - considering we have like, four equally valid candidates and I'm not sure Sega would have all that much of a preference. I think the demand for "more Sonic" is enough for that notion to be penned in and expanded on later. Someone like Chun-Li or Sephiroth would probably just be written in outright... there's really no other choice but those two. Just rambling a bit about this hypothetical lmao, but yeah it feels less clear cut.

 

[Peripuff]

I was feeling pretty good about Chun-Li until the Capcom costumes came to rain on my parade. Monster Hunter was the Capcom pick I was anticipating, but Chun-Li was my backup choice and I believed that a new opportunity was opened up for her. Not because Sephiroth necessarily guaranteed further building on top of already represented third parties, but because he showed that the worth of a character is more significant than simply the notion of "reps". Sephiroth got in because he's Sephiroth, Chun-Li could get in because she's Chun-Li and she's one of the most famous video game characters ever.

For what it's worth though, I'm convinced she's one of those characters who will definitely join Smash someday. Tails too, probably.

I actually feel a bit different about Sonic though, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Sakurai had some free reign over which character they went with - considering we have like, four equally valid candidates and I'm not sure Sega would have all that much of a preference. I think the demand for "more Sonic" is enough for that notion to be penned in and expanded on later. Someone like Chun-Li or Sephiroth would probably just be written in outright... there's really no other choice but those two. Just rambling a bit about this hypothetical lmao, but yeah it feels less clear cut.

Exactly, it feels like the shackles preventing 3rd party series that had multiple important characters from being added were kinda rescinded. Characters like Chun-Li, Sephy, and Tails are extremely significant to gaming as a whole, and probably beat out the vast majority of the characters already included despite not being the main protagonists of their games. It makes sense to include them in spite of that, and it feels like they've stopped worrying about that more recently.

I really don't believe in the notion that Sephy was added to fix FF7 repping. It probably needed it, and as someone who really likes that game I'm glad to see that they did that, but I doubt they added Sephy just for that.