Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I found an old tweet from PushDustIn regarding Kirby's gender in Japanese:

I'm getting Sheik flashbacks.

What makes sense: Female (disguised as male)
Ocarina of Time: Refers to her as male because the other characters don't know her true identity.
Other games: Refers to her as female.
Super Smash Bros. Ultimate: Refers to her as male.

 

[SharkLord]

Question: next fighter is a retro character, retro here being defined as having no new game in 20 years. Could be first party or third party. Who do you want it to be?

myself, I’m batting for muddy mole forever and always

I've got a gut hunch for Ayumi. Retro rep, promotional pick, and a throwback to the dropped plans of the very first Smash game, all in one.

...She still counts, right? The remakes aren't quite out yet, so...

 

[Perkilator]

I'm getting Sheik flashbacks.

What makes sense: Female (disguised as male)
Ocarina of Time: Refers to her as male because the other characters don't know her true identity.
Other games: Refers to her as female.
Super Smash Bros. Ultimate: Refers to her as male.
View attachment 304661

Yeah, I don't get it either. Even Pit was confused in that one Guidance for Sheik in Ultimate.

 

[Sysreq]

Hey its not the weirdest meeting of accounts online:

Corporate accounts...

 

[UltimateCyborgOverlord]

Maybe but I wouldn't really count Piranha Plant since he isn't part of the passes. Even then, Mythra's inclusion makes it so that we've so far seen 3 fp2 fighters being from Nintendo. With 2 fp2 fighters being from 3rd parties, no matter what we see, fp2 would be uneven then.



I mean... they just might...
View attachment 304655

Hehehehehe. Having the last two fighters be Nintendo characters... what a concept (I could use a little fuel myself and we could all use a little chaaaaaaaaaange). Nintendo characters for your Nintendo fighting game.

I'm being cheeky of course.

But... just for funsies let's imagine that the last two fighters ARE INDEED Nintendo, non-third party choices.


Fighter 10 is either Porky, some out there Mario fighter, a Zelda fighter, something like that. Perhaps even Ayumi Tachibana or some other out there character. Mach Rider, I dunno.

Fighter 11, the last one (until revealed otherwise) is a Pokemon, but MORE SPECIFICALLY, it's a Pokemon TRAINER, like it's ALL THREE OF THE GALAR STARTERS with Rillaboom being the heavy one, Cinderace being the fast one, Inteleon being the "in between" one with all the tricky moves. And of course, Gloria is the default trainer to go with it. THAT WAY it ends with "it's another Pokemon" but also "OH BUT IT'S THREEEEEEE FIGHTERS IN ONE!"

 

[Mamboo07]

Question: next fighter is a retro character, retro here being defined as having no new game in 20 years. Could be first party or third party. Who do you want it to be?

myself, I’m batting for muddy mole forever and always

The Centipede from Centipede, would go with the design from the PIXELS movie:

(A multi-legged fighter would be kind of cool!)

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

(A multi-legged fighter would be kind of cool!)

But single and no legged fighters are actually more unique 'cuz they don't have the extra leg(s) to stand on.

 

[SNEKeater]

Shulk is from a series that renews it's cast every game like Fire Emblem lol. I get why you're confused though since it is implied in the trailer shulk and the xc2 cast know each other. That is through a DLC that has nothing to do with the main story. Shulk can't promote a game he isn't a main character in

Now Kirby on the other hand, can literally promote every game in it's series, since it is always the protagonist

I know that. I've played XC2's DLC.

Obviously Shulk can't promote XC2, but he still promotes his series. Which happens to be more than Xenoblade 1. In the other hand, it is also obvious that Pyra and Mythra (or any XC2 character) will do a better job in promoting Xenoblade 2.

Xenoblade having rotating casts is a thing, but I think the point I made in my other message is still valid. When a character is announced people tends to be interested in the character's series. This is not an absolute thing that always happens, that is certain, but it helps.

I think a better example is Sephiroth. He's from the same game as Cloud, Cloud arrived first and yet I saw Smash fans or a few Smash content creators playing FFVII for the first time after Sephiroth was announced. I don't think it's hard to see that if they added a new Kirby character, some people would be like "hmmm, I know Kirby has a lot of games but never tried the series, maybe it's time". This also applies to any other franchise, I'm using Kirby as an example because it was mentioned before. I personally don't care about Kirby, but I'm sure if they added Bandana Dee as DLC, that would spark my curiosity in the series. The famous Smash Effect lol

 

[cashregister9]

This Imran Khan post will be the next thing circlejerked non-stop for the next few months won't it?

If he really new every single character right this minute, Then there might be more people who do, and then they would not be a secret anymore.

Also neither of these out right say that the rest are first party

 

[rexfan53]

360 wasn't so bad there. There are plenty of clues that Halo has decent following there.

3.8 million (Japanese sales of Ultimate) out of 20 million is impressive number... but that's far away from majority. I feel this is like US electoral college bs.

Smash dlc is literally catered to the west anyways or like most of it lmao.

 

[chocolatejr9]

This Imran Khan post will be the next thing circlejerked non-stop for the next few months won't it?

If he really new every single character right this minute, Then there might be more people who do, and then they would not be a secret anymore.

Huh? What'd he say this time?

 

[cashregister9]

Huh? What'd he say this time?

They are right here

Has this been discussed before? If not, then what do you think of this?

He also said this.

2 out of context resetera posts.

 

[UltimateCyborgOverlord]

(A multi-legged fighter would be kind of cool!)

My number 1 pick for multi-legged fighter is Spyro the Dragon. The guy who started the toys to life (amiibo) thing in the first place and a superstar in his own right!


Cue the "but Japan hates him" comments.

This Imran Khan post will be the next thing circlejerked non-stop for the next few months won't it?

If he really new every single character right this minute, Then there might be more people who do, and then they would not be a secret anymore.

Call it a hunch.... but I suspect that the fighters aren't AS secret as what's been implied... just a feeling I have.

Question: next fighter is a retro character, retro here being defined as having no new game in 20 years. Could be first party or third party. Who do you want it to be?

myself, I’m batting for muddy mole forever and always

Urban Champion Fighter! One of Nintendo's earliest fighting games that, despite its reputation still got a 3D Classics version.

It's just the two dudes (both colors are alts) and they punch a bunch and the innocent whistling as the cop drives by is one of the taunts, and that street where they meet and fight is the stage with the manhole being a KO zone. People pop out of the windows and drop things on you. Still no explanation for what the Urban Champions are fighting ABOUT, only that they both know it's illegal since they pretend to innocently whistle whenever the cop shows up.

 

[Digital Hazard]

I'm getting Sheik flashbacks.

What makes sense: Female (disguised as male)
Ocarina of Time: Refers to her as male because the other characters don't know her true identity.
Other games: Refers to her as female.
Super Smash Bros. Ultimate: Refers to her as male.
View attachment 304661

Yeah, I don't get it either. Even Pit was confused in that one Guidance for Sheik in Ultimate.

It's Palutena and Viridi.

They clearly were messing with him.

 

[chocolatejr9]

They are right here



2 out of context resetera posts.

This just makes me think Euden again...

How many times is that today? Three?

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

It's Palutena and Viridi.

They clearly were messing with him.

The official site refers to her as male as well:

Now Sheik joins the battle wearing the Sheikah costume from The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild. Keep the pressure on your opponent by using his speedy dash to quickly close in on (or get away from) your opponent!

It is strange, because the Palutena's Guidance does imply that this is incorrect (Pit's trying to correct Palutena and Viridi), but sources that would know that she's female consistently say otherwise.

 

[Opossum]

Y'all are so busy riding rumors and theories that you forget that is ok to not be a sheep and want something that isn't talked about 24/7 Like my drum baby Don-chan

I really don't get you.

Not even a full day ago Fly pointed out how you were so horribly missing the point about the "second chance/leftovers" theory given that people are talking about it because there's evidence supporting it. This is a speculation thread. It's something to speculate on. And yet here you are calling others mindless sheep for doing what this thread was designed for.

I don't really expect a response since you didn't respond to Fly and you'll probably just go back to whining about the lack of Layton, but for real. At least think about what others are saying before mouthing off.

 

[Mamboo07]

Y'all are so busy riding rumors and theories that you forget that is ok to not be a sheep and want something that isn't talked about 24/7 Like my drum baby Don-chan

What are you even talking about?

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

What are you even talking about?

I was mostly talking about think a certain character is coming only because of a rumor or theory or "leak". And to be fair, a person did say speculation and wants are Two different things and I agreed and dropped it from there

 

[CapitaineCrash]

Question: next fighter is a retro character, retro here being defined as having no new game in 20 years. Could be first party or third party. Who do you want it to be?

myself, I’m batting for muddy mole forever and always

I'd really like Mach rider, but I think the problem with that type of character is that it would be hard to do a complete challenger pack with those solo NES games. Mach rider could easily have a fun moveset and stages, but there's really no potential for new spirits, and pretty much every music track of the games is already in the Mach rider remix from Melee (who's in Ultimate too).

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

They are right here



2 out of context resetera posts.

I wonder how long these two posts are gonna cuirculate on here

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

I'm pretty sure they move around characters based on how development is doing and prioritize the character that is going best. Trailers are also made early or storyboarded early and we know that because sakurai talked about sephiroths trailer being done before ff7 remake came out. That is also why previous fp2 dlc don't appear in new fp2 dlc trailers. Surprised sephiroth wasnt in p+ms trailer for a jin reference

Sephiroth actually was in P/M's trailer when Mythra used Chroma Dust.

 

[UltimateCyborgOverlord]

Yeah, my 3 "Retro reps" would be:

1. Urban Champion (as mentioned in my previous comment)

2. Ayumi Tachibana (it's been mentioned a few times thanks to the remake)

3. The guy from Wizards and Warriors PURELY for this music:

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music that you love, upload original content and share it all with friends, family and the world on YouTube.

www.youtube.com

 

[RGFS]

Plant is a dlc character though. If we assume the next 2 characters are the final, why wouldn't they go for equal representation in all of dlc. It would also make sense considering how the two third parties of pass 2 are the equivalent to a list celebrities in the gaming world and the ones in fp1(excluding hero) are like b-c list celebrities lmao

it took more money to put sephiroth and steve than it did to put joker, terry, and banjo

I don't think it makes sense to consider the List status of the characters that way. You can't just exclude Hero, he happened in the first pass. Also if Sephiroth counts as an A-List, I'd argue Minecraft counts as SS-List then.

We don't know the amount of money it takes to add a character or the negotiations involved at all, it's not worth speculation. You can just as easily assume 3rd parties also sell more in general but that doesn't stop Nintendo from adding first parties.

What I mean is that I wouldn't really count Plant, but if you do, Mythra also counts. She's a completely different numbered fighter and also in the pass:
1st parties: []
3rd parties: []

No matter how you order it then, one group would have more fighters. So I believe it could go either way and this theory doesn't end up really working.

Still a possibility to keep in mind though.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

I really don't get you.

Not even a full day ago Fly pointed out how you were so horribly missing the point about the "second chance/leftovers" theory given that people are talking about it because there's evidence supporting it. This is a speculation thread. It's something to speculate on. And yet here you are calling others mindless sheep for doing what this thread was designed for.

I don't really expect a response since you didn't respond to Fly and you'll probably just go back to whining about the lack of Layton, but for real. At least think about what others are saying before mouthing off.

Well I didn't see anyone named Fly so I may have missed that but in any case, Sheep wasn't the right word. Basically what I was saying was y'all are sleepi g on a ton of fun characters because only the ones in rumors, leaks and suck matter, which is why I jokingly said "my drum baby Don-chan" but I'm stupid in my brain so I don't say the right **** lol

 

[Knight Dude]

The real question is which Sol Badguy design would they use?
View attachment 304620View attachment 304621View attachment 304622

And whether they'd use the "Smash Bros" animation style for his attacks or give him the classic "Stepped 3D animation" style that Xrd popularized.


Well I personally don't want Monter Hunter in Smash in any capacity, so it wouldn't matter to me.

Anyway that was my B I used a screenshot of the youtube title I meant to show:
View attachment 304624
which ties into my point that the standard Rathalos armor is iconic and it's the one that they'd use because it's in literally every single game.

Now that you've googled Monster Hunter box arts, you'll see that every Monster Hunter art shows the Hunter in a different armor and a different monster to highlight that game's new gimmick. Thus if they went with armor that was that game's flagship, yes, it'd be outdated. But armor like the Rathalos? Which stays relevant forever? No, that won't get outdated.

Probably Xrd Sol. It's like 80% similar to his original look with the beefier proportions of his modern incarnation. Still I wouldn't call Sol (heh) super likely, but I'm generally happy to see any new fighting game character. It is a little surprising that he's the one to get the most discussion now.

 

[SpecterFlower]

I've got a gut hunch for Ayumi. Retro rep, promotional pick, and a throwback to the dropped plans of the very first Smash game, all in one.

...She still counts, right? The remakes aren't quite out yet, so...

yeah, i believe she's more likely than many people think.

 

[SNEKeater]

Probably Xrd Sol. It's like 80% similar to his original look with the beefier proportions of his modern incarnation. Still I wouldn't call Sol (heh) super likely, but I'm generally happy to see any new fighting game character. It is a little surprising that he's the one to get the most discussion now.

I'd say that's mostly around here. Though recently I've seen more people bringing up Sol for Smash as an idea in social media. Probably because all the buzz that Strive is generating.

I guess Mortal Kombat not being popular in Japan and Tekken being seemingly out of the running also helps. Though there's Soul Calibur. I'd rather have Sol but Nightmare would be very cool as well.

 

[SharkLord]

Probably Xrd Sol. It's like 80% similar to his original look with the beefier proportions of his modern incarnation. Still I wouldn't call Sol (heh) super likely, but I'm generally happy to see any new fighting game character. It is a little surprising that he's the one to get the most discussion now.

Well...

• Street Fighter and everything SNK are already represented
• Tekken was Mii'd
• Mortal Kombat has the violence stigma, and even for those who don't believe that there's the lack of Japanese presence
• Marvel vs. Capcom has the whole fourth-party thing going on
• Darkstalkers is dormant and overshadowed by Capcom's other IPs
• BlazBlue started slowing down when Smash speculation's breadth expanded to the likes of ArcSys, and at the same time Guilty Gear was on the rise

At least, that's what it seems like to me

 

[DevaAshera]

I would argue that the ratio between Classic and Modern Kirby content, while not entirely abysmal, is still irritably one-sided; which is especially strange for a thriving franchise like the Kirby series. Assuming that the core Modern Era of the Kirby franchise started in 2011 with Kirby's Return to Dream Land, I could only pinpoint about 9 Modern Kirby spirits in total (disregarding important characters like Taranza, Star Dream, or Hyness). On the flipside, I believe that the music selection has at least improved even if there are still some strange omissions like "Galacta Knight's Theme" and "Masked Dedede's Theme"; however, it's a little unfortunate that there still isn't one remixed Modern Kirby track to be found within the entire selection.

When it does come to more noticeable elements of representation like Stages and Characters, I do want to cut Sakurai some slack.
Back in Smash 4, he did consider putting in a Kirby's Epic Yarn stage, although I would assume that the newness of Yoshi's Woolly World inclined him to develop a yarn-themed stage with that game in mind instead (not to mention that it saved the Yoshi series from having 0 new stages in Sm4sh).
Now in Ultimate, there wasn't a single 1st Party franchise (aside from Mario and Zelda) that got a brand-new stage in the base game due to the development plan of including more existing stages in Ultimate above all else. Therefore, it's hard to judge whether or not Ultimate would've been the game in which he finally put a Modern Kirby stage into the series.

As for characters, it certainly could be argued that Bandana Dee could've (or even should've) gotten into the base roster of Ultimate, and that it's simply too late for him now in a world where DLC characters depend on how much they can turn Nintendo a good profit. Personally though, perhaps one of the only things holding him back is something I would call "Rising Star Syndrome" because of his significant prominence in the Modern Kirby era in comparison to the Classic Era (where Kirby, Meta Knight, and Dedede are prominent in, as well as the Modern Era). Since, subjectively speaking, I don't see why Bandana Dee wouldn't be considered a 'big' enough pick for DLC at this point. As of now, it's clear that HAL has been trying to push him as a main character ever since Kirby's Return to Dream Land, effectively separating himself from the average Waddle Dee/Servant of King Dedede while becoming his own distinct entity in terms of weaponry and personality. Not to mention that he's also basically the sole representative of the Waddle Dee species, and would serve as a beacon for that species, which has been with the Kirby series since the very beginning, in a game like Smash. Also, generally speaking, Waddle Dees are as marketable as they could get, especially in a country like Japan.

Now, another thing potentially holding him back is the lack of a game to promote (which could possibly be resolved if a new core Kirby game managed to release this year, of which he would then have to star in), along with the reasonable argument of whether or not Kirby could simply promote the game on his own (like he typically does). However, as a prominent figure in the Kirby franchise, I personally don't think it would necessarily be a horrible business decision to make him into a DLC fighter for Ultimate either way.

Kirby & Dedede at least reference modern Kirby with their Final Smashes as well.

I love Bandanna Dee, he's my second fav for Kirby behind Adeleine, I just don't think he'd cause as much attention and hype as all of the other DLC characters, aside from Piranha Plant, did. They were all big primary characters, either the protagonists or antagonists in their series whereas Bandanna Dee would be like Toad in the Mario series, there as an important character, but not to the level of Mario, Luigi, Bowser, & Peach, but often chosen as the next playable character after Mario, Luigi, & Peach..or in Bandanna Dee's case, Kirby, Meta Knight, & Dedede.

I don't mean it as an insult to Bandanna Dee at all though, I feel the same way about even big wants of mine like Dixie Kong & Ashley from WarioWare, who don't seem big enough for DLC and aren't likely to bring in more sales or more fans into Smash, but seem like good picks for base roster..I also feel that way for characters already in like Isabelle & K. Rool..even Ridley..

 

[Shroob]

Imran Khan: Says something a year ago

Smash Fans: Is this new info?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Imran Khan: Says something a year ago

Smash Fans: Is this new info?

I know the “what makes you think...” post was, but what about the “would you be ok with the rest of this pass being 1st party characters” one? When was that made?

also don’t expect the presentation this week:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

 

[TheCJBrine]

Imran Khan: Says something a year ago

Smash Fans: Is this new info?

Was the message where he mentioned 2021 from last year? The image shared here said Wednesday.

edit: my question was ninja'd.

 

[Perkilator]

also don’t expect the presentation this week:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Okay, then maybe next week?

Not that I fully don't expect one this week; Pokemon just sort of does its own thing separate from Nintendo, so it's not like the presentation happening the same week as a Pokemon Direct should clash with each other too much.

 

[Shroob]

I know the “what makes you think...” post was, but what about the “would you be ok with the rest of this pass being 1st party characters” one? When was that made?

also don’t expect the presentation this week:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

I dunno the latter, but I severely doubt Imran knew who was going to be in the pass in January 2020, before we even knew that ARMs was going to be a thing.


Unless you think he's been sitting on the entire FP for over a year at this point.

 

[cashregister9]

I know the “what makes you think...” post was, but what about the “would you be ok with the rest of this pass being 1st party characters” one? When was that made?

also don’t expect the presentation this week:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

I can't find a listing of dates, but Haven't their been times where we've had Pokemon Presents and a direct in the same week?

 

[TheCJBrine]

I know the “what makes you think...” post was, but what about the “would you be ok with the rest of this pass being 1st party characters” one? When was that made?

also don’t expect the presentation this week:

>Let's Go: Catching

This leak sounds dumb lol.

 

[Lamperouge]

I know the “what makes you think...” post was, but what about the “would you be ok with the rest of this pass being 1st party characters” one? When was that made?

also don’t expect the presentation this week:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

I'm still trying to process the announcement so I'm ok with waiting a little longer.

 

[Shroob]

At this point, I don't really care when the Sakurai Presents is as much as I care about their release date itself.


The release date will give us some info on what to expect.


If it's SUPER early in March(Say, literal first week), then(While I myself don't expect it to happen), CP10 dropping between now and E3 isn't that odd a concept, in fact, it'd 100% fall in line with how characters have been coming out at a steady pace.


However, if their release date is later in the month? Yeah, we're waiting until June for CP10, 100%.

 

[SharkLord]

I can't find a listing of dates, but Haven't their been times where we've had Pokemon Presents and a direct in the same week?

Yes, actually

It's also happened just a week apart

So we could see Pyra and Mythra next week.