Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[SharkLord]

That's true, but if Covid change some plans and the character are chosen in advance I guess there's a possibility that the character could release more near to the release of his game. Like for example, if one game was planned this summer, but moved for the holiday because of Covid, then the character could have been chosen for Smash and still be our last fighter.

That's true, though as N3ON pointed out, the characters chosen in advance had about a year between the decision and their home game's release. It kinda evens out there; They had to have been relatively new to be in the timeframe, but COVID fricked up the schedule. Based on that, I'd say it's still around the early 2021 range at the latest.

Gonna crosspost something I posted in the Bandana Dee and Quote threads. Take it with a grain of salt but this was a very interesting thought I had.

Well, about that...

Yo so no clue how much people are still paying attention to the supposed voice theory and/or placeholder slots, but they don't seem to mean much of anything. I started poking around in the WoL param files to see if it was possible to add fights for the DLC characters, and in the process, I've discovered a few things about placeholder data.

• Voice Theory has absolutely no legs to stand on outside of a perfect square which is ultimately meaningless. The parameter file for the sound test (ui_voice_db.prc) has no placeholder entries in it. The entries for DLC characters are simply added to the end of the album list. The final two entries in the list are Sephiroth and Advent Cloud.
  
  
• Within the World of Light movement params (used for map movement), there exist 10 unoccupied entries. These entries start from dummy_07 and go to dummy_16. There are a few irregularities with the dummy slots. The first dummy string is dummy_02, and counting backwards from dummy_07 puts dummy_02 at Terry, leaving four slots (Plant, Joker, Hero, and Banjo) unaccounted for. The Cutting Room Floor has a bit more information that helps explain this discrepancy. I unfortunately only have the current patch to work from:
  
  A whopping 30 placeholder character slots existed in the files of the character selection screen at launch before being removed in the v2.0.0 update. There are also a slightly smaller 16 placeholder character slots in the files for the World of Light and in the attack_log_parameter.prc file, Piranha Plant and Joker from Persona 5 replaced the two placeholder slots from the World of Light and the attack_log_parameter.prc file, the Hero from Dragon Quest XI and Banjo and Kazooie did not replace of any of the placeholder slots in the World of Light, two more placeholder slots were removed in v6.0.0, Byleth from Fire Emblem: Three Houses did not take any of the placeholder slots in v7.0.0, and one slot was replaced by Min Min in v8.0.0 and Steve replaced another slot in v9.0.0, it is unknown if this applies to the rest of the DLC fighters or not.
  
  The important bits here are Plant, Joker, Min Min, and Steve replaced slots, while Hero, Banjo, and Byleth did not. If this article is accurate, then there is one dummy string (dummy_01) unaccounted for, and slots can be arbitrarily removed or added at any time.

tl;dr version, any theory that involves unused entries in game data is faulty, especially if the data never existed in the first place (voice theory)

also real leak

Spoiler: real

 

[SharkLord]

doublepost

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

square numbers? sounds like some complicated math concept and i dont do math. all i know is that 8 and 2 are good together.

It's basically any number you get by multiplying the same numbers together.
81 in this case is 9 times 9, or 3*3*3*3.

 

[Shroob]

Ya know I've never really listened to any of the tracks in XB2, but I really enjoyed XB1's music, maybe I'll give it a list----

Holy **** this is amazing.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

They aren't clones.

Mythra has different specials, some kind of counter/dodge with Foresight, and she seems to be focused on speed while Pyra's the offense.

Their normals are the same. Only the specials are different.

 

[Dan Quixote]

Are we sure even Pyhtra's normals are the same? I know those forward tilts looked pretty similar, but we didn't even see any of Myhtra's aerials iirc,

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Are we sure even Pyhtra's normals are the same? I know those forward tilts looked pretty similar, but we didn't even see any of Myhtra's aerials iirc,

Without even opening up the trailer, their Dair was the exact same, Mythra's was just faster

 

[SharkLord]

Are we sure even Pyhtra's normals are the same? I know those forward tilts looked pretty similar, but we didn't even see any of Myhtra's aerials iirc,

We get to see her combo down tilt into up air, so yes, we actually have seen one of her aerials.

 

[Shroob]

So what's all this about "Concert leak?"

 

[Cutie Gwen]

So what's all this about "Concert leak?"

A rumour that said we'd get Rex

 

[Dan Quixote]

Did some Googling and found a good thread about the moveset breakdown. Lemme just say that Pyra's neutral air looks weird dude

Reddit - Dive into anything

www.reddit.com

 

[Shroob]

A rumour that said we'd get Rex

Looking at the thread in question, doesn't seem to. It just says "Counterattack-XB2", which, if nothing else, props for getting XB2 of all games right as CP9.


Granted the last 2 characters are Monster Hunter(Presumably, it's a MonHun song), and Crash, who are THE two frontrunners atm.

 

[cashregister9]

So what's all this about "Concert leak?"

Someone posted a leak on 4chan before Pyra and Mythra were revealed and it was a song list for a concert that was supposedly happening next year, and it had a song for every character, including a Xenoblade 2, Monster Hunter and Crash Bandicoot song at the very end.

The big issues were things like Ken missing a song and Dragon quest and Final Fantasy being there which is hard to realistically see.

 

[PLATINUM7]

So what's all this about "Concert leak?"

Bruh, you just commented on it in the social thread.

For the Shroob in this thread, there's a 4chan post stating Nintendo will hold a Smash concert next year, seemingly having a song for each character and it listed a XC2 song (before Pyra and Mythra's reveal), a Crash song and a MonHun song.

 

[Shroob]

Bruh, you just commented on it in the social thread.

For the Shroob in this thread, there's a 4chan post stating Nintendo will hold a Smash concert next year, seemingly having a song for each character and it listed a XC2 song (before Pyra and Mythra's reveal), a Crash song and a MonHun song.

Hey now, the general thread didn't give me all the answers I was looking for. This is where the real leak hours take place.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Looking at the thread in question, doesn't seem to. It just says "Counterattack-XB2", which, if nothing else, props for getting XB2 of all games right as CP9.


Granted the last 2 characters are Monster Hunter(Presumably, it's a MonHun song), and Crash, who are THE two frontrunners atm.

Welp that's what I get for skimming the the thread instead of clicking on every link I see here. Why has the thread foresaken me

 

[Perkilator]

Did some Googling and found a good thread about the moveset breakdown. Lemme just say that Pyra's neutral air looks weird dude

Reddit - Dive into anything

www.reddit.com

She performed it right as she was about to land back on a platform, so it was interrupted.

 

[CureParfait]

How about a slight deviation: What are your favorite character designs in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate?

My favourite designs are Bayonetta, Joker, Sephiroth, and Pyra/Mythra.

 

[TwiceEXE]

Mythra's down tilt looks crazy fast. The fact that it pops up for a combo is even better. Marthcina may have to relinquish the crown for best sword down tilt.

 

[DevaAshera]

Mythra is her own character. She's just sharing a slot, but is effectively just as much like one as Sheik is now.

So we're getting slightly more characters than expected... by 1. And it's not a bonus character. Funny that~

Anyway, it's cool they did this. Not for Rex fans, but showing they aren't afraid to have team up characters again. The issue was mainly how badly Zelda/Sheik meshed together, and Samus/ZSS never actually was balanced around it(or attempted to). Pokemon Trainer is poorly done to some degree, even with buffs, but it tried to give a reason to change that isn't "one can ko, one racks up damage", and as of Ultimate, somewhat works well. I imagine Pyra/Mythra will work a lot better too.

Pretty much, yeah, since they are even numbered differently..though Zelda/Sheik, Samus/ZS Samus, and Charizard from Pokémon Trainer were split up not due to anything wrong with their mechanics, just due to the Nintendo 3DS being unable to handle transformation characters, they just decided to keep the first two sets splits while re-adding Charizard to Pokémon Trainer so the full character could return.

Full stop, I know **** about Xenoblade 2 aside from a few scattered memes


But I can already tell who my favorite characters are

View attachment 303981


Sometimes, you can just tell characters are "Token dumbasses" at a glance.

Oh, they are..I compare Zeke to a fusion of Dante from Devil May Cry and Owain from Fire Emblem Awakening while Pandoria enables his buffoonery lol

Ya know I've never really listened to any of the tracks in XB2, but I really enjoyed XB1's music, maybe I'll give it a list----

View attachment 303987

Holy **** this is amazing.

Oh yes, Xenoblade Chronicles 2 has amazing music, this one is my favorite track in the game that I want to have in Smash so badly!

I'd also love to have this song included as I adore it, though perhaps as a more upbeat remix akin to how they remixed 'Beneath the Mask' from Persona 5 and 'Aria of the Soul' from Persona 1 for Joker's DLC Pack.

Looking at the thread in question, doesn't seem to. It just says "Counterattack-XB2", which, if nothing else, props for getting XB2 of all games right as CP9.


Granted the last 2 characters are Monster Hunter(Presumably, it's a MonHun song), and Crash, who are THE two frontrunners atm.

True, but have we gotten ANY of our supposed Frontrunners as DLC yet? Outside of Leaks, most of our Most Likely characters have either not happened or gotten Mii Costume'd.

 

[Metal Shop X]

Ya know I've never really listened to any of the tracks in XB2, but I really enjoyed XB1's music, maybe I'll give it a list----

View attachment 303987

Holy **** this is amazing.

Brother, if you want to have a very, very good time.

Listen to as much song from XB2 & Torna: The Golden country as possible.

Whatever you think of the game, the OST is definitly a highlight. And why peoples wanted another XB2 characters, MOAR SONG IN SMASH.

Just be careful about some songs title, as they are quite spoilery.

 

[Kokiden]

My favourite designs are Bayonetta, Joker, Sephiroth, and Pyra/Mythra.

Hey we have the same taste (except for Pyra/Mythra since I've never played a xenoblade game)

So about this "concert leak" I've no idea about its validity, which I think isn't that likely, but if the last 2 are from Monster Hunter (never played any of these games either) and Crash, then Sephiroth was the only good inclusion in this pass for me. Him aside, very lukewarm and indifferent towards it overall.

I'd say the first pass was better overall.

 

[Pillow]

I'm honestly in awe whenever I take the time to appreciate K. Rool in Ultimate. He looks absolutely perfect.

I'd also say Dedede but I'm a bit biased. Smash has done its big boys justice, I think everyone can agree to that.

Sure, as long as no one looks at tier lists

 

[Shroob]

Pretty much, yeah, since they are even numbered differently..though Zelda/Sheik, Samus/ZS Samus, and Charizard from Pokémon Trainer were split up not due to anything wrong with their mechanics, just due to the Nintendo 3DS being unable to handle transformation characters, they just decided to keep the first two sets splits while re-adding Charizard to Pokémon Trainer so the full character could return.

Oh, they are..I compare Zeke to a fusion of Dante from Devil May Cry and Owain from Fire Emblem Awakening while Pandoria enables his buffoonery lol

Oh yes, Xenoblade Chronicles 2 has amazing music, this one is my favorite track in the game that I want to have in Smash so badly!

I'd also love to have this song included as I adore it, though perhaps as a more upbeat remix akin to how they remixed 'Beneath the Mask' from Persona 5 and 'Aria of the Soul' from Persona 1 for Joker's DLC Pack.

True, but have we gotten ANY of our supposed Frontrunners as DLC yet? Outside of Leaks, most of our Most Likely characters have either not happened or gotten Mii Costume'd.

Well, in regards to Monster Hunter, we STILL don't have their Mii Costumes, which is why they're frontrunners tbh, that, and Rise being a big, timed exclusive. The fact they've held them off for soo long is rather suspicious. They could have come with Steve, they didn't. They could come with Pyra/Mythra, which we can't say for sure, but if they're still missing, it's going to be really odd for them to miss the Rise release window, you'd assume that Nintendo would want to market Rise hard, considering the timed exclusivity.


Granted, if they appear with Pyra/Mythra, then they're probably as good as dead, and even if they're skipped over for a future pass character, that doesn't mean we're guaranteed a DLC Capcom character, but it's just something to keep an eye on at the end of the day.

 

[Nekoo]

This concert Leak is probably the longest you can piss in a violin and pretend it's making music with how much it's brought up when everything about this Fighter Pass has been literally Secret Defense that no leaker or even just people in the industry can get a name on who the **** the next fighters are.

 

[Will]

This concert Leak is probably the longest you can piss in a violin and pretend it's making music with how much it's brought up when everything about this Fighter Pass has been literally Secret Defense that no leaker or even just people in the industry can get a name on who the **** the next fighters are.

literally no one, no one has been able to predict the characters >24 hours before the reveal, even moreso >12 hours.

 

[Nekoo]

literally no one, no one has been able to predict the characters >24 hours before the reveal, even moreso >12 hours.

Yup, and I say that as someone who used to be in "le ebin sekrit circle" and knew about Hero months before it's reveal and the whole base roster in june.
Ever since the SNK fiasco, everything literally got shut down, that's why we had to play "guess who" for byleth when one rare person knowing it could only risk telling us WHO it was NOT.
And ever since then? No one knows. And when they know, they shut up, because of how secretive it has been.

 

[SharkLord]

True, but have we gotten ANY of our supposed Frontrunners as DLC yet? Outside of Leaks, most of our Most Likely characters have either not happened or gotten Mii Costume'd.

Well, there's Hero, though that was because of a leak. Also Byleth, but that was for FP2, not FP1. I suppose we could also sorta count Pyra and Mythra; Rex was a popular prediction, and while it's not exactly him, it's still XC2 characters. I doubt anyone thought he wouldn't come with the Blades, either.

So yeah. We've had Hero and a couple moments when we had the right idea, but it wasn't exactly how we thought it would be.

 

[N3ON]

It's funny because the SNK leak wasn't the fault of a leaker, it was due to old (un)reliable Intern-kun.

 

[Will]

Yup, and I say that as someone who used to be in "le ebin sekrit circle" and knew about Hero months before it's reveal and the whole base roster in june.
Ever since the SNK fiasco, everything literally got shut down, that's why we had to play "guess who" for byleth when one rare person knowing it could only risk telling us WHO it was NOT.
And ever since then? No one knows. And when they know, they shut up, because of how secretive it has been.

and good for them for being so secretive, it's clearly working, they have an uncrackable vault now it seems. after ol terry, they've really been able to hide it well. and that's what makes speculation kinda fun again, the fact that it's literally impossible.

no one called pyra & mythra without the rex, because that wouldn't have really made sense in context.

 

[Nekoo]

It's funny because the SNK leak wasn't the fault of a leaker, it was due to old (un)reliable Intern-kun.

Yup, and funnily enough, internally, from what a friend in NOA told us, the Prima Games guide, Pokémon Swords and Shield leak is also a reasons for tightening security.

 

[Shroob]

Yup, and I say that as someone who used to be in "le ebin sekrit circle" and knew about Hero months before it's reveal and the whole base roster in june.
Ever since the SNK fiasco, everything literally got shut down, that's why we had to play "guess who" for byleth when one rare person knowing it could only risk telling us WHO it was NOT.
And ever since then? No one knows. And when they know, they shut up, because of how secretive it has been.

I remember awhile ago you saying that you were pretty confident that MonHun wasn't happening.


Considering they're all the talk of the town atm, what's your opinion on it now?

 

[Will]

It's funny because the SNK leak wasn't the fault of a leaker, it was due to old (un)reliable Intern-kun.

i think CJ got fired for sure, leaking simon had him on thin ice already

 

[N3ON]

Yup, and funnily enough, internally, from what a friend in NOA told us, the Prima Games guide, Pokémon Swords and Shield leak is also a reasons for tightening security.

Publicly naming the outlet the Portuguese Sw/Sh leaker worked for was a hell of a warning shot.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Pretty much, yeah, since they are even numbered differently..though Zelda/Sheik, Samus/ZS Samus, and Charizard from Pokémon Trainer were split up not due to anything wrong with their mechanics, just due to the Nintendo 3DS being unable to handle transformation characters, they just decided to keep the first two sets splits while re-adding Charizard to Pokémon Trainer so the full character could return.

I'm aware, I'm just talking about balance issues they also have. Also, Sakurai did mention they also felt the split caused way better balance, so he does consider it important. This is also why I wouldn't mind a solo Charizard in some way. But you can't justify a Mega Charizard X/Y this way. Cause one can't turn into another. It can work, though, as a quick clone.

Speaking of, I could see a Pokemon Trainer Echo, using Wartortle, Bulbasaur, and Mega Charizard X, with small differences. They're, unlike a lot of Echo suggestions, the same bodyshapes.

 

[Nekoo]

I remember awhile ago you saying that you were pretty confident that MonHun wasn't happening.


Considering they're all the talk of the town atm, what's your opinion on it now?

At this point? I have no idea.

I was confident that MonHun wasn't happening but at this point, Idk, the furthest I knew was that we would get double dipping on Square-Enix and that Geno was out of it and back as a costume, but I just kept it to myself as it's someone I know, who's not related to smash or even interested in it just a friend wanting to tease another one to make me happy. And Min-min like two days before it's reveal.

I think everything is fair game, speculation is pretty much lively, i've left that toxic circle, or rather, that group of friends doesn't talk about it, and when we does, we don't try to snoop around, it's moreso like "Oh yknow we're getting KH news this week" and boom, Epic Store announcement or "Oh yeah, I heard Pokémon News next week" and I'm guessing it will happens soon.

We distanced ourselves from smash, because of the toxicity of it all. And with how terrible someone used us all for info. (Yeah, that sa- guys.)

I'm on the same boat as you. I think it all depends on if Hunter get Mii'd or not at this point. If they do bring back ALL of the DLC Mii or not.

 

[Will]

Speaking of the reveal, god seeing Wii era XC1 Shulk (his Ultimate model specifically) next to Pyra is so ****ing weird compared to, you know



Ew, the actual XC2 Shulk. The model itself looked pretty jank and out of place compared to Pyra's model, wonder why they didn't use this monstrosity or even the XC1DE model.

Also, the Final Destination Rex and Pyra were on looked so much like SFM to me.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I do not like when my browser freezes. As if today wasn't problematic enough. Welp.

 

[cashregister9]

Also, the Final Destination Rex and Pyra were on looked so much like SFM to me.

That was just a teaser for Gordon Freeman's trailer that will straight up be animated in Source

 

[Will]

That was just a teaser for Gordon Freeman's trailer that will straight up be animated in Source

Why not TF2 instead?

because i just want more official animations from valve