Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Mushroomguy12]

D-...Did you just refer to Spinning Bird Kick as Rising Tac-oh...you meant Terry's move...'cuz accent n' stuff.

...

The fact that that wasn't the first thing that came to mind worries me.

Bottom Text.

 

[Guynamednelson]

D-...Did you just refer to Spinning Bird Kick as Rising Tac-oh...you meant Terry's move...'cuz accent n' stuff.

...

The fact that that wasn't the first thing that came to mind worries me.

Ah yew okay?

 

[ARandomZoomer]

I don't have a lot of experience with MH, but the way I see it it's more likely that the armor sets would be related to alt costumes instead of a gameplay mechanic, no? The different weapons seem better for the latter.

Yeah I don't either, I just thought it would be a bit different to have something like that than changing between weapons. Like if said armour influenced traits such as weight and/or speed

 

[Perkilator]

So wait your argument is that fans want it, and Nintendo would make a lot of money from it, so therefore it won't happen?

No. My argument is that even considering that fans want it, makita it a Fighter when it's already done all that AT programming would, in the long run, ONLY benefit Nintendo.

But whatever. I'm not gonna argue this point anymore. Nobody's gonna question those logistics if/when it happens.

 

[Otoad64]

No. My argument is that even considering that fans want it, makita it a Fighter when it's already done all that AT programming would, in the long run, ONLY benefit Nintendo.

But whatever. I'm not gonna argue this point anymore. Nobody's gonna question those logistics if/when it happens.

um... it would also benefit the people who want that character playable

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

So with the reveal of Rose's Soul Vision, I was reminded of Zero, and how broken his version of the move is. Gamora's seems to be really good as well. So that gives me a question: Would such a move be as good in Super Smash Bros.?

 

[Pillow]

So with the reveal of Rose's Soul Vision, I was reminded of Zero, and how broken his version of the move is. Gamora's seems to be really good as well. So that gives me a question: Would such a move be as good in Super Smash Bros.?

Could you perhaps explain the mechanic for those of us that are unfamiliar with SF?

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Could you perhaps explain the mechanic for those of us that are unfamiliar with SF?

Ah yes. This style of attack gives you a copy of yourself that repeats your actions with a slight delay...Oh my goodness it's the just the Ice Climbers, if you couldn't hit the other Ice Climber, and didn't have dumb chain grab combos.

 

[SharkLord]

Ah yes. This style of attack gives you a copy of yourself that delivers delayed...Oh my goodness it's the just the Ice Climbers, if you couldn't hit the other Ice Climber, and didn't have dumb chain grab combos.

Rose Climbers will be the next Street Fighter rep. They are two Roses, each with their own Soul Vision. Also, the Soul Visions have Soul Visions of their own, creating a conga line of Roses.

Have fuuuun

 

[7NATOR]

So with the reveal of Rose's Soul Vision, I was reminded of Zero, and how broken his version of the move is. Gamora's seems to be really good as well. So that gives me a question: Would such a move be as good in Super Smash Bros.?

I didn't see her gameplay yet, but I assume with the mention of Zero and Gamora, it's a move where you have Afterimages that Do the same move you just did like a Second or even less earlier. Vergil's Doppelganger from DMC5 is an example as well

It's hard to say how good it would be because those type of moves would be taken into account for this hypothetical character's Kit. I will say is that Imagine it would make this character's attack very good on Shield, since the Afterimage should cover the Endlag of the move. Plus I think Spacing out and throwing out hitboxes would be much easier as well. Damage would be very good, but it could perhaps change their combo game as well because of the presence of the afterimage

Personally if this type of move were to exist, it needs to have some sort of Downside, or something to prevent it from being used all the same.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Year of Luigi 2 baby!

Mario on March 31st pic.twitter.com/HrdpJyVrqQ

— Jon Cartwright (@JonComms) February 12, 2021

 

[3BitSaurus]

Year of Luigi 2 baby!

...Does this have anything to do with the whole "Nintendo executes Mario" stuff?

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Rose Climbers will be the next Street Fighter rep. They are two Roses, each with their own Soul Vision. Also, the Soul Visions have Soul Visions of their own, creating a conga line of Roses.

Have fuuuun

Remember the Ike Climbers?

 

[Pillow]

Ah yes. This style of attack gives you a copy of yourself that repeats your actions with a slight delay...Oh my goodness it's the just the Ice Climbers, if you couldn't hit the other Ice Climber, and didn't have dumb chain grab combos.

Ah...that. It could be cool depending on who they give the mechanic to I guess. Seeing another top tier Zero might stir up some MvC PTSD

 

[Mushroomguy12]

...Does this have anything to do with the whole "Nintendo executes Mario" stuff?

A bunch of Mario stuff's getting discontinued on March 31st, like Super Mario 3D All Stars, Super Mario 35, Super Mario Game and Watch, Super Mario Maker 1's online servers, etc.

 

[3BitSaurus]

A bunch of Mario stuff's getting discontinued on March 31st, like Super Mario 3D All Stars, Super Mario 35, Super Mario Game and Watch, etc.

What about Mario himself? He might die again if we get a Smash reveal.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

What about Mario himself? He might die again if we get a Smash reveal.

Eh, he'll be fine.

 

[SKX31]

why? I think Dedede is fine.

To elaborate a bit:

He functions kinda fine in a more casual setting, but his toolkit is much more dysfunctional in a more competitive environment partly because he doesn't have that much synergy in his kit:

* He lacks a good way to force approaches outside of perhaps Gordos. Which hurts him a bit when Gordos are a large part of his gameplan - if a character / player can handle Gordos well Dedede's in a weird place at best.

* Dedede doesn't really have a strong suit in his CQC either. Grabs seem kinda decent at first glance, but the follow ups are wonky at best. He lacks a truly good out of shield move, and as such has to rely more on trapping. His horizontal range is also subpar outside of F-Tilt.

* Finally, he kinda suffers from power creep. Dedede has been improved in patches, but K. Rool has gained more out of the buffing (he at release was a hot mess, now he actually has a decently solid gameplan). It feels like Dedede was intended to be jack-of-all-trades superheavy, but currently he doesn't have much sauce.

Of course, that could change, we'll just have to see. Again, in casual settings he's fine since in casual settings people won't get more than 1-2 attacks in a row and Dedede benefits from that as a heavy.

Piranha Plant has a somewhat similar thing where anyone who footstool jumps it while it's crouching actually gets hurt.

That in particular strikes me as a missed opportunity - if people are going to intentionally footstool it 99 % of the time happens in the air. So the anti-footstool attack almost never comes into play. Really, one could add that mechanic to Down B (both in the ground and in the air) so people will have to respect that move a bit more.

What about Mario himself? He might die again if we get a Smash reveal.

He's probably abusing the 1-Up shell trick right now so he "survives" another death in an upcoming Smash trailer.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I didn't see her gameplay yet, but I assume with the mention of Zero and Gamora, it's a move where you have Afterimages that Do the same move you just did like a Second or even less earlier. Vergil's Doppelganger from DMC5 is an example as well

It's hard to say how good it would be because those type of moves would be taken into account for this hypothetical character's Kit. I will say is that Imagine it would make this character's attack very good on Shield, since the Afterimage should cover the Endlag of the move. Plus I think Spacing out and throwing out hitboxes would be much easier as well. Damage would be very good, but it could perhaps change their combo game as well because of the presence of the afterimage

Personally if this type of move were to exist, it needs to have some sort of Downside, or something to prevent it from being used all the same.

After realizing that the Ice Climbers essentially already have a version of this mechanic, I guess it would be pretty doable, especially since the main issue with the Ice Climbers would be gone. That being said though the character that's most likely to get a mechanic like this is Dark Samus which...

shudders in double Charge Shot

 

[Knight Dude]

As much as I'm vouching for Chun-Li to be our Street Fighter rep, IF that even happens. There are still so many other Capcom characters I'd rather want to see get in before her.

• I think another Mega Man rep is long overdue, Street Fighter already has two now and I feel we have to give our run n' gun guy some justice. The first character that comes to mind is Zero, though sadly he got Assist'd. There is also Proto Man, Bass and all the other variations of Mega Man we've seen along the years. Though I'm a bit scared they'd play a bit too similarly to Mega Man?
• There's still Devil May Cry which we've heard nothing about when it comes to Smash, besides the fact that his producer first wanted to put the games on the Switch before wanting to have the opportunity to put him in Smash, which obviously already happened. DMC1, DMC2 and DMC3 all released with DMC3 even having a some exclusive QOL stuff. I'd love to see them try to translate DMC's gameplay without making Dante absolutely busted lol.
• I'd absolutely do anything for a Resident Evil rep but sadly that got Spirited not long ago... Having Jill in Smash would be absolutely amazing and I can absolutely see some references to MvC2 in her moveset if she were to ever happen.
• Amaterasu from Okami has also been on my mind. While never playing it myself I absolutely love the overall aesthetic of the game and having a stage in Smash would be absolutely beautiful.
• There's also Morrigan or any other Darkstalkers character. Darkstalkers is a series quite near and dear to my heart and seeing that game get represented in here would be one of my never-ever wishes come true. Though sadly that IP is pretty much dormant now and there's really no reason for either Capcom or Nintendo to want any of those characters in Smash, unless a Darkstalkers 4 is secretly being worked on, which is absolutely impossible hahah (pretty please?).
• And then there's one of my most-wanted characters ever. Phoenix Wright from Ace Attorney. I have been vouching for his inclusion ever since the Smash 4 ballot days and my god how many times I've imagined him being in Smash can't be counted. And I've always promised to myself if he ever got in Smash I'd main him no matter what. God just imagine the Cornered remixes as well...

So I think it's pretty obvious that there could be an entire Fighters Pass filled with Capcom characters and I'd be entirely happy. Capcom just has one of the biggest and most iconic libraries when it comes to their videogames and it still kind of confuses me how they only have 3 with that many lovable and popular characters. God and I haven't even mentioned Rival Schools, Power Stone, Star Gladiator and Battle Circuit. Though those might get a bit too niche for some people's taste.

C'mon Nintendo make that Capcom Fighter's Pass happen!

I wouldn't worry too much about the other Mega Men being too similar to OG Mega Man. They all at least have their own sets of special weapons, which comprises a good chunk of Mega Man's moveset, they couldn't use Rush in the way that they do.

Take Mega Man.EXE for example, he also has a Mega Buster, but his 2nd most iconic weapon is his CyberSword, So he could essentially act like a weapon master of sorts. which also has a wide variety of implementations like Fire or Ice. Or Mega Man X having dashing and air-dashing, or armor based abilities, or unique special weapons like his Storm Tornado, Frost Tower or Speed Burner. Not to mention the guy uses Shotokan techniques too. Zero is primarily another sword guy, but its a laser sword, so that's a bit cooler. In all seriousness, if GBA Zero was taken, they could implement the Spear, and Boomerang Shield as well. Volnutt's other main weapon his is Drill Arm for example.

Protoman would probably be the best case for an echo, though Roll and Bass aren't exactly bad choices either. If you want to go obscure, then there's Quint, but you don't need to.

I do agree that a Capcom Fighter's Pass would hit. But I tend to at least like a handful of Capcom's franchises, but Mega Man's easily my favorite, with DMC as a close 2nd.

So with the reveal of Rose's Soul Vision, I was reminded of Zero, and how broken his version of the move is. Gamora's seems to be really good as well. So that gives me a question: Would such a move be as good in Super Smash Bros.?

Well, Mega Man X has his version of the move first in MMX4, Soul Body. I can see that being like Rose's too.
Zero's version, Sougenmu (I think that's how you spell it) works similarly in MMX5, but works more like Rose's in fighting games.
Classic Mega Man and Bass have one as well, Copy Vision, where they summon a clone to act like a turret. It's easy to see that be turned into an afterimage technique.
Dante and Vergil both have Doppleganger Style.
Dark Samus has the power to make a Doppleganger as well.
Technically, Mario, Luigi, Peach, Rosalina and Toad could use the Double Cherry.
Ryu Hayabusa's probably the earliest example of a dude making use of a Doppleganger.
And there's Noob Saibot too, but the chances of him being picked over his Younger Brother or Living Self as Sub-Zero and his Rival Scorpion is reasonably low.

Double Cherry would be busted ass item if it worked like Soul Body.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Another question borne from Street Fighter's developments: How would you guys feel about a random select character getting added to Super Smash Bros. (like, Ditto or something)? This could be either in the context of a bonus character or just having one in the game in general.

I'm personally of the mind of "what's the point?", but the reception for Eleven in Street Fighter V seems to be pretty positive. I do get the idea that it would allow the random button to be used online, but I feel like just adding the random button to online would be just as effective, though perhaps a bit less charming. Ironically, I think it would be really fun if Ditto outright replaced the random button, and I have no idea why having him be separate from it lowers my opinion of the idea.

 

[Knight Dude]

Another question borne from Street Fighter's developments: How would you guys feel about a random select character getting added to Super Smash Bros. (like, Ditto or something)? This could be either in the context of a bonus character or just having one in the game in general.

I'm personally of the mind of "what's the point?", but the reception for Eleven in Street Fighter V seems to be pretty positive. I do get the idea that it would allow the random button to be used online, but I feel like just adding the random button to online would be just as effective, though perhaps a bit less charming. Ironically, I think it would be really fun if Ditto outright replaced the random button, and I have no idea why having him be separate from it lowers my opinion of the idea.

The idea of getting to go online but changing characters each stock does sound kind of fun. And tying that to a character's who gimmick is all about that is fun. Ditto could very well work that way and probably could have similar reception if the character is treated as a bonus like Eleven is.

That said, there's only one random select close to my Black Heart.

My Dude Mokujin.

Too bad he might not work mechanically.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

I think another Mega Man rep is long overdue, Street Fighter already has two now and I feel we have to give our run n' gun guy some justice. The first character that comes to mind is Zero, though sadly he got Assist'd. There is also Proto Man, Bass and all the other variations of Mega Man we've seen along the years. Though I'm a bit scared they'd play a bit too similarly to Mega Man?

There's also Tron Bonne and Roll.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

The idea of getting to go online but changing characters each stock does sound kind of fun. And tying that to a character's who gimmick is all about that is fun. Ditto could very well work that way and probably could have similar reception if the character is treated as a bonus like Eleven is.

That could be fun, though that would require loading in a character every stock, which would be pretty slow. Though...I dunno, maybe they could randomly pick two characters at the start of the match, and when Ditto gets K.O.'ed, the first character is removed from play, Ditto becomes the second character, and a new random character is loaded in the reserve spot while you battle. Might could work, though it might have problems if Ditto comes back and immedietelly gets K.O.'ed a second time. You could add a 3rd character as a bit of a buffer, which would remove the issue from tournament play, but repleaded instant knockouts would still trigger it in casual play. How acceptable that would be would probably depend on how likely it is for players to think the game had a stroke.

That said, there's only one random select close to my Black Heart.


My Dude Mokujin.

Too bad he might not work mechanically.

Yeah the wide variety of body types would cause a lot of problems. He'd have to act like Double (Skullgirls) and have a moveset that consists of other Tekken moves, which could be kind of interesting.

 

[Knight Dude]

After realizing that the Ice Climbers essentially already have a version of this mechanic, I guess it would be pretty doable, especially since the main issue with the Ice Climbers would be gone. That being said though the character that's most likely to get a mechanic like this is Dark Samus which...

shudders in double Charge Shot

Double Charge Shots are cool.

 

[Will]

It's kinda crazy how people can just remix **** as well as this.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

It's kinda crazy how people can just remix **** as well as this.

This guy has a bunch of gems.

 

[Will]

This guy has a bunch of gems.

I've always known about him, but it's just the ****ing Home Depot commerical song that takes the cake.

 

[Shroob]

Because, again, there's no way to KNOW it works just as well. Yes, they were successful this year without Directs, but there are a LOT of other things that could have contributed to that success that have nothing to do with the Directs.

I mean, you're not wrong, but again, the current President of Nintendo was already alluding to scrapping the concept outright. "New ways to provide info" just sounds like fancy PR speak for "Cheaper", tbh.

 

[Otoad64]

This guy has a bunch of gems.

I just realised something, i'm pretty sure Club Penguin is technically eligible

 

[Dan Quixote]

Would anyone really complain if the rest of this pass was just Capcom? I mean look at that roster.

 

[Will]

Would anyone really complain if the rest of this pass was just Capcom? I mean look at that roster.

You could replace Capcom with literally any company and the answer will always be yes. Sharing is caring.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

You could replace Capcom with literally any company and the answer will always be yes. Sharing is caring.

I think I would complain if it was the company that owned Bubsy.

 

[TheCJBrine]

I really like A_A_RonHD's Bomberman remix:

This should've come with his mii costume.

 

[Will]

I think I would complain if it was the company that owned Bubsy.

Well I said someone would complain no matter who it was. can you even do 3 with whoever owns bubsy

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I just realised something, i'm pretty sure Club Penguin is technically eligible

This caused one thought to lead to another and come to the conclusion that Toontown Online is also eligible.

The preexisting Disney IPs are also even less important to the game than they are to Kingdom Hearts since they're really just used for aesthetic theming, so while you would lose on a bunch of area themes since they're named after Mickey and the gang, you could do represent the game pretty well without any of Disney's preexisting, non-video game, IPs (EDIT: as much as I think doing this with things like Kingdom Hearts would be a little silly).

can you even do 3 with whoever owns bubsy

Bubsy takes up 3 voice slots. He's still one character, but he used up the rest of the voice slots when he was added.

 

[Will]

Bubsy takes up 3 voice slots. He's still one character, but he used up the rest of the voice slots when he was added.

You gotta make room for his 100 one-liners somehow.

 

[SNEKeater]

I don't know the full scope of Trails, but from what I can gather, it could go either way. From what I can gather, Ys has the legacy and seems to be more well-known in the West, but Trails is more popular, especially in Asian countries. I'm not sure which one Nintendo would go for, and my prediction tends to flip-flop depending on the mood.
For Trails specifically, I'm also not sure. It's basically the Ys vs Trails argument, just focused on Trails rather than Falcom as a whole. Estelle is the first protagonist and set the standard, but Rean pretty much took over the series for the last five games. Estelle got the focus in the 15th anniversary logo and was cited as Kondo's favorite character to write, but Cold Steel broke a million copies sold and Rean was Kondo's backup pick, so to speak, since he couldn't think of a moveset for Adol.
So if you look at it mainly based on the series, 50% chance we get Adol and 25% for Estelle and Rean. If we look at it from a character perspective, 33% for everyone.

I pretty much agree with your post, or at least most of it.

However I will say Estelle is, as far as I know, one of Kondo's favorite characters. In this reddit AMA he said he loves all Trails characters but that Estelle is probably the one he loves more. In a different question he also chooses the Trails in the Sky trilogy (Estelle's games) as the story he enjoyed the most during writing.

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/Games/comments/c8u8iy/ama_i_am_toshihiro_kondo_president_of_nihon

Obviously he wouldn't decide which character would join Smash, but for this reason I always saw kind of weird he never mentioned Estelle when he was asked who he would pick for representing Falcom in Smash. Considering his attachment to her, I'd expect Estelle being mentioned when he answered but he only talked about Rean and Adol.
Admittedly Adol also holds a special place on his heart according to another interview. Not surprising because he was involved in the development of Ys games for a long time.

 

[JOJONumber691]

There's no way we get all 8 Eeveelutions. We either get the Kanto trio or the Johto duo.

Ah yes, and what did Steve do again? AH YES! He literally got every SINGLE STAGE Recoded just for him.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Ah yes, and what did Steve do again? AH YES! He literally got every SINGLE STAGE Recoded just for him.

That's not the same as making essentially 9 fighters.