Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Pillow]

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I’ve only just started Like A Dragon, but I can already tell that Ichiban is just as bad as Kiryu at being a crime man. Also I personally think that Majima would be the most fun in Smash. All four of his fighting styles in Yakuza 0 are amazing.

Oh definitely. Every time I see him spinning around like a beyblade I get all giddy inside. But Ichiban kinda feels like he’s got a pretty good future ahead of him, he’ll undoubtedly be leading a few more games at least while Majima is sort of the perfect side character. Plus I could just see Kameracho as a huge stage like pork city where Majima comes flying out of random locations stabbing people.

 

[Polan]

elaborating on sol badguy, the reasons why im absurdly confident in him are

• arcsys is already clearly involved in smash in some form
• a new GG game in the horizon (not coming to a nintendo console of course but sakurai and nintendo dont really care about that)
• just the right mixture of somewhat obscure but also well known among the more hardcore fg crowd
• could potentially add a mechanic we havent seen in smash aka a air dash
• yeah we got a fighting game character already in this pass but again i dont think sakurai is particularly interested in upholding those rules anyway
• he lowkey feels like the perfect character to end this pass on. not some huge addition, just middle of the road.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

I don't understand why Kiryu not being in Tekken because he doesn't want to hit women means he can't be in Smash. Super Smash Bros is meant to be a silly party game about throwing items at each other, knocking each other out in the least violent and most cartoony way possible all wrapped with the losers clapping for the winner at the end. The rules of Smash Bros are vastly different to Tekken which is more grounded in reality by comparison. I'm sure Sakurai can slip and slither his way through the cracks to get Kiryu if they're going for him.

 

[Idon]

I don't understand why Kiryu not being in Tekken because he doesn't want to hit women means he can't be in Smash. Super Smash Bros is meant to be a silly party game about throwing items at each other, knocking each other out in the least violent and most cartoony way as possible all wrapped with the losers clapping for the winner at the end. The rules of Smash Bros are vastly different to Tekken which is more grounded in reality by comparison. I'm sure Sakurai can slip and slither his way through the cracks to get Kiryu if they're going for him.

Beyond Tekken being a more technical game in terms of inputs, they're both pretty damn ridiculous.

Anyway violence against women is not obscured by the fact it's cartoony violence against women.
If the director well and truly believes that Kiryu, as a core character and identity trait, does not attack women, then I don't see him making exceptions for any other fighting game. Even Smash.

As much as I'd like Kiryu in Smash, the line of logic that Smash is somehow different in regards to how Kiryu might feasibly throw a punch at a female character always struck me as strange.

Here's hoping he does make that exception though, because Kiryu is rad.

 

[Mamboo07]

I don't understand why Kiryu not being in Tekken because he doesn't want to hit women means he can't be in Smash. Super Smash Bros is meant to be a silly party game about throwing items at each other, knocking each other out in the least violent and most cartoony way possible all wrapped with the losers clapping for the winner at the end. The rules of Smash Bros are vastly different to Tekken which is more grounded in reality by comparison. I'm sure Sakurai can slip and slither his way through the cracks to get Kiryu if they're going for him.

Ridley would like to have a word with ya.
(In his trailer, he impaled Mega Man and possibly crushed Mario's skull or snapped his neck.)

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I don't understand why Kiryu not being in Tekken because he doesn't want to hit women means he can't be in Smash. Super Smash Bros is meant to be a silly party game about throwing items at each other, knocking each other out in the least violent and most cartoony way as possible all wrapped with the losers clapping for the winner at the end. The rules of Smash Bros are vastly different to Tekken which is more grounded in reality by comparison. I'm sure Sakurai can slip and slither his way through the cracks to get Kiryu if they're going for him.

It's especially funny when Nagoshi has literally said he's ok with Kiryu in Smash by saying "Mr. Sakurai would not want them (laughs). It is all right if he said. But he does not want, maybe." But noooooooo people really have ut out for him for some reason and tried taking a statement about Tekken and claimed it was about Smash when the time Kiryu crossed over with ****ing Chrom and Lucina and **** had him shoot the absolute **** out of women too. Funny enough people try dismissing Arle, another Sega character, by falsley claiming an interview says they're out of the running when another interview proves otherwise. Now whenever I google 'Kiryu Smash' I get nothing but "KIRYU DECONFIRMED BECAUSE OF TEKKEN RELATED QUESTION!"

 

[Pillow]

Beyond Tekken being a more technical game in terms of inputs, they're both pretty damn ridiculous.

Anyway violence against women is not obscured by the fact it's cartoony violence against women.
If the director well and truly believes that Kiryu, as a core character and identity trait, does not attack women, then I don't see him making exceptions for any other fighting game. Even Smash.

As much as I'd like Kiryu in Smash, the line of logic that Smash is somehow different in regards to how Kiryu might feasibly throw a punch at a female character always struck me as strange.

Here's hoping he does make that exception though, because Kiryu is rad.

I’m not very familiar with ProjectxZone, but doesn’t Kiryu conduct some form of violence against female characters in that game? Cartoony violence is still a distinction from other types of violence, and Tekken, silly as it is sometimes, definitely wouldn’t fall under the same category as smash here.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I’m not very familiar with ProjectxZone, but doesn’t Kiryu conduct some form of violence against female characters in that game? Cartoony violence is still a distinction from other types of violence, and Tekken, silly as it is sometimes, definitely wouldn’t fall under the same category as smash here.

The first result I got for looking up 'Project X Zone Kiryu' on youtube got me this

The literal first second of this is Kiryu punching a woman

 

[7NATOR]

Kiryu was always pretty bad at being a criminal tbh. But so is Ichiban. Dudes are out here beating up other criminals, saving women, and giving money to poor communities. If we were to get a Yakuza rep, and it absolutely couldn’t be Kiryu, I’d be kind of torn on if Ichiban or Majima would be the better pick.

I'm not a Organized Crime expert, as I haven't been in any Criminal Organization or any gangs, but from what I've read and seen on the internet I want to say this is kind of accurate

When it comes to Organizations like the Yakuza, or even other organizations, Most of the violent efforts are towards other Criminals, or Rivals of the particular organization, as they tend to either mess with the organization or their money. Of course there are many examples where Innocent people are caught in the crossfire, whether unintentional or intentional, and especially if it's for monetary reasons like extortion, ransoming, or human trafficking (I know Cartels specialize in this type of thing, don't know about the Yakuza) but you don't just want to mess with Innocent people for no reason, as they usually are the people that these organizations rely on for revenue.

In particular, I do believe that the Yakuza do help out some of the poorer communities. even the Government has relied on the Yakuza protecting communities like this from what I heard

and as for Saving women, perhaps that's a thing too.

Of course, they are very destructive in the end, both towards people outside the gang, Innocent or guilty, and even people inside the gang, as this type of lifestyle is one that's very hard to live, especially if you were unwilling or forced to join. In any case, I think the Yakuza game is kind of correct in portraying that Kiryu is a criminal, despite doing things like Saving women and beating up criminals, because not everything is black or white. I also haven't played the game so I don't know what Kiryu is thinking when he's doing these actions.

 

[Pillow]

I'm not a Organized Crime expert, as I haven't been in any Criminal Organization or any gangs, but from what I've read and seen on the internet I want to say this is kind of accurate

When it comes to Organizations like the Yakuza, or even other organizations, Most of the violent efforts are towards other Criminals, or Rivals of the particular organization, as they tend to either mess with the organization or their money. Of course there are many examples where Innocent people are caught in the crossfire, whether unintentional or intentional, and especially if it's for monetary reasons like extortion, ransoming, or human trafficking (I know Cartels specialize in this type of thing, don't know about the Yakuza) but you don't just want to mess with Innocent people for no reason, as they usually are the people that these organizations rely on for revenue.

In particular, I do believe that the Yakuza do help out some of the poorer communities. even the Government has relied on the Yakuza protecting communities like this from what I heard

and as for Saving women, perhaps that's a thing too.

Of course, they are very destructive in the end, both towards people outside the gang, Innocent or guilty, and even people inside the gang, as this type of lifestyle is one that's very hard to live, especially if you were unwilling or forced to join. In any case, I think the Yakuza game is kind of correct in portraying that Kiryu is a criminal, despite doing things like Saving women and beating up criminals, because not everything is black or white. I also haven't played the game so I don't know what Kiryu is thinking when he's doing these actions.

I’m also not too familiar with the inner workings of real life yakuza, but I’m pretty sure it involves committing actual crimes. The only crimes Kiryu commits is being shirtless in public while beating up other shirtless men. Most of the rest of the time he’s singing karaoke, or playing with toy cars, or doing literally anything else other than breaking the law.

The first result I got for looking up 'Project X Zone Kiryu' on youtube got me this

The literal first second of this is Kiryu punching a woman

Ok yeah, pretty hilarious to see too.

 

[smashkirby]

Alright, let's play a game. Pitch me a first-party character and I'll evaluate their chances. See if we can expand our horizons, or at least jot down a couple darkhorses who may have a shot, slim as it may be.

Lark from Pilotwings 64?

 

[DarthEnderX]

The dude is literally a criminal!

Kiryu is as good a criminal as the Strawhats are pirates.

I don't understand why Kiryu not being in Tekken because he doesn't want to hit women means he can't be in Smash.

Because Smash also has women?

The literal first second of this is Kiryu punching a woman

You don't know a ton about Q-Bee...

Also can you imagine Sakurai asking Nagoshi if he can have Kiryu in Smash, just for Nagoshi to be like “No. Take Ichiban. He’s the one who beats women.”

I refuse to believe this sweetheart would do that!

 

[7NATOR]

I’m also not too familiar with the inner workings of real life yakuza, but I’m pretty sure it involves committing actual crimes. The only crimes Kiryu commits is being shirtless in public while beating up other shirtless men. Most of the rest of the time he’s singing karaoke, or playing with toy cars, or doing literally anything else other than breaking the law.

Well I'm not familiar with the Yakuza game lore, and how exactly the plot of each of the games go, But from what I gather, here's what I'm thinking

Kiryu is a Good criminal, but also a good person, and it's not something that is exclusive. Kiryu is still in the Yakuza, which is a criminal organization. I'm also sure that beating up people on the daily is something that's against the law. I'm not sure if it's self defense everytime, or Kiryu started the fights, but if it's the latter, then Kiryu is a serial assaulter, and while the people he beats up are criminals and rivals usually, they still have rights to not get assaulter randomly in public.

Though if you don't want to count the beating up people thing, if Kiryu only crime really is him just being shirtless in public, than he's very tame compared to other Yakuza members. but because he is with the Yakuza, he still is a criminal, and since he's not in jail and hasn't been put in it for long time it seems like, he's pretty good at it,,

Also I don't think him singing karaoke, or playing with toy cars is an example of being a bad or good criminal, or being a good or bad person. like I'm sure there's probably people that play Smash or have played smash that have Killed/killing people, or stuff like that. People don't just be commiting crimes 24/7 after all, and they are people too with there own interests and such.

Regardless, from what I've been told, Kiryu does seem like a upstanding citizen, while also being in the Yakuza, which is kind of paradoxical, but it seems that's what the Yakuza series and Kiryu shows, and in real-life, there do be people in these crime organizations that aren't bad people.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

You don't know a ton about Q-Bee..

I'm aware of how every member of their species looks mostly identical regardless of gender but she's still a woman, especially as, you know, queen bees

 

[Polan]

I'm not a Organized Crime expert, as I haven't been in any Criminal Organization or any gangs, but from what I've read and seen on the internet I want to say this is kind of accurate

When it comes to Organizations like the Yakuza, or even other organizations, Most of the violent efforts are towards other Criminals, or Rivals of the particular organization, as they tend to either mess with the organization or their money. Of course there are many examples where Innocent people are caught in the crossfire, whether unintentional or intentional, and especially if it's for monetary reasons like extortion, ransoming, or human trafficking (I know Cartels specialize in this type of thing, don't know about the Yakuza) but you don't just want to mess with Innocent people for no reason, as they usually are the people that these organizations rely on for revenue.

In particular, I do believe that the Yakuza do help out some of the poorer communities. even the Government has relied on the Yakuza protecting communities like this from what I heard

and as for Saving women, perhaps that's a thing too.

Of course, they are very destructive in the end, both towards people outside the gang, Innocent or guilty, and even people inside the gang, as this type of lifestyle is one that's very hard to live, especially if you were unwilling or forced to join. In any case, I think the Yakuza game is kind of correct in portraying that Kiryu is a criminal, despite doing things like Saving women and beating up criminals, because not everything is black or white. I also haven't played the game so I don't know what Kiryu is thinking when he's doing these actions.

most crime organizations that claim that they do not hurt civilians actually hurt civilians pretty regularly. its just PR and mythologizing.

 

[DarthEnderX]

I mean, I'm sure a lot of what Kiryu does is actually against the law. The bigger issue is that he's a terrible yakuza. Because what crimes he does commit hardly ever generate income. It's mostly just assault against other, worse criminals.

I'm not sure if it's self defense everytime

Almost always. For some reason, everyone on the street seems to want a piece of him.

I'm aware of how every member of their species looks mostly identical regardless of gender but she's still a woman, especially as, you know, queen bees

I'm not sure a giant murderbug in a vaguely female shape counts in the "won't hit a woman" department. Like, if Kiryu was attacked by a female tiger, would he refuse to fight it?

Cause seriously, she's just a giant insect. Her entire "human" face is fake.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

Ridley would like to have a word with ya.
(In his trailer, he impaled Mega Man and possibly crushed Mario's skull or snapped his neck.)

You see, the fact that you're uncertain about what Ridley did to Mario because of the silhouette frame leaves enough implication that Ridley could have done something less violent to Mario.

Because Smash also has women?

ARE YOU KIDDING ME?! When did that start happening? Feminism has gone too far! /s

 

[Idon]

I’m not very familiar with ProjectxZone, but doesn’t Kiryu conduct some form of violence against female characters in that game? Cartoony violence is still a distinction from other types of violence, and Tekken, silly as it is sometimes, definitely wouldn’t fall under the same category as smash here.

Yes, but one, that's a really low-key crossover that probably didn't have its vision of Kiryu directly supervised by its creators.

This can mostly be seen in how KIRYU IS BASED OFF OF HIS DEAD SOULS INCARNATION AND WIELDS HEAVY WEAPONRY.

 

[Pillow]

I mean, I'm sure a lot of what Kiryu does is actually against the law. The bigger issue is that he's a terrible yakuza. Because what crimes he does commit hardly ever generate income. It's mostly just assault against other, worse criminals.

Almost always. For some reason, everyone on the street seems to want a piece of him.

I'm not sure a giant murderbug in a vaguely female shape counts in the "won't hit a woman" department. Like, if Kiryu was attacked by a female tiger, would he refuse to fight it?

Cause seriously, she's just a giant insect. Her entire "human" face is fake.

Even if you’re construing Q Bee to not count (which I wouldn’t agree with but whatever) there are tons of unquestionably female characters in that game for Kiryu to punch.

Yes, but one, that's a really low-key crossover that probably didn't have its vision of Kiryu directly supervised by its creators.

This can mostly be seen in how KIRYU IS BASED OFF OF HIS DEAD SOULS INCARNATION AND WIELDS HEAVY WEAPONRY.

This is a valid point, but I’m still inclined to think the no hitting women thing is referring to more graphic and realistic looking violence than what happens in Smash. Like cmon we have Isabelle as a fighter.

 

[7NATOR]

Well if Tekken is too realistic in that it breaks the Kiryu "no hitting women" rule, than I'm gonna assume he's not gonna be in whatever the new Virtua Fighter game is either?

 

[Idon]

Even if you’re construing Q Bee to not count (which I wouldn’t agree with but whatever) there are tons of unquestionably female characters in that game for Kiryu to punch.



This is a valid point, but I’m still inclined to think the no hitting women thing is referring to more graphic and realistic looking violence than what happens in Smash. Like cmon we have Isabelle as a fighter.

Yeah and they're clearly fine with Isabelle having this done to her:

(albeit with no pain grunts)

The question is, do they want Kiryu to be in Little Mac's position? It's pretty hard to give a definitive yes or no answer but saying Smash is different because it's Smash just seems, I dunno, circular. Kiryu will punch and kick and combo with the same amount of ferocity as he would in any fighting game. (Besides MK).

Well if Tekken is too realistic in that it breaks the Kiryu "no hitting women" rule, than I'm gonna assume he's not gonna be in whatever the new Virtua Fighter game is either?

VF usually doesn't do character crossovers in their own game in general so I doubt it either way.
His tuxedo will probably be a costume in that game though.

 

[Cosmic77]

You see, the fact that you're uncertain about what Ridley did to Mario because of the silhouette frame leaves enough implication that Ridley could have done something less violent to Mario.

Realistically though, Ridley probably did something far more violent to Mario, not less violent.

I mean, it's Ridley...

 

[Mamboo07]

Realistically though, Ridley probably did something far more violent to Mario, not less violent.

I mean, it's Ridley...

View attachment 300536

Don't forget that he killed Samus's parents and probably traumatized her in a comic or whatever it is.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Sakurai: Smash Ultimate is Smash 6

Smash Fans: ok but no

Edit: to be fair this is incredibly semantic and the collective consciousness refer to Smash 3DS and Wii U Smash 4 so even though I do consider 3DS Smash 4 and Wii U Smash 5 my head canon is still that these 2 games are collectively Smash “For” so neither is really wrong to me.

 

[Flyboy]

There's enough evidence in the games to show that when it comes to harder or more realistic violence (and Nagoshi seems to group Tekken in that category) he would rather Kiryu not strike women, but he has outright said that he thinks Kiryu would be great in Smash if Sakurai and his team were interested at all.

Of course if we can't have Kiryu, we are spoiled for choice with Ichiban as the new protagonist being so great and Majima having the popularity and iconic factor. I definitely think it should be Kiryu first because of his history but if the choice is between another Yakuza rep and no Yakuza rep, I'll take the non-Kiryu options any day.

(Also, if you're an Ichiban supporter, another plug for the support thread in my signature...we got movesets....we got spirits...)

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Sakurai: Smash Ultimate is Smash 6

Smash Fans: ok but no

Edit: to be fair this is incredibly semantic and the collective consciousness refer to Smash 3DS and Wii U Smash 4 so even though I do consider 3DS Smash 4 and Wii U Smash 5 my head canon is still that these 2 games are collectively Smash “For” so neither is really wrong to me.

I see it as a pun: For = 4

That aside, split development was largely a mistake even though the switch ended up being a portable-console hybrid

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Beyond Tekken being a more technical game in terms of inputs,

Unrelated, but that's the main reason why I think Heihachi missed the chance of being in Smash twice now.

It's incredibly technical with loads of inputs and lengthy combos. Might have been what the difficulties Sakurai mentionned back in Smash 4 when it came to making a moveset, not to mention the balancing nightmare it could've been.

This is how Soulcalibur win.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Oh yeah now that I think back on ATs being made into DLC costumes like Akira Yuki, Squid Sisters and Bomberman: think we’ll get more? Like Guile, Rodin, Alucard... Yuri Kozukata?

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Oh yeah now that I think back on ATs being made into DLC costumes like Akira Yuki, Squid Sisters and Bomberman: think we’ll get more? Like Guile, Rodin, Alucard... Yuri Kozukata?

Not an AT, but I'm surprised we didn't her a Rugal Bernstein outfit with the Terry wave.

Mii Brawler up air literally looks like Genocide Cutter

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Because Smash also has women

Hands are rated E for everyone

 

[SNEKeater]

Kiryu being kept out of fighting games because of his respect for women becomes more hilarious the more I think about it. The dude is literally a criminal! Also can you imagine Sakurai asking Nagoshi if he can have Kiryu in Smash, just for Nagoshi to be like “No. Take Ichiban. He’s the one who beats women.”

If Ichiban gets in this should be his Final Smash:

 

[Truth the Ceomasterz33]

Uhh Sega is deconfirmed!

 

[Perkilator]

Uhh Sega is deconfirmed!

Not really. There are franchises besides Yakuza and Puyo Puyo (Sonic is debatable) that could work in Smash; for instance, a lesser know series called Sakura Wars.

 

[osby]

Uhh Sega is deconfirmed!

This post will look really funny after our last three DLC fighters will be revealed to be Opa-Opa, Hatsune Miku, and Segata Sanshiro.

 

[Flyboy]

This post will look really funny after our last three DLC fighters will be revealed to be Opa-Opa, Hatsune Miku, and Segata Sanshiro.

Scenes when BD Joe, Demifiend, and Eggman all make it in this pass.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

BD Joe

BD

Initials, or emoticon? You decide!

 

[Cutie Gwen]

BD

Initials, or emoticon? You decide!

Bandana Dee Joe, our first party character! He's Bandana Dee but he's in a taxi instead of using a spear! The kids will love it!

 

[Truth the Ceomasterz33]

BD

Initials, or emoticon? You decide!

Bandana Dee Joe, our first party character! He's Bandana Dee but he's in a taxi instead of using a spear! The kids will love it!

Got Named!

 

[helloiamhere]

Ichiban is also a much more interesting character than Kiryu is, who is basically Japanese Jesus. A Yakuza rep is my most wanted, but my expectations are pretty low.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Don't forget that he killed Samus's parents and probably traumatized her in a comic or whatever it is.

And you know how?

By burning and eating them alive!

If that ain't evil. I don't know what is.